Sen. Sam Brownback, R-Kan., has introduced a Senate resolution that “congratulates the Focus on the Family radio program, its staff, and its founder and chairman, James Dobson, for their excellence in radio programming and the program’s worthy induction into the National Radio Hall of Fame.” Will Brownback seek to similarly honor other 2008 inductees, including Art Bell, Howie Carr and Charlie Tuna (who once worked at Wichita’s KLEO)?
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198 Comments
Honoring hate radio, seems right up Brownshirt’s alley.
If you want to go to the summit, my vote is for Art Bell and his elite group of scientific geniuses, Linda Moten Howell, Eric Pundit and so forth.
The only one I listened to on the radio was Charlie Tuna, on Armed Forces Radio.
Dr. Dobson well deserves not only his radio award and induction into the National Radio Hall of Fame but any positive recognition given given him.
His programing is exactly opposite of what the village idiot and genuine Maggot insanely labels “hate radio”. It’s obvious he has never spent anytime listening to Dr. Dobson.
Your tax dollars at work.
Brownback WASTING time offering sanctioned kudos to a pesonage on behalf of others.
Let us hear back on how the vote goes down. HOPEFULLY this dies.
Brokeback and Dobson.
Why don’t those two just move in together?
I’ve read his books and watched him on tv- the man IS hate. Go figure Box would support him.
Is this part of the senate to honor radio hosts in a hall of fame? seriously?
The Republicans have no more pressing issues than this? They may as well be on break.
Honor Bernie Mac!
Just one more outrage by Sam Browncrack, the far right Nazi from Kansas. Sam is the worst Senator in my lifetime.
I’m sure Brownback could find something to honor Fred Phelps for as well.
Wonder how much Focus on the Family donates to Brownback?
I love how Dobson used his “Hall of Fame” broadcast to advise fathers how to prevent their sons from “choosing” homosexuality.
“Rough house and wrestle with your wimpy kid and encourage him to shower with grown-up men,” said Dobson.
Yeah. That’ll work.
“Rough house and wrestle with your wimpy kid and encourage him to shower with grown-up men,” said Dobson.
Showering with men is exactly the thing that helped make me gay back in high school!
just an attempt to force the democrats to diss jesus.
“Ksjeff” shares –
“Showering with men is exactly the thing that helped make me gay back in high school!”
Yeah, right. That’s what made you gay.
And that’s what makes James Dobson the anti-christ, I guess.
Obvious Joke:
#1 — My Mother made me a gay!
#2 — If I give her the yarn can she make me one, too?”
(cue the rim shot)
This is what we pay him for? This is leadership? God, I hate religion.
“Pleefer” shares –
“…This is leadership? God, I hate religion.”
Yeah, but what’re ya gonna do?
I know people who believe in Astrology. I can’t see how it’s any better or any worse than, say, Seventh Day Advent-ism.
If it cooks for you, groovy. Believe it for all you’re worth, for all I care.
But as soon as you think YOUR belief — in Jesus or Muhammad or the Buddha or Moses or the Reverend Sun Myung Moon or the local volcano… — is THE god, your position in civil government is diminished.
Because if it seems like your belief might have political clout, you start attacking representative democracy and use political power to oppress so-called “heretics.”
If Dobson worried more about straight white men despoiling marriage, he would be going a long way to preserving the “sanctity” of marriage than he does in ranting about gays.
Repost.
You know what I find ironic about all this?
McCain cheats on his faithful first wife then dumps her after she is disabled and no longer the hottie he wanted. He says he believes in the sanctity of marriage and thinks gay marriage is morally wrong and would destroy the sanctity of straight marriage.
Edwards says he cant condone gay marriage because of his baptist faith and the conservatives values he was raised with. To quot him, he cant make those values just “disappear”. He is against gay marriage and believes in the sanctity of “one man one woman”.
WTF?
McCain and Edwards didnt seem to let those deeply held conservative values, or their chrisitan faith, or their believe in the sanctity of “one man one woman” get in the way of gettin’ sum.
I’ve never cheated on a spouse or significant other in my life. Nor will I ever. A little matter of personal integrity to me.
WTF?
THESE jokers are gonna lecture ME on the phucking sanctity of marriage? They are going to keep my love and I from enjoying the benefits of marriage because we are not “ONE man and ONE woman”?
WTF?
Hypocricy, thy name is mccain/edwards.
They can all roast in the hottest part of hell. Sanctity my fat white ass.
…and remind me again what is so special about something straight folks can do while drunk on their ass in front of an Elvis impersonator in Las Vegas?
And THAT is legal but my love and I cant legally marry?
Woof.
This is off topic.
But I wanted you to know kfg.
Things ARE changing.
When I enrolled my son in high school the other day, I noticed that among the listed school clubs is the Gay/Straight Alliance club.
That would have seemed inconceivable when I was in high school.
The Dobsons of the world, they are losing. And like any cornered, dying animal they will get nastier as they understand this more and more.
THAT is the reason someone like Brownback wants to laud kudos on Dobson. It’s like putting their hands over their ears and going “lalallalala”.
Thanks for your undying support of the LGBT community JR. It’s appreciated!
It is my honor kfg.
For newer readers to this forum, or to the otherwise un informed?
LGBT =Lesbian,Gay,Bisexual,Transgedered
Who, as long as you don’t have nose trouble are more appropriately known simply as people.
And another thing that merits mentioning for the newer readers….
It has been my pleasure to meet in person and spend time with kansasfarmgrrl.
She could disarm the hardest heart, open just a little even the most tightly closed mind. I’ve seen her do it.
“ksfarmgrrl” says –
“…remind me again what is so special about something straight folks can do while drunk on their ass in front of an Elvis impersonator in Las Vegas?”
Don’tchu go talkin’ bad about Elvis, woman.
;^)
“Dr. Dobson well deserves not only his radio award and induction into the National Radio Hall of Fame but any positive recognition given given him.
His programing is exactly opposite of what the village idiot and genuine Maggot insanely labels ‘hate radio’. It’s obvious he has never spent anytime listening to Dr. Dobson.”
I have, and I am very much with Maggot on this one. Dobson is as nasty as they come.
“McCain and Edwards didnt seem to let those deeply held conservative values, or their chrisitan faith, or their believe in the sanctity of “one man one woman” get in the way of gettin’ sum.
“I’ve never cheated on a spouse or significant other in my life. Nor will I ever. A little matter of personal integrity to me.
“WTF?
“THESE jokers are gonna lecture ME on the phucking sanctity of marriage? They are going to keep my love and I from enjoying the benefits of marriage because we are not ‘ONE man and ONE woman’?”
Irony impairment indeed kfg.
ksfarmgrrl posts;
“And THAT is legal but my love and I cant legally marry?
Woof.”
That’s Right!!!
Kansas has a state Constitutional Amendment against that perversion, or tax scheme, which ever it is.
But you can always consider moving to Massachusetts. A move won’t help you with federal taxes though, they don’t recognized it either.
““I’ve never cheated on a spouse or significant other in my life. Nor will I ever. A little matter of personal integrity to me.”
Or…that others find you so reprehensible that they wouldn’t let you get close to them.
If it’s what you say then….well, good for you, that is significant and important.
You might want to be careful with the intolerance there Boxy.
It has a way of backlashing on ya.
The direction of society is not working in your favor. And it hasn’t now for quite some time.
Someday, maybe even in your lifetime, YOU could be the one persecuted.
We might start by taxing the churches. Since their members seem to feel the need to involve their faith into legislation?
We ran your preaching outta the schools and rightly so. Now it’s on to running it out of the law.
You best hope that’s as far as it goes.
But I wouldn’t bet on it.
“transgendered”
*shiver*
Something is VERY wrong with those people.
“transgendered”
*shiver*
Something is VERY wrong with those people.
Ah, yes, the “ick” factor.
How does that make it the business of government, to tell people who they can marry?
Lotsa folks thought good white folks marryin’ the darkies was beyond icky–why, it was a threat to the integrity of the white race!
They were “protecting marriage.” Why shouldn’t they have their way too?
BlueJay,
Your threats are of no consequence. You see there is an natural order of things in the design of the universe and this world, and while perversion will always be around, it will never win out.
As for “The direction of society is not working in your favor” comment, I am not at all worried….the pendulum swings both ways but always returns to the natural order. You might be the one surprised and dismayed as the more recent intolerance of Christian principal may well be waning and folks openly living according to those principals openly increase. It’s never really gone away.
“We ran your preaching outta the schools and rightly so. Now it’s on to running it out of the law.”
Ah….NO, Christian schools are thriving and beating the public schools at every measure. I placed my kids in a Christian school, they thrived as well. Both are Master’s level professionals. One an MBA engineer, another teaching in a state medical program.
No JR, I’m not at all worried that timeless principals will not only continue, but will be revived and increase, growing as the liberal ‘I am god’ way proves it’s distructive nature.
Are you trying to convince me or yourself Boxlock?
I made no threat. I offered you a prediction.
I DID find this funny!
“You see there is an natural order of things in the design of the universe and this world, and while perversion will always be around,”
How can “perversion” exist in the creation of a perfect creator?
Let me take you on a tour of why you will lose Boxlock.
There are several evangelical Christians who post here. I like and would like to know better?
ONE of them.
The rest, you included, make me want to stay as far away from you and your faith as possible.
“The rest, you included, make me want to stay as far away from you and your faith as possible.”
Good BlueJay….that’s makes me quite comfortable, at least the staying away from me part. But, as much as I dislike you, or more accurately your values, (just being honest), I hope and pray you will at sometime embrace Christian faith before it is to late, and you are forever separated from God.
“How can “perversion” exist in the creation of a perfect creator?”
Simply….in that perfection we were all given personal free will and many, all of us in fact, some more openly and enthusiastically than others, choose sin and perversion.
“I hope and pray you will at sometime embrace Christian faith before it is to late, and you are forever separated from God.”
I guess “God” better get more persuasive pitchmen.
“.in that perfection we were all given personal free will and many, all of us in fact, some more openly and enthusiastically than others, choose sin and perversion.”
But you see? That’s subjective and open to interpretation.
There are THREE main monotheistic western faiths and hundreds of quarreling divisions of each of those.
I’m a smart and fairly persuasive guy.
I could probably start a church tomorrow with some mish mash of them and get rich in short order.
This thread is about a government official using the force of law to heap laurels on James Dobson.
Just as it is not my role to tell people the mind of God, it is not governments role to heap praise on someone who CLAIMS to know the mind of God.
For you see? It could very easily be someone in government USING government to condemn someone’s religion.
