Registered?
Commenting on WE Blog now requires you to be a Kansas.com member. Use the links above to register, if you haven't already, or to log in.Contact us
Follow us
Daily Archives
-
Recent Comments
- BlueJay on Let immigrants run
- Monkeyhawk on Let immigrants run
- Chrisfrommactown on Let immigrants run
- BlueJay on Let immigrants run
- Monkeyhawk on Too many exemptions
- JWink on Too many exemptions
- LonnythePlumber on Jail consultants straining patience
- BlueJay on Open thread 11/22
- Regular on Open thread 11/22
- Regular on Open thread 11/22
Open thread 10/9
- By Phillip Brownlee
- Posted Oct. 9, 2007 at 1:04 a.m.
- Filed under Open thread
- Permalink
- Comments RSS
- Both comments and trackbacks are closed
258 Comments
The Election Project
While researching new 527s in Kansas on the IRS web site, I ran across “The Election Project.” The IRS 8871 form shows Prof. Chapman Rackaway at Fort Hays State is the President of this group, and Prof. Joseph Aistrup at K-State is the Vice-President. The stated purpose of the group is “Encouragement of civic engagement, public education and information dissemination, and grass roots political fund raising.”
This group’s web site is here with this description: http://www.theelectionproject.org
“TheElectionProject.org allows citizens to voice our opinions through forums and through weekly voting. By joining, you have one free voting credit that allows you to cast one vote a week for ten weeks. You may acquire additional voting credits in two ways: 1) by referring people to the site. These may be friends, other supporters of your candidate, or people you know who are interested in politics or making a statement. Each person who you refer who joins the site will have a free voting credit and will earn you another voting credit. 2) If you are in a hurry or want to make a strong statement of your support, you can buy additional voting credits for a $1 a credit. TheElectionProject is a non-profit political action committee that will distribute its contributions based on members votes!”
In an E-mail Prof. Rackaway explains for now their focus is on national elections:
“We are interested in national-level elections right now, yes, but see no reason why the Election Project couldn’t expand once people hear about it and get some buy-in. Any election level could have people nominate, support, and vote for candidates right on the site. That in turn could get people more excited about the democratic process and involved. That’s why Joe and I came up with the idea and believe in the project.”
Get involved. Check out Prof. Rackaway’s http://www.theelectionproject.org
I’ll be watching for their non-profit funds reported on IRS 8872 forms.
It seems that http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Steven_J._Milloy
“Steven J. Milloy is a columnist for Fox News and a paid advocate for Phillip Morris, ExxonMobil and other corporations. From the 1990s until the end of 2005, he was an adjunct scholar at the libertarian think tank the Cato Institute.
Milloy runs the website Junkscience.com, which is dedicated to debunking what he alleges to be false claims regarding global warming,…”
… is as clueless about economics, as he is about peer-reviewed climate sciemce.
http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/downloads/s1766analysispart1.pdf
“The work presented here is the response to the second part of the request, and thus does not Include an analysis of the costs or economic impacts of achieving the specified reductions.”
Also,’A matter of life and global warmingPresident Bush’s hot-and-cold approach delays strategy to cut harmful gases’http://www.ajc.com/opinion/content/opinion/stories/2007/10/08/warmed_1009.html ” “A voluntary approach to reducing greenhouse gases is hardly likely to be more effective than voluntary speed limits on the roads,” a top British official quipped after Bush’s [recent] address.”
See also at bottom of the page,”HE CHANGES LIKE THE WEATHER
How President Bush’s stance on global warming has evolved over time:”
The Zionist/Neocon Cabal puts words on issues into Bush’s mouth to repeat, if not, then he’s on his own and we all know what happens next…
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad apparently got the best of the Israelis and they’re very worried about their denial thing after he accused them of attempting to shut down historical research.
The article pulled over 800 responses in Haaretz { the most I’ve seen on any issue } and most respondents show real concern about what Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad had said at Columbia University……concern that the Zionists had been bested.
That article ran yesterday { Sunday I think } and rolled-over before I could link to it.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wn_report/2007/09/16/2007-09-16_neocon_hawks_go_allout_for_giuliani.html
Neocon hawks go all-out for Giuliani
BY DAVID SALTONSTALLDAILY NEWS SENIOR CORRESPONDENTSunday, September 16th 2007, 4:00 AM
Top of Form 1???????Bottom of Form 1
· “/news/wn_report/2007/09/16/2007-09-16_neocon_hawks_go_allout_for_giuliani.html?print=1″
· “javascript:void(0);”
· “/nydn/submitStory.do”
?Rudy Giuliani
They are officially known as Rudy Giuliani’s senior foreign policy advisory board, but they also could be dubbed something else: Neocons For Rudy.As in neoconservatives, the Republican faction that many see as among the most potent forces of Bush-era Washington – a well-funded, sharply analytical bunch that provided the ideological basis for invading Iraq and is now training its cross hairs on Iran.Many of its leaders now see Giuliani as the made-to-order candidate, or at least the best chance to perpetuate their influence, experts say.”Everything is still fluid. But I do think Giuliani is picking up a good bit of neoconservative support,” said Peter Steinfels, co-director of the Fordham University Center on Religion and Culture and the author of “The Neoconservatives.”That should come as no surprise given the history of the movement, Giuliani’s record as mayor and his White House candidacy, experts add.Giuliani’s neocon roster includes Norman Podhoretz, a founding father of the movement; Charles Hill, a former foreign policy official for President Ronald Reagan and early backer of invading Iraq; Martin Kramer, an expert on Islam at Harvard University and staunch defender of Israel, and Daniel Pipes, director of the hawkish Middle East Forum.Whether their embrace of Giuliani will turn out to be a good thing for the ex-mayor if he makes it to the general election remains to be seen. Some believe it could be more baggage than boost.
TRIAD – the other neocon scandal
How did they operate?
Well, they operated in lots of different ways. The most egregious ones basically set up what can really be characterized as shell corporations. They filed, you know, a paper set of articles of incorporation. They didn’t hire staff. They didn’t really have an office or a phone number or really even a purpose. Their sole purpose was to air issue ads.
And they would spend hundreds of thousands of dollars doing this.
And you would never know where the money came from, who was behind them, who was paying for them?
That’s right.
What is Triad Management?
Triad is a for-profit corporation that the committee investigation believes was created in 1995 and 1996 in order to influence federal elections. One of the things that Triad did was set up two shell corporations, essentially, tax-exempt organizations. One was called Citizens for Reform and the other was called Citizens for the Republic Education Fund, and the sole thing that those corporations did was to air attack advertising in various races across the country.
And what was strange about that?
Most of the time in the past, when we’ve seen organizations that air advertising in political races, they’re known organizations with a real membership, that stand for a key issue or a key purpose. Things that come to mind are abortion groups, the National Rifle Association, unions, groups with membership bases that stand for a certain known position.
Triad’s groups were essentially shells. They had no existence, they had no purpose, they had no staff, they had no office.
What did they do?
They aired advertising.
Here’s what your report says: “the evidence before the Committee suggests that Triad exists for the sole purpose of influencing federal elections. It is a corporate shell funded by a few, wealthy conservative Republican activists.”
That’s what the investigation showed.
So what’s wrong with it?
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/scandal/interviews/stein.html
ADM’s Jon Lottman interviews Rep. Dennis Kucinich
for “The Next Space Race”Writer and Producer:
Jon Lottman
LOTTMAN: I did tape your remarks at AU, and I have brought some copies of that with me. I wanted to come in and do a little one-on-one to sort of supplement that. Now, you seem to be very active in this issue and this debate. The first thing I want to know is, how did that get started?
KUCINICH: Well, as a young person. I remember growing up in the 50s, and having to duck under my desk and put my hand around my head, like this, and then tuck my head in my lap, so as not to be hurt by the nuclear missiles that were coming in. I mean, they didn’t tell us that if there was a missile that hit, it wouldn’t matter what position we were in; we would not survive. We were told to keep our eyes closed tightly so we wouldn’t see the flash. Well, we know now that that was all part of a way to keep the people of the United States from getting too upset about the prospect of whole populations being incinerated in a nuclear exchange.
