In my Friday column, I leap into the debate about a screaming, obscenity-laced confrontation between two debate coaches that ended up with one of them, assistant professor William Shanahan of Fort Hays State, dropping his pants, bending over and mooning his opponent with exposed underwear.
The shout-down happened at a tournament at Wichita State University earlier this year, and a video clip ended up on YouTube this month, where it quickly became a hit.
It seemed to me a pretty pathetic spectacle, and in keeping with the creeping lack of civility and restraint in our public discourse.
On Friday, Fort Hays State fired Shanahan over the incident. University president Edward Hammond said in a written statement, “Everyone has the right to freedom of speech, but these actions are not acceptable for someone who is representing our university.”
Shanahan told an interviewer: “Obviously it got out of control, but to be honest I thought I was in a safe house. I thought I was part of a community that handled its problems internally and that recognized the dangers of exposing ourselves — no pun intended — to the rest of the country. It is so difficult as a nonparticipant to understand what is going on in the debate round.”
Maybe that’s part of the problem?
35 Comments
I suppose that this could affect the level of the presidential debates too. Just think how much press you could get by mooning your opponent and having it posted on YouTube! And after all, we all got to look up President Reagan’s ass on national television coverage of his colonoscopy. What a precedent!
Once you get past the skin part Jed, everyone looks basically the same on the inside. :D
Sounded like a lively debate, maybe they’ll sell the audio and video for a University fund raiser. :D
Fort Hays State advertised itself for years as a winner of a national debate championship. Shanahan was the coach. When he’s gone, they’ll still advertise themselves as a former winner of a national debate chamionship. I always liked Shanahan.
There’s something screwy about the whole incident.
At college debate tournaments the coaches don’t debate.
Debate coaches confront other coaches over matters of judging, tactics, et cetera, in coaches’ lounges, tabulating rooms, or hallways.
Seems like a half-moon on YouTube isn’t really germane to the process at had, either to lose or keep your job.
If Mark Mangino were to drop trou on national TV and moon a referee (sorry for that mental image so early in the morning) you might have an issue.
But a debate coach from Hays America on YouTube.
I guess that’s what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps.
Shanahan is a local character out here, and he’s been a thorn in the side of the local power structure and GOBN, headed by Ed Hammond, for years. They’ve been LOOKING for an excuse to get rid of him for a very long time.
Too bad he finally gave them a reason to do it. He was an outspoken liberal in a sea of Volga German conservative catholics.
And you know, one simply may not speak to the Queen that way, as Brett Butler used to say.
Bub-bye Bill. I’ll wave at your head on the pike when I pass by. The Hays Growth Mongers not only got rid of you, but you are one in a long line of folks used as an example of what happens when you challenge the Hays power structure.
Beber is exactly right. I see it happen all the time. The GOBN take the fruits of your labor, and then kick you to the curb when it’s time to settle the accounts. But they’ll still take the fruits. Your share and theirs.
Debate has been getting worse and worse over the years as it has become quantitative instead of qualitative.
The debaters just talk as fast as they can to squeeze in as many points as they can. The opposition then has to respond to all those points and make their own.
It’s an exercise in who can talk the fastest.
They should go back to the old days when elegance of expression was valued.
Too bad Shanahan wasn’t represented by a union.
They could have tried to fire him but the union would hire an top-notch attorney to fight it in court.
Most colleges don’t want the hassle.
BUT on your own, you got nothing. You’re fair game for any administrator who doesn’t like your lip.
Okay, folks, what the heck is GOBN?
Speaking of a union…
I’m still looking for a boat. C’mon HBCers – stay strong my brothers in arms. Solidarity!
UNION YES!
UNION NOW!
public indecency, and kfg accuses some mysterious and anonymous GOBN of getting rid of this guy? That is a reach. Debate is about organized, researched and civil discourse..not screaming and disrobing.
You’ll never get your boat for 20 cents on the dollar golpher. The repossession business owned by your buddy at the country club will get it first, and I doubt that he’ll cut you a deal.
Any chance that this guy is one of our liberal Bloggers?
He has about as much class —
Accomplishments do not grant license to ignore the rules.
Those of you who act like this guy did nothing wrong are truly amazing.
Supported by taxpayer dollars, he creates a hostile work environment, presents a bad image of his school and the state, and you defend him?
It does not matter what happened before. Whatever life or reputation he had built for himself was always at risk.
That is the way it should be for all of us.
Otherwise — some people think they are above the law or above the rules.
