Former Vice President Dick Cheney said on “Fox News Sunday” that the attorney general’s decision to investigate prisoner abuse by the CIA “offends the hell out of me.”But many Americans, including Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., are offended that the United States, at Cheney’s urging, violated U.S. and international law prohibiting torture and set aside its own values and moral leadership. Though McCain doesn’t support a CIA probe, he said Sunday on CBS’ “Face the Nation” that “torturing harmed us.” McCain said that the interrogations were “in violation of the Geneva Conventions and the convention against torture that we ratified under President Reagan,” and that the interrogations “helped al-Qaida recruit” and harmed our ability to work with our allies. “The damage that it did to America’s image in the world is something we’re still on the way to repairing,” McCain said. And as for the effectiveness of the tactics, McCain noted that, according to the FBI and others, the information gained by torture “could have been gained through other methods.”
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53 Comments
And as for the effectiveness of the tactics, McCain noted that, according to the FBI and others, the information gained by torture “could have been gained through other method
—————————————————
Well Sen,what other methods do you have in mind?
Torture, is Obama’s DIVERSION from his failed policies on:
The Afghan War
Still in Iraq
The Economy
Health Care
Cap N Tax
I’d like to see the Democrats pass a law to ban torture.
They all say they are against it, but they do nothing about it.
And in the Torture-Ban Bill, the Dems will have to define what IS Torture, and what IS NOT Torture.
Come-on Dems, who’s stopping you now? Who ya gonna blame for your failures this time?
O’BAMA Diversion +1
Raw Meat for duh Libs…
——————Y A W N————–
New Improved Obama Interrogation Methods
-Read the detainee his Miranda rights in his native language.
-Establish rapport with the detainee. Become their friend. Talk about sports. Share a beer.
-Make a date between the detainee and your sister. That will make him like you more.
-Have your mother bring a home-made apple pie. A full belly makes the detainee happy!
-Make a date between the detainee and your Mother. That will make him like you more.
-House the detainee in a luxury hotel suite in Hawaii. He’ll like it there very much and will want to cooperate.
-Offer the detainee a government job in the Obama administration. That takes away his economic incentive to stay with his terrorist group.
-Bring the detainee flowers. Detainees like flowers.
-When asking questions of the detainee, remember to say “please” or “pretty please with sugar on top”.
Well Sen,what other methods do you have in mind?
How about engaging brainpower?
Mossad, the Israeli intelligence
agency, used its collective brainpower
to do its job and has widely discounted
the use of torture as being effective.
FYI, Mossad used its web of information
collection to get an idea of the 9/11
attacks months before they occurred.
http://articles.latimes.com/2001/sep/20/news/mn-47840
They are the world’s best and communicate
with other agencies within Israel, unlike the
CIA and FBI, which are busy fighting turf
battles with each other.
There will always be the Cheneys in the world and dumbbells such as the kill ‘em all and let God sort ‘em out macho man who wrote the Nation of Wimps letter in today’s paper. Pretty sickening.
Dennis
YellowdogLiberal,
The letter seemed pretty much right on to me.
How does that make you feel?
Anti,
I’ve never expected much out of you anyway, so whatever. Just turn it around and imagine it happening to you. Doesn’t seem so great, does it?
Dennis
Doesn’t seem so great, does it?
==================================
Yeah, that’s the point.
No, Anti, the point is that torture
backfires and Gitmo was the best
recruiting tool terrorism ever got.
The only goal US torture achieved was
to help swell the ranks of recruits
for OBL.
Here’s the link — GOP Sen. Kit Bond,
hardly a lib, says torture helps terrorists
recruit more participants. It’s called blowback.
http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/torture/top-senate-republican-appears-to-admit-that-torture-helps-al-qaeda-recruitment/
bowhowdy2
Posted August 31, 2009 at 2:11 pm | Permalink
No, Anti, the point is that torture
backfires and Gitmo was the best
recruiting tool terrorism ever got.
========================================
Wrong.
Islam was the best recruiting tool for terrorism.
Libs just let the terrorist know our interrogation tactics and that the terrorist would suffer no lasting physical harm. Thereby weakening our efforts.
Shoot them in the head on the battlefield.
Never bring back a prisoner.
Problem solved.
You can not tell me with a straight face that the numbers of terrorist grew, (remember these are the people who routinely saw the hands, feet, and heads off of people) because we threw water and caterpillars at them.
bowhowdy2,
Did you read your own link?
I don’t think torturing hurt us as bad as being lazy, unprepared and tolerant.
reggie,
“Shoot them in the head on the battlefield.
Never bring back a prisoner.”
