More evidence that U.S. health care doesn’t stack up globally: In a new study, America ranked last among 19 industrialized nations — with France, Japan and Australia at the top — in timely treatment of preventable illness, a key indicator of the quality of a health care system. If America had the same quality system in place as the top countries, it would have 100,000 fewer deaths a year, the study said.
Researcher Ellen Nolte said the United States has good medical care for those who have access — but there’s the rub. About 47 million of America’s 300 million citizens don’t have health insurance.
68 Comments
That is because we remain stuck on a private employer based system and those nations are all under good national single payer health programs. I often wonder when the USA will come out of the 18th century and see that Europe and Canada do some things better than we do. We need to switch over to their ways on some things.
A nation that does not care for its people will shortly become a group of people who could give not a whit for the nation.
Randy Scholfield should read carefully the process how the statistics were compiled.
Although the Editor, Randy Scholfield didn’t mention it, I imagine it’s the same old World Health Organization (WHO) survey that has been around for years.
The survey performed by WHO has nothing to do with quality of care, it has to do with access. Comparing privately run systems to Government run systems. If WHO wants to make the comparison fair, then they should include care provided to military members, Congress and other Federal Government employees who have easy 24/7 health care access.
Of course, we have been over this before on the 47 million number. Twenty million of those, at least, are illegal aliens. The remainder of the 47 million are comprised of individuals who chose not to enroll in any kind of health care. This includes people with salaries over 50K per year who choose to buy electronic toys and brand new cars every year instead of buying health insurance.
There are of course some people with low or no income that choose not to get health care because they don’t care enough about their own health. These people qualify for medicaid and other community ran health care clinics. They simply choose not to go and enroll.
Then there are families with several kids with low income. They can get their kids enrolled in SCHIPs and they can get enrolled in many of the individual states “adjusted” health care insurance plans where the plans are state regulated and the rates are lowered for low income family.
Bottom line – people who don’t have health care or health insurance choose not to get it. Either because they are too lazy to find out the facts or in very few cases mentally incompetent and in that case qualify for other programs.
Regular, theres people with health insurance that get bad treatment, just because someone has health insurance dosen’t mean its worth a damn. Some people are denied surgeries by their health insurance for pre-existing conditions. The problem with our health care industry is that it favors the best care to wealthiest people, its is the epitome of a capitalist run health care system gone to hell in a hand basket for the sake of the bottom line. Its an indusrty that actually causes problems for people, instead of people waiting in line for liver transplants we have livers waiting in line for people that will never get the surgery because their insurance will deny or reject their coverage to save their asses money.
Perhaps White Elephant,
You are comparing the most extreme type of health care treatment, worst case scenarios (organ transplant), with health care maintenance.
I can’t even use the fingers up on one hand the number of people I have met in my lifetime who need organ transplant.
Counting the number of people who have access to health care, I don’t have enough paper in my house to record their names.
Yes, I know people who have had problems with health care, but that was decades ago. One was my grandmother, who needed money to get her abdomen drained because of an infection after she had a miscarriage. This was in the 1920s. She and her husband had to mortgage the farm with the loan, then the depression happened. Needless to say, it was a rough time for them.
Their children and children of my paternal grandparents have much better access to health care. A lot were employees of Boeing, Raytheon, Cessna or Railroad. All companies that offer very good health care insurance.
The next generation had even better access to health care.
Those today who complain about access to health care are stuck in the 1930s mindset of “what can the government do to help me.”
It’s funny when you start talking to people about this and it becomes quite apparent they haven’t even tried to get health care or get a job that has health care insurance.
All one hears is one excuse after another and always blaming someone else.
We call those whiners.
Of course, there are some people who are blind, disabled or mentally ill who need assistance. And, assistance can be gained for people in this category. There are so many services that people don’t even consider when they are in these categories.
And in related news…
Health care, not taxes, at top
A poll of local business owners finds that high tax rates run a distant second to their fears over rising health care costs.
http://www.kansas.com/news/story/278181.html
Sad isn’t it? Be it their contribution to their country or the health of the people who make them their living, the bean counting business people sure hate to pay up. Cheap b#43tards.
