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444 Comments
……..science denial anyone?
anyone?
anyone?
Watch for it……………it will come.
I do not believe in gravity! I am continually falling upwards but the ground gets in my way.
I think it’s time to discuss my theory of intelligent falling.
I was inspired to question the Newtonist dogma on “gravity” when I learned that science cannot explain the movement of three things at once. Sure, Newton’s “laws” can explain how two things move, but Newtonists can’t explain how a third object would affect that movement.
Newtonism would be great if there were only two objects.
But Newton cannot explain even this one object: The Pioneer Spacecraft.
Newtonism would be great of it could explain the Pioneer anomaly.
Of course Newtonists claim they can predict the motion of planets and such, but if they can’t predict the motion of three objects, it’s clear this is a lie. Afterward, they can explain why they were wrong, but close only counts in horeshoes and hand grenades. Did a Newtonist ever predict where a comet would come into existence?
Newtonism would be great if they could explain where the planets come from.
Newtonism would be great if they could tell where gravity comes from.
Newtonism would be great if they knew what gravity was.
There’s a lot of little “if”s in Newtonism, and a lot of debate about “gravity.” I think those little “if”s add up to one big IF: Intelligent Falling.
IF holds that the motion of the planets and stars around the earth is too complex to be explained through natural processes alone. There must be a Pusher. If a person is just walking along and suddenly falls down, you expect that happened because he was pushed.
I believe that angels push the planets around, and control the falling of objects toward one another. If this is true, there’s no reason to teach our children the unBiblical falsehood that the earth moves around the sun. If the Pusher wanted the sun to move, there’s no reason that it couldn’t.
Newtonism is in crisis, and our children should be taught the controversy. If Newtonists can’t explain what gravity is, why not accept their “saint”’s recantation above and acknowledge that Intelligent Falling is the only credible explanation for the universe.
– Joshua Rosenau
M-kay – I’ve got two topics to address today. I wasn’t able to peruse all the posts yesterday, ’cause my shift ended at 2:30 and I was busy at my desk before that, so…………….first and most importantly,
Nathan, I owe you a sincere apology. You did not make the comment about “liberals loving the Carr brothers.” I’m not sure why I thought you had; I must have read one of your earlier comments and my brain became befuddled. That happens to aging amazons as time passes – and what a cruel thing it can be.
Secondly……….as regards my ardent enthusiasm for a certain music CD. I appreciate all the suggestions for securing this particular tuneful offering. But…………
I most certainly know more than a little about “delayed gratification.” I won’t get into all that; suffice it to say, one can’t always have what one wants, as Mick Jagger famously sang on “You Can’t Always Get What You Want” from 1969’s Let It Bleed.
But when I heard those samplings from Cypress Hill’s 2004 release (”Till Death Do Us Part”), I felt alive. I felt joy. I felt the need to sing my lil’ laboring heart out. I wanted to get up and dance, and as this chick can barely frigging walk at this late stage, that’s sayin’ a bunchie right there. All in all, I really did want that CD – when I wanted it. However…..
I didn’t blockade the entrances to any bookstores to get it. I didn’t threaten to “hunt down and execute” the owners of those stores who didn’t stock it. I didn’t call ‘em murderers. I didn’t attest that “hatred is a good thang.”
Dramatic/artistic license ain’t gonna hurt anyone. I just wanted that CD right away – ’cause a coupla songs lifted my soul far, far into the crowned heights. I’m trying to be nice. I’m trying to exude equanimity here. But….
All in all, TestesTied&True, I mean, “Boxlock”:
Bite me.
writerdog
Posted June 6, 2008 at 7:10 am | Permalink
I do not believe in gravity! I am continually falling upwards but the ground gets in my way.
If you had posted that at 2 AM I would have had a good explanation!
:)
Wow, must have been a rough night or two. I went to bed reading after reading the Open Thread for 6/5 and woke up to read the Open Thread for 6/8.
I know I am getting old but just how old am I to miss two days on the Open Thread.
MH – you are absolutely correct. There is absolutely no way that “gravity” can explain how the sun, with its larger mass, is held in its orbit around the earth. The same is true about the stars motion around the earth.
It becomes absolutely impossible to explain the planets and how they can ‘retrograde’ in their orbits around the earth. The so-called “Theory of Gravity” completely breaks down.
Then ask the question: What held up all that water before it “fell” to earth in 40 days and 40 nights? “Gravity” fails yet again.
Hud – were you falling ‘up’ last night?
;)
Joshua Rosenau= moron
FilmFan: If you’re looking for a quick music fix:
http://www.seeqpod.com/
Just enter what you want to listen to. It will search and provide playable results, free.
I think people act on the blog much the same as they do in a car…somehow protected and free to be themselves, which explains the rudeness and abusive nature of some bloggers.
Who was it that said “a true test of character is you act when no one’s looking”? Except in the car and on the keyboard, everyone is looking, but it doesn’t feel that way.
Baby Miraculously Survives Abortion, Expected to Live ‘Normal’ Life
Thursday, June 05, 2008
“A mother who decided to abort her son because he may have inherited a life-threatening kidney condition is overjoyed that he survived the procedure.
In November, Finley was born three weeks premature. He had minor kidney damage but is expected to lead a normal life.”
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,363434,00.html
Mary,
I don’t disagree about blogging, but I think it also has something to do with the format, and not being able to read body language or voice inflection.
It’s a little like the sometimes tendency to misread emails and their accurate intent.
Mary – good point. Many years ago I went to the very first ‘meet-up’ that Hank Price set up. All of us together over burgers was a VERY different atmosphere. Also, as boxlock notes, sometimes we lose something in the translation when we can’t see each other. For example, if I referred to Nathan as ‘the boy’ it would likely be taken as negative – but if it were on that day with a Coke in my hand it would have had a very different meaning. (Hank and I are about the same age and each have son’s also about the same age)
Outlander:
Please forgive my redundancy, but an earlier comment may have been deleted (a message stating “awaiting moderation”) was displayed – so I’m not sure you saw it.
Thanks very much for the URL! I’ve already gone over there and had me a look-n-listen-see!
I really don’t know why I’ve lost so many of my treasured CDs. Either they were 1) lost in a move; or 2) in the midst of such much instant gratification, I tossed ‘em out the window in a moment of ecstacy; or 3) the irony of making that statement (#2( caused me to misplace ‘em.
There’s lots of CDs I want to re-buy: Coldplay’s first and second CDs, POD’s “Testify”, U2’s “Boy” (their first effort), The Cure’s self-titled 2004 CD, Sonic Youth’s “Murray Street” (2002), The Rolling Stones’ 1971 CD with “Brown Sugar” (I can’t repeat the name of that LP – it would be unladylike)…….
Anyway, Big Bertha needs to re-plenish her music supply. It’s my lifeblood!!!
FilmFan posts,
“I’m trying to be nice. I’m trying to exude equanimity here. But….
All in all, TestesTied&True, I mean, “Boxlock”:
Bite me.”
FilmFan, and “I owe you a sincere apology” also.
I was a little regretful once the ‘Post Comment’ was clicked, but alas once hit it can’t be retrieved.
I really didn’t mean anything too negative about it, it just seemed, from your obvious abilities evident from your posts, that you would know a CD like that is not going to be found just everywhere, and ordering and waiting a short time would be necessary and not too great an inconvenience. In fact, I thought you might probably ‘enjoy’ the anticipation of waiting for the object of your affection to arrive.
As I said above, this format (blogging) is sometimes too quick and easy to mis-project true meaning, and my intent was not to seriously defame you at all.
Hope you will forgive, I enjoy your posts.
Love,
Boxlock
Good morning Ben,
That first BLOG meetup was a team effort by Mary and me. It could not have been a sucess without the ‘non-partisan’ participation of everyone.
I would really like to have another one, but right now my weekends are pretty full of herding events. Maybe in July sometime. I’d like to have another one at our little clubhouse/park. Maybe I could give buggy rides to the kids. (Big ‘kids’ seem to like them too!)
Long…I know, but important to understand, and this coming from a brilliant man and gifted writer..
Obama and McCain
By Thomas Sowell
“Now that the two parties have finally selected their presidential candidates, it is time for a sober– if not grim– assessment of where we are.
Not since 1972 have we been presented with two such painfully inadequate candidates. When election day came that year, I could not bring myself to vote for either George McGovern or Richard Nixon. I stayed home.
This year, none of us has that luxury. While all sorts of gushing is going on in the media, and posturing is going on in politics, the biggest national sponsor of terrorism in the world– Iran– is moving step by step toward building a nuclear bomb.
The point when they get that bomb will be the point of no return. Iran’s nuclear bomb will be the terrorists’ nuclear bomb– and they can make 9/11 look like child’s play.
All the options that are on the table right now will be swept off the table forever. Our choices will be to give in to whatever the terrorists demand– however outrageous those demands might be– or to risk seeing American cities start disappearing in radioactive mushroom clouds.
All the things we are preoccupied with today, from the price of gasoline to health care to global warming, will suddenly no longer matter.
Just as the Nazis did not find it enough to simply kill people in their concentration camps, but had to humiliate and dehumanize them first, so we can expect terrorists with nuclear weapons to both humiliate us and force us to humiliate ourselves, before they finally start killing us.
They have already telegraphed their punches with their sadistic beheadings of innocent civilians, and with the popularity of videotapes of those beheadings in the Middle East.
They have already telegraphed their intention to dictate to us with such things as Osama bin Laden’s threats to target those places in America that did not vote the way he prescribed in the 2004 elections. He could not back up those threats then but he may be able to in a very few years.
The terrorists have given us as clear a picture of what they are all about as Adolf Hitler and the Nazis did during the 1930s– and our “leaders” and intelligentsia have ignored the warning signs as resolutely as the “leaders” and intelligentsia of the 1930s downplayed the dangers of Hitler.
We are much like people drifting down the Niagara River, oblivious to the waterfalls up ahead. Once we go over those falls, we cannot come back up again.
What does this have to do with today’s presidential candidates? It has everything to do with them.
One of these candidates will determine what we are going to do to stop Iran from going nuclear– or whether we are going to do anything other than talk, as Western leaders talked in the 1930s.
There is one big difference between now and the 1930s. Although the West’s lack of military preparedness and its political irresolution led to three solid years of devastating losses to Nazi Germany and imperial Japan, nevertheless when all the West’s industrial and military forces were finally mobilized, the democracies were able to turn the tide and win decisively.
But you cannot lose a nuclear war for three years and then come back. You cannot even sustain the will to resist for three years when you are first broken down morally by threats and then devastated by nuclear bombs.
Our one window of opportunity to prevent this will occur within the term of whoever becomes President of the United States next January.
At a time like this, we do not have the luxury of waiting for our ideal candidate or of indulging our emotions by voting for some third party candidate to show our displeasure– at the cost of putting someone in the White House who is not up to the job.
Senator John McCain has been criticized in this column many times. But, when all is said and done, Senator McCain has not spent decades aiding and abetting people who hate America.
On the contrary, he has paid a huge price for resisting our enemies, even when they held him prisoner and tortured him. The choice between him and Barack Obama should be a no-brainer.”
Very well, Boxlock. I accept your apology.
I’m sorry, too.
Your comments just “hit me wrong”; the reasons for that aren’t fodder for this Blog.
Gettin’ old…..and gettin’ bitter…..and walking like Granny Clampett from “The Beverly Hillbillies” – these things are probably clouding my outlook of late…….
Have a great day,
FilmFan
Just as long as you don’t start walking like Jed Clampett. :)
“liberals loving the Carr brothers.”
That would be my post.
Amos McCoy has them both beaten with his hobble.
fleettwood
Posted June 6, 2008 at 9:12 am | Permalink
“liberals loving the Carr brothers.”
That would be my post.
=====================================
Let’s hope you dont seriously believe that, or expect anybody to take it seriously either for that matter…. What a totally ludicrous thing to say!!
Chas- Fleet is polishing up his role as BDP- he’s going to the Nationals again this year!
It’s you people who won’t let us fry them. Not me.
The Aftershock Signature of Supershear Earthquakes
Michel Bouchon1* and Hayrullah Karabulut2
Recent studies show that earthquake faults may rupture at speeds exceeding the shear wave velocity of rocks. This supershear rupture produces in the ground a seismic shock wave similar to the sonic boom produced by a supersonic airplane. This shock wave may increase the destruction caused by the earthquake. We report that supershear earthquakes are characterized by a specific pattern of aftershocks: The fault plane itself is remarkably quiet whereas aftershocks cluster off the fault, on secondary structures that are activated by the supershear rupture. The post-earthquake quiescence of the fault shows that friction is relatively uniform over supershear segments, whereas the activation of off-fault structures is explained by the shock wave radiation, which produces high stresses over a wide zone surrounding the fault.
1 Centre National de la Recherche Scientifique et Université Joseph Fourier, Grenoble, Laboratoire de Géophysique Interne et Tectonophysique, Boîte Postale 53, 38041 Grenoble, France.
2 Kandilli Observatory and Earthquake Research Institute, Bogaziçi University, Istanbul Kandilli Observatory, 81220 Cengelköy, Istanbul.
Libs.
“According to a memo to the park board from the staff released Thursday, “The overall policy question for the Board is whether it is good policy for Seattle Parks to continue public beach fires when the carbon … emissions produced by thousands of beach fires per year contributes to global warming.”"
I think you must be right, Gster…
Fleett… It is a JURY who decides such matters… not public opinion!! LOL
Wow, I’m shocked, Rhonda took Partisan Pat to task in her editorial today!
Unemployment and oil jump today.
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080606/wall_street.html?.v=24
“It is a JURY who decides such matters”
You are correct. The jury sentenced them to death.
You people are fighting the sentence.
FilmFan posts,
“Your comments just “hit me wrong”;”
Well…not really FilmFan, I would have taken it just as you did. I am so used to posting in reply, sometimes I initiate though, to other posters, to go unnamed this morning so as to not get it started, that sometimes I ‘forget’ who I am posting in reply too, or just don’t think.
You didn’t deserve my flippant remark.
You have a great day as well.
Now got’a run, need to replace the flush mechanism in the downstairs bathroom….grandkids are on the way, ha.
I read a piece about John Sidney McCain the Third (for Shrub’s 3rd term) appearing in Baton Rouge the other night.
The turnout was sparse and a bunch of kids from LSU showed up to pad the crowd for the cameras.
At the end of the speech, the kids started chanting “Four more years! Four more years! For more years!” and the real McCainiacs joined in. That is, until some campaign worker realized what that message was! Campaign operatives ran into the crowd (such as it was) to try to quell a little guerrilla tactic from local Obama supporters.
(Am I permitted to chortle, or is that solely the franchise of “Regular, et al?”)
Sowell is dead on unfortunately. Thinking people will realize this. This is probably the most important election voters have faced in their lifetime.
The unemployment figure will continue to rise as Gores $5 gasoline come even closer. Three thousand from Continental Airlines and 1100 from United Airlines alone. As people spend more and more of their money on fuel it stands to reason they won’t be eating out and buying new products as much. The result- more unemployment.
Drill now.
One bright note – Wichita has the cheapest gasoline in the country as reported today on USA today.
Fleett — WHO is fighting their sentencing?? Once again, that is not a matter solved or changed by public opinion… Geez! BDP for sure!!
Chortle Monkeyhawk – is that tantamount to Nero fiddling while Rome burned?
Boxlock,
May I suggest an additional 100psi water pump to the toliet tank. That eliminates the need for additional flushing, cleaning and lingering magazine readers on the throne. :)
I learned a long time ago when someone starts a sentence with “You people” , what follows is generally low grade BS.
Case in point!
Since most of the oil beneath Alaska is put on tankers and sold by Big Oil to Japan, the whole “drill our way to energy independence” meme is a false promise.
Just what part of “multi-national corporation” do you not understand?
The only way oil pumped from American soil goes to Americans is if we nationalize Big Oil.
C’mon, Cons. Is that what you’re really advocating?
Yup, it is.
Even as you don’t realize it.
Time to squash duh progressive Lib and environmental wackos claim about oil being shipped to Japan. Seen it several times in the past few days.
SNOPES.COM
All the crude oil produced in Alaska is sold and shipped to Japan. Status: False
http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/alaskaoil.asp
fleettwood
Posted June 6, 2008 at 9:12 am | Permalink
“liberals loving the Carr brothers.”
That would be my post.
And, as I noted yesterday, the only thing I would ‘love’ about them would be the oppotunity to try ot by two-noosed rope.
As usual; you are totally full of crap.
Hardly Monkeyhawk. That has been the argument of the left for way to long. And now your chicks are coming home to roost and it is costing you as much as those evil cons are paying. Dang, how did that happen?
In the seventies behind the tree huggers the left led the way to no drilling and no new refineries. We are now paying the price. Wake up. I can afford the gas but many can’t. Not sure how much longer I will be able to afford it. The affect is shutting down the economy and the libs have a good headstart on that.
The democrat congress did pull the GW bill off the block because even they knew that to hit the public with new taxes before Obama took office was the death knell for him.
Read the story today on the DrudgeReport where the GWers are calling for $45 trillion in new spending for this program. They have left the field of rational thought and entered outer space.
I guess that makes one Lib who doesn’t love them.
Personally, I think the Carr brothers, along with BTK should have been ground up into ‘zoo food’ and feed to the carnivores.
Regular,
Ha….I’ll check that out!
This stupid mechanism flushes just fine but it doesn’t start the water flow to refill unless I just ‘touch’ the little lever, either up or down, and then it works fine. Now I and my wife can to that, of course it’s a pain to take the tank cover off to ‘touch’ it, but the little kids can’t.
So I have to get up off my behind and fix it.
That running problem in a toliet tank is caused by a bad washer in the inlet valve. When you tap it, it reseats and works like it supposed to.
You need to replace the washer.
Have to slide out the valve linkage and the rod, the washer is at the base, replace with new washer.
Sometimes it’s easier to put in a whole new assembly if the ’slime’ and ‘corrosion’ factors have set in.
Good job, Regular on researching the ahem.. misrepresentations, on the part of the left about where Alaskan oil goes.
Dear MonkeyHawk,
Speaking of Thomas Sowell, he wrote a very good book a few years ago, “Basic Economics”. You should read it. You might then understand ’supply and demand’.
