Hillary Clinton’s refusal to recognize Barack Obama’s historic night as the Democratic Party’s nominee was more of the self-serving drama that we’ve come to expect from her.
“In Defeat, Clinton Graciously Pretends to Win,” is how Washington Post columnist Dana Milbank summed it up.
If you didn’t know that Barack Obama had won the nomination — and many of Clinton’s supporters in the media-proof Baruch College bunker apparently didn’t — then you’d think that Clinton’s speech was a victory celebration.
Clinton campaign chairman Terry McAuliffe introduced her as “the next president of the United States.”
“Denver! Denver!” her supporters chanted.
She announced that she was “making no decisions tonight.” (Thanks, but the decisions have been made for you — you lost.)
On CNN, pundit David Gergen wondered if Clinton thought she was forming a coalition government.
All in all, it reinforced Clinton’s image as a graceless loser. And she wants to be Obama’s vice president?
It’s a strange way to apply for the position, by disrespecting the party’s nominee and leader.
238 Comments
Her behavior sure adds to a suspicion that something big and negative for Obama is out there.
Obama could still be assassinated. Why would Hilary quit now?
She basically said so herself.
It is not over till it is over!
Go Hilary! All the way!
More Obama Drama…someone bring me the Dramimine.
Respect meter for Randy Scholfield.
Reading: 0
“(Thanks, but the decisions have been made for you – you lost.)”
Pissy much Randy?
You concede when you LOSE.
Senator Clinton has not lost. Obama has also not won.
Everybody see “Recount” by now?
You can learn from watching that about the danger of concession.
Gore tried to be gracious to bush too quick in calling to concede.
In the film? They have to send an aide FRANTICALLY running after Gore to stop him making a public concession speech.
And we know now that Gore actually won and SHOULD be President. But that call he made to bush? That always worked against him. Once the media called it for bush? It got hard to un do it.
Senator Clinton thinks Obama is NOT the best candidate to represent the party. Me and several million people agree with her. She wants to beat him or help him.
I hope she beats him. He better hope she is willing to help her if he wins.
All the pretty speeches and fainting crowds are in the past now. No more of that til August.
Can Obama stay on his feet and under the radar til then?
Is it too much to ask of the person who wants the most important job on the planet?
“Nathaniel” is positively gleeful at the thought –
“Obama could still be assassinated.”
Then “Nathaniel” started to scope out grassy knolls.
Will people be thinking that Obama’s vp, like mccain’s is the pres. in waiting?
As long as I am keeping you distracted here MonkeyHawk, that is less time you are spending trying to lure those little boys in the chat rooms.
“Her behavior sure adds to a suspicion that something big and negative for Obama is out there”
It may be revealed that he’s the fabled illegitimate son of John Sydney McCain!
Quote to fit the day:
If you cannot answer a man’s argument, all is not lost; you can still call him vile names.
–Elbert Hubbard
“Obama could still be assassinated. Why would Hilary quit now?
She basically said so herself.”
No Nathan, Senator Clinton never said any such thing.
But YOU just did.
And my guess (and hope) is that somewhere alarm bells went off and your name was added to the list of people that are kept a watchful eye on.
Phantom… maybe hes BJ Bills son
Wouldn’t Obama (like McCain) be the “Presumptive” nominee?
DENVER DENVER DENVER DENVER
You’re never quite through making a fool of yourself are you Randy?
“All in all, it reinforced Clinton’s image as a graceless loser. And she wants to be Obama’s vice president?
It’s a strange way to apply for the position, by disrespecting the party’s nominee and leader.
I’m going to tell you again.
Senator Clinton didn’t lose anything.
She also doesn’t have to “apply” to Barack Obama for anything. He isn’t the party’s leader. And he is not the nominee until August and the convention.
Senator Clinton doesn’t have to take a dive for him. He staggered over the finish line of the primary process. Let’s see him stay on his feet til the convention. And Obama NEEDS Clinton just as much or more than she needs him.
No, McCain is the “presumptive nominee”, because we are presuming he’ll still be here until the convention.
We’ll know he’s McCain’s if he slips up and calls him boy!
He staggered over the finish line of the primary process.
If that’s staggering, somebody bring me a drink!
Bluejay doesn’t it get lonely in your dream world.
—————
‘Gore tried to be gracious to bush too quick in calling to concede.
In the film? They have to send an aide FRANTICALLY running after Gore to stop him making a public concession speech.
And we know now that Gore actually won and SHOULD be President. But that call he made to bush? That always worked against him. Once the media called it for bush? It got hard to un do it.’
——————–
it was a movie. Bush won the election. Gore lost. Bush won the recount Gore wanted. Gore lost. The supremes said what Gore wanted wasn’t kosher.(a selective recount). Gore lost in real life.
Hillary lost in real life. She just won’t admit defeat. But just hang in there Bluejay in your dream world. Gore won and Hillary will be the democrat nominee in November.
To quote EAGLE’S opinion editor, Randy Scholfield, “And she (Hillary Clinton) wants to be Obama’s vice president?”
As I understand the presidential organization chart, the Vice President stands more or less independently of the President. The President does choose his running mate and they are elected together. But once elected, I believe they are independent offices. The President has no authority over the Vice President.
The vice president’s office is next door to the White House in the executive office building. They maintain separate staffs and schedules. The Vice President serves as the President of the U.S. Senate, as I was reminded on this blog recently.
If they should become “estranged” for want of a better word, I presume the V.P. would carry on his/her activities completely separate of the President.
Since this situation could arise with an Obama/Clinton ticket, does anyone have any thoughts on this?
If Hillary were to join the ticket as vice-president, would they prepare an agreement etched in concrete delineating duties and privileges of each? Would Hillary reserve the right to appoint her husband to the U.S. Supreme Court or other similar position and make other similar appointments? Even their living quarters might need to be negotiated.
Just thinking ahead.
BlueJay posted June 4, 2008 at 1:36 pm
“Senator Clinton didn’t lose anything.”
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/
Needed to Win: 2,118
Obama —- 2,158 — Presumptive Nominee
Clinton — 1,926
Apparently, Senator Clinton asked for input from voters as to what her next move should be. Here is where you can share your thoughts with Senator Clinton:
http://www.hillaryclinton.com/help/contact/
And here’s what I thought that Senator Clinton needed to hear from me:
“Dear Senator Clinton,
I appreciate very much your service to the voters of New York State, and to the nation. And at this juncture, I believe you can best serve our Democratic Party by conceding the Party’s Presidential nomination to Barack Obama, who last night reached the required number of delegates.
As a lifelong Democrat, who has never, ever, voted for a Republican, and who has had the pleasure of voting, twice, for another Clinton seeking the Presidency, I hope you will seriously consider my words, Senator Clinton, which I offer both in gratitude for your service to our nation, and with an eye as to what is your own best interest.
Now is the time for you to concede the nomination, and for you to turn your considerable efforts and talents toward driving the Republicans from the White House in 2008.”
Dear CF2K:
I don’t give a shit what you think.
Sincerely,
Hillary
Dang it fleettwood, you made me spit coffee.
CF2K: I predict we are going to hear the phrase, “negotiated presidency.” That is Obama as President and Hillary Clinton as V.P. and an agreement etched in concrete relating their respective privileges, duties and responsibilities. Of course, first priority will be providing for the elephant in the room, Bill Clinton.
“Of course, first priority will be providing for the elephant in the room, Bill Clinton.”
That elephant needs to be a circus somewhere.
And soon.
fleettwood,
For once, you may be right. But since Hillary Clinton asked, I’m answering: that is, after all, how grownups conduct themselves. I know that may be foreign to you, fleettwood.
JWink,
“Negotiated Presidency” sounds, to me, like the worst of all possible worlds: a weakened, hamstrung, President and an emboldened VP. Kind of like what have at the moment, actually.
If Obama doesn’t have the balls to turn Hilary down for the VP then there is not much hope for him having them to protect our country…
“If Obama doesn’t have the balls to turn Hilary down for the VP then there is not much hope for him having them to protect our country…”
This is not a black and white issue – Barack will choose the person he wants for VP, be it Hillary or someone else.
Hillary has zip influence on the process.
“Winners and losers and don’t get caught on the wrong side of that line.”
“(CNN) — A host of prominent Democrats are pushing for an Obama-Clinton unity ticket — but Jimmy Carter isn’t one of them.
The former president, who publicly endorsed Barack Obama shortly before polls closed Tuesday in the final two primary states, told a London newspaper that a joint ticket between the two former rivals would be “the worst mistake that could be made.”
“That would just accumulate the negative aspects of both candidates,” Carter told the Guardian, saying that both candidates’ vulnerabilities could overshadow that the ticket if the two team up together.
“If you take that 50 percent who just don’t want to vote for Clinton and add it to whatever element there might be who don’t think Obama is white enough or old enough or experienced enough or because he’s got a middle name that sounds Arab, you could have the worst of both worlds,” he said.
This is not the first time the former president has expressed doubt in the success of a unity ticket. Speaking at a Houston event late last month, Carter called the prospect “highly unlikely,” and said other potential picks could better serve the Illinois senator.
“I think it would be highly unlikely for Obama to ask her to take it,” he said then. “Because I don’t see how it would help his ticket. I think he needs somebody like a [former Georgia Sen.] Sam Nunn, but I won’t name others. But I think if he asked her, she would take it.”
Carter largely stayed on the sidelines during his party’s prolonged presidential nomination fight, though the Georgia Democrat had long hinted his preference for Obama. Speaking with Sky News last month before he made his endorsement, Carter said that once the final two contests had been held June 3, it would be time for Clinton to give up her presidential bid.”
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/06/04/carter-says-unity-ticket-would-be-worst-mistake/#more-7601
“But since Hillary Clinton asked, I’m answering”
McCain has asked that you get off his lawn.
fleettwood,
There are actually two possible responses to your post:
-Given that what I reported was a factual request on Hillary Clinton’s part, you would need to respond with factual evidence that I was, in fact, standing on John McCain’s lawn, and that he had, in fact, asked me to move;
However, given that distinctions such as factual / fictional clearly are beyond you, I’ll respond in kind:
-Oh; you mean Old Man shouting at cloud is addressing ME?
Methinks cf2k has lost it.
I have also written to Senator Clinton.
I asked her to take it to the convention.
I closed telling her what I will say here now.
I can’t vote for or support Obama unless Senator Clinton is holding his hand. There is just too much about him we don’t know.
“Hillary has zip influence on the process.”
Telling several million of her supporters that is NOT a good election strategy for Obama. So it’s not correct.
And as I understand the convention process. I don’t think it is accurate in fact. I think she could run for the office in a floor fight if she wanted it bad enough.
But I’d rather see her fight the convention for the whole enchilada.
I have posted elsewhere, I THINK she wants to accept VP. And I THINK Obama is happy to give it to her. That’s just my sense of the “noise” out there.
“But I’d rather see her fight the convention for the whole enchilada.”
Represent, my brother! Somebody give me an amen!
