If CIA interrogators engaged in torture, the blame extends to Congress, which has lacked “the courage and the energy to actually enact clear statutes on torture,” argues Salon’s Juan Cole. He calls the McCain anti-torture amendment of 2005 “watered down” and “easily interpreted away,” and noted that President Bush vetoed the most recent legislation in 2008. “The Democrats may only have a brief window through November of 2010 to get effective and unambiguous legislation on the books, and now we have a president who won’t veto it,” Cole writes.
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34 Comments
There are already laws against torture.
The problem is that what was done wasn’t torture.
“A_J_” –
The problem is the Shrub DOJ
weaselslawyers tortured the law and logic to within an inch of its life to retroactively rationalize and justify interrogation tactics America hanged Nazis and Japanese for 60 years ago.No constitutional court of law has addressed those issues.
It’s time they did.
AJ is right. I’m sorry, but water boarding is not torture. Torture is when someone is physically hurt to the point that they carry scars. Our veterans of war can tell you what torture is. They were beaten to the point that they were injured for life. Look at McCain, he had been beaten so many times that he cannot even lift his arm. And he is one of the lucky ones.
Remember what Saddam did to his people. He took the whole family and made the children watch his soldiers torture their parents. He cut off hands, he even went as far as putting them into grinding machines.
Then just take a look at what the Muslims do to their women, who do nothing but displease them like cooking a bad meal, talking to someone who says hi to them on the street or maybe the husband just had a bad day, etc.; they beat them with whips many times or even kill them. WHERE is the outcry for their torture?!
I mean really, these terrorists are laughing at us for punishing our own people for water boarding, making them stand on a box for many hours, playing loud music, etc and calling it torture? “What fools”, they say, “wait till we get a hold of them. We will show them what real torture is”.
You dem libs who would punish your own government for trying to protect YOU, are tying the very hands that will protect you from the terrorists who will kill you and even worse, keep you alive and show you what real torture is.
“but water boarding is not torture.”
Are you volunteering to be water boarded? I think we can accommodate you.
“BlueJay” challenges “TheBorgHunter” –
“Are you volunteering to be water boarded? I think we can accommodate you.”
Meet-Up opportunity!!!!
I don’t know about passing laws against torture-the way these tighty-righties around here howl, you’d think they’re being tortured by simply seeing a black semi-liberal president in the WHITE house.
And by the way borgie, after you’ve been waterboarded a hundred and eighty-some-odd times, maybe your opinion on whether or not it’s torture will count for something. Until then….
We do have to use this window of opportunity to put America back on track and start to reverse the damage done over the last decade.
BorgHunter, McCain is one
of the most outspoken opponents
of torture.
I hear your complaints loud & clear about the water boarding, but you seem to have a deaf ear on hands being cut off, women being whipped and people being put into grinding machines.
I tell you what, since you don’t think those are as bad as water boarding, I will volunteer to be water boarded as long as Jed, Monkeyhawk & BlueJay volunteer to be whipped, put into a grinder and have their hands cut off. You can all draw straws on who gets what.
I will gladly watch you go through your torture after I survive the water boarding that all of the other terrorists have survived. The question here is, will you survive yours? I can guarantee that the one who chooses the grinding machine, won’t.
Well you’re the one ready to tell us what is not torture there “borg”.
“Remember what Saddam did to his people”
And why should I believe that the intel on that is any better than the intel on weapons of mass destruction. And even if I did, how is it any of my affair?
When can we set up that waterboarding?
O’BAMA wants to use the Army Field Manual used by Military Intelligence for interrogation techniques.
Good luck with that, I wasn’t impressed when I went through some of it in survival training.
Shoot them in the field, be done with it. Let the terrorists know that surrender will not be an option for them.
“Remember what Saddam did to his people”
Ah, Borg, read yer history. The USA were fine with
him the 1980s whe he served our purposes
against Iran. Even Rummy went there to kiss
up to him. But when he wasn’t “useful” to us,
he suddenly was a bad guy. People like you
are so clueless about the real games Washington
DC plays it scares me more than any oversea
tyrant.
jed…….and your opinion will count when?..never
so bj……which method did you volunteer for?
LOL, ok BlueJay… Saddam was a great and wonderful guy.
I can’t believe anyone takes you seriously.
I don’t get it. Just how would allowing the U.S. to torture prisoners stop Saddam from putting people in grinders and whipping women; or stop anyone, for that matter. Will we torture them until they promise to stop?
Nathaniel posted August 28, 2009 at 11:00 am
LOL, ok BlueJay… Saddam was a great and wonderful guy.
———————
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blsaddamrumsfeld.htm
DorisKing says,
“Just how would allowing the U.S. to torture prisoners stop Saddam from putting people in grinders and whipping women; or stop anyone, for that matter. Will we torture them until they promise to stop?”
I believe that Regular has the right answer to your question for all of you wooses who can’t handle torture:
“Shoot them in the field, be done with it. Let the terrorists know that surrender will not be an option for them.”
I second that motion. And say Amen to that.
And since BlueJay didn’t volunteer for any of the tortures offered, I guess she can be included in this last option too.
Come get me Borgy.
When can we set up that waterboarding for ya?
“LOL, ok BlueJay… Saddam was a great and wonderful guy.”
