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Obama’s Not “New”
There’s an old saying: The oldest word in American politics is “new.” Only in that sense is there anything new to Barack Obama. Obama prefers the word “progressive” to “liberal” because it makes it sound like he’s shedding old liberal ideas. But if he is, it’s only to embrace older ones.
America first encountered the vision Obama espouses under Woodrow Wilson, the first progressive president and the first to openly disparage the U.S. Constitution as a hindrance to enlightened government. His new idea was to replace it with a “living constitution” that empowered government to evolve beyond that document’s constraints. The Bill of Rights, lamented the progressives, inhibited what the government can do to people, but it failed to delineate what it must do for people.
The old conception of individualism needed to be replaced by a new system in which the citizen would “marry his interests to the state,” in Wilson’s words. This would allow the state to fulfill the progressive pledge to “spread the prosperity around.” Obama shares Wilson’s faith in a living constitution and has argued that Supreme Court judges should be confirmed based on their empathy for the downtrodden.
In a vital essay in the current Claremont Review of Books, Charles Kesler notes that Obama mentions Franklin Roosevelt in his book, “The Audacity of Hope,” more times than any living Democratic politician. That’s not surprising, given that FDR — a veteran of the Wilson administration — carried the progressive vision of government much further than Wilson himself.
In 1944, FDR proposed updating the Bill of Rights with a new “economic bill of rights” that would define freedom not as liberty from government intrusion but as the possession of goodies provided by government. “Necessitous men are not free men,” FDR proclaimed. It’s a statement Obama surely agrees with; his advisor, Cass Sunstein, wrote a book saying FDR’s “second bill of rights” should become the defining principle of American politics.
Wilson, Roosevelt and now Obama — all their ideas sprung forth from the work of John Dewey, the most important liberal philosopher of the 20th century. Dewey held that “natural rights and natural liberties exist only in the kingdom of mythological social zoology,” and that “organized social control” via a “socialized economy” was the only means to create “free” individuals. Dewey proposed that statism be taught as a kind of civic religion in our schools so that Americans could be raised to see the government as the solution to all of our problems.
Dewey lives on in the education reform ideas espoused by former Weatherman Bill Ayers. Ayers, now an education professor at the University of Illinois at Chicago, often invokes Dewey when justifying his own dream of indoctrinating public school students in “social justice.” Obama doesn’t condone Ayers’ ’70s-era bombings, but he certainly subscribes to Ayers’ educational vision. In fact, Ayers’ educational work is the primary defense for the candidate’s association with an unrepentant terrorist.
Much has been made of Obama’s comment to “Joe the Plumber” that things are better when we “spread the wealth around.” The Obama campaign has rebuffed charges of “socialism” or “radicalism” with the usual eye-rolling.
But Obama’s words that day in Ohio were consistent with his past statements. A just-unearthed 2001 interview with Obama on Chicago public radio reveals as much. Then a law school instructor and state legislator, Obama offered an eloquent indictment of the Warren Court for not being radical enough. While the court rightly gave blacks traditional rights, argued Obama, “the Supreme Court never ventured into the issues of redistribution of wealth.” Unfortunately, according to Obama, “it didn’t break free from the essential constraints that were placed by the Founding Fathers in the Constitution.”
Officially, Obama says he is not advocating single-payer health care. That would seem too un-moderate. But in 2003, Obama told the AFL-CIO, “I happen to be a proponent of a single-payer universal health care program. … But as all of you know, we may not get there immediately. Because first we have to take back the White House, we have to back the Senate, and we have to take back the House.”
Note: If Obama wins next week, all three of his preconditions will have been met, and his colleagues in the House and Senate are itching like junkies for a new New Deal. Only in a country of amnesiacs could one claim that socialized medicine is a “new idea.”
Blowing away the dust and cobwebs from ancient wares doesn’t make them new. Save for his skin color, Obama doesn’t represent anything novel. Rather, he symbolizes a return to an older vision of the United States that was seen as the “wave of the future” eight decades ago. I for one have no desire to go back to that future.
Jonah Goldberg
http://townhall.com/columnists/JonahGoldberg/2008/10/29/obamas_not_new
We’re utterly fascinated by this.
In 2004, we don’t remember hearing about anyone scared Kerry was going to take their guns away – and we worked Pennsylvania for Kerry (Pittsburgh area). There were a lot of gun shops and firing ranges there, and we never heard anything about people stocking up on guns because they were scared Kerry was going to try to take them away.
Obama is perceived as more liberal than Kerry, and in fact the most liberal Democrat that’s run for president in as long as anyone can remember. Biden as VP makes this the most liberal ticket that Democrats have ever fielded. There is nothing about it that puts the bitter, gun-and-relgion-people-who-are-apathetic-to-those-not-like-them living in Pennsylvania at ease.
http://hillbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/10/29/this-is-fascinating-gun-sales-increase-could-predict-obama-defeat/
(1) Democrats like us at HillBuzz are working with Republicans for the first time in our lives to elect John McCain/Sarah Palin because we do not like or trust Obama/Biden.
(2) Hillary Democrats not openly working for McCain are silently voting for him — and voting Republican for the first time in their lives in most cases.
(3) Early voting has not met Obama’s expectations — Republicans are tied or ahead in most states, and nowhere is Obama enjoying blowout advantages he claimed he’d have.
(4) In all states, there is a marked “enthusiasm gap” between support for Obama and support remembered for Kerry in 2004 or Gore in 2000…lack of yard signs, stickers, posters, and excitement to vote for Obama, despite what the media claims.
(5) Gun owners afraid of Obama, and stocking up on weapons because they are that freaked out by the thought of anyone voting for him.
http://hillbuzz.wordpress.com/2008/10/29/this-is-fascinating-gun-sales-increase-could-predict-obama-defeat/
So we’ve all been noting the DRAMATIC drop in the price of gasoline, down to 2.09 per gallon, which is incredible considering where we’ve been.
And I heard today that “OPEC was in talks” about cutting oil production.
Don’t you see, they’re already setting it up for their excuse to raise it after the election- JUST LIKE I TOLD YOU IT WOULD.
Tell me they aren’t in cahoots again with the Bush admin.
Heckler, you can only use the ‘most liberal’ card once, and you used it with Kerry. And remember, Americans are hurting, they’re not afraid of what could happen because it can’t get much worse than what your side has already done to them.
The lack of signs and stickers is because the campaign chose to not do those- figuring that they could spend that money better elsewhere.
anyone who has a sign bought them.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15004503/
It happened during the last election too…note the DATE in this story.
Oops, another ethics complaint for Palin. The ol’ girl has to face complaints concerning her bilking the Alaskan taxpayers for Palin’s use of her family as state employees. State employees can be reimbursed for travel expenses. Palin robbed the taxpayers of $54,803. That’s about as much as she spent remodeling her office in Wasilla (because a few thousand for rape kits was too expensive). Yup, real slimeball the Republicans picked.
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Palin_subject_of_new_ethics_complaint_1029.html
Hank I must say that is one of the most intelligent counter to Barrack Obama I have read.
It would take some research to see its truthfulness and accuracy which is good as so far everything else’s has been more “if the truth an’t bad enough than make up a good lie”. Through my studying of the Neo-conservatives ideology. I am more familiar with Wilson’s thinking on using the United States to spread Democracy through out the World. They often refer to President Wilson in their intent to force the World to comply. But it will be worth researching into this aspect of the Wilson ideology sighted in the article.
But I will say, well found friend!
P.M. I made mine.
Writerdog, the first mistake I saw was Hank’s labeling Wilson as a progressive. The guy was a White Supremacist and Klan sympathizer who dragged the country to war and was dragged kicking and screaming to give women the right to vote. Why bother reading after something so blatantly absurd?
If you want to call national healthcare the ‘new deal’ I’m all for it. Remember how prosperous the US was after the last deal.
Another Republican busted for theft, or as Republicans like to call it, politics as usual.
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Republican_caught_stealing_opponents_campaign_signs_1029.html
Texas joins the list of states that has magical voting machines that switch Democratic votes to Republican ones. It’s the only way Republicans can win.
http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/10/straight-party.html
Obama’s commerical ad spin, same old pap. I hope the Messiah loses and all the polls and libs are wrong.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D944H6EO0&show_article=1
Political moma
You might note that those are not my words, they are from a Hillary site.
‘Morning dog!
How ya been?
If you enjoyed Jonah Goldberg’s column you’d really be interested in his books. He has a lot of insight into the direction the democrat party is taking today.
Hank, there is no “democrat party”. Nice to know where a non-existent party is headed. Any more revelations of brilliance? It’s the Democratic Party, dunderhead.
Writerdog, I also read Hank’s quoted editorial (you know, the link would be sufficient), and while it was a little better in tone than the nonsense that he frequently posts here, it really wasn’t much better.
Goldberg’s assumptions:
1) “Progressives”, not conservatives, want to overrule the constitution. This is an implicit assumption, and Goldberg really doesn’t back it up. We have seen plenty of “conservative” attempts to get around what the constitution says these past eight years and before that. Not to mention the perennial problems several self defined conservatives (and certainly those who constitute the online readership of Town Hall) have with the First and Fourteenth Amendments.
2) Related to this is the assumption that public government is the biggest threat to constitutional liberties and particularly negative rights. This is a broadly held assumption (not only by traditional conservatives but by libertarians who are generally intelligent enough that it is breathtaking that they don’t know better) that is, quite simply, completely wrong. It was the federal government, and especially the executive branch backing the judiciary, that forced local and state governments to finally start recognizing the negative rights of individuals from ethnic and religious minorities in the mid-20th century. The response to that was to invoke the curious concept of “state’s rights”, which in this case meant that state’s had the right to manage the lives of their citizens without federal interference. And most especially, the most modern repudiation of the viewpoint that biggest government is always the biggest threat to negative rights comes from private governments, particulary CID’s (common interest developments), where attempts to literally micromanage how a person lives in their home is common.
3) Historical reality, while the actual record is of course mixed, the New Deal at least in some aspects worked, better than the relatively hands off approach tried by the (admittedly often unjustly maligned) Herbert Hoover.
Get business OUT of Government.
Get Government IN to business!
Good morning, P-Mom!
We can use the ‘most liberal’ terms all we want! Especially when the dems think the answer is to run a team each cycle that is more liberal than the last one!
In 2007, Obama was the ‘most liberal’ senator. Biden was ranked #3.
The only avowed socialist in the senate is Bernie Sanders. He’s ranked #4! Is the Obama/Biden team the most liberal team ever? Well, gentle lady, they’re so far to the left they make Bernie look like a moderate!
hehehehe
That’s funny, McCain ranked #1 for being the most fascist Senator. He’s so far to the right he makes Mussolini look like a liberal.
Both of my grandfathers had bad things to say about Roosevelt and his new deal. The control by Roosevelt’s government was oppressive and smothering.
It’s a good thing both were subsistence farmers and could provide their own food. However, if they needed cash, they had to sign on to one of Roosevelt’s slave force, the WPA or whatever.
They spoke of slave wages and 12 hour work days.
Some of the brick streets in Wichita was the result of my grandfather’s labor.
Good morning, Maggotpunk!
No offense was meant by the term ‘democrat party’. However, if you are so week that offense was taken,. . .well, . . that’s just an added bonus!
nitwit
I’m not offended, I’m just pleased pointing out how ignorant you are. Being that you’re a creationist it doesn’t take much.
The gap is closing. Three points in some polls.
This election is starting to remind me of the KU- Memphis national championship game. Outplayed for most of the game and trailing, the Jayhawks never gave up. They snuck back in it against the overconfident Tigers until, as the clock ran out, Mario put up the 3 point prayer and….
You remember what happened. Prayer answered.
It could happen here.
hehehe
That’s ‘young earth creationist’ to you, get it right.
Dare to dream outlander.
It’s all ya got.
HLP
Posted October 30, 2008 at 7:50 am | Permalink
Good morning, Maggotpunk!
No offense was meant by the term ‘democrat party’. However, if you are so week that offense was taken,. . .well, . . that’s just an added bonus!
nitwit
————————————–
HLP, please don’t call Maggotpink nitwit.
It insinuates he actually HAS a wit.
outlander
Posted October 30, 2008 at 7:57 am | Permalink
The gap is closing. Three points in some polls.
—————————————-
Since most polls are conducted by phone, and republicans are smart enough to get on the “no call” list, it stands to reason the polls are probably inacurate.
I agree, outlander.
The early voting is very disturbing for the Obama camp. If the trend continues when the ‘bitter clingers’ pull the curtain closed on the voting booth November 4th the results might just shock ‘that one’!
hehehehe
Or maybe it’s because when the phone rings Republicans get confused by technology and think it’s the door buzzer.
Maggotpink
Posted October 30, 2008 at 8:09 am | Permalink
Or maybe it’s because when the phone rings Republicans get confused by technology and think it’s the door buzzer.
———————————–
Well they don’t seem to have as much trouble with “technology” as the average democrap voter….
hehehehehe….
at least they CAN use a votin’ machine!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!
Coming from a guy who is supporting someone who has never used a computer.
Time to finish my ballot and get it on its way.
So far, I have voted FOR the school bond and our children’s future. I’ve voted a straight Democratic ticket through the judges. AND I have realized that Kansas MUST vote for Donald Betts and be PART of the Democratic wave as opposed to being washed away by it.
My vote for Kansas United States Senator.
The reasoning here is similar. Incumbent Senator Pat Roberts is an entrenched Republicon. In a Senate that will be controlled by Democrats, Roberts will not have any voice with which to speak for Kansas and Kansas will CONTINUE to be ignored and laughed at by the rest of the country.
Too, Pat Robets’s slow and heel dragging work is an embarrassment for himself and for Kansas.
MY vote is for Jim Slattery. Let’s get some NEW blood in there.
“If the trend continues when the ‘bitter clingers’
You mean greedy bigots.
Point taken, biased 1. From now on he will be referred to as the ‘witless nit’.
As far as polls go, the dirty little secret they won’t tell you about is that only about one in six people contacted by pollsters will participate.
The reason there is such a disparity among the polls is because they all bring certain assumptions and ‘fudge factors’ to the process.
In short, polls mean little.
hehehe
The real reason Republicans are bitter and angry:
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/
Projected landslide victory. It’ll give something for the racists to whine about for the next four years.
#
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 8:13 am | Permalink
Coming from a guy who is supporting someone who has never used a computer.
_________________________________________________
hehehe
Coming from a guy that supports someone that has never landed a plane on an aircraft carrier.
witlessnit
BeeJay- You mean greedy bigots.
——————
Yes, I’m certain he did. Or maybe “God fearin’ rednecks” or a few other “non-bigoted” names you can come up with.
Coming from a guy who has never killed over a hundred sailors. Oops.
Coming from a guy who never killed anyone using a car. Oops.
Coming from a guy who never ditched his wife to hook up with an heiress. Oops.
Coming from a guy who never was part of the Keating scandal. Oops.
You’re right, I’m a nitwit, I can’t think of anything.
Maggotpink- You’re right, I’m a nitwit, I can’t think of anything.
——————————–
Agreed.
“God fearin’”
What IS that? What kind of “God” would want people afraid of him? What kind of people would worship such a “God”, the happily miserable?
hehehe
That’s it ‘punk? That’s all you got? The same old worn out lies?
witlessnit
Good point Biased. I think I should support Palin. After all, why not mock scientific research into genetics so we can all have more Down Syndrome children? Or be like McCain and mock the genetic research of bears so we can’t develop technologies that would help preserve tissues to aid old geezers like McCain.
What more do you expect from a party that derides scientific research and education?
Well, have fun kids. It’s my day off, I got to go do chores.
BeeJay
Posted October 30, 2008 at 8:23 am | Permalink
“God fearin’”
What IS that? What kind of “God” would want people afraid of him? What kind of people would worship such a “God”, the happily miserable?
————————————————
Yes, that’s it, the “happily miserable.”
My mistake, happily miserable rednecks.
Political_mama
Posted October 30, 2008 at 7:04 am | Permalink
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15004503/
It happened during the last election too…note the DATE in this story.
——————————————————————–
I’m curious, if the date on that story is 2006, why does the graph in that story have data from 2008?
heh.
Maggotpink- What more do you expect from a party that derides scientific research and education?
——————————–
“derides” as opposed to worship?
Tell me ignorant one, how does one worship scientific research and education?
“Well, have fun kids. It’s my day off, I got to go do chores.”
I wish someone would come here and do MY chores today!
The girls have been slackin’ on the eggs. It might be time for some stewed hens or chicken and noodles… Except not enough eggs for the noodles!
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 8:32 am | Permalink
Tell me ignorant one, how does one worship scientific research and education?
