According to the Nielsen ratings, Wednesday’s final presidential debate between John McCain and Barack Obama was viewed by 56.5 million people – impressive considering it was competing with baseball, but nowhere near, say, Super Bowl viewership. The audiences for their first and second debates were 52.4 million and 63.2 million, respectively. The vice presidential face-off between Sarah Palin and Joe Biden (in photo) remains king, with 69.9 million viewers (which was 6 million fewer than for the “Seinfeld” finale in 1998).
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135 Comments
I am glad that people were wanting to watch these debates, it is because so many have stopped paying attention to what the Politicians have been doing and saying that we have the mess we have. Now we just need to get back to caring about what they do or say and not just letting others whom have their own agendas tell us what the government or the Politicians are saying or doing.
The O Riley‘s, Olbermann’s, Limbaugh’s, of the world tell you only what they see the way they see it.
Not what is actually happening or said they make a cigar into a penis and vice versa. They get away with it solely because most do not take the time to find out what the true is and because they say what we want to believe.
I suppose the most unenlightening aspect of the debates was how the ones on this blog (who would never admit to bias:-)) reported their respective views on the debate. Talk about totally unbiased blogging . . . (sarcasm. . . cough, cough!!)
Wellsaid, Dog. I’m sick of the character asassinations and the negativity. All most people care about is the issues and the candidates plans to deal with them. I couldn’t care less about who served on the same charitable board that Obama served on 10 years ago or that John McCain graduated in the bottom of his class and cheated on his disabled wife.
Let’s get serious about what’s most important..electing a president who can turn the country in the right direction. The rest is just crap.
It’s sad there are such a limited number of debates and that they are done under such controlled conditions.
It would be nice to see more debates in a real (not setup) townhall meeting format. Let the candidates talk to the people for real.
I thought the last debate was good only because of the moderator…he asked some tough questions and kept them pretty much on task.
I also think is was obvious who is the better candidate…the one who focused on his plans and for the most part stayed away from the negative accusations.
My thoughts exactly Mary. That is why I am voting for McCain. He knows what needs to be done and doesn’t have a trillion dollars of pie in the sky ideas.
Yeah debates…
Like there isn’t anything else in the news…
-Housing at an all time low…
-U.S. Rep. Tim Mahoney, embroiled in an adultery scandal and a tight race for re-election, admitted Friday to having at least two affairs…
-Obama Camp Alleges ‘Frenzied’ GOP Plot to Inflate Voter Fraud Claims…
-Evangelist Tony Alamo Arraigned on Sex Charges(hated homosexuals)…
-Bush: Government Not Moving to Nationalize Banks
…and many other stories…
Reg not to mention the scandal involving Joe the plumbers question. I understand that Obama has found his own plumber now. He is named Bob.
Off to Ok. Have a great day.
If by some miracle MCCain should win…I think you’ll be disappointed, OK. Unless you’re rich, that is.
Phillip,
I know this won’t be news to you and Rhonda, and I suppose a thread is coming our way tomorrow or Monday on what will probably prove to be an incendiary topic, but just in case.
By way of further ruminations of the post-Bush GOP and what it really means to be a Republican these days, Noonan’s comments should be good kindling.
Say what you will about Peggy Noonan, Reagan speechwriter and early 43 supporter — a fallen JFK Democrat who for two decades spoke for the soul of the GOP — this old broad consistently displays more political courage than any single male I can think of.
Oh, here’s the piece I’m talking about;
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122419210832542317.html
“Her supporters accuse her critics of snobbery: Maybe she’s not a big “egghead” but she has brilliant instincts and inner toughness. But what instincts? “I’m Joe Six-Pack”? She does not speak seriously but attempts to excite sensation—”palling around with terrorists.” If the Ayers case is a serious issue, treat it seriously. She is not as thoughtful or persuasive as Joe the Plumber, who in an extended cable interview Thursday made a better case for the Republican ticket than the Republican ticket has made. In the past two weeks she has spent her time throwing out tinny lines to crowds she doesn’t, really, understand. This is not a leader, this is a follower, and she follows what she imagines is the base, which is in fact a vast and broken-hearted thing whose pain she cannot, actually, imagine. She could reinspire and reinspirit; she chooses merely to excite. She doesn’t seem to understand the implications of her own thoughts.
No news conferences? Interviews now only with friendly journalists? You can’t be president or vice president and govern in that style, as a sequestered figure. This has been Mr. Bush’s style the past few years, and see where it got us. You must address America in its entirety, not as a sliver or a series of slivers but as a full and whole entity, a great nation trying to hold together. When you don’t, when you play only to your little piece, you contribute to its fracturing.
In the end the Palin candidacy is a symptom and expression of a new vulgarization in American politics. It’s no good, not for conservatism and not for the country. And yes, it is a mark against John McCain, against his judgment and idealism.”
—
Yes. Exactly.
Not rich, not poor ,now what. I don’t want anything from the politicians except for them to keep their hands out of my pocket, so that I can survive the rest of my years. I betcha, Saturday Night Live will have their highest vews of the season, with the real live Palin on. Of course the lib news media will find something to grunch about. I did watch all the debates. I’m for America not the One.
writerdog
You are wrong on this one. The truth is, if you watch, listen, or read the “polarizing”, honestly partisan opinions pieces you will know far more than you will ever learn from the standard CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, New York Times pap.
Listen to heated arguments, on both sides, then make up your mind.
I don’t like Olberman or O’Reilly, they are both populists who try to “ride the wave” of sentiment, as they see it.
Neither Olberman nor O’Reilly are smart enough, or gutsy enough, to actually promote a cause they might think is unpopular.
Even so, even a leftist populist or a conservative populist will have a better handle on what people might care about.
The reason we have so many different sources for our news, these days, is because the “old guard” media have failed, miserably, to do their jobs.
Part of that is YOUR fault, writer, yours and people like you.
“Politics” is, by definition, “polarizing” — “Division” under Roberts Rules, refers to a VOTE!
When politicians are NOT fighting, the public is really, really in trouble, because a deal is probably being cut outside of the public view.
Politics has become intensely personal because our MSM REFUSES to actually tell us the truth about issues or candidates.
Joe the Plumber has had more questions asked, of him, than William Ayers has ever had to deal with in this election.
No major media outlet has EVER truly explained Roe V. Wade and Doe V. Bolton, to the public. There is no, true, “trimester” framework, in the abortion laws of this country. The Bolton decision pretty much obliterates any distinction. Even Obama understood this, when Obama argued that babies born alive, during an abortion, should NOT be treated, because? — “Because it would undermine Roe V. Wade” Obama said!
However, our MSM REFUSES to explain issues to us.
We have HONEST “advocacy journalism” with Rush and Hanity and Olberman, honest in that they make no bones about what they believe.
We have DISHONEST “advocacy journalism” where nearly every MSM reporter is concerned. They are pushing an agenda, the public knows it, and this is why advertising revenue, audience numbers and circulation numbers are way, way down.
