“Anybody who believes that the Republicans, whoever they are, can fix the mess they created probably believes that the iceberg could have saved the Titanic,” said Hillary Clinton, campaigning Monday for Barack Obama in Florida and also amending her convention line to say, “No way, no how, no McCain, no Palin!”
But more than a few somebodies seem to believe in Republicans at the moment, judging from the RealClearPolitics average of polls showing John McCain ahead of Obama by 2.7 percent.
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271 Comments
“But more than a few somebodies seem to believe in Republicans at the moment, judging from the RealClearPolitics average of polls showing John McCain ahead of Obama by 2.7 percent.”
That’s the power of Marketing baby!
Either way Muslim Obama or Billy Hillary is bad news and should just play it cool to have a chance.
They’ve got Brand Palin, we Don’t! WAAAAAAA
Maybe,just maybe the campaign will get a little more than skin deeep?
“Phantom
Posted September 9, 2008 at 1:27 pm | Permalink
They’ve got Brand Palin, we Don’t! WAAAAAAA
Maybe,just maybe the campaign will get a little more than skin deeep?”
If that happens it will be time for Republican plan B - release the nudes
another issue free attack against the word “Republican”.
Hmmm, the people are really convinced the Hillary and the Dems are nothing more then Anti-Republicans having no marketable solutions to offer.
IF it was bad, and it happened within the last 100 years it was a Republican’s fault.
Vote for us because…..drum roll…we are not Republicans!
No, vote for us because we’re Republicans, that aren’t Republicans. No brainer!
They might have to resort to the Vogue strategy, or God forbid, bring out the big guns in a Playboy spread (might have to go to the archives for pictures however).
Phantom, are you beber?
RealClearPolitics average of polls showing John McCain ahead of Obama by 2.7 percent.
And yet RealClearPolitics shows Obama currently ahead of McCain in electoral votes.
217 Obama to 174 McCain. There are 147 toss-up votes still in contention.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/maps/obama_vs_mccain/
“another issue free attack against the word “Republican”.”
Is it not amazing just how much control the Republicans have over the Democratic voter?
Just this morning Gallup reported,
“By contrast, Democrats’ support for McCain rose 5 percentage points over the GOP convention period, from 9% to 14%,…”
Now why do you think these Democrats are going to vote for McCain?
“They might have to resort to the Vogue strategy, or God forbid, bring out the big guns in a Playboy spread (might have to go to the archives for pictures however).” — Pathom
Or use the Republican tactic, Phantom. We could simply paste her face to some old Dr. Laura nudes.
No, the phantom is just the phantom.
“george
Posted September 9, 2008 at 1:25 pm | Permalink
Either way Muslim Obama ”
MORON!
I like seeing the word “Iceberg” next to a picture of Hillary…..Kind of explains the whole hump-a-ho-Bill mess.
“And yet RealClearPolitics shows Obama currently ahead of McCain in electoral votes.
217 Obama to 174 McCain.”
There is a timing difference. Check the dates of the State Polls.
On 1 September 2008 RCP showed:
Obama 228
McCain 185
Toss up 125
Hud,
*gasp* they’ve already started counting the electoral college votes???
Just wondering out loud -
what is the likelihood of a candidate again winning the popular vote, and losing the election via the electoral college?
I don’t know, at this point. I’m just beginning to think about it. We know it can be done, and there’s been no action - amazingly, not even a hint of action - to prevent same or make it less likely after 2000.
Thoughts?
GMC, lately it is appearing more likely (if the polls are to be given any credence). I’m not, at this early date, thinking much about it, to be sure.
Recalling some previous discourse; should anything be done to prevent this? Not in my opinion, but that’s just how I am. It will be interesting to see the reaction if this does recur in the 2008 election, especially if Sen. Obama would be the recipient of the process.
As I read the Constitution, this potential outcome was what the Founders agreed upon, to avoid the potential for a candidate winning by a supermajority of the popular vote in a few populous states, losing the majority of the states popular vote, and still being able to win the election.
“*gasp* they’ve already started counting the electoral college votes???”
No, not yet. But the votes are up for bids on Ebay.
“recipient”=”beneficiary”
No, not yet. But the votes are up for bids on Ebay. Diebold.com
“…to avoid the potential for a candidate winning by a super majority of the popular vote in a few populous states, losing the majority of the states popular vote, and still being able to win the election.”
——–
OK, counselor, wouldn’t it be exactly the same thing happening with electoral votes as popular votes? What’s the distinction?
Linda, while it may seem counter-intuitive, consider the electoral vote allocation among the states. There is sufficient population in New York, California, and Texas, e.g., that if one candidate gained 95% majorities in said states, he might well, even losing the other 47 states by slim margins, hold a majority of the popular vote; but, he would not gain the 270 electoral votes needed for election. This, of course, is a hypothetical based upon great numbers voting in these three states, and not so many elsewhere.
GMC - quite high I think. I have seen a number of large states with large Obama margins with many more states with narrow McCain leads.
Irony - before the 2000 election there was speculation that Bush would sweep TX with a big spread, win the popular vote, but lose to Gore in the ‘College’
BTW - I don’t think the College should be given any credibility until they field a football team. Or at least some scantily clad cheerleaders!
I understand better but don’t agree still. I would prefer a change, a tweaking, at least a good hard look to make sure this is the best system to reflect the will of the people. I’m not sure anyone could have imagined and planned well for what America is today vs when the electoral college was adopted. Don’t we have a couple of states that use a proportionate system? Isn’t Maine one of them?
From everything I’ve been studying there are pockets of large margins for both candidates. And, of course, if McCain was going to take the six Kansas electoral votes before the Palin-generated enthusiasm, he isn’t going to take more than those six just because twice as many vote for him from this state.
Now why do you think these Democrats are going to vote for McCain?
——————————————–
We need another war
Not enough copies of the ten commandments posted anyway
There are a few places we haven’t drilled for oil yet
Concealed Carry should be mandatory
military spending should be tripled
Not enough lobbyists in Washington
We need to outsource a few more jobs
inflation isn’t high enough
Linda, Maine is one; Nebraska, IIRC, is the other.
I think IL has a large Obama lead.
anyway=anywhere
“Don’t we have a couple of states that use a proportionate system?”
Well really not “proportional”.
“In Maine and Nebraska, two electors are chosen at-large by state-wide popular vote and the rest are selected by the popular vote in each congressional district. As a result, the electoral procedure in these States permits a split slate of electors to be chosen.”
http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/procedural_guide.html
The EC is one of the reminders of what the Unites States was on its creation. It was a collection of relatively sovereign states - almost, but not really a confederation - but not quite a single entity, politically. The US introduced a new political term and system - federalism. And our entire political system still reflects that. Thus, we do not have one national election for president, we have 50 state elections.
That said, one of the quirks of the system is that it makes possible for the counter-intuitive outcome noted here. “Reforming” the system faces powerful institutional forces opposing it. California earlier this year flirted with going to electoral votes distributed by congressional district, rather than winner take all; the effort was derailed by partisan bickering over which party it would favor in presidential elections. Maine, it has been noted, may do that now, I don’t frankly remember right now. Even if all 50 states went to distribution of votes by congressional district (with a bonus of 2 votes per state to the state’s popular vote winner, representing the EC votes designated to represent the Senate seats), that wouldn’t prevent such a contrary outcome, though it may become less likely. And it’s not at all clear that Congress could constitutionally mandate such a system nationwide, even if they wanted to, absent constitutional amendment; for obvious reasons, small states would never agree to such an amendment.
As VT notes, however, the system does have it’s advantages. It requires a candidate to have more than just a narrow regional appeal; he must win states, not just large majorities in small regions.
For better or worse, it appears we are stuck with this holdover from the Founding period, which never really worked as intended, for the foreseeable future.
“For better or worse, it appears we are stuck with this holdover from the Founding period, which never really worked as intended, for the foreseeable future”
Why don’t we change it? (hey, both parties are running on the change mantra aren’t they?)
Wouldn’t it be hilarious if Obama lost the popular vote but won the electoral vote?
I’d love to hear the CONs squeal like monkeys with their tails caught in rat traps after their stoical “get over it” 8 years ago . . .
“Now why do you think these Democrats are going to vote for McCain?”
Not all racists are registered R, even though the vast majority are . . .
“CapnAmerica
Posted September 9, 2008 at 3:50 pm | Permalink
Wouldn’t it be hilarious if Obama lost the popular vote but won the electoral vote?”
The irony in that would be marvelous
CapnAmerica
Posted September 9, 2008 at 3:52 pm | Permalink
“Now why do you think these Democrats are going to vote for McCain?”
Not all racists are registered R, even though the vast majority are . . .
—–
Obama is as much white as he is black.
Brian,
Yeah, both candidates have to run on the change mantra because almost none of the voters want things to stay the same. Unfortunately, neither of them can get beyond the word “change” and into the specifics of changing what, since each voter has his own notion of what needs to be changed, and will fight to the death for it. Which means that whoever gets elected will only be able to bring about meaningful change in baby steps. Real change takes generations to accomplish.
As GMC notes, to change the EC system nationwide would require a Constitutional Amendment which, IMO, would never be ratified. The method of choosing electors is left to the States; so, for those who would want to see a change, it would be my thought that this would best be accomplished on a state-by-state basis.
