The 154-page legal filing by George Tiller’s attorneys is meant to persuade a judge to dismiss 19 misdemeanor charges against the Wichita abortion provider. Its point of view is strong and some of its claims so shocking as to be hard to believe, such as that former Attorney General Phill Kline lied to judges and had his investigators give false information in affidavits. And it’s accurate, as Operation Rescue’s spokeswoman argues, that the current criminal case was filed by former Attorney General Paul Morrison, not by Kline.
Still, it’s remarkable to learn of the claim, based on internal memos, that Kline tried to obtain search warrants and have armed officers raid abortion clinics, by force if necessary, to seize patient records, employee files and license plate numbers of cars in the clinics’ parking lots. And that it reportedly took two years for Kline investigators to begin looking into records of live births to underage girls, though he’d said all along that his primary concern was unreported sexual abuse. The filing also details more about Kline’s reported copying, mailing and other mishandling of women’s medical records.
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46 Comments
for some reason the first link in this doesn’t work.
We kept telling you people all along this was a witchhunt. For those who are antis- they know it and don’t care. For moderates, they’ve figured it out loud and clear in the last elections. Its the ones who know how damaging and dangerous what Kline has been doing to keep this front and center.
Moderates ask yourselves…whose side would Palin and McSame be on?
This information is from a legal document that Tiller’s attorney’s filed. This information has not been proved. Tiller’s attorney’s are continuing to try their case by any means, including in the press.
If this is true, why did Morrison even file the 19 charges? Why has Six continued? Surely as they proceeded with their own investigations some of this “truth” would have come to light and made them question the evidence.
If Tiller is unable to continue his lucrative business, his attorneys as well as many Kansas political campaigns will have lost a large chunk of their financial backing.
Kline really needs to get laid and get a life. If he did that, if he COULD do that, he wouldn’t be obsessed with how much everybody else is getting.
Kline is as crazy as Cooter Brown!! He was brought about by Johnson County ultra-Conservative nuts. Thank heaven they got him back and thank heaven he is leaving.
Sigh… The Eagle will give voice to anything negative about Phill Kline.
But its likely all hyperbole. Just lawyers trying to save their client’s sorry a$$.
Naturally he’d go in with guns drawn. Being “pro-life” he’d hope for some collateral damage. What do you expect from a kook who aligns himself with the criminal terrorist organization Operation Rescue?
Let’s see, the posts on this thread will go something like this:
If you are pro-life, you will believe Kline
If you are not pro-life, you will believe Tiller.
The above thread intro by Rhonda contained nothing but accusations from a group of attorneys whose credibility is secondary to keeping their client out of Jail.
I am alway amazed RFL how some people think that an opinion editorial is factual. ‘I read it in the Eagle. It must be right.’ I can hear that conversation now.
Accusations, nothing more. Tiller alleges that…let’s wait until facts are in evidence.
There’s nothing here, move along children.
I’m not sure what the complaint is against the Eagle on this article. They make it clear that these are simply allegations being made by Tiller’s attorneys. They further point out that the charges pending were filed by Morrison. So what’s the beef against the eagle?
Did you take that buyout, Rhonda? Bankruptcy can be so rough on the hired help.
Regular
Posted September 17, 2008 at 9:21 am | Permalink
Accusations, nothing more. Tiller alleges that…let’s wait until facts are in evidence.
There’s nothing here, move along children.
—
Seems to me the same could be said about Kline’s allegations are accusations, nothing more. Let’s wait until all the facts are in evidence.
Nothing new here Regular, go back to posting your usual partisan BS.
#
mom
Posted September 17, 2008 at 11:03 am | Permalink
Regular
Posted September 17, 2008 at 9:21 am | Permalink
Accusations, nothing more. Tiller alleges that…let’s wait until facts are in evidence.
There’s nothing here, move along children.
—
Seems to me the same could be said about Kline’s allegations are accusations, nothing more. Let’s wait until all the facts are in evidence.
Nothing new here Regular, go back to posting your usual partisan BS.
