John McCain looks strong in the polls nationally and in Kansas — despite having lost the Kansas GOP caucuses — according to the latest SurveyUSA poll of how Kansans would vote in head-to-head contests. Whatever boost Barack Obama got out of the Kansas Democratic caucuses may have been short-lived, thanks to the flap over his pastor. In the poll, taken just as the pastor’s video clips were all over the news in mid-March, McCain had the support of 51 percent of Kansas voters to Obama’s 39 percent, compared with 50 to 44 percent last month and 53 to 39 percent in January. A contest between McCain and Hillary Clinton polled this month at 55 to 36 percent, respectively. That compares with 59 to 35 percent in February and 53 to 40 percent in January.
157 Comments
Just as Thomas Frank wrote in “What’s the Matter with Kansas?”
Right-wing lemmings will vote against their personal interests out of habit. The Republic Party’s rhetoric sucks ‘em in. “Less government,” although they expand government. “Lower taxes,” although the only people whose taxes have lowered are those who make $350,000 a year or more. “Pro Life,” although they advocate sending kids to war in Iraq for a hundred years or more.
Look around you, Kansans. In coffee shops, at the mall, at bars and at church. You’ll see people who think it’s more important to have a flag lapel pin than, y’know, addressing the important issues facing Americans here in America.
Yesterday I read a post where somebody compared Obama to the Anti-Christ. If that gets out in Kansas, Obama doesn’t have a chance here. Doesn’t matter whether it’s true or not, just the mere mentioning. It’s enough to make one think that Republicans are as stupid as Democrats.
Can’t improve much on that MoneyHawk.
“Right-wing lemmings will vote against their personal interests out of habit.”
————–
And lefties like Monkeyhawk think that they get to decide what Kansans’ “personal interest” is. Seems kind of arrogant.
What does a political candidate and a debate between Conservatives and Liberals have in common.
Neither discuss the real issues and only focus on meaningless minuscule. In reality, saying that Obama is disqualified by his association with Wright. Is the same as those that as a point of order disqualify Mc Cain because of his comb-over. For over five years I interacted with virtually everyone that was arrested in Wichita and Sedgwick county. Does that mean I am a bad person? Mc Cain has associations with groups that were in league with the PNAC. Now as things go in Washington political figures often are members of groups and think tanks as a matter of political gamesmanship. Rubbing elbows with others whom can help or further their own careers.
It does not mean they should be automatically dismissed or condemned solely on their chance associations. It is Mc Cain’s own words and actions that have disqualified him as a good candidate for President. And Clinton or Obama should have the same standard set on their qualifications.
“outlander” –
You’re really worried about same-gender marriage? Exactly what in your life — or any other Kansan’s — is threatened by two people who love each other enjoying the benefits (and penalties) of marriage? Yet 80% of Kansans ran to the polls to prevent it.
So many Cons in Kansas (Kons?) rail against illegal immigration but they vote for legislators who steadfastly refuse to vote against employers who hire and exploit illegal aliens.
The most precious commodity of civilization is water, yet the Kons are willing to sell out to coal-powered power plants in “the Great American Desert” for short-term profits gained by sending power to Colorado.
“Arrogant?!” Try “perceptive.”
MONKEYHAWK, a point of order though 80% of those who voted did vote it down. Only 37% of all registered voters in Kansas voted. It will be interesting when the full ramifications of that vote are finally felt. As of yet I am not aware of any challenges to child support or domestic partnerships have been effected. Though setting into the supreme law of Kansas such a clear distinction in such matters will someday bowed badly.
Monkey,
Thomas Franks was wrong. Kansas has the 15th highest state and local tax burden.
So exactly how have the conservatives been voting for smaller govt against their interests?
Kansas has fairly large govt, compared to other states.
Franks book was weak. It was an interesting read, but he provided little, if any evidence to back up his thesis.
If you think different, please let us know what evidence there is for his thesis.
“John Galt” –
In my original post to this thread I pretty much outlined in broad strokes how the people of Kansas vote their passions rather than their logic.
Abortion and evolution and same-gender unions have been the shiny distractions for so many Kansans while thousands of Kansans are scraping by on $2.67 an hour, the offical Kansas minimum wage. The Kansas Farm Bureau has advocated dead-end technologies such as ethanol for short-term profits despite long-term disaster. Placing new water-hogging power plants in the middle of the Great American Desert…to provide electricity for Colorado while fouling Kansas air is most certainly not in the best interests of Kansans. But as long as a western Kansas politician hates gays, loves guns, and demonizes reproductive rights, the Republic Party will dominate the state’s politics.
Against their best interests.
Monkeyhawk says it better. I’ll say it simple.
If you are not rich, and if you are not a bigot and you vote Republican?
You are a moron. Or you are in self denial about your personal hates and your desire to institutionalize them into government. In which case you are not a conservative at all.
Writerdog,
Pastor Wright was not a “chance association.”
I do agree on how petty politics can get, but calling the man who was Obama’s pastor for 20 years, his spiritual mentor, the man he credits in his book, the man who married Obama and Baptized his kids…. That is no “chance association.”
It speaks to your character if that is the company you keep and you don’t disavow them when they are out making the public statements Wright is making.
Clinton Culture of Corruption Campaign Continues
Maybe that is why McCain is gaining in Kansas.
http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/29/as-clinton-talks-housing-crisis-campaign-manager-serves-on-board-of-bankrupt-lender/
As Clinton Talks Housing Crisis, Campaign Manager Serves on Board of Bankrupt Lender
WASHINGTON – While Hillary Clinton campaigns for the Democratic presidential nomination in neighborhoods where many have lost their homes in unscrupulous lending schemes, her campaign manager, Margaret “Maggie” Williams, sits on the board of one of the nation’s once-largest and now-bankrupt sub-prime mortgage lenders.
Nobody cares how Kansas votes.
Least of all the Republican party.
Kansas is considered a lock. Occupied territory.
Taken for grunted. (no misspelling)
Obama’s Arrogance Continues
Nice of Obama to “LET” Hillary stay in the race, isn’t it? He knows Clinton is just a typical white person and she’ll never give up fighting the black man.