As to “never really worked as intended”, I agree here, to; while I’m not so sure I can divine the total intent behind the way the EC was originally established, it is my thought that the original idea was for the candidate obtaining the needed vote (majority) to serve as President, with the “first runner up” to serve as Vice President. That was superseded by the Twelfth Amendment, following the rise of political parties and the unseemly result of one of the early Presidential elections (don’t recall which one at the moment) where the President and Vice President were from opposing sides.
Capn -
The not-quite unspoken statement being, of course, that if you vote against Obama, you’re a racist?
Yea, that’ll fly.
Obama’s candle flamed early but is sputtering now. With Palin, the GOP finally got someone they can be really excited about. One major speech and she rallied the masses and raised hopes.
Now that Obama is exposed for the do-little he really is, he’s on a downhill slide.
The election belongs to the GOP again.
Cap’n,
How about forbidding the publication of any photos or video footage of any political candidate. Then we’d only have their words and voting records to judge them by. It really doesn’t matter what our politicians look like; it’s what they do that should be the deciding factor.
brain_never- Can you pour piss out of a boot?
“the total intent behind the way the EC was originally established,”
I think the original intent was that electors would be real decision-making people. We would elect these people and entrust them to decide whom to vote for,
Keep in mind that Senators were elected by State Legislatures; not by people.
As usual, GMC repeats the CONventional wisdumb of regarding the EC.
There is only one simple problem with the EC–the two votes each state gets whether it has people or not.
That means the most populous state, California, has 2 extra EC votes divided by 37,000,000 people while the least populous state, Wyoming, has 2 extra EC votes with 525,000 people.
That is not “one person, one vote.”
People from small states have far more influence than their demographics deserve. As a result, smaller states which are rural areas and CON create a systematic advantage for CONs running for president, as was clearly shown in Al Gore’s race.
unseemly result of one of the early Presidential elections (don’t recall which one at the moment) where the President and Vice President were from opposing sides.
1796. Adams(Federalist), as President; Jefferson(Democratic-Republican), as VP. A great book of the period, American Creation. Don’t remember the author right now.
And it was bitter. If you think campaigns are nasty now . . . . . .
GMC–
If you call yourself a Democrat and you vote for McCain, you are one helluva racist.
Yes, indeed.
I’ve heard it myself when I do phone-banking.
Me: Who do you support for Congress?
Callee: Nancy Boyda.
Me: Who do you support for Senate?
Callee: Jim Slattery.
Me: Who do you support for President?
Callee: I’m not sure.
Me: You don’t support Obama?
Callee: I don’t think he has the intelligence to be President.
Me: The guy who went to Harvard Law and was voted Editor of the Law Review?
Callee: Yes, I know. But I’m just not sure.
******
I know racism when I hear it.
To be a good democrat you must be a non-thinking robot. See: CapnAmerica Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:13 pm
Dictionary~
Racism: Please see CapnAmerica for definition.
*EYEROLL*
Capn, “one person, one vote” has no direct application in Presidential elections as to the candidates (but does, as to voting for the electors); nor, until the Constitution was amended, did it have any application in elections for the U.S. Senate.
Ben states one reason for the EC well; the electors were entrusted with the decision. The Founders didn’t want a pure democracy, as is clear from reading the Constitution as originally written and ratified. We may speculate as to why that was; lack of education in the general population is one reason that has some validity, IMO.
History trivia: the Seventeenth Amendment, allowing for direct election of Senators, was not ratified until 1913. So, “we the people” have been directly electing U.S. Senators for less than 100 years.
And it was bitter. If you think campaigns are nasty now . . . . . .
——
Just curious, GMC, did the bitterness you speak of extend to most Americans or just politicians? It’s hard for me to imagine Americans more divided than recent years, but not so difficult to understand that politicians have forever been “opponents.”
GMC,
I’ve heard far more people than I would’ve imagined (on this blog and elsewhere) say words to the effect that “there’s no way we can have a ni**er president.” Some wouldn’t even stand for a black sheriff 30 some-odd years after “Blazing Saddles!” There is still a lot more racism out there than most would admit to after 50 years of civil rights movement.
Scary!
I just wish I could get that Alaska Governor gig where they pay you to live in your own house just like you were staying in a motel.
We fired an employee who was doing that a few years back.
In Alaska, we’re told it’s “normal practice.”
Thanks, GMC; just couldn’t recall, and was too lazy to “look it up”.
History trivia: the Seventeenth Amendment, allowing for direct election of Senators, was not ratified until 1913. So, “we the people” have been directly electing U.S. Senators for less than 100 years.
*****
Interesting.
But simply because the past was worse than the present is no excuse to maintain a bad system in the present.
Jed–
Good points.
The don’t call it “The White House” for nothing.
Capn -
While that may well be true, the founders never intended the selection of President to be “one person, one vote.” They were not “democrats” (small D, as favoring democracy as a process) as we think of the term. Democracy at the time was seen as a very bad thing; the excesses of democracy were seen as as much as threat as monarchy. A republic was seen as a tempering of popular whims.
The EC has evolved as it has out of its constitutional creation for any number of reasons. The overrepresentation of small states was not accidental; like much of the Constitution, it was a compromise designed to allay fears by the small states that the large states (then New York, Pennsylvania, and Virginia) would swallow up the small.
Your post, however, implies that it was, and is, part of a vast “right wing conspiracy” apparantly reaching back to the founders. While we “conspirators” would love to take such credit, I’m afraid we can’t. It just is.
Your writing merely reflects your rampant paranoia, and fear and loathing of anyone who dares to disagree with you.
Do you ever do or say ANYTHING where your bitterness and emnity isn’t worn on your sleeve?
Capn’A is a sexist woman hater.
Linda,
Just remember that in 1860 it came down to Americans slaughtering each other in huge numbers over political divisions. The Civil War still holds the record for the bloodiest conflict we have ever engaged in. Thankfully we haven’t reached that point yet, although there seem to be factions who are starting to think that way again.
Capn, the system is as it is. As you fervently believe it needs to be changed, then you should, together with those who feel the same way, work to get it changed.
The next big swing will happen when the debates are
done. While I am undecided at this point I have found it amazing that people who were eager to bash
Obama on experience etc just love Palin. The worst
part is that they arent looking into some of the statements made by Palin to see if they are right or wrong. For example she said no the bridge to nowhere which sounds great but in reality she took
the money and used it for other projects. She also
already spent 43k traveling running Alaska. So I am not seeing where her change is except fewer books in the library.
Capn’s wife is a very beautiful woman who would effectively argue how wrong you are, Anti. In fact, he is quite a gentleman who seems sincerely interested in women and their opinions.
Capn’A, so how do you know the person on the other end of the phone is not black?
lindainks55
Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:28 pm | Permalink
Capn’s wife is a very beautiful woman who would effectively argue how wrong you are, Anti. In fact, he is quite a gentleman who seems sincerely interested in women and their opinions.
——
By his own logic if he doesn’t vote for McCain/Palin he is a sexist just as if others who don’t vote for Obama are racist.
Ew, Jed, right. Vivid reminder. OK, I can imagine, but I would rather not.
No, Anti, those words are yours, not Capns.
lindainks55
Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:32 pm | Permalink
No, Anti, those words are yours, not Capns.
—-
It sure as hell is what he is driving at.
Cap’n,
“They don’t call it “The White House” for nothing.”
The interesting part is that artists admitted about 150 years ago that white isn’t a color, but a blending of all colors. The rest of the world it seems still hasn’t caught on.
Work to change the EC?
Heh, good one, Tolle, good one.
My people can’t even get a Democrat in the White House, and you’re talking about changing the constitution.
What surprises me is that so many otherwise thoughtful people, like Mr. Tolle, have no problem with the EC.
Thanks for the kind words, Linda.
I have put ANTI on ignore awhile back and haven’t regretted it.
He brings nothing to the table except an effort to annoy and irritate.
There’s no there there.
Why am I talking to you Linda? You are not Capn’A and I don’t feel like a sandwich! ;)
Jed -
I don’t doubt that’s out there, and I won’t defend it; on the contrary.
But that’s not Capn’s position. What Capn’s saying is that if you don’t vote for Obama, you’re a racist. And HE knows it. HE can tell. HE’s clairvoyant. And reads minds.
So it’s racist not to vote for the least prepared candidate for president in at least the last century?
Riiiiiiiiiight.
Keep smoking that, Capn.
And Linda, despite the nastiness often displayed here, remember that the folks who write her are not “normal.” We are not representative of the population at large; we get wrapped up in this stuff (some more than others). I don’t think the “population at large” is nearly as divided as you think. What unites us is far more than any divisions we have. Most of us understand that politics is just that: politics. It’s not a be-all and end-all; it’s not how most of us define ourselves.
FWIW, BTW, I don’t know that popular elections of Senators, on balance, has been a particularly good thing. At least if you really believe in a limited Federal government.
CapnAmerica
Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:38 pm | Permalink
Thanks for the kind words, Linda.
I have put ANTI on ignore awhile back and haven’t regretted it.
——
I am truly sore that we can’ be friends Capn’A and I hope you rethink your choice in this matter.
Sincerely,
ANTI
can’=can’t
The “fiscal conservative” Palin has no problem billing the taxpayers for family outings including visits from the husband to perform his “marital” duties.
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Palin_billed_state_for_Thanksgiving_day_0909.html
Palin charged the state for the days she stayed at home treating it like it was a hotel. Want to go to a NCAA game? She charged that too (that should upset the Republicans here who whined about Sebelius visiting a KU game, Alaska has no teams in the NCAA).
