Illinois Gov. Rod Blagojevich has been arrested on federal charges alleging that he tried to sell or trade the Senate seat now open by the presidential election of Barack Obama. A wiretap caught the Democrat calling the Senate seat, which he considered taking himself, “a valuable thing – you just don’t give it away for nothing.” He’s also alleged to have illegally threatened to withhold state assistance to Tribune Co., related to the sale of Wrigley Field, unless members of the Chicago Tribune’s editorial board were fired. “The breadth of corruption laid out in these charges is staggering,” said U.S. Attorney Patrick J. Fitzgerald.
Corruption looks like a bipartisan thing in the Illinois governor’s office. The state’s last governor, Republican George Ryan, is serving six years for racketeering and fraud. Two other governors since 1961, both Democrats, have ended up serving prison time.
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99 Comments
They need to get their political system purged. No place in govt. for corruption, or influence peddling with the media (like the wh has attempted).
No place in govt. for corruption, or influence peddling with the media (like the wh has attempted).
Hell, Phantom – since when has gov’t done much – under either party – except corruption, or influence peddling?
In large part, that’s gov’t’s name of the game, certainly, in Chicago politics (where this is normal behavior). And it’s inevitable, the larger that gov’t becomes, and the more gov’t’s tentacles extend into the larger society, that same will expand with it.
I read what I could of the indictment, and I don’t think it will fly. Basically, you can’t conspire with people to do something illegal with people who are telling you it can’t be done because it is illegal.
Now let us go toodle off and see what we can find out about the U.S. Attorney who brought the charges. Ho-de-ho.
Also, it appears at least one of those caught on the wire taps is probably working for the U.S. Attorney. I would say Deputy Governor A. Illinois has several Deputy Governors.
Yeah. Go figure about Illinois.
Part of the story about the 1960 election was, yes, the Daley Machine cooked the books in Chicago but Nixon didn’t contest it because he knew the downstate Republic Party hacks had stuffed ballot boxes, too.
It’s like the adage: “Pick your enemies carefully, for they will become the ones you will closest resemble.” (Something like that.)
Still, ya gotta wonder. After all the prospect of replacing Obama in the Senate only became an issue on November 4th. Was Blagojevich so obviously corrupt Fitzgerald immediately went after him? Was there a fishing expedition prior to the election and finally they found something to hang on him?
It may be if you’re elected governor of Illinois the safe bet is you’re corrupts. I dunno. It just seems five weeks since Obama’s election is a pretty short window for a gubernatorial perp walk.
Patrick Fitzgerald. I didn’t know he was the u.s. attorney for the northern Ill. district. When you read up on him, you find wheels within wheels. No doubt B. is a criminal scumbag, but though he apparently wanted something for his Senate appointee, it is difficult from the indictment to see just who he might have conspired with. Hint: I do not think Mr. Fitzgerald is the corruption-free golden boy everyone seems to think he is. Anyway, the indictment in its entirity is posted now, so off I toodle.
I think the pay to play investigation had been going on for a couple of years, and Rezko was also involved, but no splash back on Obama.
I hit “send” prematurely.
One of the reasons Eliot Spiitzer got elected governor in New York was his record as a “reformer.” Then we found out about his $3,000 a night hooker habit.
Fitzgerald was the prosecutor who nailed Scooter Libby. So maybe he’s the equal-opportunity reformer Illinois needs. Or perhaps this indictment is simply a “best defense is an aggressive offense” tactic on his part.
It’ll be interesting to watch.
Change is coming???
Funny . . . when Patrick Fitzgerald was on the case against the Bush White House for “outing” covert CIA agent Valerie Plame Wilson, the CONs couldn’t contain their bile against him.
Now that he’s going after a Democratic governor–and it sounds like he should be–he will be the epitome of legal jurisprudence.
IL is an interesting state. I lived there and experienced firsthand the corruption of Ryan (Republican) and knew people who dealt with the corrupt Chicago machine (Democrat). IL is an equal opportunity corrupt state.
We do however have to be on our guard. Patrick Fitzgerald has an evil nemesis:
Gerald Fitzpatrick.
GRAND JURY SUBPOENAS ISSUED ON REZKO/OBAMA LAND DEAL…
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/oct/18/whistleblower-hits-obama-friends-appraisal/
Isn’t Illinois/Chicago politics fun.