The increase in the supply of a commodity in demand world wide anywhere, particularly one such as oil, decreases the price of that commodity everywhere.
Nationalize ‘Big Oil’? How do you propose to nationalize a multi-national, multi-corporation industry with 80% of its assets overseas?
fleetie – name ONE liberal who loves them. Again; I call BS on you.
ben ben ben The Libs who want to abolish the death penalty, that’s who.
Fleetie, you are making a false connection that everyone who opposes the death penalty must also “support” or “love” the carr brothers.
heheheheh.
But then, you are the BDP because logic means nothing to you. To you, I guess logic is just an evil lib socialist plot.
Hey, ben! There’s one.
It becomes absolutely impossible to explain the planets and how they can ‘retrograde’ in their orbits around the earth.
I can’t tell you how, but I can explain ‘retrograde’ astrologically. Retrograde (or Rx as astrologists show it) is when a planet appears to move backwards in its orbit. We’re currently in Mercury Rx, which began on May 26 and will end on June 19 this period. A Mercury Rx usually happens 3 times a year and lasts 2-3 weeks. Because Mercury is considered the planet of communication, when it’s in Rx, you can expect anything related to communication to go wacky. And computers are often the hardest hit.
Take my word for it, this is a time for backup, backup, backup, when it comes to your computer and Mercury Rx. ;) Which isn’t bad advice at any time, if you think about it.
He had minor kidney damage but is expected to lead a normal life.
That’s exactly why, at age 38, I didn’t have the offered genetic testing when I was pregnant. Downs Syndrome is often detected in pregancies of older women. I chose not to have the testing because I knew if they found it, I wouldn’t choose to abort. You see, I’m PRO-CHOICE, not pro-abortion. :)
Planet and celestial bodies rotate around barycenters (magnetic force centers) not the bodies of planets or stars like our sun.
If you have an idea how electro magnetic motors work, then the same principles apply. The rotation occurs about the confluence and is variable if the orbit is not circular, but elliptical. Each instance of the force is variable as there is no such thing as a natural steady state mechanism.
Unemployment soars to 5.5%
Increase in the jobless rate is the biggest since 1986 as payrolls decline for the fifth straight month.
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) — The unemployment rate took its biggest jump in more than two decades in May as employers once again cut jobs, according to a government report Friday.
The unemployment rate soared to 5.5% from 5% in April. Economists surveyed by Briefing.com had only forecast that the closely watched rate would rise to 5.1%.
http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/06/news/economy/jobs_may/index.htm?postversion=2008060610
Yeah Ben, and on that news, and the continuing housing disaster, the Dow is taking a big header today. Early in the day yet, but it’s down over two hundred points right now.
The bush economy at work.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16638277/
Scientists, Christians unite on climate fight
Evangelical leaders reach pact with experts on global warming issue
BOSTON – Some leading scientists and evangelical Christian leaders have agreed to put aside their fierce differences over the origin of life and work together to fight global warming.
Representatives met recently in Georgia and agreed on the need for urgent action. Details on the talks will be disclosed in Washington on Wednesday.
“Whether God created the Earth in a millisecond or whether it evolved over billions of years, the issue we agree on is that it needs to be cared for today,” said Rich Cizik, vice president of government relations for the National Association of Evangelicals, which represents 45,000 churches.
Thanks Regular, I think I’ll just replace it with a better one.
Thought for today and the time.
“The public cannot be too curious concerning the characters of public men.” —Samuel Adams
Except in the car and on the keyboard, everyone is looking, but it doesn’t feel that way.
And the shower, Mary. Can’t forget that one. ;)
A Messiah in our midst?
By Jonah Goldberg
Is Barack Obama the Messiah?
Before we answer that question, let me vent for a moment. In 2000 I was cruelly denied the Pulitzer despite being the only columnist in America to ask the pressing question: Is Al Gore an alien? The evidence was there for all to see. He was born nine months after the mysterious alien sighting at Roswell, N.M. His weird syntax and verbal rhythms are otherworldly. He often refers to “earth” or “this planet” as if he’s just passing through, and he once angrily complained to the Washington Post that it had printed a picture of the earth from outer space “upside down.”
There is no “upside down” in space—unless Gore had his childhood view in mind.
At least I’m not in the wilderness this time. Lots of people have pondered the possibility that Barack is our Divine Redeemer. There are Web sites dedicated to the question “Is Barack Obama the Messiah?” Google that question and you’ll get more than 35,000 hits. (Enter just the words “Messiah” and “Obama” and you’ll get nearly 10 times that.)
But there’s more concrete evidence. Since Obama declared his candidacy, there have been remarkably few biblical plagues. And lions and lambs seem open to bilateral negotiations.
Obama’s apostles are hard to dismiss. Oprah simply calls him “The One,” because “we need politicians who know how to be the truth.” (Jesus says in John 14:6 “I am the way, the truth…”) Oprah goes on to say Obama will help us “evolve to a higher plane,” which would put Obama in the role of our Intelligent Designer.
According to the New York Times, Obama’s volunteers are taught to eschew discussions of the issues and instead “testify” about how they “came to Obama.”
For many, he’s no retro-redeemer, but a 21st century savior, a Matrix-messiah and Neo for our modern-day Nineveh. Self-help guru Deepak Chopra dubs Obama “a quantum leap in American consciousness,” while prominent “leadership coach” Eve Konstantine assures us that, “He’s our product out of the all-knowing quantum field of intelligence.”
Obama willing, I will never be stuck next to these people on a plane.
Michelle Obama is arguably Obamanity’s greatest evangelist, even though she has a streak of Old Testament smiting and wrath to her. She insists her husband has redeemed the entire nation (hence her newfound pride in America). She proclaims her husband is the sort of leader who will fix our broken souls. But don’t hope for grace on the cheap. “The change Barack is talking about is hard,” she insists, “so don’t get too excited, because Barack is going to demand that you, too, be different.”
Those of you who thought we had a Second Amendment to keep government from fixing your soul are so 20th century. Evolve already.
And then there’s the Gospel according to Obama himself. In January, he told Dartmouth students that they will know to vote for him because “…a light will shine through that window, a beam of light will come down upon you, you will experience an epiphany, and you will suddenly realize that you must go to the polls and vote for Barack.”
When asked in an interview what sin is, Obama defined it as “Being out of alignment with my values.” Apparently, the editor failed to capitalize the “M” in “My.”
But such mistakes can be forgiven, for Hillary has been cast out and the nomination is nigh. So we can get cracking on fixing America—and ourselves.
“I am absolutely certain,” Obama proclaimed in his victory speech, “that generations from now, we will be able to look back and tell our children that this was the moment when we began to provide care for the sick and good jobs for the jobless; this was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal. This was the moment—this was the time—when we came together to remake this great nation…”
Now, if you’re under the mistaken impression that sick people had some care, or that a few jobs were to be found prior to June 2008, or that maybe—just maybe—the oceans don’t rise and fall with the election returns, or that America itself doesn’t need “remaking,” you’re not one of the “ones we’ve been waiting for.”
But you might be one of the ones Al Gore has been waiting for. You’d understand if you realized “Earth in the Balance” is a cookbook.
http://christiansandclimate.org/
Now is the time for followers of Christ to help solve the global warming crisis. There is overwhelming evidence that human activity is a major cause, and we know that the impacts of climate change would be hardest on the poor and vulnerable, and on future generations. · We need to act, and everyone has a role. As Christian citizens we can learn more, make personal changes, and rally action. Christian leaders can join more than 120 other senior evangelical leaders who have signed the Evangelical Call to Action on Climate Change. For policymakers, it’s time to make wise and moral choices to protect God’s world and its people. · Join us. Take the next step.
In 1980, when Big Oil was forced by law to sell domestic oil at a lower price than imported oil, I was working in Beaumont, Texas. Over in Port Arthur, we could see tankers loaded with domestic oil cruise down the Sabine River to the Gulf of Mexico.
One afternoon on a picnic, we happened to notice the names of the ships heading out to sea. A few hours later, we saw the same ships steaming into port.
Why?
Because once the “domestic” oil reached the 12-mile limit into international waters, they turned around and came back to shore with “imported” oil (at about twice the price, with its accompanying higher profits to Big Oil).
I got to know a guy who worked on those tankers. It was sweet for him. Daily work and he slept in his own bed every night.
We’re still in touch these days. He works out of Alaska and says “it’s the same ol’ gig.” They cruise out twelve miles, return to port with “imported oil,” and then turn around to sail for a couple of weeks to Japan or Korea or China.
“It’s okay,” he tells me. “Gina’s gotten fat and old. LOL.”
The Real World of Big Oil.
Some guy on an oil tanker…
Somebody is in denial.
Let’s just all ignore the fact that the DOE estimates drilling in Alaska would only decrease the cost per barrel of oil by 41 cents in the near term and by up to 1.44 in the next decade or two!.
If there were excessive amounts the coastal refineries wouldn’t be able to use it and it would have to go on the international market.
“As Christian citizens we…”
Is Annie a Christian?
I rode my bike into work today Annie. Third time this week. I am taking “The Next Step”.
How are you taking “The Next Step”?
That would probably be the “International Market” referred to!
Surely not, Monkeyhawk! After all it MUST be the fault of those treehugging liberals in the ’70’s.
(That’s sarcasm, for the folks who don’t have that gene.)
sing it brothers and sisters
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhmpsUMdTH8
Is Annie a Christian?
NOPE
“Regular” proves yet again that irony is not dead with –
Some guy on an oil tanker…
Somebody is in denial.
I’ve done my fair share of “sweating in the sanctuary” when the summer thermostates were turned up to accomodate lower utility bills and environmental correctness.
This of course explains why Christians carry ‘hankies’ as there is a need to wipe perspiration as they slow cook in the house of God.
How are you taking “The Next Step”?
I retired
Monkeyhawk
Posted June 6, 2008 at 10:00 am | Permalink
Since most of the oil beneath Alaska is put on tankers and sold by Big Oil to Japan, the whole “drill our way to energy independence” meme is a false promise.
=====================================
Hey, Monkey, when I posted that yesterday, the Cons called me a liar… I think we need a link to that effect today… Hmmm???
Barack and Bobby: Compare and Contrast; and, Obama-Clinton as Lennon-McCartney circa 1970
It was moving to read Tom Hayden’s reflections on Bobby Kennedy’s candidacy of 1968, his own role in it, and the ways in which Obama’s campaign has reconnected him with the spirit of those times. Yet I find it equally moving to consider the ways in which Obama and RFK are different, the ways in which they are mirror images rather than carbon copies.
My own relationship to Bobby’s campaign was not like Tom Hayden’s. I was 14 years old, obsessed by politics and rock & roll. And if you’re going to be a 14-year-old who’s obsessed with politics and rock & roll, 1968 was the year to do it: Student revolts in Paris and Prague. Marching in the streets of America. Gene McCarthy’s candidacy, then Bobby’s. And musically there were the Beatles, the Stones, James Brown, the Doors, Otis Redding, Jimi Hendrix, the Impressions, Paul Butterfield, Albert King, the Who, Aretha Franklin,Cream, Marvin Gaye, the Mothers …
Then, tragically, gun shots in Memphis and L.A. Drug overdoses in rock star hotel rooms. But before the tragedies there were the moments of exhilaration.
I’ve said this before: Had Bobby Kennedy not run for President, I wouldn’t be writing these words right now. My fascination with politics is the direct result of what he made seem possible, from the symbolic to the soulful — from his promise to make “This Land Is Your Land” the national anthem, to his tears for the Appalachian poor. I see Barack Obama having the same impact on young kids today. It’s the single most positive effect his candidacy could possibly have.
And yet, for the many similarities between the two candidates, consider the differences: Bobby Kennedy was the ultimate insider, the product of wealth and power. As he grew his hair and increasingly identified with the youth of the world, as he joined Cesar Chavez and Martin Luther King to walk with the disaffected, as he challenged the world of authority that his family had mastered, he was doing something powerful and symbolic: He was walking down from the mountaintop to join with the people below.
Obama’s is doing the opposite: He’s climbing up the mountain. Where RFK was the ultimate insider, he’s the ultimate outsider. He’s African American, multiracial, international, from a non-traditional family upbringing. Bobby’s bearing in his final year was increasingly open, informal, and emotional, which Barack’s is centered, balanced, and almost cerebral. In Marshall McLuhan terms, Barack is “cool” while Bobby was “hot.” And where Bobby joined a movement that was already underway, Barack seems to have triggered one that was waiting to happen.
Yet both of them are catalysts, and both created candidacies with enormous potential to generate symbolic and real change. Obama’s first move as party head was to refuse PAC and Federal lobbyist money for the DNC. That may be largely symbolic in hard-dollar terms, but as a sign of the times it’s enormous. Combined with his stunning ability to raise money from small-dollar donors, it’s nothing less than a declaration of revolution. He’s seizing the means of political production and transferring it from insiders to the general public.
I read every word that Tom Hayden wrote in 1968, too. He’s right to note that Obama’s policies as President might be disappointing, although like him I’m hopeful. And an Obama presidency will certainly be an enormous change from the last eight years, no matter what happens. That, plus the electrifying effect he’s having on young people, makes 2008 a year of great promise.
***
As for that “secret meeting” between Clinton and Obama last night, it made me think of Lennon and McCartney during the breakup of the Beatles in 1970. The two of them were pretty pissed off at one another by then, and Lennon loyalists felt that McCartney screwed him with the way he handled his departure from the group. But there were only four living people who knew what it was like to be a Beatle, to have lived in the eye of that hurricane. And only two of them knew what it was like to spend years fighting for the role of frontman and band leader.
People put a lot of pressure on them to put the band back together after that. In some ways, maybe they should have. Maybe then we wouldn’t have had Lennon’s “Mind Games” (”some kinda druid dude lifting the veil”) or Paul singing “we’re so sorry, Uncle Albert.” Each was always the other’s best critic. But then again, we might not have had “Imagine,” either.
Apparently Lennon and McCartney repaired their friendship, and almost showed up on a whim to play on Saturday Night Live after a great routine in which Lorne Michaels and Jimmy Carter offered the Beatles $3500 to reunite. (Lennon said later that they didn’t have time to make it to the studio where the show was being broadcast.)
My point? I guess it’s this: A lot of people want a Dream Ticket, the same way a lot of people wanted a Beatles reunion. Me, I don’t have an opinion either way. Management consultants talk about “managing up” and “delegating up” in business, and I intend to do that here. Barack is the party’s leader now, and Hillary has created a powerful following. Let them work it out between themselves, and then let the candidate make his decision.
You can be a fan of Lennon’s politics, his great writing and singing, and still acknowledge that McCartney is one of the great composers, musicians, and singers of our time. Obama and Clinton are like John and Paul in at least one way: Only the two of them know what it’s been like to be in the bubble of this campaign for the last six months. If they want to go back on the road together, that’s fine with me. If not, they’ll each have their own hits.
Like the song says: They can work it out.
Oops.
That was a cut-and-paste from RJ Eskow.
Wow Ben!
Biggest increase since 1996!
1996 unemployment rates:
1996-01-01 5.6
1996-02-01 5.5
1996-03-01 5.5
1996-04-01 5.6
1996-05-01 5.6
1996-06-01 5.3
1996-07-01 5.5
1996-08-01 5.1
1996-09-01 5.2
1996-10-01 5.2
1996-11-01 5.4
1996-12-01 5.4
Truth of the matter is the average annual unemployment rate for the Bush years is lower that the average rate for the Clinton years, but that TTBOI doesn’t fit into the liberal template.
How are you taking “The Next Step”?
“I retired”
In pre-retirement, Annie apparently participated in the cumulative actions by all of mankind to destroy the environment. After this period of earth destroying activity, she became so filled with desire to help the environment that she graciously decided to retire take the “Next Step” for saving this planet.
She feels sanctimonious in the fact that she no longer participates in the daily earth destroying activity of working at a job that produces a good or a service.
Apparently, Annie did not have the cognitive faculties available to her to figure out a way to simultaneously be productive while leaving the environment unharmed.
Since that is the case, I say good for Annie for doing the only thing she knew to do to help the environment.
Since Annie has not offered no other specifics on how to take “The Next Step”, perhaps Annie really expects people to follow after her example by retiring.
Maybe she thinks that the goods and services that Annie enjoys in her retirement will be provided by her own imagination once these people decided to quit work as well?
What is better for the world, people staying home or people working and being productive?
Now this has got to stop. Torture is one thing, but panyies have their place, and it’s not on the heads of suspected terrorists. My God, the inhumanity!!!
Lawmaker gets to the bottom of panties torture
Debate waged over making suspected terrorists wear briefs on their heads.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24974898/
“Chas” –
Bottom line is this: Oil is an international commodity. Like oats and wheat and corn.
Where it comes from is a non-issue unless a country decides (as in Venezuela, Saudi Arabia, Iran, etc) to nationalize their domestic production.
Whatever might come from ANWAR or shale oil or stripper wells in Kansas will be a mere drop in the
bucketbarrel in the international commodities market.Advocates of conservation are spot on; conservation is the easiest, first-est, cheapest, and most economically advantageous way to address immediate energy needs.
But… the most profitable corporations in the history of the world are making money hands-over-fists by jacking up the price of oil. And guys in ‘79 Torinos and SUVs want nothing other than 79-cents-a-gallon gasoline. Because… uhm, because… well, because that’s what they want!
Big Oil has purchased a lot of politicians. Big Oil should have invested more in alternative energies. But as long as they can buy public officials and public opinion for a while, maybe they can leverage their financial clout to preempt or buy out alternative energy technologies.
Hank, if we wern’t putting panties on terrorists headsa, the employment rate would be way down:-0
One idea for annie to take the “Next Step” herself would be to reduce her consumption of carboniferous foods.
The carbon that we consume through our dietary intake it metabolized and combined with the Oxygen that we inhale to form CO2.
For example: If that ground beef is left alone in the grocery market fridge, the carbon containing plant matter eaten by the cow that is now in the beef will never have the opportunity to be processed into CO2. Therefore, Annie should leave that ground beef alone since it is safely sequestering Carbon.
Essentially, annie is a miniature CO2 generating powerplant. The more Annie eats, the more CO2 she releases from the food content of her diet into the atmosphere.
annie, now that you have retired, are you going to take the “Next Step”?
