Washington Post columnist E.J. Dionne noted how wannabe peacemaker President Obama aggravated the culture war in tapping Gov. Kathleen Sebelius to be his secretary of Health and Human Services, because she’s a Catholic who has vetoed anti-abortion legislation and otherwise upset social conservatives. But Dionne observed that liberal Catholic groups have pushed back in Sebelius’ defense, in part because abortion has declined in Kansas 10 percent since she took office. He wrote: “The rapid mobilization behind Sebelius marked the emergence of an organized movement of religious progressives as a forceful counterweight to religious conservatives, and it brought home the centrality of abortion reduction to the overall argument.”
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50 Comments
The silver lining on the Republican recession is the number of abortions performed in Kansas on out of state women should increase. That’ll bring in tourist dollars and tax revenue to the state. Unless, of course, more states adopt Democratic policies of good sex ed (not abstinence, hint Bristol Palin) and increased access to affordable contraception.
However economics is the main reason for abortion, that’s why Republicans, who manage to ruin economies, help to increase the number of abortions. You know, the sort of thing they claim to be against.
“Maggotpunk” –
It’s pretty early in the morning for deep sarcasm.
It’s funny, mind you.
But I need a cup of coffee.
“But Dionne observed that liberal Catholic groups have pushed back in Sebelius’ defense, in part because abortion has declined in Kansas 10 percent since she took office.”
Any evidence that this is due to Sibelius’ policies?
No way is the decrease in any way attributable to the most anti-life governor ever elected. $ebeliu$ would allow the abortion of full-term babies if she could. She’s one of those radical feminazis like Justice Ginsburg who thought Roe v. Wade didn’t go far enough and should allow abortions at any time. Any lady who takes hundreds of thousands from Tiller the Killer, Wichita’s own Josef Mengele, can’t be credited for any drop in abortion. $ebeliu$ probably wishes the numbers had gone up 10 percent.
OK inferior one – to what to YOU ascribe the reduction? It IS, in fact, due to the pro-life policies Sebelius has fostered in this state.
It is interesting that you advocates of illegal abortion tend to oppose policies that are actually effective at reducing demand. All you want is policies that increase the illegal trade you support so strongly.
Sebelius is personally opposed to abortion, but like many of us, she is smart enough to know that outlawing abortion won’t stop it. The answer is to do everything possible to stop unwanted pregnancies. By outlawing abortion, many women will risk their lives obtaining illegal ones. As awful as I belive abortion is, I think forcing women to have children they don’t want is worse.
“By outlawing abortion, many women will risk their lives obtaining illegal ones.”
Mary, don’t you understand? THAT IS WHAT THE ADVOCATES OF ILLEGAL ABORTION WANT!
Ben has it pegged. He was able to see through fluff and discern the true motivations. Clearly pro-lifers aren’t concerned about the babies, their goal is to “force” women to risk their lives on illegal abortions.
Jeesh. I need another cup of coffee.
“Mary, don’t you understand? THAT IS WHAT THE ADVOCATES OF ILLEGAL ABORTION WANT!”
No, I don’t think so…most pro life people are firm in their belief that all human life should be cherished and respected…me included. Unfortunately, we live in a society where life is is not valued. Look how many Americans supported an unnecessary war that took the lives of over a 100,000 Iraqis, around a million abortions are performed each year, and over 30,000 Americans die from gun violence each year. Millions of Americans are without access to basic health care, which directly results in the deaths of approximately 18 million Americans each year.
It’s pretty obvious that there is little respect or reverance for life in this country.
“Clearly pro-lifers aren’t concerned about the babies, their goal is to “force” women to risk their lives on illegal abortions.”
For most “pro life” posters here at least, that is an apt description.
Mary you do walk the walk.
But?
“most pro life people are firm in their belief that all human life should be cherished and respected”
That is simply not true. We see examples of that here all the time.
Mary – I am differentiating between “pro-life” (which includes you, me, my wife, Sebelius) and those who are only “anti” and oppose safety-net support which actually reduces demand.