CraponAmerica chimes in with Plame…please…try and stay current.
————————————-
Blagojevich must have thought he was Al Capone re-incarnated and wanted to run the Illinois state government like a mob boss.
Next time he goes after a repub, he’ll be the scum of the earth and accused of partianship, again. It’s the Repub way.
Obama has many strange bed fellows.
What do you want to bet that Obama appoints a new Illinois federal judge or prosecutor to keep his own ass covered?
Obama must be pissed at Blag for calling him a “motherf***er”. Just like Al Capone and Buggs Moran, the Chicago mobsters eat their own. Valentine’s Day will be here in a few months. Will we see another massacre.
?
Oh boy don’t you guys hope that Obama is in this deep?! Oh boy what a great day that will be for you all!!! LOL!
Republican [now Regular]
Posted July 2, 2007 at 8:54 pm | Permalink
Fitzgerald even had the presiding Judge issue an order for Armitage not to discuss what he knew about the case, so Fitzgerald could perform his legal lynching on Libby.
*****
Yup, back then, Fitzgerald was a lying sack of crap.
Now that he’s going after Democrats?
Not so much . . .
I personally think Obama will have everyone killed in a cover up…you know the Chicago way. LOL! I am kidding.
“CraponAmerican” lol
I like your style Reg.
Fitzgerald was a lying sack of crap.
===============
Well, he is a lawyer after all.
Doesn’t the governor know that he should’ve taken the Senate seat himself before deciding to be corrupt? You’ll get a standing ovation in the Senate when you are busted for being corrupt.
CraponAmerica,
Fitzgerld is a typical trial lawyer wanting to make a name for himself. The only crap are the piles you keep stepping in.
Glad to see you’re so easily amused, DonnDublin.
I picked this nic because I thought it was something that you CONs couldn’t ridicule.
I was wrong.
Some [military] vets are just too stupid to help. Regular, direct quote.
Laugh at that while you’re at it, DonnyBoy . . .
I wouldn’t worry about it Capt. he is copying it from Regular anyway.
Hank Price
Posted June 13, 2006 at 12:56 pm | Permalink
Dear Randy,
Charges against Scooter will be dropped before the end of the year. Shortly after November elections.
Hank
Heh, thanks, DaveR.
No wonder Regular-Republican didn’t want to talk about the Plame affair:
Republican [now Regular]
Posted July 7, 2007 at 10:03 am | Permalink
There was no underlying crime in Libby’s case [even though he was convicted and the sentence was confirmed on appeal].
Perhaps the NY Lawyers need to go back to Law school.
*****
That is, “I hate Fitzgerald because he was right.”
“The only crap are the piles you keep stepping in.”
Capn – quit stepping on donny.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIt_QbLfnlc&eurl
Blagojevich survellience shows that the indicted Gov. didn’t like how Obama refused to “play ball.”
I hope Obama turns out to be as good as he seems to be right now . . .
This just goes to show how silly it is to endorse a more bloated and robust government.
Many politicians in high places are either incompetent or corrupt. Which would you prefer?
You really want guys like this making decisions which will have a greater impact on how you and other people in your community live their lives?
Bigger government is not helpful.
You want Change? Change yourself.
Thankfully he didn’t. A presidential scandal is the last thing this country needs.
Although praising Obama for not being unethical shows how low our standards are.
The hair, the hair…Oh my God, the hair…..
Dennis
YellowdogLiberal
Posted December 9, 2008 at 3:15 pm | Permalink
The hair, the hair…Oh my God, the hair…..
————–
Ha Ha! He kinda reminds me of a mortician!
Keep on pissing backwards you pathetic lefties. Somebody turned on a light in Illinois and all the Democrat cockroaches are scurrying for cover. Has anybody bothered to check over in Dover to see how much the going price is for Biden’s seat.
Change we can believe in?
This is just an isolated event, go back to sleep.
This is the same Democratic Chicago machine that Obama popped his cherry on. Like my environmental engineer clients say: Sh*t flows down hill.
Yea – those evil Democrats:
“The state’s last governor, Republican George Ryan, is serving six years for racketeering and fraud.”