I ask again. Why would you believe that God somehow couldn’t or wouldn’t forgive imperfection when we are all born imperfect. Why would you believe that God somehow couldn’t or wouldn’t forgive bad decisions when God gave us the decision to make. Either way, God couldn’t or wouldn’t forgive until he, or someone else had to die first. Why would you believe that in the first place Boxlox? You’re the one who started the preaching. Will you answer the question?
“That’s Right!!!
“Kansas has a state Constitutional Amendment against that perversion, or tax scheme, which ever it is.”
Don’t ever present yourself as morally superior. To tell someone that making a lifetime loving committement is perversion is just plain mean, and no comment, even “boxlick”, justifies your nasty judgementalism here. Comments like this are the reason why people are turned off by the Christian Right, and make no mistake, they are.
“But you can always consider moving to Massachusetts. A move won’t help you with federal taxes though, they don’t recognized it either.”
Like I said, you want to make nasty, heartless comments like this, don’t present yourself as morally superior.
“‘transgendered’
“*shiver*
“Something is VERY wrong with those people.”
Yes, shallow, judgemental assh*les like you are what’s wrong with them.
Per usual, hagfish, you make no sense.
Boxlock, in all seriousness, your claims that you only give what you get are beyond bullsh*t. Someone posts an opinion, particularly on social issues, that you disagree with, and you go for the jugular. I’ve seen it several times.
You start the crap that you so often find yourself embroiled in. If you can’t really see it, then you have a serious shortcoming when it comes basic empathy and human decency. And believe me, the last thing in the world I would worry about is you having a better understanding of a hypothetical architect of the universe.
“Per usual, hagfish, you make no sense.”
Your cognitive shortcoming, not mine.
“I ask again. Why would you believe that God somehow couldn’t or wouldn’t forgive imperfection when we are all born imperfect. ”
God will and wants that of course, to forgive, forget and never remember our imperfection….the decision to live with or apart from HIM is ours.
“Why would you believe that God somehow couldn’t or wouldn’t forgive bad decisions when God gave us the decision to make.”
I’m not sure I am following your questioning, but again, the decision to live according to HIS will is up to us, we can live with, or apart, from him spiritually. We have a will as well, and that will goes against GOD and our fellow man by nature. We can be forgiven, and are promised to be forgiven, if we truly want it and seek it. But it take confession and resolution to live with GOD and not against HIM, even though we continue to fail at that.
“Either way, God couldn’t or wouldn’t forgive until he, or someone else had to die first.”
Right! Everything comes, is purchased, at a cost both in the physical world and the spiritual.
We simply could not ante up, GOD had to do it for us. We can accept that gift or reject it, the decision is totally up to us as individuals.
And in that is the perfection, GOD respects his creation enough to give us the choice…live with HIM or apart from HIM.
GOD teaches us, he doesn’t mandate how we live our lives, but HE does mandate what it takes to live with HIM.
Better said than I’ve been trying to Agnatha.
My friend KFG posted a personal opinion here. It was not partisan. It held people in both parties to account.
And along comes Boxlock who does not answer her arguments but makes a concerted effort to be deliberately mean, and hurtful.
Yeah give me some of that old time religion.
Uh…Agnatha, your post,
“Like I said, you want to make nasty, heartless comments like this, don’t present yourself as morally superior.”
It’s fact….call them “nasty, heartless comments”, but they remain FACT!!!
“We can accept that gift or reject it, the decision is totally up to us as individuals.
And in that is the perfection, GOD respects his creation enough to give us the choice…live with HIM or apart from HIM.
GOD teaches us, he doesn’t mandate how we live our lives, but HE does mandate what it takes to live with HIM.”
And little old YOU is the arbiter there Boxlock?
“he doesn’t mandate how we live our lives, but HE does mandate what it takes to live with HIM.”
No it seems he has you for that. Or at least that is how you treated kfg.
That’s the advantage you use to hurt people. You are right because GOD says so.
Boxlox. As usual, you color a pretty picture. But you never really answered the question. OK, I will use your terms. Why do you believe that the ante up is necessary in the first place. You answered by telling me what you believe. Not WHY you believe. The question is, why do you believe it?
Do you believe it because of the uncertainty of your death?
Do you believe it because you are afraid not to?
Do you believe it because your parents told you so?
If you keep begging the question, I am going to ask the question. Just so you know.
BJ,
I don’t want to hurt or harm kfg, I hope she is happy, and I am convinced from what people have said that if we didn’t know one another from this blog but met, we would get along famously.
I don’t dislike gays, heck I don’t even care to know that. I KNOW they are loved by their creator every bit as much as anyone else, maybe HE seeks them even more.
I simply resist, militantly, any attempt to force me to accept, or normalize, what I know is against HIS will. How do I know his will, he has stated it very plainly, I’m not the arbiter there.
Does that make me anymore righteous that she….NO, and maybe I am in far more danger because I know and don’t always do as I know I should.
BJ, our example pointed out human failures and what HIS Father’s will was, and instructed us to do the same. Not to judge, but none the less share the truth, as given by GOD, not by man, or me or anyone else.
And BJ, I think you accused me the other day of posting and running away, wait, no that was Chas, anyway….all because I work and don’t blog all day. Well, I also sleep, and that is more important that blogging so I’m getting some…not running away now. Until tomorrow GOD get you through the night with health.
Ya jumped the shark Boxlock.
“#
Boxlock
Posted August 9, 2008 at 5:15 pm | Permalink
ksfarmgrrl posts;
“And THAT is legal but my love and I cant legally marry?
Woof.”
That’s Right!!!
Kansas has a state Constitutional Amendment against that perversion, or tax scheme, which ever it is.
But you can always consider moving to Massachusetts. A move won’t help you with federal taxes though, they don’t recognized it either.
#
Boxlock
Posted August 9, 2008 at 5:17 pm | Permalink
““I’ve never cheated on a spouse or significant other in my life. Nor will I ever. A little matter of personal integrity to me.”
Or…that others find you so reprehensible that they wouldn’t let you get close to them.
If it’s what you say then….well, good for you, that is significant and important.”
Oh yeah I feel the love and outreach in THAT!
You’ve in that become God or at least God’s personal interpreter. AND you are taking pleasure in the pain of someone else who did not attack you directly.
But you were just on your way up the ramp.
“Right! Everything comes, is purchased, at a cost both in the physical world and the spiritual.
We simply could not ante up, GOD had to do it for us. We can accept that gift or reject it, the decision is totally up to us as individuals.
And in that is the perfection, GOD respects his creation enough to give us the choice…live with HIM or apart from HIM.”
And yet YOU just took clearly GLEEFUL pleasure in being the judge, jury, and executioner on behalf of God. NOW you want to say it is choice?
And you are in favor of the laws of man reflecting the opposite?
Any dude that wants to have his willy lopped off in the name of “transgendering”….
…..is one odd dude.
Fine go to bed Boxy.
I’m going too.
But you were deliberately cruel to a friend of mine. A person who has done you no harm other than to offend your sensibilities. And you used “holiness” to do it.
I’m going to hold you to defending that or apologizing for it.
LLTVET,
This is not an attempt to answer your question in total but more out of respect for you, and your asking….as I am GOING TO BED!
But you ask:
“Do you believe….
Do you believe….
Do you believe….”
I took the chance, many years ago, to pray and ask that GOD come into my life and show me of HIS existence.
LLTVET,
HE DID!!! In no uncertain terms. And I have been blessed ongoing in ways I could not have ask for.
Now did all my problems go away…hell no, but GOD does most certaninly make himself known to those that SEEK HIM, get it…you must seek him. And as said before, it is our choice, your choice, and you are completely free to make that choice anyway you so choose.
Good night and thanks for the conversation.
BlueJay,
kfg has been deliberately cruel to me as well.
Does that justify my being cruel, of course not.
I frankly thought from your, and her posts, that what I’ve said would not materially effect or harm either of you one way or another. If in fact I have hurt either, I do apologize, and I mean that.
Until now you have never indicated my comments have hurt, only stimulated shall we say colorful responses.
Now damm it….good night!!!
Speaking of farmie…
I bet she’s going nuts watching some of these eastern-bloc Euro women in Beijing.
Shama-lama-ding-dong!
I don’t know what “KSGolfnut” talks about with –
“…some of these eastern-bloc Euro women in Beijing.”
But it sounds kinky.
Is there even an “eastern-bloc” anymore?
Just what is a “Euro” woman?
And, as far as “going nuts,” I suspect most red-blooded heterosexual flag-wavin’ true American males spent a moment or two envying Greg Louganis’ abs, even if they never entertained thoughts of going to bed with him.
Just how much of a “nut” are you, “KSGolfnut?”
Does Arnold Palmer’s tush give you a chubby?
Do you whack off in the shower fantasizing John Daly tea-bagging you?
Do you wake up in the middle of the night screaming, “Take me, Tiger! Take me! Take me!”
A lot of athletes are dykes. Some dykes are athletes.
So?
You have some odd fantasies, Monkeyboy
Being called odd by “KSGolfnut” is like being called ugly by a frog.
Monkeyboy’s post just above is expressing exactly what circulates through his mind.
And everyone should take notice of them, and about him, and the value of his posts.
“And believe me, the last thing in the world I would worry about is you having a better understanding of a hypothetical architect of the universe.”
Agnatha, that’s your loss….not mine.
“Boxlock” –
Genesis 2:25 says we should stand before the Lord naked and unafraid… so if you aren’t naked, you are probably going to hell.
As usual Monkey, your understanding is so juvenile.
The “naked and unafraid” means in honesty and openness with God.
The same as being naked around a lifelong Biblical married spouse, and not among a stranger or strangers.
Monkey…you are showing your shallowness, again.
“It’s fact….call them ‘nasty, heartless comments’, but they remain FACT!!!”
This statement is outright false. The word “perversion” is a descriptive word, and what it describes is the opinion of the person who uses it. You confuse what is self evident to you with fact, Boxlock, and that is a big part of your problem.
“Speaking of farmie…
“I bet she’s going nuts watching some of these eastern-bloc Euro women in Beijing.
“Shama-lama-ding-dong!”
Re: KSGolfnut
DNFTT
The jawless fish, along with her atheistic/agnostic compatriots are still searching for the cosmic gonads that created the universe.
Wow. The poodle dancers really outdid themselves here yesterday.
Boxlicker logic.
I’m so repulsive no one would want to cheat with me but I’m not so repulsive as to have a partner?
heheheheheheh>HEE HEE HEE HEE HEE HEE HEEEEE…..