The media wanted Obama and McCain to be the respective nominees, in this election. The media was more biased this year than ever before.
However, in keeping the REAL Obama a secret, from the public, they have done the entire country a huge injustice.
Including Hillary Clinton and Obama.
Should Obama win, we will be treated with “special prosecutors” due to Rezco or the Chicago Machine and Cook County Machine and the governor of Illinois.
If Obama has the chance to pick the US Attorney for Northern Illinois, you can bet that Obama’s choice will have ethical problems. Obama MUST have a croney in this position, since Rezco is singing like a bird now. Chicago is ALREADY under court order, due to past corruption problems and convictions of Obama/Daley cronies.
The media should have told us about these things.
Every possible negative rumor about McCain or Palin has been “reported” by the press.
Not so with Obama or Biden.
So? Should Obama win, Obama will have a rough time explaining why Obama did NOT tell us this stuff, himself!
Also, when Obama DOES start banning guns, pushing to overturn the abortion restrictions in every state, raising taxes on everyone by letting the Bush tax cuts expire, and then tries to limit 1st Amendment rights?
Obama will tank, badly, as President, precisely BECAUSE the media hid the true Obama from the public, and the public will be shocked, when they get to see the REAL Obama, in action.
Mary
The terrorist William Ayers helped PAY Obama, when Obama was a “Community Organizer” for ACORN.
The terrorist William Ayers CREATED a seperate “charitable” board, the Chicago Annenburg Challenge, and placed Obama in CHARGE of that board. That organization ALSO gave huge sums of money to ACORN.
That “charitable” organization never gave a dime, directly, to the schools of Chicago.
William Ayers, the terrorist, does not think that we have a problem with math or english or science, in this country. William Ayers, instead, thinks that education should be a tool to brain wash kids in his anti-American, Marxist world view. William Ayers was in Venezuela, just a few years ago, praising the Marxist thug, Hugo Chavez, and his youth indoctrination programs!
Roughly 25% of Chicago teachers make more than $100,000 a year.
Chicago teachers spend LESS time, in the classroom, than teachers anywhere else in the country.
Chicago schools have one of the highest drop out rates in the country.
Chicago high school students have the highest homicide rates, in the country.
Where did all of this “education” funding go, that Obama handed out?
Where are the “results” in ANY of Obama’s education initiatives?
Obama is a dirty Chicago Machine politician. Obama finds funds, for his political groups, like ACORN. Those groups then help get Obama elected. Then, in his new position, Obama finds more money, to fund these radical groups.
The only “result” that matters, to Obama, is that Obama get elected to something.
Just look at the failed Chicago schools for proof of this.
“writerdog
You are wrong on this one.” — Franklin
———
I didn’t read further as the first line turns me off. It doesn’t ask anyone to look at different evidence, it starts with a conclusion.
Every opinion is as good and as useless as the next.
Do you mean to say writerdog holds a differing opinion and you disagree because you see it a different way? And, then, here’s why.
Mary
Obama has lied, repeatedly, about money in the past.
Obama said, frequently, that he wanted to use public financing, in this election.
Then Obama went back on his word!
Obama will raise taxes on those who work, so that Obama can give away “IRS WELFARE” or “tax refunds to people who don’t pay taxes”.
The public will be repulsed. If Obama wins, Obama will be a one term President.
linda
Writer doesn’t like the heated political debates that this country MUST have.
We are a center-right country.
Obama, if he wins, will win by keeping his extreme liberalism a secret.
Writer attacks those who try to engage in true policy debate. This is wrong-headed.
We NEED very heated, very specific policy debates, in this country.
We are in a financial mess due to “politically correct” mortgages. The media refuses to explain how Obama’s ACORN helped FORCE these bad mortgages on people.
Without proper information, we will REPEAT the same bad mistakes of the past, and our MSM is a complete failure, in getting information out to the public.
Writerdog attacks “new media” personalities who actually try to bring up uncomfortable subjects.
This is the wrong approach. We need to encourage MORE debate, of all types. We need to encourage MORE opinion and policy analysis, not less.
The truth, if told, would truly piss off the American people.
This is why liberals, in particular, want to limit the 1st Amendment.
Good lord Franklin. Want me to send you over some tissues so you can cry your sad eyes into? I hope I’m not so whiny and delusional when I’m 97 years old like you are.
Franklin
Posted October 18, 2008 at 9:45 am | Permalink
writerdog
You are wrong on this one. The truth is…
—
uh huh.
I’m reminded of the ACORN scandal you tried to work up, the Ayers scandal, the Obama is a closet “Moslem,” Obama’s birth certificate is fake, etc., etc. There is a list as long as my arm of the total crap you’ve written here just in the past 6 months.
You betcha.
I think Linda nailed the truth, along with Franklin’s “integrity,” to the virtual woodshed walls here at WEBlog.
Gail Collins writes about George W Bush below, but you could substitute
Franklin for GWB everywhere and what Gail wrote would still be true:
First of all, George W. Bush showed up on TV Friday morning to reassure the nation. What could possibly be worse?
Everybody knows that anything our president says is very likely wrong, and certainly won’t happen. If he announced: “I’m sending government agents to Spokane to arrest the looters,” we would expect that the officials would get lost, nobody would be arrested, and the looters probably never existed in the first place.
So hearts sunk throughout the nation when Bush appeared at a Chamber of Commerce gathering to say that the economy would recover.
“America is the most attractive destination for investors around the globe. America is the home of the most talented and enterprising and creative workers in the world,” said the president, who also insisted that “democratic capitalism remains the greatest system ever devised.”
Which translates into: all the money is going to Asia, nobody will ever get a job again and Karl Marx was right after all.
Bummer.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/18/opinion/18collins.html?hp
—
If there’s anybody who’s ever “wrong” here, odds are excellent it’s Franklin.
Who reads the garbage Franklin writes? Pure scroll over EVERY time.
mxyzptk
I could loan you some mouse grease.
I stocked up in anticipation of the rants and weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth surrouding Novemeber 4.
faramgrrl, you have any extra “diddly squat?”
And, McCain gave Letterman his biggest audience since 1995:
http://www.thrfeed.com/2008/10/mccain-gives-le.html
Nope Linda. When it comes to diddly, I have squat!
Oh, and happy donut day!
Actually, here it’s pancakes and bacon with fresh eggs day.
heheheheh
Pedant
Do you care to prove that anything I have said here is false?
I am guessing that you won’t, since you can’t.
Hey, I am not in charge of the McCain campaign, and I am not sure why he isn’t pushing some of these issues harder.
However, they will STILL be issues, even if Obama wins.
There is STILL a federal investigation of Rezco, and Obama will have some problems there.
There is STILL a lawsuit against Obama, on the COLB issue. If you recall, I have stated that it is Obama’s arrogance at issue on this one.
William Ayers IS a terrrorist and Ayers and Dohrn helped launch Obama’s career. Ayers MIGHT have even ghost-written Obama’s book! (Obama knows nothing about sailing, and Ayers does, Ayers and Obama make similar nautical references, in their writings.)
