SEOUL, South Korea (CNN) — North Korea cut off dialogue with South Korea on Thursday, claiming the peninsula was on the brink of another war.
North Korea is taking aim at South Korea, claiming the peninsula is on the brink of another war.
North Korea also accused South Korea of driving their relationship to “confrontation and catastrophe.” The country said it was stopping dialogue after South Korea failed to apologize for remarks one of its generals made this week.
The general said South Korea would attack suspected nuclear weapons sites in North Korea if the North tried to attack the South with atomic bombs.
The communist nation said it would take unspecified “military actions” to punish South Korea.
NEW YORK (AP) — Maybe men had it right all along: It doesn’t take long to satisfy a woman in bed.
It’s difficult for men of all ages to make sexual intercourse last much longer, a psychologist says.
A survey of sex therapists concluded the optimal amount of time for sexual intercourse was 3 to 13 minutes. The findings, to be published in the May issue of the Journal of Sexual Medicine, strike at the notion that endurance is the key to a great sex life.
If that sounds like good news to you, don’t cheer too loudly. The time does not count foreplay, and the therapists did rate sexual intercourse that lasts from 1 to 2 minutes as “too short.”
“I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.”
. . . candidate Obamanation, on prodding his
daughters, age 9 and 6, into abortion mills, should they become pregnant through fornication [or perhaps even through later marriage]
[Obamanation is on record in a survey of the Illinois Senate as opposing parental notification and parental consent for secretive abortions. He appears woefully ignorant of the likely severe, long-term, punishing effects of abortion on young mothers, such as depression, substance abuse, suicide, and sexual aberrations.]
- - -
Disgraced former AG Morrison was also stiffing
attorney Don McKinney for the payment under his
contract for investigating abortionist quack George Tiller in 2007, figuring no other attorney would then take a contract to investigate criminal abortionist quacks and then also get stiffed for the payment.
Now attorney McKinney has most of his payment.
- - -
Amongst other rolling heads targeted by pro-lifers, the Executive Director of the Kansas State Board of Healing Arts, Larry Buening, turned in his blinders and resigned Wednesday amid increasing calls for his ouster. Buening tendered his resignation, effective July 1, at a special meeting of the Board that was called to address concerns of ineptitude (like refusing to take any action at all on dangerous quacks threatening public health and safety, like covering up abortion mill crimes and botched abortion deaths) in handling high profile cases.
Quickly thereafter, BOHA’s General Counsel Mark
Stafford also turned in his blinders and announced
plans to step down June 1.
- - -
“Dr. Moreau: What is the law?
Sayer of the Law: Not to go on all fours, that is the law. Are we not men?
Beasts (in unison): Are we not men?
Dr. Moreau: What is the law?
Sayer of the Law: Not to spill blood, that is the law. Are we not men?
Beasts (in unison): Are we not men?”
. . . H. G. Wells, “The Island of Dr. Moreau”
. . .
Newcastle University in England is now manufacturing living chimera embryos for destructive testing, using cow eggs and implanted human DNA. So far, implantation and birth has not been reported - but there is no denying that such “research” might be considered more productive by the “scientific community” if it were carried that far - and perhaps further. And how can limitations be enforced, if the “subjects” are not fully human?
How’s your YUCK factor?
- - -
“Slaves were considered a commodity to do with
whatever the vested interests of the day decided.
Today, in our desire to play God in our embryology
experimentation, with all its’ unfulfilled promises of miracle cures, and our decision to abort unwanted children, we are no better than those slave traders who put their interests and world view higher than they placed the sanctity and value of human life.”
. . . Gerard Wilberforce, great, great grandson of successful British anti-slavery campaigner William Wilberforce
- - -
Employees of a Hartford, CT laundry found a dead
stillborn baby among the hospital linens they were
washing Monday.
- - -
A 14-year-old Baytown, TX teenager at Cedar Bayou Jr. High School on Wednesday gave birth in the toilet of a middle school but the full-term baby died when the mother tried to flush the crying infant away.
No news report yet on whether the rapist knows his
newborn baby was murdered by this eighth-grader who concealed her pregnancy.
Remember folks, Parkay’s people will be trying to appoint the next Kansas Board of Healing Arts director, I would’nt be suprised if his folks didn’t have a hand in this guy’s resignation.
If you think they wield no power, think again. And if that scares the pee out of you, Join ProKanDo.
Nevermind I found it- it’s in a clinton thread. THat’s what happens when teh Open thread gets shut down and we’ve gotta go under other headings to have a dang conversation.
I propose that the WE editors just remove the offending comments instead of closing down the Open threads.
Saw what I suspect were illegal immigrants yesterday. I was driving past a construction area, and noticed a lot more hispanics than I normally see in town. Watched about a dozen workers pile out of one van. Stopped to run an errand nearby. When I came out a couple from the same group were working the landscaping areas in front of this office building. Across the street, they others were up on a roof maybe putting down shingles, I don’t know.
Anyway, I was suspicious - they were all bantering back and forth even from across the street in Spanish (I had two years of it in college so I can recognize the lingo). Sure was glad it was them doing the manual labor and not me.
Then I remembered my own family history. Our family historian provided us records of our earliest American relatives coming to America as indentured servants from northern Europe. Upon first hearing about this, I thought it was BS, white folk weren’t slaves. But then I learned that nearly half of white immigrants to North America in the 17th and 18th centuries were indentured servant s. My ancestors worked seven years, basically as slave farm laborers in Virginia before being eligible for freedom. Something happened, and they got in debt to the land owners and ended up working ten years before gaining freedom and moving west.
I thought about how so many of all our ancestors took the difficult journey leaving their homelands to travel by primitive ships - in the holds of the ship to come to American. How hard it must have been leaving their families
for the unknown. How difficult to live in slavery. How bad were the living and working conditions these early Americans endured? And later the joy of gaining their freedom, and the hard and long journey west. Even later,
the records reveal early settlers in Kansas with our family name - working as laborers yet again, for other farmers and ranchers in Kansas.
I was reminded about how our ancestors, signed their lives away and agreed to work basically as slaves to earn their freedom in America. Records at Ellis Island reveal millions like them. These hard-working self-sufficient men and women help build the great foundation of our nation. I was reminded that these same people did not get any handouts upon their arrival. They were doused for lice after getting off the ships and released to their landlords. They were lucky to get a meal. And medical care? Unheard of.
So as I got back into my car and started the engine I felt a sense of pride in the tradition these hispanic’s were fulfilling in their role today working as slave labor for Kansas businesses. I knew the nation would go on to great things based upon their hard work and eagerness to improve their lot in life. I also remembered how our Kansas State Legislature helped ensure today’s illegals remain “off the books” and in hiding working for peanuts in
the rain, heat, and snow so real Americans could make a profit off them. So I momentarily had a great sense of respect and admiration for the efforts of these probably illegal aliens. But then I remembered they are still
getting social benefits, contributing to the numbers of Americans without healthcare, and getting to attend state university paying resident rates and eligible for college assistance funding. As I departed, I had to stop
at a stop light right next to where one group was toiling away. With my window open, my Hybrid makes
not a sound with the engine stopped while at the light. So I could hear them laughing and shouting at each other with playful insults.
OH boy, more making a simple statement into a holier then thou issue. Obama said last week while talking about sex education. That first he would teach his daughters moral values. But that he realized they also needed to be taught the facts and reality of sexual activity. He said he would not want his daughters punished with an unwanted pregnancy or a STD at 16.
Just now on the Congress floor a rep citied a “presidential candidate” for thinking a Grandchild as a “punishment”. Then went on to say that the opposing party has so little respect for life that they would consider a child as a Punishment!
NOW back to reality! I considered my self fortunate that my daughter was 19 when I got that call. Why did I consider myself fortunate? Because at the same time, my neighbor was informed that his daughter was pregnant. His daughter was 15! In my lifetime I have personally been exposed to three families that upon finding out their daughter in her teen years became pregnant. And the results were not seen as a joyous occasion, they kicked their daughter out! Sending their teenage daughter out into the cold, pregnant and alone.
And yes they were Conservative, fundamental Christians. Neither has Obama or the Democratic Party has advocated such responses.
Ladies and Gentlemen, this rep and his ilk is playing to you, he thinks you are so stupid that rather then attack a policy or a plan put forth. He wishes you to look at a shiny object and not think! And yes this is for my Republican brothers and sisters, when will we finally let those whom would think we are so weak minded. KNOW we are not, there are more of us and unless they have us pegged and we really are that weak minded. Such actions only weaken the party and end up with us having guilt by association.
Sol, you seem overly happy about the sex timing thing. Just saying.
I’m really glad the American people are waking up to the republicans and gonna kick em all to the curb. That’s not JUST the president, but all who staunchly support him.
Now, since the bible and koran are so similar in this, seems to me that the guy would be written off as a psycho since that’s what we do here when people say and do things like that.
We don’t assign the whole Christian religion as bad because of some who abuse.
Lots of good comparisons in that site there.
Make sure to read the ‘human sacrifice’ part.
ksfarmgrrl
Posted April 2, 2008 at 8:16 am | Permalink
Sounds eerily similar to the taliban christians, no?”
God is the same god, both for the Old and New Testament.
How he deals with his creation is different between the Old and New Testament.
I do not believe that God condones or approves rape, murder or human sacrifice at any time.
God will and often has allowed evil to occur as part of His eternal plan of which we as humans cannot understand or have not been given understanding of.
“I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.”
Upon examination, I believe the republicans are making a mountain out of mole hill on this one. They will end looking stupid as that “vast rightwing of Christiandom” does not exist anymore.
And even where it does, common sense prevails.
Of course Obama will not think his grandchildren to be a punishment. Of course babies come into this world “by mistake” everyday. Only a few of us are honest enough to admit that to even our OWN children. And of course, that does NOT take one iota from the love, attention, and devotion we still have for our children.