Regular – I’m afraid you’re wrong about adults being able to get affordable healthcare at reduced rates if they are low income. Kids, yes. Adults, no.
The only thing that is broken in health care is the cost of health care and no one is addressing this problem. The government caused the problem with health care cost crises in America by over socializing (with mandates) medicine to the extent it is not completive.
http://www.InteliOrg.com/
Dr. Coles,
I see you are a man made Global Warming Skeptic. You should stick around and debate cosmos, a regular here, who is an Al Gore fed anthropogenic Global Warming alarmist.
I had company paid health care at one company where I had to check my bank account whenever I went to the doctor. The company had no other choices.
I had a friend die of cancer recently who, because the insurance company denied it, couldn’t go to Tulsa for treatment. Mind you, this wasn’t an experimental treatment.
Regular is way off base is his assumption about the poor or lowpaid workers denying themselves or their family insurance.
Indeed, stumper. Welcome to the age of disposable employees!
In addition to the 45 million uninsured adults in the United States, another 16 million adults were underinsured in 2003, meaning their insurance did not adequately protect them against catastrophic health care expenses, finds a study in Health Affairs. An estimated total of 61 million adults, or 35 percent of individuals, ages 19 to 64, had either no insurance, sporadic coverage, or insurance coverage that exposed them to high health care costs during 2003.
In “Insured But Not Protected: How Many Adults Are Underinsured?” (Health Affairs Web Exclusive, June 14, 2005), The Commonwealth Fund’s Cathy Schoen, Michelle M. Doty, Sara R. Collins, and Alyssa L. Holmgren find that inadequate coverage—much like no coverage at all—creates obstacles to care and other burdens. Underinsured adults are almost as likely as the uninsured to go without needed medical care and to incur medical debt. Lower-income and sicker adults are most at risk of having inadequate coverage.
http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/publications_show.htm?doc_id=280812
About the source:
http://www.commonwealthfund.org/aboutus/
Hmmm. . .misplaced my italics. Oh well.
Just think, if JimBob lived in France, he would have gotten the physical therapy he needs and could do something productive instead sitting around harassing and cyber-stalking people on the WEBlog on the taxpayers’ dime.
But that would be socialized medicine and it would mean that Lenin won.
:roll:
Laters, Komrades . . .
There are few problems with our health care, it’s the access to it that’s the problem. Many peopel who need medical care can’t afford it because their insurance won’t pay for it or they don’t have any coverage at all.
We need to overhaul the whole system so eveyone has access to affordable healthcare. Poor people should have to pay co-pays, even is it’s only $3 for a prescription med. The average working person should be able to get sick and receive treatment without having to go bankrupt. There is a solution for this crisis, and there are many ways to bring down the cost of health care so that the average person can get the health care they need. We need to follow the example of other countries that have achieved basic affordable healthcare for ALL their citizens…not just the rich ones, the poor ones, the old ones, or the veterans.
Yet, look at the profits of the insurance companies and the drug companies..there are those who are getting wealthy off the system that’s in place now.
“Let them eat cake….”
Why do the “non profit” hospitals pay their CEOs absurd salaries and have the monsy to buy up all the real estatein Wichita to build new facilities to compete with all the facilitites that are already out there? How many surgery centers, heart hospitals, diagnostic centers, rehab centers, etc. does one city need?
Arguably, Mary, this proliferation of facilities and services, which some would call competition, increases the costs to all. If all costs of the duplicated services and facilities must be recovered, and there are more of both than there is demand therefor, then, by necessity, the unit cost per patient utilizing the same will be higher, not lower. Thus, if a certain area contains sufficient population to efficiently utilize one CT scanning device (”efficiently” is used here in an economic sense), but in order to have CT scanners at each individual facility operated by separate entities, there are three, e.g., CT scanners serving the same population, in order to recover the costs of acquisition and operation thereof, each facility will need to charge a higher rate than would otherwise be charged if only one such scanner existed within the area.
Everyone screams about needing insurance either gov or private, but isn’t insurance part of the reasons health care costs spiral out of control. If you look at producures not covered by insurance and you find their reasonably affordable
Yes, I’m aware of the dangers of monopoly power in the simplistic example above. Thus, IMO, there needs to be regulation, much as in a public utility situation, which at one time might have existed, but no longer seems to.
