Bill Shaheen, a national co-chairman of Hillary Clinton’s campaign, told the Washington Post that Democrats should give more thought to Barack Obama’s admissions of illegal drug use when he was young, saying that Republicans would exploit it. Sounds more like a panicked Clinton team is trying to do the exploiting.
Posted by Phillip Brownlee
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148 Comments
He pre-empted the strike.
Americans can forgive anything except lying.
And that’s why we hate Bush.
He’s President Liar:
“The vast majority of my tax breaks benefit those at the bottom of the economic ladder.”
67 percent of the benefits went to the top one percent.
“I’ll fire anyone who leaked Valerie Plame’s name.”
In fact, he commuted Scooter Libby’s sentence for lying about that very issue.
“There’s a new sheriff in town, one dedicated to fiscal responsibility.”
In fact, he grew government spending by a full third in 7 years, faster than Johnson or any other president in history. The national debt (as a percentage of GDP) has risen to a post-war high.
“We don’t want the final proof, the smoking gun, to be a mushroom cloud over an American city.”
Saddam Hussein had no WMD’s or nuclear weapons or nuclear weapons programs as Bush well knew. He cherry-picked intel from sketchy sources (cf. “Curveball”) to justify a foregone conclusion.
“I would never commit US troops without an exit strategy.”
Exit strategy. Yeah. Right.
BUSH: We will stay the course. [8/30/06]
BUSH: We will stay the course, we will complete the job in Iraq. [8/4/05]
BUSH: We will stay the course until the job is done, Steve. And the temptation is to try to get the President or somebody to put a timetable on the definition of getting the job done. We’re just going to stay the course. [12/15/03]
BUSH: And my message today to those in Iraq is: We’ll stay the course. [4/13/04]
BUSH: And that’s why we’re going to stay the course in Iraq. And that’s why when we say something in Iraq, we’re going to do it. [4/16/04]
BUSH: And so we’ve got tough action in Iraq. But we will stay the course. [4/5/04]
8/22/06
George Stephanopoulos asked about James Baker’s plan to develop a strategy for Iraq that is “between ’stay the course’ and ‘cut and run.’”
Bush responded, ‘We’ve never been stay the course, George!’
Obama does drugs and Capn makes this the “Hate Bush” thread?
IF Obama has kicked his Cocaine addiction, he should allay any fears the voters may have, by taking a drug screen test and releasing the results to the public.
If he can’t do that, then he is still using drugs.
Hey Max,
How does…
“Mostly he smoked marijuana and drank alcohol, he wrote, but occasionally he would snort cocaine when he could afford it.”
…translate into “cocaine addiction?” Is it only in your mind, or is this today’s Fascist-Wing Talking Points?
How many recreational Coke users you know Tom who are NOT addicted?
And if Obama is clean, he should have no objections to taking a drug screen test and making the results public.
What does he have to hide?
When bush was asked about his drug use he just refused to talk about it.
Congress should order bush to submit to a drug test.
And, of course, Democrats NEVER lie. Nope…not under oath, especially.
“I never had sex with that woman…”
Americans can forgive anything except lying.
And that’s why we hate Clinton.
He’s President Liar:
Afterall, isn’t that who Phil was referring to when he stated:
“At least Obama is honest about inhaling”
Isn’t Bill draft-dodging Clinton the famous originator of, “I didn’t inhale.”
Like he didn’t have sex with that woman?
Fess up or lie. How can you live with yourselves?
Nice way of not answering the question, Max. You accused Obama of being a cocaine addict. Back it up. That’s how it used to work in this nation, remember? Innocent until proven guilty?
Oh wait, the so-called “conservatives” have turned the notions of innocence and guilt completely around. Nevermind, Max, it’s okay. Don’t worry about actually answering the question, or actually backing up your bullsh!t with facts.
LMMFFGAO!!!!
BILL CLINTON!!! BILL CLINTON!!!
The last desperate refuge of the intellectually dishonest heirs of what used to be the Republican Party.
“How can you live with yourselves”
I ask myself that same question about greedy health care denying Republicans all the time.
Max–
All of them.
I knew at least a dozen recreational cocaine users in college and immediately after.
None of them were addicted or became addicted, and they all stopped using many years ago.
Ditto with pot & LSD. In fact, of many, many acquaintances who used a variety of drugs, I only know of two who were addicts–one to heroin and the other to alcohol.
Except for opiates and meth, most drugs are much less physically addicting than nicotine. And booze is pretty bad too–ever see an old rummy go too long without a drink, not pretty.
“Americans can forgive anything except lying.
And that’s why we hate Bush.”
But…when proven lies are pointed out to Capn..he screams “last desparate refuge” and the rest of his pat answers.
Can’t have it both ways..either Americans hate liars or they don’t…and Clinton lied under oath. Fact. And your posturing will NEVER change that.
There should be mandatory unscheduled drug screening for the Pres., and in the current case, mental health screening.
I actually believed Clinton when he said he didn’t inhale.
I’ve done that too–many times. You’re with a bunch of pot heads, you don’t want to look like the narc, so you take a few hits, just to be sociable but you don’t really want to get buzzed right then. It’s not that unusual.
Also, Clinton was a victim of an alcoholic step-dad. It’s entirely possible he felt no attraction for intoxicants.
I agree though that Clinton lied about the Monica Lewinisky scandal. That didn’t involve a never-ending war, however.
Taz,
I guess “complete and utter cluelessness” would describe you fairly well, huh?
1. I’m not Capn. But thanks anyway for the compliment ;)
2. The thread isn’t about Bill Clinton. It’s about Barak Obama.
3. Max lied. Blatantly. He then tried to cover his lie by spinning and dissembling.
4. “American Way” helped cover for Max by screaming BILL CLINTON!!! BILL CLINTON!!!
5. You complete the circle, jerk, by misattributing the comments I made, and by mischaracterizing the context in which they were made.
