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103 Comments
Let’s make a shift from the irrefutable fact of evolution to the field of abiogenesis. Creationists probably still don’t know the difference.
Origin Of Life On Earth: Simple Fusion To Jump-start Evolution
ScienceDaily (Dec. 23, 2008) — With the aid of a straightforward experiment, researchers have provided some clues to one of biology’s most complex questions: how ancient organic molecules came together to form the basis of life.
Specifically, this study demonstrated how ancient RNA joined together to reach a biologically relevant length.
RNA, the single-stranded precursor to DNA, normally expands one nucleic base at a time, growing sequentially like a linked chain. The problem is that in the primordial world RNA molecules didn’t have enzymes to catalyze this reaction, and while RNA growth can proceed naturally, the rate would be so slow the RNA could never get more than a few pieces long (for as nucleic bases attach to one end, they can also drop off the other).
Ernesto Di Mauro and colleagues examined if there was some mechanism to overcome this thermodynamic barrier, by incubating short RNA fragments in water of different temperatures and pH.
More real science (not creationist whining) at:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/12/081218213634.htm
Near Bethlehem some time ago,
A flock of sheep was dwelling.
To shepherds, sheep, and sheep dog, too,
Angel choirs came telling.
Good news, not fear, to all the world,
A baby in a manger.
“We’d leave to see,” the shepherds said,
“But our sheep would be in danger.”
“To watch the flock, we’ll leave the dog,
While seeking mankind’s Savior.
The dog will guard and keep the sheep
From wandering behavior.”
Though disappointed not to go
To Bethlehem’s blest stable,
The dog felt duty-bound to work
As well as it was able.
The shepherds came at last and praised
God for Christ revealing,
Too wonder-struck to praise the dog
That gave them time for kneeling.
But God Himself spoke to the dog
In tones for canine hearing.
His words inspired all dogs to serve
For ages persevering:
“Good and faithful servant, well done.”
– Kent Dannen
It is hard to have pity for those who wake up each day with a chip on their shoulder. Life is meant to be enjoyed. If your enjoyment comes from pointing out ways in which you think you are smarter than someone else then you do not know enjoyment at all.
I spent too much time in my youth as a judgmental jerk. Life is better when you let that go and stop propping yourself up by trying to demean others.
Another reason to block Eric Holder. He was knee deep in the cover up at Waco.
By Michelle Mittelstadt
September 14, 1999
Associated Press
WASHINGTON–The federal prosecutor who raised questions about a possible Justice Department cover-up in the Waco standoff was abruptly removed from the case along with his boss, according to a court filing made public Tuesday.
Deputy Attorney General Eric Holder recused U.S. Attorney James W. Blagg in San Antonio and assistant U.S. Attorney Bill Johnston in Waco, Texas, from any further dealings in criminal or civil proceedings related to the siege.
Holder appointed the U.S. attorney in a neighboring district as a “special attorney to the U.S. attorney general.”
The court filing in Waco provides no explanation for the decision to recuse the U.S. attorneys’ office for the Western District of Texas, to which Blagg and Johnston are assigned, but said the action took effect last Friday.
snip
“The Justice Department dumped 100,000 documents on the committee three days before the hearings, knowing that they couldn’t possibly go through them,” the Indiana Republican said in an interview. Although Burton was on the Government Reform Committee in 1995, he was not on the subcommittee that led the investigation.
Burton also noted that the Justice Department was forced to acknowledge last week that it failed in 1995 to give Congress the key page from a 1993 FBI lab report mentioning the use of military tear gas. The final page of that 49-page report, with the key tear gas mention, was missing, he noted.
http://discussions.pbs.org/viewtopic.pbs?p=680215&sid=490fe4cb15b348126fe329b2f62ebc89
A modern day Santa:
Milkman supplied drugs to elderly
A milkman supplied cannabis to pensioners to ward off their aches and pains, a court heard.
Robert Holding, 72, delivered the drug while doing his rounds to 17 customers he had built up through “word-of-mouth”, Burnley Crown Court was told.
Judge Beverley Lunt said Mr Holding said in his police statement that the cannabis was for “elderly people who had aches and pains”.
