After 15 years of progress in lowering the rate of teen pregnancy, we’ve taken a step backward, as the teen birth rate rose 3 percent in 2006. The study has abstinence-only and comprehensive sex ed advocates pointing fingers, each side saying the other isn’t cutting it.
The fact is if you don’t have sex, you don’t get pregnant. However, children have been raised in a sex-drenched society where sensation trumps healthy sexuality.
Abstinence-only education may have the best of intentions, but until it finds a louder, more compelling way to reach teens, we need to provide teens with all the information they need to deal with the consequences MTV forgot to mention. Comprehensive sex ed, however, should present abstinence as the best option — it is.
Posted by Kristin Mehler
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90 Comments
Abstinence-only sex ed is another version of “people are better off when they’re ignorant.”
That’s an awfully bizarre position for the educational community and people who believe in education to take.
I have no problem with, after how conception occurs, teaching such points as:1. Here’s how a condom works, and here’s how it might fail.2. Here’s how the pill works, and here’s how it might fail.3. etc, etc4. The only thing that CANNOT fail is to not do it in the first place.
Comprehensive sex ed DOES teach that abstinence is best. Coming from the standpoint of “god says don’t do it” is as useful as your parents saying not to do it.
All the abstinence only stuff comes from religious wingnuts. And I was even told by one of those Pure and Simple people that she knows some will fall through the cracks and do it anyway, but that’s ok with her. I guess as long as she feels she did her ‘christian duty’, then whatever happens past that is none of her concern. That’s how awful these people are.
The real irony is that the people who want to preach to our kids that abstinence is the only guaranteed way to prevent pregnancy are the same ones who base their entire religion on a virgin birth.
Abstinence might be the sure fire way to prevent pregnancy… But it seems to me that in our time especially, Sex Ed. means a whole lot more than not getting pregnant… And there is a whole lot of territory that should be covered other than “doing it”!!
Since the dawn of man, human beings have begun sexual activity in the same range of ages, married or not, and irrespective of religion or other prohibitions. The only exception are those systems which keep the sexes apart. It’s biology. We are animals, no more supernatural than a cat or a dog, nor in any more control of our biology. Every thing else is b.s.
Or, when the eggs is dropping, the buttons be popping.
Could it be? An actual moderate at the WE?
A well put opinion Ms. Mehler. If you are going to teach sex ed, you need to teach somewhere between the Virgin Mary and a Porn Star.
Nice web site link on your “nic,” P M… People should really go see that marvelous movie!!
The real irony is that the people who want to preach to our kids that abstinence is the only guaranteed way to prevent pregnancy are the same ones who base their entire religion on a virgin birth.
Oh that’s great, may I steal it please!
I sort of liked that one too, D K!
You know it is funny to me when you think that all the religious nutcases will say NO to any sex ed but total abstinence. They will argue that not having sex will never result in pregnancy. BUT then they turn around and tell children that Mary did not have sex but still got pregnant! What they should be telling their kids is what I told my daughter- if you need birth control, then we will go to the doctor and get it. If you need the morning after, I will get it for you. If you come home pregnant, you will get an abortion. No two ways about it!
The chilrun have abandoned the ways of their parents and grandparents on morality.
No Church – no basic morality to guide them.
All the better for me.
Actually, NO, I wouldn’t say children have abondoned their parents morality. I’d say its just more out in the open.
Heres a scenario, a 20 year old gets a 16 year old pregnant, she won’t tell anybody, she tries to abort it with a wire hanger and pinesol, she and the baby dies from complications, the father finds her, freaks out, then murders her 20 year old boyfriend.
When did this take place, oh in the 1930’s.
In todays age that wouldn’t happen, I think we’ve actually progressed more than anything, even though it dosen’t appear that way.
I also think that promoting abstinence can be almost as bad. We’re telling people not to have sex, a natural function. Then some people become repressed and have pent up sexual energy, that has to come out in some way, and instead of sex, some people turn into sickos and commit sex crimes.
