Defense Secretary Robert Gates is understandably upset that Kansas Sens. Sam Brownback and Pat Roberts are blocking the appointment of a new secretary of the Army in an effort to keep Guantanamo Bay detainees from being transferred to Leavenworth. “The secretary is very disappointed,” the Pentagon press secretary told Politico. “We are fighting two wars at once, and the service that is bearing the biggest burden is the Army. So it needs and deserves this leadership.” A senior administration official called the senators’ procedural move “simply irresponsible.”
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50 Comments
The Guantanomo detainees should remain at Guantanomo Bay facility on the theory “if its not broken, don’t fix it.”
If that’s the position of Kansas Senators Pat Roberts and Sam Brownback, I agree with them. But their procedure should be to use the power of articulate persuasion. They should not be blocking a much needed Secretary of the Army, a leadership position needed by Secretary of Defense Robert Gates (raised in Wichita, 1961 graduate of East High School) in this time of world wide turmoil.
This happens all the time. Senators put a hold on a nomination in order to put pressure on an administration, get attention, force an issue. How many times did Democratic senators do it during the Bush administration? Try googling “Bush administration” and “hold on nomination” and you’ll see one case after another. The media didn’t criticize those because the media hated Bush. The Obama administration is trying to close Guantanamo as a detention center for terrorists for political reasons.
I disagree with that type of politics when the Democrats do it, and I disagree with it now. Confirm or not confirm on the merits of the nominee, not some other issue. Guys (Brownback and Roberts) get it done and move on.
BobChi
Posted August 13, 2009 at 7:15 am | Permalink
The Obama administration is trying to close Guantanamo as a detention center for terrorists for political reasons.
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That’s not the only reason. The administration also makes the case that closing Gitmo will improve national security going forward because prisoners held there now without trial would be tried and, if found guilty, transferred to Leavenworth, etc.
It would also improve national security by raising the reputation of the US as the world’s leading proponent of democracy. It would reassure the world that the US not only talks the talk of democracy, but we walk that talk, too.
To dismiss the closing of Gitmo as mere domestic politics as usual is wrong.
Gitmo is simply an additional mission (with attendant costs) of the Guantanamo Bay naval base. If we were to spend that money money in northeast Kansas — for construction, guards, support services — there’d be more jobs in and around Leavenworth County and fewer Cubans driving in to collect garbage, deliver canned goods, and a fair-sized contingent of Marines freed to go out and be, y’know, Marines instead of prison guards.
For the life of me I cannot imagine how the prisoners of Gitmo are any more dangerous thant the mother-rapers, father-stabbers, and father-rapers already in the pokey in Leavenworth County.
The government is gonna spend the money to incarcerate the Gitmo Gang somewhere.
Why not Kansas?
Brownback, Roberts, unpatriotic. We’re in the middle of two damn wars, and they want to hold up military leadership, just to have their way.
What happened to all those ks. singing “Don’t mess with the USA!”
Cowards all.
Perhaps Gates should be disappointed in himself for nodding yes to every O’BAMA decision.
There is nothing wrong with Guantanamo, let it stay the way it is.
All things considered, Guantanamo isn’t such a bad place to keep these prisoners. The chances of escaping from Gitmo are as close to zero as it gets. Cuba is an island; there’s really no place to escape to. And if someone should escape, what, they blend in with the Cuban population? Hardly. Gitmo is a paradise compared to Cuban prisons.
If they get loose in ks., they’ll just blend in right?
Why not Kansas?
Why the simple answer is that every one knows those detainees are better men then live in Kansas!
Yes they have big muscles and can lift cars over their heads. And they are so much smarter then the men in Kansas too! Not to mention they are said to be better lovers too and we men in Kansas are afraid they will steal our women. We are just afraid we can not compete with a bunch of detainees locked up behind bars.
It will be so embarrassing as we cry sad tears pleading with our wives to come home and stop stand outside the prison exposing themselves to these better men.
Phantom
Posted August 13, 2009 at 9:44 am | Permalink
If they get loose in ks., they’ll just blend in right?
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Of course. Who in the world would ever take note of swarthy furtive Arab speakers in the middle of Red State America?
/sarcasm
Regular – I think the GOP should start listening to the REAL Republicans like Gates and Colin Powell and stop kissing the butts of the Right-Wingers currently in power at the GOP.
Gates knows what needs to be done and people like you and other GOP fringies want to tie his hands just to make political points?
Brownback and Roberts helped make the mess of Gitmo and they need to now clean up their own mess.
But, I’m not holding my breath – that would take some serious patriotism and actual caring about our country and that, I’m afraid, are two factors in the current GOP that is sorely lacking!!!
But, hey, look who I’m talking to – a person who still hates Jimmy Carter because he supposedly never sent pencils for Regular and Regular had to bring in his own.
By God – where are my pencils?? Never mind the fact we have real people losing their lives – Regular needs his pencils!!!!
totoinks
Posted August 13, 2009 at 9:56 am | Permalink
Regular – I think the GOP should start listening to the REAL Republicans like Gates and Colin Powell
================================
HA HA!