Everytime Obama makes a statement, someone is quick to read into it. I believe he was making a rational comment on children having sex and birth control. He also was advocating keeping communications open with your children.
1. Teach your children that abstinance is best.
2. Do not engage in sexual relations casually.
3. If you do, use protection (STD’s and contraceptives).
4. Finally, if you do get pregnant, what are your options.
But having babies sometimes IS a mistake.
The guy was being honest and republicans are trying to make something of it.
Can’t we get back to the issues? Can’t we beat him up for being a slimy liberal socialist sucking worm?
It is one thing to reaad an Old Testament story about a war type situation where entire cities are killed/massacred…. It is another thing when the Old Testament story is quite adamant about God ORDERING such destruction of men, women, children, and even all the animals! There is at least ONE story in the Old Testament, when the armies of God’s people are punished by God for NOT killing all living things in a city!! Those things need to be addressed by the so-called “Apologists”
To say that the Old testament is nothing to Christians, when it’s part of the bible, part of the history of THEIR GOD, it is amazing to me that you all pick and choose the pieces from there that you want. Did we NOT just have a big todo on the ten commandments in our public buildings? And who made the most about that? The evangelicals.
SO right….you can’t just disregard sections of the bible when it is convenient to do so. And without the Old Testament, there is no basis to believe that Christ was really God’s son.
doesn’t it make FAR more sense that the whole thing is a farce?
The same God that was brutal and believed in rape, murder and sacrifice, is the exact same god you believe in today. He evolves and changes or he doesn’t.
Take your pick. If he doesn’t evolve and change, then it’s highly likely that Phred Phelps is the true believer. And no thanks.
Hateful killing rape and murder in the name of God for Christianity. There ya go.
“Political_mama
Posted April 3, 2008 at 9:17 am | Permalink
To say that the Old testament is nothing to Christians, when it’s part of the bible, part of the history of THEIR GOD, it is amazing to me that you all pick and choose the pieces from there that you want. Did we NOT just have a big todo on the ten commandments in our public buildings? And who made the most about that? The evangelicals.
SO right….you can’t just disregard sections of the bible when it is convenient to do so. And without the Old Testament, there is no basis to believe that Christ was really God’s son.
doesn’t it make FAR more sense that the whole thing is a farce?”
The Old Testament lays the ground work for Christianity, but Chritians did not come onto the scene until after the first coming of Christ.
Are there things in the Old Testament that are bad or we do not understand?
PMama — Excellent point!! We used to refer to that as the Chinese Restaurant method of Bible interpretation… One from Column A — One from Column B — etc., etc. Till you have all the entrees you want… Then call it, “The Bible Says”
By the way, just so you know, I always knew those passages were in there. Remember I was raised in a fundy religion. I always had trouble remedying how Satan got these people’s souls and that they could have saved themselves from such a fate. It’s a lot to ask of a mere human to have so much that is sinful and leading on the path to death against something you can’t even see. I guess that’s how the JW’s rectified it in their minds, that God would’nt put anyone to hell for eternity for simple disobedience, thus no hell for them.
Also they made it so there was NO doubt, upon judgement that one would know the true lord…so anyone that was like me, could still be saved in the end. Plays into that whole just and loving god ideal.
The whole premise is that our lives on earth are merely a test, a drama, we’re puppets to a grand puppet master, bowing to his will of bizarre social obediences. And we believe this based on something written in darn near the stone age.
Is there anything that we believe today that came from the stone age times? Isn’t it time we evolved?
I mean come on, how long is the second coming going to actually take?
Gee if you are going to get all personal and all I have things to do… Later and love you girl! I have things to haul to the dump so of course its rain here! Happens every year….
Police: Man Had Sex With Picnic Table
Anonymous Tip Led Police To Arrest
POSTED: 2:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
UPDATED: 3:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
BELLEVUE, Ohio — Police said an Ohio man has been arrested for allegedly having sex with a picnic table.
Police arrested Arthur Price Jr. after an anonymous tipster dropped off three DVDs that reportedly showed Price in the act.
According to NBC Toledo, Ohio, affiliate WNWO-TV, the videos show Price tilting the metal round picnic table on its side and then laying up against it to have sexual intercourse with the table. Afterward, he can then be seen cleaning the table and the deck.
During questioning, he reportedly admitted to having sex with the table. Police said he also admitted to bringing the table inside his home for sex.
Price faces four counts of public indecency. He was freed after posting $20,000 bond, authorities said.
Obviously, the Bible is a historical document that was written over many millenia.
One can see the Old Testament YHWH evolving from a single powerful god among many gods–like a Hebrew Zeus–YHWH himself addresses these other gods when he says, “Ye are all Gods and Sons of Gods.”
The ancient Hebrews like every ancient human society one can find once practiced human sacrifice–the story of Abraham and Issac is the lesson that forms the turning point that YHWH will accept animal sacrifice.
By the time of the New Testament–2000-3000 years later–even animal sacrifice had fallen into disuse.
If one refuses to see the Bible as living document that changes in response to people’s understanding of God (like the willfully ignorant fundamentalists do), then one will have a perverse and twisted view of God’s word.
“Grateful_Dave
Posted April 3, 2008 at 9:29 am | Permalink
I wonder what the bible has to say about this:
Police: Man Had Sex With Picnic Table
Anonymous Tip Led Police To Arrest
POSTED: 2:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
UPDATED: 3:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
BELLEVUE, Ohio — Police said an Ohio man has been arrested for allegedly having sex with a picnic table.
Police arrested Arthur Price Jr. after an anonymous tipster dropped off three DVDs that reportedly showed Price in the act.
According to NBC Toledo, Ohio, affiliate WNWO-TV, the videos show Price tilting the metal round picnic table on its side and then laying up against it to have sexual intercourse with the table. Afterward, he can then be seen cleaning the table and the deck.”
…..
Have you looked in the bible to see what is says?
During questioning, he reportedly admitted to having sex with the table. Police said he also admitted to bringing the table inside his home for sex.
Price faces four counts of public indecency. He was freed after posting $20,000 bond, authorities said.
“By the time of the New Testament–2000-3000 years later–even animal sacrifice had fallen into disuse.”
Not totally, CapN — Cf. Luke 2 — Mary and Joseph made sacrifice at the Jerusalem Temple, at the birth of Jesus.
The LAST of the Human Sacrifices, in the NT, is Jesus on the Cross… The perfect sacrifice for ALL time… The ending of the Law, as it were. As Jesus says from the Cross: It Is Finished!
“Having a baby may not have been planned, but it is never a mistake.”
Maybe AM of USA. I can easily see how Obama might have worded it better. If it’s a poor choice of words, it is still petty.
We told our children they were not planned. Their response, “You mean I was a mistake?” I’m sure I am not the first to have used the incorrect word on this particular issue.
Right, CapN — See the Gospel Reading for April 27 — JOHN 14:15-21…. Also, ALL of the references by Jesus to his coming back again, are BEFORE the Crucifixion… This has been a part of Christian History/Tradition for nearly 2,000 years now…
Outlander — In many ways, comparing Islam to Christianity is like comparing apples to oranges… They are both world religions… period… Apples and oranges — both are fruit… period
Yes, they do, more or less, PMama — However, by the time Islam began to expand, Christianity was already pretty much established around the Mediterranean Sea, and even beyond.
Historically, the Bible (Old and New) is estimated to be only thousands of years old (about 6,000 to 7,000).
“Ye are all Gods and Sons of Gods”
What verse are you referring to?
“the story of Abraham and Issac is the lesson that forms the turning point that YHWH will accept animal sacrifice.
”
Animal sacrifice originated much earlier than that. The story of Abraham and Isaac is the lesson and foretelling of the first coming of Christ, with God teaching Abraham obedience in the potential sacrifice of Isaac. God later supplied the animal for the sacrifice. Animal sacrifice originated in Adams time once he realized that he was unclothed to provide for clothing from an animal.
More or less, CapN.. The money changers were CHEATING people on their currency exchange… At Passover, there were people from ALL over the known world in Jerusalem… The Money Changers werent being fair when weighing out coins and other “currency” using accurate weights, and thus cheating worshippers!! And Jesus was appalled that they would do such a thing in God’s Holy Place!!
“You accidentally pointed out what is wrong with newspapers–you only are in awe of those on the far left of the political spectrum. When your local newspaper has turned into the Obama Daily Worship and over 50% of the country thinks their editorial page consists of a bunch of aging hippies with issues, why pay to support such irrelevancies? The WaPo has declined into such a partisan rag, that the hundreds of people I know who have ceases subscribing always cite their bias. You just can’t get over yourselves, liberals. Not everyone agrees with you. You ruined newspapers.”
Dear Karen: When you say “aging hippies with issues” you’re talking about my people. Watch it. But you do note a defect in the kit: I didn’t mean to shortchange the conservative blogs. I regularly dip into National Review, Hugh Hewitt and the gaggle at TownHall, etc., and anyone who reads this blog knows that I link to conservative pundits as well as liberal ones. But I don’t think — correct me if I’m wrong — that Slate and Salon had conservative corollaries back in the 1990s.
Otherwise, the absurdity and sheer unreasonableness of your comment brings up another issue: A lot of folks on both the Right and the Left have declared, sanctimoniously, that the MSM is being punished for being too (pick one) liberal or conservative. In fact, Alterman peddles this theory, implicitly. But the financial fortunes of newspaper companies aren’t in any signficant way (says here) connected to the political leanings of the editorial board. Liberal papers, conservative papers, they all have the same issue, which is that they’re no longer positioned squarely between consumers and advertisers. [Insert protracted dissertation on Craigslist, struggling department stores that won't spring for display ads, rise of online media with lower ad revenue, etc.] What galls me — really frosts my hackles and gets my dander so far up it’s in the stratosphere — is the pervasive notion that political writing is our main editorial product. Ever actually picked up a newspaper? Notice how much stuff isn’t about McCain and Obama and Clinton? (Lately, at least a third of it.)