Obama Delegate Count = 1623
Clinton Delegate Count = 1499
Needed to win = 2029
Obama Says Clinton Can Run ‘As Long as She Wants,’ Expects Resolution by June
Barack Obama said Saturday that Hillary Clinton can stay in the race “as longs as she wants” and put distance between his views and those of supporter Sen. Patrick Leahy, who has called for Clinton to quit.
The NATIONAL polls continue to show McCain beating either Clinton or Obama.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/daily_presidential_tracking_poll
Sunday, March 30, 2008
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The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Sunday shows John McCain leading Barack Obama 47% to 44%. He leads Hillary Clinton 50% to 40% (see recent daily results).
Clinton, the underdog, will still pull out the nomination.
Thank God for Superdelegates!
How much will this piss-off Obama supporters?
God D*mn America!
J R
Posted March 30, 2008 at 9:10 am | Permalink
Monkeyhawk says it better. I’ll say it simple.
If you are not rich, and if you are not a bigot and you vote Republican?
You are a moron. Or you are in self denial about your personal hates and your desire to institutionalize them into government. In which case you are not a conservative at all.
=================================================
Then why are the Richest members of Congress Democrats?
If McCain wins, and we saty at WAR, 4000 more soldiers will be killed. Voting for a Republican just to stay in the party lines is deadly. We dont have much of a choice. Barack, Hillary or McCain?? It like being asked, “which knee do we want broke”? Why do we except having to choose a knee? Why is this question fair? I did not ask it, I only question why they are asking me!!!!!!!! Herbert West III, keepin both knees, thanks. west.herb@yahoo.com VOTE “NONE OF THE ABOVE”, Make History, lets see who chooses the next President if we all vote “”None Of The Above”"!!!!
So… all those “crossover” repubs who voted dem just to get obama nominated WONT vote for him in the general?
Color me shocked…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s7kEb6Osqc&feature=related
haw haw haw
Thomas Frank had it right, at least in broad strokes.
However, the problem here is that McCain is not the shrill right winger, despite attempts by some to label him as McBush. The right will still vote for him over a Democrat, and the foul weather voters who lean conservative will still feel OK voting for him because he is not a Bush or a Huckabee.
So… where are all those crossover votes you obama supporters crowed about? How will THEY vote in the general? With St. Obama? That’s what he and you all were promising. Can he win in the general without them? I thought his coattails would bring the down ballot candidates with him in the sweeping mandate he would get from all those crossover voters.
Or maybe…
all that was just primary hype?
On this and many other topics I agree wholeheartedly with you grrl. There are NO crossover voters to be counted on. There isn’t a Republican person who would consider voting for a Democratic candidate, no matter what they say or how often they repeat it!
I do think Obama has the youth vote and I also think the youth are more motivated this year to actually go to the polls and cast a vote for Obama. If someone else is the candidate I don’t expect them to remain motivated.
“Writerdog,
“Pastor Wright was not a ‘chance association.’
“I do agree on how petty politics can get, but calling the man who was Obama’s pastor for 20 years, his spiritual mentor, the man he credits in his book, the man who married Obama and Baptized his kids…. That is no ‘chance association.’”
Of course, pay no attention to what Obama’s book actually said. Only pay attention to the most outrageous things Wright has said.
“It speaks to your character if that is the company you keep and you don’t disavow them when they are out making the public statements Wright is making.”
OK, several things here.
1) It continues to speak to Obama’s character that he has not complerely disavowed the man because of some things he has said, never mind the other things he has said? Obama specifically disavowed Wright’s offensive comments (which are not consistent with Obama’s comments, even in the very book he gave Wright credit for influencing).
2) By that same token, in 2000 McCain called Pat Robertson and the late Jerry Falwell “extremists”. He later, during this primary season, disavowed those comments and said that they were not extremists. What does that say about McCain’s character?
It is apparent that right wingers like yourself are trying to hang Obama on not being simplistic. Nuance, in spite of the fact that reality is that way and that honesty is actually best served by looking at the whole picture, is thrown overboard. Wright’s comments become more important that the candidate’s own comments. Don’t look at the candidate, look at this guy over here. Classic, shallow, and disgusting misdirection. Also, typical, punish the candidate for actually taking the high road, for taking the riskier path. Obama has had his bad moments (e.g., McClurkin), but this was not one of them.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/03/18/politics/main3947908.shtml
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWe7wTVbLUU
Again, listen and read, and see how well the “look at Wright” comments stand up. They don’t.
And oh yes, nice added intepretation here by Max.
“Obama’s Arrogance Continues
“Nice of Obama to ‘LET’ Hillary stay in the race, isn’t it? He knows Clinton is just a typical white person and she’ll never give up fighting the black man.”
Yep, far be it for a candidate to actually comment on what others have been saying.
Max is a reflexive idealogue, and as bad for his side as Wright is for Obama.
Unfortunately, McCain is not as vulnerable to this sort of association as other Republicans.
max = scroll over territory
“Nathan” parrots –
“…the man who was Obama’s pastor for 20 years, his spiritual mentor, the man he credits in his book, the man who married Obama and Baptized his kids…. That is no “chance association.”
“It speaks to your character if that is the company you keep and you don’t disavow them when they are out making the public statements Wright is making.”
“Nathan,” you ignorant slut.
So far we’ve seen about 20 seconds of the Reverend Wright’s sermons, from three sermons a day every Sunday for 20 years.
Do you even understand the concept of “context?”
Twenty seconds out of twenty years.
If I were the audacious liar you Kons are, I’d attack all Catholics for following a Pope who is an admitted Hitler Youth!
If you agree with everything your preacher says you’re no longer a person of faith, you’re a cultist. Drink the Kool-Aid, “Nathan.” You stopped thinking long ago.
Frankly, I suspect you’re among the one-in-five Iraq War veterans who’s come back with brain damage at worst or PTSD at least.
You’ve never answered my question why you weren’t among the thousands of Iraq War veterans who were stop-lossed. You’re still young enough to be a combat Marine but for some reason the Marines don’t want you back.
You’re paranoid (going nowhere without your concealed handgun), you’re judgemental (calling anyone who doesn’t share your religious dogma “athiests” and condemning them to Hell), you’re a political radical who parrots the party line without any hint of rational analysis.