I knew Ryan’s corruption all too well from my time in IL.
don – there are TWO Democratic Parties in Chicago. Obama was in the other one.
This blog is hilarious. The very same people that were wetting their pants with joy over Republican arrests are now attacking the prosecutor.
How phoney can you be? This is my first and last post on this ridiculous, infantile and incredibly inane blog. You people are a joke.
Thanks for your contribution! Hope you find a place where people are genuine, serious, mature, and each post is meaningful. When you find that place you may want to read awhile to get the hang of such a blogging experience so you won’t be the first to detract from the perfection of the blog.
“The very same people that were wetting their pants with joy over Republican arrests are now attacking the prosecutor.”
Who’s attacking the prosecutor? I’ve seen praise for him.
Sounds like this guy has been at it for a while. Doesn’t make you real comfortable that our president to be cut his political teeth in the sewer of Chicago politics.
———–
Monday, June 23, 2008
Rod Blagojevich:The Reasonable Suspicion of Ilinois’ Ethically Challenged Governor,Chicago Mob Ties and Ghost Payrolling
After the Tony Rezko conviction,the talk of impeaching Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich is a subject of political conversation in Illinois.Mike Madigan,the Democratic Speaker of the Illinois House of Representatives, has distributed a memo on the subject of impeaching Rod Blagojevich.Illinois has never had a Governor impeached,so to some this is shocking.
Years ago,one of the Chicago media’s top sources, Robert Cooley warned several top Chicago media people that Rod Blagojevich would go on to become one of the most corrupt Governor’s in Illinois history.Why? because Cooley warned Blagojevich would be a “hands on” guy.Where some politicians have cut outs to handle their corrupt dealings,other politicians take a more activist role.
http://nalert.blogspot.com/2008/06/rod-blagojevichthe-reasonable-suspicion.html
He looks more like a televangelist with that hair and close set eyes. Obviously his character is the same as one…he may have a future with the religious right if he doesn’t end up in jail first.
“he may have a future with the religious right if he doesn’t end up in jail first.”
He can do BOTH – they like that sort of thing.
“Sounds like this guy has been at it for a while. Doesn’t make you real comfortable that our president to be cut his political teeth in the sewer of Chicago politics.”
So? Prepares him well for dealing with the Republics in Congress.
#
bth
Posted December 9, 2008 at 5:34 pm | Permalink
Yea – those evil Democrats:
“The state’s last governor, Republican George Ryan, is serving six years for racketeering and fraud.”
I knew Ryan’s corruption all too well from my time in IL.
#
bth
Posted December 9, 2008 at 5:38 pm | Permalink
don – there are TWO Democratic Parties in Chicago. Obama was in the other one.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Yeah right bennie,
I have several colleagues and clients who have lived in the Chicago area for 20 years. The only TWO parties are the TWO mob families which own all the politicians in that area of Illinois. There’s been only one party in Chicago since before the mayor stole the 1960 presidential election. The town’s not big enough for “TWO” bosses.
Well donny; as a suburban Republican I worked a lot with Chicago reform Democrats. They are the ones trying to undermine the bosses; that is why they formed an alliance with suburban Republicans.
“He looks more like a televangelist with that hair and close set eyes. Obviously his character is the same as one…he may have a future with the religious right if he doesn’t end up in jail first.”
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I think he looks more like a lib puppet who wanted to be a real boy. Kinda reminds me of howdie doodie with dark hair.
For how long ben? One campaign season?
A bit over three years. How long were YOU involved in Chicago area politics?
You lefties are really pathetic tonight. He is one of yours. Trying to identify him with your prototype of a ‘right wing evangelist’ shows your desperation and also how wrong your characterizations are when it comes to the right.
“The hair!”
————
He was going for the Bobby Kennedy look.
http://www.vanityfair.com/magazine/toc/2008/toc200806
Come on okobserver. He may be bad, but he’s no Sarah Palin.
Outlander I know that. I mean I bet he would never try to get someone fired just for tasing a 10 year old, or drinking on the job – as a state trooper no less, or threatening to kill his father in law.
No all he did was try to sell a US Senate seat. Small potatoes for sure.
Apparently, Rahm outed him. Now wouldn’t that be a feather in the Obama transition teams cap.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385×248597
JM what better way to distance yourself from what you knew about before it hit the fan?