Since that time, when we’ve had more information about the impact of Hiroshima and Nagasaki on human beings, and we’ve learned that the use of nuclear weapons must never be an option in a civilized world, we’ve looked to have treaty regimes—formal relations between countries, saying, “we shouldn’t use nuclear weapons. We should get rid of nuclear weapons.” And my purpose as a member of the United States Congress, is to keep the faith on the issue of total nuclear disarmament. And that means on earth as well as in the heavens.
LOTTMAN: This goes back a ways with you.
KUCINICH: Sure.
LOTTMAN: I’ve been asking people who have been involved in this a long time, to just talk a little bit about people’s views of outer space. Why is it so important to keep outer space free of weapons?
KUCINICH: First of all, we still have a distance to go on this earth, of settling relations between nations. Of having peace, in the fullest sense. When you have a federal government that has a military budget of over $300 billion, and an arms industry which propagates the acquisition of arms around the world, obviously we live in a world where people have not learned how to handle conflict, and have not learned how to use nonviolence as an organizing principle in relations between nations. We don’t even have that in our own society. So that being the case, they haven’t solved their problems within this sphere they call the earth.
How in the world can we expect to ever have peace on earth, if we permit the heavens to be used as a staging area for nuclear exchanges. That doesn’t even get into the massive environmental problems that would be involved. The problems of damage to the whole eco-sphere. This is madness. And it’s time for us to speak out against this madness of hegemony in space.
There is a sense of arrogance about this. That somehow we have the power to dominate, not only the globe, but the entire universe. There is a sense of disconnection from matters spiritual in that, I think. It bespeaks a vacuousness of the human heart, to talk of weapons races that lead to engagement in outer space. It shows a lack of concern for the continuation of the human race.
We need to make a strong commitment, to affirm our belief that the life of the planet has to be the first concern that all of us, as human beings, must engage in. That we have to recognize our responsibility, as individuals, as nations, to each other. So that we can permit each other the opportunity to continue to survive.
Talk of domination of space by a military command, with the idea of somehow being in a position to manipulate the faith of the world, is just not consistent with an attitude that speaks to the necessity of the survival of the human race.
LOTTMAN: We addressed some of the political, environmental, and spiritual aspects of this. One thing I’m also interested in is the psychological. When people are stressed, when things are confusing, people look up to the sky—it makes them feel better. So what would the implications be of the skies potentially becoming a battleground?
KUCINICH: Well, you know, there’s a Christian prayer called the “our Father,” which has the words, ‘thy kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.’ We view the sky as the connection to that principle of eternity, to that idea of something transcendent in our lives. The violence to that belief in a heaven, in a transcendence, in some universal beneficence; to see the skies, the universe itself, threatened with the prospect of nuclear warfare, in the heavens, it is psychologically challenging, and spiritually punishing to invite the prospect of such an exchange of nuclear weapons between nations in outer space.
And the very fact that a nation would prepare for that while its people do not have decent health care, while its children remain not well educated in many places, while its environment has so many challenges to keep the air and the water clean, while people are still struggling to have meaningful employment… There are so many challenges we face here on earth to make our lives more livable, more meaningful. And it seems as though the projection of fear, of the instrumentalities of violence into outer space, is a threat to all of the aspirations which all of us have. Not only in this country, but on the planet.
We need to encourage people to be more than they are. We need to encourage people to unlock their own inner potential to the fullest. We need to engage with each other as brothers and sisters, to find peace and love, and to reciprocate their discoveries. The idea of a new arms race, of taking that image of a restless quest for discovery and to reach up to the sky as an expression of our limitless potential—to take that and to put it in the context of an arms race is to demean humanity. We must think more of ourselves. We must think more of each other. And we must demand of our nation that it do better.
LOTTMAN: The military powers that be, the Space Command, often express the concern that someone else is going to use outer space to harm the United States. What do you think of that concern? Is it justified, and if it is…
http://www.cdi.org/adm/1351/Kucinich.html
While I am far from sold on Obama, if I am FORCED to choose an annoited frontrunner, this 2002 statement is a good reason.
“But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history. I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of Al Qaeda. I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars.”
http://www.barackobama.com/2002/10/02/remarks_of_illinois_state_sen.php
All from facts well-known at the time, but ignored because Bush & Co.–the same folks who were falsely linking Iraq to 9-11 and claiming, absurdly, that Saddam was well on the way to getting the bomb–knew better!
Obama’s statement was sign of an intlligent, observant mind stating well-known and obvious facts that somehow seemed to elude the other 2 Dem “front runners.”
Now the big questions: how bad will his election-pandering to faux-centrist positions get, in order to be the first black nominee in history?
And what will we end up with–i.e. the “real” Barack–on January 20th?
We will most likely start a conflict war with Iran soon.
I’m asking the left and the right to unite on this cause. We do not need a divided nation on this. United we stand, divided we fall.
Regardless of your hatred towards Bush, look beyond that and let’s find a way for us to rally and bring support to our country and military when we go into Iran! It’s going to get tough people. We need all the Americans on board.
Oh I’ve little doubt you are right re: Iran there Joe. Let me give my much considered reply to your call for unity in that debacle.
NO!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF7KtJ0cntA
A few words in rememberance of the GOP.
Bumper sticker recently seen:
01/20/09 – the end of an error.
“01/20/09 – the end of an error.”
If Bush/Cheney invade Iran the end may come sooner. Instead of invading, I am expecting that they will bomb them. The justification will be to protect our troops in Iraq – the support for that hypothesis (Iran is aiding insurgents in killing our troops) is dubious, at best. I predict an asymetrical response from Iran, where they will blow up vulernable (read all) oil fields in the wider middle east. You will be paying > $100 per barrel of oil for some time. Using your car will become a luxury.
Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not.” ~ Thomas Jefferson
This is why Nancy Pelosi and Hillary Clinton want gun control so badly!
FIREARMS REFRESHER COURSE
An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject.
A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone.
Colt: The original point and click interface.
Gun control is not about guns; it’s about control.
If guns are outlawed, can we use swords?
If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
Free men do not ask permission to bear arms.
If you don’t know your rights, you don’t have any.
Those who trade liberty for security have neither.
The United States Constitution (c)1791. All Rights Reserved.
What part of “shall not be infringed” do you not understand?
The Second Amendment is in place in case the politicians ignore the others.
64,999,987 firearms owners killed no one yesterday.
Guns only have two enemies; rust and liberal politicians.
Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety.
You don’t shoot to kill; you shoot to stay alive.
911: Government sponsored Dial-a-Prayer.
Assault is a behavior, not a device.
Criminals love gun control; it makes their jobs safer.
If guns cause crime, then matches cause arson.
Only a government that is afraid of its citizens tries to control them.
You have only the rights you are willing to fight for.
Enforce the gun control laws we ALREADY have; don’t make more.
When you remove the people’s right to bear arms, you create slaves.
The American Revolution would never have happened with gun control.
Lastly, even though I will be going against my party, I cannot support a candidate who does not represent my views.
Joe you are right! When we attack Iran not just America but the entire world will change.
Iran is not Iraq, their military are not made up of mainly conscripts. The Iranians are very much like us in they are nationalists, when attacked they come together against those attacking them. The boarder between Iran and Iraq will flow with troops and the skies will be filled with attack aircraft.
The stops will be gone, those staying out of this will no longer see a need to stay out. It will mean to them that now two countries have been attack without having attacked the United States. Without there being a clear and present danger to our sovereignty. Now they will see there is no choice in the matter, they will have to join together just to have a chance against us.
Who will stand with us? We will be the aggressors, the one threatening world peace, remember what happen the last time a country was seen as a threat to world peace? Can we go it alone against the entire Middle East? Within twenty four hours the first casualties in this war will be the 165,000 U.S. Military in Iraq. Your friends, brothers, sisters, cousins all will be killed! But of course we will have to respond in kind, every able bodied man and woman will be called to service, they will be needed as it will be us against the world! Fifty years from now, history will record the name of the United States along side that of Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan. Try as we might, there will be no explaining the why we started World War three. No justification sighted will be enough to warrant it, no American will stand un-blamed for it, we will have to answer the same questions ask of the Germany people in 1945. Why did you not doing something to stop it? Why did you follow him blindly into starting a unprovoked war?