Nice try at bullsh!t, though.
I was quoting Capn, not you. It is not really all about you, y’know.
Amazing. CapnHalftruth takes up so much space and takes leaps of logic that would scare most superheroes. But not CapnHalftruth. He sees into the minds of mortals and can see their intent to deceive when the future doesn’t occur as they predict. His secret? CapnHalftruth sees through hate vision lenses.
Translation:
Obama: “Yes, I supported the Columbian Drug Lords who enslaved people in their country so they could provide me with “nose candy.”
It’s true that Clinton lied.
The difference is that most of the time, he told the truth.
Bush hardly ever tells the truth. The vast majority of what he says is false.
I swear, the man lies even when he doesn’t need to just to stay in practice.
“When I saw that first plane hit the towers,” Bush said on 9-11, “I thought, that’s one bad pilot.”
Thing is, that he never saw the jet hit the tower. He was in a car on his way to an elementary school.
He didn’t need to lie for any reason, but he did anyway.
Now, that’s a liar.
Taz,
I understand you’re having difficulties with reading comprehension and all, but once again, I’ll point out to you that I’m not Capn, and he’s not the one who said “last desperate refuge.” I am.
I understand Sylvan Learning Centers has a program for adults who are functionally illiterate. Have your mommy call them for you.
Next time you go off on your oblique tangent and call someone a jerk, why not get your facts straight first? If you bother to read the threads, you will see that Capn initiated the liar meme that I was commenting and quoting on.
Is that anything like bush vision outlander?
YOU are the afflicted one.
Believe people with that condition are called compulsive liars. Lies, Liars, and Compulsive Liars!
2. The thread isn’t about Bill Clinton. It’s about Barak Obama.Posted by: Tom | December 13, 2007 at 02:33 PM
The thread isn’t about President Bush either, but it doesn’t stop the Liberal Progressive Hootenannies from whining about him.
Max,
“And if Obama is clean, he should have no objections to taking a drug screen test and making the results public.
What does he have to hide?”
If Bush is clean and not drinking, he should have no objections to taking a urinalysis test and making the results public.
What does Bush have to hide?
3 quick points:
1) Max probably lied, but his grip on reality is so tenuous, it’s hard to tell.
2) Since we’re into “guilty until proven innocent” now, how about bio-testing the current occupant? I imagine a snort or two of the white stuff might make those staff meetings a little easier to take!
3)Al Gore admitted smoking marijuana, and received a half-million more votes than the current occupant.
Can we lay this pseudo-issue to rest now?
But using his amazing powers of deception, CapnHalftruth lies, even while he is calling others liars.
3)Al Gore admitted smoking marijuana, and received a half-million more votes than the current occupant.
Can we lay this pseudo-issue to rest now?
Posted by: Rage | December 13, 2007 at 02:41 PM
Still whining about the law of the land regarding the Electoral College Rage?
Pee.S. While we’re at it, let’s do the Supreme Court (or at least the majority in the Earls case).
Start with Anthony Kennedy.
Tom you are really starting to show definite anger management problems. This blog isn’t the be all to end all to anyone.
We razz about the Clintons when someone goes off like Cap did with his rant. It only seems fair.
This campaign has collapsed in many way and if we couldn’t laugh we’d probably all sit around and cry.
Are you contributing anything here outie?
Aside from being a peanut gallery dwelling lover of bush?
“BILL CLINTON!!! BILL CLINTON!!!
The last desperate refuge of the intellectually dishonest heirs of what used to be the Republican Party.”
Posted by: Tom | December 13, 2007 at 02:25 PM
—–
Actually, Tom, since Bill’s “running” again, perhaps it’s not as silly as it seems. Bush, however, is not running . . .
Personally, unless there is evidence of cocaine use in his recent past, I don’t care about his youthful indiscretions, especially since he’s been up front about it. If only saints are eligible for president, we might as well abandon electing anyone right now.
I actually like Obama, though I many not agree with him much (It’s kinda hard to tell, given that most of what he’s running on is an amorphous “fresh start, I’m not just another politician, I’m not divisive” platform, thick with platitudes but short on substance). Give him another decade or so of seasoning, and then we’ll talk. Right now, he’s just not ready for prime time. He’s hot, frankly, because Hillary!IS so divisive, and Edwards is plastic.
WELL WELL….I SEE NOTHING HAS CHANGED.
Geo HW Bush said he had never used illegal drugs but then added helpful, “I can’t say that about my son.”
Who’s better? Obama for admitting the truth or Bush for issuing the misleading “I haven’t used drugs for seven years” statement?
The difference is that most of the time, he told the truth.
Bush hardly ever tells the truth. The vast majority of what he says is false. CapnAmerica
The words posted by CapnAmerica are the craziest thing I’ve ever seen him publish. Not an ounce of truth, no logical thought process.
What a nut house you must live in.
If the common man is going to be subjected to drug testing, it’s definitely should be applied to their leaders in govt.
Yup, I was thinking the same thing, Trace.
What happened to the Blog Moderator from yesterday?
Obama has admitted to using Cocaine Tom, what did I lie about?
Obama likely knew he couldn’t hide his drug use in the past.
The logical question, when you have someone wanting to put his finger on THE BUTTON, is: Does Obama still use Cocaine today?
A drug test can prove that one way or the other.
If Obama has nothing to hide.
Tom, your attacks on me are not evidence that Obama is clean today.
Go ahead, swing away at me all you want, since you can’t defend Obama.
Delaware Sen. Joe Biden, ever the realist, admits he must “run one, two or three” – or maybe a closely bunched fourth – in the Jan. 3 Iowa caucuses to stay in the Democratic presidential race.
He still believes he can do it, Biden told me Tuesday in a phone interview from Iowa. “We’ll have a serious TV buy in Iowa in the next week or two,” he said, “and if we surprise people here, I think the same boomerang effect that helped John Kerry, after he won Iowa in an upset in 2004, would help us raise big money.”