———————————————
“Tell me ignorant one”
HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
TOO funny….
witlessnit
ksfrmgrrlicker- The girls have been slackin’ on the eggs.
————————
change food.
What IS the matter with Kansas?
http://electoral-vote.com/
Hang on bitter clingers. Some day, perhaps quite soon, you could have ALL of this state’s atmosphere and charm all to yourselves.
Heh, it’ll be like Thunderdome without the class.
It didn’t take too long to stump Biased, did it?
biased1
Posted October 30, 2008 at 8:31 am | Permalink
Maggotpink- What more do you expect from a party that derides scientific research and education?
—————————————————-
This is a misconception with regards to research.
I believe the conservative mantra to be no Government funding of. It’s a free market economy. Good ideas get funded. Legitimate ideas get funded. Do you think if there was money to be made in cures thru some of these things that they would not be being funded by pharamceutical companies, VC’s, etc.?
As far as teaching evolution, I like Governor Palin’s position. Teach them both. Why are liberals so afraid of Intelligent Design that is must be silenced?
“ksfarmgrrl” bemoans –
“…not enough eggs for the noodles!”
I know your type, “ksfarmgrrl.”
Years ago I asked my sister for her recipe for bean dip.
It began:
“Plant forty bean plants….”
Talk about cooking from scratch.
They’re noodles f’r chrissake! They’re sold in stores.
Sounds to me like your hens aren’t all that impressed with the resident rooster.
(Have you given him a name? Is it “biased1″?)
I was informed by KFG that a rooster is not necessary for egg production, Monkey.
Kia, creationism isn’t science so it’s no point teaching mythology in science class. As for research, genetic research is immensely promising. Palin is a creationist and just doesn’t understand science. She was giving a speech about the need for scientific research to cure genetic diseases but derided the very same research that would help with it. She also derided scientific research that would aid the agricultural community. Is it your position that agricultural research that would aid plant growth resisting crop diseases, pests and drought is somehow not fruitful? Palin is just a moron.
HA! My girls did better without a rooster!
They are just getting old, and days are shorter. They produce better in the spring and summer. I’m going to replace them next spring, but I was hoping they’d continue to produce until the new ones were ready.
Hehehehhe. I cant tell who’s working out there and who isnt. And carrying hot water to them in the freezing weather isnt my idea of fun. So…
Hatchet time for everyone!
And I’m kidding about the noodles. I actually have a bunch in the freezer.
Ummmmmmmmm!
I remember my sister made some german style noodles (Spaetzle) from some self-rising flour. I have no idea to this day why she used self-rising flour.
Evidently, the flour had not completely risen. After having a most satisfying meal, the noodles began to rise in my stomach – talk about discomfort…
Heh Reg. I love spaetzle. Kind of a cross between noodles and dumplings. My mom used to make something called “rivels” that were like spaetzle, except thicker. Ummmm. Rivel soup.
I miss my Mom….
“Why are liberals so afraid of Intelligent Design that is must be silenced?”
—–
This “liberal” has no fear of Intelligent Design. It isn’t science, will never be science and shouldn’t be taught in a science class. Theology has long been taught and I don’t see why it won’t continue to be an elective at most schools, thus there is no silencing of Intelligent Design.
“Why are liberals so afraid of Intelligent Design that is must be silenced’
Because it’s religion and has no place in the public school system that is supported by our tax money. If you want your kids to have religion, then put them in a private school.
I suppose the anti-science crowd will also demand the following:
Astrology be taught in astronomy
Phrenology be taught in psychology
Holocaust Denial be taught in history
Crystal healing be taught in medicine
Obama’s Aunt Found Living in Rundown Boston Neighborhood
The Democratic candidate’s Kenyan aunt is found living in a rundown public housing neighborhood in South Boston
By James Bone, Rob Crilly and Ben Macintyre, The Times of London
Barack Obama has lived one version of the American dream that has taken him to the steps of the White House. But a few miles from where the Democratic presidential candidate studied at Harvard, his Kenyan aunt and uncle, immigrants living in modest circumstances in Boston, have a contrasting American story.
Zeituni Onyango, the aunt so affectionately described in Obama’s best-selling memoir “Dreams fFrom My Father,” lives in a disabled-access flat on a rundown public housing estate in South Boston.
A second relative believed to be the long-lost “Uncle Omar” described in the book was beaten by armed robbers with a “sawed-off rifle” while working in a corner shop in the Dorchester area of the city. He was later evicted from his one-bedroom apartment for failing to pay $2,324.20 in bills, according to the Boston Housing Court.
The press has repeatedly rehearsed Obama’s extraordinary odyssey, but the other side of the family’s American experience has only been revealed in parts. Just across town from where Obama made history as the first black president of the Harvard Law Review, some of his closest blood relatives have confronted the harshness of immigrant life in America.
In his book Obama writes that “Uncle Omar” had gone missing after moving to Boston in the 1960s a quarter-century before Obama first visited his family in Kenya. Aunt Zeituni is now also living in Boston, and recently made a $260 campaign contribution to her nephew’s presidential bid from a work address in the city.
Speaking outside her home in Flaherty Way, South Boston, on Tuesday, Onyango, 56, confirmed she was the “Auntie Zeituni” in Obama’s memoir. She declined to answer most other questions about her relationship with the presidential contender until after the November 4 election.
http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/30/obamas-aunt-living-rundown-boston-neighborhood/
…Because it’s religion and has no place in the public school system that is supported by our tax money. If you want your kids to have religion, then put them in a private school.
This kind of logic is what puts our country at a disadvantage in the world. I don’t want the public school system immersing our kids in religion or trying to indoctrinate kids to any one religion.
But -
To believe that religion has no place in the public school system is just idiotic. ANY social studies class has to include a segment on religion, or the class is incomplete. A class on world religion should be a requirement in every single school district. Honestly, it’s more important than algebra (and I’m an engineer).
To understand other cultures – look first into their religion(s).
Going to have 4 yrs. of crying around here, but we won’t have to address any issue the RW raise, just dismiss them with More Obama Bashing. Or, Obama hater.
Going to be fun.
So Blue Jay/JR, are you FOR or AGAINST Obama?
Were you wrong then, or are you wrong now?
Maggotpink
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:05 am | Permalink
I suppose the anti-science crowd will also demand the following:
Astrology be taught in astronomy
Phrenology be taught in psychology
Holocaust Denial be taught in history
Crystal healing be taught in medicine
——————————————–
I don’t know too many conservatives that believe in Astrology, phrenology, holocaust deniers, and crystal healers. (ok maybe nancy regan)
All of this?
looney left.
anyone who has a sign bought them.
Yes, I did. Proudly.
I’ve noticed a lack of political signs around at least my side of town. Oh, there’s a “clump” here and there, but nothing like it usually is. And that goes for both parties.
Golfnut, how much time do you think it’ll take to properly cover the thousands of religions in America? Don’t forget to include the numerous non-theistic philosophies too.
AP FACT CHECK: Obama Ad Avoids Budget Realities
The Associated Press takes a look at the details in Obama’s prime-time ad
WASHINGTON — Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama was less than upfront in his half-hour commercial Wednesday night about the costs of his programs and the crushing budget pressures he would face in office.
Obama’s assertion that “I’ve offered spending cuts above and beyond” the expense of his promises is accepted only by his partisans. His vow to save money by “eliminating programs that don’t work” masks his failure throughout the campaign to specify what those programs are — beyond the withdrawal of troops from Iraq.
A sampling of what voters heard in the ad, and what he didn’t tell them:
THE SPIN: “That’s why my health care plan includes improving information technology, requires coverage for preventive care and pre-existing conditions and lowers health care costs for the typical family by $2,500 a year.”
THE FACTS: His plan does not lower premiums by $2,500, or any set amount. Obama hopes that by spending $50 billion over five years on electronic medical records and by improving access to proven disease management programs, among other steps, consumers will end up saving money. He uses an optimistic analysis to suggest cost reductions in national health care spending could amount to the equivalent of $2,500 for a family of four. Many economists are skeptical those savings can be achieved, but even if they are, it’s not a certainty that every dollar would be passed on to consumers in the form of lower premiums.
THE SPIN: “I also believe every American has a right to affordable health care.”
THE FACTS: That belief should not be confused with a guarantee of health coverage for all. He makes no such promise. Obama hinted as much in the ad when he said about the problem of the uninsured: “I want to start doing something about it.” He would mandate coverage for children but not adults. His program is aimed at making insurance more affordable by offering the choice of government-subsidized coverage similar to that in a plan for federal employees and other steps, including requiring larger employers to share costs of insuring workers.
THE SPIN: “I’ve offered spending cuts above and beyond their cost.”
THE FACTS: Independent analysts say both Obama and Republican John McCain would deepen the deficit. The nonpartisan Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget estimates Obama’s policy proposals would add a net $428 billion to the deficit over four years — and that analysis accepts the savings he claims from spending cuts. The nonpartisan Tax Policy Center, whose other findings have been quoted approvingly by the Obama campaign, says: “Both John McCain and Barack Obama have proposed tax plans that would substantially increase the national debt over the next 10 years.” The analysis goes on to say: “Neither candidate’s plan would significantly increase economic growth unless offset by spending cuts or tax increases that the campaigns have not specified.”
THE SPIN: “Here’s what I’ll do. Cut taxes for every working family making less than $200,000 a year. Give businesses a tax credit for every new employee that they hire right here in the U.S. over the next two years and eliminate tax breaks for companies that ship jobs overseas. Help homeowners who are making a good faith effort to pay their mortgages, by freezing foreclosures for 90 days. And just like after 9-11, we’ll provide low-cost loans to help small businesses pay their workers and keep their doors open. ”
THE FACTS: His proposals — the tax cuts, the low-cost loans, the $15 billion a year he promises for alternative energy, and more — cost money, and the country could be facing a record $1 trillion deficit next year. Indeed, Obama recently acknowledged — although not in his commercial — that: “The next president will have to scale back his agenda and some of his proposals.”
http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/29/ap-fact-check-obama-ad-avoids-budget-realities/
Evolution is a theory as much as Intelligent Design is.
From the Socialist:
BlueJay
Posted October 30, 2008 at 7:40 am | Permalink
Get business OUT of Government.
Get Government IN to business!
Maggotpink thinks all scientist are liberal democraps. And liberal democraps are athiests.
Does that just about sum it up for ya?
No Kia, a scientific theory is based upon facts. Evolution has it, creationism doesn’t.
The DailyKos will now be preaching how good Socialism is for America.
The Socialist Party of America and DailyKos will become one big combined web site, merged into the DNC.
The DNC will be the new Politboro of the Democrat Socialist Party of America.
Be afraid BM. Be VERY afraid!
Punk,
Sure I do. Are you suggesting that the magnitude of a subject is a reason not to teach same?
You could begin with researching what a scientific theory is and go from there. It will take some study for you to catch up but it’s a worthwhile endeavor. Or, you can continue to ignore what you don’t want to know. I’ll bet you’re well informed on something other than science. Until you have done enough study to understand your own statement of, “Evolution is a theory as much as Intelligent Design is,” there is really no need for anyone to discuss the subject further with you.
Golfnut, how can you teach creationism when there aren’t any facts to support it?
KSGolfnut
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:24 am | Permalink
Punk,
Sure I do. Are you suggesting that the magnitude of a subject is a reason not to teach same?
—————————————
Too many stars!!
ARGHHH!!
I’m losing my MIND!!
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:21 am | Permalink
No Kia, a scientific theory is based upon facts. Evolution has it, creationism doesn’t.
—————————————————-
No, it doesn’t. There is no “missing link” no matter how hard you try.
How can you teach Evolution when you can’t prove with facts how the Universe was Created?
“Missing link”? Do you mean the transitional form in between other known transitional forms? Plenty have been found and speciation has been observed but why bother pointing this out? Your position is to teach creationism which has no scientific facts to support it.
“How can you teach Evolution when you can’t prove with facts how the Universe was Created?”
For that matter, why bother teaching classes on the American governmental system if you can’t prove with facts on how the universe was created? What’s your point? There’s no need to teach two different subjects of study in the same class. Biology and astronomy are two different subjects.
Economy contracted last quarter, I’m sure when they peg the start date of the recession they’ll go further back.
Show me the evidence to support evolution and how the Universe “evolved” to form matter from nothing.
If matter was always there, and space was always there, then was caused it to be there?
Just saw that China been exporting a great deal of tainted food supplies around the world, believe one of the biggies is eggs. Farmgirl going to cash in!
If matter was always there, and space was always there, then was caused it to be there?
See evolution doesn’t discount a first being or divine source.
Blog Monitor, are you new on the forums? For the past couple months I’ve been posting scientific evidence for evolution. Looks like I have to start all over again. Should I even bother since you seem to not even know what evolution is because the development of the universe has absolutely nothing to do with evolution.
Phantom, when did the adjustments of the adjustments first begin, ’bout a year ago? That’s also when the recession began. Cooking the books found new recipes in this attempt to get bush outta Dodge before this caught up to him and his.
No BugPunk, you can’t have your evolution timeline begin in the middle. You have to prove it from the beginning or you prove nothing.
A piece of the puzzle does not prove the big picture.
Show me the evidence to support evolution and how the Universe “evolved” to form matter from nothing.
Is there a crank website out there that says this stuff? Where are you getting this nonsense?
Maggotpink- Plenty have been found and speciation has been observed but why bother pointing this out?
——————————
Example?
Like where is the bird with half a developed wing?
Or did the wing just “magically” appear?
Which came first, the snake or the lizard?
Why do we still have BOTH living on an isolated island? There are so many holes in Derwoods theory it IS laughable. Find a hole? Make $hit up.
real scientific.
So God created evolution?
Phantom
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:34 am | Permalink
If matter was always there, and space was always there, then was caused it to be there?
See evolution doesn’t discount a first being or divine source.
That is a ridiculous statement.
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:34 am | Permalink
the development of the universe has absolutely nothing to do with evolution.
“No BugPunk, you can’t have your evolution timeline begin in the middle. You have to prove it from the beginning or you prove nothing.”
No, you just don’t know what evolution is. What does the development of the universe have to do with the frequency change of alleles? Where do you get such nonsense from?
Maggotpink- “speciation”
—————–
They even had to make WORDS up!
witlessnit
Discussing cosmology and evolution with some of these people is like trying to correct a stubborn first-grader. Except the first-grader is likely to retain more knowledge.
“Example?
Like where is the bird with half a developed wing?
Or did the wing just “magically” appear?
Which came first, the snake or the lizard?
Why do we still have BOTH living on an isolated island? There are so many holes in Derwoods theory it IS laughable. Find a hole? Make $hit up.
real scientific.”
Derwood? I really have no idea the absurdity that you are rambling about? Half a developed wing? What are you blabbering about? Creationists can be so absurd it’s difficult to translate your ignorance into something nearing reality.
It’s interesting to point out that “creationists” and “Christians” are willing to share time for their theories and evolutionists are not.
If you believe in God, he was the first source, and all things flowed from him.
“They even had to make WORDS up!”
Did you even look up the word ’speciation’? Nah, that might mean you’re intellectual curious, it proves that you aren’t.
Our data only goes back to the Big Bang event. Was there matter or energy before that? Our data cannot guide us there, as the data essentially says that there was no before…
Cool, huh?
I agree biased1, this ‘debate’ is like speaking with defective robotic units that are attempting to paraphrase public prep school propoganda.
No point in trying to explain to a bug that it is just a bug and not the Supreme Being of the Jungle.
“It’s interesting to point out that “creationists” and “Christians” are willing to share time for their theories and evolutionists are not.”
Creationists have a theory? I’d love to hear what it is because I have yet to have a creationist actually present one.
There is a collection of people here determined to not understand what a theory is, what evolution is, etc.
You cannot educate anyone who is so unwilling to learn.
Angry Johnny and the Killbillies said:
“Even Jesus cannot save someone who is unwilling to atone.” A similar situation here. I suggest saving keystokes for something more useful. But it is your time, do as you wish…
t’s interesting to point out that “creationists” and “Christians” are willing to share time for their theories and evolutionists are not.
That’s interesting? Where are their theories? The editors of peer-reviewed journals have been waiting for decades in vain.
There are no creationist theories. There is simply dogma recast in scientific-looking language.
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:41 am | Permalink
“Example?
Like where is the bird with half a developed wing?
Or did the wing just “magically” appear?
Which came first, the snake or the lizard?
—————————————————-
Do you not even understand the basis of your own theory?
A bird is a bird. A snake a snake. A lizard a lizard. And a human a human.
Show me the fish growing legs fossil and becoming man as we know it today.
Dinosaurs showing feathery growths – perhaps for warmth… evolving into bigger, more structural feathers… The information is in the fossil record…
Why oh why, in this great nation do we have to keep going over biology 101 for the dufus class?