Hey JM,
I guess if it’s torture or not depends a lot on who’s panties they are putting on their heads!
Monkey”boy”
“Whatever might come from ANWAR or shale oil or stripper wells in Kansas will be a mere drop in the bucket barrel in the international commodities market.”
“boy”, you have any idea how much oil we have in shale? A BUNCH. And the world knows it. But we can’t exploit it fully because it’s expensive. As soon as we began producing significant quantities the world wide price of oil would plunge well below the production cost of the shale oil and whoever had financed the operation would go bankrupt. Just like in the early 80’s.
“I consider all American laws under the Constitution to be evil and not of God,” Mohammed said. He particularly took issue with a society that allows “same-sexual marriage” and other things that “are very bad.”
**********
Looks like Boxlock is in good company. The above are the opinions and words of Khalid Sheik Mohammed.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/06/AR2008060601161.html?hpid=topnews
“According to the 2000 U.S. Census, South Dakota’s population is 754,844. Is it any wonder, then, that ANWR’s possible 10.4 billion barrels of oil could provide fuel for a state with less than one million people for almost 500 years? I think looking at U.S. oil consumption as a whole can reveal a clearer picture of drilling in ANWR. According to the EIA, in 2006 the United States used over 20.6 million barrels of oil per day. If I’m correct in my calculations that means ANWR can provide a little over 500 days’ worth of oil, assuming the U.S. was only using oil extracted and transported from ANWR.
Five hundred days’ worth of oil. That hardly seems like enough to justify potentially causing unprecedented damage and disruption to wildlife.”
http://www.torringtontelegram.com/V2_news_articles.php?heading=0&page=&story_id=1901
Chas
Posted June 6, 2008 at 11:26 am | Permalink
Monkeyhawk
Posted June 6, 2008 at 10:00 am | Permalink
Since most of the oil beneath Alaska is put on tankers and sold by Big Oil to Japan, the whole “drill our way to energy independence” meme is a false promise.
=====================================
Hey, Monkey, when I posted that yesterday, the Cons called me a liar… I think we need a link to that effect today… Hmmm???
——————————
Being as I posted a Snopes web document link today that proves the ‘Oil to Japan’ assertion false Brother Chas, I’ll let you determine if what you and the primateraptor posted is a lie or not. :D
——————–
SNOPES.COM
All the crude oil produced in Alaska is sold and shipped to Japan. Status: False
http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/alaskaoil.asp
Well, now, Regular — Since we are not drilling in the ANWR region YET … Then what I said, and Monkey said today, can hardly be FALSE…. YET…. And YOU have just done a dig to prove it!! LOL I love it when you prove yourself wrong!!
Chas
Posted June 6, 2008 at 12:23 pm | Permalink
Well, now, Regular — Since we are not drilling in the ANWR region YET … Then what I said, and Monkey said today, can hardly be FALSE…. YET…. And YOU have just done a dig to prove it!! LOL I love it when you prove yourself wrong!!
————————–
Oh brother…
Tis indeed sad folks, very sad…
Correction — what I said yesterday… Cause what I said yesterday, was that the last I heard, the ANWR Oil would be exported out of the country… I didnt say WHERE…. I am not that stupid…
Yeah, Brother Chas…
Why do I even bother…
I mean, a man too prideful to admit he was in error when he made a false assertion and then spins it so radically, the bullsh#t meter needle pegs the scale and pops out poking right in they eyes of intellectual honesty.
Regular, what does your Snopes statement say??
SNOPES.COM
All the crude oil produced in Alaska is sold and shipped to Japan. Status: False
===================================
What I said yesterday was that the last I had heard, ANWR oil would be exported out of the country, and not used HERE….
The Snopes FALSE statement is correct… ALL oil produced in Alaska is NOT being exported to Japan….
Look here, you Dumb Ass — I never said ONE WORD yesterday about ANWR being sold and shipped to Japan…. YOU dumbShi* are the one doing the friggin spinning!!! I am not going to let you do it anymore!!
YOU just got caught…. by including ME in your Snopes.com quote… which is absolutely correct….
BUT…. All I said was that ANWR oil, last I heard would be exported!!!
SO… your SNOPES commentary which includes oil being curently produced in Alaska… does NOT apply to what I said about any future production, if any, out of ANWR……
Get it Stupid???
Anybody with a brain knows that all of the Oil produced in Alaska is NOT all being sold and shipped to Japan…
Actually, I dont believe Monkey said that either…
So, REGULAR, you are only partially right!~!
Brother Chas,
Take some aspirin, you might be heading for a stroke.
Anyone have a spare needle for the B.S. meter? It’s pegging off the scale today. :cool:
Fleetwood would be fine with executing the 126 people that were sentenced to death, but later proven to be innocent, just so he and McCluer could kill BTK and the Carr Brother and grind them up for animal feed.
You “pro-death” folks don’t get it – the system is broken – it has nothing to do with the Carr Brothers and has everything to do with the judicial system that could sentence 126 innocent men to death.
Damn.
Monkeyhawk
Posted June 6, 2008 at 10:00 am | Permalink
Since most of the oil beneath Alaska is put on tankers and sold by Big Oil to Japan, the whole “drill our way to energy independence” meme is a false promise.
=====================================
Monkey’s post doesnt even say ALL of the oil beneath… He only says “most”
However, the SNOPES.com reference is the correction of false statements made by others…. >>>>>
SNOPES.COM
All the crude oil produced in Alaska is sold and shipped to Japan. Status: False
“Looks like Boxlock is in good company. The above are the opinions and words of Khalid Sheik Mohammed.”
Steven,
That simply confirms homosexuality is condemned in ALL religions, not just Islam. There are none, to my knowledge save maybe Satanism, that endorse that behavior.
You are much smarter than to try and make much of a point of that. I certainly give you more credit for wisdom than your comment might indicate you deserve.
But I understand why you might be ‘aimed and cocked with a finger on the trigger’ waiting me. But that’s okay…I’m not insecure in my opinion on the subject.
Hope you have a delightful weekend, I’m already into mine.
but but but Clark…
It would be safer than feeding the animals Chinese glutin…
My goodness, Boxlock… You arent even right on that one… You really should try to read more… I can name at LEAST three denominations in the USA who ORDAIN Gay/Lesbian Clergy!!
WRONG AGAIN, Mr. Know-it-All!!!
When eco-activists argue against drilling in ANWR, they shout out how the oil is small compared to the global consumption of oil and therefore it is not worth the fight. They provide predictions such as “it will only lower the cost per barrel by $5″.
However, those same activists will fight to keep Holcomb from achieving its expansion based on the additional CO2 that is purported to induced global warming. However, there is no predicted increase in global temperature that the additional CO2 from the proposed 1,400 MGW addition would make even though the expansion is opposed primarily on the basis of global warming!
The contributions to the global scale matters when they are fighting to prevent drilling in ANWR, but they don’t matter when they fight to prevent a coal plant from expanding its existing facility.
REGULAR — You lost a good bit of credibility by posting the SNOPES item… since nobody here said that ALL of the oil produced in Alaska was sold and shipped to Japan…. And then, you made the attempt to prove Monkey and myself wrong…. When we never said what the SNOPES clip said to start with…. Good old straw man fallacy fell apart on you that time!!!
“you Dumb Ass”
“YOU dumbShi*”
“Get it Stupid???”
-Chas
Is this guy calls himself a Clergyman?
What a Joke.
sing it brothers and sisters
Oh, wow, Annie! I don’t watch much TV, so I’m glad you shared this.
Wake up, folks! Whether GW is caused by nature or by man, we must take care of our planet.
Now, Regular, show me a link that says the future ANWR production, if there is to be any, will NOT be exported… (which is what I have heard) — Show that link, and I will gladly retract my statement as to what I heard and read previously….
However, that doesnt mean that the ANWR production would do all that much good, as pointed out in the link from the Torington newspaper above…
Since we are not drilling in the ANWR region YET …
Sorry, Regular, but technically, Chas is right in the above statement. LOL
RFL — nothing in my ordination vows say that I can call a Dumb Ass a Dumb Ass, or a Dumb Shi* a Dumb Shi* — or somebody Stupid, who is Stupid…
What makes you think a clergyman is not allowed to speak for him/herself??? THAT is stupidity in itself, RFL… or whoever you are… TROLL!!!!
Chas
You done corkscrewed into the ground 20 minutes ago. Give it a rest. You lose.
*can* = cant
Predestined
Posted June 6, 2008 at 12:47 pm | Permalink
Since we are not drilling in the ANWR region YET …
Sorry, Regular, but technically, Chas is right in the above statement. LOL
————————–
Technically speaking, I have the potential for setting the world’s record for pole vaulting and Mr. Fizzy gallong container drinking for the Guiness world book of record as well.
Heckler — sorry — dummy — but YOU lose…
I never said anything about Oil exported to Japan to start with…. I made a comment yesterday that I had heard and read that any future ANWR production was headed for EXPORT, and not for domestic use….
GET IT???? REGULAR jumped his gun…
BTW, I was the one who said ANWR oil would be sold to China. Maybe I had my countries mixed up, but I clearly remember the oil would be sold to a Far Eastern country, or was planned to be sold there.
It’s old news anyway, but at least I’ll admit my error.
Chas
Posted June 6, 2008 at 12:48 pm | Permalink
RFL — nothing in my ordination vows say that I can call a Dumb Ass a Dumb Ass, or a Dumb Shi* a Dumb Shi* — or somebody Stupid, who is Stupid…
What makes you think a clergyman is not allowed to speak for him/herself??? THAT is stupidity in itself, RFL… or whoever you are… TROLL!!!!
——————–
Any thing in your ordination vows about bestiality acts with diseased camels?
Anyone who still has any lingering respect for Thomas “Uncle Tom” Sowell, be prepared to lose it now:
“Our choices will be to give in to whatever the terrorists demand– however outrageous those demands might be– or to risk seeing American cities start disappearing in radioactive mushroom clouds.”
1. What terrorist demands? Like we should get US troops out of Saudi Arabia like we promised? “US troops won’t be on Saudi soil one day longer than necessary,” then Sec’ry of Defense, Dick Cheney, 1991.
They were there until George W. Bush quietly pulled them out in 2002.
This was the prime motivation of all the Al Qaeda attacks against the US starting in 1993 and continuing through 9-11, 2001.
2. What countries support “terrorism” against the U.S.?
Two that do are Pakistan and North Korea. Both of those countries already possess a nuclear bomb. While I don’t like the idea of Iran possessing the bomb, there’s no evidence that it would use it against the US anymore than Pakistan or North Korea will.
A lot of evidence points to the conclusion that countries want a bomb so that they won’t get attacked and invaded by the United States, which has become a very real threat after the Iraq fiasco.
Thanks PreD — That’s what I been trying to say!! And now the sock puppets and Trolls are trying to twist and spin again!! LOLOL
Reg,
I doubt you have the potential or either that you stated above, but I still have to laugh at Chas’s statement.
Come on, we all make mistakes, even Perfect You! Can’t we all make today a NON personal attack day and give it a rest?
or to risk seeing American cities start disappearing in radioactive mushroom clouds.”
Isn’t that what the Bush-rats said about Saddam? Gee, maybe Sowell knows where the WMDs are!
Predestined
Posted June 6, 2008 at 12:51 pm | Permalink
BTW, I was the one who said ANWR oil would be sold to China. Maybe I had my countries mixed up, but I clearly remember the oil would be sold to a Far Eastern country, or was planned to be sold there.
It’s old news anyway, but at least I’ll admit my error.
=======================================
PreD… I dont know if that is an error… I had heard/read that as well…
As I posted above, if somebody has a link to show otherwise, I will gladly recant…
So far, I havent seen one yet…
I almost forgot point 3–
The CONs have nothing except fear with which to motivate voters.
It used to be the old Soviet Union and the “spread of communism” — a laughable ridiculous obsession that we morgataged our children’s future to “protect” against.
Then it was a whole host of lesser villains: Moamar Khaddafi, Manuel Noriega, Willie Horton, Saddam Hussein the first time, Slobidon Milosevich, etc. etc.
Finally, the CONs get the Mother Lode of “fearsome enemies”–bin Laden and Al Qaeda. “They can strike anywhere at anytime! They’re madmen who will kill children! They are filled with the lunacy of religious passion! We’re all gonna DIEEE!”
The CONs. Pathetic cowards afraid of life.
Pre –
“Come on, we all make mistakes, even Perfect You! Can’t we all make today a NON personal attack day and give it a rest?”
Not Chas. Ever. Under any circumstances. ANYONE who says othersise is a TROLL (in all caps). Or a Dubmshi*, or some other lovely expletive entirely appropriate for a “man of the cloth.”
And no one takes him seriously anymore, on any “side.”
Haven’t you figured that out by now?
Capn,
Saddam stated often that his reason for wanting a nuclear weapon was for protection against those who already had one.
I’ll get booed for this, but it strikes me as highly ironic that the U.S. (in particular) has decided who can and who can’t possess nuclear weapons, yet the U.S. has the most of them.
It’s a real pity that nuclear weapons and the techonology to make them were ever discovered. Same with atomic. But I guess they represent POWER, so of course we must have them. What each and every country and each and every person with a finger that can hit a button must realize is that using the weapons they have just might wipe us all off the face of the earth.
God promised never to do that again with a flood, but he sure didn’t promise it wouldn’t be by fire, and that’s what a nuclear strike would basically be. We’re just helping God along, I guess.
GMC,
What I see with Chas is that he words things in a way that leaves him open for finding fault. Instead of explaining, he backtracks to correct. Lots of people do that. It doesn’t mean they should be belittled and bullied.
“A lot of evidence points to the conclusion that countries want a bomb so that they won’t get attacked and invaded by the United States, which has become a very real threat after the Iraq fiasco.”
————-
I’d sure lie and say that if I were an Arab or third world country wanting to get my hands on a nuke. Of course, only the gullible leftists who want a weakened America like CapnA would believe it.
CapN — You left out the infamous “Carlos” from our childhood days!! LOL
Back to work for me. I won’t tell you all to be good, because when I do, all hell breaks loose. LOL
Chas
As some have already have stated (and is refernced in that Snopes article) oil is a world commodity. Whether it is exported or not makes no difference to the price we pay for oil. If the supply goes up and the price goes down what difference does it make which hole in the ground it came from.
ANWAR is just another example of how Leftie enviro wackos are costing us out the whazoo at the pump. The oil reserves we have that are off limits to drilling are enormous. Castro’s drilling for oil right now that we can’t drill for because of stupid politicians bowing to environmentalists. Sheer brilliance.
PreD says >>>>
“I’ll get booed for this, but it strikes me as highly ironic that the U.S. (in particular) has decided who can and who can’t possess nuclear weapons, yet the U.S. has the most of them.”
Not only are you correct in your statement, it is also highly ironic, that the U.S. who has most of them, is the ONLY nation who has ever USED them against another country… eh??
What I see with Chas is that he words things in a way that leaves him open for finding fault. Instead of explaining, he backtracks to correct.
That’s one explanation – a very kind one. If that’s all it was, I’d agree with you. But I’ve seen too much BS; I can’t give him that much credit. Or credibility.
Sorry Chas. That’s just the way it is.
Heckler, even if ANWR is used for domestic purposes, as pointed out above, there is only about 10.4 billion barrels there… and, as was said upthread, thats about enough for 500 DAYS of oil in the U.S.
When you figure out the TIME needed to get to that 10.4 Billion barrells… and the Energy needed to get it out… it hardly seems worth the effort…. We would be better off to drill off the Florida Coast, where Brother Jeb objected —-
Hey GMC,
What’s the official lawyer word for B.S. in the Court Room? :D
Thats OK GMC… we all know you aint much of lawyer either!! LOL
GMC — I just posted above that if somebody can find a link that says ANWR oil would NOT be exported, I will recant what I said before… that I heard/read that it would be exported… just as PreD heard/posted….
Now, your problem is what???
Not only are you correct in your statement, it is also highly ironic, that the U.S. who has most of them, is the ONLY nation who has ever USED them against another country… eh??
————-
Doggone nuke using Democrats.
“Little Miss Can’t Be Wrong”. I don’t know why that song popped into my head just as I am replying to Chas. Good song though.
GMC — if you would only READ… I also said I agreed with the SNOPES.com statement… So, I really cant see that you are doing anything here but Flaming, and Trolling….
Ummm Outlander, do you disagree with my statement that the U.S. is the only country to ever use nukes on another country??
Chas
Just how big does an oil deposit have to be to justify drilling for it? Give me a number. By your reasoning all the drilling in Kansas is a waste. We should just stop it.
And yeah, we should drill off of Florida, and California.
Just got an e-mail from the city.
There’s going to be a special council meeting at 3:30 to discuss “matters of non-elected personnel”.
Wonder what will happen… ;)
Heckler, just read that link from the Torington newspaper… I think what you are asking is answered in that piece…
MrC — new city manager?? maybe??
RFL posted June 6, 2008 at 12:40 pm
“When eco-activists argue against drilling in ANWR, they shout out how the oil is small compared to the global consumption of oil and therefore it is not worth the fight. They provide predictions such as “it will only lower the cost per barrel by $5″. ”
———-
False. It’s more like at most $2 a barrel, if OPEC ignores it. The arguments are:
We do not have the significant oil reserves needed to influence world oil prices. OPEC does.
Prices are set by BOTH supply AND demand. Lower demand caused oil prices to fall in the 1980’s.
We could “produce” much more than the Refuge with higher energy efficiency — also sooner, faster, cheaper, guaranteed, and cleaner.
And efficiency does not run dry, like Prudhoe Bay is, and the Refuge will.
The widespread infrastructure would disrupt the wildlife in the fragile Refuge.
TAPS is old, worn, and indefensible.
http://www.wilderness.org/Library/Documents/upload/PennyaGallon20yrs1.pdf
“… that even twenty years down the road, when Arctic Refuge oil is at or near peak production, gas prices would be affected by only a few pennies per gallon.”
That estimate is probably optimistic. TAPS and other domestic sources are declining. Refuge oil at best only reduces the rate of future decline.