If wit, grit and excellent credentials were enough to be elected president, Biden would be lifting his hand at next January’s swearing-in ceremony. But even if he falls short, he says he will have “given it my best shot and did it my way.”
That way would be:
• Speaking truth to power, warning President Bush that if he took the U.S. into a war in Iran without congressional assent (especially after the new intelligence reports that Iran froze its nuclear program in 2003), “I would lead an effort to impeach him.”
• Risking an unpopular stance among his party’s liberal base by voting for an Iraq war appropriations bill and proposing the most workable solution in Iraq – a federal-state system, close to our own, which would separate warring ethnic factions.
• Stumping from early morning to late at night in Iowa and New Hampshire.
Biden doesn’t just roll in, make a speech and shoot off to another event. He’ll shake every hand, answer every question and listen intently, even if he’s a bit late getting to the next stop. (Hmmm, that’s just the way Bill Clinton did it in his come-from-behind win in 1992).
Take Biden’s appearance at New England College in New Hampshire last Thursday. A student told me, “He got here about 30 minutes late. But he told us he’d stay there ’til midnight if he needed to. And he did stay until 11:30, answering all our questions, signing posters, posing for pictures.”
The next night, Biden arrived more than an hour late at Widow Fletcher’s Tavern in Hampton, N.H., having lingered with citizens after a forum on Iraq in Portsmouth. But 80 or more people crowded around Widow Fletcher’s two bars and an adjoining restaurant, and I saw no one leave.
When Biden arrived, he joked and kidded with them, shook every hand and gave his assessment of the campaign buzz that with his foreign affairs experience, he’d make a great secretary of state. “But tell me this,” Biden asked. “Would you vote for anybody who wasn’t qualified to be secretary of state?”
In Iowa, Biden said on Tuesday, “Grandmothers and mothers come up to me and say, ‘You saved my son’s life or my grandson’s life’ ” by pressing for more explosion-resistant armor for troops in Iraq. Another Iowan showed Biden shrapnel in a snuff box he carries to remind that his son might not have been killed if Biden’s amendment had been accepted earlier.
As the bill was passed in May, the Democratic line was to amend it to force a quicker withdrawal from Iraq and to oppose the bill if the amendment was killed – as it was.
“Mine was the only vote among the other senators running for president (Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and Chris Dodd) that funded the troops” and bucked the Democrats’ amendment, Biden said. “Many people said it would hurt my campaign. But I’ve seen the exact opposite.”
So that’s Joe Biden. “The word statesman comes to mind,” said a still-undecided Mollie Allen at Widow Fletcher’s.
Biden can take a joke, too. Pub owner Parker Ryan swore in Biden – as he has past candidates – into the Royal Society Bridge Club, which meets at Widow Fletcher’s. Biden raised his hand and repeated, “I will let no duty for God and country obstruct my loyal attendance” to the club. “I will never use my membership to influence Supreme Court judges.”
Biden, a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee, arched his eyebrows but smiled at that one.
I asked Biden whether if he is elected, he will invite club members to his real swearing-in. He laughed and said, “I’ll invite them all and since they asked me to attend one of their meetings, I will. Even if they have to come to Washington to have it.”
WELL WELL….I SEE NOTHING HAS CHANGED.
Posted by: Tracy | December 13, 2007 at 02:46 PM
True Tracy, This is not your “I agree with whatever is being said by anyone on my blog” Website.
Trace I was here all morning and everyone got along great. In fact it was fun. Took a couple of hours off for lunch, come back and you and cap are here and the place has fallen apart.
Hummm!! I think I am on to something here.
Well thanks for the passionate invective based on no evidence, Am Way.
Make you a deal. You go through the last state of the union address and find every statement that can be proven true or false.
I’m am quite certain that a majority of those statements are either completely false or misleading.
For instance, once Bush said that he was increasing the Pell grants for college students.
That was sort-of true–he increased the dollar amount of each Pell Grant by a token 100 dollars, but the kicker was that he reduced the number of Pell Grants!
Real nice.
What a maroon.
Posted by: CapnAmerica | December 13, 2007 at 02:38 PM
Yup, I was thinking the same thing, Trace.
What happened to the Blog Moderator from yesterday?
Posted by: CapnAmerica | December 13, 2007 at 02:48 PM
Max,
And if George Bush has nothing to hide, he should be willing to put the rumors about his drinking to rest by peeing into a cup.
Max,
With no evidence, no facts, not even a link to some wingnut WorldNetDaily article, you accused a sitting United States Senator of being a cocaine addict.
Show us your evidence.
I’ll wait.
For the record, the Blog Moderator sometimes pulls my posts.
As he should.
I welcome it.
We’ve had self-policing since this place started.
It doesn’t work.
True Tracy, This is not your “I agree with whatever is being said by anyone on my blog” Website.Posted by: Kansas | December 13, 2007 at 02:51 PM
I agree.
Now that we’ve established that I’m as much of an SOB as anyone else around here, which I freely admit, let’s get back to how much Bush lies . . . which is constantly.
accused a sitting United States Senator of being a cocaine addict.Posted by: Tom
HA-HA-HA! HEHE! O-HOHO!
ROTF laughter.
This BLOG exists for one main purpose: It provides a small circle of close knit blue people from Wichita Kansas a relief valve to post vulgar, hateful, demaning, and name-calling of the President of the United States, George Bush.
You making indignant comments in defense of a boot senator – is thick. Real thick, considering this blog!
lol
Cap, cap, cap such vitriole from such a placid person. Have you had a bad day? Are your friends using you for a doormat? Didn’t you get any friendly mail today? Have all of your phonecalls been from solicitors or bill collectors? Well I would suggest then that you leave this blog and go to Traces’. It will calm you down and then maybe you can come back here and post with the big people.