Dinosaurs showing feathery growths – perhaps for warmth… evolving into bigger, more structural feathers… The information is in the fossil record…
Why oh why, in this great nation do we have to keep going over biology 101 for the dufus class?
“Did you even look up the word ’speciation’? Nah, that might mean you’re intellectual curious, it proves that you aren’t.”
Remember, CONS dont google because it’s too much like thinking.
“Do you not even understand the basis of your own theory?
A bird is a bird. A snake a snake. A lizard a lizard. And a human a human.
Show me the fish growing legs fossil and becoming man as we know it today.”
A fish with legs? That’s easy. The oldest evidence is the Tiktaalik roseae.
Sorry. I don’t subscribe to the unearthing of new fossilized creatures as evidence that they are a link from fish to man. Show me the fins going to opposable thumbs.
“Sorry. I don’t subscribe to the unearthing of new fossilized creatures as evidence that they are a link from fish to man. Show me the fins going to opposable thumbs.”
Sorry, creationists believe in magic, not scientists. You won’t find a fish that magically turns into a man.
Why is it when you ask creationists for their “theory” or facts that they claim to have they suddenly go quiet?
It’s a matter of faith, bugpunk.
Creationists have faith in God.
Evolutionists have faith that Matter poofed out of nothingness.
“Evolutionists have faith that Matter poofed out of nothingness.”
Actually that’s what creationists believe. Only living beings that reproduce can evolve. Are you just upset because you have absolutely no clue about the subject?
Still waiting for that scientific evidence the creationists claim to have. I suspect this will be another day of creationists making excuses, whining and lying.
It’s a matter of faith, bugpunk.
Creationists have faith in God.
Evolutionists have faith that Matter poofed out of nothingness.
———-
And we’ve come full circle. It’s a matter of faith, and doesn’t belong in science classes. There is no suppression of theology there is only subjects of study separated by what belongs in which field.
Steven said it way back on the thread — why waste keystrokes? Question after question after question — the game of twenty questions — from those who won’t understand science and have no answers.
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:04 am | Permalink
Actually that’s what creationists believe. Only living beings that reproduce can evolve
—————————————————-
You’re kinda digging a hole there when you get to your homosexual argument. LOL
Why does the Ostrich still have wings and feathers?
From an evolutionary or creationism stand point re: Ostrich.
“You’re kinda digging a hole there when you get to your homosexual argument. LOL”
Once again a creationist statement I cannot translate into reality. Perhaps I’m just not capable of dumbing myself down today.
Said he (or she?) with not more than a High school education or a job…
“Why does the Ostrich still have wings and feathers?”
Why wouldn’t it?
Was McWorse involved in a DUI/fatal accident in 1964 at the front gates of a Navy base in Va. and admitted with injuries to Portsmouth Naval Hospital?
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:14 am | Permalink
“Why does the Ostrich still have wings and feathers?”
Why wouldn’t it?
========
It doesn’t fly.
I understand your point Linda.
But Yes, I have a problem with theories being taught in schools with the entire purpose being to discredit a belief system without said belief system also being taught.
Why do boys have nipples?
“It doesn’t fly.”
That doesn’t answer the question. Pandas don’t fly yet they still have hands and insulating fur. Do you have a point?
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:17 am | Permalink
Why do boys have nipples?
—————————————————-
I have nipples Greg, can you milk me?
Why do whales have hair?
I have a problem with theories being taught in schools with the entire purpose being to discredit a belief system
You really believe that? 150+ years of scientific research, all just to discredit some belief system?
What belief system is being discredited, and how?
That doesn’t answer the question.
++++++++++
I posed the question first Maggot, care to answer it?
Punk,
Just try to answer the question. Thanks.
Sure I do. Are you suggesting that the magnitude of a subject is a reason not to teach same?
I have nipples Greg, can you milk me?
——
HE HE HE!
“I posed the question first Maggot, care to answer it?”
It’s obvious, ostriches have wings and feathers because their genes code for wings and feathers. I’m just wondering why you think they shouldn’t.
True Mr. Kia. If there ever was a genetic basis for homosexuality, a homosexual organism by definition couldn’t reproduce, and under evolutionary theory the genes would have been purged from the gene pool.
Mr. Kia, until you’ve gained that understanding of what a scientific theory is, there is no discussion. I know of no science which discredits any belief system. In fact, I know of no science which even addresses any belief system.
“True Mr. Kia. If there ever was a genetic basis for homosexuality, a homosexual organism by definition couldn’t reproduce, and under evolutionary theory the genes would have been purged from the gene pool.”
Homosexuals are capable of reproducing. Therefore you really don’t have a point. How do figure a male testes is incapable of producing sperm simply because he favors other men?
It’s obvious, ostriches have wings and feathers because their genes code for wings and feathers.
=======
So due to it’s gene codes, the Ostrich has always been an Ostrich and never in any other form?
“So due to it’s gene codes, the Ostrich has always been an Ostrich and never in any other form?”
If it wasn’t an ostrich then it wouldn’t be called an ostrich would it?
Any ETA on that theory of creationism?
You mean if you choose to ahem, “favor” other men, don’t you?
If it wasn’t an ostrich then it wouldn’t be called an ostrich would it?
=======
The Pre-Ostrich. It’s like a whole other species.
Any ETA on that theory of creationism?
Seconded.
Males have nipples because all embryos begin as female until they receive the testosterone poisoning (heehee!!) from mom.
So many great question here.. too bad they won’t read the scienceor audit a science class and get some answers…
You mean if you choose to ahem, “favor” other men, don’t you?
The fact you’re overlooking at that homosexuals are humans. The fact that gay sex doesn’t produce children may account for their relatively low occurence in the genetic pool.
There aren’t many cases of progeria (sp?) either.
There actually is a fairly long history of the creationism vs. evolution “debate” (if we can use the latter term rather loosely). This “debaate” is covered in this book:
http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&id=03b_a0monNYC&dq=Evolution+vs.+Creationism:++An+introduction&printsec=frontcover&source=web&ots=YqEplSUqRE&sig=05izFVdJxvNzfnLF3QfL5v2bD5s#PPP1,M1
Read it. If you are interested.
lindainks55
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:23 am | Permalink
Mr. Kia, until you’ve gained that understanding of what a scientific theory is, there is no discussion. I know of no science which discredits any belief system. In fact, I know of no science which even addresses any belief system.
————————————————–
I disagree.
Science I believe as I see it is an effort to understand the history of the natural world and how the natural world works.
When you bring a theory of evolution and the creation of life into the mix, you are discrediting a belief in God and a Creator without the same belief having the opportunity to be discussed. That’s wrong. Why anyone has a problem with it I still don’t understand.
“The Pre-Ostrich. It’s like a whole other species.”
If you go by the Latin classification it’s not called the ostrich now. It’s the Struthio camelus in the order of Struthioniformes. But there are precursor species under different classifications. So why do you think they shouldn’t have wings and feathers?
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:24 am | Permalink
How do figure a male testes is incapable of producing sperm simply because he favors other men?
—————————————————-
Boys have a penis, girls have a vagina – Kindergarten Cop.
A homosexual man does produce sperm. He chooses to plant it in unfertile ground. If he plants it in fertile ground, he is no longer a homosexual.
Read any of the late, the great Stephan Jay Gould’s work:
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/2948/gould.html
“Boys have a penis, girls have a vagina – Kindergarten Cop.
A homosexual man does produce sperm. He chooses to plant it in unfertile ground. If he plants it in fertile ground, he is no longer a homosexual.”
That’s good to know as one of my gay friends has a daughter therefore he must not be gay so he can marry another man because it won’t be a homosexual marriage.
Any ETA on that theory of creationism?
So why do you think they shouldn’t have wings and feathers?
===========
What are wings used for? Flight. They can keep the beak, drum sticks, and extended neck, but the wings are just ridiculous. I say send them back to the shop.
“plants it in fertile ground” please, not on the ground… no no
Did he adopt the daughter or is she his biological daughter?
Any ETA on that theory of creationism?
Seconded, again.
“What are wings used for? Flight. They can keep the beak, drum sticks, and extended neck, but the wings are just ridiculous. I say send them back to the shop.”
I wasn’t aware organisms can order their DNA to come out with a certain conclusion. I guess you’ll never have to worry about baldness or cancer because you can just order your genes to produce the result you want. You really don’t make any sense.
As for that theory of creationism….
“Did he adopt the daughter or is she his biological daughter?”
Biological, hence your creationism theory that homosexuals can’t reproduce is wrong.
Dew claw on a dog, the appendix, wings on flightless birds, pig tails, ect. These serve little or no purpose….
I’m going to have to write the big guy a letter….This is just sloppy work.
What are wings used for? Flight.
Genes don’t design wings with any purpose in mind. Useful appendages (like wings) persist via natural selection.
But if wings are designed for flight, why can’t ostriches fly? Did the intelligent designer go on a drinking binge that day?
But if wings are designed for flight, why can’t ostriches fly? Did the intelligent designer go on a drinking binge that day?
======
I wasn’t there.
Consumers cut back on their spending by the biggest amount in 28 years. It was the strongest signal yet the country has hurtled into recession. The gross domestic product shrank at a 0.3 percent annual rate in last quarter, the Commerce Department reported.
“It is a direct result of the Bush administration’s trickle down, Wall Street first, Main Street last policies that John McCain has embraced for the last eight years and plans to continue for the next four,” Obama said in a statement.
grrrrr
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:40 am | Permalink
“Did he adopt the daughter or is she his biological daughter?”
Biological, hence your creationism theory that homosexuals can’t reproduce is wrong.
—————————————————-
And what fella gave birth to her then?
And what fella gave birth to her then?
Men don’t give birth (boy, talk about ignorance of biology).
“And what fella gave birth to her then?”
Men don’t give birth. Did they teach sex ed and evolution on the same day and you missed out?
Some used to say that the devil planted the dinosaur bones to confuse the faithful…
If you don’t require evidence, why not?
Did the intelligent designer go on a drinking binge that day?
——–
How do you think Satan got out of Heaven?
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:45 am | Permalink
“And what fella gave birth to her then?”
Men don’t give birth. Did they teach sex ed and evolution on the same day and you missed out?
—————————————————-
I thought homosexuals had sex with the same sex?
“Some used to say that the devil planted the dinosaur bones to confuse the faithful…”
I’m guessing that’s the theory of creationism. And they seriously want something so childish taught as science?
“I thought homosexuals had sex with the same sex?”
Actually it’s probably the case that you weren’t thinking.
“When you bring a theory of evolution and the creation of life into the mix, you are discrediting a belief in God and a Creator without the same belief having the opportunity to be discussed.”
—–
I have never discredited a belief in God. I know several scientists from several fields of study, and their work doesn’t discredit a belief in God. The two are totally separate subjects. I don’t even understand why God should be brought into a discussion of evolution.
Again, I would suggest you study the meaning of a scientific theory and when you gain that understanding a discussion of evolution can proceed, but not before.
“Did the intelligent designer go on a drinking binge that day?”
——–
How do you think Satan got out of Heaven?
So much for ID not being religion.
Linda – I don’t think you understand what the promoters of evolutions agenda is then. Just my two cents.
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:51 am | Permalink
“Did the intelligent designer go on a drinking binge that day?”
——–
How do you think Satan got out of Heaven?
So much for ID not being religion.
=======================
That was a bit of humor, Rage. You Libs really need to loosen up!
“That was a bit of humor, Rage. You Libs really need to loosen up!”
So creationism is just a long joke that’s been going on and is so unfunny that nobody is laughing?
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:48 am | Permalink
“I thought homosexuals had sex with the same sex?”
Actually it’s probably the case that you weren’t thinking.
—————————————————-
“You’re stupid”
Always the reaction when backed into a corner.
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:53 am | Permalink
“That was a bit of humor, Rage. You Libs really need to loosen up!”
So creationism is just a long joke that’s been going on and is so unfunny that nobody is laughing?
==========
Hey everybody, don’t poke(hehehe) the homo, he gets mad!
Maggotpink
Ksfrmgrrlicker
-speciation- 1906.
(sorry about the late reply, had to do SOMETHING)
““You’re stupid”
Always the reaction when backed into a corner.”
It’s based upon your stupid comments.
As for that theory of creationism….
Linda – I don’t think you understand what the promoters of evolutions agenda is then. Just my two cents.
—-
You keep those two cents, hold them tightly.
Evolution doesn’t have an agenda. It is science.
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:41 am | Permalink
What are wings used for? Flight.
Genes don’t design wings with any purpose in mind. Useful appendages (like wings) persist via natural selection.
———————————–
Hey ANTI, I think what the Derwinistas are trying to say is, that the Ostrich is the link between a lizard and a camel. He’s about half way there.
“Hey ANTI, I think what the Derwinistas are trying to say is, that the Ostrich is the link between a lizard and a camel. He’s about half way there.”
Well that pretty much explains the futility of trying to educate a creationist. Must be an overabundance of junk DNA.
We’re acting like 3rd graders dancing around the homosexual and reproduction question.
Homosexuals can’t produce if they stick with what is claimed to be instinct.
I’m not opposed to the idea that homosexuals are “born that way”.
But if this is true it is not thru passed on genetics but rather an abnormality in my opinion.
Maggotpink- As for that theory of creationism….
————————
Take Ksfrmgrrlickers advise, use the google…
witlessnit.
Evolution doesn’t have an agenda. It is science.
—————-
Chuckle… Good one Linda!
So Linda is your definition of Science the study of something that can be proven or then just the study of theories?
Evolution is nothing more than a theory.
“Take Ksfrmgrrlickers advise, use the google…
witlessnit.”
All I find is websites asking what the theory of creationism is and others not providing an actual theory. If it’s so easy then how come creationists have not been able to present one on this forum?
Maggotpink- “educate a creationist”
—————————-
Who said I was a “creationist?” Do you know how many thousnds and thousands of different beliefs and theories there are out there?
Probably not enough time for me to teach them ALL to you, so you pick one, put your “faith” in it….
Darwinista.
nit.
“Who said I was a “creationist?” Do you know how many thousnds and thousands of different beliefs and theories there are out there?
Probably not enough time for me to teach them ALL to you, so you pick one, put your “faith” in it….
Darwinista.”
So you simply branched out in your own field of study and developed your own theory? I won’t be surprised that you won’t present one.
Here you go, Mr. Kia. First link for your study. It starts with a cartoon so I think is a good starting point for you.
http://www.fsteiger.com/theory.html
Snow blankets London for Global Warming debate
By Andrew Orlowski
Posted in Government, 29th October 2008 12:35 GMT
Snow fell as the House of Commons debated Global Warming yesterday – the first October fall in the metropolis since 1922. The Mother of Parliaments was discussing the Mother of All Bills for the last time, in a marathon six hour session.
Step by Step Gov’t Takeover of 401k’s,
And Now, The Next Step is Taken:
http://www.tiaa-cref.org/support/news/articles/gen0810_136.html
Statement on TIAA-CREF’s Participation in U.S. Treasury Money Market Insurance Program
October 16, 2008
Statement on TIAA-CREF’s Participation in U.S. Treasury Money Market Insurance Program
TIAA-CREF has determined that its two eligible mutual funds, the TIAA-CREF Institutional Mutual Funds Money Market Fund (all three share classes) and the TIAA-CREF Life Money Market Fund, will participate in the U.S. Treasury Department Temporary Guarantee Program for Money Market Funds.
The CREF Money Market Account can not participate because it does not maintain a constant accumulation unit value (AUV) pegged at $1.00 or more, which is part of the federal program’s requirements. Thus, the account is not eligible for the Treasury’s stable value extension program announced on October 8, 2008. (See answer to Question 4 below.)
Key Points
To help support investor confidence in this time of market instability, TIAA-CREF is participating in the federal money market insurance program.
Eligible funds will be covered by the new insurance program. The TIAA-CREF Institutional Money Market Fund (Retirement Class-TIEXX, Retail Class-TIRXX and Institutional Class-TCIXX) and TIAA-CREF Life Money Market Fund are eligible to participate and will be covered by this insurance program.
Because it does not seek to maintain a constant accumulation unit value (AUV) pegged at $1.00 or more, the CREF Money Market Account is not eligible to participate in this insurance program.
We have confidence in all of our money market portfolios. We feel confident in the security of all of our money market funds and accounts because their portfolios:
have steered clear of troubled companies
invest in only high-quality holdings
have experienced no defaults or downgrades.
The cost of participating in this program will be paid by investors in each fund. The Treasury Department is charging one-one hundredth of a percent (or one basis point) of the total fund net assets as of September 19, 2008, the date when the guarantee begins.
