It seemed like a good idea at the time — pretesting the constitutionality of the state’s new funeral picketing law, to avoid the risk of losing in court later and having to pay the Phelpses’ legal fees. But the Kansas Supreme Court struck down the law Tuesday, ruling that the lawsuit-trigger provision violated the separation of powers and noting that its job is not to offer opinions about laws that have yet to go into effect. That makes sense, as it raises the question of whether the same fate awaits the pretest of the constitutionality of the gambling expansion. In any case, it’s encouraging that both lawmakers and Attorney General Stephen Six are eager to fix the funeral-picketing law to get it into effect, so that the state is on record prohibiting protests within 150 feet of a funeral one hour before, during and two hours after a service. Meeting with The Eagle editorial board Tuesday, Six called the law a “worthy goal and something I support.â€
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51 Comments
Sometimes the challenge of the “Law” by courts is just beyond common sense and commonly held beliefs.
I suppose “rules is rules” by I’m renaming this one to (c)ruel rule).
anti-picketing laws are unconstitutional period. If you can prevent people picketing a funeral you can prevent them from picketing an abortion clinic.
Citizens have the right to assemble peaceably. Trying to enact laws against this activity is unconstitutional.
That being said, there is more than one way to skin a cat. Petition your local media to run stories. Leave out the name of the organization. Don’t give them the publicity they desire, but rather chastise them. Show them picketing, but not the organizations name. “A group of picketers shamelessly interrupted the funeral of courageous _soldier’s name_ and family. As mourners lay to rest their fallen beloved, a few people callously chanted slanderous remarks.” Something like that. When the story completes, give the anchors like 30 seconds to ‘talk amongst themselves’ … “What absolute snail turds” “What would their parents think of them acting so disgustingly.”
You get the point. The media is a tool. Use it appropriately.
Blur out the faces of the picketers and the messages on their signs. Just show blurry blobs behaving poorly. Go so far as to muddle the audio so that their message cannot be heard.
Have a row of volunteers placed inside the private property with large white blank placards or bed sheets. Block the protestors from view.
C’mon folks, get creative and take back what is yours.
As sad an example as it is of the first amendment right, it is a slipper slope to try to ban the Phelps. But I do not see the problem with the law, it does not infringe on their free speech they can still stand passed 150 feet away and say anything they want. The reality that their chosen audience can not hear them is THEIR FAULT! My dad once told me that my rights end and begin at the tip of my nose, to deny them their chosen venue is not a violation of their rights as long as their right to a venue is not violated. I can stand in the middle of my house and shout fire, I just can not do it in a crowded theater.
I wonder if Ffred’s Ffollowers will picket his funeral, assuming that the Earth will accept him?
assuming that the Earth will accept him?
LMFAO
The Phelpes crave persecution because receiving same validates them in some perverse way.
What does a sadist do a masochist?
Nothing – the treatment of choice for the crazy Phelps clan.
sorry, should be do to a masochist?
News from our statehouse session day 58. Might be something new to glean from this, but the media actually picked up on this one quickly.
KANSAS SUPREME COURT FINDS PICKETING LAW UNCONSTITUTIONAL
Our Supreme Court says the state’s funeral picketing law is unconstitutional. In a ruling released today, the court unanimously said the so-called trigger provision of the 2007 law invalidated the entire statute. The trigger said the law wouldn’t be enforced until was upheld by a state or federal court. The Court said it was releasing the opinion now rather than the normal hand-down day of May 28 to give legislators time to address the issue. The legislation was in response to the Rev. Fred Phelps and his followers protesting at funerals of soldiers killed in combat. The law required immediate appeal to the Supreme Court by the Attorney General to ascertain its constitutionality.
The Supreme Court did not address the heart of the bill, but instead said the judicial trigger provision of the law was unconstitutional. I think I mentioned in an earlier that courts must have a “case or controvercy” involving real parties in interest. They do not provide declaratory opinions (declaring a new law unconstitutional on its face).
Legislators are going to want to address the problem this year.
Rep. Raj Goyle, D-Wichita, removed the “judicial trigger” and wrote up essentially the same bill. He said he will file it this afternoon in the House Federal and State Affairs Committee where members will likely hold a hearing on the bill next week.
The law enacted last year was to go into effect only after it was determined constitutional by a state or federal court, but the state’s high court said the trigger violated the separation of powers for two reasons. First, the lawsuit, which former Attorney General Paul Morrison filed last year, wouldn’t provide an actual controversy.