Max, Kansas, whoever…what the hell ya attackin me for?for not being disagreeable enough?
Why that’s just pitiful.Making fun of a place where I don’t argue with people?Sheesh that’s small minded.
Shewt, I dent even speak to anybody here and I get slammed?
BTW, whatever ya say….I AGREE
Unbelievable. The monitor loves the Capn.
It looks like all the cheap-shot posts are getting pulled.
Hallelujah.
Posted by: CapnAmerica
This new monitoring and moderating policy is working great.
No cheap-shots, no disruptions, no outrageous baiting and outraged responses.
Thanks, Eagle Staff. Well done.
Whatever you’re doing, keep doing it.
Posted by: CapnAmerica
It was three minutes to show time at the Havenwood retirement community the other morning, and most of the chairs stood empty. As organizers hustled the excess seating off the floor, they asked the two dozen people who had gathered to move up front. Rather than a town meeting with Sen. Joe Biden, they said, those present would have a roundtable discussion.
Biden has been a politician long enough to have a story and a strategy for every occasion, and he did not disappoint.
The story went like this: Calvin Coolidge was on a whistle-stop tour in the 1920s. In one town he stepped out back to assay the crowd behind the caboose but then walked right back in. A startled aide asked what was wrong. Well, said Coolidge, the crowd is too big for a conversation and too small for an oration.
The strategy began with Biden asking for a chair, sitting before a shiny white fake Christmas tree, unbuttoning his nicely-cut charcoal suit jacket and telling the story of his life.
It is worth listening to the way presidential candidates talk about their lives. What they leave out can be revealing, but so can what they put in – and the lessons they take from experience.
Biden’s is a familiar American story, with tragic and frightening twists. Like many in his generation especially, he rose to prominence from humble beginnings.
His family moved to Delaware from Scranton, Pa., when he was a young boy. His father was a car salesman. While Joe and his brother slept in bunk beds, “my sister, the princess, had her own room.” He attended Catholic schools and the University of Delaware with the dream of becoming a running back for the New York Giants.
When that didn’t work out, he went to law school at Syracuse and married. Among the events that drew him to politics was the turmoil in Wilmington after the assassination of Martin Luther King. The governor called in the National Guard to quell the riots, and the Guard remained deployed there for nine months.
Biden won election to the New Castle County Council in 1970 and ran for the U.S. Senate in 1972. He was only 29, too young for the office under the Constitution, but his 30th birthday was coming up before the swearing-in. He won by 3,000 votes.
On Dec. 18 of that year, before he took office, his wife and family went out to get a Christmas tree. A tractor-trailer broad-sided their car, killing his wife and year-old daughter and injuring his toddler sons, Beau and Hunter. One son had a skull fracture and the other had many broken bones. Biden thought about giving up the Senate seat before he had served a day, but he later took the oath of office in the hospital. When his sons were well enough, he began to commute 125 miles each way to the Capitol. As a single dad, he did not wish to give up his place with his sons.
His sons recovered and are grown, but his 90-year-old mother, who is apparently a wellspring of pithy sayings for his use on the campaign trail, lives with him. In the same house, he helped provide hospice care for his father for the final months of his life. To this day, Biden rides Amtrak for the 250-mile roundtrip to and from D.C.
Biden remarried five years after the accident. Or as he told his listeners at Havenwood, he had the good fortune to have not just one love of his life, but two.
As for real fortune, Biden prides himself, at least publicly, with being one of the poorest members of the Senate and the only major presidential candidate who is not a millionaire. As of last March, his net worth was $100,000 to $150,000. He says he didn’t know when he entered public life that the point was to make a lot of money.
Biden began his first bid for president in 1987. That summer, a staffer from Michael Dukakis’s campaign quietly circulated information that Biden had lifted parts of a speech from a British politician without attribution. Then C-SPAN caught Biden inflating his academic record. He pulled out. Those transgressions seem much slighter now than they did at the time. The next year, Biden was diagnosed with not one but two brain aneurysms. He twice underwent surgery to repair the damage.
At Havenwood, understandably, the one part of the story Biden left out was the downfall of his first campaign. He talked about the aneurysms in response to a question about health care. Otherwise, he left it to voters to make what they would of the ups and downs of his life.
The core of his presentation was about foreign policy, on which he is the most experienced and perhaps wisest of all the presidential candidates.
But my guess is that for the small crowd that came to meet Joe Biden, the impression he left was personal. Beneath all his smooth talk and name-dropping, Biden is a paragon of family values – the genuine article, not the cheap imitation that often mucks up American politics. Reliance on family has borne him through tragedy, fear and grief.
Exactly, AmWay.
They should pull my cheap-shots and everybody else’s.
It unfortunate that they’re not.
*****
NOW THEN, are you going to respond to my fact-check of the State of the Union or aren’t you?
You folks here are purty full of yerselves ain’t ya?
hey max
i thought you were 100% behind Hyllary? If so this should be a moot issue.
Unless, unless miracles of miracles and your cured ???/ Hallelujah !!!!!! Saints be praised
welcome back max
not all of us tracy
SubstanceCandidatesPolicy
focus focus
Hello Ken…You one of the normal ones I hope?
Yup, it looks like AmWay refuses to take my challenge.
But continue to live in your evidence-free world, AmWay.
It’s easier than thinking.
Wow, he is an admitted law breaking drug-user that is someone for my kids to look up to.
OMG!! Obama very candidly wrote about his drug use IN A BOOK a couple of years ago. Bill Shaheen has already apologized for saying anything about this, and has already tried to spin by saying the Clinton campaign did not authorize him to say anything about drug use.
AND MAX, you want Obama to submit to a drug screen when our current president refused to do so when he was in the military due to drug use. COME ON!!!