That means the cost for insuring a $1,000 investment in a money market fund is ten cents.
Background on the Federal Money Market Insurance Program
The U.S. Treasury Department’s Temporary Guarantee Program for Money Market Funds guarantees the $1.00 share price of participating money market funds. The guarantee will be triggered only if a participating fund liquidates its assets as a result of its net asset value falling below $.995, commonly referred to as “breaking the buck.”
Under the program, coverage is provided to shareholders for amounts that they held in participating money market funds as of the close of business on September 19, 2008. Any increase in the number of shares held in an account after the close of business on September 19, 2008 will not be guaranteed. Please see the bottom of this piece for some examples of how this works in various situations.
Investors cannot sign up for the guarantee themselves; the Treasury Department’s guarantee arrangement is made with the funds. The plan is scheduled to be in place for three months—ending December 18, 2008—but can be extended up until September 18, 2009, at the discretion of the Department.
Funds participating in the initial three-month period will be required to renew their participation after December 18 if the program is renewed. The cost and conditions of the extended program will be determined by the Treasury at that time.
“Just a theory.”
Man, these people are like a broken record. Bookmark this page-it’s 90% of all you’ll ever need.
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=15-answers-to-creationist
Great we’re back to “you’re stupid.”
Dig up all the fossils you want.
Show me something out of nothing.
Maggotpink- So you simply branched out in your own field of study and developed your own theory? I won’t be surprised that you won’t present one.
————————————–
Probably not, it would be like trying to teach a turtle to fly a kite.
But it is curious that you put your faith in a “theory” that has so many unproven holes and missing elements.
There is a good site I would recommend, it IS a little “religious” but actually brings up some very profound points. http://www.godandscience.org/evolution
But be very careful Darwinistas have been known to go insane after a few short visits…..
Mutations
———————–
outlander
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:22 am | Permalink
True Mr. Kia. If there ever was a genetic basis for homosexuality, a homosexual organism by definition couldn’t reproduce, and under evolutionary theory the genes would have been purged from the gene pool.
Or choices?
“Probably not, it would be like trying to teach a turtle to fly a kite.”
Yeah, it’s difficult to explain a theory when you don’t have one.
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:13 am | Permalink
“Just a theory.”
Man, these people are like a broken record. Bookmark this page-it’s 90% of all you’ll ever need.
—————————————————-
Where did the original matter come from?
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:16 am | Permalink
“Probably not, it would be like trying to teach a turtle to fly a kite.”
Yeah, it’s difficult to explain a theory when you don’t have one.
—————————————————-
Where did the original matter come from?
Show me something out of nothing.
That would be magic, not science.
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:18 am | Permalink
Show me something out of nothing.
That would be magic, not science.
—————————————————-
Then scientifically, how did life begin?
Where did the original matter come from?
What does that have to do with evolution? Or even the Big Bang?
It’s an interesting topic, but why are you bringing it up?
“Where did the original matter come from?”
Never heard of the First Law of Thermodynamics have you? This should have been learned in grammar school.
Maggotpink- Yeah, it’s difficult to explain a theory when you don’t have one.
————————————-
Is it easy for you to all of your faith into your theory that has no real evidence? To say that a finch on one island has a longer beak than one on another island is nothing more than an adaptation……
Origin of Man?
ok Darwinista, whatever you say.
Then scientifically, how did life begin?
7. Evolution cannot explain how life first appeared on earth.
The origin of life remains very much a mystery, but biochemists have learned about how primitive nucleic acids, amino acids and other building blocks of life could have formed and organized themselves into self-replicating, self-sustaining units, laying the foundation for cellular biochemistry. Astrochemical analyses hint that quantities of these compounds might have originated in space and fallen to earth in comets, a scenario that may solve the problem of how those constituents arose under the conditions that prevailed when our planet was young.
Creationists sometimes try to invalidate all of evolution by pointing to science’s current inability to explain the origin of life. But even if life on earth turned out to have a nonevolutionary origin (for instance, if aliens introduced the first cells billions of years ago), evolution since then would be robustly confirmed by countless microevolutionary and macroevolutionary studies.
“Then scientifically, how did life begin?”
Fascinating that you bring this up because recently Dr. Jeffrey L. Bada got his hands on the original equipment used for the Miller-Urey experiment. The container was looked at with more modern technology (previously it was examined with 1950s tech) and the initial discovery failed to notice numerous other amino acids that had developed. The latest observation stopped taking count when they reached 22 different amino acids. The original study had already proven that organic material can come from inorganic material, the latest findings just proved to be more successful than originally thought.
Here’s the creationist theory….
outlander
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:02 am | Permalink
Evolution doesn’t have an agenda. It is science.
—————-
Chuckle… Good one Linda!
*****
Oh crap, I am doing what I promised I would not do. Who is behind the evolution agenda and what proof do you have that these same people are wanting to destroy peoples’ faith? Unless you can offer some proof, I think we’ll just have to regard these types of statements as paranoid ranting.
Mainstream media? Secular Humanists? The whole of Academia? Who are these evil people??? Inquiring minds would like to know.
Oops, here’s the link to an article about the scientific evidence that support abiogenesis.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/17/science/17LIFE.html?_r=1&ref=us&oref=slogin
Naturally the creationists will respond with scientific evidence to support their theory…if they had a theory.
Still waiting on the ’science’ of intelligent design . . .
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:23 am | Permalink
Then scientifically, how did life begin?
7. Evolution cannot explain how life first appeared on earth.
The origin of life remains very much a mystery
—————————————————-
So it’s a matter of ….Faith?
One would certainly think that the darwinistas would have more than just a theory by now……
From Idiots R Us:
(How do you get a big bang without matter?)
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:20 am | Permalink
Where did the original matter come from?
What does that have to do with evolution? Or even the Big Bang?
It’s an interesting topic, but why are you bringing it up?
“So it’s a matter of ….Faith?”
Nope, faith is needed when there is no evidence. Scientists have evidence.
“One would certainly think that the darwinistas would have more than just a theory by now……”
You have only demonstrated you don’t know what a theory is. More evidence is demonstrated by your inability to present one.
Maggotpink- Scientists have evidence.
————————————–
So it’s the “scientists” you have faith in, or their “evidence?”
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:27 am | Permalink
“So it’s a matter of ….Faith?”
Nope, faith is needed when there is no evidence. Scientists have evidence.
—————————————————-
Where is the evidence in “It remains a mystery?”
So it’s a matter of ….Faith?
No, faith and science are different things. The fact that you persist in confusing them is the problem.
How is saying “I don’t know” an act of faith?
“So it’s the “scientists” you have faith in, or their “evidence?””
The evidence is presented, one not need have faith in reality. You, on the other hand, don’t even know what a theory is.
Any ETA on that theory of creationism?
Here’s something that should piss off the reich-wingers, both the Economist and the Financial Times endorses Obama.
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5j81JfJQgAFq49SAZCOKM0etBtS2g
http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displayStory.cfm?story_id=12516666&source=features_box1
Maggotpink- The evidence is presented.
—————————————
So if you believe that the “scientist” has drawn the proper conclusions from the “evidence” presented, you have faith in the scientist. This case being Darwin.
Darwinista.
The Economist??
Wow. . .
Well it’s been an hour and the scientifically illiterate creationists haven’t presented their theory of creationism. No point wasting any more time asking for something that doesn’t exist. It’s no wonder they hate the educated and intellectuals, it’s a matter of jealousy.
“So if you believe that the “scientist” has drawn the proper conclusions from the “evidence” presented, you have faith in the scientist. This case being Darwin.”
That was 150 years ago. Thanks for proving how uneducated you are by thinking that no scientific research has been done since then.
North Carolina Police Stop Traffic to Aid Momma Bear
Thursday, October 30, 2008
WOODFIN, North Carolina — Police had to halt traffic on a highway in North Carolina to help a mother bear get to her cub after it was struck and killed by a vehicle.
Police say the cub was struck Tuesday afternoon and the driver didn’t stop.
Officers in the western North Carolina town of Woodfin halted cars for about 20 minutes after the mother bear had failed twice at trying to get her 80-pound cub off the busy highway.
Sgt. Dawn Roberts says officers stood with rifles while others pulled the cub to the side of the road near the mother. She says the mother bear grabbed the cub by the scruff of the neck and ran off into the woods to tend to its body.
Maggotpink- It’s no wonder they hate the educated and intellectuals, it’s a matter of jealousy.
——————————————–
Yes, thats it maggie, educated, intellectuals always put their faith in man. I’m jealous of your faith.
Well… Lets get a few facts straight here.
1. Intelligent Design is not creationism.
2. You do not have to prove Creationism to disporve Evolution.
It seems like in every one of these discussions where Evolution is questioned the first thing the supporters of Evolution do is attack creationism.
Sorry, but I hate to inform you, but the lack of proof for creationism is not proof of Evolution.
Most of us who believe in creationism already admit to it being based on some level of faith and not science. Well, because, obviously a “creator” is involved at some point.
If the sole purpose of this discussion is to point out which is more absurd… well, those of you who believe in Evolution have already lost.
You see, most of us who believe in creation already admit that there is some level of faith involved (because we believe there is a creator) while those of you who believe in Evolution still think it is purely scientific.
Then we start pointing out things like the creation of the Universe and Life and you simply ignore those.
Yeah, brilliant.
I always love the argument: Assume a Universe and Assume life NOW Evolution!
LOL
Then you still mock us for our believing in creation?
LOL
Well, lets skip the part about God and use your same argument.
Assume God, NOW creation.
There you have it.
Now we don’t have to explain those silly questions either about faith, just assume God.
Well it’s been an hour and the scientifically illiterate creationists haven’t presented their theory of creationism. No point wasting any more time asking for something that doesn’t exist.
Seconded.
That was pretty good Nate.
Obviousy Rags hadn’t read it before posting.
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:30 am | Permalink
————————————————–
Because it is just that.
Faith is the belief in something that can not be proven.
Evolution admits it can not prove how life began.
Here is your chance, oh biased1, tell us your definition of a theory. What component parts make up a theory? Show your work. Thank you.
Well put, Nathan.
Evolution is silent on the origins of life. Please! At least know what you’re talking about before making such ignorant statements.
It’s no wonder they hate the educated and intellectuals, it’s a matter of jealousy.
—————–
It isn’t hate maggie. What I do object to is the delusion that science has encouraged. The delusion that within science are all the answers. It has misled so many people, to their detriment. It is misleading you now.
There is more than meets the eye out there my friend. One day, you will know. I hope it is sooner, rather than later.
Rage,
I see you have fallen victim to the same illogocial trap as others.
Is your belief that Evolution is true based on Creationism being wrong?
Does Creationism being wrong make Evolution true?
Nice to see that not everyone has been affected by the crappy economy!
Shell announces huge rise in profits
By Russell Lynch, PA
Thursday, 30 October 2008
Oil giant Royal Dutch Shell today joined the profits bonanza from record prices with a 71 per cent jump in third-quarter earnings.
The firm made a mammoth 10.9 billion US dollars (£6.6 billion) between July and September – a period when oil prices hit a peak above 147 dollars a barrel.
The news, which is likely to spark fresh calls for a windfall tax, comes two days after rival BP posted its biggest-ever quarterly profits of £6.4 billion.
Royal Dutch Shell posted the huge profits – a quarterly record and equivalent to nearly £72 million a day – despite a 1 per cent fall in production compared to last year.
This was due to factors such as the impact of hurricane damage in the Gulf of Mexico, which hit refining availability, as well as maintenance work in the North Sea.
Oil prices have since fallen back to less than half their mid-July peak to trade at around 70 dollars a barrel, as global demand fears mount.
Chief executive Jeroen van der Veer – who called the results “satisfactory” – said the company was “robust across a wide range of oil prices”.
Check this out >>>>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOZzVqLtqJ0
Well Rags and Maggotpinky-
..
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:40 am | Permalink
Well it’s been an hour and the scientifically illiterate creationists haven’t presented their theory of creationism.
..
It usually takes me longer than that to…..
..
“Tell me ignorant one, how does one worship scientific research and education?”
..
But I think you proved the point all right.
..
Thanks nits.
“It isn’t hate maggie. What I do object to is the delusion that science has encouraged. The delusion that within science are all the answers. It has misled so many people, to their detriment. It is misleading you now.”
Science has a pretty good track record so far. Your belief in magic, divining and other mumbo jumbo hasn’t added anything to understanding the world. Keep on trying to jump on the bandwagon though, it just makes you look even more jealous.
Thanks Biased, you’ve only proven that it takes you more than an hour to think up some BS. You claimed to have a theory but you can’t present one. That just makes you dishonest, or as I like to call it, a creationist.
“1. Intelligent Design is not creationism.”
This is untrue. ID is the latest version of creatinonism.
I am completely content with people having faith. Do not though say that it is equivalent to science. It is not. They are completely different things.
McCain Now Running Robocalls Attacking Obama In Home State Of Arizona!
Here’s the script:
I’m calling for John McCain and the RNC because Barack Obama is so dangerously inexperienced, his running mate Joe Biden just said, he invites a major international crisis that he will be unprepared to handle alone.
If Democrats win full control of government, they will want to give civil rights to terrorists and talk unconditionally to dictators and state sponsors of terror. Barack Obama and his Democratic allies lack the experience and judgment to lead America. This call was paid for by the Republican National Committee and authorized by McCain-Palin 2008.
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/10/mccain_now_running_robocalls_i.php
Includes audio link.
StevenEDavis
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:46 am | Permalink
Evolution is silent on the origins of life.
————————————————–
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:23 am | Permalink
7. Evolution cannot explain how life first appeared on earth.
The origin of life remains very much a mystery, but biochemists have learned about how primitive nucleic acids, amino acids and other building blocks of life could have formed and organized themselves into self-replicating, self-sustaining units, laying the foundation for cellular biochemistry.
————————————————–
“Could have”?
Great science.
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:51 am | Permalink
McCain Now Running Robocalls Attacking Obama In Home State Of Arizona!
———-
So. Obama uses robo-calls as well.
StevenEDavis
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:44 am | Permalink
Here is your chance, oh biased1, tell us your definition of a theory. What component parts make up a theory? Show your work. Thank you.
———————————-
Well little steevey, glad you could join in.
I could care less about trying to prove to you, I know more than you.
That wasn’t much work.
You ARE welcome.
I think I’ll call it a day. The creationists will continue to be as dishonest as always. It’s been months since they’ve been asked for scientific evidence and it will be many months before they actually present a theory. Intellectual lightweights, no wonder they like Palin so much.
Steven,
Evolution, if looked at in an isolated room, is silent on the creation of life.
However, for Evolution to work, there must be life.
So yes, we all know that the theory of Evolution is silent on how life began.
Those of you who believe in Evolution love to point that out (hide behind that).
However, that is not how it is taught. Evolution is taught right along with the creation of the Universe, Life, and then Evolution.
Scientifically speaking, it would be absurd to merely suggest that we “assume life” and then move on to Evolution. That is exactly why it is not taught like that either.
So while you sit here saying Evolution is silent on life they are teaching it in schools right along with how life began.
There are several layers to how Evolution is both taught and understood:
1. Universe
2. Elements
3. Galaxies/Stars/Solar Systems
4. Planents/Earth
5. Life
6. Macro Evolution
7 Micro Evolution
And all you Evloution believers want to focus on is number 7.
BlueJay “could have” been a success.
I “could have” developed cold fusion.
Neither actually happened.
Science and religion are generally compatible. It is when science moves into the realm of religion (such as origins) claiming it has the truth based not on science, but on speculation by scientists, all the while shouting down opposition, that it runs afoul.
Thank you, Chas.
“Things Are Looking Better Now
This video depicts the change that we as Americans most desperately need. It was our intent to illustrate the frustrations of so many Americans. We hope this video touches you, the way it did us.”
It touched me.
“Does Creationism being wrong make Evolution true?”
Of course not. Are you raising this red herring, because it is all you have? Wasting time. How original in getting out of an argument you can’t win.
I have no more time to waste children. I do have a question, though. Why do creationists waste their time and money to go to college, when they don’t believe anything that is taught there? Now that, is truly a mystery of the ages.
Steven,
It is true that many Creationists have latched onto Intelligent Design.
However, this doesn’t prove that Intelligent Design is creationism.
They can both be true, but that is not what Intelligent Design states nor is it a requirment to accept Intelligent Design.
For someone so conncerned with others not understanding Evolution, you don’t understand Intellient Design.
Maggotpunk
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:55 am | Permalink
I think I’ll call it a day. The creationists will continue to be as dishonest as always. It’s been months since they’ve been asked for scientific evidence and it will be many months before they actually present a theory. Intellectual lightweights, no wonder they like Palin so much.