————————–
Take your hormone pills dear, you’re starting to flail about.
Mom Klines ‘accusations’ have borne the scrutiny of 2 AGs and stood the test. We have a newspaper editorial here. If you can’t tell the difference then you’re right we should just move along and leave you in your delusions. Is it warm and fuzzy where you are?
Right now, neither the charges nor the allegations made in the filing referred to in the header rise to facts found true by either a judge or a jury. Can we all agree on that?
Yes, we probably don’t know exactly where the truth lies – but we should remind ourselves of this: Paul Hill drew his gun, and he’s as dead as my late daddy’s d–k because of it. Shelley Shannon drew her gun, and she kinda shot Dr. Tiller several times ’cause of it. More than a few clinic employees have been injured, maimed and agonized because of violence.
So……………..it’s probably fair to say there’s cause for concern here.
Let us endeavor – honorably – to avoid abortion through means of sanity, compassion and love. It’s probably fair to say that, among anti-abortionists, they fall into the same categories as any other social group: 1) the adroit; 2) the merely nondescript; 3) the profoundly annoying; and 4) the loins of Lucifer (Jonathan O’Toole, anyone???).
I’m just suspicious of Kline. That is my gut reaction. I may be wrong – I may be correct. He just doesn’t impress me all that much.
Klines’ statement from yesterday’s Wichita Eagle:
Kline declined a request for an interview but issued this statement Monday through his office: “Every judge who has viewed the evidence has found probably cause to believe that Mr. Tiller has committed crimes and all this demonstrates is that Mr. Tiller and his attorneys continue to believe that he is above the law.”
Killing babies in late term abortions.
Hiding the names of minor children.
nothing to see here folks, move along……..
Kline’s comment that girl-on-boy oral sex was OK but boy-on-girl a crime sort of destroyed his credibility in my eyes. Add to that the lack of diligence going after birth records for underage girls and it does make it look like a vendetta.
Ben I remember a lot of welching on the clinics part about releasing any records. Do we in fact know that he didn’t go after these records as well as the late term abortion records and wasn’t given them?
I am no Kline fan but do think that if the facts support what he alledges then Tiller should face the consequences.
okob – I’m not referring to clinic records. I’m referring to live births. They are just as much evidence of illegal sex as abortions are.
That would certainly be true. Are hospitals required to notify law enforcement when an underage girl gives birth?
With privacy regulations in place thru HIPAA I’m not sure that would be permitted.
I would assume that using the same logic Kline used with Tiller and PP that hospitals would face the same requirement – ‘if there is evidence of child abuse … ‘
Doctors and hospitals are mandatory reporters of abuse.
As for HIPAA that would apply as much to a private DR or clinic as to a hospital. However, as grandparents you and I both know that child abuse must be reported. And that is what Kline was alleging. “he’d said all along that his primary concern was unreported sexual abuse.”
HIPAA does not preclude such reporting.
Granny,
While I’m sure you wouldn’t mind your medical records being discussed and second-guessed on Bill O’Reilly, not everyone wants their privacy so invaded. Tiller did what he had to under medical ethical guidelines to insure his patients privacy. Kline did everything he could think of to attack Dr. Tiller and promote himself, and obviously didn’t care who he hurt in the process.
I know you don’t like Dr. Tiller, but that good old christian tradition of bearing any and all false witness, no matter how absurd, to try and damage your enemies has worn more than a bit thin over the centuries. Do the honorable thing and give it a rest!
Apparently some have forgotten how dangerous these religious zealots can be.
He and his ilk should be treated the same as any other religious terrorist….with disdain and with a 357.
I think ostracizing is a good policy.
Or better yet pillory and stocks. That is punishment from the times they want to take us to.
Kline would’ve gone in with guns blazing!
Jed, the honorable thing to do is to not let it rest until unborn babies are protected from murder while nestled in their mother’s womb.
The honorable thing for men to do is to restrain themselves until they are ready to take the wedding vows before the minister.
The honorable thing for women to do is to say no to dishonorable men.
