Abortion doctor George Tiller’s effort to dismiss the misdemeanor case against him seems like a bit of a stretch. But hearings this week have shown that the public was correct to be concerned about former Attorney General Phill Kline’s dogged pursuit of Tiller and abortion records.
Tiller’s attorneys contend that Kline convinced a Topeka judge to let him subpoena medical records based on a false claim – that Tiller wasn’t reporting to authorities cases involving sexual abuse of minors. An internal memo shows that Kline had neither a complainant nor an allegation that Tiller knowingly violated the law. It’s even more serious that Kline’s office may have deliberately misled the judge by presenting a specific case as evidence of a possible reporting violation when it knew – or should have known – that Tiller had in fact properly followed the law.
The hearing has also revealed how Kline’s office worked closely with anti-abortion groups. And former Kline investigator Jared Reed testified that he believed Kline’s office was willing to do whatever it took to get a conviction, “up to and including breaking the law.”
That’s what it looked like to many voters, too.
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65 Comments
Not like anybody is shocked Kline is unethical and dishonest. Kline is a religious fanatic, so if breaking the law and consorting with terrorists groups like Operation Rescue benefits his theocratic agenda then he’ll go for it.
This case is just a symptom if the Bush administration and the last 8 years that showed its ugly head in communities around the country. Super religious Republicans that were newly elected officials were under the impression that they had a mandate from the public to further their religiously based political platform. The problem with creationism on the school boards around the country was another symptom.
They honestly thought they were God’s soldiers and had complete carte-blanche. I don’t think God has helped any of them stay in office or kept from getting prosecuted, if need be.
Typical liberals. Willing to let the rapists of underage girls go free to protect the sacrament of abortion.
“Typical liberals. Willing to let the rapists of underage girls go free to protect the sacrament of abortion.”
Typical Christian rightist. Willing to make the same allegation over and over again even after it has been discredited.
Kline will be needing to find a new obsession.
A woman’s right to choose is a fact of life now that will not be changing.
HLP
Posted November 21, 2008 at 7:23 am | Permalink
Typical liberals. Willing to let the rapists of underage girls go free to protect the sacrament of abortion.
——————————–
Typical Republican…willing to burn the Constitution in pursuit of religious tyranny.
These types should be tried for treason.
How did Tiller follow the law? Did he report the underage abortion to Kansas law enforcement?
Kline should be investigated.
He runs for office to be a public servant, not an advocate crusader.
rare occasion, but I totally agree with bj on this . Kline’s actions have the appearance of illegality, and should be investigated. If he did nothing illegal, at least the air will be cleared. If he did, he needs to be prosecuted.
Try READING johngalt, it’s a lost art
johngalt
Posted November 21, 2008 at 7:50 am | Permalink
How did Tiller follow the law? Did he report the underage abortion to Kansas law enforcement?
“It’s even more serious that Kline’s office may have deliberately misled the judge by presenting a specific case as evidence of a possible reporting violation when it knew – or should have known – that Tiller had in fact properly followed the law.”
What if Phill Kline showed a personal vendetta against a priest or preacher and he went after them or their church with the same hatred he has shown towards Tiller?
What if Kline used illegal ways to get evidence to prosecute? Would all you pro-lifers have any problem with that?
And why did Kline remove the abortion medical records from the Attorney General’s office when he lost to Paul Morrison? Shouldn’t they have stayed in the office since Morrison was going to continue to pursue the case?
Due to the many questions of Kline’s actions, then everything he presents in relation to Tiller should be viewed as tainted.
“HLP
Posted November 21, 2008 at 7:23 am | Permalink
Typical liberals. Willing to let the rapists of underage girls go free to protect the sacrament of abortion.”
Hank – the record shows that Tiller reported them – and that the specific one was already being prosecuted when the prosecuter sent the girl here.
mom
Posted November 21, 2008 at 8:23 am | Permalink
What if Phill Kline showed a personal vendetta against a priest or preacher and he went after them or their church with the same hatred he has shown towards Tiller?
————————
Abortion is not a religious institution.
BTW – I think Phill Kline missed his calling. He should have been a preacher throwing out all those thunder bolts and preaching fire and damnation. But I simply see him as a mere mortal who has fallen into the trap of ‘pride goeth before the fall’.