Another thought on the simplistic example; if the costs of operation of the scanner cannot be recovered, then the continued existence of the same must be subsidized from other revenue sources, which, carried out to an extreme end, might well result in the insolvency of a particular facility, thereby decreasing the number of the same. This is truly how the market works, no doubt; but if the population, as a whole, won’t go to facility A because it doesn’t provide all the services facility B provides, then whether all these services are needed by any particular patient (or group thereof), facility A will close, thereby resulting in a monopoly for facility B, assuming these are the two facilities available in any given area.
BTW, “non profit” doesn’t mean a particular entity makes no profit. It, from a legal perspective, means that the profits are not distributed to the owners in forms such as dividends, e.g., unlike a “for profit” entity.
If you look at producures not covered by insurance and you find their reasonably affordable
You’ve got to be kidding.
Tom Paine, I concur with Rage. Perhaps you could provide us with some examples so I might think this through.
Free market works both ways. If private insurers find that consumer population A is profitable and consumer population B is not, they will provide coverage to A and not B. Unless you want to pass a law that prohibits corporations from making that choice, in which case you no longer have a free market. If you really want to deregulate, you could allow insurers to drop customers at any time. Then you’ll see health care costs drop!
So, any of you free market advocates ever wonder why people decided to regulate the industry in the first place? Or do you brush it off with a “bowing down to Lenin” quip?
Abortions aren’t covered by insurance cost less than a grand, actually having a baby cost more than ten thousand and that’s for one with no complications, the costs of of elective surgeries, Lasik eye surgery cosmetic surgery, all have decreasing costs. Its simple math if hospitals have a guaranteed income from insurance companies, medicare, their gonna raise their prices, then an asprin costs ten dollars and because insurance pays for a ten dollar asprin they expect everyone to.
This is a biased study, done by a European socialist:
http://www.lshtm.ac.uk/people/nolte.ellen
In short, how many slums are there, in Germany?
How many different racial problems do they have, in Germany?
How many different race-related health problems does Germany avoid, due to their monolithic society?
I’m sided, I’m fairly conservative with a lot of issues, but this is our health care we’re talking about, they should scrap the health insurance industry and include every citizen under the umbrella automatically. The other western countries that have some for of socialized healthcare do not have horrible service, its all spewed propaganda from the private industries in America wanting to keep control. We’re putting a price and profit on peoples health, we may as well legalize slavery again. Health care is not even a hassel in other countries, yet they make us jump through hoops of fire here. The system is set up to promote sickness and promote taking pills and to promote the insurance industry. We’ve been getting sodomized by the health industry and our government for too long, and the system Hilary has in mind wouldn’t help us either. These are things we’re not gonna get unless we protest and march and burn shit to the ground.
I’m not serious about burning shit to the ground, but ya get my point.
And, even though the AUTHOR is biased, the Media is mis-reading much of this biased study:
http://care.diabetesjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/29/5/1007
Diabetes is caused by OBESITY in most cases.
Will Socialized Medicine get you off the couch and keep you out of the refridgerator?
This is what Nolte says:
“CONCLUSIONS—The M/I ratio for diabetes provides a means of differentiating countries on quality of care for people with diabetes. It is solely an indicator of potential problems, a basis for stimulating more detailed assessments of whether such problems exist, and what can be done to address them.”
—-
Nolte does NOT claim that there is a problem. She states that her study should be the BASIS for stimulating more detailed assessments.
Saying our health care, in America, stinks due to diabetes is like saying that our health care, in America, stinks because of illegal drug use.
Health care providers, and health insurance companies, both private and government, can NOT protect us from stupid personal decisions.
Diabetes is OFTEN preventable:
Eat less
Eat better foods
Exercise
Do we want “nationalized gym memberships” next?
How about “nationalized overeaters annonymous”?
White Elephant
You are making a false claim.
Show me a single case where a liver, available for transplant, went unused?
We have a huge waiting list for livers.