I understand…it always seems like the ones who are most vocal against abortion are also the ones who are the first to condemn anyone who doesn’t live according to their standards.
You’re also right, BJ…look how many who are opposed to abortion don’t think a thing about all the Iraqi children who died at the hands of our government.
And consider this Mary – if they are that judgemental toward a girl who “gets in trouble” that drives her to hide it and ‘terminate’ it.
Let us not forget those who are simply not prepared to be parents, either now, or ever due to either lifestyle or mental illness. I think being pro-choice is far more pro-life than is given credit for.
Look at the things Parkay says on here, and I outright point out his hypocrisy and either he doesn’t get it, or he does and ignores it. He’s always posting this mother dumped baby, or abused baby, or had illegal abortion… and he still advocates for punishing women with babies that they do not want and cannot care for.
It appears to me that people like Newman believe that a woman’s role is to be breeder and mother and that’s it. Outside that realm, they are scum and deserve whatever they get.
oh and about Catholics, you can’t pigeon hole all the catholics together. They’re as diverse as a group as the rest of our society. You’ve got the fundie nutty side, and then you have the liberal side. I do find it funny how the fundy side tries to guilt trip other catholics with their bumper sticker that says “you can’t be both pro-choice and catholic”.
Then there are the Illegal Abortion Advocates who got all upset this week when government paid for a 9-year-old rape/incest victim’s abortion.
Yeah, fundies. I’m sure that’s what Jesus had in mind…
Unreal that they would insist a 9 year old victim of incest not be allowed an abortion. You know they believe that 9 year old should just take one for the team.
Speaking of the Catholic Heirarchy and abortion, here is a bit of insanity going on in Brazil.
http://news.scotsman.com/world/Church-bars-mother-after-.5045730.jp
Archbishop Jose Cardoso Sobrinho should be be thrown in Pope Benedict’s face every time he presumes to lecture a head of state about their ethics. What the HELL is ethical about making a nine year old child carry twins to term, and punishing every person who helped this girl with excommunication in the most Catholic nation in the world? Sobrinho’s actions are beyond reprehensible.
And to call the nomination of Kathleen Sebelius an aggravation of the culture war just demonstrates how extreme some of the voices of that culture war, including within the Catholic Church, have become.
It seems to me that catholics who support the Church’s doctines on social justice lean toward being reluctantly pro-choice. The anti-choicers tend to oppose Church teachings on social justice. In fact, I seem to recall Paul “Econ101″ telling us that the Church is wrone on economic justice.
And to bring it around to the here and now, Sam (the Sham) Brownback has apparently turned his back on his crazy cult of demi-Catholics in the interest of political expediency.
Here we’ve got a United States Senator so deep into Opus Dei he wears a barbed-wire jock strap as an act of self-mortification… who finds it opportune to get Sebelius’s fund-raising abilities out of Kansas in time for the 2010 elections.
Catholics are my children too.
“Here we’ve got a United States Senator so deep into Opus Dei he wears a barbed-wire jock strap as an act of self-mortification… who finds it opportune to get Sebelius’s fund-raising abilities out of Kansas in time for the 2010 elections.”
Snort!
(smirks)
(laughs)
Jesus, Regular, it’s getting old.
And please tell me how a Middle-Eastern man can look so WASPish. The person in the photo (obviously not Christ) is about as Jewish as St. Patrick.
“And please tell me how a Middle-Eastern man can look so WASPish. The person in the photo (obviously not Christ) is about as Jewish as St. Patrick.”
And yet it is interesting how this is the popular face of Jesus in so much of the public’s mind.
However, PreD, you gotta admit it would have been funny if the troll had posted the Viking Jesus picture right before a post that started with…
“Jesus, Regular, it’s getting old.”
Predestined posted March 7, 2009 at 11:23 am
Jesus, Regular, it’s getting old.
————————
He started doing it last night.
Predestined posted March 7, 2009 at 11:23 am
Jesus, Regular, it’s getting old.