Anti – what does that have to do with it? It is obvious to everyone with half a brain – Kline is out to get Tiller – and he will use any means necessary.
Just answer the question – or do you not care to answer it because you KNOW Kline is only on a personal vendetta against Tiller?
Kline has done no favors for the pro-life group. In fact, due to his inept and possibly illegal tactics, he has made your group look like stupid bullies.
If you’re wanting to change people’s minds about abortion, you might want to consider changing your mascot – Kline is not your best poster boy.
Kline is out to get Tiller – and he will use any means necessary.
===========
mom, I have no doubts about that.
If you’re wanting to change people’s minds about abortion, you might want to consider changing your mascot – Kline is not your best poster boy.
================
I agree.
Another of those cases – if we took all the money that has been spent on this and spent it on abortion prevention (alternatives) we would accomplish much more.
Ol’ Kline, he knew the perp, just had to find the crime!
He could’ve shown more impartiality if he’d screened all of the hospital’s delivery records as well.
Good Morning Ben!
_________________________________________
“Hank – the record shows that Tiller reported them – and that the specific one was already being prosecuted when the prosecuter sent the girl here.
_________________________________________
Really Ben? What record? Got a link? The attorneys for Tiller claim they reported to Child protective services. Did he collect DNA evidence as the law required? No. Did he report the abortion performed on a 10 year old girl to the KBI so they could cooperate with the authorities in Texas? No.
The articles on Tiller and the bias of the reporting is very informative on what they don’t report. They pretty much take what ever the Tiller attorneys and PR machine put out as fact. Never ask any questions of Tiller the baby Killer.
Valuable DNA evidence was lost because Tiller failed to report IAW the law.
#
mom
Posted November 21, 2008 at 8:33 am | Permalink
Kline has done no favors for the pro-life group. In fact, due to his inept and possibly illegal tactics, he has made your group look like stupid bullies.
If you’re wanting to change people’s minds about abortion, you might want to consider changing your mascot – Kline is not your best poster boy.
__________________________________________
I whole heartedly agree.
Tiller apparently properly reported the case. And the rapist was in jail.
Kline LIED to a judge. That is bad karma, dude.
Hank – note the fact that the girl came with a letter from the prosecuter’s office:
http://www.kansas.com/690/story/603723.html
The case of the 10-year-old girl who received a late-term abortion has become the center of Tiller’s defense team’s argument.
Documents produced by lawyer Dan Monnat showed:
The girl came with her mother from another state, carrying a letter from their local prosecutor’s office. The letter said the girl needed “an immediate medical procedure that (could) only be done” at Tiller’s Women’s Health Care Services clinic.
The relative who raped her had already been charged.
Prosecutor Steve Maxwell and investigator Tom Williams would repeat the story of the girl’s abortion, and Tiller’s supposed failure to report it, to Shawnee County Judge Richard Anderson, court transcripts showed. But that was more than a year after they learned of the prosecution in the girl’s home state.
Another document indicated Tiller had reported the girl’s abortion to Kansas Child Protective Services.
Wow, Phill Kline dishonest, ruthless and unethical?
Also, this just in: the Sun rises in the East.
Hank – a question: If Tiller did NOT do whatever was needed to support the prosecution that was already ongoing in the 10-year-old’s case why have we not heard anything from that prosecuter? The one who sent the girl here?
By the way – I am NOT a fan of Tiller – I’d LOVE to see demand for his ’services’ totally dry up. Thus my comment above about “if we spent all this money … “
“It’s even more serious that Kline’s office may have deliberately misled the judge by presenting a specific case as evidence of a possible reporting violation when it knew – or should have known – that Tiller had in fact properly followed the law.”
Ben I am no fan of Klines or of Tillers and in no way would have wanted that little girl to give birth. One of those rare instances I agree abortion was the answer. My question was why she was allowed to be this far along. What exactly was in the letter that was ‘hand carried’ from the prosecutors office?
As with our own Kelsey Brooks,charges may have been waiting for the DNA taken from the baby. This wasn’t kept by Tiller’s office and by law should have been. If this conviction is challenged in the future could this lack of evidence let a child molester off?
Philips statement in itself is an attempt to go after Kline. “may have deliberately misled the judge” “by presenting a specific case as evidence of a possible reporting violation when it knew – or should have known – that Tiller had in fact properly followed the law.” May haves and should have known aren’t parts of good reporting.