Everything I have brought up will still be in the mix, 4 years from now, if Obama wins.
Thanks ksfarmgrrl, but I’ll be as busy as a one legged ass kicker driving the wwwaaaaaaaambulance that week. Great pay & benefits…rewarding work!
“Thanks ksfarmgrrl, but I’ll be as busy as a one legged ass kicker driving the wwwaaaaaaaambulance that week.”
Does that require a CDL? Or can any ol’ librul do it?
I could use the extra work…
By the way, why isn’t Obama ahead by double digits?
Without Obama’s ACORN, Wright, Ayers, Rezco problems, Obama would be up by at least 10 points.
Does anyone here believe that this election will be anything other than very, very close?
Was that the first sign of resignation and acceptance from Paul? I forget where that falls in the stages of grief.
I think it’s the last one….
“Obama, if he wins, will win by keeping his extreme liberalism a secret”
So Paul, if Colin Powell endorses Obama does that make him an extreme liberal or an idiot in your view.
Hey Paul. Seriously, how’s your granddaughter?
I always worry about her when you are gone for any length of time from the blog.
“By the way, why isn’t Obama ahead by double digits?”
Two reasons: He is black and too many people are still buying the “Obama is a Muslim terrorist” lie constantlyspread by elements in the GOP.
Any librul but it takes nerves of steel. Many will jump out of the vehicle.
William Ayers PROBABLY ghost-wrote “Dreams” for Obama:
http://cashill.com/natl_general/did_bill_ayers_write_1.htm
dnftt
“PROPBABLY”
And who was that anti-Semitic right-winger who wrote Palin’s speech for her? I recall seeing the name shortly after the speech – perhaps one of our Googlers here will look it up for s.
So Paul – which is it with Powell? Ultra liberal or idiot.
KFG
Thanks for asking.
She is going to PUBLIC School, can you believe it?
Special Ed class, to be sure, but this is a kid that was released to hospice care, 5 years ago, from the hospital.
They told us she would never be able to sit up on her own.
Vertigo problems, she can’t walk without holding my hand, but she CAN walk with help.
Hey, I know it won’t change your vote, by Cindy McCain has a degree in special education, and raises millions for disabled kids.
Sarah Palin, of course, has taken up that cause, and the cause of Autism as well.
And, as a Grandfather, I must admit that I am still learning more every day.
I think those with “normal” kids are so affraid of these issues that they do not really learn much about them, until they have to. I must admit that is how I was, 6 years ago.
I think ALL children are normal. They are each unique but through years of working with children I’ve never found one I considered abnormal.
“Franklin” –
I know Jack Cashill. I’ve done hours of radio with Jack Cashill. Jack Cashill may be even nuttier than you.
Ben
Colin Powell is no more conservative than Joe Lieberman.
If Powell endorses Obama, Powell is probably looking for a cabinet post.
Endorsements don’t matter much.
Besides, you and the other “moveon” and “DailyKos” libs have been mad at Powell, over the WMD thing, anyway.
Funny how he has weight with you now that he might agree with you, again, on something!
True, quite a few Dems were pushing for war with Iraq, too, so that was always a phoney issue.
Ben
Again, my POINT is that Obama must hide who is really is, in order to win.
Liberals can NOT brag about their liberalism, and get elected.
What “mandate” will Obama have, if elected, if Obama has lied about everything to get there?
Oh well, Obama will, if elected, simply sign whatever the Dem Congress sends his way.
Tonight when Sarah Palin appears on “Saturday Night Live,” will the audience be larger than for any of the debates?
Will Sarah play herself? Will she “do” herself as well as Fey does?
Maybe Sarah will attempt to play Fey playing Sarah?
“Besides, you and the other “moveon” and “DailyKos” libs have been mad at Powell”
Since I read neither dailykos nor moveon I have to really laugh at Limbotomized dittoheads like you Paul.
As for the weight you false claim I give Powell – well, I simply consider the source. I mostly find the Powell endorsement ironic as I atch those who know Bush and McCain the best go over to the other side.
“What “mandate” will Obama have, if elected, if Obama has lied about everything to get there?”
Is that like your boy Bush lying about being a “uniter”?
monkey
you are among the “nuttiest” on this blog.
So, does it take one to know one?
Anyway, Cashill is not the ONLY person who thinks that Ayers was involved in ghost-writing, for Obama.
Obama has NO other published works, other than his two books. Obama took forever to publish the first one, and the publisher even wanted part of the advance back, at one time.
Then, he comes out with a book with very similar writing style, to that of Ayers?
And, Ayers has written several books, but Ayers does NOT write anything at all, under his real name, during the same time that Obama’s 2 books come out?
“ayers ghost writer obama” 22,700 hits on Yahoo Search.
It’s not like I made it up, it is a very real controversy.
Franklin
Posted October 18, 2008 at 11:37 am | Permalink
“ayers ghost writer obama” 22,700 hits on Yahoo Search.
It’s not like I made it up, it is a very real controversy
Looks like the Astro-turfers have been busy.
ben
“Astroturf” is a phrase invented by?
David Axelrod, Obama’s campaign manager.
Axelrod once “created” a “grass roots” group to lobby for higher utility rates, in Illinois.
It was later discovered that nearly 100% of the funding, for this “grass roots” group, came from? THE UTILITY COMPANY!
Good for him Doesn’t change my point abou your “controversy”
Speaking of Google hits …
” 1 – 10 of about 469,000 for McCain senile”
Results 1 – 10 of about 4,940,000 for McCain insane. (0.17 seconds)
See Paul – I can play on Google too.
Well, it’s been fun but the sunshine calls. Later …
Results 1 – 10 of about 89,000 for Obama ate a white baby. (0.19 seconds)
Why do you libs think a large number of hits is proof of anything?
Results 1 – 10 of about 2,690,000 for Obama skies on Tuesdays. (0.20 seconds)
Ridiculous
Results 1 – 10 of about 36,900 for McCain rubs one out on Air Force One. (0.24 seconds)
anti
in fairness, I started the search engine stuff here, not Ben.
However, I did so to prove, to Monkey and to Ben, that there was a controversy over Obama and Ayers, concerning Ayers, possibly, ghostwriting for Obama.
Franklin-
Probaby a bad method, don;t you think?
But, since the opposite was used
Results 1 – 10 of about 5,710,000 for obama insane
Google is your friend, well sorta
I would be interested in proof, even though nothing would make me happier than to see Obama lose. But, there are controversies like the one about us not going to the moon, but they are false.
“Franklin” went pretty quickly from “PROBABLY” to “possibly” on the “William Ayers ghostwrote Obama’s books.”
That’s a pretty close pivot for “Franklin.”
We know John S (for Senile) McCain the Third (for Shrub’s 3rd term) didn’t write his “auto”biographies. The only question, given how he’s flip-flopped on issues and his own stated principled integrity is, has McCoot read ‘em?