On Iran: Clinton: “Joe is absolutely right.” Sen. Clinton said, “I think that what we’re trying to do here is put pressure on the Bush administration. Joe is absolutely right. George Bush can do all of this without anybody. You know, that is the great tragedy and that’s why we’ve got to rein him in, and that’s why we need Republican support in the Congress to help us do so.”
On Pakistan: Dodd: “I agree with Joe.” Sen. Dodd said, “I agree with Joe. I think the more immediate problem is Pakistan, the one that needs to be addressed.”
On Afghanistan: Clinton: “I agree with Joe.” Sen. Clinton said, “I agree with Joe [regarding] the Afghanistan situation. Everywhere you look in the world we’ve got work to do, and I think we’ve got to do more than just send our young men and women out. That is not an appropriate use of their power.”
On Debating Republicans: Obama: “I’m not fearful, just as Joe isn’t, to have a debate about this with Rudy Giuliani because we’ve got the facts on our side.”
On Oil: Obama: “As Joe pointed out, out of the $90 that it’s costing right now for a barrel, about 30 percent of that is just risk.”
well my ex would argue the normal point,
more the court jester I prefer
certainly
Tracy that was a very good story about Biden. I had never heard that about him. Maybe he deserves a better look.
What are Bidens stands on tax reform, excess spending, national security, family values to name a few. Why isn’t he getting more traction?
hey max
i thought you were 100% behind Hyllary? If so this should be a moot issue.
Unless, unless miracles of miracles and your cured ???/ Hallelujah !!!!!! Saints be praised
welcome back max
Posted by: ken | December 13, 2007 at 03:10 PM
I was converted to Hillary just today, Ken!
That’s why I’m so concerned about Obama getting a pass for using Cocaine.
And before Hillary picks Obama as her VP, I hope Hillary makes Obama prove that he is clean.
As for ALL GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES taking drug tests, I’m ALL FOR IT!
Including GWB!
Tracy,The subject of the thread is Obama’s past drug use. No wonder the thread is drifting. . .
Biden and Dodd are without question the most qualified candidates on the Dem side–but the voted for the Iraq debacle anyway. They knew better, or should have.
I would be an Edwards supporter, were it not for the same thing.
Kucinich wasn’t even there at today’s debate–blew it off, or locked out?
Mike Gravel is still nuts.
Over and out,Rage
Still waitin’ on that evidence, Max.
I’m glad I’m not holding my breath.
RAGE…10-4….out
Well Max it is a good idea to test all government employees but a rule change while Bill Clinton was prez exempts the young White House staff. It seemed this was keeping them from getting the security clearance they needed to work in the White House so if you got rid of the test they could get the clearance.
Maybe Hillary will do away with that one.
Is there proof that Bill Clinton lied about inhaling? Did he admit to it?
Weapons of Mass Destruction
The President made no mention of the failure so far to locate nuclear, chemical or biological weapons in Iraq.
Bush: We are seeking all the facts. Already the Kay Report identified dozens of weapons of mass destruction-related program activities and significant amounts of equipment that Iraq concealed from the United Nations.
True, former UN weapons inspector David Kay, now heading the US effort to locate Saddam Hussein’s unconventional weapons, did report last October that he had uncovered “dozens of WMD-related program activities and significant amounts of equipment that Iraq concealed from the United Nations during the inspections that began in late 2002.”
But Kay also told the House and Senate intelligence committees:
Kay: We have not yet found stocks of weapons . . . We have not yet been able to corroborate the existence of a mobile BW (biological weapons) production effort . . . . Multiple sources (say) that Iraq did not have a large, ongoing, centrally controlled CW (chemical warfare) program after 1991 . . . . (and) to date we have not uncovered evidence that Iraq undertook significant post-1998 steps to actually build nuclear weapons or produce fissile material . . . . (and) no detainee has admitted any actual knowledge of plans for unconventional warheads for any current or planned ballistic missile.
The Economy
The President said the economy is growing and producing jobs, but failed to mention that the growth is so far insufficient to make up for what’s been lost since he took office.
Bush: We have come through recession, and terrorist attack, and corporate scandals, and the uncertainties of war. And because you acted to stimulate our economy with tax relief, this economy is strong, and growing stronger . . . . And jobs are on the rise.
It is true that the economy grew at a yearly rate of 8.2% in the third quarter of last year, making it the best quarter in 20 years. And private economists are generally agreed that tax cuts helped propel the consumer spending that fueled the growth, which continues. Also true is that the economy has gained 278,000 jobs since July, when the job slump bottomed out.
But what the President left unsaid is that in the most recent month the job gain was almost nonexistent — only 1,000 — and that as of December total employment was still 2.3 million below where it stood when Bush took office in January 2001.
I was converted to Hillary just today, Ken! Max
Well Max, the libs should tell you, “Welcome to the crowd!”
It appears that’s how they feel about Hillary too. One lib yesterday even admitted: She doesn’t know which one to vote for and was asking for a sign (koolaid). Maybe that’s because every time Hillary changes her mind on something, the sheep have to snap to and move to the other side. On again, off again.
ksgrm and all othersI truly believe in Biden.
He isn’t getting “traction’ cause he make too much sense!
He’s the only candidate with REAL plans and details. Check it out for yourselves.If you’re tired of all the BS,
JUST VOTE ON THE ISSUES.
Joe has the experience and plenty of political savvy.
Out of ALL of them, he has the best resume’.
Joe is a straight shooter.
“a rule change while Bill Clinton was prez exempts the young White House staff [from drug tests]”
Whew, that’s got the smell of Limbaugh’s ass on it, although if anybody wants to do away with drug tests, it would have to be old Oxycontin Rush.
You got a link to that “fact,” ksgrm, or did you just pick it up from the right-wing barnyard?
AW, I need to sell all my firearms quick, before they get banned.
After they are banned, I won’t be able to legally sell them.
Or do you think they would be worth more after the ban?
Wouldn’t want to risk going to jail for an illegal sale though.
We won’t need guns under Hillary, cause she will keep us all safe.