—————————————————-
Creationism is a matter of faith as evolution has been proven to be here today.
ANTI
Posted October 30, 2008 at 11:55 am | Permalink
BlueJay “could have” been a success.
I “could have” developed cold fusion.
Neither actually happened.
———————————————–
But you COULD make an Atomic Bomb with a rock and a stick. The chances ARE pretty slim, but in theory, eventually you would get it right…..
Steven,
I am not the one to raise a red herring. I am pointing out that in these discussions on Evolution and the valaditity of it as a thoery or being true usually the first thing that those of you who believe in Evolution do is attack Creationism.
So, speaking of a Red Herring…
Steven,
There are countless fields of study and classes one can take at a Univeristy that have nothing to do with Evolution.
One can be a Doctor, Nurse, Police Officer, Chemist, Engineer, or countless other things without ever having to believe in Evolution.
Nate- One can be a Doctor, Nurse, Police Officer, Chemist, Engineer, or countless other things without ever having to believe in Evolution.
—————————–
But Steevie wants to be a Darwinista, cuz it prooves he’s real smart.
Outlander,
Exactly. To believe in Creation is not a rejection of science it is a rejection of Evolution.
But to those that believe in Evolution it is much easier for them to merely attack anyone who disagrees with them and doesn’t accept the theory of Evolution as true.
In other news, did anyone mention the huffington post writer who killed her former lover and then herself?
Police: Ex-lover killed woman in rage in Boynton Beach
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/localnews/content/local_news/epaper/2008/10/29/1029bbdeaths.html
“BOYNTON BEACH — Carol Anne Burger killed her former lover by stabbing her 222 times with a Phillips-head screwdriver and then took pains to hide her crime, police said Wednesday.”
I didn’t do any looking, but I wonder how many articles the left has used from her here?
This site covers the Evolution/Creation debate fairly well….
http://theclergyletterproject.org/
Linda and Mary,
I am kind of dissapointed. You went to such great lengths to call out the “gun nuts” about that 8 year old boy who killed himself.
I wrote a response and never heard back.
I assume it was because it was a well reasoned one so you didn’t have a comment.
Chas,
As the site is quite informative, it doesn’t cover the debate well, it represents how Christians can believe in Evolution quite well.
Nate- stabbing her 222 times.
—————–
Officer at the scene: “Worst case of suicide I ever saw”……….
“I assume…”
Go on assuming.
THE VIOLENCE IN CHICAGO CONTINUES, WHEN WILL WE PULL OUT?
Hudson deaths add to South Side Chicago’s violence
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20081030/D944O6GO2.html
“CHICAGO (AP) – During the same weekend that county pathologists conducted autopsies on the bodies of actress-singer Jennifer Hudson’s mother and brother, they also examined the bodies of six other people who’d been gunned down or beaten to death.”
“…”You hear gunshots day and night, that’s nothing new,”
“…In fact, between January and August, 2,083 violent crimes occurred in the district”
Nathan… That SITE is all about the DEBATE… encouraging churches and clergy to join in the discussions at many different levels…
I guess maybe you just need to know some of the Site originators to understand that…
As I have posted numerous times… there really IS no debate on these issues…. Nor should there be….
I have come to think that the best way to explain it is in the words of a Jimmy Buffet song: “It’s 5 O’clock Somewhere”
Well, it’s over then. We need not vote at all, I guess.
——
OCTOBER SURPRISE: ALIEN ENDORSES MCCAIN!
Posted on Thursday, October 30th, 2008
By Reginald Cunningham III
WASHINGTON, DC – In a shocking reversal, the Alien has switched his endorsement from Barack Obama to John McCain.
With major implications for the U.S. presidential election, political kingmaker the Alien has changed his endorsement amid furor. Both political camps are buzzing about the implications, as the Alien has correctly predicted the winning president in every election for the past 28 years.
Ongoing investigation points to Cindy McCain as being the cause for this historic shift in allegiances.
http://www.weeklyworldnews.com/election-08/october-surprise-alien-endorses-mccain/
—-
With photos, to prove it!
(Chas, it’s right up your alley . . . .)
US election: If Iraqis could vote it would be for McCain
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=081030170209.3wcxfwin&show_article=1
“Nathan… That SITE is all about the DEBATE…”
“As I have posted numerous times… there really IS no debate on these issues…. Nor should there be….”
Chas
Posted October 30, 2008 at 12:25 pm
———————-
Good Chas and bad Chas are arguing.
Chas,
Of course there is a debate. If there was not one then there would be no need for such things as the cleregy letter project.
I love how those of you who accept Evolution would like to think that not only should there not be a debate but that there really isn’t one.
Well, except to those of us who believe differently.
Either way, if you go to that website, 95% of it is about sermons, lectures, and other things in regards to Christians accepting Evoltion.
It is hardly a coverage of any “debate” at all.
Snow blankets London for Global Warming debate
How Parliament passed the Climate Bill
By Andrew Orlowski
Posted in Government, 29th October 2008 12:35 GMT
Snow fell as the House of Commons debated Global Warming yesterday – the first October fall in the metropolis since 1922. The Mother of Parliaments was discussing the Mother of All Bills for the last time, in a marathon six hour session.
In order to combat a projected two degree centigrade rise in global temperature, the Climate Change Bill pledges the UK to reduce its carbon dioxide emissions by 80 per cent by 2050. The bill was receiving a third reading, which means both the last chance for both democratic scrutiny and consent.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/10/29/commons_climate_change_bill/
Ooops.
Oh, BTW – Here’s the actual real-world translation of the 2nd paragraph: “In order to combat a projected two degree centigrade rise in global temperature, the Climate Change Bill pledges the UK to gut it’s economy and move back to the Stone Age.
Well, either that, or they will promply ignore the “targets” they’ve just set.
Congratulations, Britons. You used to be a great nation.
This is just like Cosmos and Global Warming.
He and those who believe in AGW love to say the debate is over, there is no debate….
Yet we still keep debating. Yet there are still questions.
This is a pattern with those on the left. They do not like their ideas questioned. So they say the debate is over and that there is no debate.
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! The debate is over! There is no debate!
GMC70,
Everything is proof of AGW. Didn’t you get the memo?
This is an irregular snow, thus it proves AGW.
‘Poll: Obama doubles lead in Colorado, gains in electoral map‘
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/29/poll.wednesday/index.html
“CNN estimates that if the election were held today Obama would win states with 286 electoral votes and McCain states with 163, with 89 electoral votes still up for grabs. Two-hundred and seventy electoral votes are needed to clinch the presidency.”
———–
163 + 89 = 252
‘Obama: Rearview Mirror’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76ZXckG40gs
Nathaniel
Posted October 30, 2008 at 12:29 pm | Permalink
US election: If Iraqis could vote it would be for McCain
Al Quada/Taliban are aligned with most Republicans and are for McCain too.
Ongoing investigation points to Cindy McCain as being the cause for this historic shift in allegiances.
NOT TRUE! NOT EVEN TRUE!
Cindy McCain Claims She’s ‘Just Like Any Other Female Human’
http://www.theonion.com/content/video/cindy_mccain_claims_she_s_just
Damn, I think I evolved into a 5 pounds heavier human over lunch….ahhhh, the swelling!
““CNN estimates that if the election were held today…”
That some quality journalism right there.
ANTI
Posted October 30, 2008 at 1:13 pm | Permalink
Damn, I think I evolved into a 5 pounds heavier human over lunch….ahhhh, the swelling!
—————————————–
I suspect lunch will evolve into “something else” logically suited for a long swim…..
I believe coffee in the morning will speed this evolution.
http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1853846,00.html?imw=Y
Bank heist to be used for banker bonuses…hahahahahahahahahaha.
Also be ready for a war against Russia or China at the first of the year. no siht.
I believe coffee in the morning will speed this evolution.
======
That is the nature of the Beast.
Nathan, you are obviously missing my point…
I say there really should be no debate for a variety of reasons… but the simplist of which would be in the form of a comparison…
It is a sports analogy… Brett Favre is a better athlete because he has thrown more touchdown passes than Nolan Ryan…
but don’t let me interrupt your evolution business.
Chas,
I agree. It is obvious that this is a young Earth and that God created it according to the Bible.
There should be no further debate for a variety of reasons.
Agree?
A war against 1/2 of the world population? Pleef, can we send them blankets with small pox now to better our chances.
No Nathan… that is NOT what I said… but, you go ahead and believe that if it makes you feel better… ok??
The RAND Corp has already went to the Pentagon over it. It’s supposed to help “boost our economy”. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
China is freaking out. I’M FREAKING OUT TOO!
Ironic coincidence: I have Fugazi’s “Smallpox Champion” playing in the background right now.
Wow. . .maybe I can control ANTI’s mind remotely!
Nathaniel
Posted October 30, 2008 at 12:44 pm | Permalink
This is just like Cosmos and Global Warming.
He and those who believe in AGW love to say the debate is over, there is no debate….
———————————————
They love to worship their science.
Proof or no proof.
They draw some pretty crazy conclusions from their evidence.
If we attack China, they’ll demand their money back, with interest.
Wow. . .maybe I can control ANTI’s mind remotely!
———–
Don’t mess with my mind, it will fuk you up like polio dude!
Three critiques of our modern society >>>>
1) We Worship at our Work
2) We Work at our Play
3) We Play at our Worship
Chas,
Of course that is not what you said. It is exactly how what you said looks like to me.
That was the point.
You make a claim which many disagree with and then say the debate is over.
I made the opposite claim and said the debate should be over and you obviously disagree.
I would hope that this demonstration made sense to you.
If anyone can read Mandarin, it’s here…the whole story.
http://www.sohu.com/
I think this is what Pleefer is talking about:
RAND Corp. Warns of Military Threat from China
A leading U.S. scholar warns South Korea should prepare for Chinese military intervention and occupation of North Korea or possible attacks against the South’s military in the event of a regime collapse in the North. Dr. Bruce Bennett of the defense-oriented RAND Corporation delivered an address at a seminar in Seoul on Tuesday hosted by the South Korean Army at the War Memorial of Korea, where he forecast Chinese occupation of a portion of North Korea or a threat of invasion to South.
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200810/200810220023.html
Like our economy troubles, this too will be staged. We have a rogue government and I want it back. REVOLUTION.
If anyone can read Mandarin, it’s here…the whole story.
http://www.sohu.com/
Granted, Pleef, Google Translate isn’t very good (for that matter, it doesn’t distinguish between Mandarin and Cantonese), but. . .where is it?
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sohu.com%2F+&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&sl=zh-CN&tl=en
Nathaniel posted October 30, 2008 at 12:44 pm
This is just like Cosmos and Global Warming.
He and those who believe in AGW love to say the debate is over, there is no debate….
Yet we still keep debating. Yet there are still questions.
————
Nathaniel,
Please prove that the scientific AGW debate is over, by posting some more lies from agricultural economist Dennis Avery, Faux’s Steven Milloy, et al.
I’m sure this is the crises that we’re all hearing about. And what soothsayers they are….
Remember, Obama will have to do some ugly things.
Nathan, it is people like YOU that keep wanting to FORCE a Debate, when there is NO debate to be forced…. One more time….
Brett Favre threw more touchdowns than Nolan Ryan….
GET IT??
Cosmos,
You think anyone that disagrees with AGW is a liar and anything which is contrary to AGW is a lie.
What is the point?
Chas,
Exactly. It is people like you who keep wanting to force a debate when there is no debate to be forced.
This is a young Earth, and God did Create it.
End of Debate.
GET IT??
I was informed by KFG that a rooster is not necessary for egg production, Monkey.
Basic grade school science.
Chas,
So if the debate is over, what is the point of the cleregy letter project?
They should stop right?
Rage, I’m Barracuda’d…almost on break…
As far as teaching evolution, I like Governor Palin’s position. Teach them both.
Okay. But I must insist then that Buddhist Creation is taught. (The majority of Buddhism does not does not recognize a Creator.) Quickly followed by Hindu Creation, Pagan Creation, and Ismlamic Creation, which is closest to Christian, but doesn’t believe in the absolute 6 Day story.
So is it a deal? If so, would Science class then be called Comparative Religion class?
If anyone can read Mandarin, it’s here…the whole story.
My daughter has the opportunity to learn Mandarin Chinese. I suggested she go with Latin, instead.
Colbert Quote of the Day
Senator McCain, you need to endorse Barack Obama. It would really make you look like a maverick. (10/29/08)
Hmmm….. Interesting. I notice that al Qaeda and CapnAmerica have expressed the exact same wishes. Solidarity.
———————
Qaeda wants Republicans, Bush “humiliated”:
Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:52pm EDT
DUBAI (Reuters) – An al Qaeda leader has called for President George W. Bush and the Republicans to be “humiliated,” without endorsing any party in the upcoming U.S. presidential election, according to a video posted on the Internet.
“O God, humiliate Bush and his party, O Lord of the Worlds, degrade and defy him,” Abu Yahya al-Libi said at the end of sermon marking the Muslim feast of Eid al-Fitr, in a video posted on the Internet.
Libi, one of the top al Qaeda commanders believed to be living in Afghanistan or Pakistan, called for God’s wrath to be brought against Bush equating him with past tyrants in history.
The remarks were the first comments from a leading al Qaeda figure referring, albeit indirectly, to the U.S. elections. Muslim clerics often end sermons by calling on God to guide and support Muslims and help defeat their enemies.
http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSTRE49T76620081030?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&rpc=22&sp=true
Rage,
http://news.sohu.com/20081030/n260330741.shtml
Nathaniel posted October 30, 2008 at 1:45 pm
Cosmos,
You think anyone that disagrees with AGW is a liar and anything which is contrary to AGW is a lie.
What is the point?
—————–
The point is that Nathaniel does not debate about the science of AGW — he obfuscates and lies about it.
One of my grandsons takes Mandarin Chinese at Maize High School. I think this is his second year. He also is in his third or fourth year of French. And he has taken Spanish also.
I think he is trying to find a way to get out of speaking to his parents. ;-)
Nathan, what PreD said is my case in point…
IF you believe that this is a “young earth”, and God created it, then that is your RELIGIOUS VIEWPOINT… Call that Brett Favre’s touchdown passes…
There is MUCH evidence that this is not a “young earth” — that has no mention of God at all….
And then there is the “Clergy Letter” position… No matter how old the Earth is, or isnt, Science and Religion can co-exist in the same place/time… As my daughter often says: Who can truthfully say God didnt use Evolution to get us where we are today??
And then there is that pesky little thing called speed of light…. and that other pesky little thing about the TWO Creation stories in Genesis that disagree….
And THATS why Evolution cant be taught side by side with “religious opinion” in the school classroom….
Another reason: Not very many teachers in the schools have teaching certificates in Religiion or Theology…. darned hard things to get….
Pre,
If the choice is Mandarin vs. Latin, there’s no contest. Latin is good for learning iconic terms (particularly in medicine), but Mandarin is a language that billions of human beings speak and use every day.
Pleefer’s link, translated by software:
Rand Corporation of the United States to put military “war to save the city” with great power war
2008?10?30?09:02 [ ????? At 9:02 on October 30, 2008 [I Laishuiliangju (1216) ] [??? ? ? ? ] ] [Size: small]
??????? Source: International on-line
???“?????”??? Rand’s “war to save the market” too absurd
??? Lei Sihai
????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? According to French media, the U.S. think tank the Rand Corporation agency Department of Defense has submitted an assessment report on the assessment to launch a war to be passed on the feasibility of the current economic crisis. ??????7000???????????????7000??????????????????????????????????????? To the report, 700,000,000,000 U.S. dollars to rescue the market effect, it may not be used 700,000,000,000 U.S. dollars to launch a war, and the object of the war against Iraq in the past or Afghanistan, may be a great power.
???????????????????????????????? It is undeniable that the war has always been to continue the political, economic and political foundation and the ultimate goal. ????????????????????????????????????????????? Continuous deepening of the U.S. sub-loan crisis and economic recession, has developed to a certain extent, is likely to trigger war, the crisis in order to pass.
?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? From a historical point of view, the end of World War II, the United States has on other countries to launch the war many times, it has become a thriving, especially in the post-superpower, but also the war as it is to maintain the hegemony of the main tools, such as the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, etc. . ???????????“?????”???????? These are the United States as “the new Roman Empire” ambitious expansion means.
??????????????????????????????????????????? However, other countries, especially major powers to wage war, is not child’s play, even a superpower like the United States is no exception. ??????????????????????? First of all, the current inability of the United States has launched a large-scale war. ????????????????????????????????????????????????90%???????????????????????????????80%????????????????????????? Recently, the new U.S. security think-tank Center and the United States, “Foreign Policy” magazine, the U.S. military on active duty and retired military officers conducted a public opinion poll showed that nearly 90% of the active-duty and retired military officers believe, dragged down by the war in Iraq, the U.S. military Has quietened down considerably, 80% of the respondents believe that the United States at this time unable to re-launch another large-scale war.
