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Open thread 10/24
- By Phillip Brownlee
- Posted Oct. 24, 2007 at 1:07 a.m.
- Filed under Open thread
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276 Comments
So, if we dont talk to the trolls, they dont just go away – They multiply into all kinds of crazy morphed personalities! And they talk to each other, and they steal one Nic, and it talks to itself ad infinitum, ad nauseum.
Maybe the boycott should end! The lone idiot on the Blog might do something to him/herself the rate he/she is going so far.
Looks like he/she needs a padded room.
It ain’t me doing that that. It is annoying though as it screws up reading anything worth while.
White House ‘Eviscerates’ CDC Director’s Senate Testimony On Global WarmingToday, Dr. Julie Gerberding, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, testified before the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee on the “Human Impacts of Global Warming.” Gerberding told the committee that global warming “is anticipated to have a broad range of impacts on the health of Americans,” but gave few specifics, instead focusing on CDC’s current preparation plans. From her statement:
An effective public health response to climate change can prevent injuries, illnesses, and death and enhance overall public health preparedness. Protecting Americans from adverse health effects of climate change directly correlates to CDC’s four overarching Health Protection Goals of Healthy People in Every Stage of Life, Healthy People in Healthy Places, People Prepared for Emerging Health Threats, and Healthy People in a Healthy World.
While we still need more focus and emphasis on public health preparedness for climate change, many of our existing programs and scientific expertise provide a solid foundation to move forward.
CDC officials are now revealing that the White House heavily edited Gerberding’s testimony, which originally was longer and had more “information on health risks“:
“It was eviscerated,” said a CDC official, familiar with both versions, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitive nature of the review process.
The official said that while it is customary for testimony to be changed in a White House review, these changes were particularly “heavy-handed,” with the document cut from its original 14 pages to four. It was six pages as presented to the Senate committee.
The White House’s deletions included “details on how many people might be adversely affected because of increased warming and the scientific basis for some of the CDC’s analysis on what kinds of diseases might be spread in a warmer climate and rising sea levels.”
Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-CA) today put out a statement, stating, “The Administration should immediately release Dr. Gerberding’s full, uncut statement, because the public has a right to know all the facts about the serious threats posed by global warming.”
The Bush administration has not only repeatedly attempted to suppress global warming facts, but has also muzzled its officials from speaking out. A January report found 435 instances in which the Bush administration interfered into the global warming work of government scientists over the past five years. The administration also attempted to censor the government’s top global warming scientist, James Hansen, who has been outspoken about the dangers of climate change.
We have vast energy-saving potential.
If you live on the west side, but work at Raytheon or Boeing, put seven coworkers in a 26 mpg minivan. That’s 182 mpg per person. For one or two person in-town travel, we’re going to have 80 mpg hybrid subcompacts by 2015.
Turn Central Ave into a bike-and-local-traffic street to make bike commuting workable.
Set up a bike-parking, shower and clothes-changing facility downtown, like Chicago has done. Motor vehicle commuters can take the 54 freeway, 13th, 21st or Harry.
Put R-30 insulation in new-home walls, and R-50 in ceilings.
Install compact fluorescent bulbs: Same light output as incandescents at 25% the electricity usage.
Triple the insulation of refrigerators and water heaters, dial the temp down for the latter to 110 degrees, install 90-degree maintenance temp control for weekdays, with full heating restored an hour before after-work arrival. Or install a heat-as-you-use water heater, as one finds in Europe.
Install rooftop solar panels for water-heating and/or electricity generation.
This morning I watch a broadcast of a subcommittee hearing of the Senate on Homeland security on the threat of chemical and biological attack. Other then is had the flavor of a Monty Python skit chaired by Sen. Joe Lieberman. A couple of years ago I brought to this table the news the feds did not have a real plan of action in the case of such attacks. I was lampooned by some more from assuming that there was and not knowing of one.
The subcommittee hearing occurred Tuesday, other then some halfway detection attempts (There has been no false positives so far, 20 positives all natural causes) there is still no coordinated plan of action in the case of a chemical or Biological attack upon the homeland. If such an attack is detected then it falls to the local response to deal with it immediately. Then what they either do not know how to handle or do not have the resources to handle they may request for the Federal government’s assistance. But even then there is no set plan of action in the federal government to deal with such a request. Now it can be said that there are several different variables that one plan could not cover. But that demands a better plan not no plan at all!
MPS — Excellent suggestions!
World Series starts tonite! GO Rockies!
Go Rockies!
Not to get Toby Keith in trouble, he told my girlfriend that, in front of other women, at a tanning place on Rock Road, probably to get the girls to quit hitting on him!
whoops sorry, put that in the wrong place
Did I troll myself?
Paul, whether the right place or the wrong, your sentence doesn’t make a bit of sense. Try taking out a comma and cleaning it up.
Jesus WEPT. I just scrolled through last night’s open thread.
If the editors cant get a hold on THAT round of sock puppets, nic stealers, and trolls…
…then I can only conclude, they LIKE them!
SURELY you can ban the instigator of last night’s nic stealing and trolling.
Or is the troll really smarter than the WE editors? It’s starting to look that way…
At the GOP debate the other night, Mike Huckabee made an odd claim.
“When our founding fathers put their signatures on the Declaration of Independence, those 56 brave people, most of whom, by the way, were clergymen, they said that we have certain inalienable rights given to us by our creator.”
“Most” of the signers were clergy? Is that true? Actually, no.
Only one of the 56 was an active clergyman, and that was John Witherspoon. Witherspoon was a Presbyterian minister and president of the College of New Jersey (now Princeton University).
A few more of the signers were former clergymen, though it’s a little unclear just how many…. We’d like to give Huckabee every benefit of the doubt, but even if you consider former clergymen among the signers the best you could come up with is four. Out of 56. That’s not “most,” that’s Pants-on-Fire wrong.
It’s a common problem at the Republican debates — why let facts get in the way of a perfectly good soundbite?
Tthese days it has become impossible to tell where the mainstream stops and the fanatical fringe begins. Just look at what the so-called “mainstream” of the Republiic Party is endorsing
We have a mainstream on the right that supports torture, that is backing an Attorney General nominee who is agnostic on torture, and that rallies behind a president who refuses to define what the word “torture” means.
A mainstream that supports — even applauds — the behavior of Blackwater thugs.
A mainstream that continues to back the White House’s delusions about Iraq at the expense of our military, our treasure, our safety, and our standing in the world.
A mainstream that supports the gutting of our civil liberties.
So, it can no longer be denied: the right wing lunatics are running the Republic Party asylum.
These days, the only thing that separates the RNC and Rush Limbaugh is a prescription for OxyContin.
The latest evidence: the ugly smear campaign mounted against 12-year-old brain injury survivor Graeme Frost and his family. This new-low-in-messenger-killing wasn’t just the doing of the toxic talk radio, rabble-rousing right; it was Senator Mitch McConnell pulling together the talking points. And then lying about his involvement when exposed.
Despite the fanatical right’s takeover of the Republic Party, the traditional media — with its obsession with “balance” and its pathological devotion to the idea that truth is always found in the middle — has failed to properly document the metamorphosis. So much easier to see everything that’s happening in American politics through the lens of right versus left.
Rocket technology exchanged for Clinton Campaign Contributions is now paying off for the Chinese.
China has demonstrated the ability to destroy satellites in space, improved Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles, and now Rockets to the moon, using Clinton technology.
How nice that Clinton sold out US National Security for Campaign Contributions. And this continues to this day thru Hsu and the Dishwashers.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,304637,00.html
China Successfully Launches First Lunar Probe, Plans RoverWednesday, October 24, 2007
BEIJING — China launched its first lunar probe Wednesday, an initial step in an ambitious 10-year plan to send a rover to the moon and return it to Earth.
The Chang’e 1 orbiter blasted off with a trail of smoke from the Xichang Satellite Launch Center in Sichuan province in southwestern China, according to images from state television.
GO RED SOX!!! SOX IN 6!!!
Fox News loves to play the fear card.
“This morning on Fox News, hosts of the show Fox and Friends blamed the wildfires in California on a new culprit: al Qaeda. They pointed to a 2003 FBI memo, which raised the possibility that al Qaeda may try to set wildfires around the western United States. They also noted that men in a “hovering helicopter” saw “a guy starting one of these fires.
I should have said Fox Opinion channel because that’s all they do, give opinions. I’m glad I wised up and stopped watching Fox.
Right-wing pundit Glenn Beck responded to criticism over his suggestion earlier this week that the California wildfires are damaging the homes of “a handful of people who hate America.” Beck yesterday lashed out at “a few liberal bloggers” who, he said, “claim that I’m serious when I’m joking and try to cause trouble.”
“Despite new House travel restrictions, lawmakers accepted free trips worth nearly $1.9 million during the first eight months of this year — more than in all of 2006, records show.” For example, the conservative Club for Growth “spent $32,242 to bring 10 GOP lawmakers to its April convention at the Ritz-Carlton Palm Beach in Florida that included a four-hour cruise on a 170-foot yacht.”
“The Bush Administration is reportedly considering air strikes, including cruise missiles, against the Kurdish rebel group PKK in northern Iraq. The move would be an attempt to stave off a Turkish invasion of that country to fight the rebels.”
The Iraqi government announced today that it has decided to “formally revoke the immunity from prosecution granted to private security companies operating in the war-ravaged country.” A government spokesman said in a statement that the Iraqi cabinet “decided to scrap the article pertaining to security companies operating in Iraq that was issued by the CPA in 2004.”
$2.4 trillion: The potential cost of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan through the next decade, “or nearly $8,000 per man, woman and child in the country, according to a Congressional Budget Office estimate.” “The number is so big, it boggles the mind,” said Rep. Rahm Emanuel (D-IL).
“President Bush said yesterday that a missile defense system is urgently needed in Europe to guard against a possible attack on U.S. allies by Iran.” Defense Secretary Robert Gates suggested that the United States “could delay activating such a system until there is ‘definitive proof’ of such a threat.”
“Despite all his recent bravado about being an apostle of small government and budget-slashing,” Bush is the biggest spending president since 1964. According to an analysis by McClatchy, annual growth of discretionary spending (adjusted for inflation) has increased 5.3 percent under Bush’s watch, a number that exceeds the spending of his recent predecessors.
“The government’s terrorist watch list has swelled to more than 755,000 names,” growing by approximately “200,000 names a year since 2004.” The new report by the Government Accountability Office also “raised worries about the list’s effectiveness.”
And finally: A job listing recently appeared on the D.C. government’s public job database allegedly looking for a personal chef for MSNBC pundit Tucker Carlson. The posting named Carlson, who listed his own occuation as “Able Seaman.” The pay was just “$7.50 an hour, with no benefits.” Evidently though, according to Carlson, the posting was a hoax.
When did the poster known as Hank Price suggest the current boycott?
“Panel on Climate Change, made up of scientists from around the world, estimates the sea level rise by 2100 could be as much as 1½ feet.
“That sea level rise is only based on melt from ice sheets, and does not include a new fast flow of ice we have detected in Greenland that is generating additional icebergs,” said Dr. Konrad Steffen, a climate scientist with the University of Colorado, Boulder. Watch how greenhouse gases cause temperatures to rise »
Steffen estimates sea levels could rise three feet over the next century, a stark prediction that could wreak havoc around the world if it comes to pass. Greenland holds enough ice to cause sea levels to rise 23 feet if the entire ice sheet melted, a development few scientists expect to happen anytime soon. But global sea levels have been rising at the rate of three millimeters per year since 1993.”
I’m wondering if there is a way to speed this process up. Not sure we can wait one hundred years. We need to get rid of the blue cities/states sooner than that.
One of the only Republicans I can agree with is Jack.
CNN’s Cafferty: Bush putting the poor out in the cold to fund warMike Aivaz and Nick JulianoPublished: Tuesday October 23, 2007
Amid $190 billion Iraq request, 30 million Americans won’t be able to heat homes this winter
As he prepares to ask for $190 billion to fund the war in Iraq, President Bush refuses to approve an extra half-billion dollars that help one in four American households pay skyrocketing home-heating bills this winter.
The debate illustrates what critics say are Bush’s out-of-wack spending priorities, after he vetoed a popular measure that would have expanded healthcare available to poor children.
“No money for kids’ health insurance, no money to help poor families pay their heating bills but President Bush wants $190 billion additional for 2008 for his wars in Iraq and Afghanistan,” CNN commentator Jack Cafferty said Monday. “Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid says the president’s new request means the cost of Iraq war is now approaching $650 billion. I wonder if the Democrats will give him the money.”
Rising oil prices are creating a “heat or eat” dilemma for families struggling near or below the poverty line.