Just kidding of course. I don’t want Obama to be involved. We need a prez not a scandal.
I don’t see how this goes anywhere.
As Governor, it is within his duties to appoint who ever he likes to the Senate seat for any reason he chooses. Ethically, it is dicey, but personal gain is as good a reason as any to assign the seat.
I mean, consider the rationale that a Governor can apply in picking a replacement Senator.
Cons very much hoped that Sarah Palin would pick HERSELF to replace felon Ted Stevens IF he had won re election. What qualifications would she have to fill that position other than her own ambition?
Actually okob I thought the Howdy Doody or undertaker look was a better choice than the televangelist.
As for those who claim some sort of monolithic Democratic Party in my former home state ask Adlai Stevenson III about 1986:
“In the 1986 campaign for Governor, in a fluke, two followers of Lyndon LaRouche won the Democratic Party primary nominations for Lieutenant Governor and Secretary of State. Stevenson objected to their platform and refused to appear on the same ticket. Instead, he organized the Solidarity Party to provide an alternate slate for Governor, Lieutenant Governor and Secretary of State, which was duly endorsed by the regular Democratic organization. Persuading Democrats to vote a regular Democratic ticket and then cross over to also vote for the Solidarity candidates for Governor, Lt. Governor and Secretary of State was doomed to fail; however, Stevenson and the candidate for Lieutenant Governor position, Mike Howlett, won 40% of the vote.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adlai_Stevenson_III
Not stated in the Wiki piece is the fact that this happened due to the reform-machine split in the Party. I recall warning some of my reform Democratic friends that I had a real bad feeling about the primary. They scoffed at the idea that the LaRouchies would grab the nomination since both factios SUPPOSEDLY were backing Stevenson and Pucinski. Unfortunately NEITHER faction included them.
Interesting that he had lost the 1983 election to another crooked Ryan:
“In 1982 the initial vote count showed Stevenson winning; however, the final official count showed him losing by 1/7 of one percent. Stevenson promptly petitioned the Illinois Supreme Court for a recount and presented evidence of widespread election irregularities, including evidence of a failed punch card system for tabulation of votes (later to become infamous in the presidential election of 2000). Three days before the gubernatorial inauguration, the Court, by a one vote margin, denied the recount, asserting that the Illinois recount statute was unconstitutional. Several young Thompson staffers were later convicted of vote fraud in that campaign.”
Illinois politics is quite interesting – and complex. In some ways it is a mirror image of KS with 3 parties. Here they are Dem, moderate Rep (RINO) and right-wing Rep. There they are Rep, reform Dem (DINO), and machine Dem.
Typical Chicago politics. Remember Operation Greylord in the 80’s, when they had a bunch of Cook County judges on tape negotiating how big a bribe it would take to get a favorable ruling?
tmann – very true. But by the late 80s we had begun to crack that machine.
Perpin’ ain’t easy.
As a democrat I’m angered taht there is corruption like this in my party and Im willing to give up seats to have them removed.
I am a democrat because I don’t want my lawmakers acting like republicans.
Now if only the republicans would hold their own accountable like this. But no, that’ll never happen.
ANTI
Posted December 9, 2008 at 9:55 pm | Permalink
Perpin’ ain’t easy.
* * * * *
If anyone should know…
There wingers, is Obama’s involvement: He refused to play ball. It’s from the complaint filed yesterday:
ROD BLAGOJEVICH said that the consultants (Advisor B and another
consultant are believed to be on the call at that time) are telling him that he has to “suck it
up” for two years and do nothing and give this “motherfucker [the President-elect] his
senator. Fuck him. For nothing? Fuck him.” ROD BLAGOJEVICH states that he will put
64
“[Senate Candidate 4]” in the Senate “before I just give fucking [Senate Candidate 1] a
fucking Senate seat and I don’t get anything.” (Senate Candidate 4 is a Deputy Governor of
the State of Illinois).
This from another conversation:
“Later in the conversation, ROD BLAGOJEVICH said he knows
that the President-elect wants Senate Candidate 1 for the Senate seat but “they’re not willing
to give me anything except appreciation. Fuck them.”
Basically, the transcript comfirms how I have always suspected the majority of the powerful conduct business. This time a federal prosecuter was listening.