“Today class in Driver’s Ed we will study the principles and how the combustion engine work”.And that is how Sex Ed has been taught, but if you had Driver’s Ed you may recall that was not the main point of interest while taking it. Like a teen driver, teens are not thinking in the principles of the act but rather in the actual end practice of the act. They may not even associate the principles with the practice, since it is the internal unseen part. Nor is their interest in the consequences of the possible accident from the practice.
I have known several who were raised in a household that taught “abstinence only” and attended schools that taught the same. One girl comes to mind, all the teachings flew out the window with one action, the boy gave here a white rose! He had overheard her tell a friend that she would know it was true love and they would be husband and wife. If the boy gave her a white rose, so the boy did and all the teachings were put aside when he wanted to have sex. Where was the harm after all this was the man that would love her forever. Yes she became pregnant and yes the boy left for the hills. Was she ignorant? Of course she was, but had never been taught anything that would have countered that ignorance.
Basic biology should be taught, but basic instinct is also part of basic biology.
There were MANY people who had shotgun weddings back in the old days…you know, when if the boy took off, then the girl was sent away to have her baby. Even as last as the 1970’s, when my own 18yo mother was sent to live with a doctor in order to hide her pregnancy, which her mother insisted that she give up for adoption. And no, she wasn’t into the Woodstock crowd, she was a ‘good girl”.
“What they should be telling their kids is what I told my daughter- if you need birth control, then we will go to the doctor and get it. If you need the morning after, I will get it for you. If you come home pregnant, you will get an abortion. No two ways about it!”
So much for letting a woman control her own body, Kev….you sound like a bit of a control freck to me.
I think sex education should start almost at birth and it needs to include every aspect of biology and sexuality. There is nothing good that comes from ignorance..but we also need to stress that birth control often fails..especially with someone who is too young to take on the responsibility that comes with being sexually active. Kids need to be taught that there is no 100% way to prevent a pregnacy if one chooses to have sex, and we need to bombard them with this info as much as they are bombarded with the message from hollywood that you can have irresposible sex with no consequences.I also hate the way girls are pressured to be sexual in their actions and appearance in our culture..that has been very damaging to young women, not only in their lives, but in their view of themselves. We can’t do anything about hollywood’s influence..but we can start putting more emphasis in eduacation on the reality of being sexually active, both at home and in school.
I wish they’d just come back with the norplant. When I had it, it was 100% effective. Make it an option for people again.
I’d love LOVE LOVE to get my daughter one. She’s almost 18 and certainly doesn’t need a baby in the next 5 years.
Hey look! A new generation Norplant! http://www.implanon-usa.com/consumer/whatisimplanon/faqs/index.asp?C=27968394247002546296&svarqvp2=0#186753
I’m a thinkin I want to get my daughter to the OBGYN!
The deprovera injection is just as effective, and a woman only has to take it once every three months.I think it’s the most effective BC on the market right now.
That Implanon looks pretty good…I wonder how many women have tried it so far and what kind of results they’ve had. It would be nice a woman wouldn’t have to think about BC for 3 years.
Why did they take Norplant off the market?
Wish they could put birth control in the water, and people would have to pass a test before they could become a parent. That would solve a lot of problems.
As always, the liberals here blame religion for all the woes of society when in reality the fault lies with them. Well it is not Christianity, nor any other religion, that is under the illusion that sex is seperate from procreation. That is why they teach that marriage is where sex finds its best expression. It was liberals in the sixties who threw this out of the window and only after that was teenage pregnancy a problem. Along with that came sinlge parenting, abortion, permissive sex, MTV and the biggest elephant in the room AIDS. Your sex ed has done nothing to help the younger generation only make it worse.
john stone, yer still insane. But please say hey to aaron for me!
“john_s” offers:
“It was liberals in the sixties who threw this out of the window and only after that was teenage pregnancy a problem.”
What a totally absurd comment.
Liberals believe the pill is a guarentee against pregnancy. But if the guarentee fails there is abortion. So they lie first and to cover the lie they resort to outright murder.
“I also hate the way girls are pressured to be sexual in their actions and appearance in our culture..that has been very damaging to young women, not only in their lives, but in their view of themselves.” – Mary Caurso.
I agree with that… well said. But I am sure you can do something about hollywood.
The logical projection of what YOU are saying john_s, is that sex is ONLY for producing children.
