A Los Angeles Times article on the challenge of prosecuting pornography cases when X-rated materials are everywhere included two cautionary thoughts that apply in Sedgwick County, where a second porn-related grand jury recently brought obscenity charges against five businesses:
“This is the only crime you don’t know you did until the jury tells you you did it,” said Ira Isaacs, a Los Angeles film distributor and producer indicted in July on federal obscenity charges.
“The only people forced to look at this stuff are the jurors in the obscenity case,” added Mark Kearnes, a senior editor of Adult Video News.
Interestingly, the article link anti-smut groups’ dissatisfaction with the Justice Department to last year’s firing of U.S. attorneys and this year’s resignation of Attorney General Alberto Gonzales.
Meanwhile, the Operation Southwind group in Wichita, plans to see if local Halloween stores are displaying obscene costumes. A Johnson County grand jury recently ruled that four costumes were obscene.
Posted by Rhonda Holman
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54 Comments
If only there were a way to keep out people who didn’t want to go into these sort of shops. Couldn’t people develop some things like self-restraint and common sense? Or perhaps people could invent things like doors.
Maybe Jan Beemer is just upset because she doesn’t get invited to any Halloween parties.
Would undergarments be considered too obscene to sell? We must get a ruling from Southwind. Southwind Blows!
Let’s see which of the usual “nanny state” whiners weigh in on this one…
Looks like the charges resulting from the JoCo grand jury indictment against the Halloween costume shop (Operation Southwind will visit the local operation of which here in Wichita) was dismissed by settlement. I’d imagine that neither side was wanting to try this case (as to the costumes).
http://www.kansas.com/news/story/197832.html
Always fun to watch the self-appointed blue noses create their looney brand of stupidity.
I’m old enough to remember Sheriff Johnny Duh padlocking “smut” shops at the orders of then DA Vern (Jump out of a car trunk) Miller.
What a waste of time.
I’m only 60 years old. I’m very thankful for groups like this to tell me what I can and cannot look at and read.
Let’s see which of the usual “nanny state” whiners weigh in on this one…
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl | October 11, 2007 at 01:50 PM
Heh, ya know, KFG, maybe they read your comment, and were figuring out a way to post in favor of the censors without the hypocrisy seeming so obvious!
Note: I know some of you “nanny state” decriers will also be against these types. And, for the record, I like having a USEFUL state: there’s a difference.
For the others, i.e. those of you otherwise who laud every friggin’ government intrusion into our lives, when it suits your purposes, well. . . .
We’re waiting!
Walmart K-Mart sells underwear and you can see Panties and Bras, condoms etc:.. Why dont we file suit on them??? Herbert West III, Publisher/Journalist. west.herb@yahoo.com wesn2k.com , 913-294-9375
I support the right of cities to place stores of such type in special zoning areas,or not, as the zoning commisions and city leaders decide.
I support the right of Operation Southwind to stick their noses into business that they deem improper for the neighborhood.
I support the right of everyone else to tell Operation Southwind (and others like them) to mind their own business.
I support the right to vote for or against politicians and leaders that want such stores in their cities/states
I support the right to Purchase costumes, books, and movies, and I guess toys, of any nature you so choose.
Obsceneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
Bwahaha. I got your obscene.
Zoning and restrictions on ‘what can be seen where’ make sense. Bans do not.
Would undergarments be considered too obscene to sell? We must get a ruling from Southwind. Southwind Blows!
Posted by: The Phantom
Yeah, I bet they’re all a lot of fun in bed, huh? lol ;-) No wonder they’re pitching such a fit, they’re all unfulfilled.
If only there were a way to keep out people who didn’t want to go into these sort of shops. Couldn’t people develop some things like self-restraint and common sense? Or perhaps people could invent things like doors.
Posted by: Doug
Amen, this was too good not to repost.
Southwind should change its name to the Seriously Prudish Prudes. Seriously.
I find it offensive that they think they can determine what the adults can do and wear.
I don’t think so. Trust me SPPS group, you don’t want to see my fat ass in one of those costumes, but I might have to wear one just for your benefit. Perhaps I can get them to surrender by grossing them out?
HA.
Remember during the legislative session when they tried to get a prohibition on signs outside adult stores that (in one incarnation of the bill) would have required the store’s phone number to be displayed on the sign in large lettering.What was that for? Did doing you-know-what actually make them go blind?