Abortion did not begin - and it will not end - with Barack Obama. What WILL end (or greatly reduce) abortion will be the following: 1) Individual responsibility; and 2) societal measures that will not render pregnancy untenable. (See the movie “Bella” for more on #2…..)
Casting Obama as the evil one probably isn’t accurate. Moreover, it (almost) prevented me from reading the entirety of your post. Stuffing a live, crying baby down a toilet is a monstrous act. And I suspect, given the age of the mother (14), that many were at fault, not excluding the mother. Incidents such as these raise very, very troubling questions - not only regarding the mother but about those surrounding her.
You seem to be connected - either directly or tangentially - to Operation Rescue. I know the Bible says to ignore the admonitions of unfruitful works of darkness, but I have a suggestion. Perhaps you might suggest that its leadership create a video showcasing its new offices.
That would probably be more efficacious than wondering whether Mr. McKinney got his twenty-five thou. Or what Mr. Obama will tell his pre-pubescent daughters about abortion.
But then, what do I know. I’m unfruitful; my outlook is frequently as dark and barren as Boy George’s bathhouse; and I’m one of those weaker vessels, too. So I guess I lose on all counts…….
But then, what do I know. I’m unfruitful; my outlook is frequently as dark and barren as Boy George’s bathhouse; and I’m one of those weaker vessels, too. So I guess I lose on all counts…….
we don’t feel that way about ya, songbird. And what were you dong in Boy George’s bathroom, and with whom?
Also, after Adam and Eve eat of the forbidden fruit, YHWH says in Genesis 3:22 “Behold, the man has become as one of us.”
Redactors and apologists over the millenia have tried to expunge these references to the pantheism of ancient Hebrews, but they never quite succeed, and the careful historical scholar can see the clues they leave behind vividly.
Ok, Cap’n, they just forgot the “eventually” part of the dying. Since the experiment was aborted, we’ll never know if Adam and Eve would have lived forever. If you think listening to her yammerin’ for 900 years was hell, can you imagine eternity? Maybe Eve didn’t partake first and Adam was just looking for an escape?
(ok, ladies, start throwing peanuts now)
It always saddens me to hear someone claim not to have faith.
Nano, you must understand, many have faith–just not in a book, not in some self-righteous hypocrit demanding 10% (like he’s an agent and god needs help finding talent), and not in any religion in general.
I just allude to B. George sometimes - ’cause back in the 1980s (when he fronted Culture Club) some people told me I looked like him.
Now, I’d much rather resemble Angelina Jolie (another comparison I used to hear long ago) - but what the hellola. People in Hades, er, HAYS - want ice water on a sweltering summer day, too…….
JUAN GONZALEZ: The Bush administration’s treatment of prisoners and interrogation methods is coming under increased scrutiny this week following the declassification of a 2003 memo. The memo shows the Justice Department told the Pentagon that presidential authority overrode numerous laws banning torture or cruel treatment of prisoners in US custody. The memo endorsed assault, maiming and even administering mind-altering drugs on prisoners.
AMY GOODMAN: Alberto Gonzales, Haynes and Addington and Yoo made up what Sands describes as Bush’s “torture team of lawyers.” Sands argues the actions of these lawyers might have amounted to war crimes and could result in their prosecution overseas.
“CapnAmerica
Posted April 3, 2008 at 10:37 am | Permalink
I never could quite figure out why the Old Testament God says, “don’t eat from the Tree of Knowledge, for of the day you eat, you will surely die.”
But the Serpent (Satan?) pops up and says, “nah, you won’t die.”
Turns out, the Serpent was right.
One can’t explain that if one reads it “literally.””
Ah, but the serpent was wrong.
He indeed, and those who do not confess the Name of Christ, has experienced or will be experiencing a spiritual death. It is just delayed from that time and not immediate.
A recent entry into the bowels of Hell, the arrival was puzzled by what he saw. Thousands of people in a large room standing on their head in a foul smelling human sewage pit, gurgling struggling to breathe.
The arrival walked to the next room and saw thousands of people standing in the foul sewage and but they were sipping coffee.
Satan comes up to the arrival and asked him if he had made up his mind which room he wanted to spend eternity in.
The arrival emphatically stated, “The room where they were drinking coffee!”
Suddenly, a demon appeared the ‘coffee’ room, clapped his hands and said, “Okay boys and girls, coffee break is over, back on your heads!”
We told our children they were not planned. Their response, “You mean I was a mistake?” I’m sure I am not the first to have used the incorrect word on this particular issue.
Next time, try “surprise”.
Even within a marriage, there are surprises. Oy vay, are there!
What would Charles Darwin say about instinct by some to kill their offspring?
Does terminating one’s progeny for the purpose of sustaining one’s financial standing or to avoid negative social stigma make that person more or less fit in light of Darwinistic evolution?
growing up my sister often tormented me about being a ‘mistake’. I was about 30 when she pulled the same in fron of my folks for the 1st time. My mom said, “are you kidding? You were the mistake. You think I wanted another kid 13 months after the last one?”
“Chas.Posted April 3, 2008 at 9:40 am | Permalink
“By the time of the New Testament–2000-3000 years later–even animal sacrifice had fallen into disuse.”
Not totally, CapN — Cf. Luke 2 — Mary and Joseph made sacrifice at the Jerusalem Temple, at the birth of Jesus.
The LAST of the Human Sacrifices, in the NT, is Jesus on the Cross… The perfect sacrifice for ALL time… The ending of the Law, as it were. As Jesus says from the Cross: It Is Finished!”
>>>>
I almost totally agree Chas!
Except that Christ fulfilled the Law. The Law is written on our hearts through accepting Christ.
“ghotiphaze
Posted April 3, 2008 at 10:49 am | Permalink
American o’ USA, I have this really neat bridge over the east river yu can have cheap. Only used on Sundays by a li’l ole lady from Pasadena.”
“SolDevVB
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:02 am | Permalink
He indeed, and those who do not confess the Name of Christ
How is it exactly that Adam or Eve knew of Christ?
How about all those tribes in South America and Africa that have never seen civilization much less a bible? Are the all damned to hell?
American Indians? Eskimos? All going to hell? What a great religion you have.”
>>>>>
The only answer I have for that is that only God knows the answer for sure.
In Old Testament times, Christ was present, as is revealed in the prophecies, but had not been revealed. Christ was present at the beginning and was the creator OF the creation.
About all those who have not been reached today, Christ is the only way to salvation, according to God’s Word, and man shares the responsibilty with God in the Great Commission in the Gospels to spread His Word to all people groups. So there is a burden upon man to play out his part in that, as a coworker of God, but not as the one accomplishing the goal of salvation.
Did the “sex with Table” man have a genetic disposition to being attracted to tables?
What about the “sex with dog” man?
I think it is a bit harsh to penalize people based upon the genetics with wich they are born. Such people were unfortunate to be stuck in a marriage with a human when they only wanted to be with tables and dogs.
I am not an atheist, but I know the Bible better than many Christians, having been brought up as a strict Lutheran and having had read the Bible cover to cover.
The best example I have is that Doug who posts here pretty often, I believe, is self-professed atheist, and he has a quite impressive knowledge of the Bible.
AQmer. USA, since the Law is fulfilled in Christ, as you mention, thus, the Law is NO MORE! A fulfilled contract (which is where that word originates) is a done deal… No more to be done on a fulfilled contract. In this case, the contract is fulfilled on behalf of ALL Creation, by the Sacrifice of Christ - once for all!
For too many folks, they keep wanting to crucify him all over again, for each new believer! The Sacrifice of Christ was for ALL people of all times and places. And I would add, even for those who have not KNOWN of it!
Because it was not accomplished by US, but by God. “By grace are we saved through faith; and that not of our own doing, for it is a gift of God.”
GRACE means UNmerited favor! WE can do nothing to achieve “salvation” — It has been done FOR US… UNmerited/UNdeserved/FREE GIFT… Hope that explains it!
The problem with insinuating people are going to hell for not believing in Christ smacks of many sins. The self-righteous RR thinks their religion is the one true religion; the Jews think their’s is, the Muslims think theirs is. And then there’s the rest of us who believe God is way smarter than all the religions put together, and live our lives as such.
Remember, “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone?” I got a feeling many of the stone throwers are going to get glass shards in their hair when all their glass houses come crashing down around them.
Another interesting thing about this blog is how many threads turn into religion threads - this very one being an example.
What is the benefit of discussing religion with people you don’t even know? I have always wondered about that.
One of my complaints about Nathan is that he insists upon “debating” on this blog about religion and faith. How can those subjects be debated? Especially the faith matter. You believe or you don’t — end of “debate”.
“WSClark
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:44 am | Permalink
I am not an atheist, but I know the Bible better than many Christians, having been brought up as a strict Lutheran and having had read the Bible cover to cover.”
“WSClark
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:35 am | Permalink
“My posts.”
I believe in God, I do not believe in the divinity of Jesus, I do not believe in religion, therefore I am not a Christian.”
>>>>
How can you say you do not believe in religion, but that you do believe in God?
The Bible can be debated over its meaning and context. Whether or not people believe it on the other hand won’t be changed by debate.
I believe that the Bible is true. And I accept that people do not agree with my belief. I will debate my faith in person with people I know and who actually know me. I will refrain doing so on a Blog since living your faith is much more expressive than arguing it’s intellectual merit anomynously.
“Chas.