Seriously, “Nathan.” I strongly suspect you’re suffering from a mental disorder that will only get worse if you don’t get psychological help.
Please get help. For your sake.
Linda, I hope to hell you are right, but I remember how Gore counted on the youth vote and was sorely disappointed on election night. Conventional political wisdom is that if your campaign depends on the “youth” vote, yer screwed.
Not that the youth vote isnt valued and courted. It is good to have the youth vote. But… mostly it’s good for volunteers and such. Sadly, kids just dont get to the polls. That has been proven time and time again. Even in the 60’s at the height of political involvement of youth, the nation elected Nixon.
’nuff said?
I know. Again, you are right. This time there is a war without end, intolerance they see no reason for, an economy that has even the youth’s attention. That’s why I think their enthusiasm is more reliable than in the past. One tendency of youth is to be selfish and “me” oriented. These things affect them and they want a voice in who makes decisions that affect them so seriously.
All I can tell you for sure is this election has the attention of my grown children, my grandchildren and their friends. More than ever before!
Yep Linda. I’m always reminded though, of Drew Carey’s routine about why marijuana hasnt been legalized. He says it’s because pot smokers “just dont get to the polls as often as they’d like”.
I suspect that is also true of the youth vote.
There you go again making too much sense!
Maybe if I bribe them — promise them the best pot they’ve ever tried and drive them to the polls as a condition.
Old age and treachery…
MonkeyHawk,
Having met Nathan prior to his deployment in Iraq, I can honestly tell you that he is the same now as he was then.
Nathan,
Explain to me why it’s okay for racists to spout hate and violence at every opportunity, some from the pulpit, yet no one takes them to task over it. Yet someone with nothing else to do (or who received a pretty penny for it) found 20 seconds of “blasphemous” words in 20 years of speaking from the pulpit. Pretty weak argument.
But when it’s all ya got, ya gotta scream it from the rafters, plaster it on billboards, and repeat ad nauseum until it becomes YOUR racism. (”ya” and “your” used as broad terms, not directed toward you personally)
Drew Carey dreams in technicolor red. Although I have to say that he isn’t a huge Bush fan.
As soon as the Democratic Party decides on their nominee, and the campaign earnestly begins one on one with McCain, I predict McCain will begin to slip in the national polls. Right now, he has no opponent, and no one bird-dogging every word he says or doesn’t say. I also think he will begin to feel serious pressure from campaign advisors to appeal to the center, and from Limbaugh et al to pander to the right. He can’t have it both ways.
And “cross-over” (Ds going to McCain or Rs going to the Dem nominee) voters won’t decide this election. Independent voters will.
Many Republicans still think Obama is a Muslim so not much can be said about Republican intelligence. Some morons just want four years of John McBush, or George McSame, four more years of increasing gas prices, four more years of trillions in national debt, four more years of war, four more years of higher health care, four more years of more expensive education, but if you are rich or a corporation you’ll get a bigger tax cut.
Can anyone give a serious reason why McSame should be put into the White House? He’s already proven his incompetence on economics and foreign issues, what else is there?
****Independent voters****
Is there really such an animal?
Are you sure that isn’t just another urban legend?
Wiki says, “Like all folklore, urban legends are not necessarily false, but they are often distorted, exaggerated, or sensationalized over time.”
KsAgnostic
Obama absolutely did NOT get specific in his speach.
Obama did not specifically say what he agreed with or disagreed with.
20 seconds?
By who’s count?
Pastor Wright has several minutes of hateful comments, on CD’s that Pastor Wright thought were so important, Obama’s Church SELLS those sermons on CD!
Yeah, yeah, Paul, we get it, Wright is Black and you hate him for that. Get over it. Make him White, stick him in a White church and you’ll have no problem with him. Your Hannity routine is tedious.
And again, Obama will have trouble with other associations, like his friend from the radical, terrorist “weather underground”
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/02/22/the-company-they-keep/index.html?ex=1361422800&en=3cedc8bec4da1f1b&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss
While Hillary will have trouble with her advisor, who was a director of a failed sub-prime mortgage firm.
Doug
Your insults are childish.
You are a broken record.
Hell, if Obama listened to YOU, you would have told Obama never to try and explain the Rev. Wright issue, at ALL!
You are one of the most partisan, biased people on this Blog, Doug.
Never once have I seen a complaint, from you, about a candidate that you supported.
Nobody is perfect, but during a campaigh, Doug, you pretend your chosen, annointed candidate can do no wrong.
And, when someone else points out the faults of your chosen “saint”??
We are “racist, sexist bigots”???
Grow up. That crap doesn’t work anymore.
Pall,
“Pastor Wright has several minutes of hateful comments, on CD’s that Pastor Wright thought were so important, Obama’s Church SELLS those sermons on CD!”
I suppose it never occurred to you that you just might deserve those comments?
Ignoring the racist, liar Paul for a moment John McCain reveals his complete ignorance about sex education:
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/03/16/mccain-stumbles-on-hiv-prevention/
The old coot is completely unaware that condoms prevent the spread of AIDS and figures telling millions of Africans to just not have sex is the best way of dealing with the AIDS crisis in Africa. Apparently when questioned he was desperately looking for Lieberman to help him out with the facts. It’s not about experience boys and girls, it’s about competence and McCain has none.
“But the remarks that have caused this recent firestorm weren’t simply controversial. They weren’t simply a religious leader’s effort to speak out against perceived injustice. Instead, they expressed a profoundly distorted view of this country - a view that sees white racism as endemic, and that elevates what is wrong with America above all that we know is right with America; a view that sees the conflicts in the Middle East as rooted primarily in the actions of stalwart allies like Israel, instead of emanating from the perverse and hateful ideologies of radical Islam.”
Sounds pretty damn specific to me shill.
But then, Paul says what he wants to be true, without bothering to check it out before hand.
Classic Harry Frankfurt bullsh*t. Or Cobert style “truthiness” from Econ the shill. What a surprise.
http://www.kansas.com/205/story/356498.html
“In a world “where power of all kinds is more widely and evenly distributed, the United States cannot lead by virtue of its power alone,” McCain said in an implicit rebuke to the mind-set of the current White House. “We need to listen to the views and respect the collective will of our democratic allies. When we believe international action is necessary, whether military, economic or diplomatic, we will try to persuade our friends that we are right. But we, in return, must be willing to be persuaded by them.”