I think we are a bit more.. evolved than that. Most of us anyway.
Someday, maybe soon, we will have a medical means to turn on and off our reproductive organs. I think we can wait for THAT as opposed to turning off our brains.
“”"The chilrun have abandoned the ways of their parents and grandparents on morality.
No Church – no basic morality to guide them.
All the better for me.”"”
Huh?? Most of the kids today that are teens are children of parents who came up in the 70s and 80s. Hardly a great Purtitan period!
…and how do teenage pregnancies happen, J R? Liberals forget that along with sex as an expression of love, it is also life giving. The way TV portrays sex does not present all the facts.
“”"Heres a scenario, a 20 year old gets a 16 year old pregnant, she won’t tell anybody, she tries to abort it with a wire hanger and pinesol, she and the baby dies from complications, the father finds her, freaks out, then murders her 20 year old boyfriend.
When did this take place, oh in the 1930’s.
In todays age that wouldn’t happen, I think we’ve actually progressed more than anything, even though it dosen’t appear that way.”"”
You are right. Today the girl would get a SAFE and LEGAL abortion during which a DNA sample would be taken from the aborted fetus and the father would talk to the District Attorney who would then see to it that the 20 year old spent the next 10 years in prison (mandatory minimum here in Georgia) for aggravated child molestation. The law here is so strict that even sex between a 17 and a 15 year old will get the 17 year old 10 years. The law is no sex with anybody under 16 regardless of age. For those 16 and 17, sex is allowed only if the other person is no more than 2 years in age different. So a 20 year old would go to prison until he was 30.
I don’t think planned parenthood and their ilk would send their bread and butter to jail. A 20 yr old man who impregnates someone and forces her to have an abortion is an economic boom for PP. Maybe in Georgia it might happen but California and NY…forget it. I wonder if Tiller sent helped send anyone like that to jail here.
“”"So much for letting a woman control her own body, Kev….you sound like a bit of a control freck to me.”"”
This is what I have told my daughter. I would not in reality try to force an abortion on her if it did happen. But she needs to know that having a baby as a teen leads to nothing but trouble. Finish high school and then have babies if you want. In fact I would prefer she finish college but she will be 18 come spring and can do what she desires. The thing is that you can cope better and even continue college with a baby. You cannot in high school. Have a baby in high school and your life is basically over before it ever even started.
John — MANY MANY states have harsh punishment for males who have sex with underage females. If you would maybe look up the figures, instead of pontificating, you would know that.
“”"As always, the liberals here blame religion for all the woes of society when in reality the fault lies with them. Well it is not Christianity, nor any other religion, that is under the illusion that sex is seperate from procreation. That is why they teach that marriage is where sex finds its best expression.”"”
How do you know this? Some of the best sex I ever had was way before I was married! Sex is natural. Especially for a teenaged boy. Sex is what life is about for many of them. And if you try to deny it to them, they will find a way to do it. They might even turn to masterbation which would have a bad effect on their eyes! (something else the church taught us all!)
I remember wr back in the late 50s when a girl would ‘go away and live with her aunt’ for a while. We all knew what was going on.
The more things chnge the mor tey stay the same.
Not to mention hairy palms, Kev! LOL
Well it was mostly liberals doing the pontificating on this thread. So I thought I would put in my two cents.I feel sad for your wife Kev. If sex is natural why aren’t you having sex with other women while you are married? You can tell your wife, it is natural.Sex is what life is for a teenage boy … that is sad. It just makes girls as sex objects.
Some people need to be sentenced to about 48 straight hours listening to Billy Joel’s “Only the Good Die Young”….
Comprehensive sex ed, however, should present abstinence as the best option — it is.Posted by Kristin Mehler
What’s a nice Jewish girl doing writing meshugganah shiksa?
Given enough time, everybody becomes mayo on white bread in Wichita . . .
Even the well-known Yehuda Ann Landers had the same streak of annoying and banal puritanicalism.
….somebody is pissed with Kristin. ‘puritanicalism’? huh
If preaching abstinence worked, john, it would have worked by now . . .
….the same can be said about sex ed.