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:46 am | Permalink
AQmer. USA, since the Law is fulfilled in Christ, as you mention, thus, the Law is NO MORE! A fulfilled contract (which is where that word originates) is a done deal… No more to be done on a fulfilled contract. In this case, the contract is fulfilled on behalf of ALL Creation, by the Sacrifice of Christ - once for all!
For too many folks, they keep wanting to crucify him all over again, for each new believer! The Sacrifice of Christ was for ALL people of all times and places. And I would add, even for those who have not KNOWN of it!
Because it was not accomplished by US, but by God. “By grace are we saved through faith; and that not of our own doing, for it is a gift of God.”
GRACE means UNmerited favor! WE can do nothing to achieve “salvation” — It has been done FOR US… UNmerited/UNdeserved/FREE GIFT… Hope that explains it!”
>>>>>
No, Christ does not need to be crucified again.
Yes, Christ fulfilled the law.
Is there still sin in the world? Yes!
Does the Spirit direct our lives to keep us from sinning and directing us to the law of Christ? Yes indeed!
Christ fulfilled the perfect law, because man could not, by placing the Holy Spirit in those who believe in Him!
Have all received salvation because of Christ’s death and resurrection without accepting Him? No!
What would be the point of that, if man was not involved, by accepting that perfect gift of eternal life with God?
Did Christ die in vain?
God desires that all men should COME to him!
First you must know God, and in knowing, then you must accept Him!
“How can you say you do not believe in religion, but that you do believe in God?”
Easy. I believe that there is a God, but I don’t need a religion to tell me about Him. I do not believe in the Christian, Jewish, Muslim or Hindu versions of God, nor in the tenants of their faiths.
“What would be the point of that, if man was not involved, by accepting that perfect gift of eternal life with God?
Did Christ die in vain?
God desires that all men should COME to him!
First you must know God, and in knowing, then you must accept Him!”
==================================
So you want to insist on having a part in the UNMerited Favor of God (Grace) And you want to tell God who should/shouldnt receive that UNMerited Favor of God??
Look, if it is UNMerited, that means UNdeserved. That means NOBODY but God has made the decision. John 3 says God so loved the COSMOS (Universe) I dont think inanimate objects can choose their beliefs. Paul says the whole Creation groans in travail, as one giving birth…
The key is GRACE — UNMerited Favor!! Thank GOD salvation is not up to any of us!
762 Comments
Is this thing on? (dmmmph dmmmph dmmmph) Can anyone har me?
Good mornin to ya Kansas
hear*
SEOUL, South Korea (CNN) — North Korea cut off dialogue with South Korea on Thursday, claiming the peninsula was on the brink of another war.
North Korea is taking aim at South Korea, claiming the peninsula is on the brink of another war.
North Korea also accused South Korea of driving their relationship to “confrontation and catastrophe.” The country said it was stopping dialogue after South Korea failed to apologize for remarks one of its generals made this week.
The general said South Korea would attack suspected nuclear weapons sites in North Korea if the North tried to attack the South with atomic bombs.
The communist nation said it would take unspecified “military actions” to punish South Korea.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/04/03/koreas.military/index.html
********************************************
Isn’t this fun?
And on the lighter side…
NEW YORK (AP) — Maybe men had it right all along: It doesn’t take long to satisfy a woman in bed.
It’s difficult for men of all ages to make sexual intercourse last much longer, a psychologist says.
A survey of sex therapists concluded the optimal amount of time for sexual intercourse was 3 to 13 minutes. The findings, to be published in the May issue of the Journal of Sexual Medicine, strike at the notion that endurance is the key to a great sex life.
If that sounds like good news to you, don’t cheer too loudly. The time does not count foreplay, and the therapists did rate sexual intercourse that lasts from 1 to 2 minutes as “too short.”
http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/personal/04/02/sex.survey.ap/index.html
“I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.”
. . . candidate Obamanation, on prodding his
daughters, age 9 and 6, into abortion mills, should they become pregnant through fornication [or perhaps even through later marriage]
[Obamanation is on record in a survey of the Illinois Senate as opposing parental notification and parental consent for secretive abortions. He appears woefully ignorant of the likely severe, long-term, punishing effects of abortion on young mothers, such as depression, substance abuse, suicide, and sexual aberrations.]
- - -
New sting You-Tube video is available showing Planned Parenthood in Ohio, New Mexico, and Oklahoma accepting phoned-in donations for the expressed purpose of killing black babies, to reduce the black population.
See news page
http://michellemalkin.com/2008/04/02/more-racist-planned-parenthood-clinics-exposed/
- - -
Disgraced former AG Morrison was also stiffing
attorney Don McKinney for the payment under his
contract for investigating abortionist quack George Tiller in 2007, figuring no other attorney would then take a contract to investigate criminal abortionist quacks and then also get stiffed for the payment.
Now attorney McKinney has most of his payment.
- - -
Amongst other rolling heads targeted by pro-lifers, the Executive Director of the Kansas State Board of Healing Arts, Larry Buening, turned in his blinders and resigned Wednesday amid increasing calls for his ouster. Buening tendered his resignation, effective July 1, at a special meeting of the Board that was called to address concerns of ineptitude (like refusing to take any action at all on dangerous quacks threatening public health and safety, like covering up abortion mill crimes and botched abortion deaths) in handling high profile cases.
Quickly thereafter, BOHA’s General Counsel Mark
Stafford also turned in his blinders and announced
plans to step down June 1.
- - -
“Dr. Moreau: What is the law?
Sayer of the Law: Not to go on all fours, that is the law. Are we not men?
Beasts (in unison): Are we not men?
Dr. Moreau: What is the law?
Sayer of the Law: Not to spill blood, that is the law. Are we not men?
Beasts (in unison): Are we not men?”
. . . H. G. Wells, “The Island of Dr. Moreau”
. . .
Newcastle University in England is now manufacturing living chimera embryos for destructive testing, using cow eggs and implanted human DNA. So far, implantation and birth has not been reported - but there is no denying that such “research” might be considered more productive by the “scientific community” if it were carried that far - and perhaps further. And how can limitations be enforced, if the “subjects” are not fully human?
How’s your YUCK factor?
- - -
“Slaves were considered a commodity to do with
whatever the vested interests of the day decided.
Today, in our desire to play God in our embryology
experimentation, with all its’ unfulfilled promises of miracle cures, and our decision to abort unwanted children, we are no better than those slave traders who put their interests and world view higher than they placed the sanctity and value of human life.”
. . . Gerard Wilberforce, great, great grandson of successful British anti-slavery campaigner William Wilberforce
- - -
Employees of a Hartford, CT laundry found a dead
stillborn baby among the hospital linens they were
washing Monday.
- - -
A 14-year-old Baytown, TX teenager at Cedar Bayou Jr. High School on Wednesday gave birth in the toilet of a middle school but the full-term baby died when the mother tried to flush the crying infant away.
No news report yet on whether the rapist knows his
newborn baby was murdered by this eighth-grader who concealed her pregnancy.
hmm, I must have been blessed to get really exceptional men.
___
Nathan, I’m lost and can’t find the thread, but i’ll be there as soon as i do.
Quite a variety in topics introduced by Sol for discussion this morning!
Let’s see we can talk about war. That means guns and weapons and that is a topic many seem to enjoy cussin’ and discussin’.
Or, we can talk about sex. Seems that can now be dispensed with quickly so you can get back to the important war and guns topic.
hmmm.
Should someone mention all is fair in love and war? And is it?
Remember folks, Parkay’s people will be trying to appoint the next Kansas Board of Healing Arts director, I would’nt be suprised if his folks didn’t have a hand in this guy’s resignation.
If you think they wield no power, think again. And if that scares the pee out of you, Join ProKanDo.
Good morning PUKE-AY.
Hey, where is the thread where Nathan responded about the evil bible site?
Did it get removed? Surely not. There was nothing hostile in it.
I will SO be over the moon if it got axed.
Nevermind I found it- it’s in a clinton thread. THat’s what happens when teh Open thread gets shut down and we’ve gotta go under other headings to have a dang conversation.
I propose that the WE editors just remove the offending comments instead of closing down the Open threads.
Looks like the Repupub. plan of obstructionism is going to bite them in the butt, as well it should. They thought they were being so cute by it!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080403/pl_nm/usa_politics_congress_dc_1
Saw what I suspect were illegal immigrants yesterday. I was driving past a construction area, and noticed a lot more hispanics than I normally see in town. Watched about a dozen workers pile out of one van. Stopped to run an errand nearby. When I came out a couple from the same group were working the landscaping areas in front of this office building. Across the street, they others were up on a roof maybe putting down shingles, I don’t know.
Anyway, I was suspicious - they were all bantering back and forth even from across the street in Spanish (I had two years of it in college so I can recognize the lingo). Sure was glad it was them doing the manual labor and not me.
Then I remembered my own family history. Our family historian provided us records of our earliest American relatives coming to America as indentured servants from northern Europe. Upon first hearing about this, I thought it was BS, white folk weren’t slaves. But then I learned that nearly half of white immigrants to North America in the 17th and 18th centuries were indentured servant s. My ancestors worked seven years, basically as slave farm laborers in Virginia before being eligible for freedom. Something happened, and they got in debt to the land owners and ended up working ten years before gaining freedom and moving west.
I thought about how so many of all our ancestors took the difficult journey leaving their homelands to travel by primitive ships - in the holds of the ship to come to American. How hard it must have been leaving their families
for the unknown. How difficult to live in slavery. How bad were the living and working conditions these early Americans endured? And later the joy of gaining their freedom, and the hard and long journey west. Even later,
the records reveal early settlers in Kansas with our family name - working as laborers yet again, for other farmers and ranchers in Kansas.