That repudiation of unilateralism was just the first of many efforts to distinguish McCain’s approach from Bush’s. “America must be a model citizen if we want others to look to us as a model,” he said. “We can’t torture or treat inhumanely suspected terrorists we have captured. I believe we should close Guantanamo and work with our allies to forge a new international understanding on the disposition of dangerous detainees under our control.”
Next came a clear signal that the environmental agenda would change radically in a McCain administration. “We need to be good stewards of our planet,” he said. “The risks of global warming have no borders. We and the other nations of the world must get serious about substantially reducing greenhouse gas emissions.”
——————-
No wonder Hillary and Obama supporters will go to McCain if their candidate loses. From the sound of it, McCain is taking over the Democrat’s territory.
Doug,
McCain’s quick fold to the radical right on every issue (including torture) calls into question all those stories of him heroically resisting enemy interrogations while a POW. If he sang for them like he does for the rebuplicans……..
Jed,
McCain already admitted he denounced America under torture. Since McCain switched his mind and decided with his vote to approve of torture by the CIA, he views torture as a means to acquire honest information. So Republicans are going to vote for a guy who stands by his denouncing of America.
“No wonder Hillary and Obama supporters will go to McCain if their candidate loses. From the sound of it, McCain is taking over the Democrat’s territory.”
And boy, whether you realize it or not, you have deeply insulted many of your fellow Republicans. If the Republicans had nominated your kind of guy (and I have read many of your posts here outlander, so I think I have a good sense of where you stand), they would be losing big this election. Unfortunately for the Democrats, the Republicans did learn from the lessons of 2006, when the middle is angry, move away from the coalition Christian Right and the patriot hawks.
C’mon ksagnostic, perhaps McCain simply had yet another “senior moment” and forgot all his positions from eight years ago.
“C’mon ksagnostic, perhaps McCain simply had yet another ’senior moment’ and forgot all his positions from eight years ago.”
Or for that matter 8 months ago. But, the fact of the matter is, he doesn’t need the wingnuts any more, so he doesn’t have to pander to them. Like most people running for the presidency, McCain has “Sometimer’s” (symptoms being: “Sometimes I says this, but sometimes I says that.”). McCain’s symptoms may be a bit more severe than most.
So much ignorance, so little time. Ah well…
Here is McCain’s actual position on torture, water boarding, and interrogation vs torture. Well explained for those who make up things. You know who you are:
Sen. John McCain’s statement Feb. 13 opposing legislation restricting CIA interrogation techniques:
“It is also incontestable that waterboarding is outlawed by the Military Commissions Act, and it was the clear intent of Congress to prohibit the practice. The MCA enumerates grave breaches of Common Article 3 of the Geneva Conventions that constitute offenses under the War Crimes Act. Among these is an explicit prohibition on acts that inflict “serious and non-transitory mental harm,” which the MCA states “need not be prolonged.” Staging a mock execution by inducing the misperception of drowning is a clear violation of this standard. Indeed, during the negotiations, we were personally assured by administration officials that this language, which applies to all agencies of the U.S. government, prohibited waterboarding.
It is unfortunate that the reluctance of officials to stand by this straightforward conclusion has produced in the Congress such frustration that we are today debating whether to apply a military field manual to non-military intelligence activities. It wold be far better, I believe, for the administration to state forthrightly what is clear in current law - that anyone who engages in waterboarding, on behalf of any U.S. government agency, puts himself at risk of criminal prosecution and civil liability.
We have come a long way in the fight against violent extremists, and the road to victory will be longer still. I support a robust offensive to wage and prevail in this struggle. But as we confront those committed to our destruction, it is vital that we never forget that we are, first and foremost, Americans. The laws and values that have built our nation are a source of strength, not weakness, and we will win the war on terror not in spite of devotion to our cherished values, but because we have held fast to them.”
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/09/BABHVGO3L.DTL
And yet the bill McCain voted against would have prohibited the CIA from using torture. Now that Bush vetoed the bill the CIA can continue doing what it does, torture people with McCain’s approval. Bush’s reasoning for the veto, he said it would prevent the CIA from torturing people. It’s pretty straightforward, and McCain doesn’t mind.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/03/10/2185249.htm?section=world
Fictional metaphore:
Obama is caught red handed, shoplifting.
Obama apologizes, and offers to pay for the candybar he lifted.
The grocery store accepts the offer and does not prosecute.
Did Obama shoplift?
If Obama had not been “caught” would he have come back, on his own, and paid for that stolen merchandize.
Yes, it is exactly the same thing!
Obama did NOTHING until he was caught!
Jed
No I absolutely did not deserve the insults of Obama’s Pastor.
Neither did my country deserve those insults.
Should McCain be allowed to be President due to his lack of mental stability? He became quite furious when a reporter asked McCain about questions involving his desire to switch to the Democratic party and when he begged John Kerry to run as his VP in the past election.
Even his fellow Republicans are unsure about his sanity. He engaged in emotional tirades with screams and threats at other senators.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/03/AR2008020303242.html
“The thought of his being president sends a cold chill down my spine,” Sen. Thad Cochran (R-Miss.)
“John was very rough in the sandbox,” said former senator Rick Santorum (R-Pa.), who is outspoken in his opposition to McCain’s candidacy. “Everybody has a McCain story. If you work in the Senate for a while, you have a McCain story. . . . He hasn’t built up a lot of goodwill.”
A guy with anger issues probably resulting from his lack of counseling after being tortured isn’t the best person to have with his finger on a nuclear trigger.
Like I said long ago, McCain needed the South, and he knew he could screw over the dumbass hicks in Ks., and still get their votes in November. The EADS decision was a win/win for McCain.
And Monkey
Quite frankly, you are in absolutely NO postiion do evaluate anyone’s mental health.
Even with the addage, “It takes one to know one” in mind, I would trust Nathan over you in any emergency.
“Like I said long ago, McCain needed the South, and he knew he could screw over the dumbass hicks in Ks., and still get their votes in November. The EADS decision was a win/win for McCain.”