I agree, we need to stand together against the forces that are bring about the end of this great nation.But Joe, you will not find them in Iran, Iraq or anywhere else in the world! NO ONE has that much power, except for ourselves! But you are 100 % right, once we attack Iran it will be tough! And it will be united we stand And united we fall.
This is too long I would imagine for most to read, I am sorry I could not fit it into a two second sound bite!
Joe,
I have a better idea. Let’s unite BEFORE we start a conflict war with Iran and let this administration know that we will not stand for it!
Somebody needs to call the men in little white jackets to cart these idiots away to the loony bin, where they can play war to their heart’s content and nobody will give fat rat’s patootie.
Rox: they’ll come up with a pretext, and 80 percent will support them just like the last time. Maybe arsenic in apple pie.
Can we dub D. Moines King of the Pro-Gun Bumper Stickers?
I’m all for bush and cheney going into Iran.
Air drop them in Jan. 10 2009 or preferrably sooner.
Within twenty four hours the first casualties in this war will be the 165,000 U.S. Military in Iraq. Your friends, brothers, sisters, cousins all will be killed! Posted by: writerdog
Writerdog the anti-war activist is an expert at predicting battle casualties in a war that has not even happened. Even the experts were not even close to their own DoD estimates in the first PG war.
War and battle are just slightly more complicated than quarterbacking a football game from your couch, but the writercramps is a professional at this.
So can the writerdog be a little more dramatic?
Can we dub D. Moines King of the Pro-Gun Bumper Stickers?
Posted by: Rox
No, but maybe you can help find me a bumper sticker with the name of the democrat candidate who supports the NRA?
Otherwise, I am jumping ship. Thanx
Oh shrewd move there D.
When your job is gone and you have no health care maybe you can eat your guns. Proirities man!
here’s one for the gunsels: do aliens have the right to bear arms?
Mars, if you walk out in front of a semi do you need someone setting on a couch to tell you that you will be killed? Something’s are just that predictable, but then it might be understandable for you to see me as anti-war. I do not want this country to end nor to let a bunch of Leftists to end it for me! When it comes to stopping them from doing so, I am very Pro-war!
Joe Williams,
DING DING DING DING!
“We will most likely start a conflict war with Iran soon.
I’m asking the left and the right to unite on this cause. We do not need a divided nation on this. United we stand, divided we fall.
Regardless of your hatred towards Bush, look beyond that and let’s find a way for us to rally and bring support to our country and military when we go into Iran! It’s going to get tough people. We need all the Americans on board.”
So, let me get this straight: we’re going to “start a war with Iran soon,” but all of us need to “unite on this cause.”
Why are we going to war, Joe Williams? Give us the reasons and let them be debated here.
More to the point, if a majority of Americans aren’t cool with Dick’s plan, why are we doing it? I know you don’t think much of democracy and all, Joe Williams, but really.
As for the plan itself, it’s real simple, Joe: if we attack Iran, we fall. Want to see China call in our foreign debt? Attack Iran. Want to see the price of oil skyrocket through the roof? Attack Iran. Want to see the U.S. economy go into recession? Attack Iran. Want to paint a target on the head of every U.S. serviceman and woman in Iran? Attack Iran.
China is in a position to knock us back on our heels without firing a shot, and YOU’RE advocating a provocation of this magnitude? Have you been smoking meth with Cheney? Are you OUT OF YOUR MIND?
You shouldn’t post on Tuesdays, Joe Williams: you always write stupid stuff on Tuesdays.
“Posted by: writerdog | October 09, 2007 at 08:24 AM
I read every word, dog. And it was brilliant.
And CF and writerdog, evertime I hear someone talk about attacking Iran, I hear Micheal Stipe singin “it’s the end of the world as we know it”.
War with Iran would be an unmitigated disaster. I do not subscribe to the number of casualties that WriterDog has proposed, but agree that they would be much larger than from the iraq conflict.
Neither do I completely agree with CF2K about some of the more dire consequences of his post, but I do agree with the principle, and the tone of his post.
There is no need to invade Iran. Period. THere is no need to act unilaterally, period. As to violaiton of the UN, let the UN take care of something itself for a change, without US picking up the price, both financially and otherwese. Let the UN suffer the casualties of war, and Not the US.
Of course, the UN is a totally worthless buearacracy, but who cares. Let them and the rest of the world take care of things for awhile. It has long been held that the Diplomats publicly give the US hell for their policies, but privately give us the green light, unwilling to take a stand themselves. To hell with them, let them pick up the ball for a change.We have no need to invade Iran. They are no danger to the US at this point. If they become one, time to deal then. Preemptive strikes on a “maybe” are worthless.Yeah, they are liars. yeah, they are probably developing nuclear weapons. So what. Just tell them this. Use one, on us or our allies, and you will cease to exist. Yes, they are fueling the strife in Iraq. Close the border wbetwen the two, break financial ties, whatever.
WE will suffer hugely if we attack Iran. Yes, Joe Williams, we
must unite. We must unite to keep us out of Iran.
Proirities man!Posted by: J R (aka Hiro Nakamura)
Save the world.
Yeah Pat, but JR didn’t answer my question yesterday when I asked specifically how the Democrats are gonna save his job.
He must still be thinking about that one.
Devil’s in the details.
Hey Writerdog don’t fear. Tom Clancy’s predictions have been coming true of late, and his guess is as good as any on a war with Iran.
It reads better than your book above. Just get Tom Clancy’s novel, “The Sum of All Fears”.
Hey Pat? Go stalk Max. He’s more your type…a few rungs down the evolutionary ladder.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZmPS0XmeBwdemented philosophy of conquest
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAUQAiuRXBANeocon admits Iraq was about Imperialism.AT end it is a little to liberal for me but the first of it is enlightening.Most of the time I watch “hardball” I catch myself shouting at the TV.” JUST SHUT THE HELL UP CHRIS AND LET THEM ANSWER!”. But this time his questions force the guest to answer the important questions.
Don’t worry Doom and Gloom, the Democrats will save us, along with JR.
Look how quickly the Democrat majority defunded the Iraq war.
They won’t vote to go to war in Iran, oh no, they won’t make that mistake again.
At least Hillary won’t vote for war again, at least not before she thoroughly reviews the facts, like she did for the Iraq vote.
Use one, on us or our allies, and you will cease to exist.Close the border wbetwen the two, break financial ties, whatever.
Posted by: littlejohn |
Do you think they will be so brass as to announce they are launching a nuke at us? Of course not! The nuke will be handed over to one of OBL’s terrorist cells, loaded on a boat or the still missing 747, and dropped without reference to the point of origin.
You won’t be able to attack a smiling Iran.
Close the border? Don’t make me laugh. We cannot even close out own damn border!
our own border.
Sigh…..
D?
First generation nuclear technology does not lend itself to the uses you are afraid of.
Close the border? Don’t make me laugh. We cannot even close out own damn border!
Posted by: D. Moines | October 09, 2007 at 09:39 AM
We can, we just won;t.
As to the rest, pure speculaiton. What a reason to go to war. NOT!
“The nuke will be handed over to one of OBL’s terrorist cells, loaded on a boat or the still missing 747, and dropped without reference to the point of origin.”
Hee hee hee. HAHAHAHAH. HEHEHEHEH. heeeeeeeeee!
OMG, let’s TALK about the sum of all fears. Jesus WEPT. Government by lies and fear mongering.
And you all want to whine about WRITERDOG being all doom and gloom and paranoia?
hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehhe!
IMHO I am beginning to think that all of those who are avidly supporting an attack or invasion on Iran, should be arrested, and without benefit of legal counsel, sent to Gitmo… There they can be held in perpetuity until we get our troops out of Iraq, and then we can try them all for Treason…
That ought to get the NeoCons arguing!! LOL
ANYBODY advocating attacking or invading Iran should be considered Anti-American… what ever side of the aisle they are on… Then are enemy combatants at best!
ANYBODY should be considered Anti-American… Posted by: Chas
There’s a real American for you.