Kids imitate adults, that is one of the first rules to raising children.Mary Caruso said it right with her comment but with the children raising children society of today, it should not be that hard to understand the failures.
Sorry, no.
Every public school student has not been subjected to comprehensive sex-ed, taught by a knowledgeable instructor in a fact-based presentation.
When my kids were in high-school, I asked the simple question once at dinner–when is a woman most likely to get pregnant during her menstral cycle?
None of the three could tell me. This is simple biology–but I wasn’t taught it in high school either.
The answer by the way is when intercourse occurs a few days before or right at the moment of ovulation–for most women, 14 days BEFORE the start of their period.
Sorry, “john_s” –
It’s as if you are posting from a hundred years ago. You seem sincere but woefully ignorant of reality.
A hundred years ago, the prevailing myth was that females were innocent flowers, good for only making babies (”doing their ‘wifely *duty*’”)
The prevailing “conservative” wisdom led to Prohibition, short skirts, flappers and Garbo and Harlowe and the stunning realization that sex feels good… even for girls! (Let’s forget for a moment the centuries-old role of “sirens” and “temptresses” and that feminine seduction has been a part of literature and mythology since the beginning of time. Let’s forget that Romeo and Juliet were 14-years-old.)
And, let’s forget the War Babies of World War II. No, let’s blame the Pill and the free-love hippies of the sixties! *They* are the ones who invented sex!
How patently absurd.
Comprehensive sex education should go beyond “don’t do it.” It defies hormones and the basic human urge to be close to another you love, or are attracted to, or who can make you feel good.
And sex has consequences. Comprehensive sex education should address those consequences. And it does, far beyond simplistic, “just say no” platitudes.
You’re not dealing with a two-year-old who might be told and might be obeyed with a simple “because I said so” when they’re told to not run into the street. You’re dealing with real live human people who are hard-wired to reproduce, just like every other living organism in the universe.
Despite the frequent posts on wedge issues that occur on this forum, and despite the repeated demonstrations of selective ignorance or idealistic fantasies of what *should* be, the cold hard facts of reality deserve to be considered in public debate.
I know nothing about you, “john_s” or your background or your family’s or whatever got you to your world-view. But it seems quaint, reactionary, and desperate for a world that no longer exists… and never did.
And, good for you, “john_s!” We need idealists in the mix! We need purists, and perfectionists, and devoted moralists to remind us of how our humanity is constrained by bigotry, theology, bigotry, tribal loyalty (and its offspring, patriotism).
The diference between so-called “liberls” and “conservatives” is, in my opnion, we Liberals never stop asking questions and “conservatives” somewhere along the way are convinced *they* have all the answers. We see it in the evolution threads, we see it in the reproductive-rights threads, we see it in the Republic vs. Democratic Party threads.
I read this thread and start to laugh but then I just shake my head. Sound like free love hippies who never grew up.
To paraphrase a few:
“The kids are gonna do it no matter what”. ‘If they don’t have sex, they’ll turn into sex criminals, man” “We are just animals man. We got no control.” draw, puff, puff.. exhale.
Come on, you can do it. Just because we screwed things up in our own lives is no reason not to promote the best for kids today, who may be our kids or grandkids. You won’t be a hypocrit, you’re being an adult.
“outlander” offers –
“Just because we screwed things up in our own lives is no reason not to promote the best for kids today, who may be our kids or grandkids.”
I think I speak for most people when I say, “Huh?”
It’s lie that moment in the old film “Chinatown,” when Faye Dunnaway and Jack Nicholson go throught the the scene:
“She’s my daughter!”(slap)”She’s my sister!”(slap)”She’s my daugher!”(slap)”She’s my sister!”(slap)”She’s my sister *and* my daughter!”
So which are they, “outlander?”
“…kids today, who may be our kids or grandkids”?
As Ricky Ricardo said to Lucy, “You’ve got a lot of ’splainin’ to do!”
M.H.- Insert “own” at the appropriate point.
I’m surprised that you couldn’t figure that out with your “own” big brain.
I expect liberals to go ‘bigot’, ‘bigot’, ‘theocracy’, ‘theocracy’ when presented with arguments that go against their deeply held ideological beliefs. But I never expected it in a discussion about sex ed. Well anyway liberals will be liberals.