“Deb” pontificates –
“… the honorable thing to do is to not let it rest until unborn babies are protected from murder while nestled in their mother’s womb.
“The honorable thing for men to do is to restrain themselves until they are ready to take the wedding vows before the minister.
“The honorable thing for women to do is to say no to dishonorable men.”
…and unicorns and butterflies would frolic under rainbows and eat cotton candy from trees.
Sorry, “Deb,” but politics is about dealing with the real world.
The most frustrating aspect of dealing with religious zealotry is how fundamentalists — of every sect; Christian, Islamic, Jewish, Druid… — always pull out the “God Card” when logic and experience and intelligence fail them.
Liberals are realists.
CONs are fantasists.
Logic would dictate that women and underage girls would not get pregnant if men wouldn’t have sex with them.
Logic would dictate that women wouldn’t need abortions if men would act with honor towards them.
Logic would dictate that self-control is actually a virtue.
Of course people fail, but immorality is the norm these days and yet worse is held up as a virtue.
“immorality is the norm these days”
Back in the late 50s I remember girls “going away” for several months to “visit an aunt”. Yea, nothing has changed except we don’t sweep it under the rug as much.
I am alway amazed RFL how some people think that an opinion editorial is factual.
Like the one Boxlock posted from the NY Post two days ago?
No, of course not! Not if you’re a Republican, anyway.
Kline is to reason as McCain is to truth.
bth
Posted September 17, 2008 at 5:25 pm | Permalink
“immorality is the norm these days”
Back in the late 50s I remember girls “going away” for several months to “visit an aunt”. Yea, nothing has changed except we don’t sweep it under the rug as much.
- – - – - – - – - – - – – - – - – — – - – - – - — – -
Ben you’ve been into the stupid pills again, haven’t you. The rate of out of wedlock births back in the 50’s (or pre 60’s sexual revolution if you will) was miniscule compared to today. Society back then was not as accepting of unwed mothers. Unfortunately, back then as now, the male who impregnated the girl was not held to account. Yes, girls did have to leave town for extended visits to out of state aunts like you said and often, the babies they had were adopted to families who wanted them.
The bottom line was that getting pregnant was not approved behavior. Yes it was cruel and girls who did had a very difficult time, but compared to todays world where we do not “sweep it under the rug” and one in three births are out of wedlock and millions of babies are aborted (murdered) every year, it seems downright sane.
It wasn’t miniscule. It was the norm. Girls were married by shame or shipped off to give birth where the child was taken from them without choice.
And abortions happened by the truckloads, illegally, and fatally to the girls.
“Prior to the 1973 decision in Roe v. Wade, illegal abortion in the United States was common; some 700,000 to 800,000 abortions were estimated to have taken place annually in the 1950s and 1960s. Poor women, mostly young and minority, suffered the health consequences, and maternal mortality rates were high. Women of means had more options. Some were able to pay a medical professional to safely perform an illegal procedure. In those states that permitted abortion under very narrow circumstances, some were able to persuade hospital authorities that they fit the criteria. New York legalized abortion, without a residency requirement, in 1970, which immediately put New York City on the map as an option for those women who could afford to travel. Before that, it was an open secret that affluent American women would travel to London to obtain a safe, legal procedure (”Lessons from Before Roe: Will Past Be Prologue?” TGR, March 2003, page 8).
According to the World Health Organization, about 13% of the 500,000 deaths worldwide from pregnancy-related causes each year are associated with unsafe abortion; in Latin America, the proportion is as high as 21%. In Egypt, abortion-related problems are responsible for about one-fifth of all obstetric and gynecologic admissions. Indeed, in some developing countries, women suffering from complications of illegal abortion account for two of every three maternity hospital beds in large urban hospitals, consuming as much as one-half of obstetrics and gynecology budgets.