Hillary cares.
That’s why Hillary is My Girl!
Tracy, don’t act all innocent. You used to come by here with your your drive-by postings to blast me on a regular basis. I remember them and was asking myself why Tracy would do such a thing.
Besides, my post wasn’t an attack on you, it was a statement that your blog appears to be made of like-minded individuals who often replay with “yes, yes, I see, okay I understand” without one word of disagreement.
Nothing wrong with that kind of blog, just an observation that while heading nodding is admirable it doesn’t inspire debate on opinion that are counter or object to the very idea of the subject matter at all.
You got a link to that “fact,” ksgrm, or did you just pick it up from the right-wing barnyard?
Posted by: CapnAmerica | December 13, 2007 at 03:32 PM
DNFTT
:)
“Trolling” to the right-wing is asking them to document their facts, apparently.
And, damn, hasn’t it gotten quiet from AmWay’s side of the room . . .
Tom, I’m waiting for the evidence that Obama has stopped using Cocaine.
He said he used it. Has he stopped using it?
Heck, even baseball players take a drug test. The burden of proof is on the players to prove they are NOT using drugs.
Tom, you think Obama should have at least the same drug test requirement as a baseball player?
Kannass, yer rite i’m guilty.You’ve really said some stewpud shit from time to time, and im sure I stopped by and blasted ya for it.
This bloggie is like thatya know.not at all like my lame spot where people are friendly. How boring huh?
This bloggie is like thatya know.not at all like my lame spot where people are friendly. How boring huh?
Posted by: Tracy | December 13, 2007 at 03:37 PM
I actually read your blog Tracy and enjoy your articles.
I just don’t want to ruin it for the others there, so I never join in.
Nothing wrong with your blog, it’s just filled with people that have similar ideologies and it’s doubtful any flareups will result.
Shewt Kanass, If I knew hoo ya were I might eeven like ya but evrbuddy changes nickies so much…
BTW, you don’t even know if it was me or sumbuddy writen as tracy
Remember the gardening discussion on Open Thread? I wouldn’t want to see that here every day or even every week, but I preferred it to the non-stop lunacy that reigned at the time.
BTW, you don’t even know if it was me or sumbuddy writen as tracy
Posted by: Tracy | December 13, 2007 at 03:39 PM
True, I don’t.
Just as the people here blame me for being every other nic on this blog, which I’m not, but they accuse me anyway.
Here’s what the NY Times says about the Clinton White House and drug tests:
“None failed a drug test, and no member of the Clinton White House has ever tested positive for drug use in the random-testing program, she said.
“About 1,700 people work at the White House, from cooks and clerks to Mr. Clinton’s top aides. None of those aides — 24 assistants to the President, 30 deputy assistants and 75 special assistants — were involved [in twice a year drug tests].”
So what happened was that during Clinton’s tenure, drug testing was actually STEPPED UP.
*****
Oh, yeah, and there’s also this, also from The Times:
December 19, 1995Clinton Orders Drug Tests for Those Arrested on Federal Charges
By ALISON MITCHELL
President Clinton, seeking to take a tough stand on drugs, directed the Government today to require that all people arrested on Federal criminal charges face drug testing.
The move was one of an array of events planned by the Administration this week to tackle the social issues of crime and drugs.
******
Don’t bother to admit you were wrong and apologize, ksgrm.
We’ve heard it all before–”it was a JOKE!”
Why thanks dude.I read yer blog too.
Actually, I prefer to stay outa my own blog as much as possible.
I liketa let others say ther piece.
Hank and Nathan have even commented there without agreeing and nobody got mad. They were awful nice about not agreeing though….
Max,
You are correct all right. Obama was a coke addict.
addiction
Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.
An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.
The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.
An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.
The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.
An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.
From the NY Times:
“Hours after the disclosure today that three White House guards had been suspended for suspected off-duty use of cocaine, the White House announced a random drug-testing program for employees of the Executive Office of the President.”
Why, that dirty, no-good Clinton. Of course, this is exactly what Ksgrm was talking about!
Oops . . .
It happened in 1988, under Reagan.
Isn’t funny that now that Bush is president, we never hear about drug tests any more . . .
AmWay is a coward.
Max – Did you get in a tizzy for GWB to have a drug test after it was found out he used cocaine? Honestly curious on this one.
Tracy – It sounds as if one of the main reasons Biden isn’t doing as well as the other candidates is because he doesn’t have as much money. BTW, my brother’s name is Tracy, always liked that name.
Rage – Kucinic didn’t blow off the debate, he wasn’t invited because he doesn’t have an office in the state.
The link Rage-
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071213/ap_on_el_pr/democrats_debate;_ylt=Aob9dmLXP95mH7WaYkKXiGCs0NUE
The field of debaters was trimmed to six at the direction of the newspaper that hosted it. Rep. Dennis Kucinich of Ohio was excluded because he does not have a campaign office in the state. His supporters protested the decision, but to no avail.
It was not clear why the same rules did not exclude former Ambassador Alan Keyes from the Register’s debate of Republican candidates on Wednesday. A spokeswoman for the newspaper did not immediately return a telephone call or e-mail.
Actually, I should thank Ksgrm.
Since she brought up Clinton’s White House drug testing policy, what the heck is Old Chimpy McCokeSpoon’s?
Funny how that’s not an issue for the “liberal media.”
Max,
You keep trying to make this about me, when you’re the one who told the bald-faced lie.
If every Presidential candidate, including the current President, are required to take drug tests, I don’t really care. But I think you’re making up lies about Obama because you know he can beat pretty much any Republican currently running for the job.
And again, in this country, it’s innocent until proven guilty. If you’ve got evidence Obama is a “cocaine addict,” or has EVER been a “cocaine addict,” go ahead and post it.
Still waitin’.