DENVER DENVER DENVER DENVER
Randy’s got a man crush
Ain’t it cute?
BlueJay – I have a different take. I don’t see Clinton as VP; it has been noted before that the VP really has little power. Instead, I see her staying in the Senate and building her power base there. And then, the Court? Consider – a lifetime appointment. 20 years to shape the future of America.
CF2K
Posted June 4, 2008 at 2:50 pm | Permalink
fleettwood,
For once, you may be right. But since Hillary Clinton asked, I’m answering: that is, after all, how grownups conduct themselves. I know that may be foreign to you, fleettwood.
————————-
Pay attention fleettwood!!
weeze gettin lezzuns frun a growed up!
(chortles)
That’s funny. We were all Libs (until we grew up).
‘Superdelegates avalanche begins’
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hUPSXLSf9BMjfyPSCc2sdK8RtV8QD913F4780
Ungracious?
What do you expect from the white trailer trash couple from Arkansas?
Madame Hillary, R. Emmett Tryrrell, JR, predected as much. She wants all the power – regardless of how she looks getting it.
Of course, she also wants lib chumps to continue to continue to her lost cause – by sending money to pay off her 20 million dollar campaign debt.
Go to her webpage – they’ve revised it to allow you all to comment, and send in your donations – big letters on front page.
There is one born every minute.
Dear Hillary:
Please don’t stop. Take this all the way to Denver!
Sincerely,
The RNC
You editors missed a little something in your tireless shilling for Obama.
Hillary THUMPED Obama in South Dakota, home of Obama supporter Tom Daschle.
Tom couldn’t even get his own state on the train.
Fight on Hillary!
“Fight on Hillary!”
Damn the bell sounded last night, the fight is over and Obama won the championship.
You know, I’m just about so sick of Obama supporters and the way they have treated HILLARY, that I’m about to the point of believing that it really is about sexism. She’s the better candidate by far, and those who support Obama don’t even want her to be in the VP slot.
You wont win the presidency without us. I promise it.
So keep it up, the more you all do this, the closer Bushit’s mimime gets to the Oval Office.
“I’m about to the point of believing that it really is about sexism.”
Isn’t it always with you? When everything is sexism, it quickly becomes that nothing is about sexism. It makes your case weaker by the minute.
In fact, it makes you sound like a woman.
STAND BACK!
“Hillary THUMPED Obama in South Dakota”
Three electoral votes (ho-hum).
Another red state.
Bush in 1992
Dole in 1996
Bush in 2000
Bush in 2004
Certainly another meaningless victory which just delays the inevitable.
“Damn the bell sounded last night, the fight is over and Obama won the championship.”
Two words.
Presumptive nominee.
And some damned presumptuous supporters.
This is NOT decided until the convention. Senator Clinton can concede tomorrow and there will still be a convention with a voting process.
She doesn’t have to free her delegates til then. Ted Kennedy took it to the convention and then endorsed Carter.
And some of you Obama supporters want to watch the arrogance. I know 14 family members and friends who are already SO turned off by the media love affair with Obama that they don’t plan to vote in the fall at all if he is the nominee.
P_Mom, please explain how I, an Obama supporter, have treated Senator Clinton badly? And please don’t bring up sexism, because I’m a white, straight, female over the age of 50.
In your opinion she’s the better candidate. I’ll grant you that you have that right, just as I do to have a differing opinion, probably for different reasons. Or maybe the same. Who knows? I don’t recall ever posting nasty things about her on this blog, other than to say I didn’t particularly like her in some ways. The reasons are not recent.
As for Obama choosing her as his VP, when that time comes, I expect him to keep the welfare of our country and its citizens in mind, no matter what his decision on anything. I also suspect the DNC might have some suggestions for who he might choose. Is Hillary one of them? I have no idea. They have their ear to the ground much better than we all do and are probably better to judge what the outcome might be. It will be up to Obama to heed what they have to say. Or not.
And, btw, I also hope Hillary will keep the welfare of our country and its citizens in mind, too, when the convention rolls around. As a representative, I expect that from her.
“And, btw, I also hope Hillary will keep the welfare of our country and its citizens in mind, too,…”
Lucky for you, she’s all about the welfare.
I know 14 family members and friends who are already SO turned off by the media love affair with Obama that they don’t plan to vote in the fall at all if he is the nominee.
The media is a pretty sad reason not to vote. Wouldn’t that be considered caving to the media?
I think Obama’s rise came prior to the media, and once they recognized it, they decided to back him. Or it could be that Hillary and the media don’t mix well. I don’t know. It’s all conjecture and worthless when looking for the truth.
OTOH, I wouldn’t say the media backed him all that well, considering they can’t let go of some things and continue to beat a few pitiful “news” stories to death. But that goes for the majority of the media and all three running.
Watch it, fleetie. What goes around, comes around. ;)
If Obama doesn’t have the balls to turn Hilary down for the VP then there is not much hope for him having them to protect our country…
That may be true. Certainly, a president has to be a strong leader, and if Obama’s not strong enough to turn Hillary down, he’s not strong enough to lead.
Hillary as negotiated VP? There’s nothing to negotiate; the VP has no power. It’s a do-nothing, pointless job, an electoral and political dead end.
(Yes, the VP’s President of the Senate; but unlike Speaker of the House, it’s a symbolic position. Majority leader is where the power is. The President of the Senate can’t even vote unless there’s a tie; most of the time, unless there is a close vote that matters, the VP doesn’t even show up. The President Pro Tempore takes over, and he or she has more real power that the VP does, as a real member of the Senate)
No, Hillary just wants to be asked, so she can turn it down. And I predict exactly that will happen. Obama will offer the VP slot, and in a carefully correographed manuever, Hillary will turn it down, opting to continue to serve in the Senate, where she has real power.
On the other hand, if Obama really wants to cut Hillary off at the balls, so to speak, he SHOULD make her VP – then send her to every funeral, in every country, constantly. Remember: keep your friends close, your enemies closer.
It’s an old joke: There once was a woman with two sons. One went off to sea, the other became Vice President. Neither was ever heard from again . . .
She’s totally lost it.
I used to really hate her for sniping away at the front runner when she didn’t have a chance.
Now, I just feel sorry for her.
It’s like an eight year old who wants to keep doing it over until she wins.
Really sad, and kinda scary.
“This is NOT decided until the convention. Senator Clinton can concede tomorrow and there will still be a convention with a voting process.”
‘Superdelegates avalanche begins’
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hUPSXLSf9BMjfyPSCc2sdK8RtV8QD913F4780
“Sen. Tim Johnson became only the second Obama superdelegate to switch to Clinton, saying he would vote for her at the convention, if she takes the fight that far, because she won South Dakota.
More than two dozen Clinton superdelegates have switched to Obama throughout the campaign, including 10 on Tuesday.”
“Ted Kennedy took it to the convention and then endorsed Carter.”
Correct, BlueJay.
That was the election that Carter lost.
Not a good plan.
I wasn’t speaking of you Pre, but look at the comments after yours.
There is the problem. Someone was going to come out of this with a whole lot of p’d off supporters.
You remove the ones who won’t vote for Obama over racism, and there are quite a few, I’m thrilled to finally purge the dixiecrat hangovers from the party…so you really want to keep the rest of us who support Hillary, now don’t you?
I’m really p’d at the way the Obama democrats, the BLACK racists who voted for him just because he was black, the leaders of my own party have disrespected Hillary, and the media’s love affair with Obama too. I’ve already permanently turned off MSNBC, my ex-favorite channel. I’m tired of it. And I will stay home. There is no way you can win those all important swing states that Hillary CRUSHED victory from and still expect to win the White House without her and us.
I can’t vote for or support Obama unless Senator Clinton is holding his hand.
I thought you didn’t want Obama holding anyone’s hand, BlueJay, but I guess it’s okay if it’s someone you approve of.
That’s funny. We were all Libs (until we grew up)…
…and got greedy. That ol’ greed gene matured, huh?
“She’s the better candidate by far, and those who support Obama don’t even want her to be in the VP slot.”
As far as the “better candidate” well, if she was perceived during the primary process as being the better candidate, she would have won – she didn’t.
And the VP slot, she needs to at least concede before Obama could even consider offering her the position.
I guess Hillary does not understand that – she was introduced as the “next president of the United States” last night, after Obama had clinched the nomination.
If she considers the fight to be still in operations, she can’t be offered anything.
Call back later when she concedes, until then, by her own definition, there is still a fight to be won.
She is STILL the better candidate. Obama still hasn’t offered up squat as far as anything except hope.
And she still wins the swing states.
Carter didn’t lose because Kennedy took it to the convention.
Carter lost because he was at the unfortunate intersection of several things that were not his fault and along came a doddering old fogey going on about “morning in America” and other such bilge.
Truth? I don’t know why anyone WANTS the job after the mess bush has made. Be it Clinton, Obama, or McCain, they will get almost no “honeymoon” at all. Inside a month they’ll get the blame for the sh&8 storm bush made.
Let’s do some political calculation.
If I were Senator Clinton? I take it to the convention. That’s because I happen to agree with her that Obama can’t win the general.
If she takes it to the convention and Obama wins, Obama will probably lose the general election and Clinton can say “I told you so!” for 2012. Or, IF Obama did win the general and isn’t a spectacular success she could still run against him in 2012.
Fight on Hillary!
P_Mom, both you and BlueJay have made comments about Obama supporters and that included me, whether you meant to or not. I don’t take exception to the comments themselves, but the vitriol behind them.
What’s going to kill the party and could disrupt the entire election in a negative way is the division within the party. If the Dems don’t come together and unite behind whomever wins, it will only make it harder.
I’m perfectly willing to let this whole thing play out, but I don’t think the outcome will be any different than where we are right now, as far as the nomination goes.
It sucks not to get what we want, but you know what the Stones said…
This scenario is so god damned transparent as to be ludicrous. This is the way it works…………………………………….
Clinton continues the “fight” to the convention, weakening support for Obama. She encourages her supporters to stay away from the general, directly or indirectly, and refuses to campaign for the party that elected her husband twice to the presidency.
The Clintons are now rich because of Bill’s presidency, but they have no loyalty to the Democratic Party.
The Clintons subtly undermine Obama’s candidacy with “unauthorized” comments and a lack of support.
Obama loses a narrow election to McCain, so that the Republicans have to deal with the mess that Bush has left.
McCain ages twenty years during his four years in office, and Hillary mounts another campaign for 2012, challenging Obama to support her and accusing him of not being a Party supporter.
Wanna bet?
Any takers?
Rox I’ve only jumped on you when you jumped at me.
I’m always careful to refer to “SOME Obama supporters”.
And I’m not swinging at you when I say…
Ya know political mama? It’s funny. SOME of the Obama supporters can’t decide whether to do a victory dance or throw a hissy fit because we WON’T dance.
My take is this is not over. I’D like to see these two take it to the delegates at the convention in person. Make their respective cases. One wins and the other is VP.