1:30 PM- DATELINE WICHITA, KANSAS:
Sources near City Hall are hearing strong rumors that effective Jan. 21, 2009, former President George Bush will be named Wichita City Manager! There are reported efforts underway to provide his housing in Cow Town. More to follow– ENDS
Unexplained long lines of cars pulling trailers noticed leaving Wichita on I-135 in both directions.
gster:
At the rate we’re going, I’m almost convinced Bush MIGHT be a step up!
Mr C- I’m not there yet!
Heckler Posted June 6, 2008 at 1:04 pm
“If the supply goes up and the price goes down what difference does it make which hole in the ground it came from.”
If the demand goes down, the price goes down, and you don’t have to pump the oil from a “hole in the ground”.
And it’s cheaper now to increase efficiency than produce $100+ a bbl oil.
“ANWAR is just another example of how Leftie enviro wackos are costing us out the whazoo at the pump.”
Gas is at $4 a gallon. You believe that a few pennies = “costing us out the whazoo”?
$4.00 is bad, $3.97 is good? And that’s ignoring OPEC’s control of prices.
http://www.wilderness.org/Library/Documents/upload/PennyaGallon20yrs1.pdf
“… that even twenty years down the road, when Arctic Refuge oil is at or near peak production, gas prices would be affected by only a few pennies per gallon.”
“…it has nothing to do with the Carr Brothers”
It has everything to do with them and everybody else on Kansas’ death row. Pleased to be wondering if there is one, even one, who does not deserve the death sentence. Name just one.
Libs = love the killers.
Fleett — it only takes one mistake… one inmate executed wrongly… to make a mockery of the death penalty…. I havent seen anybody on this Blog arguing to save the lives of anybody currently on Death Row in Lansing… have you??
Any thing in your ordination vows about bestiality acts with diseased camels?
Beer shot out of my nose. Don’t give you much recognition Reg, but damn that was funny.
“Libs = love the killers.”
Cons = kill them all, even if they are innocent.
Fleetwood, perhaps do, or you know someone, that likes to play a little pool after work, crack a few and have a good time at your favorite watering hole? Do you or this person have a phone? Single? Maybe interested in a woman or two?
Well, in Arizona, that was enough to send an Air Force vet to death row, after the bartender was found raped and murdered and his phone number was in her address book.
Twelve (?) years later, DNA evidence (that the prosecution had) PROVED that he was innocent.
The pro-death folks would have had him executed after one appeal and thirty days.
Would you have been okay with executing this man?
Chas
“Heckler, just read that link from the Torington newspaper… I think what you are asking is answered in that piece…”
No, it isnt.
I repeat the question-Just how big does an oil deposit have to be to justify drilling for it?
“But I understand why you might be ‘aimed and cocked with a finger on the trigger’ waiting me. But that’s okay…I’m not insecure in my opinion on the subject”
You would not be the only person that barb could have been aimed at around here. You just came to my mind on the subject for some reason.
The other thought I had when I saw it was “so, there is a reason KFG calls some folks the ‘Kansas Taliban’”.
I hope you have a good weekend too. I will be working and thus my hopes are not high for a good one.
“I repeat the question-Just how big does an oil deposit have to be to justify drilling for it?”
Depends on the environment risk. ANWR, big problem. Off the Gulf Coast of Florida, no problem.
Why did the Bush Brothers deny drilling off the Florida Coast?
Are the Bush Brothers “environmental wackos?”
Heckler — ask a geologist — or a petroleum engineer… and while you are at it, remember it has been said that no oil will even come out of ANWR for 10 years or so, even if we go for it…
And there is still the matter of whether it is to be exported, or kept for domestic use… I have yet to see any link to clarify that matter… still waiting…
“Would you have been okay with executing this man?”
Is this a Kansas problem? If you people would be honest, you don’t want anybody on Kansas death row to be executed even though you would admit they all did what they were accused of. There is no one there who did not do it. So why do you defend them so bad? I answered that in the previous post.
Fleett??? WHO is defending them?? You act like you have a personal stake in this thing… Geez!!
We wouldn’t use all the oil in ANWR for 500 days. That is probably nearly logistically impossible.
However, 2 million barrels a day for the next 15 years IS a significant amount of oil.
Even if we sell it to Japan or China we could simply use that to offset the cost of oil from other sources which are more logistically available to us.
Drill off the coast of Florida? Sure lets do it too.
We should simply be exploring and drilling for oil here as much as we can.
Yes… we can conserve. However you feel good liberals are only fooling yourselves if you think that conservation is anything but a temporary feel good solution.
Our consumption is going up not only because the standard of living is going up but because more people need more goods and use transportation which all requires more oil.
Conservation is only a small temporary solution which would essentially stall our demand for a very short time until the natural need would exceed whatever conservation did.
The bigger problem with conservation is implimentation.
Are you going to force people to conserve or beg them to do it?
The easiest and most practical solution to the cost of oil is simply drilling for more oil.
In the meantime we can work on new technology and conserve. But not drilling is refusing to look at the future and getting caught up in your typical liberal feel good policies which don’t fix anything…. only make you feel good.
cosmos-O
““ANWAR is just another example of how Leftie enviro wackos are costing us out the whazoo at the pump.”
Gas is at $4 a gallon. You believe that a few pennies = “costing us out the whazoo”?”
Let me clarify. Combine ANWAR with all of the other places that have been made off limits, and you have a serious impact on our oil supply.
WS Clark,
Again, lets drill in both. You are using Florida as a Red Herring.
Either you support drilling in ANWR or you don’t. Florida has nothing to do with it.
Hey Ben,
How’s the new addition to your family working out?
I don’t really like the pinch collars, I don’t even really like choke chains. I have a bunch of pinch collars that were donated to me, you can have one if you feel you must go that route.
However, if you bring him out and walk around the lake with me and one of my dogs I can probably have him on a loose lead before we get back to the house. Almost any evening, bring the wife, I have wine in a box!
“WHO is defending them??”
You tell me. Do you think all the Kansas’ death row folks should get the sentence the jury gave them?
Chas
“remember it has been said that no oil will even come out of ANWR for 10 years or so, even if we go for it…”
Yeah, that’s what Bill Clinton said when he vetoed it 14 years ago………….
How long you going to make that arguement?
And I repeat the question- Just how big does an oil deposit have to be to justify drilling for it?
(in Chas’ opinion)
If it were up to geologists we would be pumping oil out of it right now.
Hank – he is a lot of fun. Loves the boys and they love him. Very lively.
I tend to not be a fan of pinch/choke either. Might have to get him out to the country some where he can really run off his energy. I think the biggest problem is he gets lonely when I’m at work. Also he doesn’t like the heat a lot.
Cosmos says:
“We do not have the significant oil reserves needed to influence world oil prices. OPEC does.”
OPEC is a collection of about 10 middle eastern countries (I’m not going to bother to look up the exact number). The USA is only O. N. E. country (I don’t need to look that up). So obviously, ten countries located in the middle east who have the infrastructure to pump out oil will have greater impact on world oil prices in the near term than a yet to be developed oil field in Alaska.
Thanks Cosmos for stating the obvious. However, the biased view of people like Cosmos on how much ANWR would alter the global oil pricing market doesn’t change the impetus for exploring for more oil.
Anywho, the USA should be using domestic sources of energy if it is going to use any energy at all.
Especially with the fact that 95% of the worlds oil reserves are owned by national oil companies many of which belonging to countries that are not too friendly with the USA other than the willingness to take dollars for oil.
To disrupt a wild life refuge for a relatively small amount of oil… when we have such a huge amount available in the Gulf, AND off of Florida’s coast, doesnt seem to be worth the time and energy needed to do it…
Im sure you know the kind of equipment it takes… and I am also sure you realize the kind of weather conditions exist in the ANWR region… Cost of drilling, versus profit?? And I am not sure you will find that ALL geologists would tell you to drill now…
In my opinion there isnt enough there, in those conditions, plus disrupting the Wildlife Refuge… to go in there…
Mch more feasible to hit the Gulf of Mexico, and the Florida and California Coasts… Bush wont be around to block Florida for that much longer…
Steven,
Thank you for your response and well wishes.
It truly is my sincere hope we can be friendly on this blog in spite of differences of opinions, which can be actually interesting to explore.
I well realize some of my past posts, and likely future ones as well, would nearly eliminate that possibility. But as you said, I believe it was you, this format of communication lends itself to obnoxious behavior, or something to that effect.
Without giving away any ‘proprietary’ information on yourself may I ask what you do for work? You mentioned, “I will be working and thus my hopes are not high for a good one”, in reference to the weekend, and I was interested. But not meaning to be nosey.
“You tell me. Do you think all the Kansas’ death row folks should get the sentence the jury gave them?”
Do you think that the 126 men proven innocent should have been given the sentence the juries gave them?
Ummm excuse me… but OPEC isnt JUST middle east countries…
HLP,
A couple of days ago, you wrote the following:
“HLP
Posted June 4, 2008 at 3:33 pm | Permalink
Well, CF2K,
Liberal nitwits like you have bandied around the racist and anti-sematic labels so much that they’ve become meaningless.
Anti-sematic? Prove it loser.
Racist? LOL! Again, prove it loser.
Nitwit”
Here’s my response, which I posted last night on that same thread.
Dear HLP,
This look familiar? It should. I had Philip delete it last week.
“HLP
Posted May 28, 2008 at 9:18 am | Permalink
Radio Televiv, 1600 on your radio dial.
But for you . . . 1598?
Your snickering that “Jews are cheap” is textbook anti-Semitism.
Here’s a quote for you from Paul Rose’s “German Question, Jewish Question: Revolutionary Antisemitism from Kant to Wagner” (Princeton NJ: Princeton University Press, 1990). The passage discusses the German author Borne’s version of Shakespeare’s Jewish villain, Shylock.
“Money and revenge are the driving forces in Shylock’s personality. ‘We detest the money devil in Shylock, we grieve for the tormented man, but we love and marvel at the avenger of inhuman persecution.’ But Shylock knows that his accursed lust for money is sick, and in the end, he is forced to admit that love is stronger than money:
‘He gives away money to avenge his people and discovers that gold is not the lord of the world as the Jew believes, but that love is more powerful than money, even in the Jew.’”
(Rose 147-148)
So, HLP, I’ll spell it out for you:
-Textbook example of anti-Semitic slur = “those Jews sure are cheap”
-”Those Jews sure are cheap!” = big laughs for HLP
I’ll let you finish the inference for yourself.
Given the pleasure you derive from employing sterotypes that exhibit anti-Semitic prejudice, you may want to be more selective in your use of them, lest anyone else accuse you of being an anti-Semite.
WS Clark,
Are you saying the Carr brothers are actually innocent?
“If you people would be honest, you don’t want anybody on Kansas death row to be executed even though you would admit they all did what they were accused of”
“Everyone” was convinced that the 126 were guilty also.
Would you have those men die so that you could execute the Carr Brothers?
We’ve got the same problem with our new puppy! She doesn’t like to be left alone. She’s too little to put with the big dogs in the ‘dog room’. She’s so small she can go through the fence.
We started out by putting her in the guest bathroom while we’re at work. She cried and licked her feet all day. So we put Samson in there with her to baby sit. He’s our oldest beardie. They are doing fine in there together.
Maybe you need another dog!
Who cares about them? Those states have that problem. We don’t. All of our death row folks did it, but you people won’t pull the trigger on them.
I said be honest. It’s not about making a mistake with our death row people. Admit it.
Chas,
There would be someone starting drilling in ANWR as soon as our government says “OK”
Since when do you care about the profit margin of the company doing the drilling?
The profit margin is a non-issue. We are not sitting here waiting for someone to think it is profitable. We are waiting for the Democrats to say it is ok.
Talk about a dumb argument.
“Either you support drilling in ANWR or you don’t. Florida has nothing to do with it.”
Asked an answered previously, but here goes again.
Why are “environmental concerns” a valid reason NOT to drill off the Florida Coast, but they are not important when it comes to ANWR?
The Bush Brothers blocked drilling off the coast of Florida and I don’t remember hearing the outrage from the Republicans.
Why is that?
Nathan, just STOP your assinine flaming… NOBODY here has even approached saying the Carr brothers are innocent… until you just mentioned it, in your FLAME…
Chas
“plus disrupting the Wildlife Refuge”
Please, you’ve seen pictures of the place. Nothing there but mosquitos the size of caribou.
And what do you care what it costs, it won’t come out of your pocket. It won’t come out of the governments pocket. And you won’t be working the rig, what do you care what the conditions are like?
SolDevVB,
How do you italicize?
ie.
SolDevVB
Posted June 6, 2008 at 1:47 pm | Permalink
http://blogs.kansas.com/weblog/2008/06/open-thread-68/#comment-364146
Here’s an excerpt from what the Rude One had to say yesterday about putting folks to death.
“William F. Buckley, mother****** though he may have been, had the guts to say that all the arguments pro-capital punishment supporters used were nonsense. Why not, he said, just admit that there’s a human desire for vengeance?”
I think fleetie and his ilk are proof we have NOT evolved beyond the “Grog kill enemy” days. Prolifers indeed.
Blastocysts, they love.
Adult humans? not so much…
The 126 that Clark keeps quoting surely have died of old age by now.
WS Clark,
Do you think that there was enough doubt in the Carr brothers conviction to not execute them???
“Are you saying the Carr brothers are actually innocent?”
Well, let me check my posts…….
Hmm, not here.
Not there.
One more, nope not there.
Nope, I never even addressed the issue of the guilt of the Carr Brothers – so that is a damned stupid question.
Are the Carr Brothers guilty in my view? Yes.
The issue is not yada, yada, yada in Kansas – it is the system in totality.
So, Nathan, since “everyone” was sure that the 126 were guilty, should they have been executed?
ksfarmgrrl
Posted June 6, 2008 at 2:21 pm | Permalink
Here’s an excerpt from what the Rude One had to say yesterday about putting folks to death.
“William F. Buckley, mother****** though he may have been, had the guts to say that all the arguments pro-capital punishment supporters used were nonsense. Why not, he said, just admit that there’s a human desire for vengeance?”
I think fleetie and his ilk are proof we have NOT evolved beyond the “Grog kill enemy” days. Prolifers indeed.
Blastocysts, they love.
Adult humans? not so much…
—————————
Adult humans – Malice Aforethought
Blastocysts – Not so much
The Libs cannot answer the easy question.
Is there even one person on death row who did not do the crime?
Well Ben, like I said before, Viszlas are related to Weims, and Weims are well known for their separation anxiety.
“Maybe you need another dog!”
I’d second that Hank, but maybe something calmer to balance things out!
“The 126 that Clark keeps quoting surely have died of old age by now.”
Funny, McCluer, the possibility of executing innocent people is god damned HILARIOUS.
WS Clark,
I have also answered you as well. Drill off the coast of Florida too.
Yet you still refuse to support drilling in ANWR.
That is why it is a Red Herring. Drilling in Florida or not has no bearing on your support for drilling in ANWR.
So why are you continuing to be so dishonest in your argument by continuing to use Florida as a Red Herring?
I understand the difference Reg. But… either you are pro life or you are not.
Oversimplified for some of the wingnuts here. And they STILL cant understand.
“Is there even one person on death row who did not do the crime?”
Execute 126 innocent men – or give murderers life without parole?
Cons = kill them all, they must have done SOMETHING.
CF2K,
That’s it! That’s the joke that has your par panties in a wad?
LOL!!
I was on a fast attack with a first class machinist mate that was Jewish. Before Mr. Gold even said a word to you you would suspect he was Jewish. After he spoke he removed all doubt!
He fit every Jewish stereotype that you’ve ever known about Jews! I learned a lot about the Jewish faith from him. We worked together, we prayed together, we drank and partied together and we went down to the sea in ships.
He had a very good sense of humor. He told me that joke. He told me some Jewish jokes I cannot repeat in public!
You call me an anti-semite over an inocent joke?
nitwit
Chas,
I asked a cery simple question. In nearly all of those “126″, if not all, cited by WS Clark, I would be willing to bet that they were eye witness accounts and had very little hard evidence and that left them open to be innocent which DNA later did prove….
So, do you think that the Carr brothers were actually innocent or that the evidence against them was not sufficient enough to execute them?
What evidence was lacking?
It is not a flame, it is a valid question.
“So why are you continuing to be so dishonest in your argument by continuing to use Florida as a Red Herring?”
Screw you, Mr. Social Skills…… I am already stated that the environmental risk for drilling in ANWR is not worth it.
How is that being “dishonest” dumbass?
Another dog? I don’t think so – the house yard couldn’t stand it. I’m thinking as he becomes more secure the anxiety will lessen. Actually it dies seem to have – especially if I throw his chase toy and give him a walk when I get home. Probably good for me too!
Last night was a bit wild – he doesn’t like sirens even when he is inside with me.
Heckler spews: “…mosquitos the size of caribou.”
Yea, right… that far NORTH in Alaska?? Sure, and not to mention all the rest of the Wildlife…. It isnt called by the Government a wildlife refuge for mosquitos!!
To me, it just doesnt make any sense that any company would even WANT to go into that kind of conditions to pump out a fairly small amount of crude…
Why are YOU so hell bent for election to get that ANWR oil anyway??? What does it profit YOU??
ksfarmgrrl
Posted June 6, 2008 at 2:25 pm | Permalink
I understand the difference Reg. But… either you are pro life or you are not.
Oversimplified for some of the wingnuts here. And they STILL cant understand.
————————–
I understand kfg. (crosses fingers and eyes, then delivers immature content)
Say Mr. Murderer. We won’t kill you, but we can offer your three hots and a cot for the rest of your life.
Ben, with all due respect, I dont think the separation anxiety will get better. Playtime and walks will tire them out more, which is a good thing, but the separation anxiety thing is genetic.
My friends in Weim rescue tell me the best luck they’ve had is crating them during the day. They tried that AFTER their two Weims ATE a leather sofa. No kidding.
Maybe your guy is already crated or crate trained, but they seem to feel more secure in a crate.
Whatever. Vis are good dogs. You could always bring him hunting out here!
““Is there even one person on death row who did not do the crime?””
Stay focused. We are talking Kansas.
Nathan SPEWS BADLY >>>>
“So, do you think that the Carr brothers were actually innocent or that the evidence against them was not sufficient enough to execute them??”