Any state with concrete contractors is doing the same things Blagojevich was, though perhaps not as blatently. Why do you think there are contractors’ associations; for social reasons?
Just a trivial observation: I will certainly not defend the corruption of Chicago politics but, last I checked, the Illinois capitol was in Springfield.
He was released on a signature bond that specifies that he’ll forfeit $4,500 bond if he doesn’t appear in court. Blagojevich also was ordered to relinquish his passport and his firearm owner’s identification car.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D94VD27O0&show_article=1
Funny how so many power freak gun banners are gun owners themselves.
For me but not for thee?
Funny how so many power freak gun banners are gun owners themselves.
For me but not for thee?
Actually, that’s a better description of power itself.
But what you’re specifically saying is yet more rhetorical blahblahblah. He supported gun regulations. He owned a gun.
Where, exactly, is the contradiction?
“I am a democrat because I don’t want my lawmakers acting like republicans.”
Well then Political mamma, you might want to take off your blinders. Wake up wouldja?
You skimmed over the thread about another of your proud democrats, Rep. William “Cold Cash” Jefferson.
How many charges and convictions do you need to see before you open your eyes and realize there are corrupt and self-serving politicians on both sides of the aisle?
If you think “your” party holds one ounce of higher moral character than the other – you are really living in a fairy tale world.
This is important: Because until all Americans become outraged by these scoundrels in both parties – nothing is going to change.
Don’t pull the “holier than thou” blue flag.
All politicians WANT you to do that. It keeps all of mad at each other instead of focusing on the politicians.
“Don’t pull the “holier than thou” blue flag.”
Loser says what?
Personally? I do not CARE what Democratic leaders do so long as they are fighting and beating vile Republicans.
“I do not CARE what Democratic leaders do so long as they are fighting and beating vile Republicans.”
—————
Well, there you have it from the “moral compass” wing of the Democrat party. Funny isn’t it, how when some folks hate so much, they become what they profess to fight?
Or maybe it is just selfish interest.
Outie, not speaking for Jay, but I think the whole “vile Republicans” thing has an obvious, recent, and well, obviously goddamn vile history.
I don’t support vile Democrats, and (again, not speaking for him), you might have noticed Jay’s vocal distaste with the most prominent Democrat of the moment.
Thus destroying the “mindless partisan” scenario you were hoping to build. Oh well.
So Rage, you are weighing in to support the statement: “I do not CARE what Democratic leaders do so long as they are fighting and beating vile Republicans”?????
Very telling. Not very ethical, but telling.
outlander
Posted December 10, 2008 at 7:55 am | Permalink
“Well, there you have it from the “moral compass” wing of the Democrat party. Funny isn’t it, how when some folks hate so much, they become what they profess to fight? ”
So true. So true.
Lol the loser comment. I voted for Barack Obama in the Primary. I won the minute Hillary lost.
P.S. Or are you arguing that the “moral compass” wing of the Democratic Party will be as vile as the similar wing in the Republican party has been?
I do not CARE what Democratic leaders do = mindless partisan
So Rage, you are weighing in to support the statement: “I do not CARE what Democratic leaders do so long as they are fighting and beating vile Republicans”?????
Uhm, no.
Your point apparently is that it’s an “end justifies the means” argument. Jay’s far more gung-ho about “gettting the bastards” than I am, but I don’t think even he is saying that.
But I don’t speak for him.
Oh, and Rage? What if everyone were to take that attitude? Would we have any standards of conduct?
If you start claiming that Democrat politicians are more moral and less vile than Republican, you are in for a fall, my friend. History teaches otherwise. The Democrats are in control now. Watch for the inevitable scandals and corruption on that side.
Sad, but true.
If you start claiming that Democrat politicians are more moral and less vile than Republican, you are in for a fall, my friend.
IF the moon is made of green cheese, then horses can fly.
I simply have asserted the obvious: Republicans have been leading the charge of immorality in recent years, wrapped in a flag and a bible.
You don’t have to look hard (even on today’s threads) to find me condemning Democrats.
Generally, I tend to consider doctrines from a reversible perspective, something you rarely (if ever) do.
That sounds too cynical. I want to make clear that I’m not indicting all politicians. There are a lot of good men and women who do what they think is right. But there are are simply bad apples who’s main ideology is self. Gov. Blagojevich is an example.