Mary Caruso said
“All most people care about is the issues and the candidates plans to deal with them. I couldn’t care less about who served on the same charitable board that Obama served on 10 years ago or that John McCain graduated in the bottom of his class and cheated on his disabled wife.
Let’s get serious about what’s most important..electing a president who can turn the country in the right direction. The rest is just crap.”
Mary, while I understand your sentiment, I disagree. Character IS the most important issue.
Even if your chosen candidate tells you how wondeful he or she is going to treat you , and how wonderful his plans are, or any thing else,
when it comes down to whethe or not they get it done, or even try, character counts. If they are liars, why believe anything else they say about the issues. Does it get too deep with false accusations and innuendo, absolutely. However, first and foremost, I want to know the character of my candidate. Which is why I will not sell my vote for whomever gives me my goodie package.
Vte “none of the above” in 2008
The real story
A lone McCain supporter at the rally said she too was convinced that the Republican nominee was finished. “McCain has lost,” said Deborah Barnhart, 48, who runs a landscaping business.
“He’s lost because the Messiah has spoken and we’re going to change the world. That’s all people want to hear after eight years of Bush.
And that is why Obama will win. And why HIllary Clinton is not the Decomcratic Nominee.
Monkey
You interpret my postings the wrong way.
I absolutely believe that Ayers was involved helping write Obama’s books.
How much? That is open to debate.
However, when I made clear that others were discussing the issue, besides myself? I had no right to put words in THEIR mouths.
Some think Ayers wrote the entire book.
Others think Ayers wrote parts of the book and then simply edited the rest.
We don’t know, for sure, and we might never know. However, when I reference what others are saying on the matter, it is better to hedge, since many are talking about it, but they do not all agree.
As for me? I see NO evidence that Obama has ever, really, written much of anything on his own.
I see strong similarities in Ayer’s writings and in Obama’s books.
little
EXACTLY!
Every good flim-flam artist is a better public speaker than George Bush or John McCain. (Or even Obama, for that matter.)
Is speaking ability, all by itself, the only factor that matters to these libs?
Having said that, McCain has done better than I expected, at the debates.
McCain did MUCH better than Obama, at the Al Smith dinner. McCain also did a good job on Letterman.
Even so? I wish we had Reagan, but we don’t.
Better an honest man who has trouble, at times, explaining himself — than a man who says whatever he thinks he has to say, to get elected!
And
There is NO sin, in ghost-writing or hiring a ghost-writer.
The problem is that this exposes another LIE on the part of Obama.
Obama says he had virtually nothing to do with Ayers, yet the evidence shows that Obama would not be running for President, today, without the help of Ayers, from the very beginning.
But, since Ayers and Dohrn are both terrorists, Obama must lie about the help Ayers and Dohrn have given to Obama.
Pall,
Mighty oaks from little ACORNs grow.
http://online.wsj.com/video/mccain-katrina-moment/3AB78382-2B06-4FF8-8FC3-BBEC1A9E1603.html
According to the WSJ, McCain’s feckless 9/24 response to Wall Street’s meltdown is evidence of his own “Katrina Dysfunction Syndrome,” which is named in honor of George W Bush’s response to Hurricane Katrina. McCain suspended his campaign, flew to DC, and allowed himself to be seen presiding over a circular GOP firing squad and not much else.
What is it with the GOP and planes? Bush, Larry Craig, McCain. These guys should stay away from airports, imo.
The WSJ reporter argues that Bush never recovered politically from Katrina — his approval ratings have been in the tank since — and that once infected, KDS is fatal to national politicans’ careers.
Interesting argument. I guess we’ll see in a couple weeks.
We will survive.
I think that this will be close.
McCain STILL has a very real shot.
And, if Obama wins?
No more “Bush fatigue” —
No more “McCain fatigue” —
Conservatives will be united in “I told you so” mode.
Obama will break every campaign promise, in his first few months in office.
Ethical problems will start blowing up, among many of Obama’s assciates.
Hillary, under Bill, had a Democrat Congress and could not get her health reform through Congress, remember?
More than a few Democrats, in Congress, already know that they will have to distance themselves from Obama.
“(fill in the blank) voted with Obama 95% if the time!) will be the most popular Republican ad, 2 years from now.
Will we produce more domestic energy?
Will taxes go up or down?
Will welfare benefits go up or down?
Will the NRA be proven correct?
Will the prolifers be proven correct?
An Obama win will be bad for the country, but very, very good for the Republican Party, in the long run.
Still, I put my country first and I will vote for McCain.
Pedant – all the more interesting since it comes from the uber-conservative WSJ.
A comment about polls depressing voter turnout. That cuts both ways – the depressed not going out and ’tilting at windmills’ and the overconfident not taking the trouble. And, I would say the latter is more likely given the demographics and the hstory of low turnout among certain groups.
Anti, lj – I agree 100% that lots of google hits means nothing. That was exactly my point.
Results 1 – 10 of about 333,000 for moon green cheese
Results 1 – 10 of about 200,000 for moon landing fake. (0.26 seconds)
lets put this another way, Kansas Democrats:
Your “up and comming” Dem candidates will do better, in 2 years, if McCain wins.
There is virtually NO chance that the Dems will pick up any Kansas Congressional seats, in 2 years or 4 years, if Obama wins.
Also, the Brownback’s shot at Cedar Crest looks MUCH better, with Obama in the White House.
Republicans will have NOBODY to apologize for.
Republicans will NOT have to worry about “Gentleman John” McCain telling us what we can and can not say.
Again, I want McCain to win, even though I believe that McCain getting re-elected, in 4 years, will be even tougher to pull off.
But Obama in the White House will be the best recruiting tool and the best fund-raising tool the Republicans have ever had.
Obama will not “triangulate” like the Clintons.
Obama will try to silence the opposition, and his approach will backfire, badly.
Obama will not be able to vote “present” anymore. He will have a very real record, and the voters will not like the real Obama anywhere near as much as the fake Obama they were sold on, in this election.
search engines do prove that some issues are in the public arena, for debate.
That was my point.
The point stands.
Results 1 – 10 of about 4,430,000 for bush apocalypse. (0.20 seconds)
Results 1 – 10 of about 121,000,000 for mccain bush. (0.22 seconds)
Man, that’s a lot of connectivity between Bush and McCain.
Results 1 – 10 of about 3,550,000 for obama ayers. (0.21 seconds)
NOT EVEN CLOSE!
So more concerned about Bush and the Apocalypse then concerned about Obama/Ayers.
No wonder the Republicans are failing and flailing.
Paul – and your connection is only about 10% as significant as moon/green cheese.
Yes – you point that any idiocy can get hits stands. And still means nothing.
Results 1 – 10 of about 131,000 for sarah palin kate beckinsle. (0.19 seconds)
Kate Beckinsale shoots down speculation that she’s gunning for the role of Sarah Palin during the Nothing But The Truth premiere held at Roy Thomson Hall during the Toronto International Film Festival.
Results 1 – 10 of about 3,210,000 for mccain alien. (0.18 seconds)
Results 1 – 10 of about 3,890,000 for obama alien. (0.17 seconds)
I’m surprised the results aren’t higher for Obama/alien. Many think he’s the Saviour from Sirius. Darn tootin’!