Nathan, I am typing slow… NOBODY HERE has suggested that the Carr brothers are innocent… Where are you coming up with that garbage?? Thats what makes it FLAMING!!
I dont think you are reading the thread at all!! Just nit picking something not even here!! Geez!! READ what Clark is talking about… Last I knew the Carr brothers are not included in Clark’s reference to 126 death row inmates who were disecovered to be INNOCENT by DNA testing…. Can you manage to stay on point??
CF2K,
My best friend in Iraq was a Jew. He and I talked all the time about faith and religion.
His parents sent him those little gold foil rapped chocolate coins.
Talk about funny!
My whole section was going around asking him for some of his “Jew Gold” for weeks!
He made more fun of himself for being so Jewish than we ever did.
There is a huge difference in being an Anti-Semite and an innocent joke.
Unless you are an uptight liberal looking for any little thing you can to hold over someones head that is….
“WS Clark, I would be willing to bet that they were eye witness accounts and had very little hard evidence and that left them open to be innocent which DNA later did prove….”
The majority of the 126 were proven innocent by other means, not just DNA.
I dunno reg. Given the choice between solitary “three hots and a cot” and death…
I’m thinkin’ I’d choose death. But that’s just me.
I say keep ‘em alive and make ‘em listen to britney spears, and the revs. hagee and parsley all day… for eternity!
Chas,
If you are so sure that the Carr brothers are guilty, why would you oppose their death sentence then?
hehehehehehe.
Hell, after that cruel and unusual punishment, they’ll be BEGGIN’ for ol’ sparky!
…and if spears, hagee and parsley dont do the trick, send in the LESBIAN AVENGERS to have a “word” with ‘em.
ksfarmgrrl
Posted June 6, 2008 at 2:37 pm | Permalink
I dunno reg. Given the choice between solitary “three hots and a cot” and death…
I’m thinkin’ I’d choose death. But that’s just me.
I say keep ‘em alive and make ‘em listen to britney spears, and the revs. hagee and parsley all day… for eternity!
—————————————-
I was thinking more of ‘Barney Videos and Sing-a-long Songs’ piped in 24/7 on widescreens with full surround sound.
The Libs don’t want the death penalty for the Carr Bros. What does that tell you?
“Stay focused. We are talking Kansas.”
Is Kansas immune from making mistakes? Are witnesses in Kansas murder trials more honest than in the other 49 states? Are our juries somehow smarter than in the other 49 states?
Burnett was convicted based solely on a co-conspirators testimony – testimony in exchange for a lesser sentence.
Do I believe Ted Burnett was guilty – absolutely yes.
Do I believe a co-conspirator would lie to get a lesser sentence – absolutely yes.
In this case, probably no, ALMOST certainly no.
Well, anyway Ben,
Let me know if you want some help walking the dog. Two trips around the lake and I could probably have him ‘at heel’ without a lead. A Vis is a pretty smart dog!
Nathan, I am now totally convinced that you either cannot or will not read what I have posted here… Let me make it big enough for you to see >>>>
I HAVE NOT SAID THE CARR BROTHERS ARE INNOCENT… I HAVE NOT SAID THEY SHOULD NOT BE ON DEATH ROW…. AND IF YOU THINK YOU CAN SHOW DIFFERENT, PUT IT ON HERE… OR ELSE, JUST SHUT UP, AND STOP YOUR DAMN FLAMING!!!!
“The Libs don’t want the death penalty for the Carr Bros.”
Copy and paste where a lib stated that they do not want the death penalty for the Carr Brothers, Fleetidiot.
It’s no wonder that you are called the Blog’s Dumbest Poster.
How about this question then liberals?
Would you ever support the death penalty if the standards of the evidence which convicted them met a certain burden of proof first?
Will do hank. You are right – he is smart. I noticed that with some neighbor kids he layed down so as not to intimidate them. That got him lots of attention from them. Also with my boys he is very gentle.
Chas
“Yea, right… that far NORTH in Alaska?? Sure, and not to mention all the rest of the Wildlife…. It isnt called by the Government a wildlife refuge for mosquitos!!”
Yea that far North in Alaska. I’ll never forget the video of one of the Kennedy boys going up there on “environmental safari” to drum up opposition to drilling up there. He was talking about what a beautifull unspoiled wilderness it was. He could barely complete a sentence, he was swatting so hard at mosquitos. Where the oil is is a swamplike coastal plane. Crawling with mosquitos.
Nathan, WHY do you insist on badgering people, when they have already told you, you are barking up the wrong tree, with a tired out dog that wont hunt??? Huh???
Chas is typing in all caps, look out!
I didn’t even have to say anything to him about not being a Christian or being a lousy minister either….
Chas,
Would you ever support the death penalty if the standards of the evidence which convicted them met a certain burden of proof first?
Nathan – my answer would be yes – as long as both the proof is strong and the crime heinous. Carr brothers, BTK, Charles Manson come to mind. But not sure I’d fry the stupid girls that followed Manson.
I saw Manson in person in LA long ago. Scary.
“Would you ever support the death penalty if the standards of the evidence which convicted them met a certain burden of proof first?”
Well, Mr. Social Skills, it would have to depend on what that standard was………
Obviously.
Heckler posted,
“Let me clarify. Combine ANWAR with all of the other places that have been made off limits, and you have a serious impact on our oil supply.”
Okay… list “all of the other places”. And document the total “serious impact on our oil supply” they would cause.
Heckler: “Please, you’ve seen pictures of the place. Nothing there but mosquitos the size of caribou.”
You mean these pictures by Subhankar Banerjee?
Incredible wildlife, plants, and land.
http://www.oilonice.org/gallery/
Biologists reports,
REFUGE WILDLIFE
‘Potential Impacts of Oil and Gas Development on Refuge Resources’
http://arctic.fws.gov/issues1.htm#section4
A speculative map of what the 2,000-acre “limit” allows,
http://www.inforain.org/Northslope/anwr_3.html
Impact of the oil technology that would be used in the Refuge,
http://www.wilderness.org/Library/Documents/upload/AlpineNoEnvironmentalShowpiece.pdf
WS Clark,
That was the point of the open question.
Would you ever support the death penalty if the standards of the evidence which convicted them met ( a burden of proof you agree with ) first?
How about … solitary confinement … and force them to watch each and every minute of ALL of the campaign speeches. Over and over again.
Then all we would have to do is leave a rope in the cell …
HLP,
“A guy who I knew once was Jewish!” And that demonstrates what?
It gets really tiresome, HLP, to hear you insist that you were only “making a joke.” It is revealing that you don’t try to deny that your “joke” plays on destructive, prejudicial stereotypes regarding Jews. You’ve thereby conceded that my criticism stands.
No one can know what’s in another’s heart, but everyone can see what someone thinks is funny from the jokes he or she tells. And that’s a pretty damn good indicator, HLP, that you need to think a lot harder about what you say.
I’ll tell you straight: “Jews are cheap” is OFFENSIVE. Saying that you’re going to “Jew” somebody down for a lower price is OFFENSIVE. And if you use that kind of language around me or on this blog, I WILL get in your face. You DO NOT get a pass. You got that, HLP?
Don’t want to be called out for making anti-Semitic jokes, HLP? Then stop making them. As is readily apparent, you haven’t a CLUE as to what does and doesn’t count as anti-Semitism.
Manson didn’t kill anybody.
Come on, Libs, answer the question.
Is there even on person on death row who did not do what they were accused of. If not, why not kill them? Libs: still lovin’ the killers.
The main standard is: Does it deter crime?? The proven answer, time after time, is NO!!
I’m human… And as with any other human, emotions run high… We like our revenge… I see the Death Penalty as WE know it, as revenge killing… NOT as punishment… It is SOOO sterile, and operating-room clean…
What is it that we do?? We put them to “sleep” the way we put down an elderly, or sick most favored pet… Why??
We spend MILLIONS of tax payer $$$$ to execute a person…. For what?? What are we proving?? For the most part, by the time we get them executed, we have to drag out the original crime stories out of mothballs, to remind us of what they did, and to whom!!
The Death Penalty is part of our Law… But I fear it is not being used properly… IF it is used the way it should be, I could much easier support it… The way it is used now?? Not so much…
We sit these people on death row for 15 – 20 years, and then, get an alcohol swab, clean off a spot on their arm, like it has to be clean for some reason, and then we put them to sleep… never to awaken…
And for that, you get all excited?? WHY??
Ahem. That would be Kansas’ death row.
Fleett — Your Trolling is getting very OLD…
“Is there even on person on death row who did not do what they were accused of.”
That has been proven over and over again, that there are MANY on death row who are Innocent of the crime(s) they were accused of… Clark has already posted about 126… And my best guess is that there are others… The system is flawed!! VERY flawed!!
ANWAR would have about .003 effect on price per gallon, extrapolaing from 43 cents per barrel. Screw the critters!
“Libs: still lovin’ the killers.”
Still can’t get it through you head, can you BDP?
“Would you ever support the death penalty if the standards of the evidence which convicted them met ( a burden of proof you agree with ) first?”
The answer is yes, but the standard has to be far higher than it is now.
Christ.
The only reason Manson isnt on death row, is not because he didnt “kill” anybody… He was still guilty of Capital Murder… There was a moratorium on the Death Penalty then… just like with BTK….
C’mon Fleett — Get with the program, or get off your itty bitty soap suds box…
“I’ll tell you straight: “Jews are cheap” is OFFENSIVE.”
Oh…I don’t know, I’m cheap and proud of it.
I’ve got a paid for home, no debt, land, plenty of investments to retire on, all by being cheap, real cheap.
Yes-er-e, I’m cheap and proud of it.
Nathaniel posted June 6, 2008 at 2:01 pm
“However, 2 million barrels a day for the next 15 years IS a significant amount of oil.”
Looks like Nathaniel does not know how to read graphs.
No wonder he is so confused and clueless about AGW.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/analysis_publications/arctic_national_wildlife_refuge/html/figure4.html
(Technically recoverable analysis, ignores costs)
Nathaniel: “Conservation is only a small temporary solution which would essentially stall our demand for a very short time until the natural need would exceed whatever conservation did.”
False. Higher mpg is the long-term solution, that cuts demand far into the future.
More drilling simply depletes our small, remaining reserves. They will run dry, like Prudhoe Bay.
Ahem. That would be Kansas’ death row.
You guys won’t answer it. Too painful, I guess.
Boxlock is Jewish??? LOL
“You guys won’t answer it. Too painful, I guess.”
How many times do you want it answered, BDP?
Dumbass.
Fleet, I have always wondered why you are so proud of being stupid?
“The main standard is: Does it deter crime?? The proven answer, time after time, is NO!!”
Well Chas, I never knew of a single criminal that was executed that ever committed another crime.
I’d say it reduces crime quite well, 100% for that guy.
Come on Chas,
I’ve got a Jewish last name….I really do, German Jew. I’m proud of that too.
“I’d say it reduces crime quite well, 100% for that guy.”
Well, if that is the standard, execute EVERYONE in prison.
Yada yada yada — How predictable!! But while that guy is being sent to lullaby land, 20 others are out killing somebody… REAL deterrent, aint it???
You dont have to TRY to be stupid… you come by it naturally!!
That isnt what I asked… I asked if you are Jewish… And if you’re not, then your last name has nothing to do with it… I know Jews named smith and jones, and green, and brown… Geez!! The rampant stupidity… and it isnt even full moon yet!!
You haven’t answered, clark. You keep blabbing about other states, not this one. Coward.
RFL posted June 6, 2008 at 2:10 pm
“However, the biased view of people like Cosmos on how much ANWR would alter the global oil pricing market doesn’t change the impetus for exploring for more oil.”
It’s not my “biased view”.
The sources are listed at the bottom of,
http://www.wilderness.org/Library/Documents/upload/PennyaGallon20yrs1.pdf
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/aeo/pdf/0383(2006).pdf
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/servicerpt/hr/pdf/sroiaf(2005)04.pdf
The DOE is oil-friendly, and their analysis is based on “technically recoverable” estimates, i.e ignores costs. Their bias is probably optimistic.
“Well, if that is the standard, execute EVERYONE in prison.”
If that is the sentence given then fulfill it.
“You haven’t answered, clark. You keep blabbing about other states, not this one. Coward”
Well, BDP, I have already answered – but again – do I believe that the Carr Brothers are guilty – yes.
Do I believe that they should die? Yes.
Do I believe that everyone on Death Row in Kansas is guilty? Yes.
Do I believe that they should all die? Yes.
Do I believe that 126 men were convicted and sentenced to death, only to be proven innocent later? Yes.
All of the above points are interrelated and relevant to one another.
Now, Fleetidiot, are you anywhere near smart enough to see the connection?
“If that is the sentence given then fulfill it.”
So, we should have executed the 126 that were sentenced to death but later proven innocent?
I am not a big capitol punishment fan, but I think it very unfortunate that we can only execute these guys:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/05/AR2008060500305.html?sid=ST2008060501880
one time. And it is too bad that Osama bin Laden is not in line with them. Would be quite happy to make him a martyr, as well.
Fleett… The SCOTUS just allowed the Kansas Death Penalty back online, after challenges were made… I would guess that the appeals will be up and running SOON… And if KS is like every other state, there will no doubt be those on KS death row, who will be found innocent, due to DNA, or other appealable matters… So, it looks like we just need to wait and see what happens next…. Can your thirst or DEATH hold on long enough??
“And if KS is like every other state, there will no doubt be those on KS death row, who will be found innocent, due to DNA, or other appealable matters…”
At least some progress. Now, pleased to be wondering, who on Kansas’ death row would that be? Anyone?
So since the Libs don’t believe in the death penalty, then they don’t any any such thing such as
…justifiable homicide.
So when the Hells Pinheads (fictious motorcycle gang) are climbing on your daughter, each taken his turn, then you have no justification in killing any of them.
Right Libs?
“Do I believe that everyone on Death Row in Kansas is guilty? Yes.
Do I believe that they should all die? Yes.”
Finally.
The gas tax holiday would be a bonanza compared to drilling ANWR!
“Geez!! The rampant stupidity… and it isnt even full moon yet!!”
Chas, poor fellow, ya know what, you have absolutely no since of humor. I don’t think I’ve ever witnessed any out of you on this blog.
I don’t know what your situation is guy but I am starting to feel sorry for you. Don’t take every single issue as if your life depended on it. It doesn’t, and I’m sorry to have to say this but if it did I’m not sure you’d get much consideration or sympathy anyway. You got’a lighten up a little.
One of the companies I represent is owned by a Jewish family. Absolutely the most capable business people I have ever met. They put several thousand dollars of education into my head, including airfare and two+ weeks in mid-town Manhattan, with no guarantees I wouldn’t take it and leave. And I didn’t even work for them, as I work for myself, and they had no assurance I would continue working on their behalf. Great folks. Not cheap like I am, ha.
I had to quit working for them though, they tried to hire me and make me a regional manager over KS, OK, TX, AK, and later possibly NM and LA, offered a six figure job. I don’t want to work that hard though so now I rep. their product through their distributer. Who knows, I may have suspected I wasn’t good enough for them and out of respect declined the offer. Ya don’t want to ruin a friendship like that by forcing them to fire ya, right.
We are still great friends and by the way Jewish jokes abound.
Since the oil companies routinely short the govt. on their royalty oil for drilling national lands, the Republicans will try and do anything to drill more.
“More drilling simply depletes our small, remaining reserves. They will run dry, like Prudhoe Bay.”
-Cosmos
Let’s see here. Production does not keep pace with demand in the OPEC controlled reserves and Cosmos calls it price control.
After 30 years of drilling oil in Prudhoe Bay, Cosmos says that is is running dry.
What Cosmos does not know or does not tell you is that the amount recoverable in Prudhoe is more than double the amount recoverable of the next largest US oil field in East Texas! The East Texas oil field has been pumping out oil since the 1930’s.
But if Cosmos is right, and if Prudhoe Bay is running dry, then that is all more reason to open drilling in ANWR!
Production levels at existing oil fields simply can’t meet the exploding demand. That doesn’t mean that they are going dry or that OPEC is controlling the price.
The whole world is scouring the earth for oil, uranium, natural gas and coal deposits. Cosmos insists that higher efficiency is the answer. Perhaps Cosmos should do the rest of the world a big favor to clue them in on this big secret that they obviously are overlooking in their mad grab for energy resources.
“At least some progress. Now, pleased to be wondering, who on Kansas’ death row would that be? Anyone?”
Ah, BDP, is is not a matter of popular opinion.
“each taken his turn, then you have no justification in killing any of them.”
Well, McCluer, I would presume that you would have been okay with executing the 126 innocent men?
Maybe it would have been okay if you had been one of them?
Maybe it would have been okay if one of your nephews had been one of them?
After all, they must have done SOMETHING, right?
Cosmos,
If the impetus for opposing the Holcomb expansion is based upon what is predicted to be a certain increase in Global Warming, how many degrees will the Holcomb Expansion raise Global temperatures by?
Likewise, if the impetus for drilling in ANWR is to offset higher oil prices, and a $2.00 drop is obtained, is the intended goal accomplished?
Why do you oppose Holcomb based on Global Warming fears even though no global reduction in temperatures can even be quantified?
Yet you oppose ANWR drilling in the face of escalating energy costs based on the prediction that it will not have an appreciable effect on global pricing?
If ANWR’s oil is a drop in the barrel ($2/barrel), then even more so is Holcomb’s CO2. You can’t even quantify the degrees by which temperatures will rise as a result of Holcomb.
Regular:Defence of your family or your country is justifiable homicide. Ritual taking of life is another matter. The former is a reacton to a real time event, the latter can be misconstructed/influenced for purposes other than justice, like the furtherance of ones’ career, income strata or plain expediency. Unless there is some kind of absolute proof, the danger of ritual murder will always be with us. The Brits now think that 15-20% of those hung in modern times, would never have been charged by to-day’s policing standards. Recently there have been folks freed from life terms by reason of DNA not avaiable at their trials and it seems they were all black. What if they had been convicted in a state with the death penalty? Personally, headlines sway me more than I like to admit for I’m Liberal on some things and Conservtive on others. I don’t think anyone is 100% bent one way or another, at least I hope not.
gster,
Thank you from the bottom of my heart for your 1:30 PM- DATELINE WICHITA, KANSAS:
Depends on the environment risk. ANWR, big problem. Off the Gulf Coast of Florida, no problem
Not necessarily true. What about leaks? Damage from hurricanes?