The shark called. He wants to know WHEN you will give up jumping him.
And as for nut boy, it must really suck to be him.
I love the smell of wingnut desperation in the air.
Yer right.
DNFTT
“The jawless fish, along with her atheistic/agnostic compatriots are still searching for the cosmic gonads that created the universe.”
Re: Regular
DNFTT
“The jawless fish, along with her atheistic/agnostic compatriots are still searching for the cosmic gonads that created the universe.”
Is it Feeding the Trolls by saying ‘funny post Regular, funny post’.
ksfarmgrrl, “heheheheheheh>HEE HEE HEE HEE HEE HEE HEEEEE…..”
What is that obnoxious noise again?
Hope it stays way way way out there on the farm.
http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1478373106050986932pllLhU
Agnatha posts:
“The word “perversion” is a descriptive word, and what it describes is the opinion of the person who uses it”
Oh?
per·ver·sion; “any of various means of obtaining sexual gratification that are generally regarded as being abnormal.”
“Perversion is a concept describing those types of human behavior that are perceived to be a serious deviation from what is considered to be orthodox or normal. Although it can refer to varying forms of deviation, it is most often used to describe sexual behaviors that are seen as abnormal, its application varies depending on culture. It is originally applied especially frequently to homosexual behavior.
As far as “what is considered to be orthodox or normal”
A 1994 British sex survey showed that only one in 90 people had had a homosexual partner in the previous year.[19] Research published in 2001 indicated that 2.6% of both men and women reported homosexual partnerships.[20]
Despite the popular media image of homosexual monogamy, several large studies reveal that less than ten percent of homosexual men or women have ever experienced a relationship of greater than ten years duration.[21] In one large early study, 74% of male homosexuals reported having more than one hundred partners in a lifetime, and 28% more than 1,000; 75% reported that over half of their partners were strangers. The figures for female homosexuals are substantially lower, but still significantly higher than those for married heterosexuals.
No…I’m sticking with my original wording and intended meaning for perverse as being more than simply a person opinion.
Seems it is NOT “normal” (3 to 5%), and is very perverse in that the relationships are very unstable and entered into most commonly for “perverse” sexual gratification.
19: Johnson AM et al. Sexual attitudes and lifestyles. Blackwell Scientific, 1994.
20: Johnson AM et al. Lancet, 2001;358: p1835-1842
“Boxlock” –
I think it’s time for you to be specific and define all those sexual acts you consider “normal.”
Please include details.
Lord knows, I wouldn’t want to offend you.
So give me a list of what’s acceptable.
I’ve just come from the grocery store.
I was thinking about Boxlock and his sort while I was there.
I saw a black man and a white woman with kids.
I also saw a late teens girl with lots of tatoos and BLUE hair.
If she was my daughter?
But she wasn’t.
I don’t want blue hair myself. But who the hell would I be to make a law against it?
I was thinking how, at one time, when folks like Boxlock had more power and say, the people I saw might have generated gasps of horror. Maybe they would have even been confronted or attacked.
The blue hair DID get me to do a mild double take. But other than that?
Just people out doing their thing, not bothering anyone.
That’s gonna be the way it is with gay people just living their lives too someday Boxy.
That you you take pleasure in holding that back SOLEY not souly because it makes YOU uncomfortable? Get over yourself.
Well thank you BlueJay for that little piece of advice if that’s what it was….I’m not really sure as it sure was strange.
Have you started drinking already today?
I don’t recall saying anything about blacks or whites or blue hair or anything.
I simply responded to Agnatha’s post defining perversion for me, and my making it clear that my understanding of the term is far more than a singularly personal opinion.
And AGAIN, and listen this time, I couldn’t care less about someones sexual preference as long as they don’t try to force me or the rest of society into placing equal normalcy or value on it as a committed traditional married relationship of a man and a woman.
But by the way BJ, “a late teens girl with lots of tatoos and BLUE hair” is going nowhere in her life odds are, whether I approve or not. That is stupidity, but….it’s her choice. I have nothing to say about it, but I sure won’t hire her.
Box,
Be thankful Junior was thinking of you only while doing his grocery shopping – vs. while he was making love to his gir…
Oh wait. Nevermind.
Junior, the blithering of a non-traveled man who has seen little and done less.
I have written that I was a Republican a long time ago. Here is one, among MANY reasons why I’m not anymore.
“ksfarmgrrl posts;
“And THAT is legal but my love and I cant legally marry?
Woof.”
That’s Right!!!
Kansas has a state Constitutional Amendment against that perversion, or tax scheme, which ever it is.
But you can always consider moving to Massachusetts. A move won’t help you with federal taxes though, they don’t recognized it either.”
Initially, this made me angry.
A friend of mine is hurting and asking only to be treated as anyone else is treated.
Boxlock responds with fists pumping making sport of another person’s pain. I’m sure I’m not the only one who gets the implied “ha ha ha HA ha!”
Of course, I have come to learn that inflicting pain is a substantial part of what it IS to be a Republican. That’s just not in me.
But on further reflection? There are two sides to Boxlocks’s sentiment. Well, at least two.
The side you have to think about to see is the side that tells us that Boxlock is afraid. It’s a twofer.
For here, for now, Boxlock gets his way. Something HE is not comfortable with is illegal. In his comments, he gets to TRY and keep it so.
Hold back the future, if only for another moment?
And so, in his fear, we SEE how the tide has turned.
The Boxlock set are chucking little stones as they back up the steps of the church.
“I don’t recall saying anything about blacks or whites or blue hair or anything.”
Ya didn’t have to. I can guess.
Bluejay after a few days away I find you are still as funny and pathetic as ever. If people don’t agree with you then they must by neccessity be wrong. Guess what – it doesn’t work that way. I don’t care one way or another what they do with Dobson but I do think that Boxlock or anyone else has a right to their own opinions whether it is your opinion or not. You paint yourself as this little quiet peacenik just ‘trying to get along’. What a laugh. You ride roughshod over the entire blog with your hatred and teach it to your son. Your admission.
You tout farmie as your poor gentle little friend who is being denied her rights and the entire right as the bad guys. She can dish it better than anyone here as we all know.
Do you ever get sick of yourself?
“Oh?
“per·ver·sion; “any of various means of obtaining sexual gratification that are generally regarded as being abnormal.”
Uhm, Boxlock, “generally regarded as” is synonymous with “generally perceived as”. As I said, “perversion” is a word that describes an opinion. Without the perception/opinion, there is no factual description of “perversion”.
“‘Perversion is a concept describing those types of human behavior that are perceived to be a serious deviation from what is considered to be orthodox or normal. Although it can refer to varying forms of deviation, it is most often used to describe sexual behaviors that are seen as abnormal, its application varies depending on culture. It is originally applied especially frequently to homosexual behavior.’”
You’re making my point for me, Boxlock. Furthermore, I guarantee you, your focusing on the sexual behavior of people who are in same gender relationships is reflective of the cultural orientation you so openly have brought here (that of a socially conservative Christian) characteristic but not limited to central and southern portions of the United States. And that cultural orientation is changing, just as it did with regards to interracial marriage.
“‘1994 British sex survey showed that only one in 90 people had had a homosexual partner in the previous year.[19] Research published in 2001 indicated that 2.6% of both men and women reported homosexual partnerships.[20]
“‘Despite the popular media image of homosexual monogamy, several large studies reveal that less than ten percent of homosexual men or women have ever experienced a relationship of greater than ten years duration.[21] In one large early study, 74% of male homosexuals reported having more than one hundred partners in a lifetime, and 28% more than 1,000; 75% reported that over half of their partners were strangers. The figures for female homosexuals are substantially lower, but still significantly higher than those for married heterosexuals.’”
Uhm, Oh kaaay. So, you think maybe those statistics (which I suspect, by the way, I will be checking on your source) might improve if same gender marriage were not outlawed (in terms of legal recognition)? You argue on one hand for making it more difficult for people to enter into monogomous same sex relationships because long lasting same sex relationships are not the norm? How are they going to become the norm for people who are gay, wiseguy, when they are illegal. To use lack of monogamy between partners of a population of people as an excuse to discourage monogomous relationships within that same population of people is, to put it kindly, circular.
Again, Boxlock, your culturally based assumptions may be self evident to you, but they are not “facts”.
‘Puts a ruler to the jawless fish’s post and finds that length doesn’t not correlate with llama saddling or wild cactus mounting.’
This appears to be the source of Boxlock’s unattributed cut and paste.
http://www.ethicsforschools.org/sexual/cmfile20.htm
A very suspect source indeed.
Here is the recent large scale demographic study:
http://cprweb.maxwell.syr.edu/cprwps/pdf/wp12.pdf
As the authors themselves would be inclined to point out, several times through this paper in fact, there are unavoidable methodological flaws in the study. For more discussion of potential pitfalls, see here:
http://www.gaydemographics.org/USA/2000_Census_Total.htm
Example:
“One stumbling block for demographers is establishing who is ‘gay’. In other words, labels. From the heady days of Kinsey, the ‘10 per cent is homosexual’ label has been toned down lately. Even though The Social Organization of Sex: Sexual Practices in the United States (Laumann, Gagnon, Michael, and Michaels, 1994) study cites that 7.7 percent of men and 7.5 of women have strong same-sex attractions, ony 2.8 percent of men and 1.4 of women consider themselves homosexuals.”
Of course, the very idea that low demographic numbers legitimizes discrimination against a group of people is ethically absurd in the first place. And again, we are talking about gay marriage here, not promiscuousness. When someone talks about gay marriage being a perversion as the justification to legally banning it (at least in terms of legal bans on legally recognized marriage), one is de facto arguing to legally discourage monogomous, exclusive relationships in favor of casual, promiscuous ones.
Same sex marriage is not “illegal”, it’s just not recognized in most countries, states, and communities, and societies, and religions, and cultures, etc, get the picture. You see it just doesn’t exist. I didn’t say it was illegal so quit assigning your words to me, which you then attack.
‘You’re be funny’….except you mean it so you aren’t, funny that is.
Again, if the vast majority of folks of a given culture define something as perversion, then it is not my singular opinion to agree, it is a consensus. And consensus within cultures make it possible for the culture to survive and thrive.
It is the typical left liberal ‘all is relative’ and ‘all behavior is okay’ that you so clearly ascribe to, but it is destructive to individuals, families and cultures….because it’s perversion. Ha! Oh, and by the way, GOD describes it as not only perversion but “abomination”, a pretty serious term coming from God…look it up, check my sources, as you say.