Everything paulie writes about Obama is based solely on speculation, and nothing more. From Ayers to ACORN, paulie has quoted nothing but speculative fiction, posted by right-wing republicans, whose sole purpose is to keep a black man out of the White House.
From his repeated ramblings about Democrats being the party solely responsible for the credit meltdown, to Obama being a non-American and a Muslim, paulie has nothing factual to add to any intelligent discussion of this Presidential election. Talk about your basic soapbox nutcase, paulie fills the bill to a “T”. Paid shill, anyone?
These videos of McCain/Palin voters speak for themselves –
http://thepennsylvaniaprogressive.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=714
Wow, talk about head-in-the-sand politics. MH, if those are the people voting for McCain, we’re in real trouble. But put that together with the “evolution” cartoon . . . ya get the feeling some are still stuck back in the cro-magnum era.
#
mxyzptlk
Posted October 18, 2008 at 1:09 pm | Permalink
I’m surprised the results aren’t higher for Obama/alien. Many think he’s the Saviour from Sirius. Darn tootin’!
========================================================
Actually, Obama was placed here by the FSM to make sure the republicans show their true, Christian faces. Seems to be working.
http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/12895
JM,
He’s an FSM Angel? You mean Obama’s Italian? Funny, he doesn’t look Italian!
Barry Goldwater predicted his Republican Party had lost its way:
“Religious factions will go on imposing their will on others unless the decent people connected to them recognize that religion has no place in public policy. They must learn to make their views known without trying to make their views the only alternatives.”
“There is too wide and complex a range of opinion for us to reach a national consensus on issues of morality.”
Our founders were wise men and knew this. It will take a few years in exile for the Republican Party to relearn it.
Interesting “favorable” graphs of the 3 debates,
‘Obama Viewed as Winner of Third Debate’
http://www.gallup.com/poll/111256/Obama-Viewed-Winner-Third-Debate.aspx
http://bjbrownsblog.blogspot.com/2008/10/must-see-tv.html
Forget the debates, watch Meet the Press tomorrow am
ACORN — The Recurring Urban Legend
http://www.truthout.org/article/101808A
Jed
Posted October 18, 2008 at 3:09 pm | Permalink
JM,
He’s an FSM Angel? You mean Obama’s Italian? Funny, he doesn’t look Italian!
That explains everything! The noodles of the FSM gently bring all of us together – and that includes Muslims and Christians. So – Paul’s claim that Obama is Muslim along with the reality that he is Christian can actually make a certain amount of sense.
Results 1 – 10 of about 136,000 for obama flying spaghetti monster
ACORN — The Recurring Urban Legend” MonkeyHawk
From the link MonkeyHawk provided:
“You see, the ACORN “election fraud” story is one of those urban legends, like fake moon landings and alligators in the sewers, and it appears three or four weeks before every recent national election with the regularity of the swallows returning to Capistrano.”
“ACORN has registered 1.3 million voters and maintains that in virtually every instance it is ACORN that has reported the incidents of fraud.”
“Arrests have been made, as well they should be.”
“Add to this the simple fact that registration fraud is not election fraud.”
And, that in my opinion wraps up the ACORN news completely!
I celebrate each headline that found REGISTRATIONS that were illegal! They weren’t added to the voter rolls! Let’s keep finding them, and keep ensuring that each eligible American has one vote, that on November 5th we have a newly-elected president and most people think he was elected fairly, that the election was for the most part well done.
And then move on to our country’s many challenges!
I’d like to see the Wichita Eagle do a story with Bill Gale on this topic. Just what ARE the difficulties on getting good complete and clean voter rolls? And what are thedifficulties involved in getting a good accurate count?
An interesting point to be made about ACORN is every card filled out has to be turned in, no matter what name is on it. That’s a federal law. That the ones filled out by idiots are being caught shows the system works.
Of a greater concern is the Republican party, in Ohio, trying to do the same thing they did in 2004, but are being denied by the court system. Thank God justice rules in this one.
Then there’s this. Talk about out and out lying:
SACRAMENTO — Dozens of newly minted Republican voters say they were duped into joining the party by a GOP contractor with a trail of fraud complaints stretching across the country.
Voters contacted by The Times said they were tricked into switching parties while signing what they believed were petitions for tougher penalties against child molesters. Some said they were told that they had to become Republicans to sign the petition, contrary to California initiative law. Others had no idea their registration was being changed.
“I am not a Republican,” insisted Karen Ashcraft, 47, a pet-clinic manager and former Democrat from Ventura who said she was duped by a signature gatherer into joining the GOP. “I certainly . . . won’t sign anything in front of a grocery store ever again.”
It is a bait-and-switch scheme familiar to election experts. The firm hired by the California Republican Party — a small company called Young Political Majors, or YPM, which operates in several states — has been accused of using the tactic across the country.
Election officials and lawmakers have launched investigations into the activities of YPM workers in Florida and Massachusetts. In Arizona, the firm was recently a defendant in a civil rights lawsuit. Prosecutors in Los Angeles and Ventura counties say they are investigating complaints about the company.
The firm, which a Republican Party spokesman said is paid $7 to $12 for each registration it secures, has denied any wrongdoing and says it has never been charged with a crime.
The 70,000 voters YPM has registered for the Republican Party this year will help combat the public perception that it is struggling amid Democratic gains nationally, give a boost to fundraising efforts and bolster member support for party leaders, political strategists from both parties say.
ACORN is as criminal organization.
ACORN is also a left leaning organization that should NOT receive any taxpayer funding, but they do.
ACORN ALSO receives huge amounts of funding from Democrat candidates, including Obama, who has given ACORN nearly $1 Million this year, alone!
ACORN protests at banks, to force banks into risky loans.
ACORN also is very active in fraudulent voter registration.
Why is voter registration fraud directly linked to voter fraud?
When the polls close, and you know that “your” candidate is down by 100 votes, wouldn’t it be easy to “vote” 100 of the surplus, “fake voters” that don’t even really exist, if you are a crooked election worker?
It is harder to do, if the crooked poll workers do not have a ready pool of phoney “voters” to draw from.
Also, Ben, Kansas doesn’t see that much ACORN activity. ACORN concentrates in the battle ground states. — However, I was in KC MO last week, and ACORN is DEFINATELY in the news, in KC, for screwing up the works like they do everywhere they go!
Like the sound of this ACORN.
It seems to turn the cons into rabid squirrels.
I might send them a donation or maybe even join up!
“This year alone ACORN has registered 1,315,037 voters.
Although the organization prides itself for its registration efforts, it also has a long history of scandal. In the state of Missouri in 1986, 12 ACORN members were convicted of voter fraud. But that case was not an isolated incident in the state. In December 2004, in St. Louis, six volunteers pleaded guilty of dozens of election law violations for filling out registration cards with names of dead people and other bogus information. Authorities launched an earlier investigation after noticing that among the new voters was longtime St. Louis alderman Albert “Red” Villa, who died in 1990. The volunteers worked for “Operation Big Vote” — a branch of ACORN — in St. Louis.