“Parents know that children can freeze to death more quickly than they starve to death, and so most decrease food purchases first to pay for heat,” wrote Dr. Deborah A. Frank, director of the Grow Clinic for Children, and Joseph P. Kennedy II, chairman and president of Citizens Energy Corp., in the Boston Globe Sunday.
The home heating debate involves grants distributed through the Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program, known as LIHEAP. The program operates with an annual budget of $2.16 billion — just $300 million more than when the program started in 1991, as Cafferty notes.
The House wants to bump LIHEAP funding to $2.66 billion per year, while the Senate has approved a bill that would maintain its current funding level, which would only cover 16 percent of the 38 million eligible American households, according to Reuters.
But even static funding is too much for Bush, who wants to cut the program to $1.78 billion for fiscal year 2008. That’s less than 1 percent of the $192 billion he has requested to fund dual wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and it amounts to about a week’s worth of Pentagon war spending, according to
To view the videoCNN.http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Bush_to_CUT_30_Million_Households_1023.html
It’s been reported that when Hillary becomes president, Bill will be the “First Laddy”.
“As he prepares to ask for $190 billion to fund the war in Iraq, President Bush refuses to approve an extra half-billion dollars that help one in four American households pay skyrocketing home-heating bills this winter.”
Poster, I do not see any of this as a problem. It illustrates the different beliefs in our country.
Where does it say I am obligated to pay anyone else’s fuel bill? You see it as a national obligation. I do not.
And fuel bills will be come much more critical, as the supply tightens and prices continue to skyrocket. IT WILL AFFECT ALL AMERICANS HEATING BILLS.
Healthcare for kids. Same situation. I have no obligation to pay your kids healthcare costs. I have enough trouble paying my own.
Not a moral obligation, not a ethical obligation, and not a legal obligation.
Sorry.
And I wish you libs would stop comparing apples to oranges. War costs are a temporary drain on our nation at any given time (any war). Please do not confuse that with the delima of providing social services to certain Americans. Services become entitlements. Entitlements become a permanent drain on our nations resources. It also etches in stone the socialist achievements of your party.
“War costs are a temporary drain on our nation at any given time (any war).”
So…. exactly HOW MANY generations of tax revenue will it take to pay for george and dick’s excellent adventure?
But please, continue to think of that as “temporary”.
heheheheheheeheh!
So…. exactly HOW MANY generations of tax revenue will it take to pay for george and dick’s excellent adventure?
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
How much did JFK and LBJ’s little Vietnam experience cost us?
I didn’t post to point fingers. Just the difference in beliefs.
And any and all funding for the George’s Iraqi Was – was approved by Congress. Just as they are ABOUT TO APPROVE AGAIN TODAY.
Please, let’s end this war! Call/email your representatives and tell them to vote NO on further funding of the iraqi war.
Do it now.
They DO HAVE A CHOICE. They can each vote AYE or NAY.
Their vote, seals them in history tied to this war.
THE TIMES OF INDIA
“Redford hits out at Bush over Iraq”
“Redford, who has directed and is the main protagonist of the anti-war thriller, came out with blazing guns against Bush and the war in Iraq.
Robert Redford lashed out at the Bush administration at a press conference at the Rome Film Festival.
The veteran star’s new movie ‘Lions for Lambs’, which also stars Tom Cruise and Meryl Streep, will be screened at the festival.
Redford, who has directed and is the main protagonist of the anti-war thriller, came out with blazing guns against Bush and the war in Iraq.
“Our country has hit a point where we have lost so much,” Variety quoted him, as saying.
“We have lost lives, we’ve lost sacred freedoms, we’ve lost financial stability; we’ve lost our position of respect on the world stage.”
The movie is also set to open the American Film Institute festival on Nov.1.
It will be then be released in the US, after which it will hit theatres in the UK and Italy.”
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Entertainment/International_Buzz/Redford_hits_out_at_Bush_over_Iraq/articleshow/2486003.cms
Amway. What an appropriate nic. Uh, the point is, the costs of this war are long term, not short term.
But thanks for twisting the subject. I notice you do that when you got nothing.
…and btw, I thought you said the costs of ALL wars was short term, no?
So then, I guess the costs of the viet nam folly must be short term too.
You are so busy posting out yer ass you dont even read yer own crap.
“Entitlements become a permanent drain on our nations resources. It also etches in stone the socialist achievements of your party.”
Ok heheheh. Now I see that you were indeed “not posting to point fingers”.
hee hee hee hee hee.
Are you really a lib just TRYING to make cons look stupid? ‘Cause you are doing a REALLY good job…
farmgirl whatever. You sure must have gotten up on the wrong side of the bed. Take it out on your farm! Go beat a rake against a barn door or something.
Don’t sidetrack us on the cost of war. My post expressed a difference in opinion in what our federal government should/should not be funding.
Say American Way, by subsidizing 1 in every 4 households in America for heating bills, we continue to ENCOURAGE the use of fossil fuels, ECOURAGE the increase in Global warming, DISCOURAGE people from conserving energy.
The Libs are all for stopping the use of fossil fuels, stoppiing the man-caused Global Warming, and for conserving energy – unless they have to PAY for it themselves.
The Socialist Environmentalists, love their causes, they just don’t support their own causes with their own pocketbook.
As long as someone else pays, I’d support it too.
But as a working man, I’m supporting myself and all those deadbeats too.
It’s time for them to support themselves.
Heh!
So according to amway….
War dollars = good.
Social security dollars = bad.
Got it.
“And I wish you libs would stop comparing apples to oranges. War costs are a temporary drain on our nation at any given time (any war). Please do not confuse that with the delima of providing social services to certain Americans.”
amway is BASED on the idea that a sucker is born every minute…
…and a reminder to all those who get a government check every month. Like the elderly, the disabled, widows and children…
A vote for republicans is a vote for the “philosophy” espoused by amway!
Vote republican! It’s easier than thinking….
So exactly which of the above would JESUS not fund?
The Libs are all for stopping the use of fossil fuels, stoppiing the man-caused Global Warming, and for conserving energy – unless they have to PAY for it themselves.
Excellent point Max.
What gets me is they claim to hold the higher moral ground with their socialist programs. Then they turn around and spit hate at religious people for having beliefs about their fellow man!
They are their own religion in a way. Socialism.
So exactly which of the above would JESUS not fund?
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
I don’t know farmy, you are the ONLY one preaching today. You must claim to know.
hee hee hee
They must be out of ammunition. They are shooting blanks now.
Reduced to “yeah, yo mama”!
“And I wish you libs would stop comparing apples to oranges. War costs are a temporary drain on our nation at any given time (any war)”
If that is the case why is the national debt approaching 10 trillion dollars. We must still be paying for the cold war.
And as an extra bonus from the GWOT, the fed seems to be monetizing the debt.That means printing money to cover the bills.Anybody who has been to the store sees the cost inflation. Milk 4.25 a gallon, health care costs skyrocketing.Dollar losing value almost daily.
There is no such thing as terrorism, just an excuse to justify a totalitarian government.
Annie, the debt does not matter when we are talking about printing up some of that FREE MONEY needed to feed the nanny nation.
“Annie, the debt does not matter when we are talking about printing up some of that FREE MONEY needed to feed the nanny nation.”
Well, if the debt doesnt matter, then why did you bring up the cost of entitlements?
Shifting sands, shifting opinions.
Face it amway. You’re getting your ass handed to you today.
And we are laughing all the way!
This is terrible.
“WINDHOEK, Namibia — Sixty-eight villagers in northern Namibia were hospitalized last week after eating a dog that had been killed by disease, the local daily The Namibian reported Wednesday.”
They should have been eating cats.
Am way
Max?
I want you guys to do me a favor.
Wear a badge or something.
See? I want to teach my kid your attitude.
SO if he sees you stalled by the road or yyour house burning down or someone trying to cut your
throat he can know who you are and say:
“Huh, not my prob;lem”
Seriously, do you IMAGINE I teach my kid the kind of America YOU want is worth fighting for?
Uh that would be no.
Max,
“The Libs are all for stopping the use of fossil fuels, stoppiing the man-caused Global Warming, and for conserving energy – unless they have to PAY for it themselves.”
Bull-f*cking-Shit, blowhard. Here’s what CF2K drives.
http://egovehicles.com/
My carbon footprint is significantly reduced, thanks. Zero emissions is still some ways off. But one shouldn’t let the perfect be the enemy of good.
Unless, of course, one is a disingenuous Right Wing concern troll. Then nothing EVER is good enough.
research done by George Barna and released in September shows the younger generation, ages 16-29, views Christianity as judgmental, hypocritical, old-fashioned and too political.http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/guestvoices/2007/10/most_christians_to_left_of_far.html
No farm girl, you are having a good time attacking conservative posters on this blog today.
You wonder why everyone leaves. What fun would you have if only one opinion was posted?
You just cannot understand that many Americans: do not want to fund your socialist agenda. I could care less about your gay rights agenda too. I really don’t care which way you “swing” personally. Don’t care. Don’t hate. Don’t want to know.
But if it comes to you reaching into my back pocket to pay for it – then I get fired up. Both barrells blazing.
So please continue to post nothing rational or even opinions (except negative opinions about others).
It’s my money, and no amount of your belly aiching crying is going to change that.
And please, don’t selectively skip over what I posted. I said to END THIS WAR NOW.
Get your democrat majority to vote NO. NOW!!
Dem’s Get ANOTHER Chance to End The Iraq War!
That’s why you Libs voted in the majority last year right!
Still, the Liberal Socialist Democrat Majority Congress voted to fund the war for 2007 last May.
Now, the Dems have ANOTHER chance to end the war!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/22/AR2007102202144.html
The spending fight will test Democrats, who so far have been frustrated in their efforts to force Bush to change direction in Iraq. The most powerful means in the hands of Congress is the power of the purse, but so far Democrats have been unwilling to refuse the president any money for the war. When they attached a U.S. troop withdrawal timetable to the war funding bill in the spring, Bush vetoed it and Congress ended up sending him the money without major conditions.
Seriously, do you IMAGINE I teach my kid the kind of America YOU want is worth fighting for?
Uh that would be no.
Posted by: J R
Right back at you J R. I taught my children self-reliance, to be independent and self-sufficient. To not expect or rely on ANYONE but themselves. To blame no one but themselves. To put as much as they can in low tax, tax deferred, and no-tax products now while they are young. To tithe to the church of their choice and help their neighbor. But NEVER give them money.
Because the greedy SOB’s will try to steal it all away from them.
Here’s a thought to keep ya warm Amway.
If terrorists come to cut your throat.
I
don’t
care!
“But if it comes to you reaching into my back pocket to pay for it – then I get fired up. Both barrells blazing.”
Funny, I feel the same way about CORPORATE welfare.
And the costs of bush’s war of choice.
And your little dog too…..
You think we dont pay taxes? Or not as much? See CF’s link about federal revenue generated in blue or “liberal” states as opposed to the welfare sucking red states.
What’s the matter? You cant read? Or cant admit the truth?
“To put as much as they can in low tax, tax deferred, and no-tax products now while they are young.”
Sounds to me like you are not paying much in taxes anyway, so quit yer bitchin’.
So much for “support the troops”.
As long as OTHERS pay the taxes!
The real truth about amway is revealed…
GMC70
If you need to get your blood pressure up today go check this out.
http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0743,weinstein,78160,6.html
Funny, I feel the same way about CORPORATE welfare.
And the costs of bush’s war of choice.
And your little dog too…..
You think we dont pay taxes? Or not as much? See CF’s link about federal revenue generated in blue or “liberal” states as opposed to the welfare sucking red states.Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
Take me out of the box you have assigned to me farm girl. I AGREE with your dislike of corporate welfare. I’d also end the agricultural welfare bucket too. I also have posted MANY times to END THE WAR NOW. And I saw your or someone’s tirade of “what if” blue and red states revenue generation was added up (and something about you having the nice beaches which mattered to you for some reason). I disagree with their conclusion about the red/blue revenue shares. But I’ll even GIVE it to you that it is correct. Great. Let’s follow that up with a nice civil war. I’d take the red states on principle, give the blue states the social welfare at all levels, and watch the beaches on the Travel Channel.You can have them.
You think we dont pay taxes? Or not as much? See CF’s link about federal revenue generated in blue or “liberal” states as opposed to the welfare sucking red states.
What’s the matter? You cant read? Or cant admit the truth?
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl | October 24, 2007 at 11:43 AM
Sorry, having a hard time finding a state that is populated 100 percent blue.
You must mean New York. No wait, they have Republican Governor and NYC Republican Mayors.
Oh! I bet California. NM Schwartzenegger is a Republican.