Mr Holding, of Fair View Road, Burnley, admitted supplying cannabis.
Custodial sentence
He also admitted possessing cannabis resin and will be sentenced at a later date.
Philip Holden, for the defence, said Holding’s customers “were of a certain age” and he built up his clientele through “word of mouth”.
The case was adjourned for a pre-sentence report. Holding was released on bail and will be sentenced at Burnley Crown Court on 6 February.
Judge Lunt warned him: “You must understand these are serious offences and in my judgment the likely outcome is an immediate custodial sentence.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/lancashire/7795835.stm
MP
I’m reading a new book that I’d highly recommend to you: Only a Theory – Evolution and the Battle for America’s Soul, by Ken Miller. It is a fascinating read.
A drug dealer is still a drug dealer..I’m sure he was making some good pocket change off of his little enterprise. I must admit I don’t know too many elderly citizens who smoke pot. That will change for sure in a few years when the baby boomers get into their 70s and 80s.
Showing compassion because of a criminals age is going to become more prevalent as boomers age and age is used as an excuse.
Compassion is the most popular word in the liberals dictionary. Right before socialism.
For you, “HLP” –
The wind was cold and harsh and cruel
At the edge of Bethlehem city.
‘Til into the trough with the newborn babe
Up climbed a fuzzy kitty.
She curled up next to the Christmas king
(Perhaps his halo was warm)
Celestial choirs did not distract
Nor the blare of angelic horns.
The swaddled boy reached out his hand
To the fur and the paws and the purring.
And, both content, they all through
The frankincense, gold, and the myrrhing.
As Joseph gazed on his Virgin’s son
The cat admonished, “Meeyow.”
”Peace on earth will take a while,
But it’s time to milk the cow.
Bad schmaltzy poetry is not the exclusive purview of dog-lovers. I knocked this off in half an hour.
Will the democrat majority step up to the plate and ensure government is more open? Will they buckle under to the UAWQ lobby?
Let us hope the bailout for the automakers has a few more controls and open records for the public than the bank bailout fiasco.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,470824,00.html
The plan now is for the both GM and Chrysler to reject the Bush bailout because of the call for employees to be part of the solution (rather than to continue to be part of the problem).
They will take the free money – but wait until Obama takes charge and the full democrat congress before whining for a negotiated settlement. The settlement will likely include US Taxpayers funding the rosy healthcare insurance plan for auto workers. This saves the union, which took over the pension/future payments and the company from future liabilities.
There are no liabilities for these companies anymore. Will there be accountability to the US taxpayers?
Good morning Blaidd_Drwg69,
From a review of your book by Behe,
____________________________________________
Call it the principle of malignant reading. He’s been doing it for years with the arguments of Darwin’s Black Box, and he continues it in this review. For example, despite being repeatedly told by me and others that by an “irreducibly complex” system I mean one in which removal of a part destroys the function of the system itself, Miller says, no, to him the phrase will mean that none of the remaining parts can be used for anything else — a straw man which can easily be knocked down. Unconscionably, he passes off his own tendentious view to the public as mine. People who look to Miller for a fair engagement of the arguments of intelligent design are very poorly served.
Oops —
I dropped a word and missed a joke –
The wind was cold and harsh and cruel
At the edge of Bethlehem city.
‘Til into the trough with the newborn babe
Up climbed a fuzzy kitty.
She curled up next to the Christmas king
(Perhaps his halo was warm)
Celestial choirs did not distract
Nor the blare of angelic horns.
The swaddled boy reached out his hand
To the fur and the paws and the purring.
And, both content, they slept all through
The frankincense, gold, and the myrrhing.
As Joseph gazed on his Virgin’s son
The cat admonished, “Meeyow.”
”Peace on earth will take a while,
But it’s time to milk the cow.”
The two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change.
– Seth MacFarlane
HLP, why would I care to hear a “review” of Mller’s book from Behe?
Miller is a Professor of Biology at Brown. Behe is a mouthpiece for the Discovery Institute.
I wonder who has the most credibilty?