???????????????????????? Second, the United States has no moral cohesion, it is difficult to find allies in the war. 1991????????????????????????????????? In 1991 the first Gulf War, although the main U.S. military is fighting, but the money is in Japan and its allies in Western Europe. ?????????????????????????????????????2003?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? War allies to join not only the United States won the moral high, and obtained the help of a lot of money; but in 2003 the war in Iraq, the United States of the Western European allies France, Germany, none joined the opposition, the United States to bear the basic All of the costs of war and morally by the world media condemned for a long time.
?????????????????????????????????? This shows that although the strength of the United States is very powerful, and can not be changed with the development of human civilization and progress of the war. ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? In today’s world, the United States to launch a financial crisis in order to transfer for the purpose of the war, and the same fascist war, will surely be cast aside all over the world, and to speed up their decline.
???????????????????????????? Third, the United States and a major power in any war, is bound to accelerate the rise of other powers. ???????????????????????????????????????? The United States is facing the worst situation is not limited to domestic, from other economies, the threat of the United States is most worried about. ???????????“?????????????”?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? French President Sarkozy issued a “tear down the U.S. economy and rebuild the world economy” is aimed at overturning the U.S. economic hegemony, replaced by the European Union; Japan is also actively preparing for the Asian dollar zone in Southeast Asia replaced the United States ; By Russia for energy and military wings, ready to build a regional rubles; In addition, China has become a recognized leader in the new economic voice in Third World countries one after another.
?????????????????????????????????? In this case, the United States and any of the great powers of the war, will accelerate the rise of other competitors. ??“?????????”???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? The so-called “struggle between snipe and the clam grapple, Fisherman’s benefit”, in World War I and World War II, the United States are waiting for the two warring sides have huge losses when the final accession to the profit and thus able to achieve hegemony in the world today . ??????????????????? Old Road here in the United States, also is not clear how this will be?
????????????“??????????”????????????????????????????“????”?????? As a result, the United States think-tank of the “war to save the U.S. financial crisis” argument, may seem a threat to other countries, but is in fact a kind of “almost hopeless” feeling. ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? And the financial crisis is a struggle between different interests, the world’s great powers in any war, would be a struggle for survival, whether Russia, China, India and Europe or the U.S. itself, will be involved in more than The interests of a more fundamental right to life for is the crux of the interests of any one of the major powers can not give up. ??????????????????????????????????????????????? Therefore, if the United States through other countries on the war solve the financial crisis in the nuclear age, does not have is operational, it will not work.
????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? In the financial turmoil in the world, countries have to question the current U.S. hegemony as the main indicator of the international financial system, irrationality, the United States are allies in the European Union put forward the idea of returning to the Bretton Woods system. ????15?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? In the next month on the 15th of the global financial upcoming summit, the United States on the war and save the market, rather than real strategic options in the United States, the United States might as well be said to be a bargaining chip to increase the shout out. ????-????? International Online – News of the World
(???????) (Editor: Xiao Yao
I want to learn German, call me lazy.
Chas,
And my point is that the debate is not over as you keep claiming and keep proving yourself wrong on.
I just hope that this RAND thing isn’t true.
But of course, why would it not be?
We’re already supposed to be wary of a crises, Madeleine Albright, Biden and Colin Powell are a few that are adamant that something will happen in the last days of January. Something that people won’t like, but will have to accept that Obama will have to do.
Hmmm?
We’re dealing with criminals and psychotics.
Bank robberies are accepted and lauded these days.
Cosmos, your thoughts?
MIT scientists baffled by global warming theory, contradicts scientific data
“Boston (MA) – Scientists at MIT have recorded a nearly simultaneous world-wide increase in methane levels. This is the first increase in ten years, and what baffles science is that this data contradicts theories stating man is the primary source of increase for this greenhouse gas.”
“However, since all worldwide levels rose simultaneously throughout the same year, it is now believed this may be part of a natural cycle in mother nature – and not the direct result of man’s contributions.”
“Findings like these tell us it’s too early to know for sure if man’s impact is affecting things at the political cry of “alarming rates.” We may simply be going through another natural cycle of warmer and colder times – one that’s been observed through a scientific analysis of the Earth to be naturally occuring for hundreds of thousands of years.”
http://www.tgdaily.com/html_tmp/content-view-39973-113.html
Snow fell as the House of Commons debated Global Warming yesterday – the first October fall in the metropolis since 1922.
MIT? Are you serious? They aren’t even paid, oh I mean peer reviewed, by the IPCC
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/29/news/economy/meltdown_bonuses.ap/index.htm
Bipartisan screw up, bipartisan back peddle.
Criminals.
I want my country back, even if it means civil …unrest.
This would appear to coincide with whatever else is out there:
http://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB9351/index1.html
I like the term, “failing forward”, it fits us.
Nathan –
An Apple is an Apple —
An Orange is an Orange —
There is no overlapping —-
No amount of DEBATE will change that….
SolDevVB
Posted October 30, 2008 at 2:32 pm | Permalink
MIT? Are you serious? They aren’t even paid, oh I mean peer reviewed, by the IPCC
======
MIT, that’s a Jr. College right? ;)
MIT? Are you serious? They aren’t even paid, oh I mean peer reviewed, by the IPCC.
Meaning you have no clue what peer review is. I’m not surprised.
Put that in the same category as people who think “global warming” means everything gets warmer. Has no sane connection to the theory, of course, but that’s kinda like creationists believe that evolution says monkeys morphed into humans.
“A man sees what he wants to see, and disregards the rest.” — Paul Simon
‘Levels of the greenhouse gas methane begin to increase again’
http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2008/methane-tt1029.html
“Methane levels in the atmosphere have more than tripled since pre-industrial times, accounting for around one-fifth of the human contribution to greenhouse gas-driven global warming. Until recently, the leveling off of methane levels had suggested that the rate of its emission from the Earth’s surface was approximately balanced by the rate of its destruction in the atmosphere.
…
A rise in Northern Hemispheric emissions may be due to the very warm conditions that were observed over Siberia throughout 2007, potentially leading to increased bacterial emissions from wetland areas. However, a potential cause for an increase in Southern Hemispheric emissions is less clear.”
We already know what kind of POS MCCain is. But if Obama is truly for change, why aren’t we getting criminal charges brought up against Bushco, why not impeachment hearings?
BECAUSE THEY ARE ALL PART OF IT. Scratching each others’ back’s.
Vote out all incumbents.
“MIT, that’s a Jr. College right? ;)”
A Jr. College that Romney started.
Rage & Cosmos, political walking sticks. We know who is shaking you back and forth.
Evolution eh?
Must be something to it…
Just look at the comparison of the pre-human megapenus Erectus and today with an exhibit like MaggotPunk – micropenus Flaccidius.
Rags- Put that in the same category as people who think “global warming” means everything gets warmer. Has no sane connection to the theory, of course, but that’s kinda like creationists believe that evolution says monkeys morphed into humans.
——————————————-
“Scientists” can’t tell me what the weather is going to be this Sunday (3 days) I’m not going to put alot of stock in what they tell me about 30 years……
But you can worship all the scientists you want raggy….
Exxon posts biggest quarterly profit ever, and Mccain wants to give them a 4 bil. tax cut!
“A man sees what he wants to see, and disregards the rest.” — Paul Simon
Actually, I think it’s a man hears.
Essential point intact, just a minor correction and refinement.
Kinda how the progression of science works.
Meaning you have no clue what peer review is. I’m not surprised.
Yeah. MIT. What a bunch of slackers. Not like they know about science or anything.
people who think “global warming” means everything gets warmer.
Yeah, like global temperatures decreasing over the last 10 years and will continue to do so over the next ten years.
How stupid to think that global warming had anything to do with, you know, warming?
Paul Simon
Now there is a scientist for ya !!!
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 2:48 pm | Permalink
“A man sees what he wants to see, and disregards the rest.” — Paul Simon
—————————————
“A man eats what he wants to eat, and disregards the rest.” – Saul the Pieman
biased1 posted October 30, 2008 at 2:45 pm
“Scientists” can’t tell me what the weather is going to be this Sunday (3 days) I’m not going to put alot of stock in what they tell me about 30 years……
—————-
Then cover your ears, and close your eyes, whenever the TV weatherperson compares todays temperatures, and accumulated rainfall, to the “averages”.
Even a pot of water–all H20 with maybe a few trace minerals, about as simple and uniform a substance as you can get–will not heat evenly, right away. Instead, it typically heats at the bottom (where the burner is), and the heat slowly works its way throughout the entire pot.
It’s call physics. Look it up.
Even a pot of water–all H20 with maybe a few trace minerals, about as simple and uniform a substance as you can get–will not heat evenly, right away. Instead, it typically heats at the bottom (where the burner is), and the heat slowly works its way throughout the entire pot.
It’s called physics. Look it up.
Regular
Posted October 30, 2008 at 2:53 pm | Permalink
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 2:48 pm | Permalink
“A man sees what he wants to see, and disregards the rest.” — Paul Simon
—————————————
“A man eats what he wants to eat, and disregards the rest.” – Saul the Pieman
————-
“A man shoots what he wants to shoot, and disregards the rest.” – Buffalo Bill Cody (and later by Tupac)
It’s called physics. Look it up.
How about the cooling that has taken place over the last 10 years. It is because of the sun. That big bright orange ball in the sky during the day. Look it up.
from_the_cosmos- Then cover your ears, and close your eyes, whenever the TV weatherperson compares todays temperatures, and accumulated rainfall, to the “averages”.
———————————-
“averages”
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!
#
Rage
Posted October 30, 2008 at 2:55 pm | Permalink
Even a pot of water–all H20 with maybe a few trace minerals, about as simple and uniform a substance as you can get–will not heat evenly, right away. Instead, it typically heats at the bottom (where the burner is), and the heat slowly works its way throughout the entire pot.
It’s called physics. Look it up.
———————–
Unless it’s a cup of water in a microwave.
Regular- Unless it’s a cup of water in a microwave.
——————————-
Microwaves don’t have a burner.
It’s called fire. Look it up.
#
biased1
Posted October 30, 2008 at 3:03 pm | Permalink
Regular- Unless it’s a cup of water in a microwave.
——————————-
Microwaves don’t have a burner.
It’s called fire. Look it up.
—————————-
Fire is for noobs…
Humans use waves, conduction and convection devices these days.
Regular-
Fire is for noobs…
Humans use waves, conduction and convection devices these days.
—————————–
Point taken. But there is alot to be said for the “old ways.”
For instance, I cannot light my cigar with the microwave.
I know a lad in Quebec City who is fluently bilingual,French/English, now taking Mandarin in middle school (grade 7). French may be the language of dilpomacy, English the language of business/science, but their school system figures it’s best to be prepared for the future, so Mandarin in middle school seems to make sense. I took Latin, enough to qualify as an altar boy to serve mass…….did I ever tell of the time I dropped the Missal?
A cold day it was and this 12 year old had a few sips of Mass wine on an empty stomach just to warm up a bit……..etc.
“Exxon posts biggest quarterly profit ever”
They paid 30 billion in taxes last year. Another record.
biased1
Posted October 30, 2008 at 3:11 pm | Permalink
Regular-
Fire is for noobs…
Humans use waves, conduction and convection devices these days.
—————————–
Point taken. But there is alot to be said for the “old ways.”
For instance, I cannot light my cigar with the microwave
========================
I’ve seen tell-tale signs of left over tobacco on electric burners – was wondering where that came from.
ALERT!!!
No need to worry about Global Warming, I kicked it’s ass a decade ago…The problem is over and we will no longer die in 20 years…well most of us.
Have a great day!!!
*This statement has been peer reviewed by the following: Chuck Norris, Kimbo Slice, Mike Tyson, the late George Burns, and Eddie Munster.
Temperature is 30 degrees for 12 days and 69 for 1 day. Avereage temperature is 33 degrees.
Temperature is 30 degrees for 12 days and 95 for 1 day. Average temperature is 35 degrees.
Global warming. Look it up.
Duckman’s commentary on modern society. :D
roflmao!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WzZ7vpBc44
fleettwood
Posted October 30, 2008 at 3:12 pm | Permalink
“Exxon posts biggest quarterly profit ever”
They paid 30 billion in taxes last year. Another record.
——————————
They had a 200 billion dollar payroll last year. Another record.
biased1 posted October 30, 2008 at 3:00 pm
“averages”
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!
—————–
Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand the term “climate”?
under_the_cosmos- Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand the term “climate”?
——————————————-
The average course or condition of wether.
Look it up.
Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand the term “climate”?
Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand 10 years of cooling with no end in sight?
Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand that the IPCC models have been proven horrifically wrong?
Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand that while you worshiped Gore and the lying IPCC the world cooled beneath your feet?
under_the_cosmos- Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand the term “climate”?
——————————————-
The average course or condition of weather.
Look it up.
Sol- Do you lack to lack the mental capacity needed to understand that the IPCC models have been proven horrifically wrong?
————————————
It’s called a hoax. Look it up.
under_the_cosmos- Can I assume the next three months “climate” by averaging the “climate” of the last three months?
Is 10 years enough for an average? Is snow fall for the first time in October since 1922 a factor? The coldest winter in China in 100 years?
Is that global warming?
Can I assume the temperature on January 1, by averaging the last 20, 50 or 200 January 1s ??
Sol, you forgot this:
Swiss lowlands received the most snow for any October since records began in 1931.
Swiss lowlands received the most snow for any October since records began in 1931.
Ahhyup. That’s that global warming for you :-b
in_the_cosmos- How long do we need to go back before we call it a “trend” 20, 50, 100, 500 years?
Who decides? Where do they get their records?
They finding 500 year old trees all over the place and “reading” their rings?
Who measured the “average” thickness of the arctic?
How could they do that?
It’s called a hoax. look it up.
Oct. 29, 2008 Florida recorded second lowest temperature ever recorded in October since 1850.
MIT scientists baffled by global warming theory, contradicts scientific data
“Boston (MA) – Scientists at MIT have recorded a nearly simultaneous world-wide increase in methane levels. This is the first increase in ten years, and what baffles science is that this data contradicts theories stating man is the primary source of increase for this greenhouse gas.”
—————–
This huge increase in atmospheric methane did occur during the American election campaign.
Coincidence?
No cosmos? No rage? Bet they are out cutting firewood for the bone chilling winterS ahead.
Kansas is alot cooler and wetter than say….oh…..1936 ?
SolDevVB
Posted October 30, 2008 at 3:46 pm | Permalink
No cosmos? No rage? Bet they are out cutting firewood for the bone chilling winterS ahead.
———————————-
Old libtard trick.
It’s called “cut and run.” Look it up.
biased1,
Thank you for proving that you lack the small mental capacity needed to understand the term “climate”, as re AGW.
in_the_cosmos- Thank you for telling me about global warming.
It’s called a hoax. Look it up.
Thank you for proving that you lack the small mental capacity needed to understand the term “climate”, as re AGW.
Of course you can’t use a dictionary definition of “climate”. What the hell were you thinking? You have to use the AGW definition.
You know, co2 means warming means lower temperatures means global warming.
Ad the best refute you can get from all the examples? Some lame a$$ “Thank you for proving…” meme from cosmos. Cause that’s all she’s got.
Evidence? Facts? Lower temperatures?
Thank you for proving that you can’t interpret facts into the Gore/IPCC fiction.
From cosmos MIT link, the full story:
*************
The amount of methane in Earth’s atmosphere shot up in 2007, bringing to an end a period of about a decade in which atmospheric levels of the potent greenhouse gas were essentially stable, according to a team led by MIT researchers.
Methane levels in the atmosphere have more than tripled since pre-industrial times, accounting for around one-fifth of the human contribution to greenhouse gas-driven global warming. Until recently, the leveling off of methane levels had suggested that the rate of its emission from the Earth’s surface was approximately balanced by the rate of its destruction in the atmosphere.
However, since early 2007 the balance has been upset, according to a paper on the new findings being published this week in Geophysical Review Letters. The paper’s lead authors, postdoctoral researcher Matthew Rigby and Ronald Prinn, the TEPCO Professor of Atmospheric Chemistry in MIT’s Department of Earth, Atmospheric and Planetary Science, say this imbalance has resulted in several million metric tons of additional methane in the atmosphere. Methane is produced by wetlands, rice paddies, cattle, and the gas and coal industries, and is destroyed by reaction with the hydroxyl free radical (OH), often referred to as the atmosphere’s “cleanser.”