“I am a democrat because I don’t want my lawmakers acting like republicans.”
Again the focus of my earlier post was that you are being less than honest with yourself if you believe one party holds the moral compass.
Be a democrat because you believe in the parties position on the issues or even because you believe the republicans are not correct on the issues.
But don’t claim to be a democrat because your party is holier than thou. Sounds an awful lot like an echo to me.
Generally, I tend to consider doctrines from a reversible perspective, something you rarely (if ever) do.
———–
Yeah Rage, you can be fair minded. But you can be an self justifing jerk as well. Such as the above comment.
Yeah Rage, you can be fair minded. But you can be an self justifing jerk as well. Such as the above comment.
Sorry to hurt your feelings, bro.
What are your thoughts on repealing the marriage amendment, you know, reversibility and all?
What are your thoughts on overturning Roe v Wade, you know, reversibility and all?
beber – thanks for the info. As I said; there is a LOT of bad blood between the Democratic Parties in Illinois.
What are your thoughts on overturning Roe v Wade, you know, reversibility and all?
Heh, fleetie, Outie immediately got it, and I am as unsurprised by that as by your cluelessness.
Ever hear of the “Golden rule”?
I prefer Kant. But the basic idea is, put yourself in someone else’s place. “For the grace of lighting-strike!, there go i.”
Get it now?
“Ever hear of the “Golden rule”?”
Tell that to the dead babies. Reversibility and all.
No Rage, I think fleettwood definitely “got it”. What you were implying was that no one else looks at all sides of the issues except you. And when you make a decision, it is not out of partisanship, but logic or whatever.
An unsupportable and arrogant assertion.
What you were implying was that no one else looks at all sides of the issues except you.
Actually, I slagged you personally, based on some of your more inflexible posts. I had enough. Sorry about that.
But if I was talking about “both sides of issues,” your criticism might be more relevant. I was talking about putting oneself in the place of other human beings, which, obviously, includes fetuses (but of course no gay fetuses :). .
You will notice a dearth of comments from me on the abortion threads. Simply put, I think that birth is a process rather than a concrete event.
Ethically, I don’t like killing anything that is alive. Seriously: I don’t even like killing flies. But I’m not going to mourn my skin cells. Genetic information aside, a fertilized egg is little more than that. It has no nervous system, no awareness, not much in human terms beyond a skin cell, really.
Things move on, and it gets more difficult. But the question of when to get the sheriff involved cannot exclude the doctor and, mostly importantly, the woman.
But even an unambiguous anti-abortion argument would not make the rest of the religious right’s demands any more moral. The objection to so-called “gay marriage” only happens to be the most ridiculous and indefensible one,
Prez Bush :” I don’t know what the big deal is. This goes on all the time in Iraq, and where do you think they learned that from? It’s just outsourcing the gub’mint; it’s gobernmenting to improve profitatiion, ain’t no big thing!”
Mike Royko is giggling in his grave.
Republican corruption in IL.
http://www.kansas.com/wireupdates/story/629839.html
Former Ill. Gov. George Ryan apologizes for crimes
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The Associated Press
CHICAGO – Convicted former Ill. Gov. George Ryan says he’s sorry for crimes he committed as the state’s chief executive.
In a statement read Friday by his attorney, former Gov. James Thompson, Ryan says his “performance in office was less than my best and for that I am sorry.”
Ryan is seeking commutation from President Bush after serving more than a year of his 6 1/2-year corruption sentence.
Among other things, Ryan was convicted of stifling an investigation into bribes paid for truck drivers’ licenses.
In November 1994, a part fell off a truck belonging to a driver with an illegal Illinois license. The part hit the gas tank of a van that exploded, killing a pastor’s six children.
Ryan mentioned the Rev. Scott Willis’s family publicly for the first time Friday.
Old news Ben, tragic, but irrelevant to Blagojevich.
It is relevant regular – indicates the endemic problem in Illinois.
#
bth
Posted December 12, 2008 at 6:30 pm | Permalink
It is relevant regular – indicates the endemic problem in Illinois.
——————————
No argument there, it’s a snake pit of corruption.
Having lived there and having been involved in politics (as a suburban Republican) I know all too well. Ryan was well-known as a crook.