You talk about things a hundred years ago and forget what is going on now. There is a hyper-sexualization in todays world and you give that a free pass. Liberals are not able to see the dangers of this, one of which is teenage pregnancy, because of their biased world view.
Here is my take on the difference between liberals and conservatives. Liberals remind me of the emperor in the story the emperor’s new clothes.
The average age of first sexual experiene hasn’t changed in 200 years John S. In earlier times, girls married earlier, and boys had brothels.
Yeah, well, “john_s” –
In your version, the Emperor *never* got naked.
… In your version, did he take sex ed?
Monkey Hawk,Here’s what I told my kids and grandkids: “If you don’t do sex right, it’s not worth the effort. If you do it right, even forgetting about STD’s and pregnancy, it’s the most dangerous thing two people can do outside of dueling it out at high noon on Main Street!
When you do it right, you place everything you are, every hope and dream, your entire identity, in the hands of another person. You have to trust that person not only to love you, but to never say the wrong thing at the wrong time, and they have to trust you the same way. One slip of a tongue can devastate both of you in ways that often can’t be repaired. When you find that person you can trust completely, and can be the person they can trust, then sex, with protection, will be the most wonderful experience you will ever have.”
It’s sad to think that our own expectations for our children and grandchildren are so low. I agree that abstinence-only isn’t adequate. What I don’t except is that if we don’t explain that the risk of pregnancy is sometimes the least of what you can catch with promiscuous sex we are missing the boat.
I raised boys and they got a little different talk than daughters would have received. Thankfully I have a very good rapport with my 16 year old grand daughter. We can and do talk about everything. She sometimes surprises me with her openness but no topic is off limits.
She told me a very sad story last week. A new girl started at her school recently. She was pregnant. My GD was friendly with her and she came in on the second class day with a ‘picture’ of her baby to share. She had just had a sonigram and wanted to share the picture. Sixteen when the most complicated thing that should have been on her mind was what to wear to school the next day.
We fail our kids when we don’t give them both sides of this argument. We fail them when we don’t talk about the very real emotional effects of an abortion will have on them. We fail them when we don’t discuss STD’s with them and tell about the long term effects of these. We fail them when we allow rampant sexuality to permeate every facet of their young lives and call it entertainment.
To every parent that is content to let MTV raise their children I challenge you to do better. Open a dialogue. Be available to set down and listen. It might surprise you what you hear.
Beautiful Jed. When did committment become a four letter word?
If it worked for you, “Jed,” fine.
If you really think sex is, “the most dangerous thing two people can do outside of dueling it out at high noon on Main Street!” I think you’re overstating the case.
But, yeah. There are consequences to sexual activity, and those consequences should be the responsibility of mature minds. (I’ve been waiting for somebody to bring up the canard of statutory rape, beastiality, and pedophilia. Those aren’t relevant issues to the vast majority of human beings. But those arguments seem to crop up in these kinds of discussions.)
I prefer to consider normal boys and normal girls and what happens to a lot of them, normally, in the course of adolescence.
The healthiest kids I know have been taught what happens to them when their sexuality develops during adolecence. And they know about the consequences.
The 15-year-old football player wants to fuc# the cheerleader — and she wants to fuc# him — but they have been educated to consider the consequences. Maybe they’ll decide to not have sex. Maybe they’ll decide to take precautions. Maybe they won’t consider the consequences, even though they *should* know better.
But most kids — as are most humans — are fairly rational human beings. And if they’ve been given adequate education as to the likely consequences of their actions, most people will choose to do the right thing.
There will still be irrational people who become serial killers. There will still be irrational people who rob banks. There will still be irrational people who have unprotected sex at age 14.
But the best-est chance of reducing those numbers of irrational people is to teach them to think rationally.
“Just say no” is about as irrational approach I can imagine.
But that seems to be the “conservative” mode of choice.
Granny,I didn’t need to talk to them about commitment; my whole life has been about commitment, and if they didn’t pick it up by example, there was no point in talking to them at all!Also remember that commitment comes in many forms, only one of which is marriage.
Monkey Hawk,”If you really think sex is, “the most dangerous thing two people can do outside of dueling it out at high noon on Main Street!” I think you’re overstating the case.”