What do we know even now about how that case was prosecuted. Is this little girl in danger still or is she in better hands than before. These are some of the reasons for this law.
Tiller doesn’t have the right to pick and choose which laws he has to follow. The Eagle should do investigative reporting and get the entire story out instead of those portions that make Tiller look good.
Even Morrison couldn’t dismiss all of the charges because Tiller doesn’t follow the law.
“This wasn’t kept by Tiller’s office and by law should have been. If this conviction is challenged in the future could this lack of evidence let a child molester off?”
We don’t know that. Also, it would seem likely that since the girl came by way of the prosecuters office that amniocentisis or something had already been done.
“knew or should have known” is a very common term in the legal field in cases like this. The point in saying it (and I have used the term myself) is that the other party has no excuse in claiming that he did not know. A “reasonable man” (another common term) would have known the information.
“My question was why she was allowed to be this far along.
It is harder and harder to find services in some areas of the country. And the poor suffer from this the most….
And it may also be that the prosecutor was getting the evidence there through amnio etc before sending her here. That would be a question best put to the prosocutor.
“okobserver” offers –
“My question was why she was allowed to be this far along.”
Gee, I dunno.
Could it be the general political climate in Texas of Illegal Abortion Advocates opposing any and every form of reproductive rights? Attempts of Illegal Abortion Advocates objecting to the morning-after pill? To insist on parental consent so underage pregnant girls have no option than shame? (You do know, “okobserver,” that many people still think a rape victim “was asking for it.”) That her rapist was a family member and she was afraid the whole family would side with him?
Any time a religion- or Bible-base issue comes up, both side accuse the other of taking stuff out of “context.” You can claim same-gender marriage is an abomination by citing one verse in Leviticus but I can’t declare the adjacent “abomination” of a ham sandwich or a shrimp Po’ Boy.
The girl in question was obviously the victim of a personal human disaster.
True justice should provide a route for rectifying or, at least, mitigating personal disasters.
Maybe that poor ten-year-old pregnant girl was the victim of institutional biases. Perhaps she spent too much time following the 3rd Commandment and, to “honor her father and mother” she hoped and prayed she wasn’t responsible for her pregnancy. Maybe that prosecutor in Texas spent hours of institutional time to find some justification to rectify his political stance against reproductive rights with justice for the victim.
The wheels of justice grind slowly. And the Illegal-Abortion Advocates have done all in their power to prevent a 10-year-old-pregnant-Texan from recovering from the crimes committed against her.
How proud you must be.
So, to answer your question –
“..why she was allowed to be this far along?” is pretty self-evident.
It was allowed to “be this far along” because you Advocates of Illegal Abortion made it that way.
MH–
Good call.
The reich-wing are nothing if not past masters at blaming the victim.
Kline deserves to go to prison.
Kline should be made to reimburse Dr. Tiller’s legal expenses.
BTH is right…instead of everyone arguing about which side is right or wrong, focus your time, energy AND your money to the causes that will help women BEFORE they have to make such a difficult choice. Hand out literature, information and birth control to anyone who wants it without limitation (parental notification etc). You all know that if two kids (or adults) decide to have sex there is nothing you can do to stop them…so ARM them with the knowledge and the power to prevent unwanted pregnancies and stop trying to be their moral conscience.
I will be away from a computer (and the blog) for some time….You all have a Happy Thanksgiving and a safe holiday whatever your plans and think of those who are less fortunate, away from home, and in our Armed Services. Consider donating your time to a charity this holiday.
Blessings from the Goddess to all! ~~ Wichi
the reason dr tiller gets so much out of state business is because the antis have hammered on providers for so long that they give up. This case in particular shows why the need to keep abortion providers is great. It shows why Dr TIller is not a bad guy. If the girl had been able to get her abortion in her home state, we’d never had heard of her. But that’s what Kline and OR wants to do here, deny access, so they have no choices. So the next time you hammer on tiller remember this case. There are always good reasons for abortions.
“There are always good reasons for abortions.”
Just as there is for war, genocide, and man’s eternal inhumanity to man.
Sometimes I get so sick of the selfishness in this world.
“Sometimes I get so sick of the selfishness in this world.”
Me too, Mary me too.