“but I do think that Boxlock or anyone else has a right to their own opinions whether it is your opinion or not. ”
I think he (and you) have all the right in the world to your opinions, phobias, prejudices, etc.
I just don’t think anyone is the voice of “God” clear enough to make those opinions, prejudices, etc, into laws. You and the Boxlock set seem to feel otherwise.
“You paint yourself as this little quiet peacenik just ‘trying to get along’. What a laugh.
Yeah that made me laugh too!
“You ride roughshod over the entire blog with your hatred and teach it to your son. Your admission.”
Hyaaaaaa! Riding over intolerance, I’ve BECOME it!
“You tout farmie as your poor gentle little friend who is being denied her rights and the entire right as the bad guys. She can dish it better than anyone here as we all know.”
The right ARE the bad guys. And you better believe she can dish it out.
I’m proud to help her any way I can.
Agnatha,
Ah…you’re wrong again…I’ve never looked at the ’source’ you are saying is mine.
By the way, you have a very bad habit of doing that.
Just glancing at the source you provided, the numbers of homosexuals, percentage in the population, is even lower than in some of the studies I’ve glanced at…thanks for helping make my point. Oh, and who, certainly not me, is going to waste time reading that big ‘pdf’ file study you dug up, though it is interesting that it states most homosexuality is very concentrated in major cities, the same cities with high HIV and even crime rates. Just a coincidence I’m sure, wouldn’t you agree. Again, ha, perversion!
I’ll say it once more…I don’t care if you have sex with someone of your own gender, I’m not interested, I don’t care, I DON’T want to know. But don’t force that “perversion” on me, and on the rest of society as ‘normal’, it ain’t. It is an activity that has been ‘frowned on’ for centuries, across cultures over the entire globe.
If you don’t want to argue about it simply keep it to yourself and out of my and others faces that know what it is.
Bluejay you just don’t get it. Because you define something as intolerance doesn’t make it so. The majority of people in Kansas and every other state that were allowed to vote on it, including California where a pack of renegade judges overturned the will of the people, said that marriage is between one man and one woman.
Wasn’t just Boxlock. Wasn’t just me. You are in the minority. You have one opinion just like I do. You were allowed to cast a vote. I was allowed one vote. So was everyone else. You lost.
Now I am not getting into semanics with you but the people voted. You lost. So stop the fool words like ‘we are backing you up the church steps’. Who do you think you are little man?
Who do you think YOU are you old crone?
“You lost.” Nope. I didn’t lose a thing. I’ve never been married and have no desire to be. I’m also not gay.
Yup it’s true.
Ya got your amendment to “protect” marriage.
For now. Hooray for you. You exploited people’s baser instincts and prejudices to the detriment of people who have done nothing more than something YOU don’t like. Like I said much earlier, the way things are trending you may get to taste that someday your own self.
And you know it. Easy to see I hit a nerve.
That or you are just naturally bad natured.
Maybe both.
Bj I neither lobbied for or against the ammendment. So I didn’t win or lose. The ammendment lost. People’s commonsense kicked in and they saw this for what it was. Farmie used to have my sympathies until her mouth overloaded her. Good luck getting that changed in Kansas or any other state without crooked judges.
You don’t get to define right or wrong. Anyone who teaches their son to hate and is proud of it has no business preaching right and wrong to anyone.
“You don’t get to define right or wrong.”
Neither SHOULD you.
My argument tends toward more liberty. Yours goes the other way.
And yes, for now you’ve won. Enjoy it. That HAD to feel good after such a long series of retreats. And what an AMAZING victory! Ya beat up and oppressed a minority!
I think, probably, that this is the last time you and yours will get to do that. And it’s gonna sting just as bad as it feels good now when you eventually lose.
And you will.
“Farmie used to have my sympathies until her mouth overloaded her.”
Nice but not surprising to know that your “sympathies” are conditional on the object of them being silent.
Ya’ll CNN has been playing “God’s Warriors”. You should watch it. It has Falwell in with the hardline Muslim fundamentalists. I think it fits for the neocons on the board too.
The American Taliban…yup, fits.
The Eagle has an article today about how gay marriage in Massachusetts is pretty much a non story.
Maybe I’ll bring that here later.
The sky did not fall. The “defenders of marriage” have pretty much gone home. Gay couples are not only accepted but well treated.
Just a personal observation from a well seasoned blogger here?
The top 5 post generators in the history of the WE Blog were all religion based. Two of them generated like 2,000 posts.
But look now? Dobson is about as controversial as they come. Gay marriage got thrown in.
And this is only post 89.
There was a time when almost every con on the blog would have been here over and over.
I call this a good thing. Many on the religious right are waking up to responsibilities to stewardship of the Earth and taking care of the poor.
Telling other people how to live just doesn’t seem popular anymore.
okobserver,
Yours posts are quite appropriate, sensible, logical, and controlled, you are to be commended.
BJ, maybe the lack of posts you predicted, and now say is a good sign, may well be just the opposite of what you think. Maybe folks don’t feel the definition of marriage is threaten any more as it was, and in fact you are losing.
And BJ, get it through you head if anything can penetrate that thick skull. Most of those coming down against gay marriage, a misnomer, don’t care what people do. They care about peoples morality, character and actions and its effects on society at large and the harm it can do.
I’m not “Telling other people how to live”, it’s none of my business, but I am voicing my opinion on what is good for society and individuals and protecting that same society from possible harm.
“Maybe folks don’t feel the definition of marriage is threaten any more as it was, and in fact you are losing.”
I don’t think so. Because I see the same on the subject of abortion and in other religion based threads.
“but I am voicing my opinion on what is good for society and individuals and protecting that same society from possible harm.”
Wearing a cape are you?
Standing in for God?
Protecting society from what? Great hair and fabulous clothes?
Protecting kids from loving gay homes? What is it exactly about gays that you think is so destroying to society?
No BlueJay, I’m standing up and raising my voice against the harm folks like you can potentially do to society. You, almost by your own admission, contribute very little, except hate and resentment for anyone who achieves anything of material or moral or ethical value. You seem to have no moral standard or code by which you live, and anything thing, any temptation that captures you, you will support as a free choice. You are a slave to whatever tempts you, and you call that freedom.
I truly feel sorry for you
I don’t think gays are destroying society at all. They’ve been around since the beginning of time, and they haven’t destroyed anything, yet – as far as I know.
And I believe marriage is between a man and a woman.
Oh what a load of bologne. You want to control what people think and do. And you wonder why we consider you like Nazis.
You JUST admitted what your end goal is. To limit. Impose YOUR definition of morality.
You are the Taliban.
Well we’re not talking about what you believe testicles. Box’s definitions are the people you side with. And I believe that you are being dishonest. There is no reason to be against an entire group of people unless you find it to be wrong.
“No BlueJay, I’m standing up and raising my voice against the harm folks like you can potentially do to society.”
Standing up for the oppressed. How very unAmerican and awful of me.
You’re wrong (again), PeeMom.
I guess now that Box has been exposed for the tyrant that his ideaology brings, he runs off.
Then explain why you feel this priviledge should only be enjoyed by heterosexual couples testicles.
P_mama,
Did you read some the links Agnatha posted that listed some of the statistics concerning homosexuals? He is very much against what I stand for, and I believe he supports a very open acceptance of any persuasion unions.
It is depressing, the statistics HE in fact brought to the blog. You may well know some homosexuals that are ‘happy and committed’ to one another and family, but the vast majority are SICK!!! The incidence of health and mental problems, the number of illicit ‘unions’, and the weakness and lack of long term relationships is horrendous.
No P_mama, there are few “loving gay homes”. There may well be some, I doubt many, but I am sure the statistics that even my adversary presents shows that homosexuality is harmful to individuals, families and society. And I for one will not keep quiet about that in spite of your or anyone else’s criticism.
I said ‘he’ when referring to Agnatha, that could be ’she’, or it could be ‘it’, I don’t know.
Box, I disagree tremendously. Of ALL the many many gays I know, NONE of them are even a little weird or mentally ill. So I don’t know what alternative universe you’re living in where you’re surrounded by these sick human beings, but you’re wrong.
The ones that DO have problems are the ones who have fought such an internal struggle because of people who have treated them like you.
P_moma,
I only know one gay guy….and he is my friend, and I wish him well, the very best. He struggles with many of the demons and challenges we all do. I think his lifestyle has brought him some unneeded pain, lots, but that’s not my place to judge or look at really. The main thing is he is truly my friend and I hope he and his ‘other’ can be happy.
I am simply referring to the large statistical studies, and not my own limited exposure to the lifestyle, when I say some of the things I say. Those objective studies bring me to the conclusion that homosexuality presents many many challenges that decrease one’s quality of life and can endanger children. Hum, wonder why GOD did make a world where gays could procreate children on their own? I really don’t think it was because of an intent for them to adopt.
And I know you and others may truly resent my belief in, and full acceptance of, what God has said about it, and that is unequivocally that it is not acceptable in HIS Kingdom. I don’t argue with that.
Good night P_mama, thanks for the civil discourse.
“Hum, wonder why GOD did make a world”, should be ‘didn’t make a world’.
All this thread shows is that the gop really is the party of stupid, and the home of the american taliban.
Idiots and bigots flock together. Boxlicker, nut boy and grmie. A real trifecta of ignorance and bigotry.
Keep posting folks. And let me remind the readers, anytime you vote republican, it’s these ignorant bass turds you put in charge.
Keep up the good work. Show us your best work. It should prove so attractive to so many voters who will want to be just like you.
ROFLMQAO!!!!
Hee hee hee hee hee hee hee heeeeeeee……
And they say there’s no evolution. Just look at these neanderthals and TELL me humans, the real ones, havent progressed.
I agree with Steven. Let’s talk about nut boy and his wife leaving him. I mean, since he’s such an authority on good relationships.
And boxie and his make believe family. Why isnt he with them on a Sunday? Or any given evening? Dont real families, ya know, the ones with the moral highground, spend time together? Perhaps they dont exist? Or they dont want to spend THEIR time with boxlicker on a Sunday? ‘Cause ya know, he’s gotta be as toxic with them as he is here. Hate that hot cant be easily hidden from the family.
And we already know about grmie and her grandchildren who are toooooooo weak and tender to undergo the rigors of public education, and so must be coddled from the real world at home. WHat a shame to raise children so ineptly that they cant function, even as kids, in the real world.
Yea, these folks are obviously moral authorities on successful families. Let’s hear more from them.
And speaking of harm done to society, has terry fox paid his property taxes yet? Joe and Fred wont make him a loan?