You will note that I prefaced that with the stipulation “If you do it right.” That’s the key to the whole statement.
Way too many people don’t understand or are afraid to do it right, and completely miss out on the real thing.
My point exactly Jed.
Ksgrm, we have found a subject we can agree on… I have lost too many friends to HIV/AIDS… We really need to teach the full range of Sex Ed. to our youth…
I was referring to the new thing called ‘hooking up’. My GD told me this is something talked about on MTV. It is where you go to a bar and take the good looking guy you just met back to your apartment for sex. Just good clean fun.
But what do you know about his/her former sex partners. Remember you are sleeping with them too in a medical sense. How do you know they aren’t the next Ted Bundy. Have we forgotten Emily Sander?
When we are giving them sex ed it isn’t just about sex or shouldn’t be.
That’s one Chas. Maybe there are others.
When we are giving them sex ed it isn’t just about sex or shouldn’t be.
Posted by: ksgrm | December 08, 2007 at 03:54 PM
=========================THAT is absolutely right on target!! Bingo!!!
Sex is one subject you can’t know too much about. It’s the ones who are in denial or who are ignorant about their own biology who usually end up in trouble. And it’s not like unwanted pregnancies started in the sixties, John S.
My mom, who would have been 95 in November, told me that when she was in high school, a friend came to her crying because she was pregnant, her friend didn’t think she could get pregnant because her boyfriend told her that “it wasn’t big enough”!I still remember a girl in high school who told me that she couldn’t get pregnant because the only time she had sex was when she “wasn’t on her period”!I’d say ignorance has made many kids into parents since the beginning of time.We need to take the shame out of sex also. How many kids don’t use birth control because that means they actaully planned to have sex?It’s a normal human function, best when saved for a committed, mature relationship…that’s what kids need to be taught, not that it’s a sinful, shameful act unless one is married.
So maybe you should define your terms, “Jed,” and not be so presumptuous to assume *your* definition of doing it “right” is the only answer.
Frankly, I never got what some people get as a kick by watching pornography. It all looks like pistons and “Industry on Parade” to me. I never could understand video stores who got hundred of new porn films in stock every month. But it works for some people, otherwise there wouldn’t be a market for it, would there?
I am personally repulsed by the concept of sado-machosism but have been around long enought to know that’s what works for some people. Go figure.
If your most erotic fantasies involve only your married-for-life spouse, groovy. It’s really none of my business.
If your 15-year-old daughter’s only goal in life is to lay the entire starting defensive linemen in her high school, I suspect she needs counseling that goes beyond her sexual fantasies.
Silly me. I think, perhaps, she might be better off if she were exposed to comprehensive sex education that addresses the consequences of her desires. “Just say no,” probably won’t be effective.
Mine isn’t a position of anything goes, if it feels good do it. Rather, it’s an understanding that for a lot of people, “doing sex the *right* way” is an issue that just might not be the exclusive domain of, say, “Jed.”
As I said in an earlier post, if your approach to your kids, that “..sex is, ‘the most dangerous thing two people can do outside of dueling it out at high noon on Main Street!’” worked for you, fine.
One can only wonder how your approach to sex education might be institutionalized. Because, you know, that’s the issue at hand.
I think kids ought to know what’s happening to them as they become sexually mature. That includes helping those people whose sexual identity might turn them toward same-gender attraction. That include understanding that there are consequences for acting in sexual urges before one is prepared to deal with the consequences.
When “conservatives” try to reduce the issue to “just say no,” they demonstrate a desperate desire to reduce real-life issues, actions, and consequences to bumper-sticker mentality.
For some of us liberals, real life is a bit more complicated that political boilerplate.
Amen to that, M H!!!
“”"I feel sad for your wife Kev. If sex is natural why aren’t you having sex with other women while you are married? You can tell your wife, it is natural.Sex is what life is for a teenage boy … that is sad. It just makes girls as sex objects.”"”Number one is that I have a wife so I don’t need to and number 2 is that, as I age, sex is less and less important.
“”"When my kids were in high-school, I asked the simple question once at dinner–when is a woman most likely to get pregnant during her menstral cycle?