One surprising feature of this recent growth is that it occurred almost simultaneously at all measurement locations across the globe. However, the majority of methane emissions are in the Northern Hemisphere, and it takes more than one year for gases to be mixed from the Northern Hemisphere to the Southern Hemisphere. Hence, theoretical analysis of the measurements shows that if an increase in emissions is solely responsible, these emissions must have risen by a similar amount in both hemispheres at the same time.
A rise in Northern Hemispheric emissions may be due to the very warm conditions that were observed over Siberia throughout 2007, potentially leading to increased bacterial emissions from wetland areas. However, a potential cause for an increase in Southern Hemispheric emissions is less clear.
An alternative explanation for the rise may lie, at least in part, with a drop in the concentrations of the methane-destroying OH. Theoretical studies show that if this has happened, the required global methane emissions rise would have been smaller, and more strongly biased to the Northern Hemisphere. At present, however, it is uncertain whether such a drop in hydroxyl free radical concentrations did occur because of the inherent uncertainty in the current method for estimating global OH levels.
To help pin down the cause of the methane increase, Prinn said, “the next step will be to study this using a very high-resolution atmospheric circulation model and additional measurements from other networks.” But doing that could take another year, he said, and because the detection of increased methane has important consequences for global warming the team wanted to get these initial results out as quickly as possible.
“The key thing is to better determine the relative roles of increased methane emission versus an idecrease in the rate of removal,” Prinn said. “Apparently we have a mix of the two, but we want to know how much of each” is responsible for the overall increase.
It is too early to tell whether this increase represents a return to sustained methane growth, or the beginning of a relatively short-lived anomaly, according to Rigby and Prinn. Given that, pound for pound, methane is 25 times more powerful as a greenhouse gas than carbon dioxide, the situation will require careful monitoring in the near future.
In addition to Rigby and Prinn, the study was carried out by researchers at Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organization (CSIRO), Georgia Institute of Technology, University of Bristol and Scripps Institution of Oceanography. These methane measurements come from the Advanced Global Atmospheric Gases Experiment (AGAGE) that is supported by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA), and the Australian CSIRO network.
****************
I would be hard-pressed to spend too long discussing these things, but until you clowns take some interest in the real science and its methodologies, it’s not even worth the time it took to write this sentence.
Methane levels in the atmosphere have more than tripled since pre-industrial times,
Given that, pound for pound, methane is 25 times more powerful as a greenhouse gas than carbon dioxide,
Well there you have it. Break out the sunscreen. Gonna be one HOT Christmas !!!
Well there you have it. Break out the sunscreen. Gonna be one HOT Christmas !!!
——–
I am digging out my European man-thong as we type!
It’s Ok Cosmos… THEY dont understand that Global Warming includes crazy spikes in the Weather, which is only one small part of the CLIMATE…. LOL…… Maybe some day…. but not today, Cosmos…
10 years Chas…10 years.
ANTI — you might want to stay out of Public View if you wear that “man-thong” thing… LOL
Ten years what??? That might be considerable time, if you think the Earth is only 10,000 years old…. But, on the more scientific scale, Ten years is hardly a wink!
Chas
Posted October 30, 2008 at 4:21 pm | Permalink
ANTI — you might want to stay out of Public View if you wear that “man-thong” thing… LOL
———–
…like 2 eggs in a hanky…
I might shave first.
But, on the more scientific scale, Ten years is hardly a wink!
——
Not when compared to man’s industrial age.
In an interview with Larry King that aired last night, John McCain admitted that he doesn’t think Barack Obama is a socialist…
awwwwwwww
Cute but irrelevant aren’t they?
The deniers I mean?
Funny little antiques. I can’t decide whether they belong in a glass case or a padded cell.
Just so long as they’re confined.
Cosmos — Some people cant see a forest… because of too many damned trees… and so, they proceed to cut down trees, until there is no more forest….
Hey DavidB… you suppose old McCain told his handlers he was going to say that, before he said it?? LOL Now, they are going to have to come out later, and tell us that what he really meant to say was: _____________
_______________________________.
Padded cell, Blue Jay… we wouldnt want them to hurt themselves on that “glass is not really glass” case…. ::roll::
The GW deniers dont understand that the shift to warming trends CAUSE the aberrant storms, and freaked out weather cycles, that they jokingly laugh at….
Watch a frog on a stove, starting out in a cool pot of water… Watch the frog slowly cook as you apply heat….
Chas, are you still tight rolling your pants?….That TREND has been over for years!
By the logic of some, the Democrats have held Congress for 14 years (since for the first time in 12 years they took control of Congress in 2006).
What we have here is a failure to communicate.
SolDevVB posted October 30, 2008 at 3:55 pm
Of course you can’t use a dictionary definition of “climate”. What the hell were you thinking? You have to use the AGW definition.
—————
Actually, the IPCC uses the period used by the World Meteorological Organization — 30 years.
Actually, the IPCC uses the period used by the World Meteorological Organization — 30 years.
——
10 years cooling= 33%….sounds like the beginning of a trend.
P.S. RIP, Paul Newman. You’ll be missed.
Well, you all have a nice spin… Those who know the facts, will be set free from those facts… The rest will “die” trying to keep up
“Nobody can eat 50 eggs!”
There is no God.
The Universe was created by a Big Bang.
Man, after evolving from Monkeys, invented God as a way to explain things he couldn’t understand.
Phony Preachers developed to make people feel good, and to help them avoid panic and despair by thinking about death and turning into the dirt from which they came.
There is no Santa Claus, Christmas, or Easter Bunny either.
#
Chas
Posted October 30, 2008 at 4:59 pm | Permalink
There is no God.
The Universe was created by a Big Bang.
Man, after evolving from Monkeys, invented God as a way to explain things he couldn’t understand.
Phony Preachers developed to make people feel good, and to help them avoid panic and despair by thinking about death and turning into the dirt from which they came.
———————————-
Yeah, phony preachers…
You guys could not imagine what is on that Obama video!
Obama and Bill Ayers getting smashed and singing “Praise Allah!”
When someone offers enough $$$$$$, the video will be released.
Reports have surfaced in Butler, Johnson, Sedgwick, and Shawnee Counties that some residents may not be registered to vote because of a flawed, paperless voter registration system at the Dept. of Motor Vehicles. One estimate from a reliable source is that perhaps 100 voters statewide are affected by this problem (so far). The problem only affects those who registered this year to vote through the DMV from Aug 25 through Oct 20. A new automatic transfer system started on Aug 25.
More details:
http://kansasmeadowlark.com/2008/10/30/100-dmv-voter-registration-lost/
“LA Times
Posted October 30, 2008 at 5:05 pm | Permalink
You guys could not imagine what is on that Obama video!
Obama and Bill Ayers getting smashed and singing “Praise Allah!”
When someone offers enough $$$$$$, the video will be released.”
Do they tag team Palin and do a few lines of coke too?
Obama do coke?
Of course. He admitted that already.
When that call comes at 3 am, that is the first thing Obama will do. He’ll take a big snort of coke and flip a coin to decide whether to push the button or not.
Heh, looks like someone’s been hitting the meth a little hard.
Gotta go trick or treating.
Putting on my collar and going out with the kiddies.
And I refuse to put that pumpkin sticker on my door.
Will be a fun Halloween tonight baby!
I’m a firm believer in Theistic evolution. In other words, I don’t think there is a conflict between Creationism and evolution. God made the universe and everything in it around 13.5 billion years ago. Man evolved from lower creatures, and when God saw fit, gave him free will (Adam and Eve).
To me, the stories in the bible were written for the people of the times. Imagine God telling people back then the earth was four billion years old, revolved around the sun, and man evolved from an ape-like creature. Ya, they would have believed that one. Good bye religion.
Look at the religious dark ages. Turns out man was wrong about just about everything back then, torturing and killing people for not believing what the church taught. Maybe some day the true believers will understand that, but I doubt it. Their faith keeps them from seeing how the universe, and man, really is.
#
LA Times
Posted October 30, 2008 at 5:09 pm | Permalink
Obama do coke?
Of course. He admitted that already.
When that call comes at 3 am, that is the first thing Obama will do. He’ll take a big snort of coke and flip a coin to decide whether to push the button or not.
====================================================
Right, and McCain, who was under communist rule for five and a half years, will call his communist handlers so he can find out what to do, right? Hey, sounds as logical as the coke BS.
http://coloradoindependent.com/13187/adams-county-quarantines-machine-that-switched-candidates-vote
Adams County ‘quarantines’ machine that switched candidate’s vote
By Ernest Luning 10/29/08 9:08 AM
An electronic voting machine in Adams County [Colorado] repeatedly failed to accept a vote for a Democratic state Senate candidate — instead registering the vote for her Republican opponent — at an early voting site last week and has been removed from service, the Aurora Sentinel reports Wednesday. Adams County Clerk and Recorder Karen Long told the newspaper the error doesn’t reflect wider problems in the county’s voting systems, but the candidate said the incident could lead to a lawsuit.
“I always just trusted the machines, and it opened my eyes,” said state Rep. Mary Hodge. “The way it works now, I’m told … is that those votes throw it to Mr. Hadfield that we’ll probably have a lawsuit and a court decision. We’ll have to wait and see.”
Hodge, the Democratic nominee, faces Republican Robert John Hadfield in the race to represent state Senate District 25.
The voter reported the problem to election judges, who canceled her ballot and allowed her to vote — this time accurately — on another machine, Long told the Sentinel.
“I have quarantined the machine,” Long told the newspaper. “It’s removed and it’s sealed up and it’s in a bag.” She said she is awaiting instructions from the secretary of state’s office.
The voter contacted Hodge after the incident. “She said that she put in, got her stuff and it would pop up Hadfield. She tried it three times,” Hodge told the Sentinel.
Late last year, Colorado Secretary of State Mike Coffman decertified three of the four electronic voting manufacturers whose machines are used in the state, citing “problems with accuracy and security,” only to recertify them after county clerks complained.
*******
Hmmm . . . more mysterious machines in which people vote Dem but the machine votes Republican.
Oh well, I’m sure it’s just an isolated incident. Except for West Virginia. And Texas, etc. etc.
Nothing to worry about . . .
Why is Chas’s name sometimes hot linked (blue) and sometimes not (black)?
Is someone trolling him?
hehehe
Good evening Capn.,
Chas is the troll.
Yes, Capn. It’s Chas ONLY when his nic is blue and linked.
Gee, I wonder who would troll Chas?
HINT:
Regular
Posted December 29, 2007 at 4:26 pm | Permalink
Okay folks, less than 8 hours until count down is finished, then I’m out of here.
Being as there is a desire for me to depart before 1 January 2008, I will be honoring that request.
So, you have less than eight hours to interact with me.
29 Dec 2007!~???
CapnAmerica, have you ever looked up the definition of trolling?
Bonedigging posts is trolling?
Well hell, take a look at last night.
“Max” must have been posting from under a bridge. It’s like “he” has bookmarked everything I ever said.
City of Wichita, Sedgwick County Zoo & Westar Energy Offer Free Firewood
Date: October 29, 2008
Contact: Communications Team
Phone: (316) 268-4351
The City of Wichita, Sedgwick County Zoo & Westar Energy are teaming up to give away firewood this winter. The wood is left over from Westar Energy’s tree trimming line
clearance work and City forestry tree pruning and removal operations. The free wood is now available for pick up from 7:00 a.m. – 5:30 p.m. through February 2009 in the
north parking lot of the Sedgwick County Zoo, 555 Zoo Blvd.
“We are grateful for this partnership that allows us to give the public firewood from park and street tree pruning work,” said Tim Martz Superintendent of Park Maintenance and Forestry. “It also saves the community valuable disposal space at the Brooks Landfill.”
Besides the free firewood, customers can also pick up wood chips to use as mulch.
The City of Wichita, Sedgwick County Zoo and Westar Energy will not allow people to use chain saws when they pick up the firewood.
Nearly one in four Texas voters erroneously believes Barack Obama is Muslim, according to a new poll.
The poll conducted this month by the University of Texas found that less than half the state’s voters, a majority of whom support John McCain’s candidacy, could correctly identify the religion of the Democratic presidential candidate. Obama has been a member of the same Christian church in Chicago for more than 20 years, and he faced controversy earlier this year when controversial statements from the church’s former pastor appeared online.
When asked Obama’s religion, 22.7 percent of the respondents said Muslim, while 45 percent correctly said Protestant.
======================================================
So nearly one quarter of Texans are that stupid? Hey, Texas, ya gotta pick up the pace on frying them criminals: They’re breeding too fast.
Some words from Rush Limbaugh that I like:
“No wonder Obama is not helping out his aunt living in the slum in Boston and his brother living in the hut in Kenya — he expects us to!”
“I want to share with you some notes that I made for show prep while watching the Obama commercial last night: ‘Obama America: fat, poor people. Google billionaire lecturing about wealth. Mom has to ration milk because of high gas prices. Bad economy.’”
“It might surprise some of you to know this, but arthritis does happen to human beings who happen to live in America. However, The Messiah is going to lay his hands on these people and cure the arthritis as soon as he’s elected president.”
I wonder if the Messiah will cure my Arthritis overnight?
Is someone trolling him?
Interesting. I’ll give them credit for slick work if it’s so. It’s not so much the lack of a link as the posts (I thought he was just being sarcastic).
Gonna try somethin’.
So nearly one quarter of Texans are that stupid? Hey, Texas, ya gotta pick up the pace on frying them criminals: They’re breeding too fast.
===============================================
Hey WalkerJM, you think they are stupid in Texas.
Take a look at how dumb they are in Harlem:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyvqhdllXgU
HA!!! I guess McCain has given money to Khaidi on more than one occasion..he also gave an undisclosed sum in 1993 as well as the half million in 1998 to fund Khaidi’s projects!!!!
And he’s SLAMMING Obama for talking to Khaidi and having dinner with him? How funny!!!
OBAMA’s TAX PLAN – Penn & Teller and gang return to comment on Barack Obama’s socialist plans to turn the United States into a Marxist wasteland!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=491_5WxfcgI&eurl=http://www.truveo.com/OBAMAs-TAX-PLAN-Penn-Teller-and-gang-return-to/id/148913598
God…you’re so desperate..haven’t you cons figured out that most Americans (the ones who actually think) don’t fall for the BS lies you spread. In fact, it’s pretty much back fired on y’all! LOL!
#
Mary_Caruso
Posted October 30, 2008 at 8:09 pm | Permalink
HA!!! I guess McCain has given money to Khaidi on more than one occasion..he also gave an undisclosed sum in 1993 as well as the half million in 1998 to fund Khaidi’s projects!!!!
And he’s SLAMMING Obama for talking to Khaidi and having dinner with him? How funny!!!
—————-
McCain has never given money to Khaidi. I see that you certainly are not above playing fast and loose with the truth Mary.
I appreciate Penn Jillette’s assaults on pseudo-science, but the man’s politics? He doesn’t even want public libraries! Phew!
Since I know you researched this money to to Khaidi’s projects, could you post a link, Mary?
But McCain has his own connection to Khalidi.
In 1993, McCain became chairman of the International Republican Institute. He still chairs that respected organization.
That same year, Khalidi helped found the Center for Palestine Research and Studies, self-described as “an independent academic research and policy analysis institution” created to meet “the need for active Palestinian scholarship on issues related to Palestine.” (Its archived Web site is HERE.)
Khalidi was on the board of trustees through 1999.
According to tax returns, the McCain-chaired IRI funded the organization Khalidi founded and served on to the tune of $448,873 in 1998 (click HERE to see the tax return)* as first reported by Seth Couter Walls at HuffPo.
The IRI continued to give money to the CPRS after Khalidi left the group as well.
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/10/the-khalidi-gam.html
Note: Khalidi is a respected scholar. Born in New York City.
“McCain has never given money to Khaidi. I see that you certainly are not above playing fast and loose with the truth Mary.”
Ha!!!! It’s true, it’s true, it’s true!!!!
Hmmm… So a group McCain was affiliated gave money to a start up organization that Khalidi was affilated with. Big whoop.
That’s it? That’s the connection? Why you’d have thought from Mary’s post that McCain was handing out personal checks to Khalidi.
As I said before, fast and loose.
Yes, a mostly tax-funded organization gives funds to further Democracy and women’s rights in Palestine.
Another big whoop for the Democraps…
If John McCain and Sarah Palin win in November, it’s likely to be more than many Democrats can stand. Slate V imagines how the Canadian government might try to capitalize on this liberal anxiety.
http://link.brightcove.com/services/link/bcpid271557392/bctid1842856410
BTW, McCain CHAIRED the organization that directly gave Khalidi the money.
yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2008/10/mccain_gave_money_to_khalidi.php
“Why you’d have thought from Mary’s post that McCain was handing out personal checks to Khalidi.”