No, we need to get away from oil for transportation and heating as quickly and as soon as possible. We’ve dragged our feet long enough. It’s not only because of the environment, but also because the time will soon be here when there will be no more oil.
I’m not saying oil is bad. We use oil for many things in addition to the two listen above. (I was thinking last night as I tossed yet another plastic container into the trash that I almost wish we would go back to glass containers. Yes, I need to recycle!) Anything we do will take years and years, but the longer we hold off, the sooner the day of little or no oil will be here.
Let’s try thinking of the future. Our future, our children’s future, and our grand and great-grandchildren’s future.
I read that study online Clark. There was one case where the convicted bragged to three other cellmates he had killed the victim. Innocent eh? However, the admissions were not allowed in court and convicted was still executed with full denial by the murder.
The paper also cited executions used in the count over the past 100+ years, way before DNA.
My guess that the number you keep repeating is way lower than what you claim, with the vast majority of the executions happening before DNA.
er full denial by the murderer.
Oil is a evry importand feedstock for petrochemicals. It is too valuable to just burn it all.
“My guess that the number you keep repeating is way lower than what you claim, with the vast majority of the executions happening before DNA.”
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=412&scid=6
I knew that you “thirsting for blood” cons couldn’t handle the facts.
“Since 1973, 129 people is 26 states have been released from Death Row with evidence of their innocence.”
Don’t let the facts get in the way of a good story, McCluer.
“Damage from hurricanes?”
Sorry Roxie, I know you mean well, but ALL of the oil platforms in the Gulf survived Katrina without a leak.
Boxlock,
Affirming “Jews are cheap” / “Jews are greedy” gets us here pretty quickly:
http://lawrenceofcyberia.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/greed.jpg
Frankly, I now have an even HARDER time taking you seriously than I did before.
I have no doubt whatsoever that there are scumbags in this world who deserve to be taken out into the street and shot like the mad dogs they are. Charlie Manson, Ted Bundy, the guy who dreamed up “Cop Rock”… Those people should be held responsible!
But I have deep and sincere doubts about the judicial system’s way of meting out criminal penalties. The same kinds of people who, for example, returned the multi-million dollar hot coffee verdict against McDonald’s (justified, in my opinion, once you know the facts of the case) were on the juries a few years back in Illinois who condemned the 8 men who were later proven by DNA evidence to be innocent of the crimes that put them on Death Row. The judicial system is inherently flawed because it depends on inherently-flawed human beings. And there’s no way to rectify an unjust execution. That’s the rub.
Whether an unjust conviction is due to bad lawyers, bad juries, bad evidence, over-zealous prosecutors, incompetent judges, bad luck… it seems to me that a system that aspires to justice should have in its intrinsic structure the capability to right wrongs. And there’s no way to un-do an execution.
And it’s altogether too easy to put people on death row and kill them.
If there is to be a death penalty — and I see no constitutional provision in the United States to prevent it — I think the death warrant should be signed by the governor (or President) in the presence of the condemned, and only after a face-to-face meeting. I think, instead of simply signing a piece of paper, the Chief Executive of the state or nation should be required to pull the switch him/herself. And if — as it could very
well have happened in Illinois where fully half the prisoners on Death Row were conclusively proven innocent — a person is put to death unjustly, the governor and the trial judge and the jury members responsible should be summarily executed for murder.
WSClark
Posted June 6, 2008 at 4:44 pm | Permalink
“My guess that the number you keep repeating is way lower than what you claim, with the vast majority of the executions happening before DNA.”
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=412&scid=6
I knew that you “thirsting for blood” cons couldn’t handle the facts.
“Since 1973, 129 people is 26 states have been released from Death Row with evidence of their innocence.”
Don’t let the facts get in the way of a good story, McCluer.
————————-
Nope, just pointing out what you conveniently left out when it doesn’t support your argument.
I think the organization is called Death Row Abolitionists that did the study.
Your number of prisoners that were released, proves that the system works and should not be changed.
Oh, and my bad, the number is up to 129, not 126.
How many innocent people executed for crimes that they did not commit is an acceptable number, McCluer?
Ten? Twenty? Fifty? One hundred and twenty nine?
How many innocents should die so that you can kill the Carr Brothers and grind them up into cattle feed?
Name a number.
“Well, McCluer, I would presume that you would have been okay with executing the 126 innocent men?”
You keep yammering about those 126. Worry about Kansas. Let the other states F-up. As you have stated, all of our boys deserve it.
“Nope, just pointing out what you conveniently left out when it doesn’t support your argument.”
What did I “conveniently leave out?”
“Your number of prisoners that were released, proves that the system works and should not be changed.”
The cons want to severely limit appeals, to as much as one appeal and thirty days.
Some of those men were proven innocent after ten, fifteen or even twenty years.
So, McCluer, how many innocents should we execute to satisfy your blood lust?
“We use oil for many things in addition to the two listen above. (I was thinking last night as I tossed yet another plastic container into the trash that I almost wish we would go back to glass containers. Yes, I need to recycle!) ”
And here is ANOTHER chance for me to say a few good words about the Pro Ks Miller recycling center.
Check it out sometime Rox.
The hours are limited to Tuesday and Thursday 1 to 4 and Saturday 9 to 1 (I think) but the facility is drive though. You pull on inside and there are lots of volunteers to help you find the right bins. You can recycle almost anything there.
A lot of how we live is going to have to change very quickly and very drastically with these futures traders jacking the price of oil. I would bet gas is $5 a gallon by the fourth of July.
As a society, we waste SO much. We SHOULD change. Now we don’t have a choice.
“Charlie Manson, Ted Bundy,…”
Manson didn’t kill anybody.
Add Fleetidiot to the list of those with a “blood lust.”
“Manson didn’t kill anybody.”
He directed his followers to kill, and he entered the home and tied up the La Bianca’s so that they could be killed.
Under the law – that is the same a murder.
Dumbass.
“fleettwood” defends Charlie Manson.
Bleeding heart liberal pantywaist.
“And it’s altogether too easy to put people on death row and kill them.”
That’s the silliest thing I’ve read all day,
“And it’s altogether too easy to put people on death row and kill them.”
Ask the (now) 129 men that have been released from Death Row.
So, McCluer, how many innocents should we execute to satisfy your blood lust?
—————————-
So Clark, how many of the 129 have been executed after they were set free?
Prove that the system does not work. Let’s see the number of innocents that work executed.
Do you have that number? I’m talking recent numbers, since DNA.
work = were
“I think the organization is called Death Row Abolitionists that did the study.”
Death Penalty Information Center – and it is not a “study” it is an ongoing report of people wrongly convicted and sentenced to death.
No Fleett —- THIS is the silliest thing all day!!
“Manson didn’t kill anybody.”
Manson was convicted of Murder in the First!!
er were executed that is…(checks blood sugar)
Maybe Fleett likes the Nazi Pervert, Manson!!
Oil is a evry importand feedstock for petrochemicals. It is too valuable to just burn it all.
That’s what I was getting at, Ben, but didn’t do a very good job of it. Too, I think recycling is important for the same reason.
Sorry Roxie, I know you mean well, but ALL of the oil platforms in the Gulf survived Katrina without a leak.
Sorry, WS, I wasn’t clear. I didn’t mean leaks from hurricanes. Two separate things in my mind.
“Prove that the system does not work.”
Stupid, just stupid, you don’t have a clue do you? Do you feel that having someone on Death Row for ten or fifteen years is acceptable?
As stated, the cons want LIMIT appeals. If that system had been in place, innocent people would have been executed.
“I’m talking recent numbers, since DNA.”
Did you even look at the case studies? If you had, you would know that DNA was NOT the primary reason for the release of most of the convicted.
Damn – blood thirsty cons……..
RFL,
I oppose both drilling in the Arctic Refuge and the Holcomb expansion because:
* They both cause major, long-term problems
* There are better, cheaper, faster, etc. solutions.
Prove the system does not work Clark.
How many of the 129 released were executed?
“How many of the 129 released were executed?”
If 129 were proven innocent, some after more than twenty years, how many innocents were executed?
Simple percentages would tell that some innocent people have been executed.
What would be an acceptable number of innocent people executed for you McCluer? Ten? Twenty? Fifty? One hundred and twenty nine?
“How many of the 129 released were executed?”
Do you really think that those 129 were the ONLY ones falsely convicted and sentenced to death?
How many of the 129 released were executed?
Ah, and for the “Blood Lust” crowd…….
Eight case studies where men have BEEN executed, despite doubts of their guilt.
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?&did=2238
Is it really worth it to execute, know the track record of wrongful convictions?
(And, no idiots, I am not claiming that these men were innocent – I am saying that there is doubt about the guilt of these eight men.)
This should be an object lesson for regular (small r) contributors to this forum:
I post a reasoned, well-thought-out piece that advocates capital punishment (with sensible reforms) and a wing-nut (who purportedly advocates capital punishment) comes out and defends Charlie Manson’s sorry ass!
How could this be?
Simply because it was posted by “Monkeyhawk?”
Poor wing-nuts are so consumed by hate for people who sometimes disagree with them, they’ll defend serial killers rather than agree!
“Do you really think that those 129 were the ONLY ones falsely convicted and sentenced to death?”
By the way, McCluer, how would YOU feel if you spent twenty years on Death Row, knowing that you could be executed for a crime that you did not commit?
A concern I have with guns:
“The 43-year-old bar owner fired several shots at the car, police said, and three bullets hit an unoccupied house in the 2400 block of West Greenfield. Police don’t know if the Saturn was hit.”
What if the house had been occupied? I don’t have a whole lot of problem with shooting if the guy could actually hit the right target but such wild shooting is dangerous to the rest of us.
http://www.kansas.com/news/updates/story/426885.html
So Clark, How many of the 129 released were executed?
bth
Posted June 6, 2008 at 5:36 pm | Permalink
A concern I have with guns:
“The 43-year-old bar owner fired several shots at the car, police said, and three bullets hit an unoccupied house in the 2400 block of West Greenfield. Police don’t know if the Saturn was hit.”
What if the house had been occupied? I don’t have a whole lot of problem with shooting if the guy could actually hit the right target but such wild shooting is dangerous to the rest of us.
———————
What if the semi tractor trailer doesn’t see you as he changes lanes?
“So Clark, How many of the 129 released were executed?”
So an answer of “none” somehow justifies the system?
Do you pay attention to anything other than you stupid posts?
Yeah, asshole, NONE?
Does that prove the “system works?”
Hell, no idiot. Any of those men could have been executed. Simple math tells you that it is likely that innocent people have been executed.
I posted a link that showed eight case studies where innocent men may have been executed.
And this is all you can come up with……
“So Clark, How many of the 129 released were executed?”
What a fine, compassionate Christian you are, McCluer.
And a fine, lacking in compassion asshole you are.
“What if the semi tractor trailer doesn’t see you as he changes lanes?”
Well, phuck it, that makes it okay now, doesn’t it.
Boxlock falsely states >>>> (1:36 p.m.)
“Steven,
That simply confirms homosexuality is condemned in ALL religions, not just Islam. There are none, to my knowledge save maybe Satanism, that endorse that behavior.”
==================================
Chas
Posted June 6, 2008 at 12:37 pm | Permalink
My goodness, Boxlock… You arent even right on that one… You really should try to read more… I can name at LEAST three denominations in the USA who ORDAIN Gay/Lesbian Clergy!!
WRONG AGAIN, Mr. Know-it-All!!!
So Clark, how many of these 129 inmates on death row had to wait 20 years like you said, to be released?
Or did you just make that up?
James — Clark’s numbers are RIGHT… You are barking up the wrong tree, and if Clark has the link, he will make you look even dumber than you already are!! You should stop your flaming now, while you still can!!
Brother Chas,
Was I responding to you?
That would be a no, correct?
short pier
long walk
take it
“By the way, McCluer, how would YOU feel if you spent twenty years on Death Row, knowing that you could be executed for a crime that you did not commit?”
Back at ya reg…
He’d probably be so damn annoying to both guards and inmates that he’d be in solitary for his own safety! :)
“Or did you just make that up?”
Obviously, dumbshit, you don’t bother with facts. Try READING the information.
You just advocate “kill them all now, let God sort it out.”
Loser.
James, ONE of those 129 that spent Years on Death Row in Oklahoma, was covered fully in a John Gresham book, “The Innocent Man” published about two years ago… or less…
Why dont you google it, and you can get some figures out of the book!!
“I can name at LEAST three denominations in the USA who ORDAIN Gay/Lesbian Clergy!!”
Correct Chas!
And I can name at least as many that would also bless gay unions in their churches. They already do, it just has no effect on civil benefits.
Lawyer Barry Scheck heads one organization devoted to freeing Death Row inmates who are innocent, but have been on Death Row, because DNA was not available when they were convicted…
Boxlick. All wrong. All the time.
So Clark, you are admitting of these 129 inmates on death row none had to wait 20 years like you said, to be released?
Just exactly which part of the statistics are we to believe?
Or do you make them up as you go along?
Whats the problem, James… Cant take it when you get beat?? Hey, you jump in to MANY conversations that dont concern you… but its OK when its you doing it — right??
Barry Scheck,
Yeah, that dude lawyer that got the knife murderer O.J. Simpson off.
We all know that O.J. is innocent…
:roll:
“So Clark, you are admitting of these 129 inmates on death row none had to wait 20 years like you said, to be released?”
“Or do you make them up as you go along?”
Why don’t you try READING the case studies instead of being an asshole, McCluer?
Or is being an asshole so much a part of your persona that you just can’t do it?
BESIDES — the Death Penalty has been a large part of this thread all afternoon….
So Chas,
Tell me how many other murderers has Barry Scheck gotten off the hook through manipulated evidence and lawyerisms?
KFG — too bad Boxlicker isnt here to see the gross error of his/her ways!! LOL
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 5:49 pm | Permalink
Brother Chas,
Was I responding to you?
That would be a no, correct?
short pier
long walk
take it
***********************************************************************************
Is James McCluer advocating the death of another blogger? That’s the way it reads to me!
He accused of as much earlier in the week.
Hypocrite, lying troll.
errr that would be Boxlock :-D
By the way, McAsshole, how many years on Death Row is an acceptable number? Ten? Twenty? Fifty?
How many years would you like to spend on Death Row?
So Clark, you can’t find any case where an inmate on death row had to wait 20 years before he was released?
Why is that?
Did you make that 20 year figure up?
Even better Clark. How many death row inmates were released after 50 years?
Name them please.
Why dont you go down to the book store, and buy John Gresham’s book, and find out for yourself… And I DID say he was working with DNA evidence not available when the inmates were convicted… DNA is not manipulating evidence… it is solid science…
Still staring longingly at your female students Apophis?
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 5:56 pm | Permalink
So Chas,
Tell me how many other murderers has Barry Scheck gotten off the hook through manipulated evidence and lawyerisms?
*****************************************************************
I guess the lying troll doesn’t believe in our rule of law: “Innocent until PROVEN guilty”.
It is the defense counsel’s DUTY to get their client a NOT guilty verdict.
It doesn’t matter who the defendent is.
And no, James, you were not responding to me… I was responding to your mindless foolishness… Many folks are just damned tired of your tactics…
So Brother Chas,
Then you believe that O.J. Simpson is innocent of murder and it was because Barry Scheck got him off by using lawyerly techniques to prove his innocent.
And Brother Chas, just how many other murderers are roaming the street because of Barry Schecks excellent lawyer skills?
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 6:00 pm | Permalink
Still staring longingly at your female students Apophis?
************************************************************
I think I would have a case of libel for that statement lying troll.
James — you are trolling, because you are beat royally on this one… you can stop trolling now, and go read some accurate articles for a change, instead of badgering people with things that they did NOT claim… You and your damned straw man fallacies!! They wont work anymore, James…
I guess the lying troll doesn’t believe in our rule of law: “Innocent until PROVEN guilty”.
—————————–
I do believe those convicted and placed on Death Row were found guilty by a Jury of their peers.
Is that even in dispute?
Or is there some other trial by jury you have tucked away that you’re not telling us about?
Apophis
Posted June 6, 2008 at 6:01 pm | Permalink
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 6:00 pm | Permalink
Still staring longingly at your female students Apophis?
************************************************************
I think I would have a case of libel for that statement lying troll.
——————————————
Go for it, I can find out your name then. Then it will be a new career for you. :)
“Still staring longingly at your female students Apophis?”
I don’t think it’s a crime to “look longingly”.
It would be acting on it that would be wrong.
Frankly, some of the girls are hot and that cannot be denied.
Explain this statement then:
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 5:54 pm | Permalink
Barry Scheck,
Yeah, that dude lawyer that got the knife murderer O.J. Simpson off.
We all know that O.J. is innocent…
OJ may not have been innocent, but he was found NOT GUILTY.
His attorney’s did their jobs.
You are an ass mccluer.
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 6:05 pm | Permalink
Apophis
Posted June 6, 2008 at 6:01 pm | Permalink
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 6:00 pm | Permalink
Still staring longingly at your female students Apophis?
************************************************************
I think I would have a case of libel for that statement lying troll.
——————————————
Go for it, I can find out your name then. Then it will be a new career for you.
*********************************************************************************
You know not who you are messing with troll.
I have never done anything that could have me fired from my job.
I know the “due process” system anyway………..any accusations you can throw out, I can beat.
You lies will come back to haunt you troll.
You = Your
Here are a couple of links >>>>
http://www.innocenceproject.org/
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6248147
Now, James, go READ those… and then you can apologize to Clark…. :-|
So Clark, you can’t find any case where an inmate on death row had to wait 20 years before he was released?
Name Years Result
James Richardson 21 Acquitted
James Bo Cochran 21 Acquitted
Gary Lamar James 26 Charges Dismissed
Peter Limone 33 Charges Dismissed
Timothy Howard 26 Charges Dismissed
Nicholas Yarris* 21 Charges Dismissed
Laurence Adams 30 Charges Dismissed
Derrick Jamison 20 Charges Dismissed
Curtis McCarty* 21 Charges Dismissed
Michael McCormick 20 Acquitted
That’s ten – only the ones with an asterisk had convictions overturned based on DNA.