The Germans tried that in WWII and it backfired on them so completely that they quit doing it. Too late. An enemy who knows there is no surrender option will continue to fight to the death, and take more of our soldiers with them. You were supposedly in the service and ought to know that!
And as for the effectiveness of the tactics, McCain noted that, according to the FBI and others, the information gained by torture “could have been gained through other method
LMAO. What a great source to ask. He was nicknamed the “Song Bird”. He rolled over on his country faster than a duck on a June bug. If he was tortured as he says he was, it sure was effective. He gave up everything.
A former Vietnam veteran with top secret clearance says he has personally spoken to numerous POW’s who dispute John McCain’s claim that he refused to provide information after he was captured and tortured in Hanoi, saying that in fact McCain’s code-name was “Songbird” because of his willingness to tell all to avoid torture.
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2008/020708_never_tortured.htm
“I’d like to see the Democrats pass a law to ban torture”
I am amazed at the lack of knowledge displayed in these blogs. For Christ’s sake, READ and become INFORMED before opening posting.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torture
Anti–Yeah, I read my link and
unlike you, I do know how to read.
I can chew gum at the
same time, too, dumbnut.
OK, so torture is
beautiful and works! Why not just
string ‘em up in Times Square and
tear their bodies apart through the
streets. Yeah, that’s the ticket!!
You’re so right — and I’m so very,
very wrong. Bring back the Middle
Ages, it was such a lovely time.
Yeah, let’s turn Amerika in the
wild west version of Afganistan.
Good times for all. Yeah, that’s the
version of Amerika Tommy Jefferson
had in mind, I’m sure it is.
boywhootie2
Posted August 31, 2009 at 3:08 pm | Permalink
Anti–Yeah, I read my link and
unlike you, I do know how to read.
I can chew gum at the
same time, too, dumbnut.
OK, so torture is
beautiful and works! Why not just blh..blah..blah..
When they come at you with a sword….
Hit ‘em with a daisy…
You’re so right — and I’m so very,
very wrong.
=========================
Yes, I know.
Drop the drama and try to cry less next time.
ed
Posted August 31, 2009 at 2:46 pm | Permalink
reggie,
“Shoot them in the head on the battlefield.
Never bring back a prisoner.”
The Germans tried that in WWII and it backfired on them so completely that they quit doing it. Too late. An enemy who knows there is no surrender option will continue to fight to the death, and take more of our soldiers with them. You were supposedly in the service and ought to know that!
—————-
Okay, forget shooting them in the head.
Use high explosive ordinance and blow them into dust. :)
I’ve seen all you CONs strutting your sadistic selves when cocksure braggadocio of how torture victims would sell out their secrets if just a little more pain or degradation or death were added to the mix.
All it tells me is you CONs are pretty sure you’d break under the treatment you prescribe.
Hell…
Dick Cheney strikes me as the type who’d reveal his undisclosed location if someone served him tepid tea.
Hell…
Limit “Regular” to one Depends a week and he’s be spilling secrets by Tuesday afternoon.
Sounds like you are for torture, “Monkeyhawk”.
And if “ANTI” and “American_Way” were forced to explore each others honey holes… Well, they’d probably just cuddle afterward.
reggie,
“Use high explosive ordinance and blow them into dust. :)”
Uh, isn’t that what we’ve been doing to no avail for the last six years? Maybe we should consider something that actually works!
Jed
Posted August 31, 2009 at 4:07 pm | Permalink
reggie,
“Use high explosive ordinance and blow them into dust. :)”
Uh, isn’t that what we’ve been doing to no avail for the last six years? Maybe we should consider something that actually works!
———————-
Yeah, So?
It works – attrition by demolition.
Not my fault duh Libs have a policy of show force-with no force in Afghanistan.
” Libs have a policy ”
I didn’t think they have a policy in Afghanistan.
All Obama does is get more Americans killed and murder women and children with stray ordnance.
Anti — Sarcasm is a form of humor that uses sharp, cutting remarks or language intended to mock, wound, or subject to contempt or ridicule.
The thing I love about these threads is how
dim most of the posters are. I’m not a smart person,
but reading these posts, I feel like I am.
Oh has Obama defined a Goal in Afghanistan and how to measure success?
How about an Exit Strategy? (Even some Democrats are asking for this now!)
WPE
Sarcasm, what’s that?
Thank you for sharing that Bohowdy.
Without you, we wouldn’t know what Sarcasm is.
Thanks again.