—————-
Phantom, Monkeyhawk thinks that it is because Republicans in Kansas care more about patriotism and the Almighty, rather than the almighty dollar. Could be.
Let’s take a look at pro-torture, pro-AIDS, pro-war McCain’s “spiritual advisers.” Now we’ve heard time and time again from one of the board’s resident racists about how evil Obama’s former pastor is for suggesting that killing people is bad. So how does McCain’s John Hagee and Ron Parsley stand?
Hagee calls for a nuclear war with Iran in an effort to create a genocide against the Muslim people simply because they are Muslim. Parsley shares in this view. But advocating genocide is acceptable since the preachers are White, but being Black and suggesting killing one person is bad is wrong, so is my understanding from McCain supporters.
Hagee also reserves hate for the pro-pedophilia, pro-Nazi Catholic church which he refers to as a whore and anti-Christian. If this whore is anything like Republican preacher Ted Haggard’s then Hagee wants to have sex with the Pope.
Hagee also says that the thousand plus people who died in New Orleans deserved what they got because they all hated god. Apparently hating god causes levees to fail and for developers to build homes in areas that are subject to flooding. Hagee also wants Jesus to come back and wipe out the Jews.
But remember, they are White and McCain begged for their endorsement so he could align himself with their views and followers. Wright is Black, so that makes him a lot worse in the eyes of people like Paul.
Oops, here’s a good article referencing the views of McCain’s spiritual advisers:
http://artvoice.com/issues/v7n13/getting_a_grip
Lovely folks, just lovely.
Doug
As far as “guilt by association” goes, I pray that there is a picture of YOU out there, with your arm around Obama and/or Clinton!
You are so deeply devoted to your own hatred and bias, you do not recognize true hate when you see it.
You simply project that hate and see it where it does not exist.
“Econ101″ is reduced to –
“Fictional metaphore[sic]:
C’mon, “Econ101,” even you are better than making up s#it in your desperate attempt to make a point. Which you didn’t.
Have you Kons lost every grip of reality you’re reduced to fantacizing scenarios and then commenting on what never was, isn’t, and never will be? Just to protect your obviously demented world outlook?
Doug, usually you’re about half substance, half leftist whacko liar. Problem is, it becomes difficult to separate the two, and thus hard to respond to the substance. In this post though, I can’t find any substance.
Thanks Outlander, as usual no lies have been presented, just accusations.
Well since we are on the subject of McCain let’s talk about McCain and family values.
McCain went off to war and his first wife was in a car accident. As a result of her disability she gained 80 pounds. When McCain returned from Vietnam he found his wife revolting and rather than support her because of the accident he decided to cheat on her with multiple women. He eventually found his latest wife and demanded a divorce.
McCain’s new wife is about 20 years younger than McCain but she too is getting on in the years so he decided to have sex with a young lobbyist, Vicki Iseman. However this news came out during an election year so McCain can’t exactly go onto wife number three.
We know how much Republicans love a Republican that sleeps around with other women while married so nothing much was made of this. Had McCain been a Democrat they’d be calling for his resignation.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2008/02/21/2008-02-21_cindy_mccain_joins_circle_of_politicial_.html
John Hagee has a prediction about how terrorists are going to attack the US. He says Islamic terrorists are going to smuggle in 7 suitcase bombs to major US cities, and blow them up; then they will attempt to blow up a nuclear power plant; and then, they will set off an EMP weapon, disrupting all communications.
Hmmmm. Hagee describes to a tee, last season’s plot for the TV Series (on FOX) “24″ LOL I wonder if he had friends who were on the writing staff of the Series, like Limbaugh claimed several times. LOL
Doug
The New York Times took a huge hit for that very same smear tactic.
I guess it doesn’t hurt your credibility very much, so go with it, huh?
I tell you what Doug, you go fight for your country, go through five years of torture and see if it doesn’t change a few things in your life. You wouldn’t be a leftist weenie when you got back.
McCain’s is a remarkable story. McCain is not perfect, but he is a legitimate American hero.
Nah, the NYTimes has a credibility problem because it has people like Bill Kristol on it’s staff. Why the guy hasn’t been fired for stating blatant lies worthy of Paul is beyond me. Nothing the NYTimes wrote about McCain’s affair has turned out to be false.
Still can’t find those lies can you Outlander? How many years did you fight overseas and how many years were you tortured?
:: = Chas
There are very good reasons to be concerned about radical Islam.
Radical Islam is a subset of Islam.
We will find more radical Islamists in a Mosque than will will in a Jewish Temple or a Catholic or Protestant Church.
No, not every Moslem is a dangerous threat.
However, radical Islam is, traditionally, headquartered in the Mosque setting.
The problem with “multi-culturalism” is, bluntly, what do you do, in order to make room for a culture that wants to kill you?
Doug,
I have never been tortured, but then again, I’m not telling disparaging lies about someone who did.
Oh, I forgot Doug, in leftist whacko world, lies are just “accusations”.
I see outlander, you’re a brave conservative like draft dodgers Ron Reagan and John Wayne. As expected you still haven’t pointed out where I’ve told any lies. Looks like you’re the only one lying here.
Doug
Nothing in the NY Times story was proven true, Doug!
http://www.nypost.com/seven/02222008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/smearing_mccain_98831.htm
Good job Paul, Jonas Goldberg and the New York Post. Not much for credibility are you. Then again, you are the one who claimed John Kerry went to Paris to meet with Communists. You have no credibility. Don’t you have a Klan rally to attend?
I have to run off for work so that’ll leave you neocons some time to give some good reasons to vote for John McInsane. Sure he wanted to switch to the Democratic party, sure he loves torture, sure he is clueless about contraception, sure he doesn’t know who we are fighting in Iraq, sure he wants 100 years of occupation, sure he wants a larger national debt, sure he admits knowing nothing about economics, sure he cheats on his wives, sure he is a member of the Keating 5, sure his fellow Republicans thinks he’s a nut, sure he embraces people who call for genocide, but I’m sure you can find a good reason to vote for him other than the fact he’s White.
OK, Doug. bye bye. BTW, I count about 6 of your lies in the quotes below. I’m sure you have told more.