Well, Blaidd_Drwg69,
Why would you? In fact, if your mind is made up, why bother to read anything?
nitwit
I dunno, Blaidd_Drwg69, someone with a PhD in Bio-Chemistry like Behe would make an excellent reviewer of such a book.
Origin Of Life On Earth: Simple Fusion To Jump-start Evolution
ScienceDaily (Dec. 23, 2008) — With the aid of a straightforward experiment, researchers have provided some clues to one of biology’s most complex questions: how ancient organic molecules came together to form the basis of life.
Specifically, this study demonstrated how ancient RNA joined together to reach a biologically relevant length.
————
‘Course we, in all our knowledge, technology and skill can’t duplicate what is alleged an accident.
Merry Christmas to all of God’s children. And Merry Christmas to accidents like Maggie too.
I don’t think Behe has actually reviewed Miller’s new book Regular. I do believe that Miller too has a PhD.
HLP has resorted to his usuaal name-calling of anyone who does not agree with his relgious view of science. Go figure.
#
BlueJay
Posted December 22, 2008 at 10:05 pm | Permalink
My ethics are pretty situational. I tend to weight toward the greater good or towards folks not getting hurt.
_____________________________________________________
Then why do you always want to “meet up” with “folks”?
Thanks for the poems HLP and Monkeyhawk! I’m an equal-opportunity pet owner — one dog and two cats allow us to live in their home as long as we take care of them. Well, it’s mainly the cats that demand the care and attempt the endless and difficult training of the humans. The dog approves of her humans even when we shouldn’t be so easily accepted.
There’s a reason why dogs are called man’s best friend. A dog will only break your heart once – when it dies.
Here’s to dear and devoted four-footed friends who have passed…
#
donndublin
Posted December 23, 2008 at 9:03 am | Permalink
• cosmos_originally
Posted December 22, 2008 at 6:41 pm | Permalink
donndublin,
I’m sorry that you are unable to understand simple facts.
The IPCC “evaluated” the published papers on GHG’s done by scientists, and found that SF6 had the highest GWP.
________________________________________________________________________
Evaluate:
1. To ascertain or fix the value or worth of.
2. To examine and judge carefully; appraise.
3. Mathematics To calculate the numerical value of; express numerically
I would say it’s more like smoke and mirrors than evaluation, especially when they ignore this common analysis of SF6.
Source: wikipedia
“Its concentration can be measured with satisfactory accuracy at very low concentrations, and the Earth’s atmosphere has a NEGLIGIBLE concentration of SF6.”
Since it’s most common use is in electrical equipment, perhaps you should quit using your computer and go back to living in a cave if you believe it’s going to destroy the earth.
________________________________________________________________________
#
cosmos_originally
Posted December 23, 2008 at 12:25 am | Permalink
donndublin again lies about me, AND he again proves that he does not understand “scientific methodology”.
A “methodology” = a system of methods, NOT a
“source”.
________________________________________________________________________
Why did you wait so long before you replied Cos? Did you have wait on your boss or teacher to get the answer. Go tell your mentor this. In my 35 years of professional practice, I’ve forgotten more about “scientific methodology” than you’ve ever read much less comprehend.
If you believe that anybody who disagrees with you is lying then you must think that YOU have a monopoly on the truth. Again you have proved that your belief system is based more on faith than science.
Some of the country’s biggest commercial real estate players are asking the government for help, as their $6 trillion industry of hotels, office buildings and shopping malls faces a record amount of debt coming due in the next few years.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/12/22/AR2008122202048.html?hpid=sec-business
________________________________________________
Why is this not surprising?
Some humans did an experiment in a lab and that shows an irrefutable fact about what happened thousands of years ago?
BTW, where did the ancient organic molecules and RNA come from in the first place? Who was the original “lab worker” making this all happen?
Merry Christmas to all you accidents and non-accidents out there!
Yes, yes, it is much more sensible that some super duper being that existed before anything existed one day (before there were days) said to itself, “I think I’ll make universe today.” “And I’ll not leave any evidence of myself whatsoever.”
You are a scientist then Dublin?
Just look around and you will see the evidence, unless you don’t want to see it. To believe that everything in existence is all an accident takes more faith than I have. Either way, you have to have faith. It’s just a matter of who or what you put your faith in. Merry Christmas!