Responsible citizens all, I see. And I notice none of these oh so upstanding conservatives can say a thing about cheaters and liars like mcsame and edwards and their “deeply held values” that dont prevent them from flagrant adultry, but do stand it their way of a vote to make legal same sex marriage.
Yep. Moral high ground, with a dash of hypocrisy and bigotry that NONE of you ass wipes can refute.
I bet that level of hypocrisy makes the baby jesus cry. Not that any of the three of you would give a shit. You’ve been too busy phucking up your own families and worrying about the functional families that dont look like yours.
Thankfully.
Dance poodles dance!
Checking out the Kansas Constitution…
Yes, marriage is defined as a union between a man and a woman.
Just as it should be.
“I only know one gay guy….and he is my friend, and I wish him well, the very best. He struggles with many of the demons and challenges we all do. I think his lifestyle has brought him some unneeded pain, lots, but that’s not my place to judge or look at really. The main thing is he is truly my friend and I hope he and his ‘other’ can be happy.”
One, and he is a great guy. Everyone has struggles and it isn’t any easier when people like you write the kind of crap that you did above. YOU are WHY he struggles. If you were truly his friend, you would be advocating for him.
“I am simply referring to the large statistical studies, and not my own limited exposure to the lifestyle, when I say some of the things I say.”
No you’re not, you’re reading the studies that cater to what you already want to believe. Your own empirical data of ONE good gay person…which believe it or not, you know far more than one gay person… disputes. Come out of your cocoon.
“Those objective studies bring me to the conclusion that homosexuality presents many many challenges that decrease one’s quality of life and can endanger children”
Objective my hind end. What danger to children for gods sake.
“Hum, wonder why GOD did make a world where gays could procreate children on their own? I really don’t think it was because of an intent for them to adopt.”
Why did God create gays then? Why are there wonderful adoptive parents who can’t have children of their own? Please, go tell the next adoptive family that God didn’t want them to have children. Your own argument is ridiculous. Perhaps that IS really why God created gay couples, so they could care for the ‘throwaway’ kids of the heterosexual couples. Why does God let women get pregnant who will go crazy and kill their children after birth? Why does God get women pregnant knowing that they will abort? See…do you see how twisted you make your own reality?
“And I know you and others may truly resent my belief in, and full acceptance of, what God has said about it, and that is unequivocally that it is not acceptable in HIS Kingdom. I don’t argue with that.”
No, what I resent is your willingness to push that belief upon others. If you feel gay is wrong, don’t be gay. This is not your interpretation of God’s Kingdom. This is the world we all share. You have to share and play nice with others. I’ll bet money if someone was trying to outlaw your religion or your guns, you’d feel rather resentful too, now wouldn’t you.
And yet, you cannot see the parallel because you DON”T WANT TO.
I think once it becomes clear what this is all about, you find that you have no real basis- outside of your religion- for your beliefs. Keep your religion, I don’t want to take it from you. But show others the same respect in regards to their own life.
I note that you refused to answer the question testicle.
“Hum, wonder why GOD did make a world where gays could procreate children on their own?”
boxlicker’s ignorance is just stunning.
For the record for you ignorant bassturds, gay people “procreate children” all the time. On their own. They give birth to their very own children, just like straight folks. The old fashioned way.
How stupid do you have to be to not know that? You think their natural born children are hatched? Brought by the stork? Found under a cabbage? Uh, no, they became pregnant the same way straight folks did, with a sperm and an egg and nine months later, a trip down the birth canal.
You are poster children for why sex education is NEEDED in school. To lift the veil of such shameful ignorance.
Perhaps your objection is that the eeeeeevil gays were not married to the other parent? Many were married when their natural children were born. Many were not. Like many straight folks who give birth out of wedlock, or who give birth and later divorce. Like golfnut who, I fervently hope has NO spawn to carry on the stupid gene. I’m thinking his wife took all the smark genes when she divorced him.
Jesus WEPT. The ignorance here is breathtaking. But thanks again for proving the gop really IS the party of stupid.
nut boy is just poodle dancing
Being enshrined in the constitution certainly didnt give HIS marriage any moral authority.
I see why his wife left him.
Tell us more about your skill in successful marriages? What is your secret to getting your spouse to leave you? Was it the breath? The stupidity? Or could you just not get it up anymore under those rolls of greasy fat?
Deja vu. We’ve been through all this before with nutboy.
Maybe she just got tired of paying for the viagra and went out to find a real man?
I mean, as opposed to a poodle boy…
Pitiful. Just pitiful.
I must say…
I’m having a hearty laugh at your ridiculous comments about my marriage. How is it relevant?
(typical liberal tactic to focus not on the issue, but on personal attacks)
For the record:
I’ve been married to the same woman for 17 years and still going strong. And don’t say she’s dumb to stay with me, she’s a PhD. =)
I answered your question, Pee.
“I believe”
That’s enough.
“And I know you and others may truly resent my belief in, and full acceptance of, what God has said about it, and that is unequivocally that it is not acceptable in HIS Kingdom. I don’t argue with that.”
Neither do I. You can handle snakes and roll on the floor in ecstacy and sacrifice chickens for all I care.
But those fun times as your church dont give you the moral highground. Edwards and mcsame go to church, read the same bible and believe in the same sky god you do.
And I see how well that worked our for their oh so moral and sanctity soaked marriages.
And you think THEY hold the moral high ground for marriage?
heheheheh. You just cant make these stupid posts UP. Keep going boxie. We’re listening. We are amused, and we do encourage you to punch your way out of the moral highground wet paper bag.
you havent done it yet.
Change the subject? The subject was straight people who disgrace the institution of marriage. Straight folks like edwards and mcsame. And you. You told folks here your wife was leaving you? Did she come back for the money? Because it sure as hell wasnt for the weak romance. That little blue pill doesnt solve all your problems. No wonder she left you.
“I said it, therefor it’s true. I believe it, therefor it’s true”.
Heheheheheheh. Maybe mrs phd just keeps you around for the laughs. It sure as hell isnt for the intelligent conversation.
Pitiful. Just pitiful. I’m thinkin’ she found a real man and not a poodle to dance with. The horizontal bop I believe it’s called. She probably couldnt breathe with you on top.
Hell, tom cruise believes in aliens as his religion. Does that make it true?
testicle is lying again to make himself look better…go figure.
And I’m sorry KFG, I know gay people have biological children all the time. I’m just thinking of a few that I know who are hoping to adopt.
I brought my spouse to the meetup I attended. Why didnt poodle boy? Perhaps because… he doesnt have one? He was hoping to cruise chicks there? She thinks he’s a maroon and wont be seen with him? She’d had enough of his breath for one day?
=)
Pure liberal hate on display.
Well, at least my sweetie isnt ashamed of me and is GLAD to be seen with me in public. She’s proud of me and I’m proud of her. And she’s happy to meet my friends.
You do have friends… right poodle boy? Although, I cant imagine it. Must be hell to play poker with other cheeto eating basement dwellers. The cards get all stained.
Isnt that right, Dave?
Anger and pity do not equal hate.
You have no argument. You lose.
Hey, at least what I’m posting about you is the truth. Why do you hate truth? Are you so ashamed of yourself and your marriage and your life you have to call the truth hateful?
must be hell to be such a failure
Even the other poodles make you dance alone. The dogs cant stand your breath.
Solo poodle dancing. To the music of “one is the loneliest number that you’ll ever hear”. And apparantly “two can be as bad as one” when your wife leaves you.
at least one blogger here knows your real identity and can verify the “state” of your marriage.
Dont you hate it when you are PROVEN a liar and failure?
Waiting for said blogger to join in, except it’s past their bedtime since they actually work for a living.
Come on now KFG, don’t be quite so mean. Pity him.
I pity his daughter more. I wonder if she has an email account? We could send her links and show her want a fine, intelligent man her presumed daddy is.
But then, she likely already knows….
“Political_mama” –
You are so right.
We should not castigate nor criticize, we should not condemn nor denigrate. We should respond with respect, tolerance for his obvious shortcomings, and extend the hand of human kindness to his ignorance and vindictive instincts…. and operate on his brain.
Go right ahead MonkeyHawk, but I still think we should check on the welfare of his kid, given what he posts here.
How are we different from them?
The posts from 12:04 to 12:16?
They sound like the crap I as a single parent routinely get from the right.
P_moma posts:
“One, and he is a great guy. Everyone has struggles and it isn’t any easier when people like you write the kind of crap that you did above. YOU are WHY he struggles. If you were truly his friend, you would be advocating for him.”
That’s bullshit, what a load of harmful crap to believe in. You advocating for activities that harm a friend…glad I don’t have friends like that.
One doesn’t advocate for a friend’s continued actions and lifestyle that are harmful to them.
What other things do you advocate for that harm friends, drinking, drugs, high-risk lifestyles just because they think that’s what they want to do.
“I think once it becomes clear what this is all about, you find that you have no real basis- outside of your religion- for your beliefs.”
Ridiculous statement again from you, one’s faith belief tenets are not important? I suppose I can believe that is the depth of your faith.
KSGolfnut,
Notice how riled up they get? Of course it means they know what we say is true and they don’t like it being pointed out. Cockroaches don’t like light.
Oh and farmie, intellectual turd that you are, my “family” was right here last night, both of us watching the Olympics while I gave this blog scant attention, though more than it deserves considering the participants like yourself. Oh, and she laughs at you as she agrees with what I’m saying and concurs with me that your actions are repulsive, ha.
Hee hee hee heeeeee….
Boxie has one gay friend, and I doubt the truth of that, but he has ONE gay friend, and he’s an expert on gay marriage and gay families.
I have about a billion christian friends. I hate all the harmful things they do to themselves and others. Does that make me an expert on christianity?
And I notice boxie STILL thinks the marriages of mcsame and edwards have no moral equity with mine.
He’s right. Mine’s superior since my partner and I dont cheat on each other.
BIG eye roll. So boxie was blogging, watching the olympics and spending time with his family all at once? Heheheheheheheheh. I bet they felt special…
I really doubt he/she has a family. If so, they certainly play second fiddle to all his/her “other” diversions.
And why were you posting during the times the other good church ladies were in church?
Jesus wept. Hypocrisy, thy name is….POODLE BOY!
Dance poodle dance. If anyone is riled up, it’s you at my comments. But I feel bad. It’s a little like teasing a dumb animal….
Oh, and to return to the original point of this thread….James Dobson and Focus on the Family, for their excellence in radio programming and the program’s worthy induction into the National Radio Hall of Fame.
Hey farmie, et al., HE WON!!! That means there were a lot, and I mean a lot of folks that agree exactly with what he says. Let that sink in.