Of course, maybe SOME Obama supporters are afraid delegates will change their minds?
Why would they be afraid?
I don’t think she HAS to wait WS.
IF she takes it to the convention she’ll beat Obama.
“One wins and the other is VP.”
One has already won and it ain’t Hillary Clinton.
Damn.
“IF she takes it to the convention she’ll beat Obama.”
Obama wins on the first ballot with the delegates he has – how is Hillary going to “win?”
“Political_mama” allows –
“I’m really p’d at…[how] the leaders of my own party have disrespected Hillary….”
I’m no “leader” of the Democratic Party, but I came out of this race disappointed in the way Senator Clinton ran her campaign.
She had everything going for her and she blew it. The money, the party (her organization basically wrote the rules for the nominating process), and the legacy of President Clinton’s 8 years of peace and prosperity (with the added benefit she’d probably not be receiving blow-jobs in the Oval Office).
Daniel Pinkwater had a nice essay on NPR over the weekend; about ones private voice and public voice. Hillary Clinton, when she’s talking one-on-one or in an intimate venue, sounds calm and thoughtful, feeling and wise. (The voice she probably used when she was raising a terrific kid like Chelsea). But in a big room she sounded entirely different; she shouted and pontificated and (and this was a big deal, I think, during those early big-arena debates), a bit shrill. In a big arena, shouting oratory might have once been called for, but when it’s televised into people’s living rooms, it comes off as harsh.
Barack Obama seems to have a public voice quite similar to his private voice. Yeah, he can pull off a stem-winder of a speech, but he builds to it and the audience is with him as he dials it up. I saw and heard him in El Dorado last winter and looked around the gymnasium. He started soft and slow (as Neil Diamond sang, “Like a small earthquake…”) and everyone in that room walked out with the feeling he was speaking “to me.” That he’d made eye-contact with every one of us.
That’s not what makes a superior leader, of course. But it’s a quality JFK demonstrated in that speech in Berlin so many years ago. (I’ve talked to people who were in that crowd and, years later, they still got chills.)
I’ve written before about the 96-year-old lady who lives on my block. She talks about hearing FDR’s first inaugural address. She’s a sweetie. And when she said, “…and then he came to that moment, ‘The only thing we have to fear is….’ he paused! It was 1933, the worst of the depression! People had lost jobs! Had lost all their money in failed banks! We were afraid of everything and this man on the radio said there was only one thing to fear, and he paused and said, ‘…is fear itself!”
Now as a policy statement it doesn’t mean a whole lot, does it? It wasn’t an outline of the National Recovery Act or the Citizens Conservation Corps or the Works Project Administration or Social Security or the F.D.I.C.. And as an inspirational call from a leader to his fellow citizens, it doesn’t really jump off the page.
I suggest people of all political stripe look up last night’s speeches side-by-side. Watch John Sidney McCain the Third (Bush term) looking like Abe Simpson trying to get his trifocals focused on the teleprompter and then watch Barack Obama’s “This is the Moment!” speech.
“Clinton continues the “fight” to the convention, weakening support for Obama. ”
Um how do you mean she weakens the support for Obama?
Do you mean people might change their minds?
“She encourages her supporters to stay away from the general, directly or indirectly, and refuses to campaign for the party that elected her husband twice to the presidency.”
Yada yada.
OK. So she commits political suicide as a strategy to win in 2012?
And the evidence for this is? Or are you just showing us your pre fab excuse in advance if Obama loses the election?
“I’D like to see these two take it to the delegates at the convention in person. Make their respective cases.”
What do you think they’ve been doing during all the past months of the long primary???
“Of course, maybe SOME Obama supporters are afraid delegates will change their minds?”
From Obama to Clinton? Nope.
‘Superdelegates avalanche begins’
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hUPSXLSf9BMjfyPSCc2sdK8RtV8QD913F4780
“OK. So she commits political suicide as a strategy to win in 2012?”
She’s a Clinton.
“Do you mean people might change their minds?”
Do you really think that 300 delegates are going to flip for Clinton in the next two months?
“Um how do you mean she weakens the support for Obama?”
Look in the mirror.
“And the evidence for this is?”
Her intro last night “the next president of the United States” and her lack of a supportive concession speech.
Damn, is Hillary Clinton a quitter or what…….
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24974674/
“NYT: Clinton to suspend campaign Friday – The former first lady is also set to endorse rival Barack Obama”
Damn, will her supporters take a hint?
BlueJay
Posted June 4, 2008 at 12:29 pm | Permalink
And we know now that Gore actually won and SHOULD be President. But that call he made to bush? That always worked against him. Once the media called it for bush? It got hard to un do it.
===============================
BlueJay
Could you provide me the link where it was determined that Gore won. The last that I heard was that several newspapers completed the recount and that Bush still won. I have not heard of any recounts that put Gore ahead. Thanks for your help.
An “avalanche” would be um….bigger.
And you are blaming Senator Clinton for me not liking Obama?
Some of you Obama supporters….sigh.
WS? YOU have more to do with alienating me from Obama than Senator Clinton ever did.
And Obama got that ball rolling all on his own.
But cosmos is always nearby to tell me I didn’t hear what I heard Obama say. And of course there’s you ready to blame me, Clinton, and little green men if Obama doesn’t get the world handed to him on a plate and with a warm towel.
You really don’t know how people get turned off by Obama AND his supporters.
MSNBC?
The Obama channel? Right.
Lots of hurt feelings out of all this. That network lost a lot of viewers.
In Kansas, I have a luxury.
My vote doesn’t count. But I’ll cast it anyway.
I cannot vote for Obama. I think he is the biggest mistake the party AND the country have made in my lifetime with the exception of george bush.
And bush didn’t have thousands of screaming, fainting, zealots to give him a big ego. Obama I think wants to be the black Ronald Reagan. Pass.
My vote is for Senator Clinton.
J R sings…
You can stand me up at the gates of hell but I’ll stand my ground. And I won’t back down.
“WS? YOU have more to do with alienating me from Obama than Senator Clinton ever did.”
Thank you, it is always a pleasure to rid the Party of fair weather Democrats, former anti-choice protesters that screamed “baby killer” at women at a crossroads in their lives.
“You really don’t know how people get turned off by Obama AND his supporters.”
Do you need the addy for the RNC? Do you wanna make a contribution to ensure that Obama loses so you can say “I told you so?”
I am sure that McCluer can make up some signs for you to parade around with.
“That network lost a lot of viewers.”
Actually, their numbers are at an all time high – but whatever.
I still think america would be very fortunate to have Hillary as the next president. But as a nation, we rarely do what is in our best interest.
Come on over to the Green side JR and Pmom. Let the obama folks get him elected.
I know CYNTHIA would appreciate your support and work to deserve it. Obama? Not so much. Take a look at her positions on the issues. I think you’ll like them.
http://mckinney2008.com/PRESIDENT/
“BlueJay” —
I love ya, have never doubted for a moment your sincerity and passion. But you’re beginning to remind me of those poor sad Japanese soldiers who were still “fighting” World War II forty years after the USS Missouri.
It was a hard race, a close race, an important race, but the race is over. In Monty Python terms, the Clinton campaign is “…an ex-parrot.”
I’m beginning to see the insights of Elizabeth Kübler-Ross among the Hillary die-hards.
Denial stage: Trying to avoid the inevitable.
(It ain’t over ’til the pant-suit lady says so)
Anger stage: Frustrated outpouring of bottled-up emotion.
(“DENVER! DENVER! DENVER!)
Bargaining stage: Seeking in vain for a way out.
(She’ll consider the Vice-Presidency)
Depression stage: Final realization of the inevitable.
(Wes Clark or Janet Napolitano are asked to be Obama’s running mate)
Testing stage: Seeking realistic solutions.
(America is stronger and better with Senator Clinton taking the torch from Ted Kennedy and being a legendary leader in the United States Senate)
Acceptance.
And JR and Pmom? If you think the democrats have your best interests at heart, dream on. They dont give a rat’s ass more about you and I than the repukes. The democratic party would rather give Hillary and Bill the finger than win in November. Yeah, THAT’ll show those mean ol’ Clintons!
The Green Party and Cynthia McKinney wont take your votes for granted.
Unlike the democrats…
Sorry, Jay, it’s not just MSNBC.
http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&tab=wn&ned=us&q=Clinton+suspend+endorse&btnG=Search+News
They could all be wrong, of course, but the Clinton campaign has been curiously silent.
…and while I’m not a Ron Paul fan, I encourage the Ron Paul folks and the Libertarian folks to vote for their choices in November.
If we have little or no influence over what the big money party bosses want, at least we can ALL send a message by having a significant number of votes go someone other than mcsame and obama.
Here’s to the demise of these two oppressive parties. The only way we will EVER have a REAL choice is to starve them both, with no donations, no volunteers…
AND NO VOTES!
“The democratic party would rather give Hillary and Bill the finger than win in November. Yeah, THAT’ll show those mean ol’ Clintons!”
With all due respect, Ms. Grrl, how are we giving the finger to the Clintons?
Heh heh,
Barack Obama is HARDLY “the party”
I think that’s fairly evident.
“Acceptance.”
I’m there, in terms of the sexism, the pie in the sky “hope and change” bleaters, and the folk who just pull the D lever out of habit. I can accept that Hillary will not be the nominee.
But I dont have to vote for obama or mcsame. I dont have to give them money. I dont have to work for either of them. I have a choice.
And I choose Cynthia McKinney and the Green Party.
All the democrats will EVER see of me again is my fat white ass as I turn my back on them.
“Barack Obama is HARDLY “the party””
By virtue of having clinched the nomination for the presidency of the Democratic Party, Barack Obama is now also considered to be the head of his Party.
That has been the protocol for decades and will be for decades in the future.
“All the democrats will EVER see of me again is my fat white ass as I turn my back on them.”
Not that the democrats will notice or care. I’m sure they will do fine without me. They’ll have all the self loathing gays who vote against their own best interest.
Democrats. The party of donnie mcclurkin, jan pauls, candy ruff, and the list could go on.
And on and on and on….
Oh and Pmom? I’ve switched off MSNBC too. I listen to CNN Headline News in the morning but that’s it.
I’m learning to like reruns…
“Not that the democrats will notice or care.”
Yeah, we will, and we will continue to fight for you and yours ’til Hell freezes over.
As I said, I wish you would join us, but we will understand if you do not.
That will not stop us from defending you and your interests.
The head of the party is Howard Dean.
And Obama hasn’t clinched anything but a number.
But if Obama is where the party is going? Pie in the sky candydates who kneecap me to work with the enemy?
I’m right behind ya kfg.
IF Senator Clinton doesn’t fight this to the convention, it SHOULD give her political capital.
But it won’t. Obama’s entitled.
And so, if she is not to be the nominee? One last word of warning.
She gets what she wants. IF Obama disses her in any way? I vote McCain.
Clark, thankfully some INDIVIDUALS like you do indeed fight for us. And thank you for that.