Happy Festivus! ;)
And Feliz Navidad to you, Davos!!
Members of Congress will pull us out of the economic turn down by spending our money on their home state roads. Take a luck nah! look, at Harry Reid and NV.
http://www.kvbc.com/Global/story.asp?S=9567674
re: commercial developers wanting a bailout
You know, as I have wandered the country for the past 15-20 years, I have looked in wonder at all of the housing developments, mostly high-dollar; the resorts; the condos at ski lodges that seemed to usually be mostly empty; etc. I realize that we have gained 10 million or so in population and they need housing, stores and so on.
But the resorts, the spas, the condo villages, all costing $200, $500, $1,000 a night and more, and I asked: Where is the money coming from?
Was it simple jealousy that I couldn’t afford to own or even stay in these places? Was it my scot tempered with being the son of a Depression-era parents? Was it the ability to add 2 and 2 and get four every time, instead of what the developers came up with?
Now I’m getting the answer I suspected all along. Debt. All of these high-living people were up to their necks in debt. The men were killing themselves with heart attacks, the women had to work (and don’t get me wrong, all of the women in my family have always worked outside the home because they wanted to).
And now all those lovely houses of cards are tumbling down. I’m sitting here, still not able to afford most of those goodies, but except for my car, I’m debt free. I just hope they don’t drag me down with them.
Dennis
Nice post Dennis.
#
DavosRancheros
Posted December 23, 2008 at 9:29 am | Permalink
You are a scientist then Dublin?
___________________________________________________
Source: wikipedia
“A scientist, in the broadest sense, refers to any person that engages in a systematic activity to acquire knowledge or an individual that engages in such practices and traditions that are linked to schools of thought or philosophy. In a more restricted sense, scientist refers to individuals who use the scientific method.”
Davos, Would you call someone with Bachelor of Science degree in engineering a scientist?
I passed whole developments of McMansions the other day outside OKC, all empty. Not a car in a driveway, not a gas-fired barbie on the back porch.
The msm is sure ignoring the untimely death of Connell.
But Monique, believing everything is not accidental is not proof of god.
There’s a reason why dogs are called man’s best friend. A dog will only break your heart once – when it dies.
Or when it chews the face of you baby.
Dublin, I would normally call that person an engineer…which is cool as I work with engineers all the time. I was curious becuase you said you had 35 years of experience.
Why would a fed judge order this response sealed?
“Arnebeck, who sought Connell’s testimony, had questioned him about alleged threats during the November deposition, but U.S. District Judge Solomon Oliver ordered those answers sealed. Arnebeck says an anonymous tipster alleged that Connell was warned that if he refused to take the fall for any election shenanigans, his wife would be criminally prosecuted for illegal activities with spouses of U.S. senators
“Showing compassion because of a criminals age is going to become more prevalent as boomers age and age is used as an excuse.”
Heaven forbid that we show any compassion to a 72 year old that sold pot to other geezers.
Build another prison – lock ‘em up.
Kia, remembered your question yesterday when I came across this:
“Based on the threats against Connell, the federal judge hearing the civil suit King Lincoln v. Blackwell, conveyed to Connell that the court would protect him if he came forward. On October 17, 2008, Connell’s attorneys attempted to quash an October 8, 2008, plaintiff subpoena for his court appearance. On October 31, U.S. Judge Solomon Oliver denied the motion to quash the subpoena and ordered Connell’s deposition to proceed on November 3, the day before Election Day. WMR has learned that on Friday, October 31, Connell was nervous and “beet red” during the hearing to quash the subpoena. On Monday, November 3, Connell was composed and it is believed that his top shelf law firm had been selected by Rove to represent Connell for the deposition. Rove’s intent was to ensure that there would be no deposition from Connell before the November 4 election.
#
DavosRancheros
Posted December 23, 2008 at 10:47 am | Permalink
Dublin, I would normally call that person an engineer…which is cool as I work with engineers all the time. I was curious becuase you said you had 35 years of experience.