…and I notice that this was the thread boxlicker went to first.
Obsess much? I think you are secretly hot for me, but then, it really isnt much of a secret, now is it?
Did you wife read your posts about your fantasies concerning my partner and I? Maybe nut boy will share his little blue pills with you…
Hee hee hee heeee..
Poodle dancing at the BLUE PILL Iguana. You really should watch that movie boxy. It might help you break your obsession with me!
A lot of folks agreed with Hitler too?
So?
Gotta love a conservative republican who decides what is moral and good based on how many people agree.
I bet THAT makes the baby jesus cry too.
But when you have no moral fiber, a majority vote will do.
Like I said, it’s as easy, and as mean, as teasing a dumb animal. The party of stoooopud indeed.
“It’s a little like teasing a dumb animal…”
I’ll bet you are a real accomplished expert at that!!! You don’t take your warped sexuality into the abuse of animals too do you?
We frequently go to church on Sat. night, get this…sometimes we go Sat. night and Sun. too.
As many times as we have gone to church over the 39 years of our marriage we have never heard anyone “advocating” for homosexual behavior, never by anyone.
sigh….
GOOOOOO GAAAAAAY!!!! (***JAZZ HANDS***)
All Gay, All the time…. :(
Every subject for KFG=Gay oppression
Waa! Waa!
Gonna have a full chorus of poodle dancers soon. Dance poodles dance!
They just cant resist me or my posts. I love having that much power over them. Except, well, I wish it was smart folks and not the dumb animals of the blog….
Well color me shocked. No one in boxlickers church advocates for gay marriage. ALERT THE MEDIA!!!!!!!!!!
Big eye roll. Because ya know, when I’m looking for people who support equality, CHURCH is where I go.
Hee hee hee hee.
Too easy….
Come on boxy, dance for us some more.
And DID you ever share your obsession with me with your wife? Do you have her pretend to be me? Or do you just think about my girlfriend and I when you are out of little blue pills?
Come on, dance for us again!
And notice, boxy still cant defend the moral superiority of straight marriages like mcsame and edwards over the faithful nature of my relationship.
Makes ya wonder what boxy does on those long road trips. Maybe he and vitter share the same little black book for traveling salesmen?
Hee hee heeeeee, come on, post the donkey pic again. I love it.
And just like I go to CHURCH looking for support for my marriage, I go to KKK meeting when I look for support for racial equality, and I go to Concerned Women meetings for support of women’s equality.
And I go to China when I’m looking for support for democracy.
What a maroon…
Farmie posts;
“I really doubt he/she has a family. If so, they certainly play second fiddle to all his/her “other” diversions.”
My “family” questions me only in that I even respond to someone like you. You see she places little consequence or value on the homosexual lifestyle as well.
And if I ‘bug’ her with your crap while she is concentrating on the Olympics or her reading she has threatened to pour her drink on my laptop keyboard.
Now there is a wise woman, I’m am blessed.
KFG, no wonder your marriage failed, you don’t know when to shut up!!! Just blah, blah, blah, all the time…that would drive any man crazy. So you had to turn gay out of spite, I get it.
farmie posts; “over the faithful nature of my relationship.”
And how many marriages relationships have you been through? As I recall you are divorced, not a friendly one either. And I believe you mentioned a causal sexual relationship with a woman on a trip, doing so in a very vulgar way at that.
Sounds like the typical “faithful relationship” to me….oh yeah!!!
And didn’t you say your were fired from your job, I believe over ah…was it sex or flaunting it.
Farmie, you’re sick, you really need to get to Church.
Fun’s over, got’a get to work. Farmie, now leave those poor little dumb animals alone that you have all that experience teasing, or whatever you do with them…..I don’t want to know.
Good point Anti, was farmie always gay, did she turn gay after a failed marriage, was she married and having gay relationships.
Doesn’t sound like a very happy, successful lifestyle to me.
Personally, I am willing to stop this childish tit-for-tat, back and forth. As I’ve said I don’t dislike gays, and don’t care what they do as long as they keep it out of my face and don’t try and alter the centuries old true and only meaning of marriage.
Hee hee heeeeeee.
“Good point Anti, was farmie always gay, did she turn gay after a failed marriage, was she married and having gay relationships.”
Is there some part of “I’ve never cheated on a spouse” that you cant understand? That includes my asshole ex. Who was and still is a raging and abusive alcoholic. It has nothing to do with me. His demons, not mine.
And no, I wasnt “fired” over sex. My board of directors, and the entire economic development program was abolished, because my board liked the results I produces and they refused to fire me. The issue was me testifying, at my own expense, and on a day of vacation, in the legislature, regarding the hate amendment.
And did I mention last week that EVERY elected official who voted to abolish my board and the program has been removed from office, either by the voters or by themselves after seeing the handwriting on the wall? heheheh. HEHEHEHEHEHEH> HEE HEE HEE HEE HEEEEEE….
But hey, dont let the facts get in the way of a good poodle dance…. When you’ve got nothin’ you can always make shit up.
And you STILL cant show the moral superiority of the marriages of mcsame and edwards over mine.
The only true marriage indeed.
Dance boys, Dance!
“Is there some part of “I’ve never cheated on a spouse” that you cant understand?”
Jesus WEPT! These dumb animals are so unfamiliar with fidelity in a marriage they cant even understand it when it’s written really slowly…
HEE HEE HEE HEEEEEEE.
Please tell me again how morally superior edwards and mcsame are in opposing gay marriage when they trash their own?
Poodle logic
So you had to turn gay out of spite, I get it.
It shows.
I am glad KFG that you have a cause now, to occupy your time.
was farmie always gay, did she turn gay after …
Does it really matter?
Actually there are some churches that are very pro-gay. There will be more.
We could talk about all sorts of moral majority issues. Like how in Iran, the moral majority there believes stoning women to death is a good thing.
Thanks for the support friends.
“So you had to turn gay out of spite, I get it.
It shows.”
Hehehehehhehehehehheh. Like I said, teasing dumb animals.
Dance poodle!
And yeah, KN, they tore Jimmy Carter a new one when he confessed to lust in his heart.
Hell, at least he HAD a heart!
I thought there was no order of magnitude in sin?
hee hee hee heeeeeee!
And they STILL cant show how the marriages of mssame and edwards are morally superior to mine!
hee hee hee heeeeeee!
And KFG still can’t answer why she would fraudulently marry a MAN if she was truely gay.
“ksfarmgrrl” –
I think “homophobia” is the wrong word.
What’s the word for “homo hatred?”
I admit I’m on the outside looking in, but I always thought homophobia was due to ignorance.
But this thread (and this forum, for that matter) reveals that a lot of these people know better, they simply choose to think worse.
They’ve got no reason. They simply hate gays for the sport of it.
“Boxlicker cheats on his spouse in his mind as his many posts about fgrrl have proven.”
KansasNaive is not only naive but a pathetic liar.
Notice how he simply conjures up scenarios that allow him some imagined upper hand, because he has nothing else.
That activity simply proves how truly weak you are.
“And KFG still can’t answer why she would fraudulently marry a MAN if she was truely gay.”
Fraudulently? Heheheheh. Nothing about fraud in our divorce decree. I know it’s hard for you to understand, but I loved the guy and wanted to spend the rest of my life with him. Until he turned into an abusive and raging alcoholic. Then I had the good sense to get out.
And now anti decides who is and isnt TRULY gay?
HEE HEE HEE HEE HEE HEEEEEEEEEEE!
Lame. Very lame. I rarely fall for the false choice thing. But thanks for playing. We are amused…
“They’ve got no reason. They simply hate gays for the sport of it.”
No shit. Welcome to my world. And they especially hate us UPPITY gays who refuse to live in the closet. Who demand equal protection under the law. Who refuse to be ashamed of who we are.
Yep. It’s a sport. Just like dog fighting or teasing dumb animals….
“Is there some part of “I’ve never cheated on a spouse” that you cant understand? That includes my asshole ex. ”
Hum, I wonder what his side of the story is as there is always two. I wager to say he has considerably stronger words to use than “asshole” in describing kfg.
“the entire economic development program was abolished, ”
and; “me testifying, at my own expense, and on a day of vacation, in the legislature, regarding the hate amendment.”
Another couple of failures in addition to the marriage….starting to see a pattern here?
Oh and dont ya love how they would rather discuss ME than defend the moral superiority of straight marriages?
“Yep. It’s a sport. Just like dog fighting or teasing dumb animals…”
There she goes again, using examples of the things she knows most about.
heheheheh. HEE HEE HEE. HAHAHAHAHAH
Only in boxies’ world is doing the right thing defined as a failure.
Yeah. I have a pattern of doing the right thing.
farmie,
I know this will disappoint you but I got’a go, this time for sure.
Why don’t you go out and do some farm chores for awhile…like go milk a bull. Ha!
I guess boxlicker you will just have to take my word for it, now wont ya? I mean, just like we have to take, or not take, your word for the “fact” that you have a wife and a job.
Sucks, doesnt it?
I believe I would drink a lot too, if I had to listen to KFG run her yap all day long…
Well, we know you cant defend the oh so holy straight marriages of guys like mcsame and edwards, so I guess you better tuck tail and run.
mcsame and edwards
—-
Sh*t Bags, the both of them.
Find someone else to defend them KFG.
I wondered how long it would take the poodles to blame me for his alcoholism? So much for the conservative culture of personal responsibility. It’s always someone else’s fault, isnt it?
Still cant defend the moral superiority of straight marriage?
heheheheheh
Maroons
“ksfarmgrrl” chortles –
“And now anti decides who is and isnt TRULY gay?”
Uhm.
Yeah.
Meant to tell you about that, “ksfarmgrrl.”
“ANTI” is now the judge of all gay-ness.
I think it involves a written and an eye test. (“Maybe you’re nearsighted and saw that Ukrainian weight-lifter and thought she was a man.”)
Guys have it even tougher. Ol’ “ANTI” is a stickler about knowing show tune lyrics into the second verse. Otherwise, not gay.
I’m thinking about starting up a business, sorta like those SAT-coaching schools, to help people prepare for “ANTI’s” gay test.
Contact me if you’d like to enroll. (I’ll throw you a deal; free lessons on how to kick a soccer ball. — 10 extra credit points on the “ANTI” scale.)
Pssst, Moneyhawk….She married a man….on purpose!
The marriage fell apart (not placing blame), then she went gay….I thought you were born with the gay? HEEE HEE HEE HEEEE HEHEHEHEHEHE! I guess I was wrong!