But the democratic party? Not so much. Sebelius? Obama? Dennis McKinney? Gays are just collateral damage to them. As a party, democrats would rather pander to evangelicals in south carolina than consistently support equal justice for all.
In fact, the presumptive democratic presidential nominee supports separate and unequal civil unions.
Exactly like mcsame.
JR, dont vote for mcsame. Please click the link and check out CYNTHIA’s position on the issues. She’ll work a HELL of a lot harder for you than mcsame.
And I see tony rezko was found guilty on 16 of 24 counts. And so it begins…
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080604/ap_on_re_us/fundraiser_trial
obama’s gonna be the latest in a looooooong line of “presumptive democratic nominees” to go down in flames.
But please feel free to blame Hillary.
“Pie in the sky candydates who kneecap me”
Yeah, it was ALL about you, J R.
“And Obama hasn’t clinched anything but a number.”
And insurmountable number that guarantees him the nomination.
“The head of the party is Howard Dean.”
By tradition, the head of the Party is the presidential nominee – of course you only became a Democrat yesterday so you wouldn’t know that.
“I vote McCain”
Go for it, you are more of a Republican than a Democrat anyway.
Have you been practicing your “baby killer” scream?
I’m not ready to count Hillary out kfg.
Paraphrasing a line from “Rocky II”
“I saw them beat that lady (figuratively) like I never seen anybody beat before. And the lady kept going after it.”
“obama’s gonna be the latest in a looooooong line of “presumptive democratic nominees” to go down in flames.”
Ah, sorry, but name another (living) candidate that clinched the nomination and did not get the nod.
She gets what she wants. IF Obama disses her in any way? I vote McCain.
==========================================
:shock:
WS? Conversation with you can serve no purpose any longer. Goodbye.
heh heh
There’s a con WS. Build a coalition with him.
Ta.
“WS? Conversation with you can serve no purpose any longer. Goodbye.”
Well, goodbye, J R, sorry to see you leave so soon – have a good life.
#
ksfarmgrrl
Posted June 4, 2008 at 7:15 pm | Permalink
Oh and Pmom? I’ve switched off MSNBC too. I listen to CNN Headline News in the morning but that’s it.
I’m learning to like reruns…
==============================================
….speaking of which . . . i was down to watching reruns of jerry springer,while recouping from surgery, including the dreadful episode entitled, “The Return of the Kung Foo Hillbilly!” Dude’s actually making a cd of his unique style, which consists of a red cape, white (kinda) pantyhose, and motionally challenged kicks. To show his mastery of the art, he kicked the sh** out of his brother for letting him pimp his wife. Hey, I ain’t makin’ up!!!
Now that’s wasted cells, and an interesting candidate for the Darwin award.
One would have to be literally brain dead to even think of Cynthia McKinney for anything but a job taking out the trash or scooping poop up after dogs.
Not even JR is that senseless. Farmer you have got to come into town once in awhile, you have completely lost it.
McKinney is an absolute ass and has demonstrated that over and over. Heck, even I get embarrassed for her.
She is an embarrassment to the state of Georgia and the United States.
She can’t even communicate, think of words to use, or tie them into sentences, let alone tie sentences together into a coherent thought.
What a nightmare of a thought. Get serious.
Obama Was Selected, Not Elected
by Ann Coulter
Words mean nothing to liberals. They say whatever will help advance their cause at the moment, switch talking points in a heartbeat, and then act indignant if anyone uses the exact same argument they were using five minutes ago.
When Gore won the popular vote in the 2000 election by half a percentage point, but lost the Electoral College — or, for short, “the constitutionally prescribed method for choosing presidents” — anyone who denied the sacred importance of the popular vote was either an idiot or a dangerous partisan.
But now Hillary has won the popular vote in a Democratic primary, while Obambi has won under the rules. In a spectacular turnabout, media commentators are heaping sarcasm on our plucky Hillary for imagining the “popular vote” has any relevance whatsoever.
It’s the exact same situation as in 2000, with Hillary in the position of Gore and Obama in the position of Bush. The only difference is: Hillary has a much stronger argument than Gore ever did (and Hillary’s more of a man than Gore ever was).
Unbeknownst to liberals, who seem to imagine the Constitution is a treatise on gay marriage, our Constitution sets forth rules for the election of a president. Under the Constitution that has led to the greatest individual liberty, prosperity and security ever known to mankind, Americans have no constitutional right to vote for president, at all. (Don’t fret Democrats: According to five liberals on the Supreme Court, you do have a right to sodomy and abortion!)
Americans certainly have no right to demand that their vote prevail over the electors’ vote.
The Constitution states that electors from each state are to choose the president, and it is up to state legislatures to determine how those electors are selected. It is only by happenstance that most states use a popular vote to choose their electors.
When you vote for president this fall, you will not be voting for Barack Obama or John McCain; you will be voting for an elector who pledges to cast his vote for Obama or McCain. (For those new Obama voters who may be reading, it’s like voting for Paula, Randy or Simon to represent you, instead of texting your vote directly.)
Any state could abolish general elections for president tomorrow and have the legislature pick the electors. States could also abolish their winner-take-all method of choosing presidential electors — as Nebraska and Maine have already done, allowing their electors to be allocated in proportion to the popular vote. And of course there’s always the option of voting electors off the island one by one.
If presidential elections were popular vote contests, Bush might have spent more than five minutes campaigning in big liberal states like California and New York. But under a winner-take-all regime, close doesn’t count. If a Republican doesn’t have a chance to actually win a state, he may as well lose in a landslide. Using the same logic, Gore didn’t spend a lot of time campaigning in Texas (and Walter Mondale campaigned exclusively in Minnesota).
Consequently, under both the law and common sense, the famed “popular vote” is utterly irrelevant to presidential elections. It would be like the winner of “Miss Congeniality” claiming that title also made her “Miss America.” Obviously, Bush might well have won the popular vote, but he would have used a completely different campaign strategy.
By contrast, there are no constitutional rules to follow with party primaries. Primaries are specifically designed by the parties to choose their strongest candidate for the general election.
Hillary’s argument that she won the popular vote is manifestly relevant to that determination. Our brave Hillary has every right to take her delegates to the Democratic National Convention and put her case to a vote. She is much closer to B. Hussein Obama than the sainted Teddy Kennedy was to Carter in 1980 when Teddy staged an obviously hopeless rules challenge at the convention. (I mean rules about choosing the candidate, not rules about crushed ice at after-parties.)
And yet every time Hillary breathes a word about her victory in the popular vote, TV hosts respond with sneering contempt at her gaucherie for even mentioning it. (Of course, if popularity mattered, networks like MSNBC wouldn’t exist. That’s a station that depends entirely on “superviewers.”)
After nearly eight years of having to listen to liberals crow that Bush was “selected, not elected,” this is a shocking about-face. Apparently unaware of the new party line that the popular vote amounts to nothing more than warm spit, just last week HBO ran its movie “Recount,” about the 2000 Florida election, the premise of which is that sneaky Republicans stole the presidency from popular vote champion Al Gore. (Despite massive publicity, the movie bombed, with only about 1 million viewers, so now HBO is demanding a “recount.”)
So where is Kevin Spacey from HBO’s “Recount,” to defend Hillary, shouting: “WHO WON THIS PRIMARY?”
In the Democrats’ “1984″ world, the popular vote is an unconcept, doubleplusungood verging on crimethink. We have always been at war with Eastasia.
I think you’re being a little hard on the good Farm Girl, Boxlock.
Cynthia might actually be a move up from Hillary. All Cynthia has ever done is assault a Capital Police Officer. She’s never littered St Marcy Park with bodies!
Oh, and don’t underestimate junior, he might be that senseless.
Hank, have you no shame?
And if I did, Clark, how in the hell would you know?
nitwit
Good phrase Hank.
Obama was “Selected not Elected.”
………….now old man price has lowered himself to copy/paste of ann coulter screed!
…..breathe the CO deeply old man!
“And if I did, Clark, how in the hell would you know?”
Of course I wouldn’t know, Price, neither you nor Nathan have any sense of shame.
But your girl, Ann “the Man” Coulter has advocated the killing of liberals.
And you choose to post her column?
If a liberal were to post a column from a progressive columnist that advocated the murder of conservatives, you would have a fit – probably a heart attack.
So, do you have no shame?
And McCluer kisses up the the Prices once more – hoping to be adopted by Hank, James?
HLP,
You’re right as usual. I have been less than charitable in what I’ve said to and about farmgirl.
But I simply got more than fed up with all the whinnying she was doing every time I touched the keyboard.
I should be nicer, after all one possible explanation for her behavior and rudeness could be that she has contacted Mad Cow Disease fixing all her own food out there on the farm. I don’t know, can you get that from roadkill?
I’ll try and be nicer, but sometimes I just can’t help it.
“after all one possible explanation for her behavior and rudeness could be that she has contacted Mad Cow Disease fixing all her own food out there on the farm”
Uncalled for, Mr. Boxlock and very un-Christian-like of you.
You may condemn her sexual orientation, but you have no cause to condemn her with that kind of slur as a human being.
WSClark……………boxtop’s comment is typical of the “christian” reichwing.
So Clark, why didn’t you comment on Apophis remark about Hank should breathe carbon monoxide deeply? (CO)
Isn’t that advocating death on a fellow blogger.
Appears to be highly unresponsible for a public servant.
“So Clark, why didn’t you comment on Apophis remark about Hank should breathe carbon monoxide deeply?”
How is that different from you suggesting violence directed at me or your universal threat to “stomp a mudhole” in those that oppose you?
Eh?
……………….are starting the shi*-throwing troll-boy?
I believe the correct word would be “irresponsible”.
I am not a “public servant” little man. There is nothing wrong with that job, that’s just not what I am.
I understand the concept of actually having a job is difficult for you mccluer.
Stomping a mudhole is a rhetorical threat.
Having a science teacher and public servant suggest that someone breathe in carbon monoxide is irresponsible and sadistic.
WSClark,
Surely you read her post recently above that advocated voting for Cynthia McKinney for President, or don’t you remember. Surely you don’t agree? The thought still raises goose-bumps.
And what else could account for such a ridiculous endorsement.
Besides WS, you are being too serious. She and everyone else including you, I would hope, knows that was a little poke done in jest. You may not appreciate the humor but that’s not the first or the last thing we will disagree on, I’m sure.
And WS, I don’t even condemn her sexual orientation, from a secular viewpoint. I only condemn her, or anyone’s, attempt to normalize it and change the meaning of marriage that as existed for thousands of years. Okay?
So Apophis remains arrogant. Perhaps some phone calls. The 260 USD Superintendent is a relative, perhaps he can help me out.
…………well mccluer, I wouldn’t lose any sleep if you were to do the same.
“Stomping a mudhole is a rhetorical threat.”
Jeez, I thought that it was an actual threat – like you were actually being honest and all that.
My bad.
“Surely you don’t agree?”
It doesn’t matter if I agree or not – I will support her right to VOTE regardless.