The Queen of Pork is always willing to accept a handout from the taxpayer.
dave2652
Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:27 pm | Permalink
For example she said no the bridge to nowhere which sounds great but in reality she took
the money and used it for other projects.
—————————————————-
State and local Governments are better suited to decide where Federal monies are spent than bureucrats in this case 1,000’s of miles away.
And Linda, ANTI may be in ignore for Capn (of course, he isn’t, but that’s another subject) but he’s right. That is exactly the logical result of Capn’s position.
So, Capn, which do you want to be? Racist or Sexist? A troubling petard you’ve hoisted yourself upon, it appears.
Did you forget, Mr. Kia, the money spent in Alaska came from taxpayers in the other 49 states? I won’t disagree with your premise but in this case it is covering a truth you’re trying to ignore.
Maggotpunk
Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:40 pm | Permalink
The Queen of Pork is always willing to accept a handout from the taxpayer.
—————————————————-
If other local politicians had the guts or smarts of Paln maybe certain levy’s would have been repaired or bridges vs. building access roads, new lanes to freeways (hello I-235) and runways.
What Capn’s saying is that if you don’t vote for Obama, you’re a racist.
Wrong.
What I clearly wrote was that “if you identify as a Democrat, and you don’t vote for Obama, you’re a racist.”
Actually, it’d be more accurate to say, “you’re most likely a racist.”
Obama represents Democratic interests and positions pretty much to the letter. The only reason that one could oppose the man and not the man’s positions is if one disliked something about the man himself.
Like his race, for instance?
Capn’A, so how do you know the person on the other end of the phone is not black??
Linda,
No, none of us wants to imagine that happening again, but when political tensions rise as they have recently, maybe we need a reminder of what the inevitable result of those tensions is when they reach boiling.
Most of us understand that politics is just that: politics. It’s not a be-all and end-all
It was the end-all for the 4100 American soldiers who died for a pack of lies in Iraq.
And everyone who voted for Bush shares in the guilt of their deaths.
A man walks by a homeless guy begging for alcohol. The man sniffs the air and finds the homeless man reeks of booze.
“Spare some change, mister?” Says the beggar.
“Nah, I’ll give you money if you promise to use it for food and not for alcohol,” replies the man.
“I promise,” says the homeless man and the guy promptly hands him a few dollars.
Later on the man sees the begger getting liquored up.
“Didn’t you promise you were going to use that money for food?” Asks the man.
“I refused your money and used it for something I thought was more appropriate,” retorts the booze smelling man.
And that’s Palin, just another Republican drunk with taxpayer money but honestly believing if you take someone’s money and spend it on something else then you never accepted it in the first place. Honesty and integrity, Republicans are so consistent.
lindainks55
Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:43 pm | Permalink
Did you forget, Mr. Kia, the money spent in Alaska came from taxpayers in the other 49 states? I won’t disagree with your premise but in this case it is covering a truth you’re trying to ignore.
—————————————————-
She’s the Governor of Alaska. It’s her job to get funding for her state not Kansas.
Kia says:
“If other local politicians had the guts or smarts of Paln maybe certain levy’s would have been repaired or bridges vs. building access roads, new lanes to freeways (hello I-235) and runways.”
Kinda like how Palin spent taxpayer dollars on sports centers instead of needed sewage treatment plants? It figures lying and stealing is considered honorable in the Republican world (where bridges and levees are not being repaired).
GMC,
No, you don’t have to be a racist to not vote for Obama, but those of you who won’t might benefit from a long hard look in the mirror.
“She’s the Governor of Alaska. It’s her job to get funding for her state not Kansas.”
Then she can’t run on a platform claiming she refused earmarks and pork barrel spending. It’s the hypocrisy if you hadn’t noticed.
The only reason that one could oppose the man and not the man’s positions is if one disliked something about the man himself.
So - YOU get to define what is a “good” Democrat? To be a democrat, you must agree with Obama’s positions, across the board. And if you think that Obama is, say, simply not experienced enough for the job yet, you are not a good Democrat.
Well there ya go, folks. The good Capn has spoken. Fall into line or else!!
You’re analogy MP is backwards. The bridge to nowhere was the useless alcohol. She worked hard to get Congress to remove the earmark language so it could be used for the food.
“Congress eventually removed the earmark language but the money still went to Alaska, leaving it up to the administration of then-Gov. Frank Murkowski to decide whether to go ahead with the bridges or spend the money on something else.”
http://news.bostonherald.com/news/2008/view.bg?&articleid=1116208&format=&page=2&listingType=2008pres#articleFull
http://news.yahoo.com/story/politico/20080909/pl_politico/20927_1
Koch backs Obama, calls Palin ’scary’
Ben Smith
Tue Sep 9, 11:03 am ET
Former New York Mayor Ed Koch, who endorsed and worked for George W. Bush in 2004, is endorsing Obama today, NY1 first reported.
I asked Koch just now what prompted the move.
“The designation of Palin to be vice president,” he said. “She’s scary.”
He said he was alarmed by the report that she’d triggered a conflict with the local librarian in Wasilla, Alaska by inquiring about the possibility of banning books.
“Any time someone goes to the library and says, ‘I want to ban books,’ and the librarian says ‘no,’ and she threatens to fire them — that’s scary,” he said.
Kia lies:
“You’re analogy MP is backwards. The bridge to nowhere was the useless alcohol. She worked hard to get Congress to remove the earmark language so it could be used for the food.”
She campaigned for governor on the platform of getting that money. After Congress removed the funding for the project (something she had nothing to do with) she claimed she rejected the money while, in all honesty, she never returned it.
That has been debunked capn’A.
Maybe someone should fill Koch in on the facts.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/157986
Here’s a pic of Palin campaigning for bridge funding that she claims she didn’t support.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravina_Island_Bridge
Yes. When presented with facts. LIES. Is the appropriate Democratic answer. LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE!!!
And everyone who voted for Bush shares in the guilt of their deaths.
Gosh, Capn, do you think you could be a little more self-rightous?
And Jed, I got no problems with my mirror. I think I see some projecting going on . . . .
MP,
Are you saying that pork is an addictive substance?
Yes, it has ANTI; she gave the librarian a letter that she intended to fire her four days before the notorious meeting that has been of such debate. So, then-Mayor Palin did not threaten to fire the librarian over refusal to “ban books”; rather, as set out in the link I posted a few days ago, intended to fire her over the librarian’s not supporting her, and later relented, according to the same article.
You got nothing, GMC.
Granted there are a few left-leaning voters who oppose Obama because he’s pro-gay but not as pro-gay as they are (KSFrmGrrl) or because he opposes RepubliCONs but just not as much as they oppose CONs and with the confrontational tactics they like (BlueJay).
I would never call KGrrl or BlueJay racist.
When I hear, “Obama is not intelligent enough to be President” from a Democratic voter, I interprete that as racism.
And I’m right.
C’mon Mr. Kia. You don’t need facts when you’ve got elections to win. Why, right is on their side; Capn said so. When you’re clothed in self-rightousness, well, all’s fair.
Facts? Facts are so yesterday. Besides, they have civilization and the planet to save; the end justified the means.
Well, that and it’s the day’s marching orders from Kos. And those can’t be ignored.
The facts, for those interested, just as Kia posted: http://www.newsweek.com/id/157986
CapnAmerica
Posted September 9, 2008 at 4:59 pm | Permalink
When I hear, “Obama is not intelligent enough to be President” from a Democratic voter, I interprete that as racism.
—————————————————-
Are you serious?
I’ve never heard that.
I notice how the press can’t get to her…they’d eat her alive and McCain’s camp knows that.
How can any rationale person be against abortion in cases of rape, incest, or to save the life of a mother?
How can any rationale person be against sex education in school?
How can any rationale person want creationism to be taught in science classes?
How can any rationale person think that God ordered the Iraqi war?
How can a rationale person believe that there is “victory” in Iraq and that all that money and all the lives lost on both sides was worth what little we gained by overthrowing that government?
She’s WAY out there, even for a Republican.
Palin got pregnant and had a baby at the age of 43…and Obama is stupid?!? That’s REALLY funny!
I note that the link Mr. Kia provides above gives a bit different timeline, as I read it, on the “firing” of the librarian; according to the same, the librarian was terminated, but rehired the next day after public opposition arose to the action taken. The given reason was “not supporting [the Mayor]” as reported in the Newsweek article linked, and upon reemployment, the Mayor stated that the librarian now supported her, per the article linked.
Cap’n,
One of the real problems Obama may be facing with the voters is that he’s TOO intelligent for many of them. Unfortunately in this country, brains are considered a political disability. Look at shrub!
Mary,
Maybe the Down’s baby was a message from god for Ms. Palin to start putting her family first.
Fired her for not supporting her, and was that determined how? How does a librarian show support or lack of, for the mayor? Not being on her campaign, being on the campaign of the opposition?
When I hear, “Obama is not intelligent enough to be President” from a Democratic voter, I interprete that as racism.
And I’m right.
Gosh. That much self-rightous certainty must be comforting. Just how do you pour your consciousness through that telephone line and peek into their heads?
It must be a gift.
How dare they disagree with you. They should be drawn and quartered, at least.
Is this how it happened?
http://www.tvweek.com/viral-video/editors-choice/
If I were mayor, I would care less if the librarian supported me or not, unless I was going to ask her to do something controversial.
Republicans only listen to what they want to hear, Jed.
I’m sure she has a nanny that will raise her disabled child for her.