I just puked a little in my mouth….
Which would be an argument that Everyone of age, should have a living will. Grassley’s point is that older people shouldn’t be making these decisions, I guess.
Usually, a younger person isn’t going to have a dnr if they flat line, while an older person in poor shape to begin with might want a dnr. I think they should be updated periodically.
For the life of me I cannot imagine how the prisoners of Gitmo are any more dangerous thant the mother-rapers, father-stabbers, and father-rapers already in the pokey in Leavenworth County.
———————————————
Did they make you sit on the Group W bench?
Don’t expect Americans in the homeland to make any sacrifices, it’s the republican way
Our prisoners would scare the hell out of Al-Quida suspects.
Phantom
Posted August 13, 2009 at 10:09 am | Permalink
Don’t expect Americans in the homeland to make any sacrifices, it’s the republican way
====================================
Why should we, when there is a perfectly good prison in Cuba?
Phantom
Posted August 13, 2009 at 10:09 am | Permalink
Don’t expect Americans in the homeland to make any sacrifices, it’s the republican way
———————————————
Seems to me that over 4000 American famlies in the homeland have made a very significant sacrifice. Dont know how many were R and how many were D but does it really matter?
Gates and Colin Powell have never been elected to anything, they have been appointed.
Holding position at Cabinet level gives one a different view of the world – sometimes complacent with whoever is in charge.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with GITMO other than Libs whining about it and passing untrue stories about torture and inhuman conditions.
GITMO has been inspected and passed with flying colors by the International Red Cross and other agencies.
totoinks, it was more than just pencils, it was aircraft that couldn’t get parts, navy ships stuck in harbors because there was no money for repairs, soldiers, sailors, marines and airmen on welfare because they couldn’t afford food.
But do keep up with the pencils mantra, it makes you look like another small-minded liberal dumb-azz.
“Freebird1971″ –
You busted me.
This isn’t exactly the forum one expects many to pick up on Arlo Guthrie references.
Regarding your question about our respective fellowships, I’ve learned to avoid talking all that much about the respective programs until there’s a much better mutual and personal understanding than ours has.
If you want to send me an off-WE Blog e-mail address I might respond with a throw-away account of my own.
But some of the things we’d discuss are just not appropriate for a public forum.
And, just for the record, the “white-knuckled dry drunk” reference was an inside joke. As was, “You need a meeting.”
Keep coming back.
Why are we still holding foreign nationals without charge? Don’t we fail our own people badly enough without earning a bad international reputation?
“Phantom” boasts –
“Our prisoners would scare the hell out of Al-Quida suspects.”
And then they’d convert them to Islam!!!
(Oh, wait….)
MH,
Thanks guess we are showing our age
Freebird, MH … ah, memories … Group W bench … for littering … and baing a public nuisence …
….. and don’t forget the fact that justice in this case was indeed blind,isnt that right Officer Obie?
BRH,
Wonder how many who are reading our posts are saying WTF are they talking about.
BTH,sorry CTS syndrome acting up
Probably quite a few … :)
I’ll give them a hint:
You can get anything you want … exceptin Alice …
If I were writing propaganda against Health Insurance Reform (and I could; as an ad man I’m a professional propagandist), I’d figure out a way for Glen Beck to recite:
“…injected, inspected, detected, infected, neglected and selected.”
That’s probably why the CONs have shot their wad with “Death Panels” and birth certificates; no imagination. No wit. Nothing, really.
Instead, we get SOCIALISM!!!!” and “Don’t let GOVERNMENT get its hands on my Medicare!”
Discussing health coverage reform with WE Blog CONs feels too much like booing at the Special Olympics; repulsive to even think about.
On May 24 I personally met a “death panel”: my insurance carrier. I had just been released from Wesley Hospital and needed a critical injectable medication. Dillons tried to get approval for it but they said it had to be filled through their own mail-order pharmacy – which was CLOSED for Memorial Day weekend. Not taking this medication could have caused death by heart attack or stroke. They didn’t care.
Fortunately I could come up with the $480 for a three-day supply and stay alive – now I am still fighting to get it reimbursed.
They still have not paid Sedgwick County EMS for saving my life and transporting me to the ER. Maybe their death panel does not believe that should be covered.
I’m sorry to hear that you’ve experienced bad health, bth. But I am even more tickled to know you are posting here and did survive! Best of everything in your continued recovery, even the part about having to fight your insurance company to get benefits you’re entitled to.
$480?!
Holy moly. I guess it’s fortunate you had that kind of spare cash around.
Hope you’re better, bth. Congrats on surviving the greatest health care on Planet Earth, the health care that the rest of the world is dying to get!
Glad your back kicking the tires and pounding the sidewalk Ben.
I always use Walgreens, never had a problem with them.
Walgreens was the same story. Problem was not Dillons – it was the insurance company.
My health care – at all levels – was great. The problems lie in the ‘business’ end. Not just the part above but reluctance of a hospital to accept ‘reasonable and customary’ payments as well.