“you are being too serious”
So, I should take Coulter’s “joke” about killing me and my family (all liberals) as some sort of “hey, this is funny” shit?
I think not.
I don’t work for USD 260 mccluer.
The super. in Derby probably feels the same way about you as most of us.
“The 260 USD Superintendent is a relative, perhaps he can help me out.”
Well, that is so phucking nice of you McCluer. You whine because someone found out that you were really JM and found out where you live, but now you want to call someone’s boss?
Jeez, are you a hypocrite or are you a hypocrite?
WSCLARK,
Craig Wilford, the Superintendent in Derby is not my boss. Even if he were, there is nothing that I have ever done that could get me in trouble as far as my profession is concerned. Irritating reich-wingers is NOT against the law.
Even if it were, there is a concept called “due process” that all members of my profession are entitled to by staute.
Case closed.
mccluer is an ass.
*statute
Hmmmm
Senator Clinton will suspend her campaign Saturday.
That’s hardly, “I concede and release my delegates to Obama.”
I won’t count Hillary out. Things can happen. The delegates are not set in stone until the convention. There may yet be buyers remorse on Obama.
Obama supporters. I am going to make a lot of you angry in the near future. For some of you? I couldn’t care less if you get mad at me. For the more reasonable?
I believe Hillary Clinton has been unfairly treated by the media and the Democratic party. I believe further that Obama is a huge and dangerous unknown.
I hear today, ONE DAY after becoming the presumptive nominee, Obama is already sounding like a Republican. His buddy Rezko was convicted of corruption. The unknown candidate continues to look worse.
Now comes word that Obama will not even offer the VP to Senator Clinton. She likely would not have taken it. For him to deny it?
That’s too far.
Between now and the convention, until Senator Clinton releases her delegates, I will be exclusively on attack against Barack Obama. My hope is the party may yet be stopped from making what many feel is a terrible and unjust mistake.
Obama? No he can’t!
“And JR and Pmom? If you think the democrats have your best interests at heart, dream on. They dont give a rat’s ass more about you and I than the repukes.”
Gotta agree kfg.
But you know me. I can’t bail a fight and I won’t leave Clinton…
until she is forced to leave me.
Olberman is gloating about that bit of bullying going on right now.
IF Senator Clinton is FORCED to quit, McKinney has a new friend and Obama just made an enemy in me.
Damn, I thought that you said “goodbye” J R. I guess you are like your hero, Hillary Clinton – your word is no good.
“The delegates are not set in stone until the convention.”
And what is the likelihood that 300 delegates are going to flip from Obama to Clinton?
Can you spell zero?
It’s over – and until she concedes, there is no chance that she will be offered anything.
But, there is that possibility that Obama could be assassinated.
THAT would make you happy, now wouldn’t it, J R?
I said goodbye to you WS.
As much as you and Obama would like to bulldoze any opposition to him, you’ll find I’m not easy pushed around and certainly not by the likes of you.
Clinton will endorse Obama Saturday:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24974674/
Now, can we leave the woman alone so she can plan her mother’s 89th birthday party?
“I said goodbye to you WS.”
Well, thank you, J R, but why are back so soon?
“you’ll find I’m not easy pushed around”
And who cares at this point? The nomination is in the books and Barack is looking ahead to the general. What is Hillary doing – trying to figure out if that story about Bill and that Hollywood actress, Gina Gershon, is really true?
Remember, J R, you and I have the same number of votes come November – one.
“It doesn’t matter if I agree or not – I will support her right to VOTE regardless.”
Hey dummy, I never said I didn’t support her right to vote! I said her choice of McKinney was essentially brainless.
Big difference.
And, Coulter is a political entertainer, who you may not like, but many do, that’s why she has a successful column and on radio and T.V. all the time. No thinking individual takes all that seriously, except ME! Kidding again, in case you have trouble with that too.
Lighten up….have some fun here, that’s what this is supposed to be.
Respects to Nancy Boyda of Kansas. She has not been part of this goon squad bullying Senator Clinton.
I commented here or somewhere about my mom, aunts, and assorted friends.
They were planning to sit out the election because of Obama.
I can now report that they have a new plan.
They will vote for Senator John McCain. They are all in Kansas. So this will matter little.
But if this ball starts rolling across the country?
Well what will it have profited Obama now he’s mugged the nomination….and lost half the party?
He was so close. But all those bleating crowds have got to his and his wife’s head.
We are about to see the most spectacular and unlikely implosion in American political history as a result.
I guess the DNC couldn’t let the RNC go quietly into civil war. They had to follow them and try and do them one better.
Pending Senator Clinton’s being forced from the race, my vote is for Cynthia McKinney and a straight Green party ticket.
BlueJay posted,
“And Obama hasn’t clinched anything but a number.”
That “number” represents voters and superdelegates. He clinched the nomination.
“IF Senator Clinton is FORCED to quit, McKinney has a new friend and Obama just made an enemy in me.”
Your “enemy” isn’t Obama — it’s the 17+ million American voters, and superdelegates who support Obama.
JR……………..I too was a Clinton supporter. I have seen for many months that Obama will be the Democratic nominee. Be a good Democratic Party member and get behind our candidate. Right now, winning in November is ALL that matters.
Voting for McKinney is futile and a wast of your vote. She will never be able to generate as many votes as Nader did in 2000.
Thanks MrC – hope that report is correct. BlueJay – if she endorses what say you?
“Well what will it have profited Obama now he’s mugged the nomination….and lost half the party?”
And if Hillary had “won” the nomination?
All of the Obama supporters would have been thrown under the bus.
So, what is your point?
From what I hear, she is being bullied Ben.
I’ll want to make sure that’s true. IF it is, her endorsement of Obama means little. It would just be the party forcing her to shut up and sing.
She has to do what she has to do. I have written her again asking her to preserve her delegates. But I understand the New York delegation is leaning on her.
I find all of this absolutely shameful and a little scary.
“From what I hear, she is being bullied Ben.”
I thought she was so tough and a real fighter.
She must be a loser to be bullied like that.
Of course, if Obama was “bullied” in the same manner, the Hillary supporters would have been all over his ass.
But, who is counting?
There is political reality there WS.
Probably Senator Clinton does not want to be black balled from the party.
I believe you and Capn and some other Obama supporters have advocated that?
So she will be shut up and go on being a good Senator working for people. Maybe the Presidency is just not the job for a real public servant or human being. Maybe it TAKES a construct like a bush or obama.
And obama will lose in a landslide.
The third parties will gain votes. The cons don’t like their nominee either.
For those still on the fence. I URGE you to go to hillary.com and ask her to hold her delegates until the convention. Political thuggery like this should not be rewarded.
BlueJay
Posted June 4, 2008 at 12:29 pm | Permalink
And we know now that Gore actually won and SHOULD be President. But that call he made to bush? That always worked against him. Once the media called it for bush? It got hard to un do it.
===============================
BlueJay
Could you provide me the link where it was determined that Gore won. The last that I heard was that several newspapers completed the recount and that Bush still won. I have not heard of any recounts that put Gore ahead. Thanks for your help.
Sorry. That would be hillaryclinton.com
Go count to 500,000 and get back to me “Right angle”.
“There is political reality there WS.”
Sigh………………. the political reality is that Hillary Clinton lost the nomination to Barack Obama, fair and square.
If that offends Clinton supports and they choose to vote for John McCain, well, with all due respect, please leave the Party because we don’t need anyone that does not support the candidate of the Democratic Party.
If that is too harsh for you – consider this – support the nominee of the Party or get on down the phucking road.
Need more directions?
Support Obama, if you claim to be a Democrat, or get the phuck out of here.
Anything else?
Vote for McCain, if care to – vote for four more years of Bush II – vote for him if you dare.
But don’t claim to be a Democrat.
‘Cuz if you vote for McCain, you cannot claim to be a Democrat in any manner.
BlueJay,
I went to http://www.hillaryclinton.com/, not hillary.com, by the way, and was going to do just as you said, I really was.
BUT…they required my name and address, phone and email and I just couldn’t do it. It might come back to haunt me later, I want no record I ever supported Hillary. Too bad, I really would like to see her stay in as well. Denver won’t be nearly as much fun now.
“You wont win the presidency without us. I promise it.”
This is a tarbaby, without Hillary you won’t win the Presidency and with Hillary McCain’s chances increase forty folded.
For once I will sight Fox News as being truly accurate, when they say the have been the fairest toward Clinton. For coverage of Hillary Clinton that has been positive throughout the campaign for the most part. One news organization that has been on her side since shortly after Obama took off. Fox News has been without compare in putting her in a positive light. Pee pee on your ungrateful Democrats! At least those Neo-Cons love her!
And did you notices John McCain is feeling the pain of all those women whom think that Obama and the Democrats are being sexist in the way Hilary is being treated!
He will let you vent your wrath at them by casting a vote for him.
This is all becoming best described by a line for the movie “Forest Gump”. It seems to slip my mind at the moment. What was it? It sums up pretty well have this is turning out.
“Stupid is as stupid does”
“Voting for McKinney is futile and a wast of your vote.”
Every vote in kansas that isnt republican is a waste. So what’s your point?
And it’s only futile because we SAY it is futile.
Do I think she’ll actually win? Of course not. But voting for her does two things for me.
One, it allows me to vote for ONE presidential candidate who REALLY believes in equal justice under the law, unlike obama or mcsame who believe in separate but unequal protection for gays.
Two, it sends a message that I wish a pox on both your houses.
As long as americans let themselves be deluded into thinking either the democrats or the republicans actually represent them and act in their best interests, the two party system will continue to phuck you and yours.
And every four years, like good little sheeple, you’ll go to the polls to support either tweedle dum or tweedle dee, believing their is actually any difference between them.
Here’s a clue. It doesnt matter which dem or which republic you put in the white house. Nothing is going to change until the third parties build enough momentum to make a difference and get some influence.
As long as the sheeple blindly buy into the phoney two party system, you’re going to get the government you deserve.
Have any of you actually READ CYNTHIA’s positions on the issues? I’ve posted the link a bunch of times, but I bet NO ONE here has read it.
A closed mind is a terrible thing to waste. So much easier to march to the polls and do the bidding of your masters.
RightAngle,
Here is the result: Gore won.
“That’s not true. The New York Times did not do its own recount. It did participate in a consortium. Here’s what they actually said:
“If all the ballots had been reviewed under any of seven single standards, and combined with the results of an examination of overvotes, Mr. Gore would have won, by a very narrow margin.”
Ford Fessenden and John M. Broder, The New York Times, November 12, 2001″
http://www.buzzflash.com/articles/contributors/1639
Bottom line: Al Gore got more votes in Florida than did George Bush. But the Supreme Court, for reasons known only to itself, decided that the one who got more votes didn’t get to be the winner.
If every disaffected woman and minority voted for Cynthia McKinney in the general election, and every disaffected states’ rights or libertarian voted for paul or barr…
I bet they could, collectively, get thirty percent of the votes cast. Probably not enough to win any electoral college votes, but enough to make the ruling class a little nervous.