Chris’s prediction of the day.-within the next two weeks, Joe Biden will withdrawl as Obama’s running mate due to an illness or some sort of family crisis. Hillary, for the good of the Country and the good of the party will reluctantly accept the role of V.P. candidate.
The reason- Simple, there is no way in hell that the Democrats will allow Biden to face Sarah Palin in a debate. Also, the real reason that Hillary was deep sixed is no longer valid. (unifying and bringing out the republican base since the base is already fired up and excited). The real race this fall will be between Hillary and Sarah, and may the best man win.
There is a timing difference. Check the dates of the State Polls.
On 1 September 2008 RCP showed:
Obama 228
McCain 185
Toss up 125
Thanks for the correction, Hud. I was looking for dates and apparently missed them. That’s an 11 point difference…for both, so basically doesn’t change much. I’ll take a closer look again later.
Okay, Chris, so we can eliminate THAT possibility…
Mary -
Are you talking about the Sarah Palin? Or the straw representation of Sarah Palin that the left (with a compliant media) has built.
What you’ve presented as “WAY out there” has little in common with reality.
I’d suggest you hunt down Mr. Kia’s link and get a few facts. You may well disagree with her politics, and that’s fine. Just do so for the right reasons.
Do me a huge favor… please don’t predict the Cubs in the World Series!!!!
I second that request, MrC! ;-)
GMC..so are you saying she doesn’t believe any of that?
So tell me…where does she stand on those issues I listed above? And please be specific.
How does a librarian show support or lack of, for the mayor? Not being on her campaign, being on the campaign of the opposition?
It’s a small town. Anybody who has lived in one can tell you how divided they can become, sometimes over something as simple as a disagreement in the past between two people.
Sara has her fans in Wasilla, but she also has those who don’t like her. The question then is just how many of the latter are vocal about that or even admit it, knowing how quickly some have lost their jobs.
I should have said how many of the former would admit to not being a fan.
And why don’t they let her talk to the press if not for the fear of what she might say?
Chase down the link, Mary. It’s right there.
How much money is she saving Alaska, if Alaska still maintains the Governor’s mansion in Juneau, and in addition pays sarah a per diem, because she doesn’t want to live there. No wonder the chef was re-assigned, she’d either have been cooking for herself or going to Sarah’s to cook.
You can bet she’s getting a crash course right now of what she can and can’t say to the press.
Her views on these issues have been well documented. Funny how the video where she’s speaking at her church and telling the congregation that “God ordered the Iraqi invasion” got pulled off you tube and her facebook got scrubbed the day after McCain announced his selection for VP!
The left, in their nasty, rabid treatment of Sarah Palin, reminds me of Terminator 3, in the scene at the end when the female terminator has been cut in half by the door, but is still raging, screaming, pulling herself toward the object of her hate. Until Ahnold shoves the explosive in her mouth, and holds it closed saying; “You ah tuhminated”.
Of course, in a larger sense humanity loses the battle there too.
I’m just sitting around wondering what will get the Moose-Dresser to move on to her next speech.
She’s still reciting the “I stopped the Bridge to Nowhere” line like a Chatty-Cathy doll; oblivious that — even with the tightest winding Republic Party spin — has been proven to be a flat out lie.
The campaign handlers for John S (for Senile) McCain the Third (for Shrub’s 3rd term) certainly are not idiots. And they’ve got to cringe every time they hear Robo-Veep recite her lines — a somewhat cognizant being might skip over the most obvious and embarrassing lines in her stump speech. But not the Alaskan Baby-Farmer! She plows through the same lines and the CONs eat it up like she’s Lynyrd Skynyrd threatening to not play “Freebird.”
I suspect the SnowBilly learned her speech phonetically.
If you think you’ve had a tough week, try being Joe Lieberman trying to tutor Miss Congeniality 1982 on foreign policy. Like coaching her about who are the Sunis and which are the Shi’ites.
(JOE: Word to the wise. Don’t ask the old man.)
Apparently she must have just wanted to be a GOBN player and hand out positions to friends. The reformer America needs.
Will we have to pay her a per diem if she chooses to stay in Alaska and work from there, if she’s elected?
Is that why bush spent so much time at the ranch?
The half body would be reciting “I stopped the bridge to nowhere, I stopped…”
“Obama is clean and articulate” - Joe Biden
“Obama is not ready to be Presidenty” - Joe Biden
“I support John McCain, he is my friend, he would make a great President.” - Joe Biden
An interview filmed over two days sounds more like it’s “Meet the Real Sarah” instead of an interview. Going to be massive editing, wonder what the edit deal consist of?
That’s why they picked Sarah, every other candidate had said something bad about mccain, and they had to go to the frozen frontier to find someone whose words about mccain wouldn’t be used against them.
Obama does appear clean and articulate. Sarah appears clean and uh, uh, sort of articulate.
GMC70 posted September 9, 2008 at 5:19 pm
“Are you talking about the Sarah Palin? Or the straw representation of Sarah Palin that the left (with a compliant media) has built.”
——-
How about the Sarah Palin who falsely claims that 1.5 MILLION acres is a “little 2,000 acre plot of land”?
The “2,000-acres” is a non-contiguous limit on the “maximum surface acreage covered” over all of the 1.5 MILLION acres.
Is Palin very confused and/or misinformed on a long-debated issue? Or is she a LIAR?
GMC..I checked out the link and the only thing that it disputes is that she would only consider abortion to save the life of a mother.
It also said she believed that students should be able to debate creationism vs evolution in public schools.
It didn’t address her statement about the Iraqi war ot that she opposes sex education (she believes that abstinence only should be taught)in schools.
I don’t think the press has been unfair as far as reporting what she believes.
There, right on cue, is the broken record of the WE Blog, cosmos.
The designated obsessive compulsive, who keeps repeating the same thing over and over, then runs off to recount his underwear over and over.
Tomorrow, cosmos will demonstrate how he recounts his kitchen matches over and over.
OK, let’s all be honest. If Dan Quayle or George W. Bush had moments like these, it would be headlines for months, if not years!
Obama is magnificent reading a tele-prompter but he’s a high school level debater- maybe that’s unfair to the high school debaters- without one.
This man is SO totally unprepared and unqualified to be President. Click below:
Another stunning Obama tape has emerged. In a weekend appearance, Obama stumbled over his words in a way that would have received round-the-clock coverage had it been George W. Bush. In a second clip, Obama blames it on sleep deprivation. This is the guy who wants to run your health care.
You Tube Obama Videos, Obama Gaffes:
The second on takes a half a minute to load, but it does eventually, and is well worth it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxBX8sz3tO8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbpWonUzlrc
So who’s that Tim Conway impersonator who comes on stage after the Moose-Dresser’s campaign appearances?
Multi-nic’d Regular posted September 9, 2008 at 5:43 pm
“There, right on cue, is the broken record of the WE Blog, cosmos.”
——-
There, right on cue, is the WE Blog’s troll, multi-nic’d Regular, with his stupid ad hominems.
No way, no how, no Sarah Palin.
The cons are having a little bit of fun. Oh and the christo fascists are about as happy as they could be short the rapture.
But the fact of it is, Sarah Palin only brings home disaffected Republicans. She is not only bush again. She is bush raised to the nth power.
Rational people will know this.
How Obama lost the election — Asia Times, online
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/JI03Aa02.html
Why didn’t Obama choose Hillary? The most credible explanation came from veteran columnist Robert Novak May 10, who reports that Michelle Obama vetoed Hillary’s candidacy.
“If Novak’s report is accurate, then Michelle’s anger will have lost the election for Obama, as Achilles’ anger nearly killed the Greek cause in the Trojan War. But the responsibility rests not with Michelle, but with Obama. Obama’s failure of nerve at the cusp of his success is consistent with my profile of the candidate, in which I predicted that he would self-destruct. It’s happening faster than I expected. As I wrote last February:
It is conceivable that Barack Obama, if elected, will destroy himself before he destroys the country. Hatred is a toxic diet even for someone with as strong a stomach as Obama … Both Obama and the American public should be very careful of what they wish for. As the horrible example of Obama’s father shows, there is nothing worse for an embittered outsider manipulating the system from within than to achieve his goals.
By all rights, the Democrats should win this election. They will lose, I predict, because of the flawed character of their candidate.”
Obama:
Obama poked fun of McCain and Palin’s new “change”.
“You can put lipstick on a pig,” he said as the crowd cheered. “It’s still a pig.”
“You can wrap an old fish in a piece of paper called change. It’s still gonna stink.”
Obama is running scared now, and starting to self destruct. Hum….couldn’t happen to a nicer guy at a nicer time, ha.
““You can put lipstick on a pig,” he said as the crowd cheered. “It’s still a pig.”
The crowd did not merely cheer.
It roared! And so did I!
It’s a perfect line very skillfully played.
See the thing is boxy? Only people like you like Sarah Palin.
And fortunately, most people are not like you.
Sarah Palin is an interesting mix as a candidate. On the one hand choosing her was utterly foolish. On the other hand, she is an extremely dangerous zealot.
Brand Palin works for its target market. Not so much for anybody else.
Still spitting and spraying Junior?
” Unfortunately in this country, brains are considered a political disability. ” — jed
It’s like being interviewed for a job at Wal-Mart.
“But the fact of it is, Sarah Palin only brings home disaffected Republicans.”
Apparently, there are a few who disagree with you.