Then there must be Kennedy’s home state of Mass? Ooops, isn’t that where Romney was Governor, you know that Republican.
Must be Florida, the winter vacation and retirement home of all Dems right? Oh yeah, Republicans sort of won that state in some Presidential elections.
So, where exactly are these 100 percent pure “blue” states at kfg? :)
neighbors = “greedy SOBs”
Now that says a lot about the state of a conservative mind, doesn’t it. Captures the real strength of that ideology.
Thank you. Back to the boycott.
Actually, I’m glad for the posts of folks like Max and Amway.
I have my kid read them. Then I ask him if he would go fight for such folks.
The mind of a kid….
“But dad they don’t care about me. Why should I care about them?”
The most powerful means in the hands of Congress is the power of the purse, but so far Democrats have been unwilling to refuse the president any money for the war.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/22/AR2007102202144.html
And still, the Dems REFUSE to STOP the Iraq War!
What’s your EXCUSE Dems?
You don’t need a super majority to NOT pass a spending bill.
There’s no Bush Veto threat to a bill you do NOT pass.
Stop it! You said you would!
DEMOCRATS LIED!
Thank you. Back to the boycott.
Posted by: Steven Davis | October 24, 2007 at 11:50 AM
ANOTHER BOYCOTT VIOLATOR!
Penalty is 3 extra days off the Blog.
Davis, you may return at 12:01 AM on 11/4.
Thank you. Back to the boycott.
Posted by: Steven Davis
Sorry, you cannot selectively participate in a “boycott”. You BROKE it bozo. Says a lot about your boycott.
neighbors = those living next door.
greedy SOB’s = liberals who think EVERYONE is your neighbor and deserve MY MONEY.
Max is a new take here.
We have people for the war no matter what.
We have the other side.
Max is unique. He will use the troops for a football no matter what.
He bitches the Dems can’t end the war.
But he would be the FIRST to jump all over them if they did.
Hate the troops much Max?
Just how short term is life long support and care for all the quadaplegics, and ptsd’s that return from Iraq? In the nam days, if you were seriously injured, you could look forward to dying, now you can look forward to a life long disability.
Go ahead JR, fill your kid’s head full of crap about Conservatives not caring.
When’s the last time you whipped out your wallet and took out 50% of your money and gave it away?
If Libs cared so much, they would spend THEIR OWN MONEY!
Instead, the Libs define caring to be:
Those people who give their money to us! They care!
We Libs don’t have to give our money to them. We don’t earn any. And, we Libs don’t really care!
Don’t mess with me James.
Or I’ll remind everyone who you are…
red state blue state dividehttp://www.princeton.edu/~rvdb/JAVA/election2004/
Fanny thing about this country.
We are willing to compel young people to go and fight and die for us.
Then SOME of us fight tooth and nail against the basic help with necessities for our fellow man….
It is not congruent.
I meant “funny thing about this country”
“Fanny” sorta works too though.
Y’kno, “J R” –
It might be a “fanny” thing about this country; too many a$$holes in charge.
“Assuming the impressions of these young respondents are shaped by the media they would only know about the extreme ultra-conservative brand of Christianity. Most Christians in the U.S. are not that. Most Christians believe in an authentic, inclusive and welcoming gospel in the thousands of communities where they worship.”
Posted by: Blue Maxx | October 24, 2007 at 11:37 AM
Even Newsweek and the Washingpost got it right. It is the paint the media put on Christians that make the young have this impression. Good source Bluemaxx.
“Sorry, having a hard time finding a state that is populated 100 percent blue.”
Typical straw man by Kansas. He doesnt acknowledge that red and blue states exist unless they are 100%.
That little bit of his ass he’s showing with those comments is what is left after having it handed to him so many times today.
I thought the red/blue thing was divided by how they voted in the preznit election. Not governors.
But hey, typical republican. Cant win the game? Change the rules.
Well that’s it for my break.
Some of you older folks; you might want to remember the younger.
You are making your fortunes at our expense. You are funding your adventures with our future.
The world or even just your little place in it is just a bit bigger and more important than you and what you’ve got or get.
J R you sure threaten lots of people on this blog. And what in the world are you doing telling that son of yours that someone doesn’t want to help him. It’s not nice to lie. Especially to your kid. I hope he has a momma that can wipe out your garbage.
I meant “funny thing about this country”
“Fanny” sorta works too though.
Posted by: J R
Yes. It makes just as much sense as the remainder of that post.
Thanks monkeyhawk : )~
I thought the red/blue thing was divided by how they voted in the preznit election. Not governors.
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl | October 24, 2007 at 12:08 PM
You thought wrong.
Ever hear of the 10th Amendment?
“The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”
Heh! That has about as much to do with the discussion as the picture of a cat with a pancake on its head.
Like I said, when you get your ass handed to ya all day long, all you can do is change the subject.
This morning should have given the eds all they need to stomp out the trolls.
If they want to, that is.
You are making your fortunes at our expense. You are funding your adventures with our future.Posted by: J R
Psst JR! That’s the secret – we WORKED for what we have. We don’t want to give it away to you.
Go EARN YOUR OWN. Just like we did.
But hey, typical republican. Cant win the game? Change the rules.
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl | October 24, 2007 at 12:08 PM
Well not speaking for anyone else I believe a thinkin person could draw the conclusion that dems or repubs couldn’t take credit for all the tax dollars in any state. So just taking the state doesn’t mean that the right wingnuts in your blue state would keep giving you their tax dollars. You blues would have to work to give away your own money. New idea for libs especially that J R.
Still hungover? Or starting a new binge. Those nonsensical posts are usually the harbingers of bingeville.
This morning should have given the eds all they need to stomp out the trolls.
If they want to, that is.
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl | October 24, 2007 at 12:14 PM
Actually kfg, another definition of trolling is excessive posting to get attention.
With that, you’ve definitely succeeded today in trolling.
ksfrmgrrrl those footsteps behind you aren’t coming for the others they are coming after you. The eds counted your posts this morning and you went over your quota and you flunked the content test.
You guys are so funny. I thought you said the LIBS made the rules, made the threads, and you were just powerless little bitches.
Editors counting the number of posts? hehheehehehehehehehe.
No wonder you nic switch so much.
Just how does it feel to have showed your ass so many times you are afraid to post under one nic?
…and I STILL havent got an answer on how it feels to be so utterly powerless?
November, 2008 is gonna be SO MUCH FUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I mean if they are already crying like little bitches….
Poor lonely kfg, still posting for attention.
Hey come on! I’m still waiting for more of your “yo mama” comebacks.
Or more changing of the subject.
Hey, I know, how about you wingnuts bring on more god, guns and gays?
Terry must be REALLY busy today.
…and you’re giving it to me.
With every nic and every posting.
Bring it.
“^^” opined:
“It is the paint the media put on Christians…”
That’s droll. There are no bigger media whores than so-called “Christian” evangelicals. Any media “paint” is self-applied by “prosperity gospel” televangelists, by James “Fathers shower with your sons” Dobson, by 24-hour-a-day Send-In-Your-Love-Offering radio, by roll-on-the-floor-sayin’-THANK-YUH-JEEEEEEEEZUS mega-chruches, by Oral Roberts’ hot and cold-running Rolls Royces, by Pat Robertson’s power-smoothie-peddlin’ ministry…
Ah, when faced with reality, the Wingnuts blame “the media.” I guess it was “the media’s” fault, not Ann Coulter when she said Jews need to be “purified,” huh?
Part of your stated theology is to ask forgiveness of your sins, not to blame “the media” for revealing your many transgressions against your fellow humans, your scriptures, and your Lord and Saviour.
If the Dems and the Republicans are BOTH going to continue the Iraq war, are both going to keep spending money like drunken sailors, are both going to ignore the Social Security/Medicare Financial Crisis, are both going to ignore Border Security – then what’s the difference?
hee hee hee hee! Good one monkeyhawk.
I get satellite tv. Even notice how many “all jesus all the time” channels there are?
And as you pointed out, every one of them is a fundraising MACHINE.
Hehehehe. And they wanna bitch about taxes when they voluntarily pay the wingnut tax.
Moneychange much?
transgressions against your fellow humans, your scriptures, and your Lord and Saviour.Posted by: MonkeyHawk
Wow! Some of you really have a hard on against religion. And a bigger one reserved for Christians.
And you have set all of them in one big box called, “wingnuts”.Almost scary how anti-christian you are. You are extreme machines.
Can’t a few christians fall outside the standard wingnut definition? Or should we just burn them all at the stake?
Maybe we should call the waaaaaaaaaaaaaambulance for amway?
AW, there’s a few radical militant lesbian libs here, not respresentative of grass roots America at all.
They live at the fringe, living off the scraps of working people.
then what’s the difference?
Posted by: Max
There is no difference. That is why liberals are extremely confused right now. They are having a very hard time keeping up with the tape recordings:
For the war,against the war,for the war,against the war,for the war until 2013,against the war.
It is not congruent.
AW, there’s a few radical militant lesbian libs here, not respresentative of grass roots America at all.
They live at the fringe, living off the scraps of working people.
Wow! Some of you really have a hard on against liberals. And a bigger one reserved for Gay People.
And you have set all of them in one big box called, “liberals”Almost scary how anti-gay you are. You are extreme machines.
Can’t a few liberals and gays fall outside the standard wingnut definition? Or should we just burn them all at the stake?
KFG
I.V. drip of meth today?
heheheheheh. That old ad hominem of libs living off the cons is just that.
It’s your fallback position, even when discredited.
Would you mind posting it again?
I think there are a few folks on your side. Maybe you could post it one more time to chase them ALL off?
And… I’m not the one on welfare. Or disability. Or social security.
And you? Are you posting from your job? Heheheheh. Like you had one.
“AW, there’s a few radical militant bigot cons here, not respresentative of grass roots America at all.
They live at the fringe, living off the intellectual scraps of thinking people.
Heckler, I.V. drip of kookaide today?
Last time kfg did this, it was a two and a half day rant against GMC.
Maybe if we ignore it, it will wear itself out and go away.
…and where would I get money for meth? Or all drugs?
I mean, living off the scraps like I am…
heheheheheh!
Not as long as you are posting Kansas. Thanks for giving me this bully pulpit wingnuts.
“American Way” asks:
“Can’t a few christians fall outside the standard wingnut definition?”
Not if conservative evangelicals continue to co-opt the term “Christian” to mean only those who agree with their political agenda.
Listen to Dobson or any of the “All God All the Time” radio stations and television channels. When the guys with the Porter Wagoner hair and the gals with the Dolly Parton wigs start talking about “Christian” this or “Christian” that, it’s perfectly clear they’re not talking about Congregationalists or Episcopalians or Mormons or Jehova’s Witnesses. Nope, they’ve steadfastly assumed the term “Christian” can only mean twice-born biblical literalism and opposition to gender rights, separation of church and state, and anything that does not fit the Republic Party’s agenda.
Some people here cook their own I think, using inadequate ventilation practices.
Unless it’s larry craig, teddy haggard, or Obama, MH. THEN they are all for gay rights, tawdry bathroom sex, male prostitutes with meth, and bigoted gospel singers.
It’s all relative for them, ya know?
Except when they are bitchin’ about OUR relativism.
I love how wingnuts hate relativism.
Until they dont.
Can’t a few liberals and gays fall outside the standard wingnut definition? Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
You really feel inferior?
Where girl did I post anything against gays? Or negative of them? I didn’t lump you with the libs because I know gay republicans. And they think YOU are the oxymoron!
Try to stay on point.
“Some people here cook their own I think, using inadequate ventilation practices.”
So then.. it must be those candles, incense and the whiff of sulfer that clogs your brain?
That must pass as another wingnut “yo mama”. The sure sign they got nothin.
Not if conservative evangelicals continue to co-opt the term “Christian” to mean only those who agree with their political agenda.Posted by: MonkeyHawk
I didn’t ASK any of these so-called prophets to speak for me. Or for MY party. I never asked them to hijack my party either, but the anti-abortion crowd needed a place to roost.
In a way, you do yourself a disservice lumping me with Christians. It’s like I have to play somewhere during recess, and you have put me on a team I didn’t ask to join.
Label me selfish, self-centered, conservative, or even nuts. But not all conservatives want to waive the Christian Soldier flag in political debates. Wish you libs were ANTI-abortion. Then you could have em and the label. (I’m not ANTI abortion or homosexuals. I’m FOR my wallet.)
Too bad, “American Way” –
But your money-grubbing greed has been soundly discredited in the political arena. The only success you’ve enjoyed at the polls have been due to the margin of victory provided by evangelical “Christians.”
If you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas.
Come on libs! Speak up! Stop this insane and wasteful spending. In your own opinion: the money could pay for kids health, free winter fuel bills, education accounts, and 401K accounts!!