McCain’s new wife is about 20 years younger than McCain but she too is getting on in the years so he decided to have sex with a young lobbyist, Vicki Iseman
Let’s take a look at pro-torture, pro-AIDS, pro-war McCain’s “spiritual advisers.
McCain begged for their endorsement so he could align himself with their views and followers
he begged John Kerry to run as his VP in the past election.
Doug
John Kerry DID meet with our Communist enemies, in Paris France, that is a documented fact.
There is not a racist bone in my body, Doug.
You are just a bully, a bully who calls any criticism of a Black Democrat “racist” — because you do not have the intellectual capacity, or the facts, to argue any other way.
Actually, as a conservative I look at it this way:
It is, truly, a “lessor of two evils” election, though I do not consider John McCain to be an “evil” person at all.
One of the policy initiatives of George W. Bush was “Social Security Reform” — something I supported but it never happened.
Presidents do not always get what they want.
With John McCain, Republicans probably hold our own, in Congress, whether we win or loose the White House.
Either way, the Kyoto Treaty was never really brought up for a vote, last time the greens were trying to ruin American industry.
I think that there are enough smart Republicans and enough smart Democrats to stop the dumbest ideast that the President might come up with.
That, and the Courts will keep McCain in line on some issues, like campaign finance and freedom of speech.
And, with McCain, there is a real chance that government spending will be brought under control and that the ACLU and the trial lawyers will not be picking our Supreme Court Justices.
It is not a hard choice.
John McCain gets my vote.
(But not my soul)
Doug
Don’t let the facts get in your way:
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/03/25/kerry_spoke_of_meeting_negotiators_on_vietnam/
“(But not my soul)”
George WMD Bush already has your soul, Rossell, you have only one soul to give for your president.
WS
I was against George W. Bush signing off on McCain Feingold free speech restrictions.
I was against granting “amnesty” to illegal aliens, of any type, other than to the families of US Armed forces.
I wanted to seal the borders first, before we discuss illegal aliens that are already here.
I was not thrilled with the Kennedy education bill.
I think Bush should have vetoed several spending bills, in the past.
I have argued against Bush policies many, many times.
I still think that Bush is a good President.
We will never have a perfect President.
RD,
Why would I explain to you why it is ok for racists to spout hate and vilence at every opportunity when I don’t believe it is?
I simply find it rather amazing that for the past decade all it takes is for a Republican to say one stupid thing and the media and Democrats will demand blood.
Now all of a sudden, the attitude is that it was only one thing or only a small bit of what the man actually said.
The double standard is so obvious.
What about Imus? How many hours has he been on the radio and he messes up that one time and everyone demands blood.
The examples abound!
There is nothing “racist” in pointing out that the comments from Wright are disturbing to say the least.
Econ says >>>>
“We will find more radical Islamists in a Mosque than will will in a Jewish Temple or a Catholic or Protestant Church.”
That i just such a — Ummm — Errr — A Brilliant Statement…
Sort of like GWB’s “Nuculer” threats, eh??
Golly gee, I WOULD HOPE there wouldnt be radical Islamists in Jewish Temples, or Christian Churches. We might find some American terrorists inside the Brnch Davidians, or the Christian Identity movement; or the Brotherhood.
Econ, you didnt address ANY thing that I posted regarding Hagee’s screwed up prophecy, that is straight out of the series, “24″ — OR maybe “24″ is straight out of Hagee’s prophecies.
Now, maybe you might want to actually try to address something that IS posted, instead of wandering off into your own fantasy world?
And, I am Square Peg… Get it?? You keep lying by calling me Chas. Get over yourself!
Econ spouts >>>>
“John Kerry DID meet with our Communist enemies, in Paris France, that is a documented fact.”
So it is. And so did Henry Kissinger also meet with our enemies in Paris. And your point is what? It’s OK for Kissinger, and not for Kerry?
Hmmmm….
::/Chas/Sugar/Das writes -
“So it is. And so did Henry Kissinger also meet with our enemies in Paris. And your point is what? It’s OK for Kissinger, and not for Kerry?”
Kissinger was authorized by the United States Government to attend talks.
Not only was Kerry not authorized, what he did could have gotten him in trouble by consorting with the enemy. I’m surprised it didn’t.
Regular
Posted March 30, 2008 at 4:28 pm | Permalink
::/Chas/Sugar/Das writes -
===============================
And so REGULAR keeps up with the rest of the pack of LIARS…
I am NOT Chas, and who in the hell is Sugar and Das?
I have not seen Sugar or Das on the Blog for as long as I have been here. I do wish you people who want to be taken seriously, would all just grow up.
Apparently Kerry did nothing illegal. Given the government mood at that time, he would have been arrested, tried, convicted, and sentenced for prison if he had done something illegal.
Just another “Swift Boat” line of Bull.
::
Prove that you are not Chas/Das/Sugar.
Prove it. :)
#
: :
Posted March 30, 2008 at 4:34 pm | Permalink
Apparently Kerry did nothing illegal. Given the government mood at that time, he would have been arrested, tried, convicted, and sentenced for prison if he had done something illegal.
Just another “Swift Boat” line of Bull.
—————————-
Or…
Kerry got away with one - consorting with the enemy.
Regular — Why dont you prove you have a real keyboard, and that you are really a veteran, or that you are really crippled, and disabled? Can you prove any of that? On this Blog?
I am a Wichita business owner. My name is very recognizable in this City. I can not, and will not use it on this open Blog. And even more so with the likes of you and your other troll brigade here.
So, just forget about who I am. I am called Square Peg. : : is a lot easier to type. Get over your own self importance. It does not exist, except for in your own mind.
You are nothing more than a flaming troll. And you arent nearly as smart as your would like these sick people to think you are!
Regular, yesterday you stated on the Blog that it is stooooooopid to try to prove a negative. Why dont you follow your own statement! LOL POS
Sure ::, let’s meet at Denny’s on Harry Street in 1 hour, I’ll show you my Military ID card and my gimpiness in person.
You are nothing more than one Chas/Das/Sugar’s many nics.
Business owner eh? What kind of business, fertilizer? :)
I said prove it on this Blog. In front of all of the posters you lie to daily. You cant do it, so why dont you get off of your one trick pony, and either contribute something useful, or crawl back under your troll bridge where you belong. The Blog is tired of your crap.
bawk bawk bawk…
crawl back under your troll bridge is the exact same words that Chas/Das/Sugar uses.