Franklin sniffed, disapprovingly
#
CapnAmerica
Posted August 23, 2008 at 9:18 am | Permalink
Okay, folks, what the heck is GOBN?
I second. What is GOBN?
Good
Old
Boy
Network
I can understand why Franklin might think he’s up against a debate coach on the blog.
Please post where I condoned what Shanahan did.
I didnt. I didnt defend what he did. I SAID he finally gave them a reason to do what they wanted to do.
Do you all just have a problem with reading and comprehension? Both things are true. They HAVE been trying to get rid of him because of his outspoken liberalism and his opposition to the wind farm.
He WAS also wrong in what he did on the video and gave them the reason they’d been looking for to silence him. And make an example of ANYONE who opposes the power structure in Hays.
Someone said the mark of an intelligent person is that they can hold two opposing thoughts in their head at the same time.
Some of you should try it…
And captain, like you, I’m appalled at what debate has apparently become. I’m an old debater and an alum of Ft. Hays. This sounds like theater, not debate.
I still say my participation in debate was the biggest advantage I had in my career. I was always thankful for the critical thinking skills, research skills, and speaking skills I gained in that venue.
This? Bears no resemblance to what we used to do in debates. And we won.
FYI
Debated in High School and, briefly, in College.
Was also a Judge, more than once.
kfg, you said, “They HAVE been trying to get rid of him because of his outspoken liberalism and his opposition to the wind farm.”
His multiple arrests for assault probably had more to do with his dismissal. (Assaults against police officers, his son’s T-ball game referee and another spectator, his eye doctor . . . and those were just the ones that were reported.) If you’re from the area you know he has a reputation for uncivil discourse. He’s well-known for yelling and screaming at the drop of a hat, a strange reaction from someone who’s supposed to be both a role model and a professor of communications.
The dean of the FHSU college who helped investigate this issue, Faber, was a much more outspoken and effective opponent of the wind farm. That issue doesn’t seem to have been a factor in the decision.
Gosh
So many liberals that don’t like windfarms.
Not in MY backyard, huh?
“Debated in High School and, briefly, in College.
Was also a Judge, more than once.” — Franklin
Once again, the WingNut has the pertinent personal experience. Uncanny. If the subject were all the tea in China, at least a half dozen of them would claim to be tea tasters.
hey beber…did you miss kfg saying…
“I still say my participation in debate….”?
OF COURSE YOU DID…you don’t bother with reality at all, do you? Everything you see/hear is somehow a means to slam people who don’t agree with you, isn’t it?
must be sad to be so petty and so obsessed.
I like Faber, and yes, I’m from the area.
I do know all about Bill’s legal problems, and, for the last time, I am not defending him. But dont tell me his OUTSPOKEN oppositon to the Hays power structure didnt have something to do with it. After this incident, Faber had no choice.
And it isnt just libs who oppose this windfarm.
Hehehehe. Evil grin.
Any takers that there may be new dirt on the windfarm and Ellis county politics?
http://www.hdnews.net/Story/batteryarson082208
Politics is a contact sport in Ellis county.
Hit’s the nail on the head, doesn’t Raptor. You’re the person claiming to take neither side, yet always on the side of the Right. You are a standard character on every blog.
Ahhhh….very mature. Ignore my questions and go on the attack instead. You really do have a problem with reality, don’t you?
Truly pathetic.
Never on a debate team, however, never lost an argument!
“Ahhhh….very mature. Ignore my questions and go on the attack instead. You really do have a problem with reality, don’t you?” — Raptor
This is like the 100,000th time you’ve used those exact words on this blog, Raptor. Would it tax you too much just once to write something original?
“Debated in High School and, briefly, in College.
Was also a Judge, more than once.” — Franklin
The more interesting (and telling) part of that statement was his admission of being a “judge” more than once. I see it daily, but didn’t realize he had “credentials.” ;-)
I used to judge debates. It was eons ago when debate still included “eloquence of expressison,” as Capn called it. It was always instructive and nerve racking to me. I wanted everyone to win! Know what, I think they all did. We used to tease our son about being a Master Debater. He has used those skills often — teaching, the ever-present need to get funding, and even testifying before Congress as an expert.
that is because that is the 100,000th time you or one of your buddies have done the exact same pitiful thing. You cannot carry on an intelligent, adult conversation, instead you rely solely on insults, attacks and childish vulgarity.
Shanahan. Idiot. ‘Nuff said.
absolutely loved coming upon this post!!