Commie
D Moines, I doubt the nuke would be air dropped. Too much security with radar and all in the air. But they won’t need to air drop it.
Now that Mexican trucks can drive all over the USA, any Nuke can be simply trucked across our border and driven to the major metropolitan area of their choice.
Or by boat. Tons of drugs are brought in from offshore. Put a little nuke in a fishing boat or cargo boat, and wa la!
I’m guessing both nukes will enter initially by boat. One on each coast, much more difficult to track 2 nukes 3,000 miles apart.
On the west coast, say in a little fishing cove on the Washington or Oregon shore, they will come to America. From there, trucked to the Golden Gate bridge, where the truck will be ’stalled’, the drivers will get picked up by car and driven to the north shore, up the hill high enough to watch and videotape, for celebrations back home in Iran.
The second one will be on the east coast. This one will not be unloaded. The boat will simply anchor beneath the Brooklyn Bridge. This will be videotaped from Staten Island. Perfect view from there and far enough away to survive.
Both will go off at the same time, during morning rush hour during the week. 9/11/11.
Oh, we can negotiate with them though, on their surrender terms. You see, they will blackmail us by claiming to have a dozen more nukes parked all over America. And Hillary Clinton will waive the white flag, just like she’s doing now in Iraq.
The green, white, and red flag of Iran will then be flown over America.
“Commie”
That’s one of those words like newkyalr or YUnited States.
When you see the one written or the others spoken, you are clearly dealing with a deiciency in intellect.
OMG, let’s TALK about the sum of all fears. Jesus WEPT. Government by lies and fear mongering.
hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehhe!Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
I believe the book has more merit than anything writercramp wrote above.
Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehhe!
Got it all worked out there Max?
Guy? You’re insane.
yes, let’s invade Iran! Oh goody!Can’t wait!
It’s all part of our top secret right wing conspiracy.
Shhhhhhhhhh! Don’t tell anyone else.
We are going to get the entire globe for America.
And when we are finished, we are going to hand it all over to the liberal democrats – to turn it blue.
IMHO I am beginning to think that all of those who are avidly supporting an attack or invasion on Iran, should be arrested, and without benefit of legal counsel, sent to Gitmo… There they can be held in perpetuity until we get our troops out of Iraq, and then we can try them all for Treason…
That ought to get the NeoCons arguing!! LOL
Posted by: Chas. | October 09, 2007 at 09:48 AM
ANYBODY advocating attacking or invading Iran should be considered Anti-American… what ever side of the aisle they are on… Then are enemy combatants at best!
Posted by: Chas. | October 09, 2007 at 09:50 AM
Bit extreme, don;t you think? Or, because they disagree with you, then they are enemy combatants?And deserve everything that you have professed to be against. Got it.
hee hee hee hee
Posted by: Doom and Glooom | October 09, 2007 at 09:58 AM
heeheheheheheheh. It’s a little early for meltdowns, no?
Hee hee hee hee hee hee. Wingnuts, they’re not just for breakfast anymore….
The green, white, and red flag of Iran will then be flown over America.
Posted by: Max
You know Max, on second thought, the ragheads will probably blow up a major US City with the device. Every major city is colored blue today (highest unemployment/food stamps/crime).
With a 49/51 national margin, every little bit would help.
And deserve everything that you have professed to be against. Got it.
Posted by: littlejohn | October 09, 2007 at 10:02 AM
Like I said, Chas, is a real American.
As long as he can twist it his way, it is the right way.
You know Max, on second thought, the ragheads will probably blow up a major US City with the device. Every major city is colored blue today (highest unemployment/food stamps/crime).
With a 49/51 national margin, every little bit would help.
Posted by: D. Moines | October 09, 2007 at 10:04 AM
Well D, that would seem to cast doubt on your earlier suggestion of party affiliation.
I also think that post warrants the attention of the Dept. of Homeland Security,
Hee hee hee hee hee hee. Wingnuts, they’re not just for breakfast anymore….
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl
Oh the liberals prize name caller is having her second breakfast already. Like a big cow. And a comedian at that.
Leftnuts, they’re not just for entertainment anymore!
Neither shalt thou lie with any beast to defile thyself therewith: neither shall any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto: it is confusion.
heeheheheheheheh.
Yup D Moines, NYC and San Fran gone would tip the balance quite a bit.
Not sure the United Iranian States would have elections though.
Actually, I believe the scenarios by Max are quite possible. I do not agree they will happen any time soon. I beleive that they will happen only after we have removed ourselves from at least Iraq, if not the rest of the middle east. Those who are followers of the current thugs calling themselves Islamists, will never rest until they are either destroyed (impossible to do which is a fact that many seem to ignore), or have subjugated the rest of the world under their control (another fact ignored by many).
Regardless, it does not justify attacking Iran. It does not justify staying in Iraq. It does not justify “killimg all of them, because soon or later one of them may kill us”
I also think that post warrants the attention of the Dept. of Homeland Security,
Posted by: J R
Whatever trips your trigger. Also let me know when you submit. I have a few of your colorful posts to send them. They need a really good laugh!!!!
Probably arrest you for false reporting. Wouldn’t that be nice?
so doom and gloom, let’s go for it today, what do ya say?
I see an opportunity here to draw a CLEAR distinction between the left and the right.
You play the right, I’ll play the left.
Ready.. set… HATE!
J R all of a sudden concerned about national security? That’s a big surprise.
D&G since you brought it up, according to the “book” KFG is OK as long as she does not lie with animals.The quote is directed towards men, the mention of women is about lying with animals. I have met her partner, no she is no animal! Ok she is quite human and they fall into that classification, but then no one is perfect!
Yeah when right wing lunatics begin to discuss the destruction of an American city I think it worthy of note.
Ok wingnuts, us “blues” would be GLAD to leave!
Dear Red States…
We’ve decided we’re leaving. We intend to form our own country, and we’re taking the other Blue States with us.
In case you aren’t aware, that includes Hawaii, Oregon, Washington, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois and all the Northeast. We believe this split will be beneficial to the nation, and especially to the people of the new country of New California.
To sum up briefly: You get Texas, Oklahoma and all the slave states.
We get stem cell research and the best beaches. We get Elliot Spitzer. You get Ken Lay.
We get the Statue of Liberty. You get Dollywood. We get Intel and Microsoft. You get WorldCom.
We get Harvard. You get Ole’ Miss.
We get 85 percent of America’s venture capital and entrepreneurs. You get Alabama.
We get two-thirds of the tax revenue, you get to make the red states pay their fair share.
Since our aggregate divorce rate is 22 percent lower than the
Christian Coalition’s, we get a bunch of happy families. You get a
bunch of single moms.
Please be aware that Nuevo California will be pro-choice and
anti-war, and we’re going to want all our citizens back from Iraq at
once. If you need people to fight, ask your evangelicals. They have
kids they’re apparently willing to send to their deaths for no
purpose, and they don’t care if you don’t show pictures of their
children’s caskets coming home. We do wish you success in Iraq, and
hope that the WMDs turn up, but we’re not willing to spend our
resources in Bush’s Quagmire.
With the Blue States in hand, we will have firm control of 80 percent of the country’s fresh water, more than 90 percent of the pineapple and lettuce, 92 percent of the nation’s fresh fruit, 95 percent of America’s quality wines (you can serve French wines at state dinners) 90 percent of all cheese, 90 percent of the high tech industry, most of the U.S. low-sulfur coal, all living redwoods, sequoias and condors, all the Ivy and Seven Sister schools, plus Harvard, Yale,
Stanford, Cal Tech and MIT.
With the Red States, on the other hand, you will have to cope with 88 percent of all obese Americans (and their projected health care costs), 92 percent of all U.S. mosquitoes, nearly 100 percent of the tornadoes, 90 percent of the hurricanes, 99 percent of all Southern Baptists, virtually 100 percent of all televangelists, Rush Limbaugh, Bob Jones University, Clemson and the University of Georgia.
We get Hollywood and Yosemite, thank you. YOU GET KANSAS!!!