Oh, and Amway doesn’t know the difference between a physical, clinically identifiable addiction to a controlled substance, and the colloquial use of the word “addicted.” Nice try though, Amway.
Hey, AmWay?
That hole in the ground over there you see . . .
Yup, that one.
It’s not your ass.
Just thought I clear that up for you.
Tomorrow’s lesson: the difference between $hit and shinola.
Be ready to take notes.
Great Idea Max
Drug test all gov’t employees (wait til I buy a drug testing company that contract will be hugeeeeee!) — maybe thats where we need to start fire all the beuracracy (sic) —- hell can’t get much slower any way
Cap a little reading for you. Gary Aldrich who spent a lot of time in the Clinton White House as an FBI agent disagreed with the opinion you just post and I could find many websites that disagree. Read his book, Unlimited Access, and then tell me what was going on.
Okay, I did some googling.
Turns out that Bush does use drug tests.
He’s tested many, many drugs over the years and he liked all of them . . .
Tracy ? Blog?
Ah, okay, thanks for popping your head up, Ksgrm.
So you’ve got a swift-boat type who wants to make a buck dishing dirt on the Clinton’s, eh?
That’s not Limbaugh’s ass, but it’s definitely in his dirty laundry pile.
Come back when you have a real source.
Hey y’all impeached Bill ya can’t do it twice !!
Yet
(Hsh — voiceover by Chris Matthews)
My source is as real as your source. Who said you were the arbitor and got to pick sources?
meant “Hah”
Cap I have told you before and it bears repeating. If you were as good as you thought you were you would be a General instead of being stuck as a Captain.
Okay, great, ksgrm.
Then you have to agree with Larry Flynt who said that Bush arranged for his underaged girlfriend to get an abortion in Texas when it was still illegal.
A source is a mainstream news source. Not the publisher of Hustler and not some POS book by a self-proclaimed “insider” for which no corroborating evidence can be found.
Yeah?
And you’d be . . . what? . . . a GREATgrm instead of just a grm?
Cap I think my AP story trumps your source:
Use of crack, hallucinogens hung up White House staffBy THE ASSOCIATED PRESSCopyright 1996 Associated Press.07/18/96
WASHINGTON (Jul 17, 1996 6:11 p.m. EDT) — Some of the Clinton WhiteHouse employees who were placed in a special drug testing program hadused cocaine and hallucinogens and were originally denied White Housesecurity passes, Secret Service agents testified Wednesday.The testing program was created as a compromise so the newadministration’s workers could keep their jobs, according to ArnoldCole, who supervised the Secret Service’s White House operations.”Initially, our response was that we denied them passes,” Cole said ina deposition released by the House Government Reform and OversightCommittee.Cole and other Secret Service agents appeared before the committeeWednesday to answer questions about a different matter — the WhiteHouse’s improper gathering of FBI background files on Republicans.But he was briefly questioned about the drug issue, which came tolight earlier this week, saying that despite his agency’s originalconcerns about the workers, “at one point they did receive a pass.”Asked who ultimately determined whether workers who had recently useddrugs would be suitable, he answered: The issue “would be resolved atthe highest levels” of the White House.Another agent’s deposition revealed the background checks turned upuse of hard drugs.”I have seen cocaine usage. I have seen hallucinogenic usages, crackusages,” said Jeffrey Undercoffer, when asked to describe the types ofdrugs used by employees who were placed in the special programs.The Associated Press reported Monday that 21 Clinton White Houseworkers had been placed in the special testing after their backgroundchecks indicated recent drug abuse.—–
Did you see that part about the ‘”would be resolved atthe highest levels” of the White House.’ that was your boy Bill.
Hurts to be wrong doesn’t it. I had to apologize to JR yesterday and I’ll be waiting for you.
And AmWay is still down for the count:
SEVEN . . . EIGHT . . . NINE . . . DING! DING! DING!
This bout is over, folks. It goes to the still undefeated Cap’n America.
“the background checks”
The background checks were questionnaires that the employees were asked to fill out.
Remember, “no one failed a drug test” and some were asked to take random tests twice a year.
In other words, Clinton raised the bar, not lowered it.
“the background checks”
The background checks were questionnaires that the employees were asked to fill out VOLUNTARILY PROVIDING INFO.
Remember, “no one failed a drug test” and some were asked to take random tests twice a year.
In other words, Clinton raised the bar, instead of lowering it.
Not so fast Cap you lose AP trumps your source.
“… hadused cocaine and hallucinogens and were originally denied White Housesecurity passes, Secret Service agents testified Wednesday.”
Cap – originally denied White House security passes – what kind of double speak are you using now?
Whether you were denied because you had a dirty UA or because you said ‘I can’t pass a drug test’ it means the same thing. Drugs were being used in the Clinton White House.
I’ll take that apology now.
Woo Hoo.
The Blog Monitor is back.
Legit bloggers salute you!
Grm–
What your article says is that potential staffers admitted to using drugs at some time in the past.
That is why none of them failed a drug test.
They weren’t using “in the White House” as if they were snorting coke off their desks and lighting up chronic in the break rooms.
Sheesh. Get a grip.
Next we’ll be hearing about Bill’s pulling the trigger of Vince Foster’s pistol . . .
I suppose that Alrich guy was big into that theory too, eh?
So now the AP isn’t even a good source. Well I tried to give you an out. Sorry you have lost all credibility with me.
The article says recent, which is open to interpretation, govt. background checks go back yrs.
Used to work for Adm. Rickover. Zero tolerance for drug use. Zero tolerance in the nuclear power program and zero tolerance in submarines.
Was there sailors that used drugs in submarines? Of course. But mere suspicion of that use would get you removed from nuclear power and submarines.
I served with men that, with all their faults, were not drug users or abusers. How can you elect a Commander in Chief of the armed forces that cannot meet the standards of the men he is the Commander in Chief for?
Obama fails the test. Being honest about illegal drug use is not one of the atrributes that I look for in a leader, let alone president.