None of the three could tell me. This is simple biology–but I wasn’t taught it in high school either.”"”
Soooo what is the correct answer to that?
Kev that answer was posted somewhere upthread earlier. Not sure what time, though.
Cf Black Hand,You have quite a collection of euphemisms! But wouldn’t it be easier just to learn the proper spelling of “M-A-S-T-U-R-B-A-T-I-O-N ?” Then, since you won’t need them, you can send them to the Smithsonian for their American Folklore Archive.
The answer is during ovulation, which occurs around 14 days after the start of the last menstruation.
But that can be skewed if a woman has taken birth control and misses too many days or stops.
Or takes antibiotics and other medications.
Public schools suck. My kids are both in 2nd grade, coming home and telling me about their “girlfriends” and boyfriends”. I ask the children if the teachers hear this talk at school and they answer that the teachers hear it. Now I know that the useless teachers will tell me that it’s “not their job” to “raise our kids”. Excuse me, retard, you have a captive audience for the greater part of the daylight hours and unless you are even more retarded than I believe you already are, you would have an inkling that a 2nd grader ought not have to think about girlfriends and the like at 7 years old. No matter how “cute” you think it may be.
Pleefer, if the [public schools suck so bad send your kids to private school.
Newsflash it is Not the teachers job to raise your kids. Do you call people retards in front of your kids? hope not.
Kids were having boyfriends and girlfriends in grade school forever. Didn’t you have one.
HA! I remember in 3rd grade a little boy who sat behind me gave me note that asked me to marry him…Sister Basil got hold of it..took us up in front of the whole class and gave us an ass chewing I’ll never forget…even threatened to tell out parents if she “ever saw a note like this again”!Needless to say…we got the message really early that attraction between a boy and a girl was shameful and sinful…no wonder there are so many messed up Catholics today!
You’re all over the map dude.
1. I would send my kids to public schools but the private schools are nothing more than Christian indoctrination plants. And I can’t home school because both my wife and I have to work in order to pay for the entitlements of the other kids whose parents don’t work.
2. No, it isn’t the teachers job to raise my kids. But if everyday, I must deprogram the bs they they allow to go on at school out of my kids’ heads then they have a slight responsibility to not allow semi-adult behavior from kids.
3. Yes, I do call people retarded in front of my kids. Isn’t the bs term for retarded, “mentally challenged”? So I’m alright to say “retard” as it is not offending the mentally challenged. Gotta love political correctness.
4. Don’t force your acquiescence to kids and the acclimation of sexual behavior on me or my kids. This is why kids screw each other and are pregnant at 12, because you say it’s “ok” and “innocent” to do it at 7 years old. Not only do I have to watch what these teachers are putting in my child’s brain, I have to fend off the dumb ass parents of the other kids. If my kid is not allowed to draw a friggin gun on a piece of paper without getting expelled, then your kid shouldn’t be allowed to “come on” to my kid. Can my kid make a bong in ceramics class in the 2nd grade (it’ll be cute)? If you want your kid to be a little whore, that’s fine with me. But don’t get too offended when my kid calls your pregnant kid a “retard”.
I’m not saying anything about atrraction to one another. But with the lawsuits against kids that hug each other, you are confusing the kids. And my kids are talking about “getting tongue” and all that nonsense. True, they don’t know what they are talking about. But that is the scary part, hell half the idjits that have babies now, don’t know what they are talking about. Lets do it right, let’s just make a class of sexual relationships. We’ll get em screwing early, teach them the right way to “do it”. Parents won’t have to do “the talk” and men and women will be “satisfied” later on in life. All because we let the government teach us how to screw.
I wish that parents would screen what their kids watch on TV, video games, music, etc…our culture is so saturated with sex that we shouldn’t be surprised when children mirror it back to us. It’s true that children learn what they live. I hate it when I see children exposed to adult themed entertainment, but we have so many immature parents today who don’t have a clue about how to raise children in a healthy home environment. I would love to see parenting and relationship classes required all four years of high school…I would have used that sort of education much more than I ever used Algebra.I can empathize with your frustration, Pleefer. I’m glad I’m not rasing my kids in the MTV culture today..I’m grateful they’re grown now.