Elephant, Im not for burning shit to the ground either but I do believe that the next wave of shootings, since we’ve already at workplace, schools and churches, will be hospitals, targeting doctors and nurses especially if the trends continue of denying care to people with insurance and the massive cost contributing to bankruptcy.
Tom
If a person refuses to purchase health insurance, and can afford it, and then gets sick —
That person took the risk, for both himself and for his other creditors.
“Although the Editor, Randy Scholfield didn’t mention it, I imagine it’s the same old World Health Organization (WHO) survey that has been around for years.”
Actually, from the linked article:
“Researchers Ellen Nolte and Martin McKee of the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine tracked deaths that they deemed could have been prevented by access to timely and effective health care, and ranked nations on how they did.”
“All one hears is one excuse after another and always blaming someone else.
“We call those whiners.”
I am assuming that the above is speculation on your part and that you zero data to back up these contentions.
Econ, maybe we need to treat health insurance like we do home/auto/life if you smoke or are fat then you pay a higher premium if you have a gym membership you get a discount
Paul – off topic. I played a bit further with our arithmetic over at Arena.
“Diabetes is OFTEN preventable:”
Type II diabetes is genetically inherited and it is also the type most preventable in regard to diet and exercise.
Type I diabetes is also on the rise. Some contend that it is caused by viral infection and that this virus is on the rise.
Simple solutions are often not so simple.
Steven
There ARE genetic tendencies for lots for lots of things.
Drug and alcohol addiction has a genetic trigger.
Obesity might have more than one genetic trigger.
Diabetes also, as you stated.
So what?
The person with genetic tendencies should be more careful. The person with such tendencies will reduce the chances of getting diabetes through exercise and weight control.
Diabetes IS preventable!
You can’t have it both ways, libs. This study was supposed to be done on “preventable deaths”.
There is absolutely NO medical treatment to prevent diabetes.
It can only be prevented by lifestyle.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,317809,00.html
Luekemia patient died, denied liver transplant twice by Cigna.
“Diabetes IS preventable!”
Not always Paul. Type 1 usually is NOT preventable. Type 2, the one I have to watch for, generally IS preventable.
The Facts Behind the Nolte Health Care Study
The study by Nolte was paid for by the Commonwealth Fund.
This is a 24/7 publicity machine designed to advance one thing, single payer health care.
The Commonwealth Fund has diverted their focus from helping researchers and those needing health care to one of the more lucrative publicity machine for socialized medicine.
One of the contacts on the updated paper by Nolte is:
Mary Mahon
Senior Public Information Officer
The Commonwealth Fund
212-606-3853
mm@cmwf.org
The “highly regarded” Commonwealth Fund is also the same “highly Liberal” Commonwealth Fund that has been consistently lobbying for a U.S. single-payer health care system.
It’s also important to note that the pioneering” comparative study failed to sample in rural areas internationally where health and access disparities show up. And even then, Americans did as well or better than less diverse and urbanized countries in getting prompt care.
One point, conspicuously absent, is that Americans are the ones paying for global medical innovation.
Indeed, what would survival rates for any number of diseases look like if a nation could only use medicines they helped pay to develop? This “disparity” is unfair to the American consumer and not sustainable. The rest of the world must accept its fair share of the burden for health care R&D. Zero discussion of this by Ellen Nolte, Ph.D. and associates.
Of course, Randy Scholfield, Wichita Eagle Editor, wants to use research that tells you what you he thinks you should hear.
Paul:
Just pointing out that the prevention of Type II is possible by what you indicate – diet and exercise. This is true even though the risk is genetically inherited. I believe I am correct in saying that if one has a first degree relative (a parent, say) who has Type II diabetes, your chances of getting the disease are increased 50% over someone who does not have a first degree relative with Type II diabetes.
The above is not true with Type I diabetes. The physical cause of this disease is known, viz. the dysfunction of the cells in the islets of Langerhans (in the pancreas), what causes these cells to shut down is not known. A virus is suspected. The contribution of genetics in regard of risk for getting Type I diabetes is quite small. Since the diesease’s cause is not known, it is impossible to prevent Type I Diabetes.
Hope that is simple enough for you.