“Gay marriages thriving uneventfully in Mass.
BY ROB HOTAKAINEN
McClatchy Newspaper
BOSTON – When Michele Frost and Mary Helen Walker enrolled their 3-year-old daughter, Shea, in preschool, it required a change in the school application form. But it was no big deal: Officials simply substituted the words “mother” and “father” with “Parent 1″ and “Parent 2.”
When the couple got their marriage license, city employees behind the counter were more interested in the child than they were in questioning the two lesbians about their relationship.
“We have been greeted so warmly,” said Frost, 42, who moved three years ago from Chicago to Quincy, Mass., just south of Boston. “We’ve just had a great experience.”
Nearly five years after the state’s Supreme Court ruled that a ban on same-sex marriage was unconstitutional, the vitriolic battle that brought international attention and apocalyptic fears to Massachusetts is all but dead. Since the first marriages on May 17, 2004, more than 11,000 couples have tied the knot. They’re busy mowing lawns and hauling kids to soccer practice, and the sky has not fallen.
Polls have shown consistent public support for gay couples. And with overwhelming support for gay marriage in the state legislature — the last effort to put it on the ballot failed 151-45 — the opposition has, for the most part, packed its bags and gone home.
“The biggest surprise about the whole thing is that there really has been no surprise,” Republican state Rep. Paul Loscocco said. “It’s been fairly much a non-event.”
While same-sex marriage is firmly entrenched in Massachusetts, gay activists in the Bay State say the future of the movement nationally could depend on what happens in California. In May, the California Supreme Court made the state the second to legalize gay marriage. But voters will get the final say in November, when they decide whether to back Proposition 8, which would ban same-sex marriage. A Field Poll released last month showed that 51 percent of likely voters would oppose the initiative, while 42 percent would support it.
“As goes California, so goes the rest of country,” said Joyce Kauffman, a lawyer in nearby Cambridge who’s active in promoting gay and lesbian issues.
Hey there, “ANTI” –
You’ve got no argument from me.
YOU are the ultimate authority of gay-ness.
I bow to your expertise.
Good.
I could care less if KFG is truly gay or not, but she has proven to be quite the hypocrite and that is what I am calling her out on.
Gary Bauer:
“The homosexual movement gained public acceptance by repeating the argument over and over that what two consenting adults do in the privacy of their own homes should not concern the rest of society. Then it started making demands on public policy, like the right to redefine marriage. Now, its agenda is moving beyond two adults, and it involves children, possibly even yours. As the concept of homosexual “marriage” gains a foothold in states like California and Massachusetts, children are getting dragged into the debate in a variety of ways, including homosexual adoption and state promotion of the homosexual agenda in the public schools.
The Associated Press reported this weekend that more homosexual couples are choosing to adopt or have their own biological children through surrogacy programs. The AP report described two homosexual men from New York who used a lesbian woman in Oregon as a surrogate mother. At some point, their now two-year-old son is going to ask why he has “two daddies,” and I’m sure it will only add to his confusion when he is told that his biological mother is a lesbian. Children deserve mothers and fathers. Each brings a unique perspective on life and family, but two daddies cannot make up for the lack of a mother any more than two mommies can compensate for the lack of a father. “Tolerance” is turning nature on its head, and the consequences for our culture and society will be profound.”
First of all, it should be apparent to all that ANTI is nothing but a troll (I suspect another poster posting one liners under this name) who posts for the express purpose of getting responses. Given the total lack of any content in its post, the appropriate response is…
DNFTT
Boxlock, once again, if you think you are winning this discussion, you are quite deluded. Lest you or anyone else forget…
You. Started. This.
Ksfarmgrrl posted on the hypocrisy of Edwards and McCain in terms of their opposition to gay marriage, while failing to uphold the vows of their own. Your chosen response, immediately get personal by calling what ksfarmgrrl does “perversion”. In one sense, I am glad you decide to act in this way…because you do damage to your cause by revealing the vapid and judgemental meanness of your POV at its core. On the other hand, I have known many people, people who are gay, and people who are conservative, politically active Christians. Very few of the latter would carry on with the sheer nastiness that you have demonstrated in this thread. I think of the people who I met as a widower in support groups, including people who were gay who mourned a same sex spouse, and I think of how hateful and hurtful your words would be to them.
On top of all that, you continue to demonstrate an incredible ineptitude in even relaying basic information or in constructing any sort of logical argument.
So, to business:
“Agnatha,
“Ah…you’re wrong again…I’ve never looked at the ’source’ you are saying is mine.
“By the way, you have a very bad habit of doing that.”
Sigh.
Boxlock, Boxlock, Boxlock. Don’t try to play this game if you don’t know what you are doing. Well, then again, if you knew what you were doing, you wouldn’t make this sort of mistake.
Peter Saunders is the source of the words you quoted. It is possible that this article was posted somewhere else (although I noticed that your quotation included an abbreviated list of sources relevant just to the paragraph you cut and pasted). And since you have never before demonstrated the least sort of ability to vette your sources, much less edit them appropriately enough to link the words to the sources that the author used and edit out the extraneous material, it is apparent that, once again, you lifed from a tertiary source. But, the words were Peter Saunders’, the original source was Peter Saunders and your missing that fact, regardless of whether that was the particular website that you got the quotation from, indicates once again that you don’t even bother to really pay attention to where you get the quotations you post. And that, basically, results in you waving a huge red flag that indicates that you not only don’t know what you are saying, you don’t care to know what you are saying.
“Just glancing at the source you provided, the numbers of homosexuals, percentage in the population, is even lower than in some of the studies I’ve glanced at…thanks for helping make my point.”
You really don’t have a coherent point. Percantage of the population is irrelevant to determining whether something is “perverse”. Perversity is an imposed subjective judgement influenced by cultural and personality and perceptual variables. And again, you seem to have missed the point that measurements of the percentage of population who are “gay” or “lesbian” is complicated by all sorts of reporting variables (such as the fact that several times more people report being strongly attracted to people of the same gender than people who actually report that they are homosexual). Of course, again, percentages do not prove that something is “perverse”. A majority of the population of this country, in recent history, considered interracial marriage “perverse”, or at least wrong. You yourself have indicated your opposition to that particular idea. What you seem to fail to understand is that by the very same criteria you argue against gay marriage, interracial marriage should also be disallowed, or at least unrecognized.
“Oh, and who, certainly not me, is going to waste time reading that big ‘pdf’ file study you dug up, though it is interesting that it states most homosexuality is very concentrated in major cities, the same cities with high HIV and even crime rates. Just a coincidence I’m sure, wouldn’t you agree. Again, ha, perversion!”
Boy, you really didn’t bother to read it did you? Then again, I have found it predictable that you would actually flaunt your willful ignorance. BTW, the authors and others have pointed out reasonable hypotheses for this apparent discrepancy, including:
1) People who are gay feel safer in larger cities.
2) People feel it is safer to be honest about their romantic and sexual orientation, even on “anonymous” surveys, much less census forms, in larger cities than in small towns.
“I’ll say it once more…I don’t care if you have sex with someone of your own gender, I’m not interested, I don’t care, I DON’T want to know. But don’t force that ‘perversion’ on me, and on the rest of society as ‘normal’, it ain’t. It is an activity that has been ‘frowned on’ for centuries, across cultures over the entire globe.
If you don’t want to argue about it simply keep it to yourself and out of my and others faces that know what it is.”
This brings to mind the old HL Mencken definition of puritanism: “the haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.” The idea that people who ARE NOT YOU, can make a lifetime commitment to other people who ARE NOT YOU, is something being forced on you is a perfect example of self cented arrogance. You are exactly the sort of peron who would have voted for John R. Brinkley for governor.
Well, there is Gary Bauer, whose Christian Right activism makes what he has to say on gay parents predictable and entirely independent of reality.
There there is this summary of peer reviewed research:
“Children of Lesbian and Gay Parents
Charlotte J. Patterson 1
1 University of Virginia
Address correspondence to Charlotte J. Patterson, Department of Psychology, P.O. Box 400400, University of Virginia, Charlottesville, VA 22904; e-mail: cjp@virginia.edu.
Copyright Copyright © 2006 Association for Psychological Science
KEYWORDS
sexual orientation • parenting • lesbian • gay • child • socialization
ABSTRACT
ABSTRACT—Does parental sexual orientation affect child development, and if so, how? Studies using convenience samples, studies using samples drawn from known populations, and studies based on samples that are representative of larger populations all converge on similar conclusions. More than two decades of research has failed to reveal important differences in the adjustment or development of children or adolescents reared by same-sex couples compared to those reared by other-sex couples. Results of the research suggest that qualities of family relationships are more tightly linked with child outcomes than is parental sexual orientation.”
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118584105/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0
Those of us who live in the reality based, rather than the blindly reactive based on pre-existing prejudice community, know what to take seriously on this subject.
Agnatha,
I am so flattered, I guess, or suppose I should be, that you would devote so much space to me. What that tells me and everyone else or should, is that what I posted REALLY gets to you, and that if it were not for the most part accurate and relevant it would not challenge you to the point you would expend the energy, emotion and time to refute it as you have, as it would not threaten your pet agenda. I say ’space’ because frankly I haven’t read what you wrote, and really don’t intend to. Sorry just being honest, as I have much more important things to do to night like watch the Olympics, or if there is a telecast failure then cleaning the lint from under the refrigerator, if there even is any.
Oh…I really shouldn’t be so disrespectful. I’m sorry.
You did expend some considerable energy and apparent emotion with the above posts and I do respect that. Because I do respect that I will admit that I don’t treat this blog with the literary respect or reference notations that a ‘paper’ of some sort would demand…I mean it’s only a damn blog after all. But my points are brought honestly, and they usually reflect my feelings, if sometimes a bit exaggerated because of the apparent density of some of those posting.
Oh, and by the way, I never posted or responded at all to the “hypocrisy of Edwards and McCain” question. I don’t know what all the factors were in their marriages or their campaigns on that subject, I don’t look to Presidents to involve themselves with social issues like that.
And I really didn’t read your ‘big pdf file’, I scrolled it and ‘think’ I picked up that there were very low percentage numbers of homosexuals, that they were concentrated in large cities, and that by coincidence those cities have large numbers of HIV, poverty, crime and how shall I say many other undesirable statistics for healthy living.
Just what I consider the ‘gay’, (got to be anything but happy), homosexual lifestyle and community in large to be.
Agnatha,
Why does it bother you so much that I, or anyone else, feels the homosexual lifestyle is a disadvantage in this world, and that in fact it is very contrary to a healthy lifestyle and more importantly to Biblical teaching?