“McCain Now Winning Majority of Independents”
http://www.gallup.com/poll/110137/McCain-Now-Winning-Majority-Independents.aspx
Well Boxlock, it has to be quite disconcerting for this Harvard educated lawyer, annointed to the One, to be derailed by this remarkable woman who rose from the ordinary people of Alaska.
He is probably not thinking right.
“Anybody who believes that the Republicans, whoever they are, can fix the mess they created probably believes that the iceberg could have saved the Titanic,” said Hillary Clinton”
Oil prices up and the Democratic Congress and Democratic Senate block drilling and she says Republicans?
She should be checked for drugs.
I’m not seeing Palin win over any voters to McCain in this forum or elsewhere.
Senator Barack Obama said the light would shine down on me. I’d have an epiphany and say “I have to vote for Barack.
It didn’t happen.
I’m not real sure what an “epiphany” is supposed to feel like. But I feel something coming on.
A sensation is coming over me. I am realizing that in order to keep this country from sliding backwards 50 years; in order to keep an inexperienced arguably crazy zealot out of office…
I HAVE to vote against McCain/Palin.
BlueJay
““You can put lipstick on a pig,” he said as the crowd cheered. “It’s still a pig.”
The crowd did not merely cheer.
You can attend a white hating Church but in the end you will screw up and say the truth
- Obama the Muslim who finally says -
“my Muslim faith”.
At least liberal baby killers can say our man said the truth once.
“See the thing is boxy? Only people like you like Sarah Palin”.
And fortunately, most people are not like you.
————–
Hmmm… that’s not what the polls seem to be saying. But, maybe if you repeat it enough, it will come true for you BJ.
Obama’s not an idiot. He knows where the trouble is coming from. But he can’t figure out how to handle it.
But resorting to calling Sarah Palin a pig is not a good start.
“- Obama the Muslim who finally says -
“my Muslim faith”.”
Link?
“Oil prices up and the Democratic Congress and Democratic Senate block drilling and she says Republicans? ”
Oh I don’t know.
The President is a Republican. HE is in charge of foreign policy.
He has spent billions of dollars invading and occupying Iraq. Which just happens to hold the second largest oil reserve on the planet.
What am I missing here? Why are gas prices high with our troops standing on all that oil?
Where are the advantages of empire to do along with the costs? Other than to the oil companies I mean.
CFMT says >>>>
“Joe Biden will withdrawl as Obama’s running mate due to an illness or some sort of family crisis.”
Gee, I heard that RUMOR last nite on a talk radio show… sheer speculation as to why Biden was allegedly to meet with Clinton today (didnt say if Bill, or Hillary)….
And oh boy, the horses were off to the races!! Biden is dying… Biden has a family crisis… Biden this… Biden that…
And did he REALLY meet with a Clinton today at all???
Geez… this whole damned election is playing off of the RUMOR MILL, from which there are never worker strikes!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKGdkqfBICw
#
bth
Posted September 9, 2008 at 6:51 pm | Permalink
“- Obama the Muslim who finally says -
“my Muslim faith”.”
Link?
BlueJay
“I’m not seeing Palin win over any voters to McCain in this forum or elsewhere.”
Not true. As if you would like to hear the truth.
I’ve repeatedly said I am now voting for McCain because of Palin.
I also know several people who like me were going to vote for “None of the Above” until Palin.
I don’t like McCain at all its just that he is running against somebody who is clearly EVIL.
Palin for President.
Kandi — If you have such a problem distinguishing good from evil, you should probably not vote at all…
On the other hand, if you go around seeing signs of Evil, I can recommend a few good psychiatrists who are taking new patients…
:roll:
BlueJay
“She is not only bush again. She is bush raised to the nth power.”
Dream on Bush wanted to get along with liberals he never did realize there is no middle ground between good and evil.
Palin realizes this and unlike Bush she is a conservative.
For the record Kandisue?
I happen to think you are evil. And maybe more than a little bit crazy.
You never did answer me. If a woman is raped, should she be forced to carry to term if she is impregnated?
Sarah Palin thinks so. How about you?
What would Kandisue tell that rape victim?
If she’s raped by father or brother, should she have to carry it too?
You can put lipstick on a female pitbull, it’s still a bitch.
Unfortunately Phantom, this IS the truth.
Kandisue posts:
“I don’t like McCain at all its just that he is running against somebody who is clearly EVIL.
Palin for President.”
I like him a lot better now, and my opinion of his judgment has risen considerable, since he was wise and insightful enough to choose Palin as his running mate.
With all due respect intended, ‘That girl’s got what it takes’…’Her folks brought her up right’ and she has continued on that path.
I am so hoping for 4 years of McCain/Palin and then 8 years of Palin/whoever, she in her wisdom chooses.
I know I am getting ahead of things, but she has the smarts, experience, record, and from what I see everything else it takes to grow into what this country needs.
And damn the liberal/socialists for the cheap baseless attacks on her and her family. It shows the shallowness of their character.
#
Phantom
Posted September 9, 2008 at 7:09 pm | Permalink
You can put lipstick on a female pitbull, it’s still a bitch.
——————
Nice Phantom.
For a while at least, whenever you post something when I am on, a copy of this will follow it.
Pathetic
BlueJay
For the record Kandisue?
“I happen to think you are evil. And maybe more than a little bit crazy.
You never did answer me. If a woman is raped, should she be forced to carry to term if she is impregnated?
Sarah Palin thinks so. How about you?”
What would Kandisue tell that rape victim?”
———————————————-
Just so you know -
I think anybody who supports abortion or those who support those who support it are Evil -
this includes you as well.
Now whether you or those who support this evil will ultimately end up in Hell - I can’t say - but I sure wouldn’t want to be in your shoes when you find out.
When you say carry to term? Carry what to term?
Chas
“Kandi
On the other hand, if you go around seeing signs of Evil, I can recommend a few good psychiatrists who are taking new patients…”
Have they helped you?
How so?
Please be specific.
Thanks
You know, I think that there should be an exception for rape victims, incest, and legitimate threat to the life of the mom. So I differ with Sarah Pain on that. Of course, that would never become the law of the land anyway.
But the Democratic platform does not even oppose partial birth abortion. It is abortion on demand, anytime under any circumstances, plus the parents have no rights in the event of a minor’s pregnancy.
So Sarah Palin doesn’t agree with me 100%. You ever have a politician that agreed with you 100%? I would urge her to soften her stance a bit. But it is not a hard decision for me to determine who is closest to my beliefs.
Ooooh she even capitalized evil!
No caps in my right back atcha though. Kandisue clearly having some mental issues.
So Kandi? How are you going to force a woman to carry to term? Are you going to strap her to a gurney? Maybe put her in a straitjacket?
Forcing a rape victim to carry to term is a winner with maybe what 5% of the people of this country?
I wonder if this defense of Sarah Palin’s honor will continue un broken if it is found out she was banging her husband’s best friend?
I am waiting to find out what Blue Jay thinks women should not be forced to carry to term.
“I am waiting to find out what Blue Jay thinks women should not be forced to carry to term.”
A down syndrome afflicted pregnancy for starters there Deb. Sarah Palin made an admirable choice carrying a Down pregnancy to term.
She HAD a choice. But she would deny that choice to others. That removes the nobility of her own choice and diminishes others who choose as she did.
bth,
I caution you on Regular’s link to the “Muslim” quote video. I haven’t checked his link, but there are 2, one the shortened version that I suspect is the one Reg posted, the other the full version.
BlueJay
“I wonder if this defense of Sarah Palin’s honor will continue un broken if it is found out she was banging her husband’s best friend?”
I still want to know if michele obama has killed any of her babies.
If she has killed any, how many voters for obama the muslim will he lose?
Sarah Palin for President.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnxFrORjuWs
Good grief, I just watched the so-called, “Muslim Faith” quote, and if that’s all you got, the Palin is a commie ’cause Alaska is so close to Russia.
Talk about pure Wango linear logic: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
She also made a difficult choice she could well afford to make. Not everyone can get a per diem for staying at home, or make the bucks that she does. Alot of parents would’ve had to take into account the consequences for their other children.
BlueJay
“She HAD a choice. ”
———————————–
Capitalization?
Both side of your mouth?
I take it you must be a liberal.
Yes, they wouldn’t hold a mistake against sweet Sarah (long as she doesn’t lie about it, right?) I mean cons. think that is a family affair, best kept out of the media, and shouldn’t affect performance in the W.H.
Kandisue
Posted September 9, 2008 at 9:18 pm | Permalink
BlueJay
“I wonder if this defense of Sarah Palin’s honor will continue un broken if it is found out she was banging her husband’s best friend?”
I still want to know if michele obama has killed any of her babies.
If she has killed any, how many voters for obama the muslim will he lose?
========================================================
Kandibrain, you gotta be the dumbest broad on the planet. DON’T REPRODUCE!!!!!
Decision, decisions, do I abort and commit political suicide, or do I bear it, and become a modern day saint? What to do!
JMWalker
Good grief, I just watched the so-called, “Muslim Faith” quote,
______________________________________________
How long does it take to say “my muslim faith”?
He said it - I’m just glad he is finally admitting the truth.
He is a muslim. I’ve been saying it for along time but for those of you who still think OJ is innocent you won’t belive him even if he admits it.
KANDI — YOU ARE ONE SICK COOKIE!!
GET SOME HELP WHILE YOU STILL CAN….