Second, the court said it could not rule on a provision of a law that was not in effect yet. “A court issuing such an opinion would usurp the legislature’s duty to make a preliminary judgment on the constitutionality of inoperative legislative provisions,” Justice Marla Luckert wrote for the court.
The ruling is another set back for lawmakers who for years have sought to reign in the activities of pastor Fred Phelps and the Westboro Baptist Church in Topeka. Members have become infamous around the world for protesting at the funerals of killed U.S. troops, saying their deaths are God’s punishment of the country’s acceptance of homosexuality.
The statute would have prohibited protesting within 150 feet of a funeral one hour before, during and two hours after a service. The penalty for the misdemeanor offense is a maximum six months in jail and $1,000 fine. The law also contained a provision allowing family members to file civil lawsuits against people who defame the dead.
(no link)
Raj Goyle, the great legal mind.
Raj Goyle, the man who sent out oversized post cards saying “Phelps must be Stopped” —
Raj Goyle, the ACLU attorney who worked for an organization that defended Phelps, in the past, promised us that he would, in fact, “Stop Phelps”!
Ok, Raj is ONLY one person in the legislature.
However, I do not think anyone else PROMISED to “Stop Phelps” in their campaign literaturer.
I am positive that no other candidate for the legislature claimed as much legal expertise on this matter.
Raj knew this would happen.
If he did not know?
Well, then he is not the legal genious that he pretends to be!
Econ101,
Normally, correcting someone’s spelling is beneath me. But really, Econ101, if you’re going to ridicule Raj Goyle for knowing less than he claims to know, you’re putting a target on your own chest by misspelling “genius.”
…”he is not the legal genious [sic] that he pretends to be!”
It takes a genius to recognize one, I guess. Talk about pretenders… LOL!!!
The difference, EconJeenyous, is that Raj at least attempts to do the right thing.
Except for protecting 13 year old girls’ right to marry, Bonnie Huy was AWOL.
The right to free speech is only valid if we allow speech that we abhor. Phelps bunch are a bunch of losers. A group that sickens nearly everyone. Nevertheless, they have a right to their opinion, and to their speech. Banning it leads to a very slippery slope. But, in my mind, restricting their protests as to when and where, is not much different than requiring permits for other activities. Better yet, I think, is to use some of the advice above. Ignore them. Give them no publicity, let the patriot guard, and other oganizations, provide the screening. Keep them out of the press.
You’d think after all this time someone would slap a libel suit on Phred’s clan. One count for every sign.
“God hates fags”
GET REAL!!!
All they have to do is produce God as witness in their trial to state the disposition of His mind in court.
CF
Agreed
I should spell check
However, my bad spelling is rather consistent. It makes it hard for anyone to copy me, huh?
Bonnie Huy voted for the bill that became law, as far as underage marriage is concerned.
Well, sure, Econ.
Brenda Landwehr voted for it, and Bonnie always voted exactly like Brenda did.
What always amazes me whenever I see Fred Phelps picketing is how someone in such an advanced stage of physical decay can publicly protest.
My theory is demon possession.
Seriously.
Someone should do a Catholic exorcism ritual next to Old Man Phelps at his next protest. I’ll bet you that his head turns around 360 and he projectile vomits 50 feet.
My theory is demon possession.
I’m not sure that even Ol’ Nick would have anything to do with Phred
Raj ain’t so dern smart, is he?
Wow, what a 1st amendment expert.
As has been pointed out, the proposed law does not ban picketing; it places some restrictions thereon as to time and place.
Wondering, Econ, whether the original bill enacted when introduced had the “trigger” mechanism within its provisions, or whether this was added later by amendment? This is important to know, I believe, as I think most attorneys recognize the risk in placing such a provision into any law (the gambling law has the same type of provision, which I think is a fatal flaw there as well), and the question I have is why and at what time such provision was added.
Not saying it wasn’t there originally, as I don’t know and don’t care to find the engrossed bill. If it was there originally, it smacks of a political compromise to get the bill enacted. If added later, then the legislature wanted to try to avoid the problems set out in the first sentence of Rhonda’s initial post.
If anyone wishes to discern the magnitude of the fetid Fred Phelps’s psychoses, do the following (like I did in 2000):
Go to a search engine, conduct a search on the inbred moron and his history, hold your stomach, consume an entire bottle of extra-strength Maalox, gobble up some opiate painkillers if you’ve got any handy, and prepare to be repulsed.