Agnatha,
You post; ““the haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.” The idea that people who ARE NOT YOU, can make a lifetime commitment to other people who ARE NOT YOU, is something being forced on you is a perfect example of self cented[sic] arrogance.”
What makes you feel that as a member of this society, and more or less forced to live within it, that I have no say in what may very well effect the quality of life living within it for me and my family.
As I said, I don’t care what you or anyone else does as far as your relationships go, but I do care how that effects society as a whole and me and my family in particular. When someone pees in the pool it can touches everyone in the water.
Now…God Bless and I’m off to watch more of the Olympics with attention.
Yeowie.
I can see why FarmNag’s husband hit the bottle so hard. Living with that ongoing yappity-yap all day long. Just imagine.
*shiver*
I’m guzzling tequila just from having to read all this shit.
It is my sense, Boxlock, that you have had to accept a LOT of things that offend you.
“What makes you feel that as a member of this society, and more or less forced to live within it, that I have no say in what may very well effect the quality of life living within it for me and my family.”
I might ask you the same thing.
If you get to be the voice for God and enact legislation accordingly?
Well? Who is next? The single parent? The unchurched?
ANYONE who gets you outside your comfort zone?
You are losing Boxlock. And whether you know it or not, that is a good thing for you.
Nearly 12 hours after “ksfarmgrrl” posted on this thread –
“KSGolfnut” gave us –
Yeowie.
I can see why FarmNag’s husband hit the bottle so hard. Living with that ongoing yappity-yap all day long. Just imagine.
*shiver*
“All day long?”
“Ongoing?”
Oh.
Okay.
I get it now.
You’re drunk.
“I’m guzzling tequila….”
From now on, “KSGolfnut,” just tell us when you’re not guzzling tequila. It’ll save us a lot of time.
Not worried BJ….simply not worried, because who I place my confidence in is in control even when I don’t understand it.
Why are you trying SO HARD to convince me I’m losing??? I find that quite peculiar, and interesting.
BJ, I’m not trying to be mean here, but from what I’ve witnessed on this blog and understood mostly from your own posts, is that you, yeah you, are the loser. I don’t take delight in that, but I point it out so you might be able to hesitate for a moment and try an analyze just why that is.
Speaking out against wrong actions is both a right and a duty BJ, and I will continue to do that with or without your blessing…thank you.
“(1)I am so flattered, I guess, or suppose I should be, that you would devote so much space to me.(/1) (2)What that tells me and everyone else or should, is that what I posted REALLY gets to you, and that if it were not for the most part accurate and relevant it would not challenge you to the point you would expend the energy, emotion and time to refute it as you have, as it would not threaten your pet agenda(/2). I say ’space’ because frankly I haven’t read what you wrote, and really don’t intend to.”
Out of that long and rambling sentence are a couple of things worth responding to:
1) There is a reason why I tend to respond to you more than someone like, say a Regular or an Anti or even a KSGolfnut. You are, I think, very misguided and occasionally startlingly harsh (and I frankly feel I am understating the case here). However, I also have no doubt that you are sincere, and I guess I respond to that (as I try not to respond to trolls who simply post outrageous material to get responses).
2) There is a lot wrong with your speculation. First of all, the length of response someone gets is not related to the factual or logical merits of one’s post. Sometimes the illogic and mangling of factual information is so outrageous that an opposing poster has a lot of material to work with. Furthermore, my “pet” agenda is that people making a lifelong commitment to each other is something to be encouraged. The same virtues make a strong marriage, whether of a man and a woman, or two men, or two women. Virtues are virtues, and legally discouraging (indeed legally banning) two people from expressing those virtues simply because they share the same gender is every bit as arbitary as legally discouraging (indeed banning) two people from doing so because they are perceived to be of different “races”.
It’s not a “pet” agenda, it is simple human decency.
“Agnatha,
“Why does it bother you so much that I, or anyone else, feels the homosexual lifestyle is a disadvantage in this world, and that in fact it is very contrary to a healthy lifestyle and more importantly to Biblical teaching?”
I find the way that you phrased this question to be very interesting. While I have no doubt that the question is sincere, and I will treat it as such, in practice it is downright Orwellian.
1) Let’s start with Biblical teaching, since you think it is most important. First of all, in this country, “Biblical teaching”, by itself, is irrelevant as a basis for legally regulating behavior. Some of the more generally recognized virtues touted as “Biblical” actually have a far wider basis (e.g., the Golden Rule and its usually, in most situations, superior cousin, the Platinum Rule). Other “Biblical values” arise from picking and choosing from a book that, when all is said and done, is the collection of varied writings written over centuries, and imperfectly copied for centuries more, that from my point of view reflects the cultural and historical attitudes of people who lived in ancient worlds that are no more. As such, because it comes from multiple times and multiple frames of reference, the “consistency” is a contemporary perspective imposed by the believer from without. In this, it isn’t any different from any other “book based” religion. The Islamists insist that they are advocating for “Koranic” values, and we see the horrific impact they have on their countries. Christian theocrats have had similarly horrific impacts on their own countries, including at times, this one.
And quite frankly, given our First and Fourteenth Amendments, it is unAmerican to even attempt to use “Biblical morality” as the basis for defining what activities are legal. Period.
2) As for your belief that “the” homosexual lifestyle is “a disadvantage in this world” and “is contrary to a healthy lifestyle”. Fine, believe that. There are plenty of people who still believe that “racial miscegnation” is similarly wrong and unhealthy. Perhaps a less inflammatory comparison would be that a lot of people believe that eating fatty foods “is contrary to a healthy lifestyle”. However, it is one thing to hold this belief, it is another to try to impose it on others. It clearly bothers you that people think there is nothing wrong with “gay marriage” (remember, YOU waded into this fray with ksfarmgrrl, not the other way around), therefore, the question can be fairly turned around. On a personal level, I find your judgementalism of an entire population of people you clearly don’t know much about to be MORALLY outrageous. But, that explains my response on a personal leve. On another level, the legal realities, however, your question is downright disingenous. No one is trying to make heterosexual marriages illegal. No one is trying to legally prevent you or yours from marrying the person you are romantically and sexually attracted to, the person, in other words, you have fallen in love with. But, in the name of promoting your (unsupported by the way) personal opinion concerning what constitutes a healthy life style, you have firmly aligned yourself with those who would legally prevent ksfarmgrrl and others from marrying someone who they are romantically and sexually attracted to (the person, in other words, with whom they have fallen in love). In a curiously oddly self contradicting way, you point to the purported promisciousness of people who are homosexual as evidence of the wrongness of that lifestyle to support your opposition to gay marriage. But for most people who enter into it, the ideal of marriage means the same thing, gay or straight. It means monogamy. Are you really incapable of seeing the irony of your “argument” here?
Finally, to wrap this up, here is the thing. No one, despite your protestations to the contrary, is “imposing” on you if they are legally able to get married to the person they love. You may disapprove of it. You may think that it endangers your childrens’ immortal souls, but then again, so presumably, would be anything that competes with what you believe to be the values of your faith (Would you promote making marriage between atheists illegal-if not, why not? The example of publicly allowing atheist marriage would presumably be just as soul endangering as gay marriage). You already have to live with a secular world, and this country’s offerings of freedom of conscience is dependent upon our having a secular government that allows people of faith, and no faith, to openly live their beliefs. Legally allowing gay marriage does not threaten your ability to live your belief, and it does not, in the end, create obstacles or temptations that living in a free society doesn’t already impose.
So, in the end, the justification you are left with is the Mencken description of the fear of the puritan:
“the haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy.”
More to the point, the fear that people may be happy doing things that you don’t approve of.
It is, at its very basis, a truly mean reason to be opposed to something.
Well, after all that all I can come up with at first is ‘well, there they go again’. I thought this thread had more than played out. I will respond once more simply out of respect for the effort you obviously put into it and that I feel you are also sincere, though very misguided.
You post:
“Furthermore, my “pet” agenda is that people making a lifelong commitment to each other is something to be encouraged. ”
Agnatha, I have never stated or advocated at anytime or in anyway that people can’t make “commitments to each other”. Nor have I made anything of “legally discouraging (indeed legally banning)” what they do in private. I am simply saying that the homosexual community may not simply change the historical, legal, religious meaning of marriage at their whim, that’s arrogant in fact. And, why are you bringing in interracial marriage? I certainly have never commented on that and consider it to be an entirely different subject, not one I am apposed to, though it certainly may present it’s own set of challenges.
Your attack on the relevance of the biblical condemnation of homosexuality is unwarranted, though it may well not have secular legal weight it sure does relate to this countries, and most others as well, societal norms and in turn the successful functioning of our society.
And of course I feel the homosexual lifestyle is a disadvantage in this world, that is proven by the documented increased incidence of physical and psychological problems, the documented high numbers of sexual partners, and the short term, changing relationships occurring in that group. None of that is beneficial for individuals or societies. Sure there are exceptions but the statistics aren’t lying.
In closing, and that is what I am doing with this thread, I will repeat for the umpteenth time, do what you will, it’s your life and I don’t care to get involved or know about it. But leave the laws and moral convictions of the vast majority of society alone. You have no right to change that to make yourself feel better. Oh…sure you are free to try, but realize there are many who will strenuously object and stop you. The desire for a healthy society trumps your desire for acceptance of a lifestyle and actions that have never been accepted across the globe and across time and for good reason considering the problems statistically shown, and is in fact condemned by most societies and all religions. Religion being a signification component in society if not a secular legal factor to be considered.
Go your own way….I will go mine, and we both will continue to work for what we believe.
Take care, stay healthy, you’ll need it if you continually expend this much effort and emotion on what I predict is a losing endeavor.
And this is the guy boxlicker thinks holds the moral high ground? Heh. hehe. HEHEHEH.HEE HEE HEE. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAH!
http://www.crooksandliars.com/
Ooooooh. Moral authority indeed. Maybe he’ll pray for rain on my wedding day too!
ksfarmgrrl, Posted August 13, 2008 at 9:37 am |
“And this is the guy boxlicker thinks holds the moral high ground? Heh. hehe. HEHEHEH.HEE HEE HEE. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAH!”
What is that obnoxious noise again?
The most obnoxious animal on the farm or anywhere.
http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1478373106050986932pllLhU
KFG- I think he want to be your “special friend”!
????
Like the bible said: “I am not talking of you all: I have knowledge of my true disciples, but things are as they are, so that the Writings may come true, The foot of him who takes bread with me is lifted up against me.” (John, 13, 18).
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