A while back, my Father-in-law found the reciept for my wife’s birth. Total $12.75, including a $3 fee from the doctor, for delivery, five days in the hospital and meals at 25c each. Of course he was earning $7 a week at the time, but it was still less than 2 weeks wages for a poor person. A standard delivery today runs about $2500, with only one day in the hospital, and complications can run that up a 100 times or more.
Back in the late 1950’s nobody had health insurance. The insurance companies hoped to buld a market by encouraging doctors, hospitals, medical equipment manufacturers and drug companies to raise their prices. Unfortunately that beast ran away from them and got a life of its own. Now, even the insurance companies are squawking.
The only way to return to reasonable medical costs is to have a single insurer that controls the market. Private insurance companies can’t do that, and we wouldn’t want them to. A government program, just like the one our congresspeople get, could be expanded to include everyone in the country. It would have to include everyone in order to ensure that there is no second-class treatment for poor people. If everyone has to get the same treatment, you can bet that the rich and powerful will see to its quality!
To see why health cost are rising go to http://www.newstarget.com/012291html indicating surgery is being sold rather than performed when needed. It blew me away.
You missed a dot in your link, “sursum” –
It should be:
http://www.newstarget.com/012291.html
And it was worth reading. To a certain degree.
For-profit healthcare most certainly results in unnecssary procedures. Most doctors don’t own their own practices anymore and the corporate bean-counters most definitely montitor every physician’s profitability.
But the other side of the equation is the tendency, as old as surgery itself, for a doctor with a particular skill-set to apply that skill-set to the problem at hand. An internist might approach ulcers with medication and other non-invasive treatments; a surgically-trained physician might recommend going under the knife. A chiropractor will wiggle your spine. Many courses of treatment are valid in individual cases but the profit motive interferes with the whole process.
A for-profit insurance company may reject needed surgery in favor of less-expensive medication therapy; a for-profit corporation that’s built a specialty surgery hospital may encourage the knife. The chiropractor will keep wiggling your spine.
One of the case-histories in Michael Moore’s “Sicko” was a physician in England. He was well-paid, owned a million-pound home and a hot little Audi sports sedan and was absoulutely astounded that some people in America might consider the treatment he and his colleagues deliver is somehow substandard.
Single-payer non-profit universal healthcare coverage will not diminish the quality of doctors and treatments in America a whit. The bright young people who make it through medical school will be richly rewarded for their efforts and achievements and service to humanity. The blood-sucking middle-men in the for-profit segmenet of the healthcare economy might suffer. Perhaps they can open a payday loan kiosk somewhere instead.
Jed: My tonsils were taken out on the kitchen table by our family doctor circa 1947 and my brother held the either mask. Moneyhawk: I agree that if the only tool you have is a hammer one has a tendency to see all problems as a nail but what the article reads does make me think that unnecessary procedures are being done to benefit the industry, not the patient thus driving up premiums and reducing coverage. I think this was a big thing in the media as well few months ago.
White Elephant
NO, you did not answer the question that I asked.
I believe that the liver that you mention WAS used, in a different patient.
Also, Cigna was correct to question the case you mention.
Leukemia patients are very, very poor candidates for liver transplants or any other type of transplant.
Transplant patients get heavy doses of “anti rejection” drugs. Such drugs would only make any cancer or leukemia much worse.
Also, anti-leukemia drugs are very hard on the liver.
This patient was terminal, no matter what Cigna, or anyone else, decided to do or not to do.
Steven
Why the slam, “hope that is simple enough for you”??
HUH?
Is it not the very PURPOSE of the opening of this thread to claim that we are not doing a good job in prevention?
How do you win that argument by pointing out that some types of diabetes are NOT preventable????
Your point would seem to support me.
Your point would seem to argue against the Nolte study.
But, “Econ101″ –
When you parot the Cigna line (dependent as you are on sales commissions from selling for-profit health insurance policies) with:
“Leukemia patients are very, very poor candidates for liver transplants or any other type of transplant.
“Transplant patients get heavy doses of “anti rejection” drugs. Such drugs would only make any cancer or leukemia much worse.
“Also, anti-leukemia drugs are very hard on the liver.