An old codger told me one time what was dangerous…
He said the two most dangerous things on the face of the earth were:
Religion and Pussy
…after so many years I have found him to be spot on.
So you guys keep an eye on the religious wingers, they are extremely dangerous….and Ill keep my eye on the pussy….OK. Thanks
Mr. Con,Now that is interesting- a requirement for a huge display of a porn shop phone number, when for a long time Kansas liquor stores could be identified only with letters no more than 4″ high. These people need to compare notes!
There is a direct connection between on porn and sex crimes(the more extreme and perverse the more connection)Thank you. Perves, you may return to your online porn sites that corrupt your minds and anesthetize your morals. That is all.
Ugh.
Can we just give the wingnuts their own country already?
I for one, applaud the sacrifice our self-appointed censors make by exposing their own immortal souls to the inherent corruptions our society has to offer. For in the process of saving our impressionable youth from exposure to moral evil, they have willingly condemned their own souls to burn for eternity in the furthest reaches of hell. They have turned themselves into molesters in order to save the rest of us from that fate! Such heros!
Yeah, I bet they’re all a lot of fun in bed, huh? lol ;-) No wonder they’re pitching such a fit, they’re all unfulfilled.
Angrysar
Yup, I agree with you, these people must have some mental issues, and they must never have sex, its the same old story repeating itself. Blame the symptom not the problem. If you don’t want kids seeing things like this, well then the parents should be doing their jobs as parents, a 7 year old should be in bed by 9 O’clock and shouldn’t be attedning any adult halloween parties, or surfing the internet for porn either. Sounds like people have to suffer, because of a bunch of Prudes and bad parents.
I am just wondering if any of you have a line?
Do you want people walking in front of your children naked?
How about a wierd guy flashing in front of your kids?
Are you ok with that? Or should it be illegal?
Just wondering…
Because I am pretty sure that at some point you do have a line. The only issue isn’t that some of us are prudes and censors. The issue is that your line is not where ours is.
So enough with the ad hominem already.
You are all censors and prudes too, just at a different level.
If you don’t want to watch porn then don’t. Don’t tell others they can’t. There used to be a porn theatre in Wichita called the Circle Cinema back in the 70s. My brother used to work there. I never cared much for porn myself.
If they’re going to try and shut down anything, it should be all those payday loan places.
The Nelson family was found today…tramatized, hungry, dirty, cold, but safe and alive. They did make it to South Carolina.It’s a long story, but they were basically held held hostage for 6 days…the story will be out soon. Tonight the family is just trying to recover.
Oooo…the perves are out on this thread. And they are militant.
Porn has a direct correlation with sex crimes! Porn demeans women and turns them into objects for gratification.
Sad, isn’t it, when porn is a substitute for real life?
Society is porn’s victim!
Well, as a parent…
See? I get to say that ’cause I’m a parent.
As a parent, I’m more concerned with the violence and gore in media and video games as to my son. A porn shop isn’t going to let him in anyway. And they can put just so much on a sign or in a window.
I am getting a kick outta some of the responses on this thread.
I think Nathan’s post is pretty much Nathan, ASININE!
LOL wearing a costume on Halloween is now a substitute for real life?
I’m dying here. Really. What a stretch.
Nathan sounds a bit sexually repressed. Look for him and his wide stance in a bathroom stall near you.
I am just wondering if any of you have a line?
Do you want people walking in front of your children naked?
How about a wierd guy flashing in front of your kids?
Are you ok with that? Or should it be illegal?
Nathan, how did you go from inappropriate costumes to somebody flashing your kids.These racy costumes are worn by women, not men. My stance on the porn issue is different from these constumes. I think porn objectifies women, and desenitizes people that watch them to sexual reality, meaning it perverses their sexuality if that makes any sense, and there are correlations with the porn industry and sex crimes that takes place. On the other hand, young women that choose to wear racy costumes at a halloween party is something completly different. Their not getting paid to dress like a slut, as one college student stated, she gets to tramp out once a year, and be eyed by men as a piece of meat without having to feel violated, thats her choice, in an adult setting to do so. I think the porn industry is extremly sleazy and classless, and its sad to say some of the porn peddelars are major corporations like Hilton Hotels, and General Motors. Its easy sleazy money, I don’t think it should be illegal, but people should be educated why watching it is detrimental to ones mental health, and parents need to do a better job of monitoring internet use, because the internet can be a very disgusting place, especially if a kid is surfing unsupervised, and is looking for smut, I’d imagine a kid who didn’t know any better, might think that the porn they see is what is normal in the real world and that is where the most damadge is done. I still think banning costumes is ludacrous, it’s like a catch 22 with the kids. It seems like kids are more sheltered than ever, banning them from playing tag, and absurb things of that matter, but then theres the internet, when your trying to protect them from the scary world outside, theres an even sicker world they can tap into, in your own home. Really it comes down to, as it always has, the parents doing their job.