Happy now, McAsshole?
Due process sounds like Union weasel words to me.
Are you a Union weasel Apophis?
Sit on the board do you? Or perhaps a sub member, getting those freebies not recognized by the State as being legal? :)
Chas, WSClark………………..I propose that we refuse to engage McLiar the rest of the day.
James, Barry Scheck did not prove OJ innocent… A JURY declared him NOT GUILTY… If you dont like that, take it up with the JURY…. A Jury that could most likely just as easily found him guilty…
So, less than 10 percent eh Clark?
You were giving the impression that all of the 129 had to wait 20 years or longer to get their verdicts reversed?
So, how many of those after 20 years were found innocent or were they just released because of techical violations of the law? You know like some cop flicked their ears with his thumb while arresting them.
I agree Apophis… but I still think he owes Clark an apology…. Clark, you can add Ron Williamson to your list… And it was due in large part to DNA… which was available, but hidden by prosecutors…
So Brother Chas,
As you said a JURY found him not guilty. Did the JURY make a mistake?
How many murderers have been released because a JURY made a mistake or how many murders have been released because of some slick lawyering or some technical mistake?
James Falsely states >>>>
“You were giving the impression that all of the 129 had to wait 20 years or longer to get their verdicts reversed?”
WRONG AGAIN JAMES… He did NOT say that!!
Chas………………..walk on by
No James… this isnt about Simpson… Stop spinning… you will get dizzy and fall over…
““Manson didn’t kill anybody.”
Manson was convicted of Murder in the First!!”
Perfect example of lack of logic.
Both are true statements. Like this:
OJ killed two people.
OJ was found not guilty.
DANCE PUPPETS DANCE!!!
(EATS SUPPER AND WATCHES TOONS)
WRONG Flkeett — The Law does not require you to do the actual killing, in order to be convicted of First Degree Murder… I swear, you know nothing, but you spew your blasted spam, and Troll anyway!!
Yep — Troll boy wont apologize… but he had his butt handed to him anyway…
Time for TV Apophis… and dont forget about that highly libelous comment made earlier…. :-)
“So, less than 10 percent eh Clark?”
Well, that makes it okay then.
“You were giving the impression that all of the 129 had to wait 20 years or longer to get their verdicts reversed?”
Some as long as twenty years……
“just released because of techical violations of the law?”
You get a new trial based on technical violation, not freedom.
Of course, McCluer thinks that executing an innocent person is FUNNY, unless that innocent person were to be him or one of his.
Funny shit, McAsshole, hew ha!, let’s execute someone, we don’t care if the guilty party is running free, let’s just KILL someone!!!!!!!!
Fleett says now that the law of the land is a “lack of logic” Stupid just cant be fixed!
“(EATS SUPPER AND WATCHES TOONS)”
Watching ‘toons – the only thing on TV other than the test pattern that is not over McAsshole’s head.
JM Look in a mirror little man — there’s all the “TOON” you should need …. LOSER
The Libs keep mewling about the 129, because that is all they have. They will fight like crazy to keep the Carr Bros alive based on something that has nothing to do with the 129. They are against the death penalty on principle, which is honorable, but are afraid to admit it because it will show what they are about. They will defend the Carr Bros with more fervor than they will defend this country against her enemies. Not to mention dead babies.
Not a great place to be.
“The Libs keep mewling about the 129, because that is all they have.”
Well, Fleetidiot, rather than one of the 129, how would you feel if you were one of the 8?
Eh?
Okay with that?
After all, executing the innocent should be just fine and dandy with you, right?
Cuz they must have done SOMETHING, right?
“fleettwood” (the Charlie Manson defender) doesn’t have the cajones to serve on a jury if a wrongful conviction and execution would result in his being executed along with the judge, prosecutor, governor, and rest of the jury.
Talks big and brave, but is a typical Con blow-hard and coward.
(Maybe he hopes Charlie Manson could introduce him to some girls.)
;-)
Chas……..I will never forget the troll’s libeleous comment, never. The moron crossed the line.
Contrary to what fleetwood posted: “I don’t think it’s a crime to “look longingly”.
It would be acting on it that would be wrong.
Frankly, some of the girls are hot and that cannot be denied”, I can never accept this as an acceptable behavior in my profession.
Union membership or NOT, this type of behavior warrants removal from our profession.
Worry about your own state. If there is someone who might fit into the 129 in Kansas, step up.
Otherwise let the frying begin. But you don’t want it to. The 129 is bogus. A red herring. You don’t like the death penalty. Admit it.
Then kiss the brothers on the lips and get the disease they gave that poor girl who lived.
CF2K,Posted June 6, 2008 at 4:47 pm |
“Boxlock,
Affirming “Jews are cheap” / “Jews are greedy” gets us here pretty quickly:
Frankly, I now have an even HARDER time taking you seriously than I did before.”
I never said that, are you attributing that, those statements, to me?
I said I was cheap and proud of it in response to that self-righteous crap you were spewing.
Being cheap can mean different things, and to me, and applying it to me which is what I was doing, means not spending much now for immediate gratification so one can have those things later they want to have. That is one attribute of discipline and self control. Something I’m not sure you have ever experienced or would even understand, uh?
CF, what is it with you, are you black, and hyper race conscious? Are you a failure? Do you blame your failure on racism or on anything but yourself? I don’t know the answers to those questions, don’t care frankly, but until you look in the mirror for your problems you are never going to find the cause of those problems because they lie just back of your nose.
And another thing –
Why is “attempted” murder treated as a lesser crime than murder itself?
Just because the victim didn’t have the common decency to die?
Somebody gets shot or pummeled and left for dead but defies all medical expectations and holds on to dear life and the crime is somehow not as serious?
“Union membership or NOT, this type of behavior warrants removal from our profession.”
Are you talking about the Thought Police?
“The 129 is bogus.”
Well, Fleetidiot, EXPLAIN how the 129 is bogus….
Yeah Apophis,
Sort of like a Middle School Science teacher suggesting that Hank Price should breathe in Carbon Monoxide.
So you have nothing in your Union codes that say suggesting physical harm leading to death is appropriate behavior?
You wanna push it? Go for it.
Regular
Posted June 6, 2008 at 5:49 pm | Permalink
Brother Chas,
Was I responding to you?
That would be a no, correct?
short pier
long walk
take it
***************************************************************
…………..”suggesting physical harm leading to death is appropriate behavior?”
I AM pushing it asshole!
Bring it on troll!
I mean the 129 argument is a bogus argument when talking about Kansas’ death row. The other states problems are not our problems. As you have said, no one there is not guilty. You agree that we should kill all of them, right?
I am going to the pool. To look longingly.
Hope the Thought Police aren’t around.
In other news –
The Dow is down 370 points (2.5%) while the NASDAQ and S&P500 make similar terrible plunges, unemployment shot up the most since 1986, oil hit $138 and gasoline costs $4.50 a gallon at the start of summer, teen-age unemployment hasn’t been this bad since 1948, the housing collapse is really just beginning, foreclosures are at another new record high, even 3.5% of “prime” mortgages are now heading into default, and the dollar is worth a mumbled “Fuc# you” in French.
JOHN SIDNEY McCAIN the THIRD
(for Shrub’s 3rd term)
FOUR MORE YEARS! FOUR MORE YEARS!
“You agree that we should kill all of them, right?”
Well actually, Fleetidiot, I would like to see YOU spend about ten years on Death Row before you were proven innocent – I would bet that would change your tune, asshole.
yawn…
Regular,
We both agree Apophis has got to be the worst teacher in the world, and a miserable excuse for a human. It’s guys like that that keep teacher’s pay so low, they simply aren’t worth more. They aren’t worth what they are paid even.
Regular, start keeping a file of Apophis’s posts that are threatening and vulgar, etc. Simply copy and paste into a retained Word file. With a compilation of them maybe we can get something done about him as a teacher. Or, I believe he is just stupid enough to slip and reveal enough we can find him to turn the stuff we collect in to the school system.
Ha, it’s a new mission, adding interest back into coming here.
What say you?
Yeap, the economy is tanking with a Democraticlly controlled House and Senate.
After all they make the laws and spend the money.
Maybe I already have. :)
“Regular, start keeping a file of Apophis’s posts that are threatening and vulgar”
Apophis, start keeping a file of McCluer’s posts that are threatening and vulgar.
Which includes almost all of them.
Then we can have him arrested and executed because he doesn’t care if the convicted are guilty or innocent.
So Clark, did the Jury make a mistake when they found O.J. Simpson not guilty? Do you believe that O.J. Simpson didn’t commit any murders?
How many murderers are out there that eluded conviction because of technicalities or slick lawyering?
Don’t you care about the murder victims and their families Clark?
“Don’t you care about the murder victims and their families Clark?”
So, McAsshole, when an innocent person is executed or on Death Row for twenty years, does that heal the wounds and make the families feel better?
When an innocent person is released from Death Row, that means that a killer is still on the streets. Are you okay with that, McAsshole or should we just execute ANYONE to satisfy your blood lust?
Posted June 6, 2008 at 7:03 pm | Permalink
Regular,
We both agree Apophis has got to be the worst teacher in the world, and a miserable excuse for a human. It’s guys like that that keep teacher’s pay so low, they simply aren’t worth more. They aren’t worth what they are paid even.
Regular, start keeping a file of Apophis’s posts that are threatening and vulgar, etc. Simply copy and paste into a retained Word file. With a compilation of them maybe we can get something done about him as a teacher. Or, I believe he is just stupid enough to slip and reveal enough we can find him to turn the stuff we collect in to the school system.
Ha, it’s a new mission, adding interest back into coming here.
What say you?
************************************************************************
I’m not worried in the LEAST about what a couple of ignorant reichwingers THINK they can do to me.
They are losers.
They are irrelevent.
Even if they could find out WHO I am, it wouldn’t matter……………………….
With my reputation within the district, as well as state and national organizations, there is little you could do to me.
Have another masturbation dream troll-boy and boxtop!
No Oedipus, you are a loser, and I’m out to prove it.
I have started a Word document and and it’s running in a second tab as I type, and will be anytime I’m here. I have just added my first post of your’s to the record and I will continue to copy and paste them in as time goes on. I’m sure you will slip up enough to eventually reveal where you are if not who you are and then it’s just a matter of time.
Plus you are such a repulsive individual somebody somewhere, or many, will help with this.
The one thing you have going for you, if anyone can actually call it that, is that contrary to what you say;
“With my reputation within the district, as well as state and national organizations, there is little you could do to me”, I’m betting you are a little nobody. A little guy simply drawing a teachers salary, and that only because there is a shortage and they can’t get rid of you right now. I wish that weren’t the case because it would make it easier to find you if you did have some recognition. And, frankly it’s much more fun, more of a trophy if you will, to reveal the true debased nature of someone like you if they have some position to raise an alarm and take them down from. But I’m not betting on that advantage and can work without it.
Thanks for the sport…sport, the hunt is on.
PS: Oh and Oedipus, I am very patient when I set out to accomplish something like this.
Very patient and persistent.
After months of refusing to honor subpoenas issued by a citizen-called grand jury investigating abortionist quack George Tiller, Attorney General Steve SixSixSix has finally submitted 34 late-term abortion records to the grand jury that were gathered during an investigation conducted by Phill Kline while he served as Attorney General.
The records were from late-term abortions that took place in 2003 for which the statute of limitations has not yet expired. 34 of the 61 abortion records were turned over to the grand jury on May 20, and the rest fell outside the statute of limitations, successfully stalled. All patient identifying information was redacted during Kline’s tenure as AG, so the records present no risks to patient privacy.
- – -
Legalized abortion, besides killing babies, creates a climate of disrespect for women’s health that leads to a greater number of maternal deaths.
Nicaragua made abortion completely illegal in 2006 and then reaffirmed that prohibition in 2007. The overall positive results for Nicaraguan women have been just amazing, in spite of the abortion lobby’s usual screaming that making abortion illegal would cause women to die in droves because of more back-alley abortions. Didn’t happen. In fact, the opposite is true – fewer women are dying now. The overall maternal mortality rate decreased by 58% in the year after the abolition. There were 21 maternal deaths for 2007 compared to 50 maternal deaths the year before. The lie that more women will die from back-alley, “unsafe,” abortions than from legalized abortions is nothing but a scare tactic.
- – -
A new Griffith University study published in the journal Stem Cells found that adult stem cells harvested from the noses of Parkinson’s patients gave rise to dopamine-producing brain cells when transplanted into the brain of a rat.
The debilitating symptoms of Parkinson’s such as loss of muscle control are caused by degeneration of cells that produce the essential chemical dopamine in the brain.
Current drug therapies replace dopamine in the brain, but these often become less effective after prolonged use.
This is another of the promising and underreported successes pointing to more coming new cures and treatments in adult stem cell research, while useless, unethical, over-hyped embryonic stem cell research still cures or treats nothing.
- – -
Jessica Rizor, 30, of Washington, PA was convicted in March of first-degree murder and other charges, for killing her newborn daughter in 2004 and throwing the tiny body in the garbage. An autopsy showed that the baby girl suffocated inside a garbage bag. Rizor has now been sentenced to life in prison.
…….LET the hunt be on boxtop, you’ve got NOTHING.
……………never will
With my reputation within the district, as well as state and national organizations, there is little you could do to me.
Have another masturbation dream troll-boy and boxtop!
—————————————–
The bigger they are, the harder they fall.
Different Topic: Reading Time (2007 issue)in the Doctors office to-day I noted an article which says the US is 35th in ratings describing a free society, with a rating of 83. The Danes are tops with 100, Nordic Europe in the high 90’s, Canada and Australia come in the mid 90’s and the rest of Western Europe, excluding Spain, in the low 90’s. The World Governance Council says unresponsive politicans and the decline of a free press is why the US rating have plummeted to the level of Chile and Praguay, since the last ratings were done in 2002. Wonder why!
We’ll see, I will be building a file of anything I think will show your true nature and I can keep at it for months if necessary waiting for your eventual screw up. I’m in no hurry and it’s no trouble simply opening another tab and running the Word document in the back ground to copy and paste your crap into it to archive.
And why am I so confident…just read your own posts, you are close to being deranged besides being a flaming socialist and undoubtedly a crappy teacher.
If you have no concern then tell me what you teach and where. Ha, fat chance of that because you know you are, or would be, on the bubble job wise. I have heard you are a middle school teacher, which narrows things down a lot right there.
Boy, I am so glad I put my kids in a private school for several years if you represent what the public schools have to offer.
I’ll be watching you Apophis, like a guardian angel, except not, ha.
Ah yes Denmark, sursum.
Let’s see: Slightly less than twice the size of Massachusetts, with five million people. Heck, we got that many illegal aliens in Los Angeles alone!
All Europeans think Americans are stupid, ignorant and not worthy being on the same planet, unless that is, they need or vast resources or money.
World Governance Council – yeah, there is a well know (cough) organization.
Well, Apophis, at least Boxlock has no idea who you are… But, still, threats and stalking your posts… That can be downright disturbing, if not aggrivating!! Hang in there…
Boxlock falsely states >>>> (12:36 pm)
“Steven,
That simply confirms homosexuality is condemned in ALL religions, not just Islam. There are none, to my knowledge save maybe Satanism, that endorse that behavior.”
==================================
Chas
Posted June 6, 2008 at 12:37 pm | Permalink
My goodness, Boxlock… You arent even right on that one… You really should try to read more… I can name at LEAST three denominations in the USA who ORDAIN Gay/Lesbian Clergy!!
WRONG AGAIN, Mr. Know-it-All!!!
=================================
Hmmmm…. Boxlock has still not acknowledged his ERROR on this matter…. Hmmmmm….
Well, thats enough for tonite…
Good night; Good luck; God bless –
Whatever you conceive God to be!!
Blessings ALL!!
So mote it be!!
Browse the Profiles
Click on the categories to arrange each column in ascending or descending order.
Last First State Conviction Year Exoneration Year
Jones Joe KS 1986 1992
Lowery Eddie KS 1982 2003
http://www.innocenceproject.org/know/Browse-Profiles.php
” I can name at LEAST three denominations in the USA who ORDAIN Gay/Lesbian Clergy!!
WRONG AGAIN, Mr. Know-it-All!!!”
And one is being tossed out of the parent church as a result. Good!!!
The others, whoever they are, and I notice you don’t list them, are so minor or errant in doctrine nobody pays any attention to them.
Metropolitan Community Church; UCC; UUA; The Episcopal Church
Thats FOUR
Apophis,
CF2K got your back.
Boxlick,
What a good little Nazi you are, making direct threats and trying to intimidate people who offend your sensibilities.
Why do you hate America, Boxlick? Why aren’t people who disagree with you permitted to speak their minds?
Would-be fascist asshole.
Oh yea, there is one other one that has its own rules on Gay/Lesbian Ordination — ELCA
Oh yea, one other one too — UNITY
And the United Methodists have some kind of understanding that Gay/Lesbian clergy remain un-partnered, or else….
But that doesnt apply to ALL United Methodists Conferences… as I understand it…
Nor to ALL ELCA Synods either….
Ahh my gentle god loving friends before you threaten people becuz you don’t like the way they look smell or post on a blog please consider this….
§ 21-3438. Stalking. 1992. Amended 2002.
(a) Stalking is an intentional, malicious and repeated following or harassment of another person and making a credible threat with the intent to place such person in reasonable fear for such person’s safety.
Stalking is a severity level 10, person felony.
(b) Any person who violates subsection (a) when there is an order issued pursuant to the Protection from Stalking Act, sections 1 through 9, and amendments thereto, a temporary restraining order or an injunction in effect prohibiting the behavior described in subsection (a) against the same person, is guilty of a severity level 9, person felony.
(c) Any person who has a second or subsequent conviction occurring against such person, within seven years of a prior conviction under subsection (a) involving the same victim, is guilty of a severity level 8, person felony.
(d) or the purposes of this section:
(1) “Course of conduct” means a pattern of conduct composed of a series of acts over a period of time, however short, evidencing a continuity of purpose and which would cause a reasonable person to suffer substantial emotional distress, and must actually cause substantial emotional distress to the person. Constitutionally protected activity is not included within the meaning of “course of conduct.”