I was reminded about how our ancestors, signed their lives away and agreed to work basically as slaves to earn their freedom in America. Records at Ellis Island reveal millions like them. These hard-working self-sufficient men and women help build the great foundation of our nation. I was reminded that these same people did not get any handouts upon their arrival. They were doused for lice after getting off the ships and released to their landlords. They were lucky to get a meal. And medical care? Unheard of.
So as I got back into my car and started the engine I felt a sense of pride in the tradition these hispanic’s were fulfilling in their role today working as slave labor for Kansas businesses. I knew the nation would go on to great things based upon their hard work and eagerness to improve their lot in life. I also remembered how our Kansas State Legislature helped ensure today’s illegals remain “off the books” and in hiding working for peanuts in
the rain, heat, and snow so real Americans could make a profit off them. So I momentarily had a great sense of respect and admiration for the efforts of these probably illegal aliens. But then I remembered they are still
getting social benefits, contributing to the numbers of Americans without healthcare, and getting to attend state university paying resident rates and eligible for college assistance funding. As I departed, I had to stop
at a stop light right next to where one group was toiling away. With my window open, my Hybrid makes
not a sound with the engine stopped while at the light. So I could hear them laughing and shouting at each other with playful insults.
So I remembered my civic duty and turned them in.
1-866-DHS-2-ICE
http://www.ice.gov/
Should be on this thread, PMama!!
Remember, the 3-13 min does not include foreplay.
“Looks like the Repupub. plan of obstructionism”
This has been in the news for months. I’d almost bet democrats will hold both houses of Congress next year.
It will be your parties turn - to make it or break it. And the whole nation will be watching.
OH boy, more making a simple statement into a holier then thou issue. Obama said last week while talking about sex education. That first he would teach his daughters moral values. But that he realized they also needed to be taught the facts and reality of sexual activity. He said he would not want his daughters punished with an unwanted pregnancy or a STD at 16.
Just now on the Congress floor a rep citied a “presidential candidate” for thinking a Grandchild as a “punishment”. Then went on to say that the opposing party has so little respect for life that they would consider a child as a Punishment!
NOW back to reality! I considered my self fortunate that my daughter was 19 when I got that call. Why did I consider myself fortunate? Because at the same time, my neighbor was informed that his daughter was pregnant. His daughter was 15! In my lifetime I have personally been exposed to three families that upon finding out their daughter in her teen years became pregnant. And the results were not seen as a joyous occasion, they kicked their daughter out! Sending their teenage daughter out into the cold, pregnant and alone.
And yes they were Conservative, fundamental Christians. Neither has Obama or the Democratic Party has advocated such responses.
Ladies and Gentlemen, this rep and his ilk is playing to you, he thinks you are so stupid that rather then attack a policy or a plan put forth. He wishes you to look at a shiny object and not think! And yes this is for my Republican brothers and sisters, when will we finally let those whom would think we are so weak minded. KNOW we are not, there are more of us and unless they have us pegged and we really are that weak minded. Such actions only weaken the party and end up with us having guilt by association.
Sol, you seem overly happy about the sex timing thing. Just saying.
I’m really glad the American people are waking up to the republicans and gonna kick em all to the curb. That’s not JUST the president, but all who staunchly support him.
parkay = scrollover territory
Foreplay should count too!
Political_mama
Posted April 3, 2008 at 8:44 am | Permalink
Sol, you seem overly happy about the sex timing thing. Just saying.
P_Mom,
If If try really hard I can almost make it to the bottom end of the time spectrum. Hell just seeing my wife undress… and I’m half way there
Phantom
Posted April 3, 2008 at 8:48 am | Permalink
Foreplay should count too!
________________________________________
Hell I was 22 before I realized there was something after foreplay
McCain’s probably pissed. The GAO refused to dismiss Boeing contesting the award!
The sex study is right… It’s not necessarily what you got… It’s what you do with whast you got!! I hear ya Sol!!
“Political_mama
Posted April 2, 2008 at 8:15 am | Permalink
OH OH OH where’s my link.
http://www.evilbible.com/Rape.htm
Now, since the bible and koran are so similar in this, seems to me that the guy would be written off as a psycho since that’s what we do here when people say and do things like that.
We don’t assign the whole Christian religion as bad because of some who abuse.
Lots of good comparisons in that site there.
Make sure to read the ‘human sacrifice’ part.
ksfarmgrrl
Posted April 2, 2008 at 8:16 am | Permalink
Sounds eerily similar to the taliban christians, no?”
God is the same god, both for the Old and New Testament.
How he deals with his creation is different between the Old and New Testament.
I do not believe that God condones or approves rape, murder or human sacrifice at any time.
God will and often has allowed evil to occur as part of His eternal plan of which we as humans cannot understand or have not been given understanding of.
heheheheheheh. HEhehehehehHEHEHEH. HEE HEE HEE HEE!
Hell, it takes us lesbians 13 minutes just to light the candles…
“I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don’t want them punished with a baby.”
Upon examination, I believe the republicans are making a mountain out of mole hill on this one. They will end looking stupid as that “vast rightwing of Christiandom” does not exist anymore.
And even where it does, common sense prevails.
Of course Obama will not think his grandchildren to be a punishment. Of course babies come into this world “by mistake” everyday. Only a few of us are honest enough to admit that to even our OWN children. And of course, that does NOT take one iota from the love, attention, and devotion we still have for our children.
Everytime Obama makes a statement, someone is quick to read into it. I believe he was making a rational comment on children having sex and birth control. He also was advocating keeping communications open with your children.
1. Teach your children that abstinance is best.
2. Do not engage in sexual relations casually.
3. If you do, use protection (STD’s and contraceptives).
4. Finally, if you do get pregnant, what are your options.
But having babies sometimes IS a mistake.
The guy was being honest and republicans are trying to make something of it.
Can’t we get back to the issues? Can’t we beat him up for being a slimy liberal socialist sucking worm?
Do republicans like to look petty?
It’s difficult to NOT look petty when every comment must be a negative about the opposition.
There appears to be nothing positive about McCain.
Guess when you have NOTHING worth defending or supporting…
“We don’t assign the whole Christian religion as bad because of some who abuse.”
The references from the website on rape were all from the Old Testament.
The Old Testament is not about Christianity, but it is the story of God and his chosen people Israel.
God deals with his creation differently since Jesus Christ’s first coming.
It is one thing to reaad an Old Testament story about a war type situation where entire cities are killed/massacred…. It is another thing when the Old Testament story is quite adamant about God ORDERING such destruction of men, women, children, and even all the animals! There is at least ONE story in the Old Testament, when the armies of God’s people are punished by God for NOT killing all living things in a city!! Those things need to be addressed by the so-called “Apologists”
“The Old Testament is not about Christianity, but it is the story of God and his chosen people Israel.” — Merican
As long as you think Adam is yer grandpa, you’ll never be able to get out of the Middle East. Chosen people my patootie.
Clearly another example of Argumentium ignoratium.
So,m AUSA, God is NOTT the same Yesterday, Today, and Tomorrow??
Hey American Way,
“3. If you do, use protection (STD’s and contraceptives).”
Protection does not guarantee you won’t get STDs.
“4. Finally, if you do get pregnant, what are your options.”
Is abortion an option and why?
“But having babies sometimes IS a mistake. ”
Having a baby may not have been planned, but it is never a mistake.
Hell, it takes us lesbians 13 minutes just to light the candles…
LOL OMG I took so long resisting saying it KFG… But damn me! I just could not stop it!
“Hell, it takes us lesbians 13 minutes just to light the candles…”
ITS BECAUSE OF A LACK OF WICK!!!!!
Damn this mind, it just does not shut off!
Chas,
Absolutely! God is the same Yesterday, Today, and Forever!
He dealings with his creation are different from time to time.
Thus, God changes!
To say that the Old testament is nothing to Christians, when it’s part of the bible, part of the history of THEIR GOD, it is amazing to me that you all pick and choose the pieces from there that you want. Did we NOT just have a big todo on the ten commandments in our public buildings? And who made the most about that? The evangelicals.
SO right….you can’t just disregard sections of the bible when it is convenient to do so. And without the Old Testament, there is no basis to believe that Christ was really God’s son.
doesn’t it make FAR more sense that the whole thing is a farce?
Should have been:
“His dealings with his creation are different from time to time.”
Typo.
The same God that was brutal and believed in rape, murder and sacrifice, is the exact same god you believe in today. He evolves and changes or he doesn’t.
Take your pick. If he doesn’t evolve and change, then it’s highly likely that Phred Phelps is the true believer. And no thanks.
Hateful killing rape and murder in the name of God for Christianity. There ya go.
“Political_mama
Posted April 3, 2008 at 9:17 am | Permalink
To say that the Old testament is nothing to Christians, when it’s part of the bible, part of the history of THEIR GOD, it is amazing to me that you all pick and choose the pieces from there that you want. Did we NOT just have a big todo on the ten commandments in our public buildings? And who made the most about that? The evangelicals.
SO right….you can’t just disregard sections of the bible when it is convenient to do so. And without the Old Testament, there is no basis to believe that Christ was really God’s son.
doesn’t it make FAR more sense that the whole thing is a farce?”
The Old Testament lays the ground work for Christianity, but Chritians did not come onto the scene until after the first coming of Christ.
Are there things in the Old Testament that are bad or we do not understand?
Absolutely!
PMama — Excellent point!! We used to refer to that as the Chinese Restaurant method of Bible interpretation… One from Column A — One from Column B — etc., etc. Till you have all the entrees you want… Then call it, “The Bible Says”
Heheheheheheeh Writerdog!
No, I think it is because we have trouble dealing with the TINY WICKS on candles…
Christians.
Typo
“Political_mama
Posted April 3, 2008 at 9:17 am | Permalink
doesn’t it make FAR more sense that the whole thing is a farce?”
If God does not exist as you are essentailly saying above, and this reality is a farce, what is your explanation for this existence?