ONLY EVIL PEOPLE HAVE NO FEELINGS FOR THE PAIN OF OTHERS…. THAT WOULD BE YOU…
Anybody who would FORCE a woman to carry a birth to term, as the result of incest or rape, has to be Evil Incarnate…
Shame on you Kandi!! And you call yourself a believer?? In what?? Fantasy??
“Kandibrain, you gotta be the dumbest broad on the planet. DON’T REPRODUCE!!!!!”
I don’t think she gets many offers. Hence the seething hatred.
You know I bet there is a phrase somewhere out there that can be taken totally out of context and played over and over again to make Palin or McSame look evil.
Oh wait…not out of context at all “bomb bomb bomb iran”. …
So, JM, it’s OK for JR to make unsupported allegations as to an affair, but not OK for Kandisue to make in retaliation, an unsupported allegation regarding an abortion?
That’s not how I would handle it, but I can understand why Kandisue would retaliate. I would Handle it by just re-posting the idiocy and hate for everyone to see, kind of like I’ll be doing for Phantom for a while.
Sarah Palin REMOVED a law stating that rape victims would not be responsible for her own criminal rape tests. Now that’s the lowest of the low no matter who you are.
The reason Sarah Palin keeps saying the same exact lying talking points over and over is because she hasn’t learned to speak on her own yet. She hasn’t been properly trained yet.
Phantom’s idea of political discourse. Leftist hate.
—————–
Phantom
Posted September 9, 2008 at 7:09 pm | Permalink
You can put lipstick on a female pitbull, it’s still a bitch.
Very poor indeed, directly post convention to be only 2 pts ahead on a neocon poll. I don’t think they’re doing so hot.
OMG Outlander- how many hateful things have we put up with from the right. Don’t act like your sheet don’t stink.
olitical_mama
Posted September 9, 2008 at 9:38 pm | Permalink
Sarah Palin REMOVED a law stating that rape victims would not be responsible for her own criminal rape tests. Now that’s the lowest of the low no matter who you are.
————
Wow! The yappy little lib blog dogs keep barking out the lies.
Hey outlander, What Phantom said…. Is there something NOT true about it???
Did Phantom use any NAMES???
If not, get over it… move on…
And maybe get some of your furry friends to stop with the “Obama is a Moslem” CRAP!!!
I don’t think Obama is a Muslim. But why do you think being a Muslim is a bad thing, Chas?
Obama passed a law for Chicago that allowed black men who raped women parole for their first offense.
Now that is lower than low. I don’t care who you are.
“So, JM, it’s OK for JR to make unsupported allegations as to an affair”
Go back and read again outlander. I included “if” in my post.
That “if” is currently headlines at every checkstand in this country.
I’ve posted none of the speculation behind that headline. That is the job of those behind it.
“I am waiting to find out what Blue Jay thinks women should not be forced to carry to term.” posted by Deb
“A down syndrome afflicted pregnancy for starters there Deb. Sarah Palin made an admirable choice carrying a Down pregnancy to term.” posted by Blue Jay
“pregnancy” is the condition of being pregnant.
Pregnant with what? What is it that has Down’s syndrome?
“Sarah Palin REMOVED a law stating that rape victims would not be responsible for her own criminal rape tests. Now that’s the lowest of the low no matter who you are.”
More please? A link?
#
BlueJay
Posted September 9, 2008 at 9:50 pm | Permalink
“Sarah Palin REMOVED a law stating that rape victims would not be responsible for her own criminal rape tests. Now that’s the lowest of the low no matter who you are.”
More please? A link?
—–
While your at it, how about a link to the McCain cunt story?
Hi Deb, you’re new. I guess.
The cons here, they engage in nic switching. SO it’s always hard to tell.
I’m a single dad Deb. Do you have any kids?
“While your at it, how about a link to the McCain cunt story?”
Hi Joyce. I have not posted much as to that story.
P.M. BloJob
Joyce, still pushin’ the Hank theme??? What a freakin’ retard BlueJay is….no wonder he can’t hold down a job and provide his son with insurance..
Blue Jay, you haven’t answered my question.
Yes, I have children. Lots of them. In fact I have seven. Yes, I have grieved over miscarriages. Yes, I am married to their father. No, we are not on welfare. Is there anything else you need to know for me to be able to speak on this forum? Yes, I spend countless hours volunteering with a youth organization, I’ve taught special education children, including those with Down’s syndrome, I’ve tutored “at risk” children and I’ve worked with handicapped children at a camp.
Having been pregnant 9 times, I am still wondering what it is that women should not be forced to carry to term?
and now you know
=
“He’s one of them – she’s one of us
© 2008
One wonders: What did Sarah Palin ever do to inspire the rage and bile that exploded on her selection by John McCain? What is there either in this woman’s record or resume to elicit such feline ferocity?
What did we know of her when she was introduced?
That she was a mother of five who had brought into this world a baby boy with Down syndrome, thus living her Christian beliefs. That she was a small-town conservative who had risen from mayor of Wasilla (population 9,700) to be governor of a state twice the size of Texas.
That she was a reformer who had dethroned an old boys’ network by dumping a sitting Republican governor. That she had taken on Big Oil, taxed the companies and returned the money in $1,200 checks to every citizen of Alaska. And that she had cut a deal with Canada to build a pipeline to bring natural gas to her fellow Americans.
And, oh, yes. She was “Sarah Barracuda” – a fierce high school athlete, a runner-up in the Miss Alaska pageant, a Feminist for Life and lifetime member of the NRA. Introduced by McCain, she praised Hillary Clinton and pledged to finish her work by smashing through the glass ceiling in which Hillary had made 18 million cracks.
What, in any or all of this, is there to justify the feral attacks within minutes of her introduction? What had she done to cause this outburst? Answer: absolutely nothing.
No. Sarah Palin is not resented for what she has done, but for who she is: a Christian conservative who believes unborn children are gifts of God, even those with birth defects, and have a God-given right to life.
Normally, the press is reluctant to rummage into the private lives of public servants, unless their conduct affects their duties or they preach virtues they hypocritically do not practice.
Yet, no sooner was Palin introduced than the media went berserk over the news that her 17-year-old daughter is pregnant. As one in three births in America is out-of-wedlock and Hollywood celebrates this lifestyle, why did the New York Times and the Washington Post splash this “news” on Page 1 above the fold?
How does Bristol Palin’s pregnancy disqualify Sarah Palin to be vice president? Why is it even relevant?
They did it because they thought it would damage Sarah Palin in the eyes of a Christian community they do not comprehend.
So out of bounds was the media that Obama, in an act of decency, declared Palin’s family off limits and reminded the media that he was himself born to a teenage single mom.
If one would wish to see the famous liberal double standard on naked display, consider.
Palin’s daughter was fair game for a media that refused to look into reports that John Edwards, a Democratic candidate for president, was conducting an illicit affair with a woman said to be carrying his child and cheating on his faithful wife, Elizabeth, who has incurable cancer. That was not a legitimate story, but Bristol Palin’s pregnancy is?
Why did the selection of Sarah Palin cause a suspension of all standards and a near riot among a media that have been so in the tank for Barack even “Saturday Night Live” has satirized the infatuation?
Because she is one of us – and he is one of them.
Barack and Michelle are affirmative action, Princeton, Columbia, Harvard Law. She is public schools and Idaho State. Barack was a Saul Alinsky social worker who rustled up food stamps. Sarah Palin kills her own food.
Michelle has a $300,000-a-year sinecure doing PR for a Chicago hospital. Todd Palin is a union steelworker who augments his income working vacations on the North Slope. Sarah has always been proud to be an American. Michelle was never proud of America – until Barack started winning.
Barack has zero experience as an executive. Sarah ran her own fishing fleet, was mayor for six years and runs the largest state in the union. She belongs to a mainstream Christian church. Barack was, for 15 years, a parishioner at Trinity United and had his daughters baptized by Pastor Jeremiah Wright, whose sermons are saturated in black power, anti-white racism and anti-Americanism.
Sarah is a rebel. Obama has been a go-along, get-along cog in the Daley Machine. She is Middle America. Barack, behind closed doors in San Francisco, mocked Middle Americans as folks left behind by the global economy who cling bitterly to their Bibles, bigotries and guns.
Barack has zero foreign policy experience. Palin runs a state that is home to anti-missile, missile and air defense bases facing the Far East, commands the Alaska National Guard and has a soldier-son heading for Iraq.
Barack, says the National Journal, has the most left-wing voting record in the Senate, besting Socialist Bernie Sanders. Palin’s stances read as though they were lifted from Reagan’s 1980 “no pale pastels” platform. And this is what this media firestorm is all about.”
I have you only at your word Deb.
“Is there anything else you need to know for me to be able to speak on this forum? ”
I don’t think I in any way tried to silence you.
IF you are a new poster, you will be surprised to learn that I was once “pro life”. I was at the “summer of mercy”.
But the REAL causes of women choosing to end pregnancy cannot be addressed successfully with laws and dictates.
MY candidate for President was Senator Hillary Clinton. She said that it takes a village to raise a child. I don’t call that a perfect answer. But it is a start.
Sarah Palin would make ending a pregnancy ILLEGAL even in the instance of rape. That is not an answer to a problem. It is punishment for disagreement with her personal beliefs.
Evidently P.M. is spewing her typical ignorant lies, as she has nothing to back them up. When called on said lies she always runs away.
“Palin’s daughter was fair game for a media that refused to look into reports that John Edwards, a Democratic candidate for president, was conducting an illicit affair with a woman said to be carrying his child and cheating on his faithful wife, Elizabeth, who has incurable cancer. That was not a legitimate story, but Bristol Palin’s pregnancy is?”