And remember your concern about our troops dying?
What the heck happened? How will your representatives vote? END THE WAR NOW!!
IT IS WITHIN YOUR PARTIES POWER!!!
They vote soon:
“By Ken Dilanian, USA TODAYWASHINGTON — The cost of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan could total $2.4 trillion through the next decade, or nearly $8,000 per man, woman and child in the country, according to a Congressional Budget Office estimate scheduled for release Wednesday.”
I was thinking the same Monkeyhawk.
Maybe the wingnuts roosted in your party because your party shares their beliefs?
If you dont like it, boot ‘em out of your party? Or cant your party do without the “christian” money they bring in?
’cause it’s all about YOUR wallet.
Are you saying greed knows no party?
“Greed is good”? Are you really Gordon Geko?
“IT IS WITHIN YOUR PARTIES POWER!!!”
And yours too. That’s why they call them “roadblock” republicans.
I bet if the repukes introduced a resolution to end the war, a majority of the democrats would support it.
Why not write to Todd and have him do it? Or sam. Or Pat. Or Jerry.
You first. The dems will follow.
Really.
But your money-grubbing greed has been soundly discredited in the political arena. Posted by: MonkeyHawk
Well thank-you for that! Money-grubbing greed. I like the sound of that. Maybe I can make a new NIC outta it. Work in progress.
Soundly defeated? Just wait. I am one of 77 million Americans who are crossing into a new stage of life.
77 million is 25% of the American population. With declining birth rates – we will be the BIGGEST politcal force in America.
Liberals and conservatives. We will allll be greedy when we are allll on limited/fixed incomes.
We will make the AARP look like a chorus line.
When your income stops, you will protect your own. And along with me – we will tax the heck out of the youngsters (JR included).
Just like the AARP does today!!
Why not write to Todd and have him do it? Or sam. Or Pat. Or Jerry.
You first. The dems will follow.
Really.
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
I DID!!! And BOYDA!!!!
Vote to end the wasteful spending and life of our service men and women! (I really didn’t care about the innocent civilians, that used to be your party banter, but it went out with Hillary’s announcement in support of the war.)
“Liberals and conservatives. We will allll be greedy when we are allll on limited/fixed incomes.”
Uh, I thought conservative took care of themselves and their own, and planned ahead so they wouldnt need handouts?
Why would their income stop if they planned ahead?
Why dont they return their social security and disability and SSI checks?
Looking out for their own wallets?
MAX, HOW MANY TIMES DO YOU HAVE TO BE TOLD? THE DEMOCRATS CANT DEFUND THE WAR, BECAUSE THEY NEED A SUPER-MAJORITY 2/3 VOTE, AND THE REPUBLICANS WONT HELP THEM TO VOTE AGAINST FUNDING. SO, IT IS NOT THE DEMOCRATS FAULT!
Chas disappears with his CAPS and exclamation points and Sugar shows up with his CAPS and exclamation points. Interesting.
Oh man, I think this is FUNNY as hell. I was right. We need to call the waaaaaaambulance for both Garden City and Hays.
“The Hutchinson News
GARDEN CITY — Lon Wartman jumped ship from the Republican Party during the Watergate scandal of the 1970s.
Now, he’s ready to renounce ties to the Democratic Party over coal plants in western Kansas.
Wartman announced his resignation as chairman of the Finney County Democratic Party within minutes of the decision to reject permits for two proposed plants in Holcomb, calling the party’s state leadership “despicable.”
“At this point in time, when you find issues with both parties, to be fair to everybody it would probably be best if I was an independent,” Wartman said.
The Kansas Department of Health and Environment handed down the long-awaited decision on the plants proposed for the Hays-based Sunflower Electric Cooperative site in Holcomb on Thursday.
Wartman said he’s heard from several party members who have gone to the courthouse to change their affiliation and predicts a long dry spell for Democrats in the southwest corner of the state.
“There isn’t going to be a Democrat elected in western Kansas for a long time to come,” he said.
The party didn’t have much of a foothold in the region as it was. Only two legislators — Sen. Janice Lee, Kensington, and Rep. Dennis McKinney, Greensburg — are Democrats, and both supported the Sunflower expansion.
“It was pretty cold out there for Democrats to begin with, and now it’s in a deep freeze,” said Joe Aistrup, chairman of the political science department of Kansas State University.”
The best part of this?
The party didn’t have much of a foothold in the region as it was. Only two legislators — Sen. Janice Lee, Kensington, and Rep. Dennis McKinney, Greensburg — are Democrats, and both supported the Sunflower expansion.
Heheheheh> NOW do you get it? Sebelius doesnt give a RAT’s ass about western Kansas.
Her ex-chief of staff PERSONALLY told me there weren’t enough votes out here to matter.
I’m so sure they are running scared of the BIG BAD republican machine in the west.
Like I said before. How does it feel guys to get screwed without even being kissed?
heheheheheheh!
Uh Lon? Exactly WHEN was the last time Finney county sent a democrat to the legislature? Or didnt go republican in a congressional race?
Waaaaaaaaa. Waaaaaaaaaa. We arent going to vote for you, even if we never did. Waaaaaaaaaaa!
“SO, IT IS NOT THE DEMOCRATS FAULT!”
It’s the Republican’s fault because they are in the minority.Wait.. what?
Am Way….you only solidify my previous posts about what the GOP stands for….God , Guns and Greed. Its the “stay out of my pocket” unless its to go kill innocent foreigners policy that has eroded our credibility. Your party was the one on “accountability”. Well at least thats what they ran on. And restoring “crediblility” to the WH. Hows that going? You prove once again that your party is not interested in whats best for the country. But whats best for a selected few. Thats what I call “real leadership”. You can benefit from the GOP as long as you are white, hetro, male, make more than 100k per year, love to hunt, hit the plate on sunday, and is paranoid dillusional. You can keep your party and the beliefs of said party.
Like playing the victim don’t ya Mike.
“there’s more than enough for all the needy, but never enough for all the greedy”
Ghandi I think
Never called myself a victim Kansas…eerrrr Republican. Just pointing out the narrow minds of those in your party. You are outraged at how local taxes are spent, yet you allow companies like Blackwater and Dyncorp to loot the treasury. You embrace prejudice will carrying your bible. Your party is the true definition of hypocrisy. You don’t talk out the side of your mouth you guys blow hard out of your asses. Its amazing to see. And what really blows my mind is that you actually think that people believe what you are saying. Your ego doesn’t allow you to consider that you are insulting the others intelligence with the pure garbage that is spewing from your mouth. You use God as a crutch to push forward an agenda full of hate and intolerance. Yet you forget that what you are doing is specifically addressed in that book you carry under your arm. Not a victim buddy. Not an idiot either.
http://www.socsec.org/publications.asp?pubid=507
Myth #1: Social Security is in crisis and facing bankruptcy.
Even if Congress were to leave Social Security untouched, the program would be able to pay currently guaranteed benefits in full until 2042, according to the program’s trustees. Thereafter, about 70 percent of promised benefits could be financed. The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office is even more optimistic: it projects that, without changes, Social Security will be able to meet its obligations in full until 2053, after which about 80 percent of benefits still could be paid for. Even under those worst-case scenarios, decades from now the system would be far from “bankrupt,” “flat-out bust,” or “broke,” which imply that no resources would be available to pay any benefits. At that time, workers and their employers still will be contributing payroll taxes to finance benefits for retirees.
Iraq war: $1.9 trillion. That’s 1,000 billion dollars. And the republicans are bitching about 35 billion over ten years. Someone has their priorities radically screwed up.
MAX, HOW MANY TIMES DO YOU HAVE TO BE TOLD? THE DEMOCRATS CANT DEFUND THE WAR, BECAUSE THEY NEED A SUPER-MAJORITY 2/3 VOTE, AND THE REPUBLICANS WONT HELP THEM TO VOTE AGAINST FUNDING. SO, IT IS NOT THE DEMOCRATS FAULT!
Posted by: sugar | October 24, 2007 at 01:26 PM
WTF?
Wrong again Sugar baby.
Did you read any of the news links posted above?
Did you have a basic Government 101 class in grade school, middle school, high school?
There is NO more funding for the Iraq War, UNLESS Congress appropriates more money for it.
THE Lib Dem Socialist Majority in Congress can STOP any Bill from passing.
You DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT need a Super Majority to NOT Pass a spending bill.
If all Dems are this stupid, my God our Education system sucks!
Sugar = Chas
CHAS IS VIOLATING THE BOYCOTT!
NO ONE ELSE TYPES IN ALL CAPS LIKE HE DOES!
If all Dems are this stupid, my God our Education system sucks!
Posted by: Max | October 24, 2007 at 02:12 PM
Public Education does suck, Max. It is that bad.
Uh, I thought conservative took care of themselves and their own, and planned ahead so they wouldnt need handouts? Why would their income stop if they planned ahead?
Looking out for their own wallets?
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
Just like senior citizens TODAY. Both parties!!!! Rich and poor. Seniors take care of seniors. Proven fact. Look at AARP. Look at the causes they promote. Rich and poor agree – don’t mess with me.
No cut in Social Security.No reduction in the COLA formula.No means testingControl Medicare contributions by seniors (reduces SS)No taxing 401K’s (last bastion of billions)No taxing Roth/otherKeep retirement age the same
To name but a few. All common goals of the 77 million boomers.
(some will talk trash now, about how they would sacrifice to save the program – BUT WHAT’S TO SAVE??? Demcrats are FIRM – SS IS NOT BROKEN….)
“there’s more than enough for all the needy, but never enough for all the greedy”
Ghandi I think
Posted by: ken
Then why the heck are you liberal democrats wanting to STEAL from the GREEDY to give to YOUR NEEDY???????????????
They’re *everybody’s* needy.
Unless, of course, you believe in the old “I got mine, all other go to hell” philosophy. Which, apparently, you do.
What a cold, humanless existence you must live, “American Way.”
For Sugar/Chas, I’ll type real slow and use a very simple example of how the Democrats can End the Iraq War(if they wanted to):
BUSH:
Congress, we need $200 billion to continue the war in Iraq from December 2007 thru December 2008. Congress, please pass a spending bill for $200 billion to authorize funding for the war in Iraq.
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES:
The mean nasty Republicans introduce a $200 billion Iraq spending bill. ASSUMING the kind caring Democrats allow the bill to pass out of Committee, then the bill goes to the floor for a vote.
200 mean nasty Republicans vote to pass the $200 billion Iraq spending bill.
233 kind caring Democrats vote to reject the $200 billion Iraq spending bill.
Result: The bill does NOT pass. The War in Iraq is NOT funded.
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES:
Sorry Bush, the War in Iraq is NOT funded. The money the Dem Congress approved to continue the War in Iraq in May 2007, will run out in December. We suggest you pull the troops out before they run out of money.
Outcome:
US Troops are pulled out of Iraq. The kind caring Democrats then take responsibility for the resulting chaos and bloodshed.
And now Chas, you have your answer. Your Liberal Socialist Democrats don’t want to be held accountable for the resulting chaos in Iraq – the Dems just want to be able to blame Bush, without actually DOING anything about it.
THUS, the DEMOCRATS LIED TO YOU IN 2006 WHEN THEY SAID THEY WOULD END THE IRAQ WAR.
The truth is, the blood is on the hands of any Congressmen (Dem or Repub) who voted for the Iraq War.
Bottom line: Dems will whine and complain, then they WILL vote to continue the Iraq War.
What a cold, humanless existence you must live, “American Way.”
Posted by: MonkeyHawk
If you only knew. (smiling)I’m active in my community, church, family, scouts, and a few other community “things” I cannot disclose here.
But I’m tired of getting burnt by you thiefs coming after my hard earned money.
I put three kids through KU without any assistance. Two at the same time (3 years). Kids got scholarships, but didn’t qualify for an education loan. Why? Because my wife and I saved too much. Instead of spending everything, we had to report money in the bank. Meanwhile KU Tuition jumped over (OVER!) 125% over a five year period.
All this on a middle class salary which is the result of me x two jobs and wife working full time.
Just one example of many.
I am not alone. There are many in the upper middle class who are tired of paying all the bills.
What right do YOU have to demand MY MONEY???
What church do you attend which preaches such nonsense? Church of Socialism?
It sure is not the USA where every man earns his keep and way.
That country is long gone.Gone like a freight train,gone like yesterday.
It is now, as someone here said:The United Socialst States of America.
I’m impressed American Way you do all that and blog all day long too.