By the way, just so you know, I always knew those passages were in there. Remember I was raised in a fundy religion. I always had trouble remedying how Satan got these people’s souls and that they could have saved themselves from such a fate. It’s a lot to ask of a mere human to have so much that is sinful and leading on the path to death against something you can’t even see. I guess that’s how the JW’s rectified it in their minds, that God would’nt put anyone to hell for eternity for simple disobedience, thus no hell for them.
Also they made it so there was NO doubt, upon judgement that one would know the true lord…so anyone that was like me, could still be saved in the end. Plays into that whole just and loving god ideal.
The whole premise is that our lives on earth are merely a test, a drama, we’re puppets to a grand puppet master, bowing to his will of bizarre social obediences. And we believe this based on something written in darn near the stone age.
Is there anything that we believe today that came from the stone age times? Isn’t it time we evolved?
I mean come on, how long is the second coming going to actually take?
Gee if you are going to get all personal and all I have things to do… Later and love you girl! I have things to haul to the dump so of course its rain here! Happens every year….
I wonder what the bible has to say about this:
Police: Man Had Sex With Picnic Table
Anonymous Tip Led Police To Arrest
POSTED: 2:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
UPDATED: 3:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
BELLEVUE, Ohio — Police said an Ohio man has been arrested for allegedly having sex with a picnic table.
Police arrested Arthur Price Jr. after an anonymous tipster dropped off three DVDs that reportedly showed Price in the act.
According to NBC Toledo, Ohio, affiliate WNWO-TV, the videos show Price tilting the metal round picnic table on its side and then laying up against it to have sexual intercourse with the table. Afterward, he can then be seen cleaning the table and the deck.
During questioning, he reportedly admitted to having sex with the table. Police said he also admitted to bringing the table inside his home for sex.
Price faces four counts of public indecency. He was freed after posting $20,000 bond, authorities said.
Was he charged with kidnapping?
Definitely one for the Sex Offenders List!
Hey Chas,
Being that you are an ordained minister, I assume, what is the correct interpretation of God’s Word?
Why do we exist?
Now that is a good question. I don’t know. Why do ants exist? Do they have a little ant god and a little ant heaven?
Why does the solar system exist with millions of planets if ours is the only one God is concerned with?
It’s scary isn’t it, that our human race might be a big fluke in the evolutionary chain?
We might look like an amoeba compared to the complexity of a future self.
Our time on earth is but a sand in the desert.
Airlines folding… $1,000+ to fuel a Semi… But BUSH thinks the economy is doing just fine!! And healthy, and growing??
And McCain likes Bush policies??
Ummmm… OK……..
American–
Obviously, the Bible is a historical document that was written over many millenia.
One can see the Old Testament YHWH evolving from a single powerful god among many gods–like a Hebrew Zeus–YHWH himself addresses these other gods when he says, “Ye are all Gods and Sons of Gods.”
The ancient Hebrews like every ancient human society one can find once practiced human sacrifice–the story of Abraham and Issac is the lesson that forms the turning point that YHWH will accept animal sacrifice.
By the time of the New Testament–2000-3000 years later–even animal sacrifice had fallen into disuse.
If one refuses to see the Bible as living document that changes in response to people’s understanding of God (like the willfully ignorant fundamentalists do), then one will have a perverse and twisted view of God’s word.
“During questioning, he reportedly admitted to having sex with the table. Police said he also admitted to bringing the table inside his home for sex.”
And of course, no mention of how old the table might be.
And… while he brought the table inside for the express purpose of sex, at least he didnt take the table across state lines…
“Grateful_Dave
Posted April 3, 2008 at 9:29 am | Permalink
I wonder what the bible has to say about this:
Police: Man Had Sex With Picnic Table
Anonymous Tip Led Police To Arrest
POSTED: 2:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
UPDATED: 3:46 pm EDT March 28, 2008
BELLEVUE, Ohio — Police said an Ohio man has been arrested for allegedly having sex with a picnic table.
Police arrested Arthur Price Jr. after an anonymous tipster dropped off three DVDs that reportedly showed Price in the act.
According to NBC Toledo, Ohio, affiliate WNWO-TV, the videos show Price tilting the metal round picnic table on its side and then laying up against it to have sexual intercourse with the table. Afterward, he can then be seen cleaning the table and the deck.”
…..
Have you looked in the bible to see what is says?
During questioning, he reportedly admitted to having sex with the table. Police said he also admitted to bringing the table inside his home for sex.
Price faces four counts of public indecency. He was freed after posting $20,000 bond, authorities said.
Grteful Dave — short answer: Heal the Sick!
Sorry dog, I didnt mean to include you in the “tiny wick” club…
Heheheheeh. Love you too dog.
I have more ‘taters to plant. And it’s raining a little here too!
I liked it better when we called the landfill the dump. And we used to go out to “the dump” and shoot rats…
Life in a small town!
P_Mom–
I think it is entirely possible that the 2nd Coming already happened.
After all, the apostles seemed to believe it was all going to happen in their lifetime.
The 2nd Coming could have been when Christ arose on the 3rd Day.
Very soon after, His Church was established that became far more powerful than the Roman government that was the world power at the time . . .
“By the time of the New Testament–2000-3000 years later–even animal sacrifice had fallen into disuse.”
Not totally, CapN — Cf. Luke 2 — Mary and Joseph made sacrifice at the Jerusalem Temple, at the birth of Jesus.
The LAST of the Human Sacrifices, in the NT, is Jesus on the Cross… The perfect sacrifice for ALL time… The ending of the Law, as it were. As Jesus says from the Cross: It Is Finished!
During questioning, he reportedly admitted to having sex with the table.
Yeah but was it consensual sex? How old is the table?
“Having a baby may not have been planned, but it is never a mistake.”
Maybe AM of USA. I can easily see how Obama might have worded it better. If it’s a poor choice of words, it is still petty.
We told our children they were not planned. Their response, “You mean I was a mistake?” I’m sure I am not the first to have used the incorrect word on this particular issue.
Right, CapN — See the Gospel Reading for April 27 — JOHN 14:15-21…. Also, ALL of the references by Jesus to his coming back again, are BEFORE the Crucifixion… This has been a part of Christian History/Tradition for nearly 2,000 years now…
Well, AmWay, mistakes do happen!!
“You mean I was a mistake?”
Answer :
No, you were a gift.
Also true, Sol — And sometimes gifts are totally unexpected!!
Here is a comprehensive comparison between Christianity and Islam.
http://www.faithfacts.org/world-religions-and-theology/contrasting-christianity-and-islam
THat is a very good point, one that I’ve never heard before Chas.
Thanks, PMama
Outlander — In many ways, comparing Islam to Christianity is like comparing apples to oranges… They are both world religions… period…
Apples and oranges — both are fruit… period 
and they both stem from the same place.
Yes, they do, more or less, PMama — However, by the time Islam began to expand, Christianity was already pretty much established around the Mediterranean Sea, and even beyond.
CapnAmerica,
I am “American, of the USA”, not “American”.
Historically, the Bible (Old and New) is estimated to be only thousands of years old (about 6,000 to 7,000).
“Ye are all Gods and Sons of Gods”
What verse are you referring to?
“the story of Abraham and Issac is the lesson that forms the turning point that YHWH will accept animal sacrifice.
”
Animal sacrifice originated much earlier than that. The story of Abraham and Isaac is the lesson and foretelling of the first coming of Christ, with God teaching Abraham obedience in the potential sacrifice of Isaac. God later supplied the animal for the sacrifice. Animal sacrifice originated in Adams time once he realized that he was unclothed to provide for clothing from an animal.
Mary and Joseph made sacrifice at the Jerusalem Temple, at the birth of Jesus.
Right, Chas, I had forgotten about that. Also, Jesus’s wrath at the Temple “money-changers” involved those who sold animals for sacrifice, IIRC.
That’s what “mythic” means, American–having meaning at many levels . . .
“Ye are all Gods and Sons of Gods”
It’s in the Psalms… Check a concordance…
Where in the Psalms Chas?
More or less, CapN.. The money changers were CHEATING people on their currency exchange… At Passover, there were people from ALL over the known world in Jerusalem… The Money Changers werent being fair when weighing out coins and other “currency” using accurate weights, and thus cheating worshippers!! And Jesus was appalled that they would do such a thing in God’s Holy Place!!
Amer. USA — like I said, check a concordance!
I gotta go for now — got a lunch meeting!!
See you all later!!
Parkay is a nun, right? Ain’t had nun; don’t want nun, and ain’t never gonna get nun.
From the Washington Post (plus a discussion of the business problems of running a newspaper):
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/achenblog/2008/04/newspapers_and_middleaged_angs.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
“You accidentally pointed out what is wrong with newspapers–you only are in awe of those on the far left of the political spectrum. When your local newspaper has turned into the Obama Daily Worship and over 50% of the country thinks their editorial page consists of a bunch of aging hippies with issues, why pay to support such irrelevancies? The WaPo has declined into such a partisan rag, that the hundreds of people I know who have ceases subscribing always cite their bias. You just can’t get over yourselves, liberals. Not everyone agrees with you. You ruined newspapers.”
Dear Karen: When you say “aging hippies with issues” you’re talking about my people. Watch it. But you do note a defect in the kit: I didn’t mean to shortchange the conservative blogs. I regularly dip into National Review, Hugh Hewitt and the gaggle at TownHall, etc., and anyone who reads this blog knows that I link to conservative pundits as well as liberal ones. But I don’t think — correct me if I’m wrong — that Slate and Salon had conservative corollaries back in the 1990s.