(2) “Harassment” means a knowing and intentional course of conduct directed at a specific person that seriously alarms, annoys, torments or terrorized the person, and that serves no legitimate purpose.
(3) “Credible threat” means a verbal or written threat, including that which is communicated via electronic means, or a threat implied by a pattern of conduct or a combination of verbal or written statements and conduct made with the intent and the apparent ability to carry out the threat so as to cause the person who is the target of the threat to reasonably fear for such person’s safety. The present incarceration of a person making the threat shall not be a bar to prosecution under this section
(4) “Electronic means” includes, but is not limited to, telephones, cellular phones, computers, video recorders, fax machines, pagers and computer networks
Thank you very much Annie!!
Your welcome Charles,
I congratulate you sir for becoming a first class mega debating take no prisoners pitbull on the we blog.
Chas has to be one of the biggest idiots on this blog. The sad thing is, that he is too stupid to even realize it.
However, he is fortunate to have such company as he does here who will continue to pat him on the back and take care of him.
CF2K,
I hope you don’t watch South Park and that you boycott comedy central for putting it on the air.
I hope you don’t watch the Chapelle Show.
I hope you don’t watch Carlos Mencia.
Actually, I could go on all night listing all of the things you had better stay away from.
I am just looking out for you, because you are so easily offended.
Nathaniel,
Actually, you are one of the biggest idiots on this blog. We might have to take fleettwood’s BDP award away from him, and give it to you.
Nathaniel posted June 6, 2008 at 2:01 pm
“However, 2 million barrels a day for the next 15 years IS a significant amount of oil.”
Looks like Nathaniel does not know how to read graphs.
No wonder he is so confused and clueless about AGW.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/analysis_publications/arctic_national_wildlife_refuge/html/figure4.html
(Technically recoverable analysis, ignores costs)
Nathaniel: “Conservation is only a small temporary solution which would essentially stall our demand for a very short time until the natural need would exceed whatever conservation did.”
False. Higher mpg is the long-term solution, that cuts demand far into the future.
More drilling simply depletes our small, remaining reserves. They will run dry, like Prudhoe Bay.
Somebody’s gotta do it Annie!! :-D
Cosmos,
You better watch out, posting the same information over and over again towards me might be stalking….
Seriously, you still don’t get it do you?
You go on and on crying about how everyone is attacking you and that all we can do is make the ad hominem attacks against you.
Yet, that is exactly all you do towards others:
“Looks like Nathaniel does not know how to read graphs.
No wonder he is so confused and clueless about AGW.”
You make an accusation that I can’t read graphs and then call me confused.
When you can learn how to have a discussion without doing all the things you cry about others doing, perhaps then I will address you seriously.
“Looks like Nathaniel does not know how to read graphs. No wonder he is so confused and clueless about AGW.”
That doesnt look like ad hominem — That looks like a fact!! LOL
Just like the fact that you are not a Christian, right Chas?
It must truly SUCK to be you Nathan…. What a sad person you are!! I have only pity for you… Blessings to you… So mote it be!!
Actually, I am a pretty happy person. My feet don’t stink and Jesus loves me.
What that has to do with you not being a Christian, I don’t know.
Nathaniel posted June 7, 2008 at 1:50 am
“Cosmos,
You better watch out, posting the same information over and over again towards me might be stalking….”
——–
What are you going to do Nathaniel?
Make me “disappear“?
Nathaniel posted June 6, 2008 at 2:01 pm
“However, 2 million barrels a day for the next 15 years IS a significant amount of oil.”
——–
Nathaniel will now:
1) Explain how this graph shows “2 million barrels a day for the next 15 years“.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/analysis_publications/arctic_national_wildlife_refuge/html/figure4.html
(Technically recoverable analysis, ignores costs)
2) Provide a graph, from a credible source, to support his claim in his 2:01 pm post.
Or,
3) Admit that he is 100% wrong about his claim in his 2:01 pm post.
———
Nathaniel, if you want to have a “serious discussion” about Arctic Refuge oil, research it BEFORE you post your unsupportable opinions.
Nathan, I am FED UP with you and your holier than thou religious Bull Shit!! And so are a lot of bloggers!! Just who was it that died, and named you GOD??? Huh???
If you think I will bow down to your little teeeny tiny narrow minded view of religious beliefs, you are very NUTS!! And you know what??? You can complain all you want that I am not a Christian like YOU are!!
And that suits me JUST fine!! I wouldnt want to be a Christian like YOU Nathan!!
YOU give Christians everywhere a bad name!!
………..boxtop, are you ready to start collecting “intel” for your file on me again today?
……..go for it little man.
……..I cannot wait until you share it all with my employeer; it should be a good laugh!
“you are close to being deranged besides being a flaming socialist and undoubtedly a crappy teacher.”
…………I guess it would now be illegal to be a “flaming socialist”!
You reichwingers are just disgusting!
So mote it be, Chas?
Whoa! You and I need to have a talk.
And I thought I was all alone here…
Good night, Apophis, or morning or whatever it is. Don’t let the b@st@rds get you down. :)
Good morning Pre-…………………..
I’m not worried in the least bit about boxtop and his dossier building. Petty people have petty lives.
The fact that I can draw this much attention from the reichwing just proves that I am doing my job correctly. They see me as a threat to their warped and narrow-minded world view.
PreD — send me email :-)
Chas posts,
“Metropolitan Community Church; UCC; UUA; The Episcopal Church
Thats FOUR”
Exactly as I said, one is fracturing nationally and globally, and the others are bit players if you can even call them that.
annie_moose,
What does you cut and paste job on staking have to do with anything here, you seem to be one who is talking of stalking.
Keeping a file of posts certainly can never be considered such. After all, all these posts are archived, by the Eagle.
Seems to me that you, in fact, might be making a threat.
I am have simply started personally archiving some posts.
Oh annie_moose,
Read your own post;
“Constitutionally protected activity is not included within the meaning of “course of conduct.””
Oh Apophis,
Your ‘guardian angel’ is up.
Good morning!
CF2K posts;
“Apophis,
CF2K got your back.”
Whoa…would that ever make me nervous.
Better be concerned you’ll get a knife slipped in it. Or worse.
Regular: About those standings of Governance. America was the leader or amongst the leaders apparently in 2002 with all the same problems you describe in your rebuttal post in place then as now. Denmark (and Ireland, Belgium and Holland for that matter) might not be a fair comparisons, but perhaps France, Canada and Australia are. With less than 3 persons per sq. km. plus their aboriginal populations/attendant problems, the latter two must have huge problems related to the opposite end of the density scale.
Nathan,
“I hope you don’t watch South Park and that you boycott comedy central for putting it on the air.
I hope you don’t watch the Chapelle Show.
I hope you don’t watch Carlos Mencia.
Actually, I could go on all night listing all of the things you had better stay away from.
I am just looking out for you, because you are so easily offended.”
*********************************************
Your concern for my sensibilities is genuinely, well, trollish, as befits the son of an anti-Semitic oaf who gets pissed off when someone calls him out as what he is.
You can watch what you like. But if what you’re saying expresses racist stereotypes, specifically anti-Jewish / anti-Semitic ones, you’re personally insulting ME, which I don’t have to put up with.
You’re also revealing your own racially prejudicial attitudes and small-mindedness, Nathan, but that is, of course, your right.
As for the “Jews are cheap” slander, it is offensive on multiple levels, not the least of which for its historical roots in Martin Luther’s “On the Jews and their Lies.” Here’s a sample of Luther’s hateful, hateful text:
“Moreover, they are nothing but thieves and robbers who daily eat no morsel and wear no thread of clothing which they have not stolen and pilfered from us by means of their accursed usury. Thus they live from day to day, together with wife and child, by theft and robbery, as arch-thieves and robbers, in the most impenitent security. For a usurer is an arch-thief and a robber who should rightly be hanged on the gallows seven times higher than other thieves. Indeed, God should prophesy about such beautiful penitence and merit from heaven through his holy angel and become a flagrant, blasphemous liar for the sake of the noble blood and circumcised saints who boast of being hallowed by God’s commandments, although they trample all of them under foot and do not keep one of them.”
Here’s the rest of Luther’s stomach-turning rant:
http://www.humanitas-international.org/showcase/chronography/documents/luther-jews.htm
That’s what you’re toying with when you make anti-Semitic jokes, however slight or minor you think them to be. Ignoring that history and conceptual legacy and pretending it doesn’t exist or isn’t in play allows bigotry to disguise itself.
And in the case of HLP, it allows the bigot to denounce the one calling him out for his bigoty.
“CF2K” –
Thanks (although I’m sure it was painful) for posting the Martin Luther stuff. (Those wacky Germans! Will they never quit?*)
* Seriously. Will they ever quit?
Granted, some “Christian” sects have renounced their theological antisemitism, but its at the core of their movement and, especially among fundamentalists, is never far beneath the surface.
Additionally, a national newspaper in Germany yesterday published on its front page a picture of the White House with the headline: “Uncle Barack’s Cabin?”**
** Seriously. The Germans are (like most American CONservatives) are so racist, they don’t even realize it as they’re being it. Will they ever quit?
Probably not. Not all of ‘em, anyway. There’s still 25% or so of them who still think Shrub’s doing a good a good job! Hell, even Barney*** doesn’t think Shrub’s doing a good job.
***Then again, Barney is black.
The Republic Party is going to join its rightful place on the dust heap of history, along with the Whigs and their intellectual ancestors, the Know-Nothing Party.
CF2K,
I think you are being rather disingenuous.
You are pretending to be offended where no offense was meant.
Playing the typical liberal “I’m a victim card”
Sorry, CF2K, it is not going to work.
Neither my father nor I are racists, bigots, or anti-semites.
You are taking something my father said and going way overboard with it.
Just like the liberals always do, they find some little nugget of something that was said and act as if they uncovered the entire mine full of something that was never there.
As I said, you better hide in your basement because you need some thicker skin.
“You are pretending to be offended where no offense was meant.”
As is the case with sexual harassment, it is the “victim” that determines what is harassment or offensive.
Most reasonable people, when told that a remark or comment is anti-Semitic or otherwise offensive, have the decency to apologize and cease and desist.
CF2K,
You didn’t answer my question either.
Do you watch South Park or do you boycott Comedy Central for putting it on the air?
Cartman:
“Ah ah ah, ah, I know what you’re thinking, Stan. You’re thinking, you’er gonna go tell Kyle. Look, I know you think he’s your best friend, but Kyle is a Jew rat! He has his Jew ethics while he hoards his greedy Jew gold, and he will Jew you out if you tell him about this!”
Innocent cartoon joke or is Comedy Central full of anti-semites that CF2K should be boycotting?
You tell us CF2K?
WS Clark,
Neither you nor CF2K are reasonable people so why would you expect us to treat you reasonably?
OOOTay . . . let’s get serious here. We have dancing with the stars, celebrity golf and celebrity circus. What America really wants is:
Celebrity Hooker. The winner is the one who can do the most tricks in a twenty four hour period, and make the most money (pickpocketing is encouraged). The winner gets a free lifetime supply of aids medication.
Celebrity doper. The winner is the one who can go two hours, thirty seven minutes, completely clean of all drugs ( or figure out a way to beat all tests). The winner gets a free lifetime supply of the drug of his or her choice.
Celebrity homeless. The winner is the one who can collect the most shopping carts, with no two shopping carts coming from the same store, and survive the gauntlet of die-hard Republicans wielding straw brooms and obsolete remote controls. Carts confiscated by the law do not count in the final total. The winner gets two free mosquito nets, a large, refrigerator sized, cardboard box, and a dog of undetermined origin
My expertise on producing, writing and directing for the above money making endeavors can be had for a very large sum of money.
“Neither you nor CF2K are reasonable people so why would you expect us to treat you reasonably?”
Well, Mr. Social Skills, I mentioned that most people are considerate enough to stop with anti-Semite or harassing jokes when asked.
Of course, being considerate is part of having social skills, something that we all know you are lacking.
Nathan,
South Park attacks everybody and anything. They hold no favorites, and intend to punch every bigot in the mouth with their own (bigots) sordid brand of logic. In other words, make fun of everybody. Like I always say, if you can’t laugh at yourself, you got no right, or business, laughing at anybody else.
PSSSSSTTTT, Nathan, you think Ann would go for the celebrity hooker show?
WS Clark,
Where are my father and I continuing to make jokes?
CF2K didn’t politley ask, he is still droning on calling us bigots and saying my father is an anti-semite.
As I said, when you act like a reasonable person I will treat you like one.
JMWalker,
I love South Park. My point was that if CF2K is going to be so easily offended by what my father said he should be out boycotting Comedy Central for having South Park on the air.
Are you trying to say that if I was to make racist jokes and bigoted comments towards every group on the blog that would make it ok?
As long as I don’t leave anyone out?
“CF2K didn’t politley (sic) ask,”
Ah, when subjected to anti-semitism, the burden is on the individual that made the offensive remarks – the victim is not obliged to be polite, nor would anyone subject to racial or ethnic bigotry.
But who cares what you think, Price?
Nathaniel,
Aren’t you going to answer my earlier post?
http://blogs.kansas.com/weblog/2008/06/open-thread-68/#comment-364579
“Are you trying to say that if I was to make racist jokes and bigoted comments towards every group on the blog that would make it ok?
As long as I don’t leave anyone out?”
==============================================
Nope. Bigots do that. Maybe I should have said with instead of at. I don’t consider you a bigot.
“Nathaniel” asks –
“Are you trying to say that if I was to make racist jokes and bigoted comments towards every group on the blog that would make it ok?
As long as I don’t leave anyone out?”
Hell. Maybe.
It works for me, mostly.
Poor ol’ “Fleettwood” about stroked out when I posted in favor of capital punishment (with minor reforms) yesterday. He couldn’t cope.
I guess the only reason “Boxlock” isn’t posting to this forum today is his promise to bone-dig my previous posts that he thinks will prove I am “the most vulgar and perverted” participant in this forum. I guess that task is taking more work than he anticipated.
I’ve pissed off liberals and Cons on this forum but stand by my opinions with the courage of my convictions.
I was a more-or-less regular listener of Rush Limbaugh for the better part of a decade, just to hear if he’d actually surprise me with some genuine conservative opinion that didn’t parrot Republic Party cant.
Never happened.
I can spin the radio dial and channel surf Faux Noise Channel in a half-hour and pretty much pick up all the GOP talking points that show up from Cons on this forum.
Surprise me, “Nathaniel.” Take a step out from under the Cons’ agenda for once and tell us what you really feel, for once. On another thread, I’ve expressed that George WMD Bush’s approach to National Guard duty should be an affront to the dedication you obviously have for your Marine Reservist service. Can you admit that? Or is Republic Party dogma so much more important to your deep and personal commitment to your country and the Corps?
Come clean, “Nathaniel.” Consider this a patriotic altar call.
(Oh, and you haven’t invited me to your church yet, either.)
Nathaniel,
I don’t watch South Park because I don’t find it amusing. As in, “not funny”–lame, obvious, and smug. SO smug, in fact. I though the first movie was pretty funny, but “Team America” gave up on the humor in favor of making a heavy handed ideological point. I grant that the puppet sex WAS pretty funny.
I think WS Clark nailed the point when he said this:
“Ah, when subjected to anti-semitism, the burden is on the individual that made the offensive remarks – the victim is not obliged to be polite, nor would anyone subject to racial or ethnic bigotry.”
It’s real simple, Nathan: if you don’t want to be called an anti-Semite, don’t play anti-Semitic stereotypes for laughs. Period. Because when you do, you’re laughing at the same racist shit that White Power assholes like Ian Santiago laugh at. When you laugh at those stereotypes, Nathan, you join THEIR linguistic community. I suspect that really isn’t where you, or your father, want to be. But that’s where you put yourselves when you snicker about how “Jews are cheap.”
As for your imputation that I’m just some sort of concern troll who wasn’t REALLY offended, but just wanted to make a point, well, Nathan, really, what the f*ck do you know?
One of the things about being in MY skin, which is to say, that of being a practicing Christian with a Jewish heritage and a WASP last name, is that people feel comfortable using anti-Semitic stereotypes and slurs because they think you’re not Jewish. And they get REAL quiet when you tell them you are. I’m an adult with a big mouth who isn’t afraid of a fight; obviously. But in every case, I ALWAYS would prefer that the person had not said what he or she said. It’s just no fun, and is generally a losing proposition, to have to call someone out–as the current exchange makes abundantly clear.
Finally, you want to know what REALLY offends me, Nathan? Well, I’ll tell you: it’s the way the Wingnuts on this blog throw the “anti-Semitic” accusation at anyone who challenges the right of the Israeli state to do whatever it wants, whenever it wants, to whomever it wants. I’m sick of Wingnuts using such an extremely loaded term as a cheap argument-stopper, without any knowledge WHATEVER of its historical backstory.
I didn’t embark on calling your father out lightly. I hope he changes how he uses language. But if he isn’t afraid of being seen as anti-Semitic for continuing to employ anti-Semitic stereotypes, then I’m not afraid to call him out for doing so.
So it is true that the muppet poster CF2K supports Palestinian terrorists.
Monkeyhawk,
“Additionally, a national newspaper in Germany yesterday published on its front page a picture of the White House with the headline: “Uncle Barack’s Cabin?”
OY. Those Germans work SO hard at rehabilitating their image, and then something like THAT shows up. The mind reels…
“So it is true that the muppet poster CF2K supports Palestinian terrorists.”
Grow up, McCluer, or at least PRETEND to grow up.
That was a stupid comment, but what else would we expect from the likes of you.
Sad. Stupid and sad.
Almost aa totally wasted Thread today!!
Well, Chas, it’s not THAT bad considering that it didn’t even exist until tomorrow.
You should have been here yesterday, when tomorrow was today.
First “WSClark” says –
“…it’s not THAT bad considering that it didn’t even exist until tomorrow.”
Then “cosmos_originally” comes up with –
“You should have been here yesterday, when tomorrow was today.”
And I’m stuck here in the middle asking –
WHERE AM I NOW THAT I NEEDED ME?!
Ever notice, CF2K NEVER SMILES.
He’s always on a rag about something.
Wonder why.
…….you’d better copy/paste this into your WORD file to complete that dossier!