Additionally, 38 percent of those in the Red states believe Jonah was actually swallowed by a whale, 62 percent believe life is sacred unless we’re discussing the death penalty or gun laws, 44 percent say that evolution is only a theory, 53 percent that Saddam was involved in 9/11 and…
61 percent of you crazy b*****ds believe you are people with higher morals then we lefties.
By the way, we’re taking the good pot, too. You can have that dirt
weed they grow in Mexico.
Peace out,
Blue States
Well D, that would seem to cast doubt on your earlier suggestion of party affiliation.Posted by: J R
Just reread the rest of your comments. I am registered as a democrat and tend to vote that way. I can poke fun of anyone at anytime, without affecting my party affiliation.
I don’t have to agree with any of you, or stick up for any of you.
Max is probably as conservative as they get, so I’m sure my comment appealed to him and his way of thinking(confirmed by his later post).
You on the other hand, I have seen contribute little, but enjoy name calling and degrading posters.
That’s why I skimmed over your post.
Oh and with clarification Max.
If the bogeyman comes for you? I don’t sweat that too much.
hee hee hee hee writerdog. With alll due respect though, I have to disagree.
She CAN be an animal….
There. I hope the resident wingnuts have THAT image in their heads all day.
Yeah whatever. bogeyman can have “D moines” too. The poster not the city.
he is quite human and they fall into that classification, but then no one is perfect!
Posted by: writerdog
Oh don’t concern yourself with my biblical quotes. They are just like JESUS WEPT. They, don’t really mean anything. It’s just a method of making fun of gays, sorta like KFG making fun of Christians. It’s all good fun. Just ask her.
Littlejohn, I presented that little scenario above hoping to open the eyes of those who do not think National Defense is a big priority for America.
I think those scenarios are possible today. What’s to stop it from happening?
When you have countries like North Korea able to supply nuke material to Syria; Russia to Iran; Pakistan to whoever; the proliferation of nukes has already happened.
Do you think we can track every device? Do you think we control our own US borders?
I think not.
Whether a pre-emptive strike is needed for Iran now or later, I don’t know.
The danger is in waiting too long.
I just hope America maintains a strong defense, and a posture of deterrence to prevent such an attack on America.
Libya and North Korea MAY be good examples of how to de-arm a rogue country. Time will tell if that works for Iran. If not, we need to be prepared as a nation to take action if/when needed.
The Chamberlin approach NEVER works, thus WWII.
“They, don’t really mean anything.”
I wish I could post a picture of that cat with a pancake on it’s head.
Details, details, farmgirl, I need details now!
Picture whatever you like. But you have been asked nicely before by others to stop making fun of Christians beliefs.
Jesus wept for a reason, and it does not apply to each of your flippant and humorous posts.
There are Christians in all walks of life, not just republican. And your tossing the bible verse around is hurtful. So let’s all toss it around for our own purposes and device.
Max-
The problem is that you are battling and idea, a political mnovement, and a theology all rolled into one. It is not the Chamberlain idea, because there is no country to hold accountable.
WE must fight those who will engage in terror. We must use whatever legal means we have to find them, catch them in the process of committing an act, and dealing with them appropriately. We must perhaps deal with those countries (including our “friends” the Saudi Arabians) in ways that dissuade them from supporting such people. WE cannot just invade or bomb every country that harbors such people. We could, militarily deal with those countries who use such people for proxy wars, but only when direct linkage can be found.
Woofstock sets attendance recordBuoyed by record attendance, last weekend’s Woofstock raised more than $200,000 for the Kansas Humane Society.
Hundreds of dogs were displayed at the 10th annual event, which was held Saturday at Sedgwick County Park.
As many as 15,000 people may have come to Woofstock this year, said Kim Janzen, the Humane Society’s director and chief executive. That compares to between 8,000 and 10,000 for last year’s event, she said.
Although revenue figures are not yet final, Janzen said, “I’ll bet we’ll end up with at least $210,000.”
That would represent a 17 percent increase over last year’s event, she said. Janzen credited good weather and increased awareness for the huge turnout.
– Stan Finger
Good news and good for all who participated!
Heeeeeee!
When I said “ready, set, hate” I guess doom and gloom took me seriously.
Yes please, continue to strut yer stuff doomy. I think those distinctions are being made veeeeeeeerrrrry clear.
I hear bells. Must be gay angels getting their wings.
God, guns and gays!
It appears liberal christians can all come out of the closet now.
Obama also turned his message of bringing red and blue states togetherinto a spiritual call.
“As I travel around the country I feel hopeful and optimistic. There’sGod’s spirit in each and everyone of us that’s waiting to be releasedand to be let out,” Obama said. “He wants us to join together and breakthe partisan divisions.”
Obama concluded by asking the congregration to pray for him and hisfamily, making a plea that the prayers of the assembled would keep himon a righteous path.
“Sometimes you can become fearful, you can become vain, sometimes youcan seek power for power’s sake,” Obama confessed and asked the crowd to”pray that I can be an instrument of God” as he ran for president.
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2007/10/07/400809.aspx
Hundreds of dogs were displayed at the 10th annual event,Good news and good for all who participated!Posted by: J R
Did they have any of those nasty pitt bulls you wanted to kill?
“…the drivers will get picked up by car and driven to the north shore, up the hill high enough to watch and videotape, for celebrations back home in Iran.”
I hope there’s a good, strong south wind.
Looks like the sock puppet parade has arrived.
WE cannot just invade or bomb every country that harbors such people. We could, militarily deal with those countries who use such people for proxy wars, but only when direct linkage can be found.
Posted by: littlejohn
I thought, “You are either with us or against us.” Was pretty clear.
thought, “You are either with us or against us.” Was pretty clear.
Posted by: American Way | October 09, 2007 at 10:37 AM
It was a nice soundbite. And maybe it even seemed the right thing to say, but world politics Unfortunately) is much more nuanced than that.
…here’s a good one for ya.
http://www.planetout.com/entertainment/news/?sernum=5776&navpath=/entertainment/popcornq
ksfarmgrrl,
Hear, hear! An end for Blue State welfare to Red States! If they can’t pull their weight, let the free market have ‘em!
Yep CF. Gives the phrase “welfare state” a whole new meaning.
KSfarmgrrl-
Excellent post. There are many with christian convictions that must come to terms with homosexual family members. Or family members that have children out of wedlock, or family members that do other things not accepted by Christianity. It must be done. Period. One must differenttiate between the person, and the activity. I know you believe that is not so, that you cannot separate the two. I tell you that it is. I have been there and done that. More than once.
I believe homosexuality is wrong. I do not believe homosexuals are evil, or vile, or preverted. I Believe it is okay for the state to sanciton their union. I believe that they should not be persecuted for being homosexual. I still believe it is wrong.
——————————————————————————–
——————————————————————————–
—————————————————————————————————————————————————————-INVASION USAIllegal aliens murder12 Americans dailyDeath toll in 2006 far overshadows totalU.S. soldiers killed in Iraq, Afghanistan
——————————————————————————–Posted: November 28, 20061:00 a.m. Eastern
By Joseph Farah© 2006 WorldNetDaily.com
WASHINGTON – While the military “quagmire” in Iraq was said to tip the scales of power in the U.S. midterm elections, most Americans have no idea more of their fellow citizens – men, women and children – were murdered this year by illegal aliens than the combined death toll of U.S. troops in Iraq and Afghanistan since those military campaigns began.
Though no federal statistics are kept on murders or any other crimes committed by illegal aliens, a number of groups have produced estimates based on data collected from prisons, news reports and independent research.
Twelve Americans are murdered every day by illegal aliens, according to statistics released by Rep. Steve King, R-Iowa. If those numbers are correct, it translates to 4,380 Americans murdered annually by illegal aliens. That’s 21,900 since Sept. 11, 2001. ____________________________________I am a legal Mexican American and I say let’s sort and deport these vermon, Government please take action before the people do !!
Twelve Americans are murdered every day by illegal aliens, according to statistics released by Rep. Steve King, R-Iowa. If those numbers are correct, it translates to 4,380 Americans murdered annually by illegal aliens. That’s 21,900 since Sept. 11, 2001.