GIMME GIMME GIMME GIMMIE GIMMIE GIMMIE
Meth addict Cami Lucille Southard, 29, of Tucson, AZ pleaded guilty to child abuse for abandoning her 1-month-old baby in July, and is scheduled to be sentenced Dec. 10. She faces between 6 months and 2 1/2 years in prison. The baby is in the custody of Child Protective Services.See news pagehttp://www.azstarnet.com/metro/207685- – -
In Vantaa, Finland, an 11-month-old baby boy miraculously survived Saturday, after being abandoned in a bush next to a bus stop in sub-freezing weather, wearing only a t-shirt and jeans. A passing pedestrian rescued the infant after he had crawled across the busy urban road, and notified authorities, else the boy would soon have frozen to death. The mother, likely under the influence of amphetamines, said she wanted to hide her baby after hearing voices.[There are still people here in the USofA, apparently sane, who want to provide shooting galleries and clean needles for drug addicts, so that junkies can live a little longer while endangering everyone around them.]See news pagehttp://www.hs.fi/english/article/Mother+abandons+baby+by+roadside+in+Vantaa/1135231248206
Those advocating Paying IT Forward, are not the same one’s taking IT out of their own pocket.
Isn’t it such a crime when you get to keep more of your OWN money that you EARNED by working for it?
And now it’s time for something completely different…
Lib Dems love to do whatever France is doing.
I’m surprised our Lib Dems in Congress hasn’t proposed something like this:
France to make some migrants pass DNA testsBy Jennifer Macey
The French Government says the DNA tests will stop would-be migrants faking their papers. (Reuters: Suhaib Salem)France has adopted tough new immigration laws and migrants seeking to join their families already living in France may soon have to undergo DNA tests to prove their kinship.
The migrants will have to sit a language and values test, provide DNA to prove their family ties, and ensure that their relatives can support them financially when they first arrive in France.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/10/24/2069538.htm
MaxI am sure you can hide your assets as many of your fellow repukes have done. You can create an off shore account that will not only help hide your assets, it will help you avoid paying taxes too. Sounds like a win/win from over here. Good thing you weren’t around when SS was started. Good thing alot of people do not adopt to your philosphy of “everyone is perfect some just make bad choices” or nobody would volunteer at say the Lords Diner etc.. This was one of the most giving countries in the world. With those like yourself being in charge no wonder the rest of the world hates us. The whole “I got mine…you better get yours” philosphy will only isolate us further from the progression of the rest of the planet.
“With those like yourself being in charge no wonder the rest of the world hates us.”
If, by the “rest of the world”, you mean the democrat party, then you would be correct.You people hate this country.
“Those advocating Paying IT Forward, are not the same one’s taking IT out of their own pocket.”
democrats: Saving the world with other peoples money.
Funny how religious the Dems get when the discussion revolves around eliminating Socialism from America.
Judgemental too.
The Lords Dinner, Mike?
Come on!
You are too full of yourself.
No Fleet. I mean every country that I have traveled to in the last 90 days. When you tell someone where you are from they look at you like you said you come from Mars. When you watch the news abroad you see how they look at us. They view us as arrogant cowboys with no value of life unless its American. They look at us with great pity. They see our idiot president for exactly what he is. A war monger. You can say dems hate this country all you want. But its your party my friend that has set this country back 40 yrs. Own it. Love it. You people did it.
So, when is the Democrat Majority Congress going to End the Iraq War?
I wonder how many “Christians” would give to their churches if it weren’t tax-deductible.
Sometimes…
I think my visceral hatred of Republicans is wrong.
Then I read a post from Amway or Max.
I am actually ashamed that I went to college at KU now Max. To know that it produces prejudice minnions is highly disappointing. I never mentioned religion in my previous post. I am simply pointing out how greedy and self serving you are. If others had the same attitude as you do, where would charities like the Lords Diner be? Thats socialism at its core. Taking care of the homeless. If left to you they would starve or freeze to death. Love your position….embrace it. Don’t stop now.
Mike if you give a man a fish he will eat for a day if you teach him to fish he will eat for a lifetime. What part of working for a living do dems not get?
One poster was put down because he put his kids thru KU. Another because he wanted others to work as he did to earn a living.
The extreme views of J R and some others just weaken the liberal position. Makes you all look foolish. The right is tired of the left keeping their hands in our pockets. Take care of yourself. Someone mentioned The Lords Diner well that isn’t financed by the government it is financed by local churches and manned by local volunteers.
Conservatives outgive 4-1 the liberals. This has been documented. THey give generously and freely. What they mind is the government deciding who is needy and taking their money to give to some that are lazy and not needy. IMOHO.
Reach in your own pockets and give freely – keep your hand out of mine.
How courageous of you not to put up a nic at all.
You baby boomers of a Repub;oan bent, you made your living on the back of others.NOW you make your fortune selling out your country so you can get rich.
Nice of you to post your name to your opinions. I forgot how many neo cons lived on this blog daily. I do work and make enough money for the repuke policy to benefit me. I however, have a heart and a conscience. I don’t believe in turning your back on those less fortunate. You Christians however do. I don’t know where in the Bible it tells you to do that, but it must somewhere. Not all dems are welfare cases. You like to pick a small minority and prop them up as the end all be all. So with that I am going back out of the country. I wish you all the best. Please do not destroy my country while I am gone. I will keep each of you neo cons in my prayers….that somehow you will awaken from your drunken haze.
And btw….its not my hand in your pocket. Thats your buddy…GW. Half a trillion dollars spent in Iraq to date. And you worry about the dems…..f*cking hilarious. Bigoted idiots!
“either it’e really the documented facts or it’s just your humble opinion ??”
Of course it’s true. You people have no money. You are the takers not the takees. We are the givers, you are the givees.
Poll: Bush administration’s foreign policy is failing.
A new poll finds that the American public not only doubts whether the Bush administration’s foreign policy is working, but is “increasingly skeptical about whether anything can turn the situation around.” Seventy-nine percent believe that the world “has become more dangerous” for the United States, and 64 percent “think the rest of the world sees the U.S. negatively.”
“Mike if you give a man a fish he will eat for a day if you teach him to fish he will eat for a lifetime.”
No. If you teach a man to fish, he will get drunk, his wife and kids will leave him and he’ll go back to asking for the handout fish again.
Right. We are the haters.This, coming from “you love to hate” and “keep your hand out of my pocket unless you are larry craig” and “neo-cons suck” and “you’re a liar”?
Tell me again, who’s the hater?
More new from the Office of Pulling Numbers Right Out of Your Ass.
“WASHINGTON – The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan could cost as much as $2.4 trillion through the next decade, the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office said Wednesday.”
what a sad joke or were you serious? We as a nation should care that Fox who has single handedly sent more illegals to the US than any other politician while raping the Mexican economy and turning Mexico into a third world country doesn’t have a high opinion of Bush. This makes me even prouder of him. As for what the world thinks of us – Well the media gives them all of their talking points. When the news media never talks up any good point but constantly points out our bad one what can we expect. It is sad but by no means a joke that libs are comfortable with the ridicule people like Fox with a book to sell heaps on the US.
For the benefit of “no, you are not ok” who didn’t see the original post:
I’ll type real slow and use a very simple example of how the Democrats can End the Iraq War(if they wanted to):
BUSH:
Congress, we need $200 billion to continue the war in Iraq from December 2007 thru December 2008. Congress, please pass a spending bill for $200 billion to authorize funding for the war in Iraq.
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES:
The mean nasty Republicans introduce a $200 billion Iraq spending bill. ASSUMING the kind caring Democrats allow the bill to pass out of Committee, then the bill goes to the floor for a vote.
200 mean nasty Republicans vote to pass the $200 billion Iraq spending bill.
233 kind caring Democrats vote to reject the $200 billion Iraq spending bill.
Result: The bill does NOT pass. The War in Iraq is NOT funded.
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES:
Sorry Bush, the War in Iraq is NOT funded. The money the Dem Congress approved to continue the War in Iraq in May 2007, will run out in December. We suggest you pull the troops out before they run out of money.
Outcome:
US Troops are pulled out of Iraq. The kind caring Democrats then take responsibility for the resulting chaos and bloodshed.
And now Chas, you have your answer. Your Liberal Socialist Democrats don’t want to be held accountable for the resulting chaos in Iraq – the Dems just want to be able to blame Bush, without actually DOING anything about it.
THUS, the DEMOCRATS LIED TO YOU IN 2006 WHEN THEY SAID THEY WOULD END THE IRAQ WAR.
The truth is, the blood is on the hands of any Congressmen (Dem or Repub) who voted for the Iraq War.
Bottom line: Dems will whine and complain, then they WILL vote to continue the Iraq War.
Now when is the Democrat Majority Congress going to End the Iraq War?
The Dems do NOT need a super majority to NOT pass a spending bill for the Iraq War.
There is nothing for Bush to veto, if there is No Bill Passed!
Dumbsh*t Liberal Socialist Democrat propoganda keeps crying about how the Democrats can’t stop the Iraq war.
And ya know what? You know that most of your fellow Democrats are stupid enough to believe your propaganda!
The DEMS CAN STOP THE WAR BY CHRISTMAS!
But they won’t!
Instead, the Dems will keep Lying to you about how they can’t stop it! And will continue to blame Bush.
Allowing the blind to carry guns seems like a really good idea.
Have you seen Stevie Wonders wife?Neither has he! BADDA BING!
“LEBANON, N.H. — Republican presidential front-runner Rudy Giuliani is leaving the door open to allowing the blind and physically disabled to carry guns.”
“Max” –
The Democratic majority could pass legislation authorizing fund *only* for the safe orderly withdrawal of troops from Iraq.
Think Shrub might veto it.
The the Republic Party might fillibuster it before it even comes to a vote?
Someday, “Max,” I hope you’ll post something that’s based in reality. So far, it’s hope triumphing over expectations.
you don’t deserve to live here.stupid people do so much better in russia.
Posted by: ur on drugs right? | October 24, 2007 at 04:35
lib – Russia is socialistic in nature. They are a failed communistic country. You would be much happier there than I would.
I like the capitalistic democracy/republic I live in.
Give a man a fish and he’ll eat for a day.
Give a man a gun and he’ll go out and get his own damned fish.
Well Fleetwood, they have braile on the drive-up ATM’s don’t they?
You going to talk or are you going to fish?
Yes they do Max, yes they do.P.S. Coffee is hot.
Well, so much for the jury box and the ballot box, things are gonna get real ugly and soon!
Another Black Male in the “Wrong Place at the Wrong Time.”
By Curt Maynard
Yep, apparently that’s the case, Orange Taylor was just in the wrong place at the wrong time when he stumbled upon the already dead body of Laura Dickinson in her dorm room on December 13, 2006, and decided to “pleasure himself,” which presumably means masturbated until ejaculation onto her body. Sound unlikely? Well, not to one of the black jurors on the case, a Ms. Lauretta Codrington, who voted to acquit and then refused to change her mind despite the fact that everyone else on the jury, with the probable exception of another female if Codrington can be believed [She is thus far the only one saying that two people refused to convict], thought Taylor guilty as hell. According to Ms. Codrington, race never entered the [juries] discussion,” which may well be true, the white jurors were probably petrified they’d be charged with a hate crime if they were to point out the obvious, the reason Orange Taylor wasn’t convicted is because two black females on the jury refused to, or were incapable of, considering the overwhelming amount of evidence that should have convicted him.
Codrington also neglects to tell us that she herself was involved in a racial bias suit back in 1991, in which she accused a white landlord of discrimninating against her, I wonder if she told the prosecution this during jury selection, or if it just “slipped her weak mind.?” Maybe Codrington ought to be in jail huh?
To briefly sum up that evidence, the jury was told that Taylor had admitted that he unlawfully entered Dickinson’s dorm room that night, but Ms. Codrington felt that because it was possible that the 22-year old Laura Dickinson might already have been dead, the result of a heart attack, Orange Taylor wasn’t necessarily guilty of a home invasion. If she’d been alive at the time, yes, okay, a home invasion might have taken place, but being that she might have already been dead, she didn’t see any guilt on his part. In another incredible display of Codrington’s intellectual prowess, she accepts Taylor’s defense, that he was just “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” and when he saw Laura Dickinson lying there dead, he thought to himself, what the hey, why not “pleasure myself” on her corpse while I’m here.
The media and Eastern Michigan University have done their best to cover this story up from the beginning, despite believing that Laura Dickinson had been raped and murdered immediately after finding her body, the University, with the collusion of the Zionist media refused to say so for ten weeks, that’s more than two months. They didn’t tell Ms. Dickinson’s family and they didn’t warn their student body. Eastern State’s President, John Fallon has been fired for his part in the subterfuge, which included actually telling Ms. Dickinson’s mother and father that they did not believe she was the victim of “foul play.”