I didn’t say that. One way or the other, how was it our affair?
Oh and I can tell you for a fact that no one I know takes you seriously Nathaniel.
“but water boarding is not torture.”
Are you volunteering to be water boarded? I think we can accommodate you.
Are you volunteering to torture? How very hypocritical of you.
BlueJay
Posted August 28, 2009 at 11:54 am | Permalink
“LOL, ok BlueJay… Saddam was a great and wonderful guy.”
I didn’t say that. One way or the other, how was it our affair?
Oh and I can tell you for a fact that no one I know takes you seriously Nathaniel.
————
BJ are you trying to upset Nathan by telling him this. I am sure he is crushed to think that your circle of friends don’t take him seriously. I know I would be. Not.
DorisKing says,
“Just how would allowing the U.S. to torture prisoners stop Saddam from putting people in grinders and whipping women; or stop anyone, for that matter. Will we torture them until they promise to stop?”
——————
I don’t know about the torture thingy but since Bush put him out of business he isn’t giving anymore acid baths, running rape rooms, putting people feet first in tree grinders, etc..
Guess Bush knew how to stop the man. Now if Obama can just figure out Afganistan as well.
okobserver posted August 28, 2009 at 12:14 pm
Guess Bush knew how to stop the man.
————————-
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blsaddamrumsfeld.htm
but since Bush put him out of business
Too bad Bush didn’t put the Saudis out of business — were most of the 9/11 hijackers came from. Mmmm…could be those Bush-Saudi business connections that the wingnuts also overlook…
What’s stopping the Democrats from passing an Anti-Torture law?
Can’t they define it?
Go ahead and pass it.
Just remember – never say never.
Ruffle,
“Are you volunteering to torture? How very hypocritical of you.”
If he volunteers for it, it ain’t torture, it’s masochism. Who are we to deny him his satisfaction?
Democrat Hall of Shame.
Frank Church. The Church commission in the mid seventies did untold damage to the intelligence apparatus of the U.S.
Jamie Gorelick. The wall of separation that she created during the Clinton years prevented our various Intelligence agencies from sharing info and resources just at the time that Islamic Jihadist’s were laying their plans for attacking us.
Barack Obama and Eric Holder. Proving once again that democrats are too stupid to learn from their past mistakes, they are planning to investigate and prosecute the CIA for so called torture. God only knows what horrible things will befall this nation as a result.
Why do Democrats hate America and her citizens?
Chris, who pays you to be a fan of torture, or were you born that way?? If you are so DAMNED sure waterboarding isnt torture, then can I assume you would be willing to show us all how wonderful it is??
We can use a public venue… And sell tickets… all proceeds to the returning war vets and their families….
Just let us know when you will be ready… And hey, we can even let Borgie hold your hand…. or we can let him do it with you, and double the proceeds to the vets and families…
Let see today is Friday…. Yesterday was Thursday…. Yesterday electric shock was torture… But today is Friday so it is not torture! Such arguments and so little reality in them. Water boarding was torture for over four hundred years and illegal in accordance with the laws of the land and international treaty. But when we do it then it is not! I can see clearly now….I did not rape my neighbor’s wife it was marital relations between to married people. She is married to my neighbor and I am married to my wife. So it was not rape!
Why do Democrats hate America and her citizens?
I often wonder why some many would wish to undermine just what has made America what it is?
My life and your is squat compare to what this country stands for, you die or I it will not matter.
If the United States soul dies this country dies too. Bin laden with a thousand planes slamming into a thousand building can not kill America. But you can or should I say we can and only we the people of the united States can kill America.
A land of laws that put the person above the order.
A people who holds the rights of man above their own personal interests.
That believes in freedom and liberty even if it means the individuals death to maintain it.
“oh no, the others loved the Constitution more, they loved liberty more, so these unwise laws were passed“. That is what Sen. Sessions of Al. said on the senate floor. I asked just what does he think it worth the defending with American blood and lives?
What inch of ground is so great, what manner of living it worth that cost to defend?
If not for that Constitution what would American be?
If not for those liberties who would these people be?
What follows is a part of something I wrote after 9-11, it was read on KFDI once:
“You think that by destroying my country, you can destroy me, you really do not know me.
If even with out a country, I would go on, with my dying breath I will still be. For it is not my life or breathe that is my being. It is what I stand for, it is the way of life, the way of thinking that will go on.
You can not, will not destroy me, try as you might, I can not be killed. For in every child’s heart, I shall live.
Your children, my own, in every child of God, I will live on. You may be able to cause me to stumble, you maybe able to cause me to weep, but you will not destroy me. In the hearts of children that have never heard my words, I too live in their hearts. And they too will defend my believes, with their very life.
To be free to live without terror, to worship without fear, to be at peace with those I live amongst.
I may not have to like their ways, but they will not have cause to fear me. Less they like you threaten my ways.”
That speaks of the America I live in, which America do you hate?
#
GMC70
Posted August 28, 2009 at 4:16 pm | Permalink
Go ahead and pass it.
Just remember – never say never.
————–
What GMC70 said. God only knows what perils will arise to demonstrate that point.
“outlander” ponders –
“God only knows what perils will arise to demonstrate that point.”
How ’bout if the Repubican Party steals another election?