Posted by: Jose Hernandez | October 09, 2007 at 11:15 AM
I find it very difficult to believe that number. But if so, we are obviously fighting the wrong ‘terror”
SORT AND DEPORT !!ILLEGAL IS ILLEGAL.ENFORCE THE LAW OR WE WILL VOTE YOU OUT !IF YOU ELECTED ONES WON’T DO THE RIGHT THING THAN YOUR REPLACEMENTS WILL !
A small private intelligence company that monitors Islamic terrorist groups obtained a new Osama bin Laden video ahead of its official release last month, and around 10 a.m. on Sept. 7, it notified the Bush administration of its secret acquisition. It gave two senior officials access on the condition that the officials not reveal they had it until the al-Qaeda release.
Within 20 minutes, a range of intelligence agencies had begun downloading it from the company’s Web site. By midafternoon that day, the video and a transcript of its audio track had been leaked from within the Bush administration to cable television news and broadcast worldwide.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/09/AR2007100900791.html?hpid=topnews
The traitor Bush administration strikes again!
SORT AND DEPORT !!ILLEGAL IS ILLEGAL.ENFORCE THE LAW OR WE WILL VOTE YOU OUT !IF YOU ELECTED ONES WON’T DO THE RIGHT THING THAN YOUR REPLACEMENTS WILL !
Hey Pat,
“Did they have any of those nasty pitt bulls you wanted to kill?”
We tested over 70 dogs on stock for herding instinct. The only dog that tried to bite me was a Standard Schnauzer. I was able to get him under control and actually work stock. The only dog I couldn’t get under control was a Rat Terrier.
I did test three or four ‘pit bulls’. All of them were sweet dogs, not much herding instinct. They were actually too shy.
Hank
I’ve predicted a couple of times that Bush will start a war with Iran before he leaves office. Bush doesn’t need Congressional approval to order up an air strike.
Oh no, say it isn;t so!
Coors, Miller plan mergerNEW YORK – The makers of Coors and Miller plan to combine their U.S. brewing operations in an effort to compete better against industry-leader Anheuser-Busch.
The joint venture announced today will be known as MillerCoors and will have responsibility for selling brands like Miller Lite and Coors Light in the U.S.”
I know that in the scheme of things, this is not even a fleck of concern, but hey, We need a bit of levity once in awhile, no?
Interesting XXX,
Seems that Iran has been at war with us since we invaded Iraq. A few bombs dropped here and there seems appropriate.
Hank
lj, and I think I heard on the radio while commuting this morning that the Coors/Miller combination will be joining with Molson (from Canada) in some fashion as well. BTW, I’m not a fan of the products of either of the American breweries, nor of the Canadian one.
XXX, in case the urge ever gets to you too:
http://our.marines.com/
EB Sends
Where’s the justice, Supreme court refuses to hear illegal rendition case.http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071009/pl_nm/usa_torture_masri_dc_4;_ylt=At15bFbgR_GvWLsKk57qTellM3wV
nor of the Canadian one.Posted by: Vaughn Tolle
My gawd man!Not even a Molson Golden?
I prefer Labatt Blue, but only ice cold.
You know how they make Coors light, don’t you?
Ten gallons of water and one bottle of Heinken.
British are cutting their Iraq commitment by half, henceforth let the name English Muffin be changed to Freedom Muffin!
D., my choice from Canada is Labatt Blue; Molson Golden is consumable, but (given it is, indeed, ice cold), the Blue is my choice.
Gee, from my limited experience with Coors light, I thought it was twenty gallons of water…. :-)
Thanks for the link, Semper Fi.
Do you know how Coors Light and making love in a canoe are alike?
Hank
Coors light is okay, Miller Lite okay, but lite beer is like decaf coffee. Why bother? Okay, I guess the girth that surrounds me is a good argument. Alas. :(
Interesting XXX,
Seems that Iran has been at war with us since we invaded Iraq. A few bombs dropped here and there seems appropriate.
Hank
Hank, I don’t particularly agree that Iran has been at war with us although I’ve read the accusations.
If we bomb Iran, I hope we have enough sense to go nuclear. The results of the first bombing run will be critical.
I do prefer Miller lite, once in awhile a Corona lite. But my beer intake being small, I will usually go for the real thing.
No Hank, why isCoors Light and making love in a canoe are alike?
“Okay, I guess the girth that surrounds me is a good argument. Alas.”Posted by: littlejohn |
Me too LJ, me too. But I read in last months issue of Consumer Report a ranking of light beers. And was curious for the same reasons. Tried most of them, but only their top rated one was any good. And at 121 calories, I said to myself, “Self, for only twenty calories more you can have a regular beer.”
Yep, Hank, I do.
‘Cause it’s F’n close to water…
Did they have any of those nasty pitt bulls you wanted to kill?
Posted by: Pat Herron | October 09, 2007 at 10:34 AM
No dear none at Woofstock that I saw. My Mom and her litttle dog were of course attacked by a pit bull a few weeks ago as I posted and you reference.
The dog was NOT removed from the residence and destroyed. My mon and all 5 witnesses have to go to a hearing next week. I hope they take that dangerous dog and put it down. I see it loose again and I’ll take care of it myself.
One reason why BLOGS like this one encourage conflict–
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/07/jobs/07pre.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
The advantage of a phone call or a drop-by over e-mail is clearly greatest when there is trouble at hand. But there are ways in which e-mail may subtly encourage such trouble in the first place.
This is becoming more apparent with the emergence of social neuroscience, the study of what happens in the brains of people as they interact. New findings have uncovered a design flaw at the interface where the brain encounters a computer screen: there are no online channels for the multiple signals the brain uses to calibrate emotions.
Face-to-face interaction, by contrast, is information-rich. We interpret what people say to us not only from their tone and facial expressions, but also from their body language and pacing, as well as their synchronization with what we do and say.
Most crucially, the brain’s social circuitry mimics in our neurons what’s happening in the other person’s brain, keeping us on the same wavelength emotionally. This neural dance creates an instant rapport that arises from an enormous number of parallel information processors, all working instantaneously and out of our awareness.
In contrast to a phone call or talking in person, e-mail can be emotionally impoverished when it comes to nonverbal messages that add nuance and valence to our words. The typed words are denuded of the rich emotional context we convey in person or over the phone.
E-mail, of course, has a multitude of virtues: it’s quick and convenient, democratizes access and lets us stay in touch with loads of people we could never see or call. It enables us to accomplish huge amounts of work together.
Still, if we rely solely on e-mail at work, the absence of a channel for the brain’s emotional circuitry carries risks. In an article to be published next year in the Academy of Management Review, Kristin Byron, an assistant professor of management at Syracuse University’s Whitman School of Management, finds that e-mail generally increases the likelihood of conflict and miscommunication.
Jesus. LaBatt’s?!?
Try anything from Unibroue (motto: “Drink less, drink better”), a Quebecois brewery.
La Fin du Monde is a world class Belgian gold (9% ABV), and the 3 Pistols (Trois Pistoles) is maybe the best Belgian strong dark I’ve ever had (also 9%). Jesus, the bottles of 3P I had last March, consumed in a barn just south of Lindsborg where the hay had just begun to release its spring smell: I can still remember that.
Either is memorable. The Maudite is pretty good stuff, too.
Molson? Fark, blecch.
Coors is a major supporter of reich-wing causes.
I don’t touch it. Besides, it tastes like p*ss.
Samuel Adams
http://www.samueladams.com/
Do you want to have a swig of real beer or do you just like to piss?
All of this discussion of going to war and if I do say so on a very liberal site! I see most of it is negative which is a real good thing, but then I see we have progressed to strategy for a war. Not a good thing.
No expert, but I have neighbors from Iran. They left when the Shah was thrown out and the country went into biblical shock from fledging democracy (yes, even under the US installed dictator). Besides sharing some of the biggest pistachio nuts I’ve ever had, they also shared much of their heart. Very reserved and not boisterous also very strict in their muslim religion. I told him they were weird, and eventually, after much coaxing, he told me I’m weird. Our kids grew up together. Eventually met the entire local Iranian community. Many are American citizens now.
At any rate, I do not believe the Iranian people want war, violence, or support terror activity abroad. They thirst for democracy.