“This patient was terminal, no matter what Cigna, or anyone else, decided to do or not to do.”
You ignore what Cigna finally decided to do:
Cigna finally *approved* Nataline Sarkisyan’s transplant. Only too late. Just as planned.
It was all a delaying tactic, with Nataline’s life less worthy than Cigna’s profits.
If Nataline wasn’t a suitable candidate for transplant, and Cigna were right in denying the procedure, Cigna would have stuck to their guns, wouldn’t they?
But no.
Monkey
In my opinion, CIGNA should not have backed down.
This was an “experimental” procedure, at best.
Also, the patients own medical team seems a bit biased.
Often, a transplant surgeon gains a “star quality” and can throw his or her weight around a bit, in the medical field. It appears that is what happened, the system failed to begin with: This woman should never have been OFFERED a liver, in the first place.
CIGNA was faced with a rare and ridiculous procedure request.
That request decision was destorted by a powerful surgeon with too much invested in the case to be an honest decision maker.
That request decision was further corrupted and distorted by political activists that got involved for reasons having little to do with this patient.
If YOU were given a list of all the people in the country awaiting a liver transplant, I sincerely doubt that this leukemia patient would be at the top of your list.
That means that this lady, getting a liver, would mean someone else, with a better chance, would die.
Paul,
I was not trying to win anything. Instead I was pointing out the error of your blanket statement that diabetes is preventable. One type is, one type is not. Then I explained why. Sheesh…
You’re just another for-profit insurance company operative who thinks you know more about the practice of medicine than the doctors.
You’re part of the problem, “Econ101.”
Dead people help the bottom line.
Econ101:I have travelled Europe and not seen any slums to speak of in Germany, the UK, Austria, Italy or France. The do have poorer sections because of Black or Islamic immigrants or refugees, but not slums as we understand them. So, does that bring up another problem??????
Sursum
“Jed: My tonsils were taken out on the kitchen table by our family doctor circa 1947 and my brother held the either mask.”
Gee, I had mine out in 1949, and they put me in the hospital and promised me all the ice cream I could eat if I just let them put a mask on me.
Pall,
“Experimental?” Thats a company word for “expensive as hell.” I’ve had you insurers deny treatment as “experimental” that my doctor told me had been standard practice for years. Face it; insurance companies make their money by raising premiums and treating their customers like sh*t! Is it any wonder that we wouldn’t jump at an opportunity to break you a**holes?
Jed
Get real!
Medicaid and Medicare and the VA would have had serious questions about doing a liver transplant on a leukemia patient, as well.
Such a procedure is a dumb idea.
For research, perhaps it makes sense.
Why? Because they could see how long the liver might last without the anti-rejection drugs, or they could try different anti rejection drugs. Some sort of “new” untested treatment might have been tried. Medical and research benefits, for other patients, might have been discovered.
HOWEVER:
The prognosis, for the PATIENT (What insurance is suposed to pay for) was piss poor.
Anyone who says otherwise is lying.
Transplants have a very high rate of failure, in even the best of patients.
A liver transplant, to a cancer or leukemia patient, is so dangerous, and so lacking in possible benefit, to the patient, that this was not justified as anything other than an experiment.
And, was that experiment worth the denial of a good liver to a more medically promising patient?
Jed: I lied. My dad was still in the Army, so it must have been before 1945. You were bribed, I thought it was gonna be fun but my throat really hurt afterwards for a few days even with treats. I learned to stay away from doctors and hospitals though, because the idea in those days was doctors only make you sicker and people go to hosptials to die. Not much has changed.
You know if you try to get your medical needs taken care of by negotiating with the doctor with paying cash in full, no insurance involved, you would be surprise how much of a discount you can get.
Doctors love cutting out the middleman and all that paperwork.
Gee Pall,
I must have missed your graduation, your medical licensing and your residency as a transplant surgeon with an MD! Congrats!
Sursum,
Yeah I was bribed! To this day I’m suspicious of anyone offering free ice cream.