But you must remember, while YOU are truly pro life, many people who CALL themselves “pro life” are motivated not by compassion but by some selfishness or other.
I don’t know..I could never find a “good reason” to deny someone their life. And I really don’t know any pro-lifers who are like the monsters profiled on this blog. The ones I know are good people who have nothing but compassion for others, they simply believe that a developing, unborn baby is human and has the right to live.
I know there are some things worse than abortion, but it’s still an act that denies someone their chance to live, no matter how you spin it.
“My question was why she was allowed to be this far along.”
Think about it. She was 10. And if you can’t come up with even one reason, let me know, and I’ll give some clues.
Met a woman today who was dying of cancer, she has a 3 year old grandson whom she adores, and it’s so hard for her to say goodbye to him. We talked a long time about how much we value life and how hard it is to let it go. Life is a precious gift and so many of us take it for granted until it’s being taken away.
I’m lucky, I survived my cancer..others aren’t so fortunate. Life is valuble should be cherished.
Brownlee, you can bend over and kiss my butt. So can all of you liberal Tiller lovers. George Tiller is the anti-Christ, the modern day Jim Jones and Josef Mengele rolled into one. 5107 East Kellogg=American Auschwitz. Tiller is one of 10 people whose extermination would make this world a better place.
Wichita=infaticide capital of the world, safe haven for rapists of underage girls
Maggotpunk=Marxist motherf***ER
People who need to be exterminated PRONTO
George Tiller
Leroy Carhart, Tiller’s accomplice
Chelsea Brooks’ killers
Jeremiah Wright
Al Sharpton
David Duke
Kim Jong-Il
Hugo Chavez
Brownlee=Spineless Marxist sycophant. Go live in North Korea loser.
Have we met “ICT”?
The only other nic I have ever had is J R.
Do I know you? You remind me of someone.
“People who need to be exterminated PRONTO
George Tiller
Leroy Carhart, Tiller’s accomplice
Chelsea Brooks’ killers
Jeremiah Wright
Al Sharpton
David Duke
Kim Jong-Il
Hugo Chavez”
And how does calling for the “extermination” of others make you prolife?
“Inferior” = ignorant idiot.
No wonder he is inferior.
Mary_Caruso, the above people have killed millions of people (Kim Jong-Il, Tiller and Carhart), and others have called for the killing of others (David Duke). And certainly Wright and Sharpton believe the world would be a better place without white people.
5107 East Kellogg=AMERICA’s AUSCHWITZ. Tiller the Killer INCINERATES the bodies of the babies he murders. He has his own INCINERATOR! Just like the Nazis.
BlueJay, I don’t give a F*** if you’ve heard of me or not. All I know is you, Monkeyhawk, Maggotpunk, MaryCaruso, and Captain America fill this blog with your Marxist BS.
Wichita is the armpit at the southern end of the Kansas Turnpike. You have to go to Kansas City to breathe again. The only thing the two cities have in common are Marxist newspapers, although Komrade Brownlee is trying to move farther left than Red Star.
The world would be a better place if someone nuked Tiller’s Auschwitz.
Mary_Caruso, do you have a picture of George Tiller you sleep with at night?
I C(an’t)T(hink),
What are you doing out tonight? It’s not a full moon!
ICT,
Nice act. Should serve the purpose you seek, which is to give the Obamanauts cause to investigate the prolifers like Clinton did.
Now, since I recognized you as a ringer, your friends and handlers should note that you went well over the top and should be demoted back to trolling for male prostitutes.
Is it BJB, or the guy from Russell, or Geitzen?
Parkay Newman’s new name?
I asked you a question “ICT”.
Have we met?
BlueJay, fortunately, we have never met, and I don’t ever want to meet you a$$hole.
“ICTisInferior” –
You apparently “…would give anything to kick [my] pansy A$$.”
Whatcha got?
My pansy ass can take a kicking if the price is right.
ICT etc. is a full-on troll. I doubt even Parkay would welcome this development.’
So dinnertime is over, or should be.
Pmom,
Re: bjb
It’s Bryan J. Brown. I hadn’t even heard of him. He helpfully volunteered that information.
Kline is a Nazi. Kline did nothing while Attorney General except pander to the right wing nut jobs who only care about what others do with their body. Instead, real issues he should have concerned himself with such as fraud, consumer protection and predators such as the Carr Brothers were allowed to run free.