This is what happens when a candidate evades the press as Sarah Palin has Kandisue.
And while you are being concerned about the media, I remind you that the media avoided coverage of John Edwards’s affair.
Are they doing the same thing now for Sarah Palin?
The same investigators who went after and caught Edwards now say they have Palin in an affair. SURELY you want to know more.
To keep up the appearance you are not a hypocrite?
The same investigators who went after and caught Edwards now say they have Palin in an affair. SURELY you want to know more.
—-
They got the Edwards story right, but not the thousands of Elvis baby/Alien baby stories.
“So I differ with Sarah Pain [sic]…”
Mike, those Freudain slips are telling on you…
You guys are always good for some laughs.
Listening to the same lies repeated over and over must be Pain.
Regular
Posted September 9, 2008 at 6:30 pm | Permalink
Still spitting and spraying Junior?
*****
Come on James, it is not like you are Clark Kent or anyone like that.
And, J R, I think it is time to stop the James attacks on his appearance. Email me and I can tell you more than this.
Capn, while I appreciate the humor, the whole AquaLung thing is getting old, too.
Why don’t I like Sarah Palin? Easy: she lies like she breathes (the plane wasn’t sold on Ebay, but to a Republican millionaire at a loss), is a shameless hypocrite (great job snapping up those millions in Federal earmarks while posing as a reformer who passed them by), and routinely abuses the power of her office for personal vendettas (Troopergate) and personal gain (charging the state of Alaska per diems for the nights she slept at home).
In other words, she’s the Second Coming of Bush/Cheney. Eight years was more than enough the first time, thanks.
Then there’s her willingness to serve as a Karl Rove action figure whose job, alternatively, is a) to act like the Kid Sister who hides behind her brother’s legs while hurling spitballs, while also b) serving as a female human shield to enable the McCain to deflect all legitimate attacks as “sexist.”
Presenting herself as less than a full candidate who can’t mix it up with the boys on the one hand, while on the other also being off-limits to attacks because of her gender, actually sets the cause of women back several decades. Whatever good her governorship did for the cause of women in American politics has been overshadowed by the way she’s allowing herself to be used–and using herself–under the direction of the McCain campaign.
Sarah Palin’s lack of self-respect is exceeded only by John McCain’s lack of honor. They are as deserving of one another as the Republican Party is deserving of them both.
http://www.frontiersman.com/articles/2000/05/23/news.txt
There’s the story from an old Alaska paper that started the Palin charges for rape kits story. I don’t even know if Palin was mayor then. You figure it out
Deb I’m glad you’ve never felt the need to make the heartwrenching decision a pregnant woman in crisis needs to make. Good for you. You do well with kids- good for you. Not all women are like you.
Some are poor- some are ill equipped mentally, some are young, some are battling substance abuse, some are facing major threats to their own health, some are carrying fetuses so disabled that the mother feels that it is worse for the child to bring it into the world to live a life of pain.
WORKING with disabled kids is nothing like ‘owning’ one. I mean give me a break.
At the end of the day you get to go home. You don’t have to pay for their care. You don’t have to watch them suffer day in and day out. You don’t have to worry about who will care for them when you die. And you don’t have to worry about if they’ll be abused when you can’t protect them. Never worry about losing your career to stay home and care for them- and even then- who will care for you. What about your other kids.
Apparently, C3PO and other democrats don’t like a dose of their own medicine.
WORKING with disabled kids is nothing like ‘owning’ one. I mean give me a break.
—–
I bought one last week, housebroken and everything….maybe you should find a different breeder.
“Presenting herself as less than a full candidate who can’t mix it up with the boys on the one hand, while on the other also being off-limits to attacks because of her gender, actually sets the cause of women back several decades. Whatever good her governorship did for the cause of women in American politics has been overshadowed by the way she’s allowing herself to be used–and using herself–under the direction of the McCain campaign.”
As usual, Mr. CF, excellent points. While, I agree with this conclusion: “being off-limits to attacks because of her gender, actually sets the cause of women back several decades.” What are your suggestions on dealing with this problem?
Oh the right are such hypocrites. Won’t even question the woman on why she put her pregnancy and her life in danger just so she could have the baby in Alaska? That’s absurd.
I’m telling you, Palin has never said she gave birth to Trig- and although Bristol might not be the mother- it aint Palin.
Nathan, you got some kind of link for your racist diatribe upthread aabout Obama “passing a law” that lets black men off with parole on a rape conviction??
See, Obama cant PASS laws….
LINK PLEASE????
I put that ‘owning’ in paraphrase for a reason Anti.
you know palin’s sister also has a disabled child. Where was she during the gestational period.
I’m telling you, Palin has never said she gave birth to Trig- and although Bristol might not be the mother- it aint Palin.
——
Liberal retardation at it’s finest!
Oh yea, Nathan, it wouldnt have been a law for CHICAGO Black men…. It would have had to be a law for the entire State of Illinois…
AGAIN, LINK PLEASE???
sentencing should be up to the judges- and what reason does a man have to leave a woman alive if he’s going to get the exact same punishment for raping and murder? He’ll not leave behind the witness.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/015/427xjuoj.asp
[Sarah Palin:] “One of the pieces of a solution is allowing exploration on that little 2,000 acre plot of land out of the 20 million acres up there in the coastal plain.”
A speculative map of Sarah Palin’s “little 2,000 acre plot of land”.
http://www.inforain.org/Northslope/anwr_3.html
Retardation is you anti- and Palin for flying when her water was broken if true!
This is the last time I will say this:
TO FORCE A WOMAN TO CARRY A PREGNANCY TO TERM, EVEN WHEN RAPED, OR BY REASON OF INCEST, IS NOTHING BUT PURE EVIL.
you know palin’s sister also has a disabled child. Where was she during the gestational period.
——
Attached to the baby in her belly I would guess.
Pmom,
Trolls are not worth responding to. Some are so dumb that they are quite laughable.
#
Political_mama
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:07 pm | Permalink
Retardation is you anti- and Palin for flying when her water was broken if true!
—–
Your proof? Don’t tell me you heard it from the same guy that told you about the McCunt story! Meth is a hell of a drug. Seek help.
MOST OF US HAVE SAID pLIN’S FAMILY ISSUES AER OFF LIMITS….
Why would YOU, ANTI (beast) choose to drag up another Palin family matter??
Oh yea, LINK PLEASE??
Oh look, there he is!
StevenEDavis
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:10 pm | Permalink
#
Chas
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:11 pm | Permalink
MOST OF US HAVE SAID pLIN’S FAMILY ISSUES AER OFF LIMITS….
Why would YOU, ANTI (beast) choose to drag up another Palin family matter??
Oh yea, LINK PLEASE??
——
WOW, uh I didn’t…..Hold on Chas, I need to get an Apache(?) linguist to decipher your writing…If not Apache please tell me so I can save on my long distance phone call.
Did you know that while Obama was a community organizer that he helped black men who were convicted rapists get back into their community, several of whom were repeat offenders?
He did this by bringing law suits against anyone who wouldn’t hire them because they were rapists.
Steven Davis,
If the Repukes want to tell soft-focus human interest stories about Sarah Palin, respond by making her own her record. This is pretty much what the Obama campaign is doing now, actually. And given the McCain campaign’s total lack of any vetting, there’s lots and lots of details that have yet to be aired.
Keep hitting the dissonance between what she’s saying now and what she’s said and done in the past. It won’t affect the Fundos, but all the sane people will begin to sense that something isn’t right.
Above all, keep pointing out that she’s a bald-faced liar, and tie that skill back to George W. Bush. The brand “Palin equals ‘lying politician’ needs to be cemented NOW. Attack her character, since this is what Rove is most intensely focused on fabricating. And with this groundwork laid, Biden can go right at her lack of truthfulness.
Those are my two bits. Hope Obama and Biden are checking the Weblog.
Thank you C3PO, we did not notice this ’strategy’ of the left…..HA HA HA!!!! Seriously, are you still playing with wooden blocks? Linkin logs? Chutes and Ladders?
Trolls are not worth responding to. Some are so dumb that they are quite laughable. When you respond to them, you are too. Get a clue.
I will take this short amount of time to remind people with brains, that “Anti” started out as “Anti-J R”. His/Her whole identity was in opposition to another poster - setting him/herself as only being uni-dimensional - against another as opposed to having anything of value to say for him/herself. He is the troll of trolls. Put him/her/it on ignore. Simple. Plus he is a dumbass of the most obvious variety.
Night all.
StevenEDavis is BlueJay
Let’s have a link Nathan.
Unless of course you are a liar like your father and step mother.
ANTI
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:08 pm | Permalink
you know palin’s sister also has a disabled child. Where was she during the gestational period.
=============================================
Ummmmmm you say this isnt yours??
yep…just keep right on attacking her.
That’s working so far.
::: laughing all the way to the White House :::
SED, you are just pissed because I point out the Left’s(yours) faults…Sorry the truth hurts. Did you little freaks think you could get away with your kookiness forever?
Nathan, you got some kind of link for your racist diatribe upthread aabout Obama “passing a law” that lets black men off with parole on a rape conviction??
See, Obama cant PASS laws….
LINK PLEASE????
#
Chas
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:28 pm | Permalink
ANTI
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:08 pm | Permalink
you know palin’s sister also has a disabled child. Where was she during the gestational period.