Sad. Hillary is a loser. Edwards is plastic. Opra’s man is all you got.
So, since bush says noneya, and the press says, Ok. He’s eligible for pres.Obama mans up to it, and he’s disqualified.Typical RW logic.
Well, Monica anyway, not too sure about Hillary.
Yep Phantom,
You pretty much got it! Just because the left accuses Bush of drug use is no reason for him to dignify the false charges by answering questions.
Obama knows he can’t deny drug use. It’s in his past and there’s no way to hide it. All he can do is try and get out in front of the issue.
Bush, on the other hand, does not seem to have that problem. There’s no evidence that he has ever used illegal drugs. None.
Your intellectual integrity never fails to underwhelm us Hank.
bush used drugs and everybody knows it. That he refuses to discuss the matter doesn’t make him clean.
Hank Price,
If Bush doesn’t have anything to hide regarding claims about his drinking, he shouldn’t have any problem taking a urinalysis test to prove he’s really stayed clean and sober.
Oh, and Hank? Why won’t George Bush agree to deny that he used illegal drugs before 1974?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Bush_substance_abuse_controversy
Lots of questionable things regarding Bush and drug use–your breezy attempts at “nothin’ to see here” to the contrary.
Interesting J R, and just how do you “know it”?
CF2K, I think I already addressed the point. Bush doesn’t have drug use in his past, therefore, he doesn’t have to dignify the shrill, baseless, left-wing questioning with an answer.
Your intellectual integrity never fails to underwhelm us Hank.
Posted by: J R | December 13, 2007 at 05:58 PM
Oh where OH where is Chas, the blog expert on what is an insult and what isn’t.
I don’t know Chas, but what J R wrote looks like a very direct and personal insult to me.
When asked if they have used drugs in the past, honest people say yes or no.
Dishonest people say they will not talk about it.
This is a clever way to lie without actually saying anything at all. bush is far too dense to have come up with that on his own. Hughes probably came up with it.
Occams razor. bush did drugs and does not want to talk about it.
It appears that you like trial by accusation J R.
Just because you accuse someone of doing something like Bush doing drugs, doesn’t make it true.
I could accuse you of stealing company property while you worked under a Union contract.
Does that make it true as well?
Yup it’s true!
I’m proud of it too.
See how easy it is to be honest?
J R,
Indeed. “Have you ever used illegal drugs in the past” shouldn’t be a difficult question to answer for someone who hasn’t used them.
Hank Price,
Your question-begging non-answer determinedly avoids the question of why Bush won’t issue a blanket denial that extends beyond 1974. And your name-calling suggests you’re more than a little testy. Wonder why?
CF2K could you ask CF2K why he keeps asking the same question over and over again. My kids did that when they were young. I guess that thought if they asked often enough they would get a different answer until I would finally tell them they had my answer now quit asking.
Hank has answered you CF tell CF to back off.
CF2K
Testy? You pick out my comments to charge testiness?
When did I call anybody names?
Dear J R,
If you asked me a direct question, depending on my mood and your attitude I may or may not give you a direct answer or for that matter, any answer at all. Doesn’t prove anything one way or another.
The NYT sent many, many reporters to Texas during the 2000 campaign to try and find evidence of drug use by Bush. They came up with nothing after interviewing over two hundred people close to Bush.
So children, keep making this little drill about Bush. He ain’t running. B J Clinton and his lovely wife are running. Let’s talk about them.
It is really stupid to complain about anyone’s past use, especially pot.
So for this, Hillary’s team can stick a pipe in it lol.
Hank Price,
Methinks that mentions of “shrill, baseless, left-wing questioning” are a bit of a tell as to your defensivness.
ksgrm,
Hank Price never answered my question. He still hasn’t. That fact escapes you, as does my ironic use of the third person (which so irritates you) to refer to myself.
But then, irony would one of those pesky higher-brain functions with which you are, once again, so demonstrably unencumbered.
CF thank you for that I think. Maybe you didn’t get the right message from CF because that one didn’t make much sense.
Maybe Hank doesn’t like talking to Muppets
This is about Obama — kind of a moot issue beating the dead and or dying horses like bill asnd george ….
… i heard something that said Obama made the statemeny his HS years were a fog or similar — the obvious implication was it was due to drugs — is that what he meant ….
I lean towards Hanks opinion —
I was in the nuke missile launch business and share some of the same concerns he has …. had some responsibilities and training in the drug abuse programs — tough to rationalize the risk of some sort of a flashback effecting decisions leading to use of those weapons –
otherwise he would be a viable candidate — looks like Biden and Dodd may be getting a bump
on a personal level — know 2 friends from the hood in the 60s 70s fried their brains pretty good — still have flash backs
Organic brain syndrome..or what we call “wet brain” from chronic alcoholim or heavy drug use. An unfortunate consequence of long term use.
1) I do believe that at this point in time, it is irrelevant as to whether GW Bush used drugs earlier in his life. If he is using illegal drugs NOW, that would be a problem…
2) Yes, Kansas, JR did type what I would call an insult.
Back to my TV show now!! Bye for now!!
I didn’t know Bugs Bunny was on this late.
Good night; Good luck; and God bless; whatever you conceive God to be!!
Blessings All!!
MERRY XRMAS!!
Your intellectual integrity never fails to underwhelm us Hank.
Posted by: J R | December 13, 2007 at 05:58 PM========================I don’t know Chas, but what J R wrote looks like a very direct and personal insult to me.
Posted by: Kansas | December 13, 2007 at 06:32 PM
========================
Not sure what you mean here Kansas… Looks like JR’s insult was directed at Hank… Unless, of course, you were posting with Hank’s nic :-)
Hanks, so sure Bush didn’t use drugs how does he know, been holding bushs cock for the last 30 years? and isn’t Bush an self admitted 12 stepper. That would imply some sort of problem.