Now the final insult, we’re told that Orange Taylor’s defense was that he was just “in the wrong place at the wrong time,” and decided to “pleasure himself” on Laura Dickinson’s already dead body when he found her in that state in her dorm room on December 13, 2006. We’re expected just to swallow the idea that a black female juror [and possibly another] just happened to disagree with the rest of the jurors on Taylor’s guilt and that it “had nothing to do with race.”
I want the reader to consider these words again:
Taylor “just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.”
Taylor, just happened to “pleasure himself” on Dickinson’s already dead body.
“it had nothing to do with race.”
What does the Taylor-Dickinson case mean for whites in the future? Can we expect more equity when we’ve finally become a minority? This case should tell any unbiased and sane person that justice cannot be had if a black juror sits in judgment of a fellow black when the murder of a white is concerned. I truly do not know how to read this case in ANY other way. Am I wrong for saying so? Am I a racist and bigot for pointing it out? Am I? What is a racist in modern America? Is it someone that insists on telling the truth and demanding that they be able to tell others too? If so, if that’s what a racist truly is in America today, get me a KKK robe, I’ll put it one and continue writing.
Please comment on this article – Show you carehttp://pcapostate.blogspot.com/
Thanks to MonkeyHawk, we now know what the impotent Democratic Party is capable of, when they have both houses – nothing.
What’s the best caliber for Bass, Monkeyhawk?
Thanks to MonkeyHawk, we now know what the impotent Democratic Party is capable of, when they have both houses – nothing.
Posted by: Kansas | October 24, 2007 at 04:49 PM
I don’t know why anyone would vote for them, if they can’t do anything anyway.
Kansas, was my example too complicated?
I can’t translate into a simplier language for them.
Maybe I could find a 3rd Grade teacher to help.
“What’s the best caliber for Bass, Monkeyhawk?”
White Bass — 20 ga
Black Bass — 12 ga
#4 Shot or 00 Buckshot the best?
carp – double barrel 10 ga
If you wipe the slime off, you can use a trap thrower for the carp.
PULL!!!
(Doubles is difficult though)
I catch them with my super Bill Dance lure, then beat the crap out of them with the gun stock.Then I have another beer and do it again.That’s when I saw the bear.
Give a couple of beers to the bear and they leave ya alone after that.
I’d hate to muck up my gun stock with Carp too much. Better to just leave on the bank or throw onto the highway or train track.
Used to fish on a levee that had a couple of train tracks. Worked perfect for Carp, gar, etc…
(Remind me to tell ya the bear hunting joke later. Gotta run for now.)
Is that place in Rulo, Nebraska still in business.
It’s a restaurant right on the Missouri River and the Specialty of the house is… wait for it… carp!
I dunno how they cooked it, but the meat was flavorful, the bones not a problem, and (especially Saturday nights after Husker football games) the place used to be packed!
max – you stupid idiot… The SENATE needs the 2/3 super majuority to pass the bill. Not the House. Yes, the Dems can pass it in the House, and they have. But, the Senate cannot get the 2/3 majority to fund the damned bill! Get it? And since you are so stupid, I had to use caps earlier, so you could READ it! And I am NOT Chas. I think Chas. is observing the boycott. I can see you arent!
“I think Chas. is observing the boycott.”
I missed the boycott thing. What happened? Are the “Fisting With Fury” bunch moaning, again?
‘Sup?
22/10/2007
U.S. ARMY CHIEF: IRAQ WAR HAS SAPPED ABILITY TO FIGHT IRAN
By Haaretz Service
The new chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff said in an interview published Monday that the prolonged military campaigns in Iraq and Afghanistan may have undermined the military’s ability to fight wars against major adversaries – including Iran.
With the United States already heavily committed in wars in two Muslim countries, Joint Chiefs Chairman Admiral Mike Mullen told The New york Times that an offensive against Iran, a third Mideast Islamic state “has extraordinary challenges and risks associated with it.” He counseled against an immediate attack on Iran, saying that the military option should be a last resort.
But Mullen warned Iran and other nations not to “mistake restraint for lack of commitment or lack of concern or lack of capability.”
“Because we have had such an intense focus on the Middle East and Iraq and Afghanistan, there is risk associated with those other parts of the world,” Admiral Mullen said.
Asked whether the American military should aim at sites inside Iran if intelligence indicated that such action could stem the flow of bombs into Iraq, he said “the risks could be very, very high.”
“We’re in a conflict in two countries out there right now,” he added. “We have to be incredibly thoughtful about the potential of in fact getting into a conflict with a third country in that part of the world.”
Speaking of his visits to soldiers and marines in Iraq and Afghanistan in recent weeks, Mullen said: “They’re tired. They’ve been doing unbelievably great work for our country. And we need to make sure we take care of them and their families.”
Regarding prolonged and repeated deployments for the ground forces in Iran and Afghanistan, he said, “The ground forces are not broken, but they are breakable.”
What are people boycotting?
Hank Price called a boycott of the regular bloggers as a form of protest against the sock puppet trolls. A handful are participating.
Conservatives too busy for hearing on Iraq war’s cost.
White House staffers aren’t the only ones “not worried” about the ultimate cost of the Iraq war. The Republicans in Congress seem equally apathetic. The House Budget Committee held a hearing today to receive testimony regarding the CBO’s estimate that the Iraq and Afghanistan wars may total $2.4 trillion. Only one Republican member of the committee attended. Rep. Lloyd Doggett (D-TX) noted their absence:
Doggett: “I assume, by Mr. [Paul] Ryan (R-WI) being here, that every member of this panel, including every Republican member on that side of the aisle where all the seats are vacant, received notice about this hearing about the cost of war in Iraq?”
Spratt: “I’m sure they did.”
Doggett: “And when was this notice of the hearing sent out?”
Spratt: “Seven days ago, as required by the rules.”
A handful of regular bloggers are participating.
The sock puppet trolls are his ususal self.
House Democrats will bring the widely-supported SCHIP bill “back to the floor as early as this week,” with relatively few changes from the version that President Bush vetoed.
Campaign for America’s Future has a new video featuring children with a message for President Bush and conservatives opposing an SCHIP expansion: “No health care for us, no photo ops for you.”
The White House indicated today that it is willing to “shift” and allow “states to cover children up to 300% of the federal poverty level. … The administration previously opposed legislation permitting states to cover children above the 200% level.
Pardon stupid me but since I am not a regular everyday poster on Weblog, what are “sock puppet trolls.”
max – you stupid idiot… The SENATE needs the 2/3 super majuority to pass the bill. Not the House. Yes, the Dems can pass it in the House, and they have. But, the Senate cannot get the 2/3 majority to fund the damned bill! Get it? And since you are so stupid, I had to use caps earlier, so you could READ it! And I am NOT Chas. I think Chas. is observing the boycott. I can see you arent!
Posted by: sugar | October 24, 2007 at 06:19 PM
Dang, Sugar, that should make it even easier for the Dems to NOT pass a bill.
Remember, you Dems are trying NOT to fund the war.
You do NOT want an Iraq spending bill to pass. So don’t vote for it, and the Iraq war ends.
What a dumbsh*t you are!
Laughable.
Oh, and the super majority is 60 votes, not 66.
So you Dems only need 41 votes in the Senate to stop any funding bill for Iraq.
And let’s see, you Dems have 49 Senators, plus Lieberman the Dem turned independent when other Dems pounced on him. So that’s 50 votes you Dems have and you only need 41 to NOT fund the Iraq war!
And in the House, you Dems have 233 Reps, with only 217 (2 house seats are vacant) votes to stop any spending for Iraq.
And the Dems can’t stop spending money for Iraq!
Lying SOB’s, promised to end the Iraq war!
Ha!
What’s wrong with the Democrat party, why can’t they get the Iraq war stopped?
Just don’t pass any more funding bills!
Oh, Sugar, shove it. Your Dems are FOR the war.
By Thanksgiving, the Democrats will vote over $100 billion to go to continue the war in Iraq.
Think about that as you carve your turkeys.
Be thankful for your Democrat party.
Baby killers.
Here’s a nice piece from The Guardian about a legislative tool the Repukes have used to ratf*ck the work of the House. Weblog readers, meet…the Motion to Recommit.
Republicans couldn’t govern while in the majority, and from the minority they’re determined that no one else should, either. It’s like Newt’s shutting down the government without the bad press.
**********************************
http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,,2198227,00.html?gusrc=rss&feed=networkfront
“Revealed: the little-known device used to block Democrats in the House
“Republicans use obscure motion 16 times in a year, compared to just 14 for the Democrats in more than a decade of opposition.”
Elana Schor in WashingtonWednesday October 24, 2007Guardian Unlimited
“All year long, Democrats in the House of Representatives have watched with increasing impatience as their Senate counterparts find themselves bedevilled by a filibuster-wielding Republican minority. On measures criticising the war in Iraq, the House has passed four since May to the Senate’s zero; on annual spending bills, the House has cleared all 12 to the Senate’s six.
That Mitch McConnell of Kentucky and his Senate Republican colleagues routinely have blocked the Democrats from getting the needed 60 votes on many measures has received considerable press attention, even inspiring a splashy “anti-obstruction” media campaign.
What’s far less well known, though, is that the party has almost as nasty a bugaboo in the House. Republicans there have found stunning success with a procedural tool called the motion to recommit, and they have repeatedly used it to divide the Democratic caucus and block key initiatives.Sometimes called the MTR, its full name is the motion to recommit, with or without instructions. Ironically offered as a minority-party right by Newt Gingrich in the heyday of the Contract With America, its aim is to allow the often-powerless House minority a chance to shape legislation as it moves toward a vote. Even if Democrats allow no debate on amendments to a bill, the MTR guarantees Republicans a vote – usually minutes before final passage – either on new additions they have written or on forcing the measure back to square one.
Republicans have mastered the game of crafting MTRs they know will force Democrats to defect to their side or risk political consequences, especially among the 60 or so Democrats who represent “red” districts. Some Republicans motions are phrased to ensure a delay of the bill at hand if they pass, compelling Democrats to pull measures from the floor rather than lose precious ground.
When Democrats were in the House minority, they succeeded only rarely in blocking Republican initiatives with the gambit. The MTR helped push through the television filter known as the “v-chip” in 1995 and nearly closed campaign-finance loopholes aimed at free-spending political groups four years before the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth targeted John Kerry. Only 14 of the motions, or 7.6 percent of the minority’s efforts, prevailed between 1995 and 2006.
This year, 16 of the House Republican motions have passed, several with significant support from across the aisle, blocking initiatives large and small. Remember the effort to bring voting rights in the House to the District of Columbia, which stalled before falling short over the summer? It was derailed first by a successful MTR that called for overturning the US capital’s gun ban, which many red-state Democrats supported. Another gave legal immunity to anyone reporting suspected terrorist activity on public transportation, which some Democrats decried as a call to racial profiling.
But the biggest MTR intrusion of the year came last week, when the Republicans stalled a bill to provide greater judicial oversight of secret wiretapping by the Bush administration with a proposed MTR that even critics begrudgingly called clever. The motion provided that no court order would be needed to tap the phones of Osama bin Laden and al-Qaida members – a caveat that frustrated Democrats noted was already in their measure.
“All members and all Americans believe in this goal,” one Democratic memo stated, “so the authors cynically wrote this redundant motion in such a way that if it passed it would KILL this important national security bill.”
The MTR now threatens to become as aggravating to the House speaker, Nancy Pelosi, as the filibuster has for Harry Reid, the Senate majority leader. House Democrats have vowed to bring back the wiretapping bill soon, but there are few solutions in sight for how to defeat the Republican MTR should it rear its head.
“We need some discipline on motions to recommit,” said Massachusetts Democratic congressman Jim McGovern, a veteran of the rules committee that sets procedures for House debate. “That’s going to come.”
Indeed, Republicans stopped the majority of Democratic MTRs under Mr Gingrich and former speaker Dennis Hastert by treating the votes as purely political. Even if the minority’s alternative plan had merit, Republican leaders urged solidarity, and the motion’s defeat, as a matter of party loyalty.
Despite a 93% record of sticking together on House votes this year compared to 84% for Republicans, Democrats have found party loyalty elusive on several MTRs. The clash between a Democratic bill and its forced amendment can be stark: to legislation cracking down on the “no-bid” contracts that have driven charges of Bush administration cronyism, Republicans added language requiring colleges to welcome military recruiters onto campus.
Congressional scholar Norman Ornstein, who recently wrote a book on the health of the legislature titled The Broken Branch, predicted that Democrats might have to consider changing the rules for the pesky motions.
“Democrats are not anticipating as well as perhaps they might some things that can come to the floor and heading them off with language that might be in the bill … to cut the pins out from under the motions to recommit,” Mr Ornstein said.