In some parts of the world, lay practitioners’ use of noninvasive techniques and the increasing availability of antibiotics may be having a positive impact in lowering infection rates associated with clandestine abortion procedures. (In the United States, abortion-related maternal deaths declined sharply following the introduction of antibiotics in the 1940s.) Experience in country after country has shown, however, that reducing the need to resort to unsafe procedures and untrained practitioners—through legalization and bringing the provision of services into the open—has a direct and immediate effect on reducing abortion-related mortality and, therefore, overall maternal mortality rates.
Six months after abortion was legalized in Guyana in 1995, for example, admissions for septic and incomplete abortion dropped by 41%. Previously, septic abortion had been the third largest, and incomplete abortion the eighth largest, cause of admissions to the country’s public hospitals. Another stark example is Romania, where abortion was legally available from 1957 until 1966. The Ceaucescu regime then outlawed abortion in 1966 as part of its pronatalist policy, which led to soaring maternal death rates. Maternal death rates than fell dramatically once abortion was relegalized in 1990 after Ceaucescu’s ouster (see chart).
”
http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/tgr/06/2/gr060203.html
Guttmacher = pack of lies. No credibility. P-momma: even less
The Eagle is showing its brilliance again. The shocking accusations by Kline against Tiller was dismissed as a crusade by the Eagle. Now Tiller does the same thing and they give it credence.
Seriously, liberals then turn around and complain about Foxnews being biased. As long as ‘news’ papers sell lies about a liberal point of view, it is okay. Thank God there is a Foxnews. It gives Liberals a taste of their own medicine.
Debbie,
“Logic would dictate that women and underage girls would not get pregnant if men wouldn’t have sex with them.”
Oh, of course the only reason women and girls would consent to sex is because men seduce them. Good christian women themselves have no sexual desire and get no pleasure from the act (only vile strumpets and harlots sent by Satan to deflower our innocent young men have such desires) and only consent because they think it will snag them a husband.
Logic would dictate that you obviously grew up in the Victorian age where ignorance was a virtue, corsets were too tight, and the weaker, dumber sex was swayed by the blandishments and promises of marriage of dishonest old lechers.
I have news for you baby! Women have the same desires as men, and are just as likely these days to want a sexual relationship. Many, if not most have seen what marriage did to their parents and want no part of it.
“Logic would dictate that women wouldn’t need abortions if men would act with honor towards them.”
Logic would dictate that all of us could do with a bit more honor all the way around. Logic would dictate that there is seldom any logic where love and/or sex is concerned. Logic would dictate that women wouldn’t need abortions if they insisted on condoms and took the pill or used other forms of birth control.
One of the attributes that makes us human is the finding of multiple uses for the things around us. That goes for sex too. Sex is used for a great many purposes, personal and commercial, other than increasing an already high birth rate. It can be recreational, it can bond people together, it can be used to express a multitude of emotions, it can represent love, hatred, power, submission to power, etcetera, etcetera, all without any intention whatsoever of reproducing. I’m sure you think all that is evil beyond belief, but I’m sure you’ll concede you’ve been outvoted.
I doubt you will find many stronger advocates of marriage than me, but I also acknowlege that traditional marriage isn’t the only way to have a relationship, and that marriage can destroy as easily as create.
You would do well to find if you can, some way out of the rigid Victorian patterns of thinking that got us into the current situation, recognize that different individuals need different things, and that sexuality is a normal and natural part of humanity, and work for a society where sexual relationships can take the forms people people need them to in order to live the different lives they’ve created. Not everybody wants to live your life.
WOW! Kline with a gun! That’s a mindful. I’m sure he would go through the Deadeye Dick Cheney Gun Safety Course beforehand.????
Would Kline really have gone in with guns drawn?
You are kidding right? That is how government operates. Suppose that a government official shows up at your door demanding entrance. If you refuse they will come back with armed agents to discuss it with you.
Any and all examples you can come up with, once the decision is made to go somewhere that is where they will go. By force if necessary.
This is a big reason why government should be limited. They always have the option of using force to accomplish their goals.
Chrisfrom bigmack – no, I have not. But, as usual, you are back in your self-acknowledged tin foil hat.