So let’s not talk about war in the objective terms of right and wrong. Bush or Clinton or WHOMEVER takes the white house, should be thinking about the people of these countries and how we can improve our relationship with them. Screw the government.
So they get the bomb. Welcome them to the growing club. Pakistan is Muslim and has the bomb. Did they give it to terrorists? Maybe they will. But we don’t go to war on maybe.
This fear of Bush starting a war is valid, as he has proven himself more than capable. It’s good to protest. But I hope we don’t stop there. Let’s make sure all the candidates know how we feel about a war with Iran.
Like I was hoping you would vent on the top candidates refusing to make a commitment to getting our people out of Iraq.
Maybe for Republicans you go way out there and vote for Ron Paul, even if only has a slim chance of winning. He voted against the war in 2002?
Who on the democrat side will commit to withdrawal from Iraq? Likely the same would hesitate before attacking Iran.
BTW, this isn’t a free pass on Iran. They f–k our troops up,and we prove it: Warn them strongly once, and then we retaliate with bombs in a limited fashion. They export terror of any kind we get the world behind actions short of war to stop it.
Don’t commit our troops unless we are attacked outright.
WASHINGTON — Al Qaeda is believed to be intensifying efforts to smuggle operatives into the United States to launch possible attacks, likely using safe havens in Pakistan as a spring board, the White House reported Tuesday.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,300469,00.html
In addition to Iran, we should be looking real hard at Pakistan.
Coors is a major supporter of reich-wing causes.Posted by: CapnAmerica
Damn Capn! I agreed readily with your second statment, but your first one has me worried.
I never questioned the political position of my favorite beer maker!
They could be communist for all I know. Damn!
Now I gotta find out and probably won’t like the answer. Damn it!
Can’t just sit my fat butt on the bar stool and order a draw (that’s a draft for east coasters)anymore. I gotta take stock in the company?
That really sucks. Darn it!
Here I just thought it tasted good.
WEBSTER CITY, Iowa (AP) – Every citizen could get a 401(k) retirement account and up to $1,000 in annual matching funds from the government under a plan offered Tuesday by Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Rodham Clinton.
At a cost of $20 billion-$25 billion a year, the plan is Clinton’s largest domestic proposal other than her plan for universal health insurance. The New York senator said it would be paid for by taxing estates worth more than $7 million per couple and would help narrow the gap between the rich and those who don’t have enough savings for retirement.
Hillary is once again buying the election it seems only she isn’t spending her money.
Not to change the subject but Hillarys’ newest plan to pick the pockets of the rich to give to the poor looks at first glance a lot like privatizing SS. How will those poor idiots know they can’t spend that money (per the demo objection to privatization)that it HAS to be saved for retirement. A little surprise here if they don’t live long enough to spend it they can pass it down to their heirs. Oh My Gosh.. Say it isn’t so. Citizens passing on retirement benefits to their heirs. Really sounds like privatizing SS. Hillary is sounding more and more like Bush. Be afraid, be very afraid. Dems you should be circling the wagons. NOW. Oh and by the way she did throw out the baby with the bath water. The $5000 to each child born in the US didn’t fly in the polls – and it’s out of here.
Sent to be by a cousin in Indiana. Checked Snopes – found nothing to disprove it.
For whats it worth – Hillarycare might not be the answer for poor.
Subject: National health care — Canadian styleA letter from a Canadian:
Please take the time to read it so you can do whatever youwish….research, verify, etc., but please read it.I saw on the news up here in Canada where Hillary Clinton introduced her
new health care plan. Something similar to what we have in Canada. I also
heard that Michael Moore was raving about the health care up here in Canada
in his latest movie. As your friend and someone who lives with the Canadahealth care plan, I thought I would give you some facts about this great
medical plan that we have in Canada.First of all:1) The health care plan in Canada is not free. We pay a premium every month
of $96 for Shirley and I to be covered. Sounds great! What they don’t
tell you is how much we pay in taxes to keep the health care system afloat.
I am personally in the 55% tax bracket. Yes 55% of my earnings go to taxes.
A large portion of that (I am not sure of the exact amount) goes directlyto health care our #1 expense.2) I would not classify what we have as health care plan, it is more like
a health diagnosis system. You can get into to see a doctor quick enough
so he can tell you “yes indeed you are sick or you need an operation” but
now the challenge becomes getting treated or operated on. We have waiting
lists out the ying yang, some as much as 2 years down the road.3) Rather than fix what is wrong with you the usual tactic in Canada is to
prescribe drugs. Have a pain- here is a drug to take- not what is causing
the pain and why. No time for checking you out because it is more important
to move as many patients thru as possible each hour for Government
re-imbursement.4) Many Canadians do not have a family Doctor.5) Don’t require emergency treatment as you may wait for hours in the
emergency room waiting for treatment.6) Shirley’s dad cut his hand on a power saw a few weeks back and it
required that his hand be put in a splint – to our surprise we had to pay
$125 for a splint because it is not covered under health care plus we have
to pay $60 for each visit for the dr. to check it out each week.7) Shirley’s cousin was diagnosed with a heart blockage. Put on a waiting
list Died before he could get treatment.8) Government allots so many operations per year. When that is done no
more operations, unless you go to your local newspaper and plead your case
and embarrass the government then money suddenly appears.9)The Government takes great pride in telling us how much more they are
increasing the funding for health care but waiting lists never get shorter.
Government just keeps throwing money at the problem but it never goes away.
They are good at finding new ways to tax us, but they don’t call it a
tax anymore it is now a user fee.10) A friend needs an operation for a blockage in her leg but because she
is a smoker they will not do it despite paying into the health care
system all these years. My friend is 65 years old. Now there is talk that
maybe we should not treat fat and obese people either because they are a
drain on the health care system. Let me see now, what we want in Canada is
a health care system for healthy people only. That should reduce our health care
costs.11) Forget getting a second opinion, what you see is what you get.12) I can spend what money I have left after taxes on booze, cigarettes,
junk food and anything else that could kill me but I am not allowed by law
to spend my money on getting an operation I need because that would be
jumping the queue. I must wait my turn except if I am a hockey player or
athlete then I can get looked at right away. Go figure. Where else in the
world can you spend money to kill yourself but are not allowed to spend money toget healthy.13) Oh did I mention that immigrants are covered automatically at tax payer
expense having never contributed a dollar to the system and pay no premiums.14) We now give free needles to drug users to try and keep them
healthy. Wouldn’t want a sickly druggie breaking into your house and
stealing your things. But people with diabetes who pay into the health care
system have to pay for their needles because it is not covered by the
health care system.I send this out not looking for sympathy but as the election looms in the
states you will be hearing more and more about universal health care down
there and the advocates will be pointing to Canada. I just want to make
sure that you hear the truth about health care up here and have some food
for thought and informed questions to ask when broached with this subject.Step wisely and don’t make the same mistakes we have.Jackie
All that to illustrate someone who has more health care than I do?
Nah I still want national health care. Some is better than none.
JR if you don’t have health care then you should go to one of those dreaded employers you hate and ask for a job. All of our 30 employees have company paid health benefits and make a very good salary. Maybe you need to rethink your take on what makes the economy go.
Gotta go.
Jackie and Shirley? hmmmmm LOL
Seriously, Canadian Health Care is determined by each province. Or is that provence? Whatever. I’ve spoken with Canadians and most are quite secure in their health care and the cost of it. That does not mean there are those with poor coverage or high costs.
No one, not even Hillary, has said we will model U.S. health care after Canada’s plan. We’ve had time to study the plans of many countries and to learn what works and what doesn’t. If the U.S. is as smart as it thinks it is or should be (obviously not as pro care as others), we take the best of the best of all current plans out there, add or change what would be needed to make it cost effective with beneficial care and go with that.
We’re already paying for the health care of all. Why not do it in a less costly way?
The green, white, and red flag of Iran will then be flown over America.
Posted by: Max | October 09, 2007 at 09:54 AM
===================
I have heard rumors, Max, that “24″ has made some avid disciples… Either that, or you have been reading too much of the Turner Diaries!! LOL
Your little scenario is so patently absurd, I am not real sure why I am even responding to it… Oh wait, You are trying to incite some kind of Right Wing demonstration!! Thats it!! LOL
Thanks anyway grm. I work only for me. I’m trying to out conservative you conservatives that way.