Such an attempt risks unsavoury coverage that contrasts a mid-year rules change with vows from Ms Pelosi and others to run an open and transparent House. When some Democrats suggested in March altering the guidelines for relevance (”germaneness,” in Congress-speak) of the MTRs, Republicans threatened to walk out of the chamber and halt business altogether.
John Boehner, an Ohio Republican and the House minority leader, crowed at those reports of a planned rules change.
“Perhaps before they game the system by changing the rules to their liking, the Democrat leadership should ask its own members why they are voting in droves for our proposals,” Mr Boehner said, dropping the “-ic” suffix from his rivals’ party in a common Washington putdown.
Faced with the choice between limiting Republican attempts to split their caucus and prodding those members to resist the MTRs, Democrats are likely to choose the latter, at least for the time being. The Republicans’ 30-second campaign ad on the wiretapping motion may write itself – featuring ominous Bin Laden visuals and a voiceover murmuring, “Democratic congressman X voted to stop the government from listening to terrorists’ phone calls” – but the party’s nearly 10-to-1 fundraising advantage over Republicans helps take the sting out of that threat.
Besides, as Mr McGovern pointed out, “If I order the wrong thing for lunch, these guys will run a 30-second ad against me.”
The stakes are particularly high for the House wire-tapping vote. Democrats believe they have the votes to pass their bill, which largely threads the needle in satisfying the liberals and conservatives among them. But a difficult battle remains with their filibuster-plagued Senate counterparts.
The Senate intelligence committee has offered legal immunity to the telecommunications companies that allowed the Bush administration to eavesdrop without a court order. That group of senators is the only congressional panel to win access to documents on the purported legal framework for the wiretapping, and Democrats in the House have refused to discuss immunity until their members can examine the documents.
“We can’t provide immunity when we don’t know what we’re providing immunity for,” said Stacey Farnen Bernards, a spokeswoman for House majority leader and Maryland Democrat Steny Hoyer.
The Senate judiciary committee soon will take up the intelligence committee’s measure, and its members remain in the dark with the House, denied access to the Bush administration documents. Even if the Senate begins debating a bill without a shield for the telecoms, however, Republicans there are almost certain to insist on 60 votes to end a filibuster.
Thus Democrats’ ability to beat back an MTR and pass the House bill becomes crucial to establishing the party’s position, as George Bush continues to insist on his way or a veto.
Moral of the story: Repukes would rather burn down American democracy than allow legislation to pass that’s politically disadventageous to the interests of GOP backers.
The GOP is doing Osama’s work for him. He ought to be paying them, really.
That’s why we need to pick up at least 11 more seats in the Senate in ‘08. Than we can also tell Lieberman to take a hike.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcJG8gyn3c4&eurl=http://www.crooksandliars.com/
MAX — Open your little bitty closed mind long enough to grasp this: The Democrats TRY to pass anti-war legislation, but they cant do it because they cant GET the 60 votes required. They ARE voting AGAINST the damned war!
What is there about that, that makes your brain not comprehend what has been happening this entire YEAR…. House passes a defunding bill on the War.. Senate CANT pass the bill, because the Republicans are blocking it!
Open yuor tiny brain, Max. Its really very easy to understand!
Excuses CF, just Excuses.
Now here’s an updated position from Hillary. Earlier she said the war in Iraq would continue until at least 2013.
Now, she’s saying she will not vote for more funds for Iraq.
What will she do?
What WILL she do?
Very unpredictible she is. Need to measure the wind direction and check the latest polls before making any decision.
Just what we need, an indecisive President.
http://www.usadaily.com/article.cfm?articleID=136151
Hillary Clinton threatens not to vote for further funding of the Iraq war Marty Eels
Published 10/24/2007 – 1:58 p.m. EDT
Democratic Presidential hopeful Hillary Clinton, feeling the brunt of anti-war rhetoric from Democratic challengers, Senator Barack Obama, Congressman Dennis Kucinich, Senator John Edwards, New Mexico Governor Bill Richardson, and Republican Ron Paul, among others, threatened to vote against further funding of the Iraq war.
Clinton has been criticized by her opponents for voting to support the Iraqi war. Obama has accused Clinton of voting for the war and now not taking responsibility for it. Ron Paul has even said that the vote to authorize the President to use force instead of a Declaration of War was illegal and unconstitutional.
Now Hillary Clinton says she will not vote for further funding in Iraq unless it starts the process of removing troops from Iraq.—–
kscitydude,
Indeed. Once the Democrats build their majority, Harry Reid can retrieve his balls from Joe Lieberman’s pocket.
Max,
“Reasons” aren’t the same as “excuses.” But since you’d rather gloat than think, Max, I won’t push you to accept something that any thinking person ought to accept.
Well said CF2K
Sugar, you are totally brainless, or you truly think your fellow Dems you are trying to fool are brainless.
What the F is a defunding bill?
Bush has asked for $200 billion more – a funding bill.
Not a defunding bill.
How stupid can you be Sugar?
If Congress does not pass a F-U-N-D-I-N-G bill, then no more money goes to Iraq.
WTF Sugar, you think the money flows forever unless Congress votes to stop it?
If Congress fails to vote to fund more dollars for Iraq, the funding stops.
You might be getting war funding mixed up with your perpetual entitlement funding – which you Socialists keep expanding as often as you can.
CF, you accepted no reasons from the Republican majority.
I’ll accept no ‘reasons’ for your Dem majority’s failure to act.
Rant much Max?
This is bush’s war.
This is YOUR war.
YOU want the political advantage of being able to point and say ” LOOK LOOK! The Democrats cut the funding for bullets and armor and supplies! They are stranding the troops to die!”
Shame on you Max. Our troops are no more than a political football to you. You really don’t care about them at all.
That’s an interesting article CF. Thanks for posting it. I had no idea that was going on.
Interesting that the Republicans are frustrating Speaker Pelosi with a maneuver that that the Dems have had available to them for 10 plus years when they were in the minority. She is not passing the leadership test real well, is she?
Maybe the Democrites should write more letters based on Media Matters investigations (cough).
Where’s that waaaaaaaaahhhbulance that kfg talks about it, I think some of the Democrites could use it.
They appear to be bleeding from their egos.
:)
Max,
Total disanalogy. Complete failure of understanding on your part.
I objected to Republican ACTIONS while they were in the Majority, while you’re objecting to Democratic INACTION. And insofar as you’re objecting to Democratic INACTION, I’m providing a legislative explanation for their failure to pass legislation.
You can call Democrats ‘liars’ all you want if it makes you feel warm and tingly in your pants. But doing so is meaningless unless you acknowledge that the Republican minority is using every tool at its disposal to obstruct the ability of Democrats to pass legislation.
Then again, the risk of saying meaningless things has never kept you quiet in the past; no reason to think it would do so now.
And now the Dems become Hawks.
Talk about playing politics with the troops.
First the Dems cry about getting the troops home this year, now they want them there until at least 2013.
Outlander,
And it’s instructive, isn’t it, outlander, that Democrats used MTR 14 times in 11 years, while the Republicans have used it 14 times in one year.
Which party hates America? Well, judging by the House GOP’s constant use of the legislative monkeywrench that allows them to take their ball and go home when they’re going to lose the game, we know which one hates representative government.
Max,
That’s right–change the subject and run away. At least you know when you’re licked.
Maybe you should drink less beer while ranting online. It might help you keep track of the argument.
You are a rotten little liar Max. You want the troops in Iraq. But failing that, you want Democrats blamed for any pullout.
Oh I give you credit. You have found the original strategy of bush’s handlers and you are sticking to it.
It also makes you a slimeball.
As for ‘playing politics with the troops,’ the runaway winner at THAT would be our “Commander in Chief.”
He hides behind men in uniforms almost as often as he hides behind the women with whom he surrounds himself–Laura, Karen, and Condi.
Is there anybody Bush won’t whore out to protect his own ass?
Funny CF, I would look at it more of a failure on the part of the Democratic leadership. Since Dems are hardly ones to make nice I would think that the reason they did not use the MTR more is that they were ineffective when they did try to use it, due to Republican unity.
I think that you mistake incompetence for good faith.
Maybe Democrats are just more decent people there outie.
That’s my experience anyway.
Max,
You are on a roll. The liberals are now wanting more blood in Iraq.
They WANT more innocent men and women to die in a needless war.
They WANT more contractor killings and bloodshed.
They thirst for it. They want WriterDog and fans to hate Bush, but love the war.
To 2013, and beyond!!!!
They have sold their souls to the oil empire.
‘playing politics with the troops’CF2K
Bill Clinton, in his last act, after having already passed the power to the new president, insisted, DEMANDED, the military honor him. He forced them to provide a final dignitary proceeding as he and the REAL president Hillary, departed Washington and boarded a flight to their new destiny (Hillary NY, Bill to his next fling).
The military he SPAT on, was forced to pay tribute to their king.
And we hated every moment of it.
Troops as political tools.
That should be the motto of the GOP.
Of course we democrats are more decent. I was so decent with Marilyn Monroe because she was one fine fuk. My brother was decent with her too, and joined me in hell.
And later, another brother found solitude in another intern of sorts. After abusing her body, he drove her off a bridge, and into history.
We are decent people.
Outlander,
Part of what you say is accurate. As the article says,
“Only 14 of the motions, or 7.6 percent of the minority’s efforts, prevailed between 1995 and 2006.”
Which suggests that many more were proposed but not sustained.
However, Democratic Minority Leader Dick Gephardt was WAY more conciliatory than current Republican Minority Leader John Boehner. No comparison there: Gephardt was center-left while Boehner is hard right. Gephardt was DEFINITELY one to ‘make nice.’ And he was hardly ‘incompetent.’
What he wasn’t was hyper-partisan. And in the current era of hyper-right wing partisanship, I will again assert that the Minority leaders in both houses of Congress would rather burn the place down than let legislation come to the floor that enjoys popular support. SCHIP, anyone?
Can someone please contact me? I have Capn American’s email, but he has not responded to any of my emails.
I have the handout puter XXX gave me (his wife is nice), but I cannot get the email software working.
Any other handouts? I have kids to raise and set the example for.
Please someone give me another handout.
Thank-you
Well Hi there James!
You don’t want to do this. I’ll make you famous.
Well my fellow citizens and democrats, we will OWN Iraq and this war starting next year. We must keep it going.
We need more bloodshed. More innocent deaths. More fighting.
We can blame Bushy for it all, and still appease the oil standard bearers.
We ARE warriors!!! Afterall, we will bomb, shoot, and kill!!!
We, as liberals LOVE war. We have a proud tradition to uphold. So very many many wars started by our party. We must pursue more graves in America veteran homes and cemetaries.
We know, blood makes the grass grow, so:
Well, well, well: it’s $20,000 to spend a night with Ann ‘The Man’ Coulter.
http://students.yaf.org/speakers/speaker_detail.cfm?speakerid=12
CF2K wouldn’t f*ck her with Max’s dick.
Figure that’ll give you lonely Wingnuts something to jack off to.
Even though I don’t have a dick.
I am more of a cock sucker
For you Wingnuts on a budget, here’s Michelle “I’m nuts!” Malkin. A mere $10,000-15,000 for a night of Wingnut, um, passion.
http://students.yaf.org/speakers/speaker_detail.cfm?speakerid=32
I am a sorry sickly pimple faced fart.
I am sorry that I am a sorry shit.
I post crap all day long. I insult people and call them names.
It gives me a hard-on.
Please accept my deepest apology.It’s just the way I am.
Me and my right fist are friends.
And Hillary has her sights on Iran next.
Or she may change her mind again.
Well, I see some of the more liberal posters have nothing on me.
You do quite well insulting your culture without any help from me.
No great loss on this blog. In fact, we have been quite effective, if I do say so myself.
Devolve for me James.
And finally, for those hard-up Wingnuts who never quite got over Mom, here’s…Phyllis Schlafly! A mere $3,000-5,000.
http://students.yaf.org/speakers/speaker_detail.cfm?speakerid=45
Hillary the Hawk:
Hillary Clinton calls Iran a threat to U.S., IsraelThe Associated PressPublished: February 1, 2007NEW YORK: Calling Iran a danger to the U.S. and one of Israel’s greatest threats, U.S. senator and presidential candidate Hillary Rodham Clinton said “no option can be taken off the table” when dealing with that nation.
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/02/02/america/NA-GEN-US-Clinton-Iran.php
Max, you cannot say such things!
My great and loyal donkey party is NOT for war. Never has been.
We want our boys home.We want to stop the killing.
But now our tape recording tells us to maintain the death levels until 2013.
I will DIE defending that.