Sad but true – funeral picketin’ is but one of Freddie’s delinquencies.
Let me be blunt here (without being too, er, blunt): There ain’t a preacher alive today (with the exception of the pedophilic originator of Islam if he were alive today) who would condone the sort of behavior exhibited by Fred toward his family.
Reading this sorry saga, I wanted to weep. I wanted to cry until I absolutely couldn’t cry any longer. I cried for his wife and children. (I know it’s fashionable to say, “Why didn’t she leave him?” But when you’re a repressoid religionist’s wife, and ya got no education and/or income, and ya got many, many little mouths to feed, that’s easier said than done….)
I repeat: If funerals are your only exposure to Fast-Buck Freddie’s demi-droppings, ya ain’t heard nothing yet.
The man’s a pig. A gutbucket, poison-fed, megalomaniacal, slime-bellied pig.
In my opinions, laws aren’t made to protect non-humans. They’re made for people.
That ain’t Fred – by a country mile.
Oh, crap – let me explain myself further.
Laws are made to protect animals, too. I love animals more than life itself – so I wanted to clarify my point here.
But Fred is less than human. He’s less than animalistic. He’s something else again.
He’s something akin to the little ring around my chamber pot when it’s time to clean the darned thang. He’s something similar to the pus pockets that erupt when a surgeon discovers he’s left a raging infection in someone’s gut after surgery.
He’s something not unlike the loose stools a flu-stricken wildebeest inflicts on a prairie in the dead of night.
That’s how much I love Freddie.
Agreed that Phelps is a pig, and worse. However, laws indeed are made to protect the likes of Phelps, just as the likes of the Carr brothers, etc.
(ok, this is just a JOKE…)
You still have chamber pots? Can’t ya afford indoor plummin’?
Whoa – ol’ Freddie’s a killer, too? Now that’s something I hadn’t heard.
Not that it would surprise me. I wouldn’t put anything – ANYTHING – past Mr. Phelps.
Hard to know why he would do something like that. After all, from what I read……………..Mr. Phelps ain’t got no moral capital to stand on or crap upon – not when it comes to his own goatlike sexual behavior…..
I couldn’t find anything on Phred’s clan offin’ anyone’s GF. Sorry Song, guess my google just doesn’t go far enough.
Yeah – just lookin’ into Freddie’s fetid retinal cavities would be enough to drive me to drive to Seattle, traipse on over to Kurt Cobain’s old domicile, and put something hard and cold to my noggin.
(No, Freddie, that’s not a metaphor for your shortcomings……….yours are so minuscule they’re minus………..)
Legislature complains about Bremby trying to do their work: Then the complain because the judiciary won’t do their work!
Ahh
Let this small band of Christians have their free speech.
At least they are honest about their faith. And they do the rest of us a service in that honesty.
This is not a slippery slope, because they are not trying to ban protesting. As has been pointed out, they are just trying to put restrictions as to time and place, much like a permit. Or a parade.
The Phelps Clan is one more ugly part of this Iraq misadventure.
Of all people, the military families deserve better than Bush’s lunacy, Cheney’s conniving and Israeli insatiable greed.
TDT
EXACTLY — we give parade permits all the time, and, if you try to disrupt the parade? That is “disturbing the peace” or something along that line.
Maybe not TDT… Remember that nut case preacher in Wichita, who disrupted that gay rights parde, and he got off the hook??
Looks like the Blog is pretty dead again tonite… Oh well…
I fully support the finding of the court. Just because people are filthy, tasteless and disgusting does not give the government the right to silence them.
If you people would quit voting Republican and encouraging nutcases like the Phelps- and the Republican in OK City that said fags are worse than Ben Laden and more of a threat, you might find that Kansas will be welcomed into this century!
For the bloggers that relish posting obituaries here and making fun of the dead and their families, you should be very supportive of your right to protest at every funeral in the state.
Happy day for you bottom feeders.
Oh, and WE Blog has seen fit to leave such attacks posting on their blog.
From the Open 3/10:
Chas.
Posted March 11, 2008 at 12:11 am | Permalink
This looks interesting >>>>
Max get the hell out of this country if you don’t like it here!
What a waste of citizenship you POS are!
Yopu flip off our soldiers by complaining about a little tax taken out of your check!