He did…because he headed up the organization, he was directly involved with giving Khalidi the grant money to start up his research center in Palestine. He also was directly involved with giving Khalidi funding for his projects in in 1993.
Obama had dinner and several conversations with Khalidi..anotherr “big whoop” for the Republicans!
No one cares Mary. You are rapidly becoming the female equivalent of Chas on this blog.
When explained to you want the funds were for, you ignored it.
When explained that the money did not go to Khalidi, but the organization, you ignored it.
When explained that Obama chose to hang around Khalidi and his Palestinian buddies at anti-Israel rallies, you ignored it.
Mary, the female Chas of the blog. Ignores proof and never states she’s wrong on a matter.
She has concluded that thinking wrongly and being stupid is being clever.
Those actions just make you look more stupid.
“If John McCain and Sarah Palin win in November, it’s likely to be more than many Democrats can stand”
I DON’T think we have to worry about it!!!! HAHAHAHA!!!
We can read Mary. Can you? Organization to organization. As much as you’d like to personalize it, it didn’t happen.
Oh, and that was back in 1993. Was Khalidi speaking for the PLO then like he was in 2003?
Normally Mary, I would say that you are pretty fair in your posts, but lately I’m afraid you have gone over nutball falls.
heehee.. they just can’t admit that Fox is pushing another phony boogie man…
Sour Grapes, Reg?
You ad homonym attacks are so pathetic..
#
Regular
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:03 pm | Permalink
No one cares Mary. You are rapidly becoming the female equivalent of Chas on this blog.
When explained to you want the funds were for, you ignored it.
When explained that the money did not go to Khalidi, but the organization, you ignored it.
When explained that Obama chose to hang around Khalidi and his Palestinian buddies at anti-Israel rallies, you ignored it.
Mary, the female Chas of the blog. Ignores proof and never states she’s wrong on a matter.
She has concluded that thinking wrongly and being stupid is being clever.
Those actions just make you look more stupid.
======================================================
Wow, I think Regular and Franklin have finally morphed into one and the same. Once Regular starts capitalizing whole words randomly, the union will be complete. Well, maybe commas strewn here and there will help the coupling.
That two separate minds can practice Wango logic becoming one in the same is scientific history. All hail Frangular the First!!!
“Mary, the female Chas of the blog. Ignores proof and never states she’s wrong on a matter.”
Regular if I understand the rules this is the point where you are suppose to post something like this:
Mary = Chas.
That is what I have learned from B J and a few others.
It was in 1993 and 1998, and maybe even on more occasions, Out…I guess my point is (in case you missed it)…Why does McCain make an issue of Obama’s aquantance with a man that McCain helped on more than one opccasion to fund Palestinian projects? I guess McCain “pals around” with terrorists, too?
The grant money was given to diectly to Khalidi, who started the Palestine Research Center.
Don’t you think it’s JUST a little hypocritcal?
If it was Obama instead of McCain…the Republicans would be making a huge issue of it.
Just like they have with William Ayers, who Obama served on a board 10 years ago along with 3 other Republicans.
I just think it’s really funny….and hypocritcal.
I DON’T think we have to worry about it!!!! HAHAHAHA!!!
Now, now, don’t understand their capacity to manufacture incidents or use dirty tricks, Mary. Or even some random, stupid event intervening.
It ain’t over ’til it’s over.
“Mary, the female Chas of the blog. Ignores proof and never states she’s wrong on a matter.”
What proof?
Funny..I don’t remember you ever admitting you’re wrong about anything, either…hypocrite
“Understand”? “underestimate”
Oh well, my typos are least interesting!
OK, I’ve had enough fun for one evening…good nite! :)
BILL CLINTON SAYS:
http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/30/clinton-suggests-obama-uncertain-economic-crisis/
Bill Clinton: Obama Got Lots of Help on Economic Crisis Response
Bill Clinton says at a rally that Barack Obama called a round of advisers during the height of the economic crisis and said, “tell me what … to do.”
Barack Obama cultivated the image of a cool and collected leader during the height of the economic crisis last month, when lawmakers on Capitol Hill scrambled to draft a workable bailout package after a meltdown on Wall Street.
And when John McCain suspended his campaign to dive head first into the fray, Obama’s campaign accused the Republican of being “unsteady.”
But to hear Bill Clinton tell it, the Democratic nominee didn’t quite have a handle on the situation himself.
“I haven’t cleared this with him and he may even be mad at me for saying this so close to the election, but I know what else he said to his economic advisers (during the crisis),” Clinton told the crowd at a Wednesday night rally with Obama in Florida. “He said, ‘Tell me what the right thing to do is. What’s the right thing for America? Don’t tell me what’s popular. You tell me what’s right — I’ll figure out how to sell it.’”
Clinton said when the crisis broke, Obama called his own advisers as well as those of the former two-term president, Hillary Clinton, Warren Buffet and others.
“He called those people. You know why? Because he knew it was complicated and before he said anything he wanted to understand,” Clinton said. “That’s what a president does in a crisis.”
The seeming praise may come off as a backhanded compliment, especially since Obama repeatedly accuses McCain of admitting he doesn’t know much about the economy. McCain’s campaign said Clinton’s remark shows Obama was uncertain when Wall Street seemed to be on the verge of crumbling.
“Barack Obama had no idea what the right thing to do is or at least that’s Bill Clinton’s impression,” McCain spokesman Michael Goldfarb said.
“It’s disturbing that … Barack Obama’s response to this is ‘Tell me what to do and I will sell it,’” Goldfarb added. “That’s been Barack Obama’s entire campaign — is one big sales job.”
Ah conservativism, where black is white (except with skin tone) and up is down.
They want you to actually think you’re crazy because you know the facts.
#
Mary_Caruso
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:17 pm | Permalink
I just think it’s really funny….and hypocritcal.
======================
Then we can just ignore your posts from now on.
You aren’t interesting in discussing anything.
I am voting for McCain. Evolution is a joke, sorry I could not defend it better. I love Jesus and am scared to admit it!
So Barak Obama knows some people who now the players in the Palestinian and Israeli conflict. That could be a good thing, you know.
McCain? His policies are more of the same, and we know how well that has been working…
“McCain’s approach, while forceful and militant, leaves little room for new ideas about how to peacefully settle wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, how to successfully fight a war on terror that won’t be open ended, and how to settle the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.”
http://middleeast.about.com/od/usmideastpolicy/a/me071122_2.htm
Can anyone believe what Obama says?
In the last week, several tax plans have come out.
1. Those earning $250,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
2. Those earning $200,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
3. Those earning $150,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
4. Those earning $200,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
What will the LIAR say next?
One last thought:
“He called those people. You know why? Because he knew it was complicated and before he said anything he wanted to understand,” Clinton said. “That’s what a president does in a crisis.”
I think it’s important that someone sees all sides of an issue before he acts on it. That’s wisdom…not weakness. Abraham Lincoln put his biggest critics in his cabinet..becasue he wanted to see all sides in order to understand an issue as fully as he could….Obama does the same thing.
We’ve had nothing but knee jerk decisions and acting “from the gut” for the last 8 years and look what it got us. I don’t know about you, but I’m ready for someone who gives thought to the impact of his decisions before he determines the course he should take.
Obama is going to be a great leader.
Oh my, Reg is going to ignore me…’cuse me while I go cry myself to sleep.
Good nite.
Oh my, Reg is going to ignore me…’cuse me while I go cry myself to sleep.
Good nite.
“Obama is going to be a great leader.”
Indeed, Mary. I heard a commentator backing Obama on NPR recently who said his greatest gift was that he liked to think.
It is very sad that the last 8 years we have had a president who loathes thinking. Very sad…
Goldfarb, the RNC hack who is trying to scare little old Jewish ladies in Florida with this crap was smacked down on CNN quite nicely by Rich Sanchez.
Sanchez simply insisted Goldfarb back up a claim, and Goldfarb pulled an incredible dig-in-his-heels song and dance. He had nothing.
You can watch the embarrassing performance:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/30/rick-sanchez-v-michael-go_n_139357.html
African war lord son found guilty in Miami for (get this) Torture.
Guess the U.S. reserves exclusive rights to torture, and will convict others for doing same!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20081030/wl_nm/us_usa_liberia_torture_1
StevenEDavis
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:39 pm | Permalink
“Obama is going to be a great leader.”
Indeed, Mary. I heard a commentator backing Obama on NPR recently who said his greatest gift was that he liked to think.
===============================================================
My GOD, that is so profound Steven. I’m saving this post.
Too bad this woman didn’t have a gun in her home to defend herself. Killed in her own home.
Murdered Anchor Remembered At Funeral
http://www.wspa.com/spa/news/local/article/murder_anchor_remembered_at_funeral/10425/
Tigger & Pooh Think,think, think song
I record this on my digicam coz My 1.5yr old son love this song. He would point his finger to his temple to think,think,think. When this clip ended,he will say ‘a-mo?’ (summore). cutez.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZAWIQb9JmA
I can see Obama now, singing the Winnie the Poo song and whacking the side of his head:
Think
Think
Think
American’s are so poor they are starving to death! Especially the poor non-hispanic black people.
Obama will fix this.
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5728a1.htm
In the 2007 BRFSS survey, 25.6% of respondents overall were obese. Obesity prevalence was 26.4% for men and 24.8% for women (Table). By age group, obesity prevalence ranged from 19.1% for men and women aged 18–29 years to 31.7% and 30.2%, respectively, for men and women aged 50–59 years. By race/ethnicity and sex, obesity prevalence was highest for non-Hispanic black women (39.0%) followed by non-Hispanic black men (32.1%).
MaxGrobnik posted October 30, 2008 at 9:55 pm
I can see Obama now, singing the Winnie the Poo song and whacking the side of his head:
Think
Think
Think
—————
Is that how you try to think, MaxGrobnik? Judging from his posts here, MaxGrobnik has whacked the side of his head with a heavy iron skillet — for a long, long time.
I don’t need to think Cosmos.
I just read your links all day long instead.
Must be really bad for McSame when Kristol on Daily Show says he’s “holding out hope” as if he knows its over for the cons.
Poorer people have less access to healthy food choices.
You know that.
I just read your links all day long instead.
——————————————–
I can see it now Max in his little booth in the parking garage pounding out wisdom fer the masses–your a true merkin Max keep up the good work
Beware the (Obama) Bandwagon, or just jump on it!
If I was so ambivalent about who I was going to vote for this close to an election, I’d probably just sit this on out. But voting in an historical election might just hold some appeal, especially to younger voters.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20081030/pl_politico/15070
MaxGrobnik
Posted October 30, 2008 at 9:33 pm | Permalink
Can anyone believe what Obama says?
In the last week, several tax plans have come out.
1. Those earning $250,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
2. Those earning $200,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
3. Those earning $150,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
4. Those earning $200,000 or less will see a tax cut.
Then:
What will the LIAR say next?
============================================
What’s the matter Max?? Your mental skills lacking tonite??? Those are not contradictory… in fact, quite the opposite… They all say the same thing…
Anybody under $250,000 will see no new tax… That has some kind of problem for your mental capacity??? or what??
Oama winning should be good for fox and rush et.al.
Instead of Clinton they’ll have Obama to hate for 8 yrs.
Thar’s gold in them fools, as Joe the Plumer might say.
Poor max is that 150k getting a little too close for comfort? Thought not.
Chas you are a fukin’ idiot!
Got my first scam letter from some desperate African needing my help in moving a huge some of money.
Chas you are like a hyperactive angry Forrest Gump, minus 10 IQ points.
ANTI — Max made up everything on his list, except for the $250,000, and the $200,000 — and those two are or two different categories of tax filers… Try learning to read, numb nuts…
http://signs.cafepress.com/item/gun-owners-for-obama-banner/303228648
buy one now
Chas try listening to Obama with your ears. Then process the information with the peanut in your head.
Ah, fuk it, you are deaf and blind Rev…
It’s going to take a shot of adrenalin to get consumers to spend, Obama and the dems got it right in reallocating the bush tax cuts to those who need it and will spend it to stimulate the economy. This recession may get real ugly before it’s over.
WASHINGTON – Scared and out of money, Americans stopped buying everything from cars to corn flakes in the July-September quarter, ratcheting back spending by the largest amount in 28 years and jolting the national economy into what could be the most painful recession in decades.
With retailers bracing for a grim holiday buying season, the economy isn’t just slowing; it’s actually shrinking, the government confirmed Thursday. It reported that the nation’s gross domestic product declined at an annual rate of 0.3 percent in the year’s third quarter and consumers’ disposable income took its biggest drop on record.
In simpler words, “The train went off the tracks,” said Brian Bethune, economist at IHS global Insight.
Watching Billo
Among celebrities that are cons?
John Ratzenberger (the mailman from “Cheers”)
Joke.
Victoria Jackson. I used to like Victoria. Too bad she sold out because she cannot find work.
Chas I think if Obama asked for your eternal soul, you would give it to him.
ANTI
Posted October 30, 2008 at 10:51 pm | Permalink
Chas try listening to Obama with your ears. Then process the information with the peanut in your head.
Ah, fuk it, you are deaf and blind Rev…
============================================
Ahhh but I HAVE listened…. Thats why I know I am right, and YOU and MAX are total liars and idiots!!
Among celebrities that are cons?
——-
Who gives a rat’s ass about celebrities? You know BlueJay, most of them are…..shhhhh…RICH!!! So why do you care what they think?
Heh HEH!
O’ Reilly is slipping in the ratings.
He rants that it is a conspiracy!
Nah Bill, it’s just that some of us know you are not looking out for ANYTHING but your helium supply.
Deflate that cons ego in front of a thousand wind mills and you could power the whole country for a century.
Slumming and watching FOX “news”
Better know the enemy and their deluded?
They have some little creep that looks like Nathan who follows people around and harasses them.
BlueJay,
Get any quotes yet? Did you even submit your information?
If you are looking for a date Nathan, I respect your lifestyle but am not interested.
BlueJay,
Even if I were gay, I wouldn’t want a date with you.
Did you even submit your information or get any quotes yet?
Go hit on “Regular” Nathan, he is more your type.
BlueJay,
We have several people here willing to help you. All you have to do is plug your information into that website and get some quotes.
How hard is that?
You can’t be so lazy that won’t even do that. Can you be?
good night; good luck; god bless —-
whatever you conceive god to be!!
blessings ALL!!
Blessings for the Eve of All Saints tomorrow nite.
so mote it be!!
Thanks to you and your “several people” there Nathan.
But I’ll hold out this country will do the right thing.
MANY people before me needed and did not have health care. I can wait for the country to get better.
Whatever it is you offer? I don’t like who I would have to thank.
Yeah, no sh! t, BluJ.
Who does Nathan think he is telling you what you need?
He doesn’t even have a family. His only real motivation was to embarrass us LIBs for not digging deep into our pockets to help another Lib.
Unfortunately, his little trick didn’t work when KSGrrl stepped up and said she would pay.
I’ll send you some affordable plans by e-mail I saw on The New York Times webpage tomorrow.
You can see if anything meets your needs.
But don’t let Mr. Insincere Christian goad you into anything unwise . . .
CapnAmerica,
My little trick works either way. If you don’t pay, you don’t really care about BlueJay.
If you do pay, well then BlueJay gets health insurance and it costs you.
I win either way, idiot.
And the best part is that it was all my idea when it does happen!
LOL
Obama’s TAX PLAN >>>>
Middle class families will see their taxes cut – and no family making less than $250,000 will see their taxes increase. The typical middle class family will receive well over $1,000 in tax relief under the Obama plan, and will pay tax rates that are 20% lower than they faced under President Reagan. According to the Tax Policy Center, the Obama plan provides three times as much tax relief for middle class families as the McCain plan.
Families making more than $250,000 will pay either the same or lower tax rates than they paid in the 1990s. Obama will ask the wealthiest 2% of families to give back a portion of the tax cuts they have received over the past eight years to ensure we are restoring fairness and returning to fiscal responsibility. But no family will pay higher tax rates than they would have paid in the 1990s. In fact, dividend rates would be 39 percent lower than what President Bush proposed in his 2001 tax cut.
Obama’s plan will cut taxes overall, reducing revenues to below the levels that prevailed under Ronald Reagan (less than 18.2 percent of GDP). The Obama tax plan is a net tax cut – his tax relief for middle class families is larger than the revenue raised by his tax changes for families over $250,000. Coupled with his commitment to cut unnecessary spending, Obama will pay for this tax relief while bringing down the budget deficit.
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FULL Details here >>>>
http://origin.barackobama.com/taxes/
If the comments cant be kept to what is on this web site, then it isnt an honest argument, or disagreement…. ALL of the questions are answered here….
http://origin.barackobama.com/taxes/