Phillip Morris is campagning against the tobacco tax by providing a number that you can call and they will hook you up with your local representive…I called it and got the office of the honorable Todd Tiahrt, where I left him a message blasting him for opposing the tax because of his vested interest in the tobacco companies, who generously contribute to his campaigns. It’s easy to understand why he would oppose to a tax that would make smoking so expensive that many people would quit, it would cut into the profits of the tobacco companies, the very companies he’s obligated to protect above anything else.
He also voted to cut off funding to the Dept of Justice’s lawsuit against the tobacco companies. In every instance, he has voted in the interest of tobacco companies.
Just think how much we could gain if people stopped smoking..it would go a long way into bringing down the cost of health care for everyone, and the money saved by not having to treat smoking related illnesses could be put to better use for children’s or preventative healthcare. The savings to the taxpayers alone would make it worthwhile.
If you’re interested, the # is 1 866 527 4494. Call and let him know what a scumbag he is for selling out to the tobacco companies.
Jed
To the best of my knowledge, the fraud John Edwards, who is pushing this stupid liver transplant case, and the political hacks on this Blog, who are paroting Edwards, have no medical degree, either.
You liberals are hilarious. You think doctors are “evil” — unless the doctor does abortions or complains about an insurance company or gets a “Messiah Complex” and thinks he can walk on water or cure a terminal patient (by letting other, deserving patients die for lack of a liver)
In the above cases, the Doctor gets Knighted by the Church of Liberalism and made a Saint by the media.
Deny anybody a claim there recently paul?
I understand you all get a kickback for that.
Deviant.
Doing unwaranted operations on terminal patients is:
FRAUD!
Unless, of course, the procedure is done for experimental purposes, which are fully disclosed.
Uncomfortable answering a direct question there Paul?
Pall,
“. You think doctors are “evil””
I’ve never said anything about evil doctors. My physician and I get along just fine. I reserve that label for insurance companies and their lying con men. I certainly don’t want you assholes deciding who lives and who dies, based on their chances of being payers of overpriced future premiums. Insurance in it’s original conception was a good idea, but you bastards have turned it into the second most cruel and criminal scam the world has ever seen. I’m for anything or anyone who will rid the world of that so-called industry and helps us regain its original decency, and my second greatest hope is to watch you in your skivvies in February, trying desperately to sell a cupful of Bic pens on the corner of Douglas and St. Francis. Bye bye.
Jed
Nobody is even proposing a “single payer” health system.
Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, is talking about any big changes in Medicare.
Most of the health insurance I deal with is for those on Medicare.
By the way, our Democrat Governor just put into place a program to encourage the purchase of PRIVATE Long Term Care Insurance.
There will always be plenty for me to do.
However, Liberals, thanks for admitting, once again, that you are motivated by hate and envy.
Juvenile
You really don’t understand much about business in general or insurance in particular.
There are “conflicts of interest” in this business, and what are called “moral hazards” in both medicine and insurance and all financial services, government or private.
Therefore, the people who set rates are different from the people who approve or disapprove claims, and the people who enroll beneficiaries are kept separate, as well.
Checks and balances are in place.
The claims people can not enroll people. They might have an incentive, then, to “cherry pick” only the healthy, which is not legal in Medicare plans or in supplement plans, during “open enrollment” or guaranteed issue periods.
So, no, I do not deny claims.
However, I know what types of claims do get denied.
Liver transplants on cancer and leukemia patients SHOULD be denied.
Pall,
“Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, is talking about any big changes in Medicare.”
That’s funny, everybody I’ve talked to about health care issues (and that’s a lot of people) think that single payer is the only workable way to go. Oh, excuse me, you were only talking about the politicians your industry donates money to?
“Therefore, the people who set rates are different from the people who approve or disapprove claims, and the people who enroll beneficiaries are kept separate, as well.”
Of course they all get their paychecks from the same company.
And why are the weasel words in every policy in 2pt Agate type printed in light gray ink that can only be read under a scanning electron microscope? If your company were actually honest, you wouldn’t need to do that, would you?
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[...] Randy Scholfield placed an interesting blog post on Poor showing for US health care.Here’s a brief overview:More evidence that US health care doesn’t stack up globally: In a new study, America ranked last among 19 industrialized nations — with France, Japan and Australia at the top — in timely treatment of preventable illness, a key indicator … [...]
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