Even if my own children become eligible to enlist (sorry writerdog) on their own. Even if they WANT to enlist.
They will do OK, because it is far more justified to die for Hillary in the Bush war, than to die for Bush in the Bush war.
Make sense?
Sadly, the Wingnut speaker’s bureau doesn’t have Larry Craig or Jeff Gannon on contract for all you closeted, self-hating gay Wingnuts.
Hillary the Hawk, attacked by Obama:
BARACK OBAMA SLAPS HILLARY CLINTON ON IRAN VOTEBy GEOFF EARLEOctober 24, 2007 — WASHINGTON – Barack Obama launched an airmail attack on Hillary Rodham Clinton yesterday, slamming her “dangerous” vote for a Senate resolution on Iran.
The letter marks one of the sharpest exchanges of the campaign and refocuses attention on a topic that drew headlines when Clinton got into a heated confrontation with an Iowa man at a campaign event.
The mailing brought up a Senate resolution for which Clinton voted declaring Iran’s Revolutionary Guards a terrorist organization.
“Barack Obama is the only major candidate for president to oppose both the Iraq war from the very start and the Senate amendment that raises the risk of war with Iran,” the letter said.http://www.nypost.com/seven/10242007/news/nationalnews/barack_slaps_hill_iran_vote.htm
BLAH Blah blah
Skeered, eh, Max? Don’t blame you.
If I had to choose among the Repuke Monkey Boys, I’d be doing everything I could to bash Hillary.
Dead from the waist down aint ya JM?
And from the waist up don’t work to well either does it?
Who’s missing Pat? I haven’t noticed.
BLAH Blah blah
Oh yeah that’s the way to go Pat.
Pay to post.
Then ol’ on the dime JM can stick it out.
MAX — One more time… If the Republicans bring a bill to fund $200 Billion more for the war, and the Democratic Senate cannot get their 60 votes necessary to DEFEAT it, then it passes. But NOT because the Democrats passed it. Because the Republicans have enough votes to keep it from getting 60 votes against it!
Now, tell me the Democrats are voting to FUND the damned war!
I know you cant possibly be that STUPID!
I know you (Max) cant possibly be that STUPID!
Posted by: sugar | October 24, 2007 at 10:50 PM
Come on. You know he is.
Hey, Repuke, I was TRYING to be nice, OK??
Sugar, they need 60 votes to pass it.
Not 60 votes to defeat it.
The Dems don’t want the funding bill passed, and unless it gets 60 votes, it fails.
The Dems want the bill to fail.
And it will, if 41 Dems vote against it.
Try again.
SSDD.
That’s it junior? All you got is insults?
I guess J R is bored and decided to test his word skills while I was gone from the blog. Odd, he would talk to himself like that though.
I think J R has slipped a cog.
Hell Sugar, the Bill shouldn’t even make it out of the House!
233 Dems there!
The Senate should not even see a bill, unless -
The Dems Truly Want To Continue the War in Iraq!
Although, personally, I feel these blogs should be FEE FOR SERVICE. $20.00 a month and loss of service for flame/troll postings. Posted by: Pat Herron | October 24, 2007 at 10:35 PM
I’m all for that, J R would have to stay home and play with himself.
You know he doesn’t have two nickels to rub together.
Sugar, here’s a great example of fine leadership and parliamentary procedure by the Leader of the US Senate today:
http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog/g/389a14eb-3e87-48e6-91b3-5dbbec6b1242
“You know he doesn’t have two nickels to rub together.”
Word on the street is that J R is part of the Koch family. He could buy the government that supplies you with your benefits, Kansas. Better watch your tongue.
Word on the street is that J R is part of the Koch family. He could buy the government that supplies you with your benefits, Kansas. Better watch your tongue.
Posted by: Like KS has any idea | October 24, 2007 at 11:11 PM
I’ll guess what part that is. :)
Well JM at least my nickels are MINE. I get no government welfare unlike you.
Interesting how you spend it.
J R is jealous because I had a career in the military.
J R doesn’t know what career means.
Someone explain that to him.
MAX — once again… if the Democrats bring the funding bill, to the Senate, where they have a small majority, and the bill needs 60 votes to pass, They cannot GET the bill to pass no matter how many Democrats vote for it!! SIXTY VOTES MAX!!!
You lose on this one!! Stop blaming Democrats for what the Republicans are doing!!
I’ve been posting to JM.
And I am being responded to by “kansas” and other nics.
Any other admissions you’d like to make there JM?
JR — Ummm JM doesnt appear to be posting here tonite.
Oh do think fast troll boy.
MAX — to put it another way, The Democrats cant PASS a Bill to stop funding the war, UNLESS they can get about 14 Republicans to vote with them, just to make sure. Get it??
J R appears to be confused again, he calls me J M, I think Pat Herron J M and somebody named J M named J M.
Will the real J M please stand up.
You J R, I bet I can count on one hand the number of posts you have made that actually have to do with a topic and doesn’t have an attack on someone.
Now, that is a sad commentary on your bitter little self J R.
You talking to me now, JR?? I am a hard core left winger! I dont much like talking to Kansas, or any of the other Trolls, or Graffitti monsters, or sock puppets.
MAX — once again… if the Democrats bring the funding bill, to the Senate, where they have a small majority, and the bill needs 60 votes to pass, They cannot GET the bill to pass no matter how many Democrats vote for it!! SIXTY VOTES MAX!!!
You lose on this one!! Stop blaming Democrats for what the Republicans are doing!!
Posted by: sugar | October 24, 2007 at 11:20 PM
The Democrites are doing it to themselves. If they weren’t so cocky and tried to use their brains, they might actually get things done. But they would rather call names and point fingers.
You know, sort of like the Libs on this blog. That’s all they know how to do.
“J R is jealous because I had a career in the military.
“J R doesn’t know what career means.
“Someone explain that to him.”
Kansas is an extremely brilliant man. He was gifted, skipped grades in elementary school, and made a 4.0 GPA in college. He is an expert on almost everything. He is so brilliant, it blinds one to gaze in his general direction. He makes astute remarks on a small town Kansas newspaper blog.
But, wasn’t Ann Coulter correct about servicemen; if they were worth a pinch of shit, wouldn’t they have been involved in the free market enterprise. Kansas wasn’t.
So sad. Too bad.
The end of a sad story.
Ya know what I think JM Kansas etc.?
I think you are a really lonely and sad man. I think you would do anything here for a fight just so you could get some human interaction.
It doesn’t have to be that way you know.
I know alot about you. I know that you help people.
You don’t have to be a pain here. You could be a positive force.
Oh? Do tell J R?
How do I help people? I want to know the details you know about me.
Will be sort of like a biography on line.
So sad. Too bad.
The end of a sad story.
Posted by: The Kansas Story | October 24, 2007 at 11:28 PM
Ah, you quit too soon troll Story.
You had me looking good there for awhile. Perhaps you can come back from your boycott (cough) and post more Capn – oops! I mean troll Story.
Why don’t you share it?
Hey I aint pleased how I came to know you. And you have some real weird quirks. I’d prefer you work to the better in your nature.
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_102407/content/01125100.guest.html
Thanks James I’ve no interest in your distraction.
I am trying to help you. It’s not an insult. Hell I could not even be here if not for the help of someone who wanted me here.
It’s better that. To be wanted as opposed to being despised.
Oh I see J R. It means you got nothing.
Very well then.
Gee… Limbaugh sounds like a few of the Right Wing Bloggers here:
“Any governor or mayor or councilman with any degree of competence knows that states and localities are best at dealing with this kind of disaster. Their first actions are not to call Barbara Boxer; their first actions are to attack the fires.”
“It’s your job to protect yourself in the first place. If a fire comes to your house, are you going to sit there and burn to death waiting for the government to show up, or are you going to get the hell out? Come on!”
Almost as bad as Glenn Beck suggesting that the people losing their houses in the fires are the same left wingers that he says “hate America” What an imbecile!!
No JM you gave me alot. More than I already had.
Careless in your posts, you responded to my posts to JM with posts from kansas and other nics.
I do not understand the pleasure you get from making yourself a hated pest here. And since I have done my best to try and reach you I am through trying.
Thanks James I’ve no interest in your distraction.
I am trying to help you. It’s not an insult. Hell I could not even be here if not for the help of someone who wanted me here.
It’s better that. To be wanted as opposed to being despised.
Posted by: J R | October 24, 2007 at 11:44 PM
Naw J R, Capn is just mad because I stood up to him and gave him the same medicine he was dispensing.
He can’t stand that someone would challenge his (cough) authority, so tried to take me on.
He lost and lost badly, as I’m still here.
Now, if he wants to discuss the issues without adding insults and assigning me nicks that aren’t mine, he will be left alone.
If not, I will be the thorn in his side, the pain in his butt and haunt his every move.
He can behave himself or suffer the consequences, the choice is his.
I don’t scare, back down and move away or run scared to another blog.
“kansas”? JM? James?
Capn didn’t lose anything. He is mostly respecting a boycott on this blog called by right wing poster Hank Price.
That boycott was called largely because of you. Well you and the damage you bring anyway.
This isn’t YOUR blog JM. It was here way before you came around.
I can go get bonedigs of your demands to suspend your activities or leave. You’ve made it real easy.
Like you just did.
I would like you to do something for me JM. I want you to go back in the archives. Use search math as I have with you.
Research Crusader X and LRB.
These were troubled posters who I helped or was instrumental in destroying.
I was away from the blog a long time. And as you bash me for it, it is only the kindness of friends allows me here.
I want to help you.
“I don’t scare, back down and move away or run scared to another blog.”
Is anyone else impressed by this manly man? It is difficult to run to another blog, if one has to do so, on quad canes, no?
I’d do a hehehehehehe… , but this fool is unworthy…
bonedig…
Yawn…
Zzzzzz…
Well unlike you James JM “kansas” I work for a living.
So I gotta sleep. I don’t have all night and tomorrow to be here.
I tried. No one can say I didn’t.
Comes the morning and when I can, I show the blog one James ….
Sleep on it.
I’ve read this before J R. You didn’t deliver as there is nothing to deliver but your petty character which everyone is well aware of on this blog.
Somebody said (I can’t find the exact quotation) something along the lines that, “Intelligent people talk about ideas. Ordinary people talk about events. But truly stupid people talk only about people.”
Well, I’ve been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and I realize this is the Internet, but the personal attacks in this forum — from both sides to the other — tend to constitute the stupidest things I ever read.
I may personally think that “Kansas” is an ass, or that “Max” is an idiot, or that “Nathan” is ignorant, or that “parkay” doesn’t understand the full consequences of his/her obsession… but I’ve tried — really tried — to address my comments to them based on the issues they present in this forum.
Doesn’t matter how much I try. I’m sure I’ve been guilty of ad homs simply because some of their ideas strike me as so utterly stupid, ignorant, or hypocritical. Yet, I try to address the issues. I really do.
Too many people who participate in this forum are in it for the insult. Even those whose opinions (validly held, I assume) come across as politically-biased venom fall into “Gotcha” mode.
I suspect — maybe I just hope (I’m a liberal, after all, and expect good people to do good things) — rational discussions of issues on this forum might result in understanding, commonality, maybe even compromise.
Maybe even some ideas that just might work.
There will always be trolls in these kind of forums (fora?); people who will post outrageous stuff just to attract attention and generate flame wars.
A certain amount of self-restraint could solve the problem. But all it takes is some idiot posting, “Lynch all Swedes!” or “‘POSTER’ is a frog-fuc#er!” or “Ted Kennedy is fat!” or “Dick Cheney is a fascist!” and we’re off on irrational tangents. (Well, perhaps, except fot the Dick Cheney one.) (And that’s a joke, guys. I hoped you’d realize that.) (But I’m not counting on it.
Look: Technology has given us a forum to interact with people most of us are unlikely to meet in everyday life. In real life I don’t no anyone who’s so avid an advocate of what they (say) they believe in as, say, “Kansas,” “Max,” “Econ101,” or “parkay,” to name a few. When those people are talking about issues instead of personalities, their contributions to this forum actually mean something.
But when they and (to be “fair and balanced”) “J R” and “Chas.” and “ksfarmgrrl” and (to be honest) “MonkeyHawk,” get drawn into personal flame wars, the potential of this forum is reduced to elementary school playground taunts.
Would that we all would concentrate on the ideas that concern us, the issues that affect us, the processes that might get us out of the serious problems that face us.
I frankly don’t care if “Republican” pulls the teeth out of poodle puppies’ mouths so they can suck his dic# (well, actually, I might, but this is a hypothetical). I’m more concerned about what “Republican” might think about the issues of the day and the ideas that might resolve them.
Hey. I’m a Liberal. I tend to expect the best of people. Even some of you people.