Otherwise, the absurdity and sheer unreasonableness of your comment brings up another issue: A lot of folks on both the Right and the Left have declared, sanctimoniously, that the MSM is being punished for being too (pick one) liberal or conservative. In fact, Alterman peddles this theory, implicitly. But the financial fortunes of newspaper companies aren’t in any signficant way (says here) connected to the political leanings of the editorial board. Liberal papers, conservative papers, they all have the same issue, which is that they’re no longer positioned squarely between consumers and advertisers. [Insert protracted dissertation on Craigslist, struggling department stores that won't spring for display ads, rise of online media with lower ad revenue, etc.] What galls me — really frosts my hackles and gets my dander so far up it’s in the stratosphere — is the pervasive notion that political writing is our main editorial product. Ever actually picked up a newspaper? Notice how much stuff isn’t about McCain and Obama and Clinton? (Lately, at least a third of it.)
Psalm 82
1God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
. . . .
6I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
7But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.
Pro-choice people profess to agree with pro-lifers that society is better off the fewer abortions take place.
Why is this?
The arguments I hear from pro- choice show how abortions are GOOD for society.
Abortions reduce human population
Abortions reduce the financial strain on parent(s)
Abortions enable the mother to pursue education.
Abortion is not morally wrong (ie: it is simply a medical procedure with no psychological side effects).
What reasons then to pro-choice people have for seeking to reduce abortions?
Also
John 10
32Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
33The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
34Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, “I said, Ye are gods?”
the videos show Price tilting the metal round picnic table on its side and then laying up against it to have sexual intercourse with the table.
The table was flat and dry anyway, so get off it’s back!
What’s with all the sex posts today? do you have any idea how hard it is typing with the keyboard bouncing up and down?
I still wana know…
During questioning, he reportedly admitted to having sex with the table.
Yeah but was it consensual sex? How old is the table?
millenium, a period of one thousand years
millenia, a period of several thousand years
6 to 7 thousand years old equals millenia.
And also this reference which may be the same (NIV):
Psalm 82:6:
6 “I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’
Good point CapnAmerica on millenium
Not now, Parkay. We’ve got a headache.
Abortion did not begin - and it will not end - with Barack Obama. What WILL end (or greatly reduce) abortion will be the following: 1) Individual responsibility; and 2) societal measures that will not render pregnancy untenable. (See the movie “Bella” for more on #2…..)
Casting Obama as the evil one probably isn’t accurate. Moreover, it (almost) prevented me from reading the entirety of your post. Stuffing a live, crying baby down a toilet is a monstrous act. And I suspect, given the age of the mother (14), that many were at fault, not excluding the mother. Incidents such as these raise very, very troubling questions - not only regarding the mother but about those surrounding her.
You seem to be connected - either directly or tangentially - to Operation Rescue. I know the Bible says to ignore the admonitions of unfruitful works of darkness, but I have a suggestion. Perhaps you might suggest that its leadership create a video showcasing its new offices.
That would probably be more efficacious than wondering whether Mr. McKinney got his twenty-five thou. Or what Mr. Obama will tell his pre-pubescent daughters about abortion.
But then, what do I know. I’m unfruitful; my outlook is frequently as dark and barren as Boy George’s bathhouse; and I’m one of those weaker vessels, too. So I guess I lose on all counts…….
But then, what do I know. I’m unfruitful; my outlook is frequently as dark and barren as Boy George’s bathhouse; and I’m one of those weaker vessels, too. So I guess I lose on all counts…….
we don’t feel that way about ya, songbird. And what were you dong in Boy George’s bathroom, and with whom?
Also, after Adam and Eve eat of the forbidden fruit, YHWH says in Genesis 3:22 “Behold, the man has become as one of us.”
Redactors and apologists over the millenia have tried to expunge these references to the pantheism of ancient Hebrews, but they never quite succeed, and the careful historical scholar can see the clues they leave behind vividly.
Hmmm, the open thread reads today like a Concordance and weird sexual practices hand book.
Sorry, I can’t get into this. Y’all are acting like God wrote the book, not a bunch of literary loners.
reads today like a Concordance and weird sexual practices hand book.
Isn’t it the same thing?
*ducks*
I always hunted for the dirty parts in the bible. Didn’t everyone?
I never could quite figure out why the Old Testament God says, “don’t eat from the Tree of Knowledge, for of the day you eat, you will surely die.”
But the Serpent (Satan?) pops up and says, “nah, you won’t die.”
Turns out, the Serpent was right.
One can’t explain that if one reads it “literally.”
It always saddens me to hear someone claim not to have faith. You just have to wonder what is so wrong with people like that.
Foreplay should count too!
That should bring the time up to 5-15 minutes for a Republican.
Ok, Cap’n, they just forgot the “eventually” part of the dying. Since the experiment was aborted, we’ll never know if Adam and Eve would have lived forever. If you think listening to her yammerin’ for 900 years was hell, can you imagine eternity? Maybe Eve didn’t partake first and Adam was just looking for an escape?
(ok, ladies, start throwing peanuts now)
I think there Capn, the word “die” may have implied that before the forbidden fruit was eaten, Adam and Eve may have had eternal life.
It always saddens me to hear someone claim not to have faith.
Nano, you must understand, many have faith–just not in a book, not in some self-righteous hypocrit demanding 10% (like he’s an agent and god needs help finding talent), and not in any religion in general.
Thanks, Ghoti:
I just allude to B. George sometimes - ’cause back in the 1980s (when he fronted Culture Club) some people told me I looked like him.
Now, I’d much rather resemble Angelina Jolie (another comparison I used to hear long ago) - but what the hellola. People in Hades, er, HAYS - want ice water on a sweltering summer day, too…….
JUAN GONZALEZ: The Bush administration’s treatment of prisoners and interrogation methods is coming under increased scrutiny this week following the declassification of a 2003 memo. The memo shows the Justice Department told the Pentagon that presidential authority overrode numerous laws banning torture or cruel treatment of prisoners in US custody. The memo endorsed assault, maiming and even administering mind-altering drugs on prisoners.
AMY GOODMAN: Alberto Gonzales, Haynes and Addington and Yoo made up what Sands describes as Bush’s “torture team of lawyers.” Sands argues the actions of these lawyers might have amounted to war crimes and could result in their prosecution overseas.
http://www.democracynow.org/2008/4/3/the_green_light_attorney_philippe_sands
’cause back in the 1980s (when he fronted Culture Club) some people told me I looked like him
See, I knew I dated you!
“CapnAmerica
Posted April 3, 2008 at 10:37 am | Permalink
I never could quite figure out why the Old Testament God says, “don’t eat from the Tree of Knowledge, for of the day you eat, you will surely die.”
But the Serpent (Satan?) pops up and says, “nah, you won’t die.”
Turns out, the Serpent was right.
One can’t explain that if one reads it “literally.””
Ah, but the serpent was wrong.
He indeed, and those who do not confess the Name of Christ, has experienced or will be experiencing a spiritual death. It is just delayed from that time and not immediate.
even administering mind-altering drugs on prisoners.
Geesh, Solly, that was their recreational period. Didn’t you live through the 70s?
American o’ USA, I have this really neat bridge over the east river yu can have cheap. Only used on Sundays by a li’l ole lady from Pasadena.
A recent entry into the bowels of Hell, the arrival was puzzled by what he saw. Thousands of people in a large room standing on their head in a foul smelling human sewage pit, gurgling struggling to breathe.
The arrival walked to the next room and saw thousands of people standing in the foul sewage and but they were sipping coffee.
Satan comes up to the arrival and asked him if he had made up his mind which room he wanted to spend eternity in.
The arrival emphatically stated, “The room where they were drinking coffee!”
Suddenly, a demon appeared the ‘coffee’ room, clapped his hands and said, “Okay boys and girls, coffee break is over, back on your heads!”
We told our children they were not planned. Their response, “You mean I was a mistake?” I’m sure I am not the first to have used the incorrect word on this particular issue.
Next time, try “surprise”.
Even within a marriage, there are surprises. Oy vay, are there!
What would Charles Darwin say about instinct by some to kill their offspring?
Does terminating one’s progeny for the purpose of sustaining one’s financial standing or to avoid negative social stigma make that person more or less fit in light of Darwinistic evolution?
growing up my sister often tormented me about being a ‘mistake’. I was about 30 when she pulled the same in fron of my folks for the 1st time. My mom said, “are you kidding? You were the mistake. You think I wanted another kid 13 months after the last one?”
“Chas.Posted April 3, 2008 at 9:40 am | Permalink
“By the time of the New Testament–2000-3000 years later–even animal sacrifice had fallen into disuse.”
Not totally, CapN — Cf. Luke 2 — Mary and Joseph made sacrifice at the Jerusalem Temple, at the birth of Jesus.
The LAST of the Human Sacrifices, in the NT, is Jesus on the Cross… The perfect sacrifice for ALL time… The ending of the Law, as it were. As Jesus says from the Cross: It Is Finished!”
>>>>
I almost totally agree Chas!
Except that Christ fulfilled the Law. The Law is written on our hearts through accepting Christ.
Scary isn’t it, that we agree on some things?
It always saddens me to hear someone claim not to have faith.
Nano, there are many kinds of faith. Are you only referring to your kind? Even athiests and agnostics have faith.
“ghotiphaze
Posted April 3, 2008 at 10:49 am | Permalink
American o’ USA, I have this really neat bridge over the east river yu can have cheap. Only used on Sundays by a li’l ole lady from Pasadena.”
>>>>
I’ll pass. I already have a bridge.
He indeed, and those who do not confess the Name of Christ
How is it exactly that Adam or Eve knew of Christ?
How about all those tribes in South America and Africa that have never seen civilization much less a bible? Are the all damned to hell?
American Indians? Eskimos? All going to hell? What a great religion you have.
I have a question concerning those bible passages about being god. Who is speaking to whom?
Thanks
Having an unplanned child is a blessing, once you do realize that it is a gift of God.