————————
He started doing it last night.
http://blogs.kansas.com/weblog/2009/03/unemployment-keeps-climbing/#comment-532744
http://jesusoftheweek.com/
I wonder if the net nanny would catch a porn pix; someone with the html mettel please try it for me.
I would also point out that a “full-term baby” can not be aborted. Nor can one born premature.
I saw the pics from yesterday, too, cosmos. This morning about 4. It’s a wonder I didn’t dream of “long-haired-hippy-freaks” during those 5 hours of sleep managed. ;)
As far as I’m concerned, posting a WASPish Jesus IS porn.
I don’t think this blog has a ‘net nanny.’ Rarely, and I think only if a poster complains (and it is the the right poster doing the complaining, the right day, right time of day, all the stars are aligned just right), a post is removed.
Also rarely, a poster is removed for the time it takes them to register with a new nic.
More often if ‘they’ (whoever that is!) are bothered with adequate numbers of complaints, we see a new filter that puts more of the legitimate posts into moderation limbo, and does absolutely nothing to reduce the profane or the abusive posts.
I wonder if the net nanny would catch a porn pix; someone with the html mettel please try it for me.
No thanks. If the blog allows anyone to blat a jpg anywhere, it certainly won’t have image-recognition capabilities. I’d rather not get booted for something that pointless! :)
Has anyone ever been booted? I’ve tried everything I can think of.
Has anyone ever been booted? I’ve tried everything I can think of.
Yeah. Pleefer said he got booted for two days for registering a second nic. I’m pretty sure that at least one of the persistent cons had to re-register under a new nic.
Why not abort yourself Beber? From all of the boards.
Ah, P.M., but it’s no fun unless someone does it to you. You of all people should know that.
I am still wanting to know what particular policy Sebelius put in place which can be accounted to reducing the number of abortions in the state. There may be some, but I just don’t know of any.
She’s pro-comprehensive sex education instead of abstinence only, she’s pro funding birth control measures that help prevention.
Thank god we have someone who will veto the con’s plans to have no birth control and no abortion.
Political Mama, Are you saying that Sebelius put comprehensive sex education in the schools where it is used now and that this occurred during her term of office or that she kept pro-life people from taking comprehensive sex education away? Same thing with government funding of birth control…..I am just uncertain that she is the cause of abortions going down in Kansas.
I’ve also read that chemical abortions (private at home use of Mifeprex or other perscriptions) account for 20% of abortions….however the Guttmacher Institute doesn’t count these as abortions in their statistics. This is the reason some account for the number of abortions being down.
Deb – I would point to support of ’safety net’ programs including but not limited to Healthwave and support for new mothers. All those ’socialism’ programs.
I support similar efforts through Catholic Charities.
Much of what the anti-abortion preachers say isn’t about sweet little babies; it’s about the obedience of women to a role model that keeps them in second-class status. Note that many conservative churches demand that the enforced ideal for a woman should be marriage, absolute faithfulness, submission to her husband (and his sexual desires) and no birth control of any kind. In other words, a woman is nothing more than a servant to her husband and a means for him to make more good little christians as often as he desires. She is not allowed a say in any aspect of her life.
“Oh, the heart is the fortune of all womankind.
They’re always controlled, they’re always confined,
Controlled by their parents until they are wives
And then slaves to their husbands the rest of their lives.”
-Traditional-
Here’s the catholic view of women’s lib:
VATICAN CITY (Reuters) – Feminists of the world sit down before you read this. The Vatican newspaper says that perhaps the washing machine did more to liberate women in the 20th century than the pill or the right to work.
The submission was made in a lengthy article titled “The Washing Machine and the Liberation of Women – Put in the Detergent, Close the Lid and Relax.”
Will anyone address how Planned Parenthood’s founder was deeply involved during the 1920s and 1930s with the German Nazis and that this group still abides by her teachings and directions, still based on ugly racial eugenics and bad racism?
cafrench, because it’s not true? Nice that you need to lie and create a strawman to promote your anti-abortion agenda. It tells a lot about you.