_____________________________________________________
There is a difference between engineers and professional engineers. Some call themselves engineers without a degree or scientific training i.e. “sanitation engineer”.
“The term Professional Engineer and the actual practice of professional engineering is legally defined and protected by a government body. In some jurisdictions only registered or licensed Professional Engineers are permitted to use the title, or to practice Professional Engineering.”
The main difference is a professional has been through rigorous exams and continuing education to prove their proficiency. The professional not only has a degree but goes through years of on the job training before they are eligible to apply for the certification exam. I have been licensed for 29 of those 35 years.
You are correct donD. In the state of Kansas Professional Engineers are regulated under the same authority as we Geologists are – the Ks State Board of Tech Professions. So, just as I would tell you tolook for ‘LG’ in my field I would look for ‘PE’ in that field.
“Davos, Would you call someone with Bachelor of Science degree in engineering a scientist?”
An engineer. Just like a person with a Doctor of Philosophy in a science field is a scientist instead of just a Philosopher. (although he probably qualifies classically as a philosopher as well)
Thanks, Chas and Beber.
Sometimes I think I may just be more intelligent than I feel other times.
A common human condition, I expect.
Dennis
donndublin posted,
I would say it’s more like smoke and mirrors than evaluation, especially when they ignore this common analysis of SF6.
…
—————-
I NEVER claimed that SF6 was a strong factor in AGW. I used it as an example to show that different molecules have different GWP’s, to refute your false claim from Spencer.
donndublin posted,
In my 35 years of professional practice, I’ve forgotten more about “scientific methodology” than you’ve ever read much less comprehend.
—————
Your posts show that you’ve forgotten EVERYTHING about it.
donndublin posted,
If you believe that anybody who disagrees with you is lying then you must think that YOU have a monopoly on the truth.
—————
You didn’t “disagree” with me, you LIED about what I believe. And if you’re not lying about AGW science, then you’re very ignorant and misinformed about it.
Really Dublin, I did not need that explaination. I have am a professional geologist.
Davos – so we have at least two of us ‘rockheads’ on here!
Sweet. You too bth?! Right on.
Ben,
Would you say that this statement is accurate?
donndublin posted December 22, 2008 at 2:20 pm
The role of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere’s greenhouse effect is relatively small, due to the fact that CO2 is a ‘trace gas’ — only 38 out of every 100,000 molecules of air are carbon dioxide. It takes a full five years of human greenhouse gas emissions to add 1 molecule of CO2 to every 100,000 molecules of air.”
I have am a professional geologist.
_______________________________________________
However, I are not am English major.
However, I are not am English major.
———-
Nope but I do hurry when I post. My fault.
I out to lunch then out on a job. Won’t be back till after the holiday.
Happy Holidays everyone.
I not be an English major too – although my baby sister is.
Cosmos – not a true statement. The second half may be true (would have to look up the numbers) but the first half – the conclusion – is false.
Sounds like Yearning for zion, was a pedophile haven (or is that pedophile heaven?):
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081223/ap_on_re_us/polygamist_retreat;_ylt=Al3H9ihNUDvbQDMQelaWCH5vzwcF
bth posted December 23, 2008 at 12:15 pm
The second half may be true (would have to look up the numbers) but the first half – the conclusion – is false
———————–
And the 2nd half is irrelevant — what matters is that humans have caused the GHG levels to rise.
Vets with PTSD shouldn’t have to be recruiting, would probably have fewer suicides:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081222/ap_on_re_us/recruiter_suicides;_ylt=AqkkkUwu0z76mqBLlOqV2qVvzwcF
#
bth
Posted December 23, 2008 at 12:15 pm | Permalink
I not be an English major too – although my baby sister is.
Cosmos – not a true statement. The second half may be true (would have to look up the numbers) but the first half – the conclusion – is false.
___________________________________________________
I value Roy Spencer’s (PhD in meteorology ) opinion more than your’s,”rockhead”.
Yesterday Cos tried to throw a smoke screen up with the comment:
“The global warming potential of SF6 is 23,900, making it the most potent greenhouse gas the IPCC has evaluated.”