And the blessing just keeps on going when you have grandkids on top of that.
Regarding the sex with table issue………
Are table years and dog years the same?
Was there any foreplay involved?
Did the table go all the way on the first date or did it insist on waiting?
Did the man in question cheat on the table with a park bench?
What does the man’s wife look like? Any resemblance to the table?
And most importantly, did they practice safe sex?
“SolDevVB
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:02 am | Permalink
He indeed, and those who do not confess the Name of Christ
How is it exactly that Adam or Eve knew of Christ?
How about all those tribes in South America and Africa that have never seen civilization much less a bible? Are the all damned to hell?
American Indians? Eskimos? All going to hell? What a great religion you have.”
>>>>>
The only answer I have for that is that only God knows the answer for sure.
In Old Testament times, Christ was present, as is revealed in the prophecies, but had not been revealed. Christ was present at the beginning and was the creator OF the creation.
About all those who have not been reached today, Christ is the only way to salvation, according to God’s Word, and man shares the responsibilty with God in the Great Commission in the Gospels to spread His Word to all people groups. So there is a burden upon man to play out his part in that, as a coworker of God, but not as the one accomplishing the goal of salvation.
I hope this makes sense.
One word WS,
Splinters.
WSClark,
Must you be so juvenile?
What do you think about the the above?
I hope this makes sense.
So then your answer is yes. All those people, through no fault of their own are damned to hell. This is a religeon you choose?
Did the “sex with Table” man have a genetic disposition to being attracted to tables?
What about the “sex with dog” man?
I think it is a bit harsh to penalize people based upon the genetics with wich they are born. Such people were unfortunate to be stuck in a marriage with a human when they only wanted to be with tables and dogs.
religion. Damn thing…
Ok. ok. ok. Has to be said.
Gives new meaning to ‘morning wood’
“Must you be so juvenile? What do you think about the the above?”
Well, excuse the Hell out of me for seeing a little humor in the man on table issue.
As for the above, there are more than 100 posts “above.” What are you talking about?
“SolDevVB
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:21 am | Permalink
I hope this makes sense.
So then your answer is yes. All those people, through no fault of their own are damned to hell. This is a religeon you choose?”
>>>>>>
It is God’s desire that none should perish, but that all should have eternal life with Him.
God works in the world and through man to bring this about.
Will some go to hell? Yes!
Who? I do not know. Only God does.
When will this happen? I do not know. Only God does.
“Even athiests and agnostics have faith.”
Athiests certainly have faith - faith that God does not exist. Ever notice how athiests know the Bible better than most Christians?
Agnostics on the other hand, profess the reasonable belief that they don’t know about the existence of God.
The above could be a function of my bias.
WSClark,
My posts.
The real question I am asking after reading my last post, is bias a form of faith?
Maybe.
If a certain religious faith teaches that there is no Hell for those who reject that Faith, what incentive is there to be a part of that religion?
“My posts.”
I believe in God, I do not believe in the divinity of Jesus, I do not believe in religion, therefore I am not a Christian.
“It always saddens me to hear someone claim not to have faith. You just have to wonder what is so wrong with people like that.”
Faith in what?
“Athiests certainly have faith - faith that God does not exist. Ever notice how athiests know the Bible better than most Christians?”
Do you have some examples?
Many atheists have sought to disprove that God exists by searching and studying the scriptures and have found out that they believed in God!
Lee Strobel is one.
I am not an atheist, but I know the Bible better than many Christians, having been brought up as a strict Lutheran and having had read the Bible cover to cover.
The best example I have is that Doug who posts here pretty often, I believe, is self-professed atheist, and he has a quite impressive knowledge of the Bible.
“Steven Davis
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:33 am | Permalink
The real question I am asking after reading my last post, is bias a form of faith?
Maybe.”
>>>>
What bias are you referring to?
I have faith that if I jump off a cliff I will fall.
I guess I am biased in that regard because of the physical laws.
AQmer. USA, since the Law is fulfilled in Christ, as you mention, thus, the Law is NO MORE! A fulfilled contract (which is where that word originates) is a done deal… No more to be done on a fulfilled contract. In this case, the contract is fulfilled on behalf of ALL Creation, by the Sacrifice of Christ - once for all!
For too many folks, they keep wanting to crucify him all over again, for each new believer! The Sacrifice of Christ was for ALL people of all times and places. And I would add, even for those who have not KNOWN of it!
Because it was not accomplished by US, but by God. “By grace are we saved through faith; and that not of our own doing, for it is a gift of God.”
GRACE means UNmerited favor! WE can do nothing to achieve “salvation” — It has been done FOR US… UNmerited/UNdeserved/FREE GIFT… Hope that explains it!
Wow, religion Thursday, what?
The problem with insinuating people are going to hell for not believing in Christ smacks of many sins. The self-righteous RR thinks their religion is the one true religion; the Jews think their’s is, the Muslims think theirs is. And then there’s the rest of us who believe God is way smarter than all the religions put together, and live our lives as such.
Remember, “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone?” I got a feeling many of the stone throwers are going to get glass shards in their hair when all their glass houses come crashing down around them.
Another interesting thing about this blog is how many threads turn into religion threads - this very one being an example.
What is the benefit of discussing religion with people you don’t even know? I have always wondered about that.
One of my complaints about Nathan is that he insists upon “debating” on this blog about religion and faith. How can those subjects be debated? Especially the faith matter. You believe or you don’t — end of “debate”.
“WSClark
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:44 am | Permalink
I am not an atheist, but I know the Bible better than many Christians, having been brought up as a strict Lutheran and having had read the Bible cover to cover.”
“WSClark
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:35 am | Permalink
“My posts.”
I believe in God, I do not believe in the divinity of Jesus, I do not believe in religion, therefore I am not a Christian.”
>>>>
How can you say you do not believe in religion, but that you do believe in God?
Amer USA — “Religion” is a system of belief. Beliving in God is strictly Theistic.
“What bias are you referring to?
“I have faith that if I jump off a cliff I will fall.
“I guess I am biased in that regard because of the physical laws.”
I’ll try to spell it out for you. It really is not that difficult.
Bias is an inclination toward reality that someone accepts without having to re-examine daily. Hence, in that manner, like faith.
Spot on, Steven… well stated!
The Bible can be debated over its meaning and context. Whether or not people believe it on the other hand won’t be changed by debate.
I believe that the Bible is true. And I accept that people do not agree with my belief. I will debate my faith in person with people I know and who actually know me. I will refrain doing so on a Blog since living your faith is much more expressive than arguing it’s intellectual merit anomynously.
“Chas.
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:46 am | Permalink
AQmer. USA, since the Law is fulfilled in Christ, as you mention, thus, the Law is NO MORE! A fulfilled contract (which is where that word originates) is a done deal… No more to be done on a fulfilled contract. In this case, the contract is fulfilled on behalf of ALL Creation, by the Sacrifice of Christ - once for all!
For too many folks, they keep wanting to crucify him all over again, for each new believer! The Sacrifice of Christ was for ALL people of all times and places. And I would add, even for those who have not KNOWN of it!
Because it was not accomplished by US, but by God. “By grace are we saved through faith; and that not of our own doing, for it is a gift of God.”
GRACE means UNmerited favor! WE can do nothing to achieve “salvation” — It has been done FOR US… UNmerited/UNdeserved/FREE GIFT… Hope that explains it!”
>>>>>
No, Christ does not need to be crucified again.
Yes, Christ fulfilled the law.
Is there still sin in the world? Yes!
Does the Spirit direct our lives to keep us from sinning and directing us to the law of Christ? Yes indeed!
Christ fulfilled the perfect law, because man could not, by placing the Holy Spirit in those who believe in Him!
Have all received salvation because of Christ’s death and resurrection without accepting Him? No!
What would be the point of that, if man was not involved, by accepting that perfect gift of eternal life with God?
Did Christ die in vain?
God desires that all men should COME to him!
First you must know God, and in knowing, then you must accept Him!
anonymously
God is way smarter than all the religions put together, and live our lives as such.
AMEN
“How can you say you do not believe in religion, but that you do believe in God?”
Easy. I believe that there is a God, but I don’t need a religion to tell me about Him. I do not believe in the Christian, Jewish, Muslim or Hindu versions of God, nor in the tenants of their faiths.
I believe in God - that’s all.
I am at peace with my spiritual beliefs.
“What would be the point of that, if man was not involved, by accepting that perfect gift of eternal life with God?
Did Christ die in vain?
God desires that all men should COME to him!
First you must know God, and in knowing, then you must accept Him!”
==================================
So you want to insist on having a part in the UNMerited Favor of God (Grace) And you want to tell God who should/shouldnt receive that UNMerited Favor of God??
Look, if it is UNMerited, that means UNdeserved. That means NOBODY but God has made the decision. John 3 says God so loved the COSMOS (Universe) I dont think inanimate objects can choose their beliefs. Paul says the whole Creation groans in travail, as one giving birth…
The key is GRACE — UNMerited Favor!! Thank GOD salvation is not up to any of us!
#
Steven Davis
Posted April 3, 2008 at 11:55 am | Permalink
“What bias are you referring to?
“I have faith that if I jump off a cliff I will fall.
“I guess I am biased in that regard because of the physical laws.”
I’ll try to spell it out for you. It really is not that difficult.
Bias is an inclination toward reality that someone accepts without having to re-examine daily. Hence, in that manner, like faith.
————————–
If you stop to examine your faith, you end up losing the process of examination and your faith.
“brought up as a strict Lutheran”
Missouri Synod?
Tell us about your God WSClark. Can we all know him?
“If you stop to examine your faith, you end up losing the process of examination and your faith.”
If examination of your faith causes you to lose your faith, then you didn’t have much faith to begin with.