What a lying human being you are Chas.
Now you are talking to a poster that isnt even posting here. I believe you need help, man. Big time!
Can’t go to Denny’s ::/Chas/Das/Sugar ? Watsa matter? Afraid to be found out? :)
Are you suggesting that only one poster is allowed to use certain words? Do you realize how crazy that is? Oh well, consider the source.
And with your “bawk, bawk, bawk,” I guess you are admitting what a Chicken $**T you are! LOL
Regular, I wouldnt walk across the street to meet you, you sorry excuse for an “alleged” veteran!
Keep your flame going long enough, and you will burn yourself out! Hooray for the Blog!
#
: :
Posted March 30, 2008 at 5:00 pm | Permalink
Regular, I wouldnt walk across the street to meet you, you sorry excuse for an “alleged” veteran!
——————————–
Again, another phrase used by ::, that Chas/Das/Sugar uses. (sorry excuse for an “alleged” veteran!)
Even offered to meet ::/Chas/Das/Sugar at Denny’s and show him my Military ID card.
:: is Chas/Daz/Sugar for sure, no doubt about it.
Off to Church, back in a few - have pew cleaning duty. :D
Maybe some day, the Blog Editors will figure out some way of banning Regular from disrupting up every thread s/he posts on. Then again, probably not!
Regular again LIES blatantly >>>>
“:: is Chas/Daz/Sugar for sure, no doubt about it.”
Folks, this is obsession! This poster needs serious help.
“Afraid to be found out?”
Don’t bother, Square, he chickens out when someone takes him up on his offers of a physical confrontation.
He’s just a loser - just ignore him.
Physical confrontation? Who be afraid of dat?
Let’s kick some a**! Advocate violence like WSClark!
Way to go brother!
It wouldn’t be Kansas without a stupid white man in the lead.
How do you think we keep re-electing “term-limit” Tiahrt?
“Advocate violence like WSClark!”
And when have I advocated violence, McCluer?
Dont let racist pigs take over this thread too!!
Rev Wright–
Last week, that would have been clever.
This week, it’s lame.
You should switch your nic to “Rush Limbaugh.” Then you could say whatever you wanted to and pretend it’s true even when it’s not.
LOL CaapN!!
The national polls listed in the header are a few days old.
Three-day rolling average Gallup Poll for 3/29/08
Obama 52% vs Clinton 42%, MoE +/- 3
—
McCain 47% vs Obama 44%, MoE +/- 2
—
McCain 48% vs Clinton 44%, MoE +/- 2
http://www.pollingreport.com/index.html
: :
Posted March 30, 2008 at 5:24 pm | Permalink
Regular again LIES blatantly >>>>
“:: is Chas/Daz/Sugar for sure, no doubt about it.”
Folks, this is obsession! This poster needs serious help
———————-
::/Chas/Das/Sugar even posts in the open thread to whine so he can troll more attention.
It’s a typical Chas/Das/Sugar/:: move.
“It’s a typical Chas/Das/Sugar/:: move.”
And of course, Irregular NEVER nic switches or trolls.
That would be SO unlike him.
/sarcasm/
What a loser McCluer is……. on a good day.
Here is a more appropriate analogy than the inept (and of course, classic bullsh*t)shoplifting one offered by Paul the shill:
Obama says people should respect their grandmothers.
Obama’s friend insulted my grandmother.
Faux Noise runs footage of Obama’s friend insulting my grandmother.
Obama says that his friend shouldn’t have insulted my grandmother.
But, he only said it after his friend had insulted my grandmother.
Obama did not disown his friend, even though he said that he shouldn’t have insulted my grandmother.
Therefore, Obama must approve of insulting my grandmother.
By the same token, McCain must approve of insulting my jewish aunt and threatening my Muslim neighbor, even though he himself never insulted my jewish aunt or threatened my Muslim neighbor, because, after all, he once invited the guy who insulted my aunt and the guy who threatened by neighbor over to a big dinner he had.
Econ 101 evidently never got through logic 001.
the simple minded repukes will vote for crazy ol’ mccain just because all the kids in iraq haven’t been found and killed yet.
a repuke’s gotta have a target to hope to kill or they’re not happy.
Exile, that is the dumbest written statement I’ve seen since Moses saved the Jews.
Can you prove the statement Wrong, Wright?? Or is that just more verbal flatulence from your cranial cavity??
Obama did NOTHING until he was caught!
Caught doing what? What crime did he commit?
He attended church services at a church where the pastor is quite passionate about the injustices practiced against himself and those of his race. Obama has stated that the pastor has been/is his mentor, but I’ve never heard in what distinction that is. Does anyone know? A mentor usually focus on one aspect, not everything.
What really is strange that none of this was brought out in ‘04 during Obama’s Senate race or before at any time during his political career…until now. Can’t “you people” come up with something a little more current? Is this all ya got?
RD — First it was his ears. Then he either wasnt black enough, or too black. Then it was Limbaugh’s stupid song, “Barack the Magic Negro” Now it’s Dr. Jeremiah Wright, a truly great spokesperson for the Black community in America.
And you know what, RD?? The ONLY statement that is even questionable in all of the sound bytes is the one about AIDS and Africa — and even that one has had its conspiracy theorists for a number of years, and cannot actually be proven false.
It is all the white racists tryng to build a case for not electing Obama, for ANY reason they can invent/twist/spin, without actually saying that “America isnt ready for a Black President.”
::
you’ve grown a notch.
Stuff it Sarah!! B***h!!
Square Peg, I guess you could say that IS all they’ve got.
I’m familiar with the AIDS and Africa angle. I’m sure there are those who are as willing to believe it as there are those who are completely UNwilling to consider it. Is it probable? No. But it is possible.
And, Sarah Bellum/Cerebellum, your nick doesn’t fit.
::
Yes, it was legal for Henry Kissinger to meet with our Communist enemies, in Paris France.
That was his duty.
That was his job.
Yes, it was ILLEGAL for John Kerry as a private citizen to give “aid and comfort to the enemy” in any way.