=============================================
Ummmmmm you say this isnt yours??
—–
That is half my post- it is originally written by P.M….Idiot.
#
ANTI
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:08 pm | Permalink
you know palin’s sister also has a disabled child. Where was she during the gestational period.
——
Attached to the baby in her belly I would guess.
—-
That is the whole post Chas/Idiot.
Identity confusion and the irrelevance of nics.
The right sowed that here.
No, “ANTI” Steven is not me.
Now I have said who it is I think you are “ANTI” and just why it is you started posting here under “ANTI J R”.
Prove otherwise or wear it.
Ummmm Auntie, you ever hear of “quotes”???
LOL
BJ is SED
I will not deal with Palin’s personal family matters, UNLESS she (Ms. Palin) drags them into focus…. I suggest the rest of us do the same…. BOTH SIDES OF THE ISSUE!!!
#
Chas
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:32 pm | Permalink
Ummmm Auntie, you ever hear of “quotes”???
LOL
——-
You ever hear of a Styrofoam helmet?? It would have saved your smarts! LOL, LMAO, !!!, ASDFASFSEE, ???, and so forth.
Political Mama:
“WORKING with disabled kids is nothing like ‘owning’ one. I mean give me a break.”
I spent much of 4 years with a sibling who was dying of cancer, including helping with care, so I am not exactly inexperienced in this area of day to day living with the disabled.
You have a tough job, and I hope their are others who are able to help you with your load of cares as you serve your family.
While I believe that life in the womb truly is life and should be honored as such, I am aware that there are awful situations out there that women find themselves in. There is enough work out there for all of us to jump and help with.
Check ya later fools.
ANTI is a troll
re: ANTI
DNFTT
Apparently Nathan has NO LINK for his vitriolic spew about Obama and rapist convictions… How typical… More Right Wing CRAP!!
And all because a Black man is candidate for President!! Damn, racism dies hard in this country!!!
Well Hank is all the time inviting people to lunch.
I volunteer to meet and greet “ANTI”. Hey I’ve met more posters than anyone else here.
I feel obligated since that poster came to this forum as “ANTI J R”
What say you “ANTI”? Do you have more guts than Sarah Palin?
Deb, dying of cancer really sucks too. But in that- even then you know there will be an end…it may be a long prolonged painful death- but there will be an end to it.
I love my son very very much. I don’t say that often enough on here because I’m trying to make points. He has value and quality of life- even if it is very difficult. Its hard when I cannot protect him and worry about how other kids will hurt him, how he wants to have friends, how it is so hard for him to follow simple instructions- which frustrates him. If something ever happens to me- I’d rather him pass away than to see him in a crappy group home.
So is that wrong to think that? Someone tell me- why is that wrong?
More importantly, how is it appropriate for this forum?
Keep up or shut up testicle.
Look at the topic, PMom. Please. Take it offline.
Thank you, Nora.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqSHPsY2bY4&feature=related
ANTI
Posted September 9, 2008 at 11:33 pm | Permalink
BJ is SED
*****
Glad to live inside your brain [sic] asshole…
I think Obama’s ad “That’s not a Maverick”, is a direct hit on the two repub. liars. If it were me I’d pull my ad making the false mccain/palin Maverick claims, have a little self respect.
Then there’s her willingness to serve as a Karl Rove action figure whose job, alternatively, is a) to act like the Kid Sister who hides behind her brother’s legs while hurling spitballs, while also b) serving as a female human shield to enable the McCain to deflect all legitimate attacks as “sexist.”
Let’s not forget her upcoming cozy tour of the most friendly members of the corporate press (starting with Charlie Gibson, the man who regularly watching Brit Hume’s special report and has great respect for her work).
This is not, it should be note, because Palin is too dumb to be trusted in a real interview (mortage lender comments notwithstanding). Rather it’s because of the McCain camp’s crying need to win with propaganda and spin, rather than the actual issues. The corporate media, ever fearful to the right (e.g. Olbermann and Matthews getting booted), ever more interested in a bright shiny story instead of boring substance, is all too willing to let the McCain camp get away with that.
The bar is also intentionally being lowered: Expect some time in the future something like Palin facing up to say, Wolf Blitzer, and he dares to ask an unaccommdating question, it will be portrayed as a courageous reformer facing the hostile liberal press, rather than an arrogant politician finally acknowledging some minimal obligation to respond to the Fourth Estate.
And when she gives her well-practiced competent answers (including many she’s been practicing since being mayor), expect the McCain camp to seize on the low expectations created by not only her sloppiest critics but by the McCain campaign’s paper-thin narrative itself. She will then be trumpeted as some undiscovered genius–all because she stayed on-message and didn’t make any obvious gaffe.
As far as substance goes, since her days as mayor, Ms. Palin has shown an authortarian streak a mile long, and a repeated tendency to ruthlessly go after those who get in her way. And, looking at her history, she has one subject that she gives any sustained attention: oil production. Expect her to steer the subject in that direction in any and all interviews.
She needs to be hit hard–with the facts–for now. But I hope we will eventually return to the presidential race, and not spend too long focusing on this bright shiny object. That would be a huge mistake.
No questions, please; Palin sticks to her script
By The Associated Press
09.10.08
LEBANON, Ohio — John McCain took a risk in picking little-known Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as a running mate, but now the campaign’s playing it safer. She’s sticking to a greatest-hits version of her convention speech on the campaign trail and steering clear of questions until a hand-picked interview later this week.
More than 40 million people tuned in last week to listen to the speech from Palin, the 44-year-old, first-term Republican governor whom McCain had announced as his surprise vice presidential pick just days before. Since then, that basic script is all anyone has heard from her publicly, and her only interaction with the news media was a brief conversation with a small group of reporters on her plane on Sept. 8 — off the record at campaign staffers’ insistence.
Associated Press reporters were not on the plane, but an aide told the journalists on board that all in-flight conversations with Palin would be off the record unless the media were told otherwise. At least one reporter objected. Two people on the flight said the Palins greeted the media and they chatted about who had been to Alaska, but little else was said.
By comparison, her Democratic counterpart, Joe Biden, has been campaigning on his own, at times taking questions from audiences. He split off to campaign separately from Barack Obama the day after Obama announced Biden’s selection. They reunited at their party’s convention and spent the following weekend campaigning together.
Biden’s appearances have touched on a range of issues — in Florida he talked about U.S. support for Israel, in Pennsylvania it was economics and tax policy. He was interviewed on NBC’s “Meet the Press” on Sept. 7.
Amid growing sniping from Democrats, the McCain campaign announced that Palin would sit down for her first interview this week, with ABC’s Charles Gibson. It is to take place over two days at her home in Alaska.
And then?
McCain campaign manager Rick Davis has said Palin would “agree to an interview when we think it’s time and when she feels comfortable doing it.”
“She’s not scared to answer questions,” Davis said on “Fox News Sunday.”
So far, Palin has barely spoken with voters either. Since the convention, she and McCain have breezed through a Wisconsin ice cream shop, a New Mexico restaurant and a Missouri barbecue place, shaking hands with diners but not taking any questions. Photographers and television cameras have been allowed full view while reporters are typically kept too far away to ask questions or hear most of the conversations.
Her public remarks essentially have been excerpts of her convention speech, delivered while introducing McCain at rallies.
Her schedule released yesterday said she would attend a “welcome home” rally in Fairbanks, Alaska, this evening — her first major campaign appearance without McCain at her side and his advisers hanging in the wings.
To be sure, all candidates running for office give the same remarks over and over — Barack Obama’s stump speech has hardly changed throughout the campaign and McCain has been telling familiar stories and jokes for months.
But none of the candidates in this race has been so shielded from the media, so protected from any spontaneous situation, and Palin’s unvarying remarks give the impression that she and her message are being tightly controlled. As before her convention speech, McCain’s campaign is briefing Palin for her first TV interview.
After a rally yesterday in Lancaster, Pa., a group of supporters waiting outside to shake hands with McCain and Palin screamed for her to jump up on an outdoor platform, as McCain had just done, and speak to them.
“Speech! Speech!” they cried. She continued down the line, shaking hands, and then hopped into an SUV.
http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/news.aspx?id=20513
Gov. Palin’s retreating from the press speaks far more loudly and eloquently than she apparently can on her own!
Nathaniel
“Did you know that while Obama was a community organizer that he helped black men who were convicted rapists get back into their community, several of whom were repeat offenders?
He did this by bringing law suits against anyone who wouldn’t hire them because they were rapists.”
____________________________________________________
Wow and the anti American pro Muslim Obama has not reported on this at all.
This guy is evil.
Do you have a link?
Thanks
Phantom
“I think Obama’s ad “That’s not a Maverick”, is a direct hit on the two repub. liars.”
_____________________________________________
Liars?
How about -
Obama - “I am not a Mulim”.
Obama “My Muslim Faith”.
He has to be the king of liars in the party of the immoral.
There is as much evidence that Obama is a muslim as is there is that Kandisue regularly has sex with farm animals. Therefore, if you believe the former is true, surely you must also believe the latter.
Chas
This is the last time I will say this:
TO FORCE A WOMAN TO CARRY A PREGNANCY TO TERM, EVEN WHEN RAPED, OR BY REASON OF INCEST, IS NOTHING BUT PURE EVIL.
______________________________________________
You sound so angry. Whats wrong?
How would a baby killer know what evil is?
I do indeed believe that Kandisue has sex with farm animals.
how awesome is this stuff