This is a gross exaggeration since SF6 is negligible in the atmosphere. Here’s a math lesson for you Cos: 23,900 times 0.000000001 = 0.0627375 or less than 0.01% or for all practical purposes 23,900 times 0 = 0
cosmos_originally
Posted December 23, 2008 at 12:59 pm | Permalink
what matters is that humans have caused the GHG levels to rise.
____________________________________________________
Just like an ant is a bump in the road for a 2 ton pick up truck.
Davos,
You beat me to it!
I see the airing of grievances has already begun :)
Thierry Magon de La Villehuchet, who ran a fund that invested with Bernard Madoff, was found dead at his office today in an apparent suicide, according to a police officer at the scene.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aI_dGvx.XITs&refer=us
__________________________________________________
And so it goes…
I wonder how much more of this we’ll see before this is all over.
#
Phantom
Posted December 23, 2008 at 10:37 am | Permalink
The msm is sure ignoring the untimely death of Connell.
_________________________________________________
Seems a little strange, huh? I’d think the press would be all over this.
“Sales of existing homes plunged far more than expected last month…”
That’s weird. Usually they are spot on.
donndublin posted December 23, 2008 at 1:02 pm
This is a gross exaggeration since SF6 is negligible in the atmosphere.
————–
Poor donndublin. Despite his “35 years of professional practice”, he just can’t understand the simple fact that different gases have different GWP’s
http://www.epa.gov/highgwp/scientific.html
“The concept of a global warming potential (GWP) was developed to compare the ability of each greenhouse gas to trap heat in the atmosphere relative to another gas. The definition of a GWP for a particular greenhouse gas is the ratio of heat trapped by one unit mass of the greenhouse gas to that of one unit mass of CO2 over a specified time period.”
—————-
http://www.ipcc.ch/ipccreports/ar4-wg1.htm
IPCC Chapter 2
Table 2.1. Present-day . . . Radiative Forcing for the measured LLGHGs
. . . Watts per square meter (2005)
CO2 1.66
CH4 0.48
N2O 0.16
…
SF6 0.0029
Anyone notice the article today about the banks that have been given a fed bailout will not disclose how they are using the money?
That is just indefensible. That is our money!
LOL!
‘Coal ‘Smells good, too!’ [video]
http://www.desmogblog.com/coal-clean-smells-good-too
cosmos_originally
Posted December 23, 2008 at 1:52 pm | Permalink
IPCC Chapter 2
Table 2.1. Present-day . . . Radiative Forcing for the measured LLGHGs
. . . Watts per square meter (2005)
CO2 1.66
CH4 0.48
N2O 0.16
…
SF6 0.0029
________________________________________________
SOURCE: wikipedia
“Global warming potential (GWP) is a measure of how much a given mass of greenhouse gas is ESTIMATED to contribute to global warming. It is a relative scale which compares the gas in question to that of the same mass of carbon dioxide (whose GWP is by definition 1). A GWP is calculated over a specific time interval and the value of this must be stated whenever a GWP is quoted or else the value is MEANINGLESS.”
__________________________________________________
I would put your comment in the meaningless category Cos.
[citation needed]
‘Sea Ice at Record Low‘
http://davidappell.blogspot.com/2008/12/sea-ice-at-record-low.html
“So to within the precision of the satellite measurements, today’s numbers are essentially the same as last year’s.”
Ho Hum
“Some economists believe the economy’s decline in the October-December period could be as large as 6 percent.”
You can take that to the bank. They are always spot on.
Wonder why Obama hasn’t released the promised “internal review” report yet.
Seen the Obama ad promoting “Clean Coal Technology”?
http://greenworldads.blogspot.com/2008/12/barack-obama-clean-coal-commercial-ad.html
fleettwood,
You people can’t brag that there’s more ice this year.
“You people can’t brag that there’s more ice this year.”
I would call it record sameness.
#
cosmos_originally
Posted December 23, 2008 at 3:10 pm | Permalink
fleettwood,
You people can’t brag that there’s more ice this year.
__________________________________________________
What was it 50 years ago Cos? Or 100 or 1000 years ago?