A plug for Sedgwick County EMS – they were great! (Except they didn’t give me a teddy bear – said my 5 grandkids would fight over it)
I take a pill called Agranox (spelling?) it’s for Stroke prevention and fairly expensive.
The physician in charge of my care at Wesley made sure I had a 30 day supply of it before I check out of Wesley. This was of course, put on my hospital bill, more expensive than an outpatient pharmacy, but the prudent thing to do.
It’s when your health insurance is put to the test that you learn of the problems — and this just happens to be the time you should be able to concentrate on recovery and getting well! Sure isn’t the time to find out what you’ve paid for doesn’t give you the security you need without hassles.
Regular – in retrospect they probably should have given me a 10-day supply (20 syringes) but the ‘assumption’ was that with a Walgreens or Dillons on every corner that should not have been needed.
“The physician in charge of my care at Wesley made sure I had a 30 day supply of it before I check out of Wesley. This was of course, put on my hospital bill, more expensive than an outpatient pharmacy, but the prudent thing to do.”
Just another area that needs to be looked at and included in health-care reform. We have the potential to make great improvements in the costs and the delivery system of health care for all Americans. Pretty exciting!
A sacrifice imparts some fore knowledge of events which you’ll be involved in. Those 4000 were more aptly victims.
Regular – interesting that the approach is to INCREASE costs just to get around the ‘death panels’
#
lindainks55
Posted August 13, 2009 at 12:40 pm | Permalink
“The physician in charge of my care at Wesley made sure I had a 30 day supply of it before I check out of Wesley. This was of course, put on my hospital bill, more expensive than an outpatient pharmacy, but the prudent thing to do.”
Just another area that needs to be looked at and included in health-care reform. We have the potential to make great improvements in the costs and the delivery system of health care for all Americans. Pretty exciting!
————————————–
That would be more of a policy of pharmacies’ administration than the Government.
I suppose one could pass yet another regulation, but costs will be added on of course to maintain 24/7 service.
Did you miss this part of the post bth made?
“Walgreens was the same story. Problem was not Dillons – it was the insurance company.”
You see the goal of health care insurance reform is to make the entire system more efficient, more accessible, more affordable for ALL Americans. Worthy goal, don’t you think? One worthy of cooperation, truth, respect and hard work by all involved.
If everyone stops trying to make someone wrong, and everyone puts their heads together we can do it!
Linda,
Let us know when it’s time for milk and cookies.
I don’t disagree lindainks – just saying that the government is not the answer for everything.
There may be a way to contact Walmart or Dillions and ask them about their policies.
I imagine the local pharmacist or physician groups could get involved as well.
McDonalds went to 24/7 at some stores, who know – maybe we could get lucky. :D
Regular – you fail to read what I wrote: the issue was NOT Dillons policy. It was and is the insurance company policy.
Unless, of course, you are expecting Dillons or WalMart to give me the meds for free as charity.
Dillons was open. The insurance mail-order was not.
And all it took to was $480 of bth’s money — not the insurance company’s money because they weren’t payin’ because the insurance company’s mail-order pharmacy were off for the holiday — to get the syringes.
But bth was covered by his insurance policy. What happened is the insurance company didn’t do its job and bth was thus at risk.
Of course now bth is left to fight for reimbursement, something else that in addition to coughing up $480 of his own money he he should never have had to do.
Question. What if bth didn’t have $480 in pocket change? What then? Wait until Tuesday and hope for the best?!
Oh yeah, best health care system in the world baby!
Phantom
Posted August 13, 2009 at 1:34 pm | Permalink
A sacrifice imparts some fore knowledge of events which you’ll be involved in. Those 4000 were more aptly victims.
—————————————-
Typical of you,denegrating the deaths of those who chose to join the military,putting themselves in harms way,they could have refused to go,but they didn’t,they put the country before themselves,something people of your ben are always calling the rest of us to do. So to call them a victim just shows what you think of the military and those who put others first
Freebird1971,
When I read your comment about the 4000 families who made a sacrifice I thought you were referring to the families of those who died on 9-11 since the topic of this thread is the detainees at Guantanamo.
I can’t speak for Phantom, but I suspect that he read your comment the same way. It’s obvious that those who died serving in Iraq and Afghanistan did so with the full knowledge that they were willingly putting themselves in harm’s way…that is sacrifice. Those who died on 9-11 at the WTC and Pentagon had just showed up for work one sunny Tuesday morning like they had countless times before. They were victims.
BTW…I love that song. T-95 plays it every year at noon on Thanksgiving and we gather the kids around and we all sing along during the appropriate parts. I have a copy of the song somewhere on my computer, but it just doesn’t seem right listening to it on any other day.
Freeb,
A couple years ago I had a long talk with two of my granddaughter’s friends who had been talked to by army recruiting sergeants. Not once did the recruiter mention the possibility of perforation, and somehow it had never occurred to to them that they might end up in a war zone with actual bombs and bullets that actually kill people. The nearest thing these kids had experienced to war was video games. All they were thinking about was getting job training. They weren’t choosing to make a sacrifice, they were being sacrificed.