On February 10, 2005, Nonaresa Montgomery, a paid worker who ran Operation Big Vote during the run-up to the 2001 mayoral primary, was found guilty of vote fraud. Montgomery hired about 30 workers to do fraudulent voter-registration canvassing. Instead of knocking on doors, the volunteers sat at a St. Louis fast food restaurant and wrote out names and information from an outdated voter list. About 1,500 fraudulent voter registration cards were turned in.
In October 2006, St. Louis election officials discovered at least 1,492 “potentially fraudulent” voter registration cards. They were all turned in by ACORN volunteers.
In November 2006, 20,000 to 35,000 questionable voter registration forms were turned in by ACORN officials in Missouri. Most all of these were from St. Louis and Kansas City areas, where ACORN purportedly sought to help empower the “disenfranchised” minorities living there. But the ACORN workers weren’t just told to register new voters. The workers admitted on camera that they were coached to tell registrants to vote for Democrat Claire McCaskill.
In 2007, in Kansas City, Missouri, four ACORN employees were indicted for fraud. In April of this year eight ACORN employees in St. Louis city and county pleaded guilty to federal election fraud for submitting bogus voter registrations.
And, that was just Missouri. —
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/the-complete-guide-to-acorn-voter-fraud/
“This year there have been several accusations of fraud against ACORN. Over a dozen states are investigating the organization already. Here is a complete list of the ongoing investigations:
North Carolina — State Board of Elections officials have found at least 100 voter registration forms with the same names over and over again. The forms were turned in by ACORN. Officials sent about 30 applications to the state Board of Elections for possible fraud investigation.
Ohio — The New York Post reported that a Cleveland man said he was given cash and cigarettes by aggressive ACORN activists in exchange for registering an astonishing 72 times. The complaints have sparked an investigation by election officials into the organization, whose political wing has supported Barack Obama. Witnesses have already been subpoenaed to testify against the organization.
Nevada — Authorities raided the headquarters of the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now on Tuesday October 7, 2008, after a month-long investigation. The fraudulent voter registrations included the Dallas Cowboys starting line-up.
Indiana — More than 2,000 voter registration forms filed in northern Indiana’s Lake County filled out by ACORN employees turned out to be bogus. Officials also stopped processing a stack of about 5,000 applications delivered just before the October 6 registration deadline after the first 2,100 turned out to be phony.
Connecticut — Officials are looking into a complaint alleging ACORN submitted fraudulent voter registration cards in Bridgeport. In one instance, an official said a card was filled out for a 7-year-old girl, whose age was listed as 27. 8,000 cards were submitted in Bridgeport.
Missouri — The Kansas City election board is reporting 100 duplicate applications and 280 with fake information. Acorn officials agreed that at least 4% of their registrations were bogus. Governor Matt Blunt condemned the attempts by ACORN to commit voter fraud.
Pennsylvania — Officials are investigating suspicious or incomplete registration forms submitted by ACORN. 252,595 voter registrations were submitted in Philadelphia. Remarkably, 57,435 were rejected — most of them submitted by ACORN.
Wisconsin — In Milwaukee ACORN improperly used felons as registration workers. Additionally, its workers are among 49 cases of bad registrations sent to authorities for possible charges, as first reported by the Journal Sentinel.
Florida — The Pinellas County Elections supervisor says his office has received around 35 voter registrations that appear to be bogus. There is also a question of 30,000 felons who are registered illegally to vote. Their connections with ACORN are not yet clear.
Texas — Of the 30,000 registration cards ACORN turned in, Harris County tax assessor Paul Bettencourt says just more than 20,000 are valid. And just look at some of the places ACORN was finding those voters. A church just next door is the address for around 150 people. More than 250 people claim a homeless outreach center as their home address. Some listed a county mental health facility as their home and one person even wrote down the Harris County jail at the sheriff’s office.
Michigan — ACORN in Detroit is being investigated after several municipal clerks reported fraudulent and duplicate voter registration applications coming through. The clerk interviewed said the fraud appears to be widespread.
New Mexico – The Bernalillo County clerk has notified prosecutors that some 1,100 fraudulent voter registration cards were turned in by ACORN.
That’s not all. So far this year at least 14 states have started investigations against ACORN. Talk about a culture of corruption. It is so bad that Representatives of Congress have asked for the Justice Department to investigate, and GOP presidential candidate John McCain is bringing it up in his stump speeches. The Obama camp is stealthily altering its “Fight the Smears” website to distance themselves from the organization — quite a challenge considering how close their candidate’s association has been with the group.
The liberal vs. conservative, voter fraud vs. voter intimidation debate will no doubt continue after this election. But this year, with the assistance of scandal-plagued ACORN, it appears that — so far — the voter fraud side is winning.”
THE crowning example of a stolen election was bush taking the Presidency via Supreme court fiat in 2000.
I guess big, bad ACORN couldn’t stop that huh?
There will be no more stolen elections. And those who work to suppress the vote will continue to be exposed and marginalized.
These videos of McCain/Palin voters speak for themselves –
What I noticed the most in the 4 videos was that when people were presented with facts, they didn’t know how to answer and often hurried away. It wasn’t anger on their faces or even stubborn determination to believe what they choose to believe, but confusion. Basically, they have nothing but soundbytes, with no substance behind them. Even the simple facts, such as Ayers first name, escaped them. When asked what what the acronym ACORN stands for, they don’t have a clue.
Oh, well, so goes half of half of the country…
I’m glad that econ’s nic is at the top of his posts, and that I’ve got a scroll wheel on the mouse.
We all know the truth of what Rove said, “Half of Americans are below average,” but it sure seems those 24 percenters ALL fall in the bottom 24%. Maybe that explains why they’re still fooled?
I’m going to pop some popcorn and settle in for SNL. I’m still wondering whether Palin will attempt to play herself or play Fey playing Palin… Should be fun anyway. Palin is good for laughs! Proves that everyone is good for something even it’s as a bad example.
cosmos, ksfarmgrrl said she has been saving up on scroll grease, so don’t worry about running out. She doesn’t have any diddly squat tho. I’m not sure where we’re gonna find any…
BJ
Get real would you? Not a single respectable autority believes that Gore could possibly have won, in Florida.
And, regardless of that count of actual votes, the fact remains that tens of thousands of Florida Panhandle REPUBLICAN votes, WERE supressed by the news media falsely giving Florida to Gore. The Panhandle, in a different time zone, threw in the towel at that bogus announcement. Even with that media mistake, Bush STILL won!
Is it your position that Democrat crimes are “ok” since, in your twisted mind, you still think Gore “won” in Florida?
Where does it stop? If we do not respect the election process, we might as well live in a dictatorship.
” Not a single respectable autority ”
And since when are YOU any sort of credible expert on…anything?
I’d love to stay and play.
But it’s time for lil’ Sarah Palin’s SNL nosedive.