The Antartic ice is growing. I wonder how much is land ice versus sea ice?
http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/india-
news/antarctic-ice-growth-is-one-of-the-odd-side-effects-of-global-warming_10095353.html
Mother earth takes care of herself.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/dec/07/melting-icebergs-slow-global-warming
donndublin posted December 23, 2008 at 2:19 pm
A GWP is calculated over a specific time interval and the value of this must be stated whenever a GWP is quoted or else the value is MEANINGLESS.”
__________________________________________________
I would put your comment in the meaningless category Cos.
—————
My comment that you copy/pasted into your post was not a GWP value.
PCC Chapter 2
Table 2.1. Present-day . . . Radiative Forcing for the measured LLGHGs
. . . Watts per square meter (2005)
CO2 1.66
CH4 0.48
N2O 0.16
…
SF6 0.0029
Cos, it’s all relevant.
“Is our climate warming? As Professor Carter, at James Cook University in Queensland, Australia, so ably points out; “It depends”. If the measure is the trend from the beginning of the last Ice Age to the present day, based on sampling of ice cores taken from Greenland, then yes, the climate is warming. If the measure is the temperature trend from the beginning of the Holocene period (10,000 years ago) until the present day, then the climate is cooling. If the measure is the temperature trend from say, 2000 years ago until the present day the cooling is even more dramatic. If the measure is the earth’s temperature over the last 700 years from the beginning of the “Little Ice Age” the temperature trend is stable. Over the last 100 years the climate shows a warming trend and over the last 10 years the temperature has been demonstrated to be stable.”
Cos,
So what? It’s still MEANINGLESS.
donndublin posted December 23, 2008 at 3:27 pm
Mother earth takes care of herself.
———————
Or maybe emissions from Croatia, and a few other small nations.
———
“A 1 per cent increase in the number of icebergs in the Southern Ocean COULD remove an extra 26 million tonnes of CO2, equivalent to the annual emissions of Croatia.
…
A key question is how much of the carbon soaked up by the growing plankton is returned to the atmosphere. ‘We simply DON’T KNOW the answer to that,’ Raiswell said. Seeding the oceans with iron will only benefit the climate if the plankton sink to the bottom when they die, taking the carbon with them.”
donndublin posted December 23, 2008 at 3:40 pm
Cos, it’s all relevant.
——————-
What’s relevant is that anthropogenic emissions have changed the chemistry of Earth’s atmosphere, and those changes are causing warming.
You nor anyone else has proved that Cos.
The problem is pollution. You should take your argument to the China before they do as much harm as the industrialized world did a hundred years ago.
The Kyoto treaty does not apply to them.
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2008/08/25/greenland-ice-core-reveals-history-of-pollution-in-the-arctic-but-theres-a-twist-it-was-worse-100-years-ago/
China = Chinese
donndublin posted December 23, 2008 at 3:53 pm
You nor anyone else has proved that Cos.
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Then post your proof of what caused the warming, and increase of the oceans heat content since the mid-1970’s.
It wasn’t solar, and it wasn’t cosmic rays.
AGW explains the warming.
Still waiting for the Obama document drop.
cosmos_originally
Posted December 23, 2008 at 4:05 pm | Permalink
Then post your proof of what caused the warming, and increase of the oceans heat content since the mid-1970’s.
It wasn’t solar, and it wasn’t cosmic rays.
AGW explains the warming.
_________________________________________________
Why do you think there must ONE culprit? The only proof is what we observe in the data. Everything else is speculation. I’m not the one trying to force draconian changes on the world.
You’ve shown nothing to prove that solar, cosmic rays, ocean tide, wind currents, volcanoes, earthquakes, axis shifts or who knows what are not causing it and you can’t prove it’s going to continue to warm to the extent the AWG crowd is suggesting. For all we know Algore may be up in the Artic with a blow torch and won’t stop until we make him king.
Here’s more data to add to the dilemma.
http://omniclimate.wordpress.com/2008/11/16/two-mile-deep-antarctic-ice-core-reveals-stupidity-of-agw-catastrophism/
Here it is, all we have to do to fix the global warming that is melting away our nice, cold winters is to cover a few thousand square miles of desert with mirrors to reflect away the sun’s heat, costing a mere $280,000 (unless, of course, there were to be cost overruns).