Max you aren’t worth a hangnail of one of the men fighting for your freedom!
POS Max!
For those bothered by funderal protestor bottom-feeder types:
http://www.patriotguard.org/
Patriot Guard Riders Mission Statement
The Patriot Guard Riders is a diverse amalgamation of riders from across the nation. We have one thing in common besides motorcycles. We have an unwavering respect for those who risk their very lives for America’s freedom and security. If you share this respect, please join us.
We don’t care what you ride or if you ride, what your political views are, or whether you’re a hawk or a dove. It is not a requirement that you be a veteran. It doesn’t matter where you’re from or what your income is; you don’t even have to ride. The only prerequisite is Respect.
Chas hates being reminded of his sick post.
I intend to do remind EVERYONE EVERYDAY, until the WE pulls that disgusting post.
Maybe Chas’ posts could be sent to his church.
Max, If you dont like it, Send it in… They wont post it… There is nothing wrong with it, except for in your Warped Mind!! Get over it!! That young man who died was thinking way beyond his too youthful years, by having a Donor Card that would SAVE the lives of FIVE other people… But, YOU Max, YOU cant see that… YOU sir, are WARPED beyond all reasonable measure BUT IF you dont like it, send it in…. That thread is closed… why??? Who knows??? Maybe because people like YOU attacked somebody for posting a reasonable post, with your vitriolic hatred!! Maybe the Editors dont WANT your kind of hatred here… Either send it in and STFU about it, or get over it… STOP HARRASSING ME!!!
Here Max… Let EVERYBODY see what you are flaming about… Let EVERYBODY see this most interesting Obit. about a young man with a vision far beyond his years, that he filled out a donor card to save the lives of at least FIVE other people — Let EVERYBODY see what a small minded idiot YOU ARE MAX…
Chas.
Posted March 11, 2008 at 12:11 am | Permalink
This looks interesting >>>>
McClure, Benjamin Harrison, 20, cherished son, brother and uncle, passed away Friday, March 6, 2008. Ben was born March 2, 1988 in Wichita, Kan. He was able to graduate in 2006 from Southeast High School while living on his own, and later moved on to work at Burlington Coat Factory and the Cracker Barrel. He was a passionate writer and pianist, and an advent student of yoga and meditation. Ben was known and loved by many and will be best remembered for his kind heart and giving nature. He was always quick to help a friend in need, even when he had very little himself to give. Even in his sudden death, there is comfort in knowing that his generous spirit lived on in the gift of organ donation. Through his passing he was able to give the most of himself by saving the lives of at least five different people. He is survived by his mother and stepfather, Angela and Stan Allenbach; his father, James McClure; sisters, Shelby Bais, Molly McClure, Anna McClure; his three nieces, Paige and Lynndon Bais, Nia McClure; grandfather, Glen McClure. Funeral sevices 10 a.m. Thursday, March 13, 2008, Biglow-Bethea Funeral
Max — The true question is: What Christian pastor WOULD NOT notice the self-giving nature of this young man, who died way too young, but yet, had a vision of being able to save others, in the event of his own passing??
THAT is the TRUE question…. Now, Max, leave ME alone, and stop harrassing me with your extremist hatred for all that is beautiful, and holy, in this holy season!!
Max spews: “Maybe Chas’ posts could be sent to his church.”
Thats a good one Max… This young man’s story is in my Easter newsletter column for my parish… See, Max, this young man’s story of giving, is part of what celebrating New Life and Easter is all about!!
But, I guess your mind is too closed, and warped to see Easter in the stories of People all around us. And that, sir, is a shame!
Notice how Chas changes what he bolded in the original post on 3/10.
GUILT.
GUILT.
GUILT.
GUILT will eat at his soul, if he has one.
Repentence is his only hope.
Max, either deal with the issue here, or just stop your CRAP!!
The Phelps family protested at our little church in Sand Springs, Oklahoma. They wandered around our parking lot and sidewalks aimlessly with their placards of ignorance and hatred while the police stood by. Man, it was a tempting and target rich environment for awhile. There (the Phelps)is one family gene pool that needs an overdose of chlorine.
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[...] UP, but 2.5 rounds DOWN!! Don??t believe me? Look at the code and results ovebalneus.wordpress.comTry again on funeral picketing law – The Wichita EagleIt seemed like a good idea at the time ?? pretesting the constitutionality of the state??s new [...]