As a member of the U.S. Naval Reserve, it was absolutely, positively illegal for Kerry to work against United States interests and it was absolutely illegal for John Kerry to meet with the Communists in Paris France.
This is probably one of the reasons that John Kerry had his discharge upgraded, under Jimmy Carter’s Amnesty program.
Kerry did NOT get away with it.
Kerry lost an election for President because many of us will not forgive him for meeting with the enemy.
Kerry did get punished, at the time, he got a Less than an Honorable Discharge from the Naval Reserve, and later had to use a “Board of Officers” under Jimmy Carter, to get Carter’s Navy Secretary Claytor to upgrade Kerry’s discharge.
:: = Chas
They both have the same personalty.
They both have the same writing style.
They are both pompous and rude and like to use insults a lot more than the average liberal.
Besides, if you really get Chas:: going, he will forget and use the wrong nic.
Such lies, Econ, and on a Sunday nite too!!
Look you dumb Effin number cruncher… I AM NOT CHAS!!! I AM GETTING FED UP WITH YOU RIGHT WING A$$HOLES AND YOUR FRIGGIN CHAS!!! I know who and what Chas. is. I am not him! I dont want to be him! So, STOP your friggin harassment! I have already spoken with the Blog Editors about your ridiculous fetish with the poster Chas. They are working on it!
NOW, ECON — Why dont you just go join all the rest of your little Troll buddies, whatever bridge they go when their mommies call them home!! I HAVE HAD IT WITH YOUR POMPOSITY, AND YOUR ARROGANCE!!! ECON, YOU ARE NOT GOD! BUT THATS OK, BECAUSE I AM STILL AN ATHEIST!!
RD
It is really very simple:
Chicago politics works in Chicago and the rest of Illinois.
Chicago politics does not work in the rest of the country.
The rest of the country will be turned off by J. Wright and Farrakhan.
Econ101,
As I have said before. What does it really matter?
Even if :: isn’t really Chas, he might as well be. They post in a very similar style, use the same style of insults, both get upset and go off the same way, both quote the same type of bible verses…
Just treat them like the same person and move on. They might as well be if they really are not.
:: Chas
Rush Limbaugh did NOT make up the “magic Negroe” line.
That came from the press, and from other Democrats.
Econ101,
And, as proven above, :: uses the caps when pissed off just like Chas…
Econ101,
Perhaps Chas doesn’t know he is ::. Some split personality problem or something?
Busted Chas ::
“And you know what, RD?? The ONLY statement that is even questionable in all of the sound bytes is the one about AIDS and Africa — and even that one has had its conspiracy theorists for a number of years, and cannot actually be proven false.”
Nobody else on this Blog justifies the AID’s/Wright statement but Chas and ::.
They also use the same argument.
They are the SAME person.
one is a fake preacher.
the other is a fake businessman.
Just respond to the post, not the post-er.
Seems like I heard that from the reich-wing about a thousand times in the past.
Oh, well.
Registration. Bring it on.
Uh huh
What’s “Regular”
That’s ok, everybody knows.
Nathan, Econ — you are both a couple of good for nothing Jesus freaks!! You are both obsessed by your own private egotistical Faith Fetish.
And you know what Econ?? I dont even CARE if Limbaugh made up the “magic negro” line. Because he sure as hell exploited it in a highly charged Racist manner. And THAT is what is important here.
Why dont you two go out somewhere, and SIT on your Bibles… Maybe some of the better admonitions it contains might be absorbed into you in some way…
Both of you need to consider whether you own your faith, or if your faith owns you! I dont worry about some god that cant be seen, or felt, but only imagined in your mind. Not something that I need to think about.
::
Get your schizoid personalities correct
Chas is the “preacher” though he likes to cuss and call names and judge people.
The average “businessman” often had to treat Sunday the same as any other day.
Why don’t you, Chas:: try to keep the Sabbath holy by ratcheting down your insults.
Econ, you are absolutely proving your extent of lunacy. The Africa/AIDS connection has been talked about for at least 20 years. Why dont you actually look up something, before you spout off, and get proven to be totally worthless as hind tits on a boar hog?
Anybody who really CARES about the AIDS crisis in this world knows about the Africa/AIDS connection. The only people who claim to know nothing of it, are right wing, egotistical, self centered A$$holes like you and Nathan, and some others..
Now then, I am done for the night. Talk about me all you want. I am STILL not Chas. I am Square Peg!
I hope you have a really lousy, friggin BAD week — both of you!!
Funny how Rossell and Price yap about a slight possibility that Square and Chas are one and the same, but they have no problem with McCluer and his daily nic switching, trolling and admitted nic stealing.
Funny - could it be that McCluer is just a right wing idiot just like they are?
Maybe McCluer, Rossell and Price ARE one and the same - they use the same convoluted logic, repeat the same old same old over and over again and always seem to be around at the same time.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm………………….
Naw, those are three different people………….
Just as Chas and Square are TWO different people.
Econ, why would I keep anybody’s Sabbath?? I dont have one, nor do I need one. I call it a day off! Which I take every week! Why would I hold down insults against a couple of insult pretend artists? Cant take what you dish out, huh, Econ? What a dumb A$$hole you are! I can only hope your grand kids dont find out what you are really like!
Nathan
Now for my “arm chair diagnosis”
It makes sense if the “base” personality is an atheist. This would be ::
In that way, the :: “businessman” personality would not worry about taking the Lord’s name in vain, in his own posts or in his distortions of the Bible, in his alter ego “Pastor” Chas.
“Now for my “arm chair diagnosis””
Give it up, Rossell, you’re just making an ass of yourself.
Then why the comment about “Sunday Evening” you “Atheist Businessman”???
and — I thought you were leaving.
BOTH of you, lol!
Nathan and paulie are making character judgements?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
One is a serial liar. The other is an idiot.
But it’s easy to get them mixed up!
Econ101
Posted March 30, 2008 at 9:07 pm | Permalink
Then why the comment about “Sunday Evening” you “Atheist Businessman”???
===============================
What the HELL are you obsessing over here???
Econ — Idiot — Its Sunday nite… For you super Christians, you should watch your constant fetish for lying on YOUR holy day!!
For me? Its just another day of the week. Just cant buy beer at Dillons! Ha!
Thanks :C:HAS