And if we built coalitions, we could see a McKinney/Paul or Barr ticket in 2012.
Incremental gains.
Or… you can blindly vote for the repuke or dem of your choice and keep the status quo going.
And I see how well that’s working….
For the record?
I do NOT regard ws clark as representative of obama supporters at large.
I don’t regard ws clark as much more than a liability here and also to his own candydate.
Put honestly, the guy is bats.
I never said I would vote for McCain there loonytoon. I just reported some backlash of the Obama or else movement.
And your 10:34 is a perfect example of that.
I called it first. “Hope” and “change” were just words.
They’ve been replaced now with fear and smear.
“Yes we can” is gone too. In ONE day it has become “YES YOU WILL or else!”
Obama is going down in flames. PLEASE Senator Clinton. Hold your delegates.
“Have any of you actually READ CYNTHIA’s positions on the issues? I’ve posted the link a bunch of times, but I bet NO ONE here has read it.”
You’re right, no one would read that stuff. All one has to do is listen to her. What good does it do to read what her handlers write for her when she is worse than comatose.
And BlueJay, I can’t believe I did it but I did what you ask and wrote Hillary.
“Hillary don’t drop out!
All the way to Denver!
Obama can’t win…please stay in.”
Doesn’t matter what the newspaper count was, the methodology and the declaration by the Florida Supreme Court was declared unconstitutional because of different counting standards.
(two voters could have marked their ballot in an identical manner, but one voter’s ballot in one county would be counted while the other voter’s ballot in a different county would be rejected, due to the varying standards used for manual recounts.)
Besides, Gore lost his home state of Tennessee. If Gore won Tennessee, the Florida vote wouldn’t have mattered. But Gore didn’t win his home state.
Obama was selected not elected.
“Obama was selected not elected.”
Well, that is the second time you have posted such tripe – care to explain or are you just blowing smoke up the fleetwood of the world?
From HLP’s earlier post:
After nearly eight years of having to listen to liberals crow that Bush was “selected, not elected,” (because Gore won the popular vote)
Obama was selected not elected.
Has a good ring to it, doesn’t it? :)
“Besides, Gore lost his home state of Tennessee. If Gore won Tennessee, the Florida vote wouldn’t have mattered. But Gore didn’t win his home state.”
*****
James McCluer is living in the year 2000. Big surprise there. The man has no idea what is happening in this century. Ha, ha, ha…
So, I guess no one should be surprised that boxlick would rather rant and rail from ignorance than to actually READ the truth about a candidate.
It must be so blissfully easy to just let the MSM define your political views, and then feed you things that only agree with their view for you.
For those of you actually seeking FACTS, without having your mind made up BEFORE you read, here’s a link to Cynthia’s economic statement.
And there is another link to her “peace agenda”.
Her’s is the only truely progressive candidacy. The others are conservative and con-lite.
heheheheh. box and max are gonna LOVE this!
http://www.runcynthiarun.org/system/files/economic_plan_bw.pdf
HEY there he is again.
Build a coalition WS. You and James sit and work things out.
Like obama sez?
Hmm I like that.
This whole nomination process has become “obama sez”
obama sez, take votes from Hillary in Michigan and give them to me.
And the DNC complies.
obama sez “I am the Democratic nominee!” and the DNC makes it so.
obama sez, “yes we can!”
I say? No you won’t.
If you go to mcsame and obama’s websites, you will see LITTLE difference between them. A few different promises around the edges that neither one will actually keep, but essentially the same.
French vanilla or vanilla bean, it’s really all the same.
Give me the rich, sweet and strong dark chocolate offered by CYNTHIA.
It’s time for a REAL choice.
Poor Steven Davis, such a bitter Lib. If he’s not careful he’ll get a wrinkled neck from all the blog ‘craning’ he’s doing.
French vanilla or vanilla bean, it’s really all the same.
Give me the rich, sweet and strong dark chocolate
———————-
One scoop of each pla..
Here’s a link to the Ten Key Values of the Green Party.
You progressives might just be impressed by this.
http://www.greenparty.org/values.php
And here’s the Green Party Platform
http://www.gp.org/platform.shtml
“obama sez “I am the Democratic nominee!” and the DNC makes it so.”
Well, I guess those pesky delegates that Obama has earned are just so much DNC “makes it so” right?
And if the situation was reversed, the Clinton supporters would be SCREAMING for Obama to concede and kiss up to Hillary.
Now that the opposite has happened, not so much.
Hypocrites.
When did Obama smear Hillary Clinton? I’ve heard nothing but gracious and kind remarks made by Obama in regards to Hillary. Today Obama stated that Hillary and he agreed on about 99% of the issues. So how is that smearing her?
Hillary and Bill Clinton expected her campaign to be a cakewalk and both of them would wind up with what they wanted – the power!
But they did not count on an unknown junior senator from Illinois to beat them at their own game. Something had to resonate with the Obama supporters and it is more than just Obama’s speech of hope and change.
Maybe the average Americans are tired of the partisan bickering between the two political parties and Obama offers a change from that.
After all, both Hillary and McCain have been in politics for decades and change is not likely to come from those two.
And after doing some reading, I gotta wonder HOW any real progressive could read this and then support the corporatist democratic and republic parties.
It’s the GREEN PARTY that has the progressive agenda. And yet self professed progressives throw away their time and money by supporting democrats.
It “puzzles me.
Go CYNTHIA!
McCluer is a troll. That is all one has to know about him. He has never, in his poor pathetic life, had as much attention as he gets here.
If you want to do what is reasonable, starve the mofo. Do not respond to his crap. Ignore him. He deserves less, actually.
When the Hankster or Nathan defend the James, ignore them also. It is easy to do. They only support each other in defending James to have some form of alliance they were never able to have in R.L. They are as sadley pathetic as James.
Night all…
“So, I guess no one should be surprised that boxlick would rather rant and rail from ignorance than to actually READ the truth about a candidate.”
Wake up farmer…McKinney doesn’t write that stuff.
Look at her, watch and listen to what she says, she is dumb as a post, no worse, she doesn’t know it and just keeps spouting off.
She’s being used and can’t figure it out.
“Maybe the average Americans are tired of the partisan bickering between the two political parties and Obama offers a change from that.”
They offer insignificant change. The difference between saying toMAYto and toMAHto. It’s still the same nasty fruit.
Cynthia and the Green Party offer REAL change, not just incremental differences.
Or… are progressives here just mouthing the words when they say they want change and a progressive agenda.
‘Cause you aint gonna get it from the DNC or their presumptive nominee.
And do I need to even mention mcsame and his lack of change?
GO CYNTHIA!
Be a good little Lib Steven Davis, run along now and cry yourself to sleep that you can’t get your way.
I’m staying the fight for Hillary kfg.
Until the thugs for “hope” and “change” drive her from the race.
IF that happens? I’m on board with McKinney and the Green party.
The GOP is going into irrelevance for the future. Maybe the DNC needs to join them.
Well, God damn it, don’t sugar coat it, SD, tell it as it is!
(Paraphrased from “Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid”)
So boxlick, if you are not reading about her on her own website, where do you get your “info”, and I use that term loosely?
Gee, let me guess. You heard what you heard from the MSM, that bastion of truth.
Good dog. Now if you roll over, the msm will give you some lovely dog treats. Hopefully they will be made with chinese gluten…
“The GOP is going into irrelevance for the future. Maybe the DNC needs to join them.”
Now THAT would be change I could believe in.
But alas, too manyn two party sheeple for that to happen.
“I’m staying the fight for Hillary”
What fight – she lost – now will you support the nominee or will you be a traitor to the Democratic Party?
Simple question – in or out.
My guess is you are not a real Democrat and you will opt out – cry baby.
And, by the way, I am really, really glad to see you out of the Party.
Really.
And if we built coalitions, we could see a McKinney/Paul or Barr ticket in 2012.
Incremental gains.
Bob Barr? You serious? The author of the Defense of Marriage Act?
I have a feeling I’m reading things too literally, because right now I’m in state of serious bewilderment.
True, the ACLU worked with the man on the Patriot Act, but I still get the feeling there must be an ironic joke here that I’m just not comprehending.
My humble apologies.
KFG thank you for the invite and at first I was going to try to write Paul’s name in. But this vote is more important than the standard election year. I just can not throw away my vote on a third party candidate or a protest vote. I can not support McCain either, he does differ from Bush on a number of things some really are important to me. But on the two that are of the utmost importance to this country he has already said he will continue the Bush Doctrine as to the economy and Iraq. Both are the ruination of this nation.
I said that if he became the GOP nominee it might be the reason I would need to vote for Clinton as hard as that would for me. I am glad Obama got it, I can live with the policies and idea he has said for the most part. Thou he is still a little to liberal for my taste, he shows he is thoughtful and intelligent. I would rather someone that can think about what his adviser tell him rather then someone whom blindly is following his Neoconservatives handlers like McCain. Or Hillary who is willing to lie to her own supporters, her own party and the country and it is called being “Politically savvy”.
I will check out your links those.
And I am really REALLY glad to distance myself from you WS.
You’re nuts.
I will write again to Senator Clinton. I will ask her that IF she is forced to endorse obama that she release her delegates and not ask them to support obama. She doesn’t need anything from him. He is going to lose and be a badly remembered joke.
IF that happens? I’m on board with McKinney and the Green party.
Well, that beats the shit out of voting for McCain. Still wrapping my head around that threat, and the source of it.
I guess the clocks were striking thirteen.
Thanks CF2K,
Very interesting – first time I had heard that. Most of the time over votes can not be counted because they are two different persons and they don’t know which person sould get the vote.
He’s quoting that Ann Coulter article.
For me, that clinches it. Anyone who gets that much venomous ranting from Ann Coulter gets my support ;)
Regular
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:13 pm | Permalink
Be a good little Lib Steven Davis, run along now and cry yourself to sleep that you can’t get your way.
*****
Ignore him, all (especially you, Chas) … Night.
I’m no fan of Bob Barr. However, I think if the non-major parties could stick together in the future, they could put real pressure on the tweedle dum and tweedle dee parties.
If the corporatist stranglehold isnt broken by ending the two party system as we know it, NO CHANGE will be possible.
I think Cynthia and the Greens will be getting ALL my support from now on.
And dog? If you are not voting republican, your vote in kansas is a waste anyway. So why not waste it on mckinny instead of wasting it on obama?
“And I am really REALLY glad to distance myself from you WS.”
And you are a Democrat in name only – and I am glad to be rid of you – please join the Republican Party – they need more fair weather jokers that can’t stand the thought that their candidate sucked so bad that she couldn’t win – so they look to cheat to get the nomination.
Good luck, J R, sucks to be you.
StevenEDavis
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:36 pm | Permalink
Regular
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:13 pm | Permalink
Be a good little Lib Steven Davis, run along now and cry yourself to sleep that you can’t get your way.
*****
Ignore him, all (especially you, Chas) … Night.