You understand Mary, thanks.
My sad story is that I have no television at home. I can’t keep my kids from being social and when my daughter goes to a friends house and gets to play with the Bratz dolls and then comes home to “boring ol boardgames and coloring books” it makes it very hard. I know I’m not the only one who deals with this and understand, I’m no puritan, but there are certain things I don’t want to introduce my kids too at this early age. Bratz help to teach our daughters how to be spoiled little Paris, Britney wanna-be’s and it gets carried over to school life. I love freedom and I want it to be known that I hold firm that it’s freedom to watch Bratz and if you must, so be it. But I do feel sorry for the teacher of my children. I will always give my kids the other side. When my son wanted to bring a candy cane for his two “girlfriends”, the teacher scolded him for not bringing them for each classmate. I told him to tell the teacher that in his house we aren’t socialists and that life doesn’t work that way. Not everyone gets to win and not everyone is equally smart or pretty or athletic. Schools need to just stick to teaching reading, writing and arithmetic. And that’s another thing…what’s with the phrase, “teaching the three R’s”? Have we become that stupid as to okay the word “writing” to begin with an R? That may sound trite, but it’s still a symptom.
Why do our schools need to have all of this social engineering going on? I thought that was the job of those who are “supposed to raise our kids” (the parents).
Waaay too much double-speak.I may sound like I’m attacking the teachers. I’m not, half of my family are either teachers or administrators and my Grandma taught for 40 years and told me to put teachers to task and ask questions. Needless to say, I wasn’t a favored student in school. And with any luck my kids won’t be either.
We read books in my house.
Pleef,All I can say is that I truely pity your children.
Who asked you Jed? Truly.
Pleef,At some point the rest of us will have to cope with what’s left of your kids.
Why would you pity Pleefer’s kids, Jed? It sounds like Pleeper is actually taking the right road, which is almost always the hardest one.My grown kids don’t have TVs in their homes, and I wasn’t even allowed to buy a Barbie doll for my granddaughter. My grandkids have parents who take them to the park and library, they spend a lot of time reading and doing crafts (they’re making candles for everyone for Xmas). They dance, play musical instuments and play outside a lot…in other words, they’re getting to be KIDS!It takes a lot more effort than just letting them watch whatever they want on TV or allowing them to spends hours on the computer or playing video games..but it pays off by not having kids who are looking for someone to “hook up” with at the age of 10.I’m very proud of the parents my kids turned out to be, they are much better at it than I ever thought about being.Keep up the good work Pleefer…you’re doing the right thing by holding teachers accountable and setting boundries for your kids so they can actaully have a childhood.
BTW, I HATE the Bratz dolls, they look like prostitutes and model to little girls that happiness is dressing like a hooker and being selfish..pretty pathetic rolemodeling.
What do you mean Jed? What’s left of my kids? Explain yourself please.
What do you mean Jed? What’s left of my kids? Explain yourself please.
I want Mary in my family. She gets “it”. I want my children to be able to sit in a room with anyone and have a conversation. I’ll do whatever I can do to make sure that my kids are using everything god has given them. And if you don’t believe in God, then I’m letting them use whatever goo, DNA and molecular structure they were given during conception.
I guess there aren’t many leaders left.
Jed:Please, please, walk on by!!
Well, Jed?
Pleefer good for you. If only more parents loved their kids as much as you do.
Indeed,My kids are my life. I don’t care too much about “keeping up with The Jones’” what I care for is giving them a chance intellectually. It’s not like I can afford all of the little trinkets and baubles that seem to matter to most kids (and their parents) anyway. I feel sort of bad in that I told them this year about Santa. People look at me funny when I say that, but I look at it another way. My wife is deeply spiritual and I am to a point. So my logic is that how can I explain that Santa, The Easter Bunny and the Tooth fairy aren’t real, but God, yes he’s real. I’m sorry I lied all of this time, but believe me now, God is real. You may think that this is way over my kids’ thinking and that I should let them be kids. Maybe so, but I want my kids to trust me and to be able to come to for anything. Besides, why should I let the fat-man take credit for the stuff I do get to buy for my kids?