Regualr-Jed: Taking prisoners has a to do with the ability to contain and sustain them without tying up your own ability to inflict damage to the enemy. Taking no prisoners as an order of the day, means rapid movement forward not be to interruped for any reason. The Brits and her sister countries/colonies had an “understanding” of never accepting prisoners if they surrendered with an empty magazine. I think Ike issued such a directive in D-Day, and come to think of it,I don’t ever recall seeing anything about D-Day German POWs being taken. The Germans have recently complained over Allied atrocities noting that their soldiers were taken behind sand dunes and shot, others tied to tanks acting as human shields, but of course never made public. That may have be the reason behind Malamady for some knew about the treatment of Germans and made a break for it sparking the massacre. Australian/New Zealand infantry overran an Afrika Korps hospital in North Africa and killed everybody including the doctors and nurses, nothing was ever said. War IS hell and everyone associated with it knows niceties don’t count much. Professional soldiers know that, it’s the idiots who have never had to fight a parking ticket who don’, and send kids off in defence of “freedom”. You know the patriotic politicians who got out of ‘Nam service to be cheerleaders at Ole’ Miss etc. etc.,
Bush just may have screwed the pooch so severely in the last 8 yrs. in Afghanistan, that there is no other realistic option but withdraw like a cur pup he’s made America into.
And Russia screwed the Afghan pooch before that.
Maybe, just maybe Bush was able to keep the Taliban and AlQueda on the run in Afghanistan with a minimum number of troops, and smaller casualties.
Maybe Bush learned a lesson from history, that Obama is bound to repeat.
Bush was a fly swatter, with no real aim.
Russsia could at least point at the U.S. for arming the opposition, you know Bin and company.
I guess we may just have to learn to be content in the knowledge that we avenged the 9/11 victims in Iraqi blood, and with the knowledge Saddam won’t be around to invade America again. Bush has set things right!
The blood lust is satiated, bring ‘em all home.
’til next time.
“I guess we may just have to learn to be content in the knowledge that we avenged the 9/11 victims in Iraqi blood,”
Actually Obama is doing that even today – killing Afghanistan women and children even sneaking across into Pakistan and blowing up women and children there.
Obama is blood thirsty and just can’t get enough revenge.
Duncan Hunter was on Hardball, he used the “we water board our own troops” defense
The one about during survival train we water board so are you saying we torture our own troops?
No but every time I hear it is sounds like arguing that rape is not rape because it is basically is the same action as Consensual sex!.
I wish that someone could come up with a defense of the interrogation that does not sound like it was
thought up by a madman or some left handed logic.
BTW I noticed up thread the mention of giving them cookies. Did you forget that happened and it got the detainee to open up? The Detainee was diabetic and the interrogator brought him some sugar free cookies.
The Detainee was so impressed that he opened up and answered the questions. Seems he was expecting to be tortured and when there was an act of compassion. He did not know what to do. he had always been told the Americans were soul-less and evil.
Obama is blood thirsty and just can’t get enough revenge.
LOl so what are you saying he really was born in the United States?
Who needs to see a birth certificate, he is blood thirsty and can not get enough revenge!
Sorry to go there…
Who wasn’t after 9-11?
We also expose our troops to tear gas in basic training, thus if we wanted to use tear gas for any duration we might choose and as often as we liked, in getting prisoners to open up, who could question that?
COOKIES!
Writerdog is on to something now.
THE COOKIE INTERROGATION METHOD!
And if they are really good, they get milk with their cookies.
Jim deny reality if you like.
reggie,
“It works – attrition by demolition.”
Shouldn’t you have mentioned this to the Russians? That they just didn’t use enough bombs? How many do you suppose it will take, and how many lives and how much money will it cost? And is it worth it?
I’m curious: Is it even possible to violate Godwin’s law, when you have these idiots gleefully and unapologetically endorsing the tactics of totalitarian regimes?
It has been known for centuries that torture often yields only what the tortured thinks the torturer wants to hear.
I’d also like them to explain why America should function with such an utter lack of basic moral standards as any brutal dictatorship to ever foul the Earth. And why those who most often proclaim their superior moral judgment on their fellow citizens feel free to be utterly depraved when it comes to foreign nationals. Oh right: foreigners have no rights–we can shoot them for sport!! /sarcasmOFF.
Of course, if Cheney had his way, anyone—including US citizens–could have been held indefinitely and tortured, merely by being labeled, without proof, as enemy combatants.
Where were these imbeciles who equate health care reform with Nazism, when Obama quietly suggested violating the Magna Carta, US Constitution and Geneva Convention with indefinite “preventative detention”?
P.S. Look! Another “terrorist” got away!
Young Gitmo detainee released, meets Hamid Karzai
The Afghan, who said tortured into falsely confessing that he attacked US troops, has spent nearly one third of his life in the detention center.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2009/0825/p02s07-usju.html