By the way libs, several DEMOCRAT election officials are complaining about ACORN.
ACORN helped Obama steal the election from Clinton.
BJ
NAME someone other than yourself, who believes that Gore won in Florida.
“When the polls close, and you know that “your” candidate is down by 100 votes, wouldn’t it be easy to “vote” 100 of the surplus, “fake voters” that don’t even really exist, if you are a crooked election worker?”
It’s even easier if you are Diebold and counting the “ballots”.
Paul – I am well aware that ACORN is more active elsewhere – as you know I was a Chicago-area Republican before moving to Kansas. My point with Gale was more for general background. I am sure that as a professional he communicates with his profassional colleagues elsewhere.
I don’t have the names for 50 + million people there Franklnpaulie.
bush stole it. An entire new generation is growing up knowing it.
#
Franklin
Posted October 18, 2008 at 10:30 pm | Permalink
By the way libs, several DEMOCRAT election officials are complaining about ACORN.
ACORN helped Obama steal the election from Clinton.
========================================================
PROVE IT!
“ACORN helped Obama steal the election from Clinton.”
Now THAT is even funnier that Paul’s usual jokes!
Are you sure Paul isn’t doing an SNL parody?
Palin is good for laughs!
Too bad there was nothing to laugh about on her SNL visit. As usual, except for the recent opening skits and the Weekend Update news skits, SNL is found lacking. Major dumb and a waste of time. The last 30 minutes included one song and two poor skits. The rest was commercials that were as dumb as the SNL skits.
Someone tell Lorne to find some new writers. The current ones can’t even definte funny.
Palin’s SNL stunt was a flat failure.
She is not as intelligent as Tina Fey and Fey gave her her own back with “OOOkay Byeee”
Earlier today, Franklin posted the following: “The terrorist William Ayres created a separate “charitable” board, the Chicago Annenberg Challenge and placed Obama in charge of that board…”
Franklin, that creation was done by the millionaire Republican Annenberg family. Mrs. Annenberg asked Obama to be the chairman of that board. She also appointed Ayres to be a board member.
President Reagan appointed one of the Annenberg’s to be ambassador to Great Britain while he was in office.
Thank you Jayne…. Good to see you call Franklin out for his continuing LYING about the real facts about Obama…. This is just one of a long string of mis-direction, and intentional mis-representation of Obama’s past, or his present policies….
Again, thanks!!
“Where does it stop? If we do not respect the election process, we might as well live in a dictatorship.”
Are you including your OWN LIES about Obama??
Hmmmm???
Hey Franklin — Let’s see your ditzy spin on how BAD McCain screwed up the Joe Plumber FACTS???
janeeyre
Posted October 19, 2008 at 12:19 am | Permalink
Earlier today, Franklin posted the following: “The terrorist William Ayres created a separate “charitable” board, the Chicago Annenberg Challenge and placed Obama in charge of that board…”
=================================================
That means Franklin is telling us all that the Annenberg’s were palling around with terrorists —- LOL And REAGAN appointed people hanging around with terrorists, as ambassadors to England!!! ROFLMAO!!!
Franklin, you been HAD on this thread!!
BJ
On this subject, you are clearly a loon.
NOBODY with any authority at all thinks that Gore won, in Florida.
Nobody in the media agrees with you.
Nobody with any real legal knowledge agrees with you.
Also, the fact that the MSM called the election WAY too early, in Florida, DID supress Republican votes, in the Panhandle area.
You need to get over yourself. You were disappointed. So what?
Grow up.
Gore lost.
Ben
As a former resident of Chicago, you should know that Obama has been part of the dirty Cook County Stroger machine and part of the dirty Chicago machine.
“Good government” Democrats and Republicans came together to back a true “reform” slate of candidates.
Obama ENDORSED and worked for, and helped raise money for: The old-guard, corrupt, machine backed candidates.
Obama is dirty.
JM
You are lazy, as usual.
Many of the election officials who are the most upset with ACORN happen to be Democrats, many of those officials realize that Obama and ACORN were pulling this stuff in the primary, against Clinton.
Read a few of the news stories and you will find some election-officials, who are Democrats, who are trying hard to distance themselves from ACORN.
In fact, I have already posted links here that quote Democrats upset with ACORN.
(Obama is “distancing” himself, as well, but he is not really upset the ACORN is breaking the law, only that ACORN got caught so many times. Obama has given ACORN millions of dollars, over the years. ACORN helped finance Obama, when Obama was a “Community Organizer”.)
Jan
You are full of it.
YOu are just flat wrong.
The Chicago Annenberg Challenge was NOT controlled by the seperate Annenberg Foundation Board.
The Chicago Annenberg Challenge was controlled by terrorist William Ayers. Ayers personally recruited most of the board members, for the CAC. Their votes were clearly in Ayers pocket.
By the way, the “schools” initiative, funded by the Chicago Annenberg Challenge, which was RUN by Obama, had an office right down the hall from terrorist William Ayers!
As posted previously:
“This Chicago Annenberg Challenge website from 2002 shows the total amount of funds given to Bill Ayers’ Small Schools Workshop from 1995 to 2001. The amount is not the $175K I had reported earlier. According to this page, the total given under Barack Obama’s direct supervision was $1,056,162. Adding that amount to the money given by the Joyce Foundation and Woods Fund during Obama’s tenure brings the grand total to $1,968,718. Just shy of two million dollars! That’s a lot of scratch, to put it bluntly. And don’t forget, this doesn’t count the 3/4 million that went to John Ayers during the same time period.
Now here’s the second and bigger break, again big hat tip to Morgen for his work on this…
Bill Ayers and Barack Obama shared an office. Ayers’ Small Schools Workshop, the one Obama directed all that money too is located at 115 S. Sangamon Street, Chicago, Illinois 60607 [Note the link is to a year 2000 version of their website]. Here’s a screengrab from the website’s footer:
http://www.verumserum.com/?p=2907
In 1998, the address for the Chicago Annenberg Challenge, where Obama presumably worked, was 115 S. Sangamon Street, Chicago, Illinios 60607. Here’s a copy of their 1998 tax return with that address:
(see link, above)
The CAC moved to a new address sometime in 1999 or 2000, but the shared office probably persisted for at least three years. I can’t say for sure because 1998 is the earliest tax information available online. [Correction: I can say for sure that they shared the same building for the years 1995-1998. Here is a 1995 progress report from the CAC with the same address.]
Now remember, the NY Times described Obama and Ayers as having “crossed paths.” Ben LaBolt, Obama’s spokesman said:
Mr. LaBolt said the men first met in 1995 through the education project, the Chicago Annenberg Challenge, and have encountered each other occasionally in public life or in the neighborhood.
I’m going to suggest that two guys working in the same building for a period of years probably crossed paths pretty often. For all we know, they had lunch together on a daily basis. Maybe, in an effort at conservation, they were even carpool buddies. After all, Ayers is a guy from Obama’s neighborhood.
Would someone at the Times like to contact Mr. LaBolt for a follow-up?