And, as you are well aware, I financially support BIRTH alternatives; not abortion. You already know that.
Chris,
“The rate of out of wedlock births back in the 50’s (or pre 60’s sexual revolution if you will) was miniscule compared to today. Society back then was not as accepting of unwed mothers.”
And that’s why the abortion rate in the ’50’s and early ’60’s was roughly 4-5 times what it is now, even though it was highly illegal. At that time, Wichita was supporting at least four full-time abortionists and a large number of part-timers, at about $10-25 per abortion, not to mention all the scared girls with coathangers! Believe me, there was just as much premarital/extramarital sex going on then as now, maybe more; it just wasn’t talked about. I was there!
Jed — ah, memories … the back seat of a 52 Chevy …
And not to mention the shotgun weddings – that all to often led to abuse and/or divorce.
bth,
“Jed — ah, memories … the back seat of a 52 Chevy …”
Something our grandchildren will never know- they’d have to be contortionists to do that now!
Here’s the truth about what’s really been happening, from kansasliberty.com:
Attorneys blame Morrison’s former mistress for convincing him to file charges
Tiller lawyers attack Kline over charges filed by Morrison
In a motion filed Monday, attorneys for a late-term abortionist facing 19 misdemeanor counts in Wichita launched a withering attack on former Attorney General Phill Kline, even though it was Kline’s successor, Paul Morrison, who had filed the charges.
The lengthy motion, filed on behalf of Dr. George Tiller, briefly acknowledged that Kline did not file the charges, but said Kline’s actions while conducting an inquisition of the abortion provider had permanently tainted the case.
Tiller’s lawyers sought either dismissal of the case or suppression of the evidence collected by prosecutors. District Court Judge Clark V. Owens has indicated arguments on the motion will be presented in November.
The motion, which was made available on the website of Tiller’s law firm, claims that Morrison only filed the charges in response to pressure applied by pro-life groups.
The motion further claims that Morrison’s mistress (described as “a Kline-influenced paramour”), who remained with the District Attorney’s Office after Morrison replaced Kline as Attorney General, also had encouraged Morrison to file charges. The claim was based on a newspaper article in the Topeka Capital-Journal.
Troy Newman, president of Operation Rescue, said he would like to believe Morrison caved in under pressure from various pro-life groups, but admitted that notion was somewhat unlikely, given the substantial donations made by Tiller and his PAC. The donations helped get Morrison elected as Attorney General.
Tiller is charged with performing late-term abortions on girls as young as 10 without obtaining the signature of a doctor unaffiliated with Tiller’s Wichita abortion clinic.
State law requires that before performing a late-term procedure, an abortionist must find a second, unaffiliated doctor to concur that the abortion is medically necessary. The criminal complaint contends that Tiller consulted a second doctor – Kristin Neuhaus – with whom he was financially affiliated. Neuhaus also performs abortions.
“The issue in the case is simple: Did Tiller have a financial relationship with Neuhaus or didn’t he?” Newman said. “All the rest of this stuff is just blame-shifting by Tiller – ‘it’s all Phill Kline’s fault.’”
The 154 page motion includes a table of contents with chapter headings that read like tabloid headlines: “Kline’s Holy Grail: Patient Records”; “Kline is out but can’t let go of Dr. Tiller (or his files)”; and “Kline continues to prejudice Dr. Tiller’s jury pool and thumb his nose at the courts”.
Newman said the titles might have been lifted from the National Enquirer. “It just fills me with glee when I think how much Tiller had to spend to get this thing prepared,” he said.
According to the motion, “This prosecution is the product of an obsessed AG’s lies, half-truths and material omissions. His assistants and agents directed these prevarications to other state offices, the public, and the courts. This prosecution and the evidence on which it depends have been irreparably tainted as a result of Kline’s office’s misconduct. The only meaningful remedy is to dismiss the charges or suppress the evidence.”
On Monday, in response to a request for comment, Kline expressed a concern that the case, which has already been delayed many times at Tiller’s request, might be “side tracked” yet again.