As a conservative I must tell you, Southwind needs to get a life.
Are they going to protest JC Penny’s catalogues next?
Please folks, don’t make a laughingstalk out of yourselves. You make it more difficult to make serious changes or to make serious complaints about things that matter.
Let me put it another way:
Show me a Halloween costume that shows more skin than a perfectly legal bathing suit?
Show me a Halloween costume that shows more skin than the average cheerleader uniform, or gymnastics outfit?
Show me a Halloween costume that shows more skin than the ceilings of a Vatican Cathedral. (Painted at a time when all Christians were Catholic.)
This isn’t about porn. A Halloween store is a place that would be loaded with kids, so the issue is having such items in a place that is a designated kid zone.
I don’t even know what the costumes were. I don’t really care for moral do gooders, they are the biggest hypocrites of all. But let’s be fair when talking about what their issue is concerning this.
OK, now let’s talk porn. I’m newer to Kansas, came from a more liberal state, goes both dem and rep from time to time. It’s more liberal overall. Less crime, less drugs, less porn shops, less strip clubs, less “escort” agencies. So now I’m here in the Bible belt, and the things bible thumpers are against, their is 5 times as much as. Why? I think it’s interesting. Nobody where I come from cares about nudie bars, when one does open, nobody makes an issue of it, but yet their aren’t many. I dunno what I’m trying to say.
Now, is porn right, or is porn wrong. Well, in principle it’s not wrong enough for anyone or any government agency to but their noses into. BUT BUT BUT…
It DOES rip up alot of lives. I’ve known so many girls who have been destroyed by that industry. Their are also some who do it, make some money, and get a jumpstart in life. YOU’D BE SOCKED HOW MANY HOT SOCCER MOM’S HAVE A JADED PAST!
I’ve been able to have a unique insight into this whole porn, adult entertainment issue. I work with people in recovery, I help them, and that’s what helps me. I’ve had some pretty deep personal conversations with gals who have been drug through that lifestyle. I’ve also known a couple who didn’t develope a drug habit, or alcoholism, and THEY will be the 1st to admit they are .10%
I’ve even known 2 people who own strip clubs. Even THEY concede that it completely destroys the women. To quote ones comments when a dancer was braging up her money situation, “she will have NOTHING in 10 years, especially her pride.”
The pornography and adult entertainment industry is riddled with drugs, and most, even those who swear they would never fall into that trap do.
It needs to be cleaned up in my opinion. The government has in my opinion a civil right to help prevent people from destroying themselves. I think entertainers should be highly screened for drugs at their expense, every 30 days. I’m talking hair test, you can’t cheat those. If they fail one, then they lose their licence. 1/3 of all money that ends up into the hands of drug cartels originated in the adult entertainment industry. Not only do girls work to support habits, they often are supporting some useless moran’s habit too. Strict monitering of drug use in that field would be a MAJOR blow to drug dealers!
I spent countless hours working on the “Adult Entertainment” language for Sedgwick County code enforcement revisions, when I worked in the Clerk’s office.
Vice cops had lots of stories to tell us.
But we are not talking about porn here. We are not talking about nuddie bars.
Yes, kids will be exposed to some things that us parents will find awkward to explain.
It is kind of like a child who has an overprotective parent, who literally “sanitizes” everything, boiling bottles, disinfecting everything a child might ever touch.
The kid never develops normal, natural immunities. The kid is unhealthy, in future years, due to TOO MUCH mothering, coddeling and protection.
A kid who is overprotected, even from tasteful, clothed sexual expressions of others, will not be socially healthy.
I don’t want my kids exposed to S & M, to gross porn or really kinky, degrading sexual material that does not respect women.
I don’t think you see anything close to that in a Halloween store.
Lighten up!
“The government has in my opinion a civil right to help prevent people from destroying themselves.”
No no no no no.
I totally 100% disagree.
WE porn is like anything else, gambling, booze, smoking..steak…water…… too much is a bad thing for anyone.