———————–
DANCE PUPPET DANCE!!!
(chortles)
Do you need help paying for your meds, McCluer? You have obviously missed a dose this evening.
Feeling a bit like J R, are you?
Take a Valium and get over it.
Or, failing at that, check into ComCares mental health facility.
You need the help – maybe you and J R can get a two for one deal.
I don’t usually have so much time to blog as I have today.
I guess the george bush economy can be thanked for that.
There IS still the convention. Unless obama and his con apologist army have that strong armed too.
Senator Clinton? You know that obama cannot win. That is why you carried the fight this far.
Carry it just a little farther. Save the party from this pandering sloganeer obama
No, I don’t used narcotics, sedatives, pain killers or mind altering drugs. Thanks anyway.
Perhaps you can loan Junior some of your stash. You know, some zippo papers, a few matchsticks or that spare bong you have under your mattress.
Obama was “Selected not Elected.”
Oh you should be WORKING with James there WS.
Obama sez so.
You build a coalition with him. You have being crazy and not respected here in common.
WSClark
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:15 pm | Permalink
Well, God damn it, don’t sugar coat it, SD, tell it as it is!
(Paraphrased from “Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid”)
*****
Hoped I did.
To his credit, I think I spent on the order of $3.50 for James’s lunch. He must be glad to help his country help its Vets. Does he support the Bush repudiation of Vets benefits? What kind of jerk is James? Simple answer: A Kansas jerk – like Brownback, like Roberts, et al…
“Carry it just a little farther.”
The numbers say that Obama has won.
Either get behind the nominee or get out of the Party.
Easy.
One or the other.
Also in the speech, Clinton will urge once-warring Democrats to focus on the general election and defeating Republican presidential candidate John McCain.
The only degree of uncertainty was how. Clinton is exploring options to retain her delegates and promote her issues, including a signature call for universal health care.
Just how big of a Hillary supporter are you JR? And KFG? How about you? P_Mom? If Hillary asked you personally to help defeat McCain, would you blow her off?
I tip my hat to Senator Clinton if she follows through on her promise to help unite the party to win in November. That’s the sign of a big person. I’m seeing sour grapes among her supporters, and I can’t say that I blame them, but think about what’s important here. Is Hillary the issue? Or is the country?
Maybe WS IS James.
That would explain a lot.
Let me be the first to tell you “WS”
Obama is gonna lose and in 40 states in the fall.
And then he and his wife can retire to oblivion.
“You know, some zippo papers”
Eh, Zig Zag.
And J R, please leave the Party – you are NOT a true Democrat – fair weather Democrats are asked to leave politely.
Unless they won’t go – then we kick their sorry asses out.
StevenEDavis
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:50 pm | Permalink
WSClark
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:15 pm | Permalink
Well, God damn it, don’t sugar coat it, SD, tell it as it is!
(Paraphrased from “Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid”)
*****
Hoped I did.
To his credit, I think I spent on the order of $3.50 for James’s lunch. He must be glad to help his country help its Vets. Does he support the Bush repudiation of Vets benefits? What kind of jerk is James? Simple answer: A Kansas jerk – like Brownback, like Roberts, et al…
======================================
DANCE PUPPET DANCE!!!
(chortles)
mom
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:09 pm | Permalink
When did Obama smear Hillary Clinton? I’ve heard nothing but gracious and kind remarks made by Obama in regards to Hillary. Today Obama stated that Hillary and he agreed on about 99% of the issues. So how is that smearing her?
___________
Good post, mom! Hopefully, in a few days things will simmer down and many will understand the seriousness of this political period.
I’ll let the rest of you fight it out. Just remember that bitterness and hate will eat away at you until there’s nothing left.
I have said Rox that I think Senator Clinton is being bullied. You may trust me to vet that out.
I DO think WS proves my point with his post…
“Either get behind the nominee or get out of the Party.
Easy.
One or the other.”
Senator Clinton MAY be bullied into supporting Obama so that she can do her own good.
I am not so restricted.
Obama faces lingering divide in Democratic Party
Democratic Party elders who hoped the emergence of a presidential nominee would end the bitter divisions of the primary race got a startling reality check Wednesday.
One day after Barack Obama clinched the nomination, supporters loyal to Hillary Clinton kept up the fight and in some cases antagonized Obama and his campaign.
Even as more than a dozen superdelegates drifted to the Illinois senator Wednesday, Clinton backers flooded the office of one Obama supporter on Capitol Hill with threatening calls and some urged other Clinton-ites to shift their support to presumptive GOP nominee John McCain.
Meanwhile, bloggers on Obama’s Web page and major liberal Web sites threw charges and slurs at Clinton for refusing to concede the race Tuesday night in New York City.
“Hillary Showed No Class!” read one headline on Obama’s community blogs page.
The strife among supporters underscores the challenge ahead for Obama and Democratic leaders working to bridge the party divide in their quest to galvanize voters on a message of hope and change, and take back the White House.
Clinton could ease some of that tension Friday, when she is expected to drop out of the race and endorse Obama.
But supporters on both sides of the Democratic fence almost immediately began drawing a line in the sand Tuesday over what likely will be the big question facing Obama over the next few months: whether he should tap Clinton to be his running mate.
If there’s middle ground on the issue, it was hard to see Wednesday.
Former President Jimmy Carter, now an Obama supporter, told the Guardian’s Weekend magazine that picking Clinton “would be the worst mistake that could be made.”
Meanwhile, Clinton supporter Bob Johnson, founder of Black Entertainment Television, wrote the Congressional Black Caucus asking its members to urge Obama to place Clinton on the ticket.
Clinton supporter Lanny Davis also was circulating an online petition pushing for the joint ticket, saying such a match-up would be “unbeatable.” In an interview with FOX News he denied that Clinton was bullying her way into the No. 2. slot.
CBC spokeswoman Keiana Barrett told FOX News, though, that the caucus “is not considering any appeal and will support Senator Obama’s right to make his own selection; like all other nominees have done in the past.”
Obama named a three-person team to spearhead the vice presidential search Wednesday. And the campaign is tight-lipped about whether they’d seriously consider the overtures for Clinton to be his running mate.
The campaign was also tight-lipped about Clinton’s refusal to concede after the final two primaries Tuesday night. Obama said simply that she was “understandably focused on her supporters.”
But she stunned Obama supporters and several Democratic strategists by not acknowledging his historic achievement.
While Clinton extended her congratulations to Obama for running what she called an “extraordinary race” Tuesday night, her address almost took the tone of a victory speech, rather than a concession, as she talked up her supposed popular vote advantage. At one point, supporters started to cheer “Denver! Denver!” — a nod from them that she should take her fight to the August convention.
Democratic strategist Bob Beckel said whoever made the call to not recognize Obama’s delegate majority Tuesday night was “stupid,” and he said she effectively jeopardized her chances at being the No. 2 by doing so.
After Obama’s victory, there was some scuttlebutt about Clinton backers breaking for McCain.
Cristi Adkins, of the newly formed Clintons for McCain group, told FOX News she wants Clinton backers to throw their support behind McCain and not the presumptive Democratic nominee because they have more in common.
“I can fairly comfortably give all of my passion over to McCain should Hillary Clinton be bullied out of the White House,” she said.
“I look out for my children and I fear Senator Obama. He wants change, what kind of change is that?” she said, adding that it’s going to be “very challenging” for Obama to pick up Clinton supporters.
Obama will have fence-mending to do with Clinton supporters, especially women voters.
Amid all the talk about a first black president, many women are deeply disappointed, in some cases furious, that Clinton’s own historic campaign fell short and that Obama’s campaign undercut her along the way.
Obama himself must heal the rift with women, said Clinton fundraiser Susie Buell of San Francisco, or a new brand of “stay-at-home moms” might sit out the election.
“I know that women are very worked up right now,” she said. Obama “has never apologized for the way Hillary has been treated.”
Emotions boiled over at last weekend’s televised meeting of a Democratic Party rules committee, when some women chanted “McCain ‘08? after the Clinton team lost its bid to win more disputed delegates from Michigan.
Many party insiders believe that, over time, most Clinton supporters will decide that a reluctant vote for Obama is better than a spiteful vote for McCain. Still, polls underscore Obama’s challenge.
FOX News exit polls from the South Dakota Democratic primary — where Clinton scored her final victory of the campaign Tuesday — showed that 30 percent of voters there would be dissatisfied with Obama as their nominee.
Healing the wounds will require a strong endorsement by Clinton of the man who beat her, says Sen. Claire McCaskill, D-Mo., one of Obama’s most prominent female supporters. And the reality of the presidential stakes will sink in, too, she says.
“As time passes and everyone begins focusing on the differences between John McCain and Barack Obama,” she said, “I think the medicine is going to be a little easier to swallow. But right now I think it’s really hard for these women.”
House Majority Whip James Clyburn, S.C., also said Wednesday that his office has been deluged with angry phone calls from people identifying themselves as Clinton supporters.
Clyburn, who endorsed Obama Tuesday, told FOX News Radio there were racial overtones in the calls and that some of the callers used “names that I would not repeat on this show today.” He said some threatened to “sabotage this election.”
He later told FOX News that “there are a lot of immature people in this country, and those of us who are mature are going to have to work that much harder to overcome that.”
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said Wednesday that Obama is the clear nominee, and that it’s time to “rally around” him. Other Democratic leaders on Capitol Hill made a strong call for party unity.
Washington Rep. Adam Smith, an Obama supporter, told FOX News there was absolutely no bad blood between Obama and Clinton.
“We’re rather happy this morning,” he said. “We have secured the nomination. There is no consternation whatsoever about what Senator Clinton said last night.”
FOX News’ Aaron Bruns and Chad Pergram and The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Former President Jimmy Carter, now an Obama supporter, told the Guardian’s Weekend magazine that picking Clinton “would be the worst mistake that could be made.”
JIMMEH!!!!!!!
“I DO think WS proves my point with his post…”
And take your sick, lame pony with you, J R, you are not needed in the Democratic Party.
Loser.
And on that very happy note, I am out of here for the night.
And J R, please work on the scenario, absent Obama dropping out, how Clinton is going to “WIN” the nomination.
We will be waiting to hear this story……………………………………
Psssssssssssssstttttttttttt – Red Wings rule!!!!!
Sigh….
I’ll say it. Someone has to.
WS is our own sides version of the pariah that is James “Regular”.
Are they the same person? I don’t know.
Barack Obama is NOT going to be President. Funny in a way. He and his supporters have killed his candidacy on the cusp of his “nomination”.
Regular,
How long have they been saying they should ignore you now? It must be years.
LOL
:cool:
nathan and james, such a sweet couple… Are they kissing in a tree? Up to you to decide.
Steven,
You can’t even take your own advice or follow your own plea to ignore Regular!
At least take your medication.
I have said Rox that I think Senator Clinton is being bullied. You may trust me to vet that out.
Please do, JR. I don’t think Senator Clinton is bully-able, but I’m open to proof that she is. She’s a tough lady (not a slam) and an exceptional Senator.