In a statement, Kline told KansasLiberty.com, “Every judge who has viewed the evidence has found probably cause to believe that Mr. Tiller has committed crimes and all this demonstrates is that Mr. Tiller and his attorneys continue to believe that he is above the law. The only questions remaining are whether this court as some others have done will improperly delay or side track legitimate prosecution and also whether the Attorney General will begin to perform his duty and seek additional information from Mr. Tiller. Patient privacy has never been at risk and the women have never been under investigation.”
Here’s the truth of what’s really been happeng in the Tiller case, from kansasliberty.com:
Attorneys blame Morrison’s former mistress for convincing him to file charges
Tiller lawyers attack Kline over charges filed by Morrison
In a motion filed Monday, attorneys for a late-term abortionist facing 19 misdemeanor counts in Wichita launched a withering attack on former Attorney General Phill Kline, even though it was Kline’s successor, Paul Morrison, who had filed the charges.
The lengthy motion, filed on behalf of Dr. George Tiller, briefly acknowledged that Kline did not file the charges, but said Kline’s actions while conducting an inquisition of the abortion provider had permanently tainted the case.
Tiller’s lawyers sought either dismissal of the case or suppression of the evidence collected by prosecutors. District Court Judge Clark V. Owens has indicated arguments on the motion will be presented in November.
The motion, which was made available on the website of Tiller’s law firm, claims that Morrison only filed the charges in response to pressure applied by pro-life groups.
The motion further claims that Morrison’s mistress (described as “a Kline-influenced paramour”), who remained with the District Attorney’s Office after Morrison replaced Kline as Attorney General, also had encouraged Morrison to file charges. The claim was based on a newspaper article in the Topeka Capital-Journal.
Troy Newman, president of Operation Rescue, said he would like to believe Morrison caved in under pressure from various pro-life groups, but admitted that notion was somewhat unlikely, given the substantial donations made by Tiller and his PAC. The donations helped get Morrison elected as Attorney General.
Tiller is charged with performing late-term abortions on girls as young as 10 without obtaining the signature of a doctor unaffiliated with Tiller’s Wichita abortion clinic.
State law requires that before performing a late-term procedure, an abortionist must find a second, unaffiliated doctor to concur that the abortion is medically necessary. The criminal complaint contends that Tiller consulted a second doctor – Kristin Neuhaus – with whom he was financially affiliated. Neuhaus also performs abortions.
“The issue in the case is simple: Did Tiller have a financial relationship with Neuhaus or didn’t he?” Newman said. “All the rest of this stuff is just blame-shifting by Tiller – ‘it’s all Phill Kline’s fault.’”
The 154 page motion includes a table of contents with chapter headings that read like tabloid headlines: “Kline’s Holy Grail: Patient Records”; “Kline is out but can’t let go of Dr. Tiller (or his files)”; and “Kline continues to prejudice Dr. Tiller’s jury pool and thumb his nose at the courts”.
Newman said the titles might have been lifted from the National Enquirer. “It just fills me with glee when I think how much Tiller had to spend to get this thing prepared,” he said.
According to the motion, “This prosecution is the product of an obsessed AG’s lies, half-truths and material omissions. His assistants and agents directed these prevarications to other state offices, the public, and the courts. This prosecution and the evidence on which it depends have been irreparably tainted as a result of Kline’s office’s misconduct. The only meaningful remedy is to dismiss the charges or suppress the evidence.”
On Monday, in response to a request for comment, Kline expressed a concern that the case, which has already been delayed many times at Tiller’s request, might be “side tracked” yet again.
In a statement, Kline told KansasLiberty.com, “Every judge who has viewed the evidence has found probably cause to believe that Mr. Tiller has committed crimes and all this demonstrates is that Mr. Tiller and his attorneys continue to believe that he is above the law. The only questions remaining are whether this court as some others have done will improperly delay or side track legitimate prosecution and also whether the Attorney General will begin to perform his duty and seek additional information from Mr. Tiller. Patient privacy has never been at risk and the women have never been under investigation.”