See science page
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/12/081222114546.htm
Correction, cost is $280 Billion+.
Clean coal spreads through Tennessee:
http://www.scholarsandrogues.com/2008/12/23/ash-flood-superfund/
Such an amazing technology. Maybe Republicans in Kansas will get their wish and bring this clean coal technology to Kansas.
donndublin posted December 23, 2008 at 4:46 pm
For all we know Algore may be up in the Artic with a blow torch and won’t stop until we make him king.
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That DOES seem to be about all that AGW denier donndublin knows about climate science.
donndublin obviously is not knowledgeable about the current/recent natural and anthropogenic climate forcings.
And like Reguliar, he cannot DEFEND his AGW denial with any facts, or rational explanations. Axis shifts, since the 1970’s?
‘BAU = F’d
Hadley Center study warns of ‘catastrophic’ 5-7°C warming by 2100 on current emissions path’ ‘
http://gristmill.grist.org/story/2008/12/22/1111/3775
“The consequences of 5.5°C warming by 2100, which Hadley says is “likely” on our current emissions path are all but unimaginable — mass extinction, devastating ocean acidification, brutal summer-long heat waves, rapidly rising sea levels, widespread desertification. But they are rarely studied or articulated by scientists who can’t imagine humanity would be so stupid as to let this happen. I have tried to piece them together them together from the scientific literature”
More at link.
cosmos_originally
Posted December 23, 2008 at 5:22 pm | Permalink
donndublin posted December 23, 2008 at 4:46 pm
For all we know Algore may be up in the Artic with a blow torch and won’t stop until we make him king.
——————-
That DOES seem to be about all that AGW denier donndublin knows about climate science.
donndublin obviously is not knowledgeable about the current/recent natural and anthropogenic climate forcings.
And like Reguliar, he cannot DEFEND his AGW denial with any facts, or rational explanations. Axis shifts, since the 1970’s
—————
Got something against precessional shifts?
Tell, what do you do when you want to warm something on a different side, you turn it don’t you?
Of course, that’s not the only reason for climate change – too numerous to mention here.
But do carry on Henny Penny.
I love the denial pick-of-the-week. “Recessional shifts” this week? Stay tuned… when you don’t have to rely on evidence, the possibilities are endless.
For everyone’s enjoyment and edification and education:
The year 2008 in photographs:
http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2008/12/the_year_2008_in_photographs_p.html
Let’s just call the whole thing off Al Gore. Scientist says Global warming cannot be controled by Man. Listen up Kathy and Rod.
http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=13773
Sorry Mary, but the only difference between that guy and you is a prescription.
and marijuana is already in pill form legally.
It is just another route of administration.
Nothing wrong with trying to make someone feel better.
As far as faith Monique, is that like the faith you had that Bush would lead America to prosperity?
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/12/23/madoff.investor.suicide/index.html
Is this the start of the building jumping? Sad.
The Royal Navy assigned much treasure and considerable assets in the 19th century to find an ice free route to China. The most tech savvy group around in those days, the Royal Navy knew of artifacts found in Nova Scotia/Labrador that were Chinese in origin, which “proved” the Chinese had not only explored the Pacific but Atlantic coastlines of North America as well. China could have only done that if the Arctic seas were ice free. (Artifacts were also found in that area of 10th century Viking settlements, later proven to be quite accurate….they’re tourist attractions now). The Royal Navy was convinced the Arctic ice ebbs and flows which is why some of the Admiralty were more than hopeful a commercial trade route existed across the top of Canada.
Political Mama,
You must have me confused with someone else. I have never posted a single word about Bush and never thought he would lead America to prosperity.
You voted for him though didn’tcha?
george,
We cannot “call off” anthropogenic global warming. There’s more warming in the “pipeline”, due to our GHG’s, and we do not (at this time) have the ability to stop it.
But we can prevent adding even more warming to that future amount, by reducing our GHG emissions.
good night; good luck; god bless —-
whatever you conceive god to be!!
blessings ALL!!
Happy Chanukah on this 3rd night of Chanukah!!
so mote it be!!