And to be honest, I think you and WS have “bullied” each other, day after day. While I understand the kind of passion you both show for your candidates, I’m tiring of the nastiness. It’s uncalled for, from both of you. It’s how I expect the “Cons” to act. ;)
WSClark
Posted June 4, 2008 at 11:55 pm | Permalink
“You know, some zippo papers”
Eh, Zig Zag.
And J R, please leave the Party – you are NOT a true Democrat – fair weather Democrats are asked to leave politely.
Unless they won’t go – then we kick their sorry asses out
————-
Geez that sounds a lot like Bush’s policies. I’m this party, like it or not, just as much as you are. And you will NOT WIN WITHOUT US.
Here is the thing, you took the presidency away from us, but you won’t take Hillary out of the number 2 or you will pay dearly. Its pretty simple. And if you think that we’re being stubborn, if you recall, we also were stubborn in the beating down Bush because of his misbegotten war.
We won’t shut up. And we’re not just going to hang our heads and say oh I guess we’ll go here now.
No, it’s the ones like us with this kind of fortitude that will get us out of the war, will keep republicans from bullying us in the senate and house. We’re NOT republican-lite.
And sorry KFG, but there is no way I’m leaving my party when a 3rd party is a sure loser.
Regular’s comment is the most dead on article I’ve read so far.
political mama
I continue to hope that Hillary will make a fight of it. She’s come back from worse.
But when people who are supposed to be your friends turn on you and tell you to shut up and sing…or else?
IF Senator Clinton is not the nominee, I hope you will consider at least advocating with me and kfg for voting third party. In Kansas, that really is the best way for us to make any sort of difference. For myself, I will be leaving the Kansas Democratic party today. I don’t see a dime’s worth of difference between obama and Karl Rove.
Oh and don’t worry. obama is gonna lose in a landslide if he mugs his way into this.
“Here is the thing, you took the presidency away from us”
With all due respect, (sincerely) P Mom, just how did “we” do that? The stage for the first Democratic debate was pretty full, Clinton had the same opportunity as the others.
She lost. How is that “taking the presidency away?”
WS, it started out well enough, the party elders, the ‘anyone but Hillary’ dems who thought that Hillary couldn’t, the black vote, and the media. That is who.
Pre, you want to know how big a Hillary supporter I am?
Not as much as I support Cynthia McKinney. I didnt even know she was running until last week. I would have easily supported her over Hillary. I know you all think I’m crazy, but I have been screwed over so many times by the Democrats, that ONLY Hillary could have brought me back to the party.
I dont buy this “go with what you’ve got, not what you want”. Gay folks have done that for a hell of a long time, and what has it gotten us? DOMA, DADT, and a slew of states that institutionalized bigotry. And during the hate amendment fight in Kasnas, the kdp was as big an obstacle as the ksgop.
I think “going with what you got” gets us what we got.
Bush.
But, if you want to believe that there really is a difference between democrats and republicans, that is your right. As someone who’s been in the trenches for over thirty years, I can tell you that is just SOMA.
Until you and others stand up to your party and say “no more tweedle dee and tweedle dumb” you will continue to suffer the consequences.
For you, those consequences might be just inconvenient. For me?
It’s my life.
The democrats will nominate someone who successfully convinced us he’s not Hillary.
Now, you better hope he can win in November by saying “I’m not bush”.
It appears it’s all he’s got. Democrats tried that in 04. I hope it works better for you this year.
P_Mom and JR,
Obama won more delegates. The people voted for him. How is that stealing?
Farmie,
Isn’t Cynthia McKinney the one who assaulted the police? Did she pull the race card? I know she didn’t have her pin and thought she should be recognized anyway…
Yup, she’s the one. Good appology though.
“There should not have been any physical contact in this incident,” McKinney said.
“I am sorry that this misunderstanding happened at all, and I regret its escalation and I apologize,” she said surrounded by colleagues on the House floor.
http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/04/06/mckinney/index.html
“WS, it started out well enough, the party elders, the ‘anyone but Hillary’ dems who thought that Hillary couldn’t, the black vote, and the media.”
Yes, and all of this should have been anticipated by the Senator and her campaign staff. Hillary entered the primary season with the highest negatives of all the candidates and the “Bill Baggage.” She may have been the presumed front runner, but it was obvious from the beginning that people were looking for an alternative to another Clinton White House. Clinton fatigue was/is very real.
Hillary Clinton’s failure was in not recognizing these issues and not addressing them upfront. Both she and Bill were way too overconfident and that cost them the nomination.
“Isn’t Cynthia McKinney the one who assaulted the police? Did she pull the race card? I know she didn’t have her pin and thought she should be recognized anyway…”
Right, she thinks she’s so important everybody is to not only recognize her but allow her to bend and break rules. When she doesn’t get her way she throws a tantrum, and needs to be physically and verbally restrained.
She was the ape that when questioning the oil execs. she sounded as if she was having a stroke or was on pills. She couldn’t get her words out and then became frustrated, angry and threatening towards those witnesses. It was hilarious as they just sat there just looking at her wild eyed as if expecting her to spontaneously combust into flames shooting out of that crazy hairdo.
She’s a goon!
“She was the ape that when questioning the oil execs.”
Wow, sexist, homophobic AND racist! The ape? Woof.
Boxlick hit the bigot trifecta!
And CF, how long did you think it would take before someone whined about her hair?
Just seeing boxlick’s head explode ought to be enough reason to vote for her!
IIRC, Cynthia has been convicted of nothing.
unlike scooter libby…
“Wow, sexist, homophobic AND racist!”
Dang, that’s hard to do in just one sentence – the bigot triple play!
Doesn’t happen often in baseball or real life.
It usually gets a standing ovation.
The one in baseball, not the bigot version.
That one usually gets the “Bronx cheer.”
So much for the election being about “issues”.
If you so called progressives looked at Cynthia’s postions on the issues, and the Green Party’s position on issues, it would be helpful.
Unless the cult of obama charge is true?
The Green Party cant win only because YOU say it cant win.
And the sheeple sleep…
…and isnt it interesting that the Green Party chose Cynthia McKinney over Ralph Nader?
Uh oh, someone is going to get their shoes stolen…
“Uh oh, someone is going to get their shoes stolen…”
Translation please?
Pre, you want to know how big a Hillary supporter I am?
I think I have a clue, KFG. ;) And that’s not a problem for me. If you feel you need to vote for McKinney, so be it. Just be sure you’re doing it with an open mind and without malice. Not that I believe you aren’t.
Just think, all, we started out with how many candidates? 16 by my count. And all we could have (of dem or rep) was 2. That means there are probably a lot of people who aren’t able to vote for the candidate they originally wanted. That’s nothing new. Happens all the time. So should all those people NOT vote for one or the other left?
While it would be wonderful to have at least one viable third party, I don’t see it happening. Not in my lifetime, anyway. But, please, surprise me! I’ve never felt the government of this country was set up with more than 2 parties in mind. I could be wrong. I didn’t get to talk with the Founding Fathers, so I can only guess. That doesn’t mean it isn’t worth a try to have one/some.
I simply don’t want to see another 4 years like the past 8 have been. I want the U.S. to once again be respected by the world. There’s no way we can lead if everyone hates us. Otherwise, we’ll only be leading ourselves into obscurity and maybe a chapter in the history books. Fall of the Roman Empire, anyone?
“If you so called progressives looked at Cynthia’s postions on the issues, and the Green Party’s position on issues, it would be helpful.”
Does the Green party believe 9/11 was an inside job like you do?
Ws you just turn your back on the candidate that is most hated by the cons. Clinton fatigue is made up by people like you, who seem to not understand how much the Clintons did for America. Ungrateful.
She lost. My guy lost. My guy won’t even get a spot at the convention. The GOP changes the rules every time an RP deligate gets elected.
I don’t hate anyone for it. I don’t hope that the other guy loses.
I just see a lot of hate and alienation from the Clinton supporters. Shame.
“Ws you just turn your back on the candidate that is most hated by the cons. Clinton fatigue is made up by people like you, who seem to not understand how much the Clintons did for America. Ungrateful.”
Point one – I never turned my back on Hillary Clinton, I supported another candidate. If she had won – and I stated this many times – I would have supported and campaigned for her.
She didn’t win.
“who seem to not understand how much the Clintons did for America. Ungrateful.”
I know what the Clintons have done for America, I have followed their careers and supported them for many years.
I also know how divisive Bill Clinton’s presidency was for the country and how a Hillary presidency would have been more of the same.
I also know that Bill Clinton earned the title of “the Best Republican President Ever.”
“Clinton fatigue is made up by people like you”
Clinton fatigue is very real, it is not made up. There are millions of people that, while they appreciate the contributions of the Clintons, would just as soon they go away.
A lot of Democrats are just sick and tired of defending the actions of Bill and Hillary Clinton. I am one of them.
The country has been horribly divided for nearly thirty years. Our problems are huge. We need to come together as a country – as we did during World War II – in order to solve these problems or risk becoming a much lesser nation.
We cannot continue down the same path and expect to arrive at a different destination. We need a new approach, not the same old partisan divisions.
That is not to say that the Democrats should acquiesce to Republican demands – and we won’t – but it does mean that we need all Americans to solve our issues, not just those that have a “D” behind their names.
Well put WSClark.
You turn your back on the person who has done the most for America, not just the democratic party, and look at what all those good deeds earned, vitriol on the part of the republicans. That is a SLAP IN THE FACE to call him a ‘republican’.
I happened to LIKE life under the Clintons, and yes you are ungrateful. You let them win- they got rid of the person that they felt was the biggest threat to them. Good for you, weenie. Oh dear, they don’t like our stance, I guess we’ll just bow down to their demands now.
I will never forgive Republicans for what they have done, not to the Clintons, not to AMERICA. And you think they’re going to be any better to Obama HAHAHA.
“That is a SLAP IN THE FACE to call him a ‘republican’.”
I didn’t invent the term, thank you.
“Good for you, weenie.”
Well, thank you, I take back the comment “with all due respect (sincerely)”
“Oh dear, they don’t like our stance, I guess we’ll just bow down to their demands now.”
And I stated just the opposite, but, whatever.
See ya’.
Oh yeah, and you have no social skills either Political Mama!
Ha! Take that!
LOL
You let them win
Shame on you Mr. Clark. You let them win…
“The country has been horribly divided for nearly thirty years.”
Uh huh.
What are you prepared to give away to get the cons to play nice?
What is obama ready to trade off?
This country is divided BECAUSE of the Republicans. You don’t fix it by working with them. You work them over.
And in the Senate and House we will still have that chance. They can roll right over John McCain. obama would probably take sides against his own to be bipartisan.
You don’t fix it by working with them. You work them over.
Maybe it is an attitude like this that made you and your candidate losers.
Obama beat Clinton. He won against THE most difficult, THE most qualified opponent he will face!
No one cheated, no one stole anything.
McCain will be a cake walk compared to what he’s accomplished.