Update: Made the correction above. Also, Obama was a state senator from 1996-2004. However, he still likely spent some significant time at the Sangamon street address, especially in 1995. But even after his election he would presumably be working on his CAC duties at the Sangamon office, not from some other location.
According to this letter dated 1995, Obama’s office was on the 3rd floor:
(see link, above)
And according to this memo dated 1996, Small Schools Workshop was also on the 3rd floor:
(see link, above)
Do you think maybe Obama and Bill Ayers ran into each other once in a while?”
Jan
You do realize that Theresa Heinze-Kerry was married to a Republican prior to getting married to John Kerry, don’t you?
The Annenberg foundation is FAR more liberal, today, than it was while Reagan was president.
Besides, the CAC or Chicago Annenberg Challenge was a spin off, completely out of the control of the original Annenberg Board, accept for the name and the “grant” funding that terrorist William Ayers obtained for Obama’s only executive position in his life.
Chas
I have not lied about Obama.
Prove that I have lied, or admit that you just lied.
and — let us not forget:
Obama’s “Chicago Annenberg Challenge” was a complete failure, as far as educating kids is concerned.
Ayers and Obama indoctrinated kids to be political activists.
Ayers and Obama did not care about grades or graduation or college admission.
“Franklin” –
Wile E. Coyote was less obsessed and more effective.
This is taken from a Wall Street Journal story, though I found it reprinted in another story:
“Between 1995 and 1999, Obama led the CAC, which was founded by Ayers, and remained on the board until 2001.
“One unsettled question is how Mr. Obama, a former community organizer fresh out of law school, could vault to the top of a new foundation?” Kurtz writes. “In response to my questions, the Obama campaign issued a statement saying that Mr. Ayers had nothing to do with Obama’s ‘recruitment’ to the board. The statement says Deborah Leff and Patricia Albjerg Graham (presidents of other foundations) recruited him. Yet the archives show that, along with Ms. Leff and Ms. Graham, Mr. Ayers was one of a working group of five who assembled the initial board in 1994. Mr. Ayers founded CAC and was its guiding spirit. No one would have been appointed the CAC chairman without his approval.”
The CAC’s agenda flowed from Ayers’s educational philosophy, says Kurtz, which called for infusing students and their parents with a radical political commitment, and which downplayed achievement tests in favor of activism.
“CAC translated Mr. Ayers’s radicalism into practice. Instead of funding schools directly, it required schools to affiliate with ‘external partners,’ which actually got the money. Proposals from groups focused on math/science achievement were turned down. Instead CAC disbursed money through various far-left community organizers, such as the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (or Acorn).”
According to Kurtz, Obama once conducted “leadership training” seminars with Acorn, and Acorn members also served as volunteers in Obama’s early campaigns. External partners like the South Shore African Village Collaborative and the Dual Language Exchange focused more on political consciousness, Afrocentricity and bilingualism than traditional education. CAC’s in-house evaluators comprehensively studied the effects of its grants on the test scores of Chicago public-school students. They found no evidence of educational improvement.
In his book The Audacity of Hope, Obama paints some of his Democratic contenders — quite obviously suggesting the Clintons — as leftovers from the ’60s, still brooding about old enemies in the college cafeteria. He has moved on, he claims. But Obama’s friendship with Ayers indicates that he has not. Indeed, the Clintons were just naïve coat carriers and fellow travelers, like the millions of others of their generation, smoking dope and chanting and shouting at Grant Park in August 1968 and surging ahead with the horde when Abbie Hoffman held up the sign to demand, “Chicks up front!” as the Chicago police came on them with tear gas and rosewood night sticks, to insure that the blood in the morning newscast would be on the sympathetic faces of women.”
http://pundits.thehill.com/2008/09/24/obama-and-bill-ayers-together-from-the-beginning/
Chas and jan, you are both wrong.
This is why McCain is losing the election, Republicans think the top story is William Ayers, for something he did 40 years ago, when Obama was eight. Never mind that Ayers didn’t kill anyone unlike McCain and the numerous sailors on the USS Forrestal, or while he was a member of the board of a fascist organization.
MP,
Near as I’ve been able to find out for sure, the only bombing Ayers actually participated in was the blowing up of a statue honoring the Chicago Police for their corruption and brutality during the Haymarket Police Riot in 1886.
Franklin
Posted October 19, 2008 at 4:43 am | Permalink
Ben
As a former resident of Chicago, you should know that Obama has been part of the dirty Cook County Stroger machine and part of the dirty Chicago machine.
Actually Paul – he challenged that machine. As a collar-county Republican often worked with the ‘outcast’ Democrats in the City.
There is an old joke in Chicago: Where do they put the Reform Democrats in the St. Patrck Day Parade? Behind the horses – with brooms.
On the Powell endorsement. It obviously does not impact people like me; however it WILL impact some fence-sitters. Let us consider an analogy in the other direction:
What would be the impact if Bill Richardson endorsed McCain? I would go “WHOA!” Or if Clinton endorsed McCain – people like BlueJay might be swayed. That is what the Powell endorsement does in Republican or independent circles.
The Powell endorsement.
“Franklinpualie” must be burning Powell in effigy as we speak!
Gore won in 2000 “Franklin”. I know it. You know it. EVEN bush knows it. Certainly history will know it.
BlueJay – maybe ACORN somehow FORCED Powell to endorse Obama. Threatened to knee-cap him perhaps?
Ben I made a promise this morning to post without the names and negativity because I think the issues are too important to ignore or sweep under the rug. If you, Jed and Bluejay really think Ayers is an innocent victim of over zealous newsmen then defend him. But don’t make the issue that he wasn’t convicted or wasn’t guilty. He said ‘Guilty as hell, free as a bird, What a great country’. He ground the American flag under his feet for the cover of his book. He said ‘I only regret that I didn’t go more’.
As for Colin Powell – I respect who he is but when you listen to his argument in it’s entirety you know that his wasn’t a principled endorsement but more an opinion that made for other reasons. My opinion only. I don’t want to bring race into the election but it is already there when 95% of blacks say they will be voting for Obama.
BlueJay
Posted October 19, 2008 at 10:57 am | Permalink
The Powell endorsement.
“Franklinpualie” must be burning Powell in effigy as we speak!
Gore won in 2000 “Franklin”. I know it. You know it. EVEN bush knows it. Certainly history will know it.
————
Bluejay as long as you hang onto this fairy tale your statements have no impact on rational discourse.
okob – I have not defended Ayers or the Weather Underground. In fact, as I noted, because of where I was during those years I could have been at risk. If memory serves (after all these years) a math building at U Wisconsin was bombed. I was in a chemistry building at UCLA.
Fair enough.
The interesting thing is that it is highlylikely our paths crossed when I was in Illinois. However, I do not specifically recall meeting Ayers.
Similarly my path may have crossed with Hillary Rodham in the 60s – we were at Wellesley at the same time.
okie
I do not seek reflection in your eyes.
I don’t like how far down I’d have to look.