By far most people who view porn aren’t predators, they aren’t pervs. So don’t dictate what others can do simply because of a few.
Nathan,”Do you want people walking in front of your children naked?
How about a wierd guy flashing in front of your kids?”
Way too many years ago when I was a fine arts major at KU, I had a professor who would take a model home on weekends to paint in his studio. His wife and kids were quite used to being around nude models.One nice weekend he decided instead of painting, he’d take the family on a canoe trip down the Kaw river. as they came around a river bend, a young man stepped out of the bushes quite nude and waving to them. Wife and kids glanced up, waved back and paddled on, leaving behind one very frustrated flasher.I’ve always considered their attitude to nudity much healthier than what the churches promote.
Jed, ignore Nathan.
He is just flashing (pun intended) his christian/Taliban credentials.
We’d better be careful though, he might threaten us. You know he is a big, bad marine (reservist) who is protecting us from those halloween costume wearing terrorists.
He knows guns, his daddy says he’s a wepons specialist.
We should probably listen to EVERYTHING he says.
How can anyone take these people seriously?
Jed,
Years ago, I too had a stint as a model at the art school. The feedback from the classes were quite encouraging. In their own words, they expressed a gratitude to have a model with some dance training who could hold some difficult poses.
I’ve come to realize that nudity is probably the most natural state for humans. Why else would we born naked?
society determines that the human body is obscene, and it’s really sad. When you work with people who are nude..for bathing, for surgery, for medical purposes, it becomes old hat. You see many tribes in Africa/South America where people run around naked and kids are exposed to nudity and they’re naked too. GASP!
Does anyone find this Chicago Sun Times story obscene?
http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/494203,CST-NWS-snake02.article
I mean the kid had a snake coming out of his pants after he tried stealing it. According to Jan Beemer a snake coming out of someone’s pants is obscene.
Get real Mom. Pornography is not just nudity. You act as if it is something innocent. It disrespects women, teaches young men to view women as sex objects, and fuels the fantasies of sexual criminals.
“I am just wondering if any of you have a line?”
Nathan, I think I answered that clearly:
“Zoning and restrictions on ‘what can be seen where’ make sense.”
I agree with Econ’s view above over protecting your kids from the world is unhealthy at its worse you create people like Ed Gein who’s the basies for a lot of fictional sociopaths. Also do we really want groups like SW using the heavy hand of government to dictate our morals, values, as to want stores we can shop in, books/magazines we read, Movies we watch and how we live our lives because to me that sounds and awfully lot like fascism.
over extreme protection is bad not all protection as could be inferred from my above post
Running around naked in public is already illegal
The fundies will not stop until it is illegal to run around naked in your own home.
“It disrespects women, teaches young men to view women as sex objects, and fuels the fantasies of sexual criminals.
Posted by: outlander | October 12, 2007 at 09:45 AM ”
So are you saying pornography causes young men to view women as sex objects and disrespect them and causes sex crimes?
I think those things happen in the minds of the individuals before they see their first pornographic images.
Get real Mom. Pornography is not just nudity. You act as if it is something innocent. It disrespects women, teaches young men to view women as sex objects, and fuels the fantasies of sexual criminals.
Posted by: outlander
Uh, I’m a woman and I enjoy porn. Different strokes for different folks I guess. (pun not originally intended)
And you’re absolutely right, brian. Look at the lives of serial killers… most started mutilating animals before the age of 10. They had bad home lives, bad parents, were abused, infinite reasons they decided to kill. If they watched porn and the types of porn they watched are a SYMPTOM, not a cause of what they did when they killed.
I don’t want my kids exposed to S & M, to gross porn or really kinky, degrading sexual material that does not respect women.
I don’t think you see anything close to that in a Halloween store.
Lighten up!
Posted by: Econ101
Absolutely, I agree completely. Your statement earlier about being able to see cheerleaders and athletes in skimpy outfits (which is all the worst is in terms of Halloween costumes at Party City, etc etc) everywhere was perfect.
I dunno..have you seen the “Tricky Dicky” costume? You won’t find that at any athletic event.
Outie,” Pornography is not just nudity. You act as if it is something innocent. It disrespects women, teaches young men to view women as sex objects, and fuels the fantasies of sexual criminals.”
Thing is, it couldn’t teach disrespect for women if that disrespect wasn’t already inculcated into the child’s upbringing. Children get the foundation of their attitudes about gender relations from their parents. Without that existing bias, such porn would be utterly meaningless.