I’m glad you made the point you did. One of the goals of the expanded SCHIPS program was to remove some of the insurance burden from small business.
I’m surprised that there is no thread on the recent shooting in WS. You would think that the pro-gun control editors would be all over that one.
WS? Do you mean WI?
“She’s looking more inevitable, and the more inevitable she looks, the easier it is to raise money. People want to be with a winner,” CNN’s senior political analyst Bill Schneider said.
Heck, you didn’t need Bill Schneider to tell you libs this.The press decided that months ago.
Tell em libs. Tell em it was in your June koolaide.
On Sunday, Edwards argued that Clinton was not committed to ending the war. Clinton has said she would withdraw a “vast majority” of the combat troops from Iraq but would leave some troops to conduct anti-terrorists operations.
“To me, that is a continuation of the war, and this war needs to be brought to an end,” Edwards told Tim Russert of NBC News.
Edwards said he would withdraw all combat troops from Iraq and position a quick reaction force in Kuwait to combat al Qaeda.
“I want to be able to say next fall, when I’m the Democratic nominee, and I’m standing with the Republican candidate, that Americans have a very clear choice,” Edwards said. “They can choose a Republican who wants to continue the war or a Democrat who wants to end the war. We can’t just be a little bit better than them. We have to be very clear that voters have choices in this election.”
“Blood makes the grass grow, kill, kill” That’s Hillary’s position on the war.
I’m surprised that there is no thread on the recent shooting in WS. You would think that the pro-gun control editors would be all over that one.
Posted by: ProudMan | October 09, 2007 at 02:11 PM
Not a good story for the gun control people. 1) You can not always count on the police to be there when you need them, so you should be able to arm yourself. 2) You can sometimes count on the police to shoot you when they get there, so you should be able to arm yourself.
Loser for the gun control people. Very quiet story for that reason.
Max, the SHOOTER was a Cop!!! WAY bad story for the Reich Wing Gun nuts!!
KSgrm, very sad, but not surprising story on Hillary’s 401k plan above.
Every week we can expect at least 1 New Socialist Program to be promised by Hillary, at least for the next 14 months.
At anywhere from $20 – $500 billion per Socialist program, that should add up to somewhere between $1.2 Trillion to $28 Trillion PER YEAR in Federal Spending.
Very sharp there Chas.
Doesnt say much for CC Laws either… and I dont even know if WI has CC LAWS
Max,
If we ban guns we need to make sure we start with our police department.
England cops don’t carry guns.
How you gonna pay for Bush’s WAR Max?? Hmmmm??
Hey Max… there is a looney tune shooter loose in Washington State right now… they got school kids in a lock down at this moment….
Why did Pelosi back down on pushing the War tax? Her party is suposed to stand up against this war and the debt we are running up to finish the job. Pushing a war tax through would be common sense. After all, we do have to pay for the war one way or the other. Either axe a few programs or install a tax. Any Democrat or Republican should be able to see that.
I support a war tax because I think defeating Al Queda and paying for it with money in the bank is a good thing. The president does not agree with me.
Any thoughts?
Let’s see what state was that?
Wisconsin or Wosconsin….
Good question rfl… Pelosi is probably afraid that if she supports it, the Repubs will just spin it around to make it sound like Dems support more new taxes!! LOL
Chas,
1. WI has no CC law. 1 of 2 states that does not. In a private home though, you don’t need a permit. Can’t trust the cops to save you, and in this case the cop killed 6 kids. Too bad these kids didn’t have a way to defend themselves.
2. Don’t worry about how to pay for the Iraq war Chas, you don’t pay taxes anyway.
3. I bet guns are banned in the WA state school. How would a gunman bring a gun in there? Hope those kids are allowed to pray.
OMG, now Max thinks he has the inside notebook on the Hillary campaign… how sad… Max, I do think there are pills or such delusional thinking… LOL
Private Home Max… LOTS of hunters in Wisconsin… LOTS of people have weapons in their homes Max… You ever know anybody in Wisconsin??? LOTS of folks in rural Wisconsin have all kinds of guns… hunting… bears… etc, etc.
I support a war tax because I think defeating Al Queda and paying for it with money in the bank is a good thing. The president does not agree with me.Any thoughts?
Posted by: rfl
rfl, I will support a war tax the day Congress stops spending social security on general fund items. All of your FICA dollars and mine, are being spent for many different projects. Possibly a bridge to nowhere (no cancelled, a rock-n-roll museum, a tropical rain forrest in Iowa.
Sorry, the concept is a good one but our federal government is not a good one (all levels/all parties).
(no cancelled s/b
(now cancelled)
“OMG, now Max thinks he has the inside notebook on the Hillary campaign” Chas
Well Chas how is that any different from you having the inside notebook on God?
Notice to anybody on this Blog who is sending out SPAM emails…
Your server is being traced, and you will be stopped soon!!
Max, the SHOOTER was a Cop!!! WAY bad story for the Reich Wing Gun nuts!!
Posted by: Chas. | October 09, 2007 at 03:19 PM
Do tell?
Explain this little tidbit. I want to see how a warped mind works.
I have never claimed to have the inside notebook on God… Bloggers like YOU keep saying that kind of trash, Hotdog1… NOT me…. stuff it weeny
31 Wichita schools awarded standard of excellenceBY JILLIAN COHAN AND KATIE LOHRENZThe Wichita Eagle
Thirty-one Wichita public schools — roughly one third — were awarded the state’s standard of excellence for performing well on state assessments in reading, math or writing, the Kansas Department of Education announced today.
This year, 26 district schools earned recognition for reading or math performance, compared with 21 in 2006. kansas.com
So much for the NCLB decriers.
It’s such a great idea that the private schools should do it too.
Except they don’t.
CapN, the private schools think the Rapture will take care of the children left behind LOL
littlejohn,Do you then believe that the homosexuals who rape young boys are evil, vile, or perverted? Because, there are a lot of them, as the Catholic Church found out some years after admitting a lot of “sanctified” homosexuals to their priesthood. (Maybe they won’t make that mistake anymore.)If not, what is it you think, that they had a momentary lapse in judgement? (That doesn’t fly in view of their grooming their young victims for weeks or months to sodomize.)
It’s such a great idea that the private schools should do it too.
Except they don’t.
Posted by: CapnAmerica | October 09, 2007 at 03:57 PM
That’s why they are private, as in they don’t take government money, so they don’t have to abide by the rules of the government concerning NCLB.
Honestly, I thought you were more intelligent than that Capn. :)
Parkay, that is just plain stupid… ANYBODY who rapes people is evil, and perverted!!
Cant you come up with something decent to post here??
Sometimes I think you have a grand fascination for things perverted!!
“Sent to be by a cousin in Indiana. Checked Snopes – found nothing to disprove it.”
Posted by: ksgrm | October 09, 2007 at 01:44 PM
http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/canada.asp
http://message.snopes.com/showthread.php?t=17352&page=1
Private Home Max… LOTS of hunters in Wisconsin… LOTS of people have weapons in their homes Max… You ever know anybody in Wisconsin??? LOTS of folks in rural Wisconsin have all kinds of guns… hunting… bears… etc, etc.
Posted by: Chas. | October 09, 2007 at 03:33 PM
Unless it’s loaded and ready to go Chas, not enough time when some crazy cop starts firing away.
Now if someone with a carry permit had a gun on their hip, then maybe 1 or more of those kids might have been saved.
Oh, and you are right. Lived in WI for several years myself. EVERY neighbor hunted and owned several guns.
WI will be a difficult state for Hillary’s confiscation plan.
littlejohn,Do you then believe that the homosexuals who rape young boys are evil, vile, or perverted? Because, there are a lot of them, as the Catholic Church found out some years after admitting a lot of “sanctified” homosexuals to their priesthood. (Maybe they won’t make that mistake anymore.)If not, what is it you think, that they had a momentary lapse in judgement? (That doesn’t fly in view of their grooming their young victims for weeks or months to sodomize.)
Posted by: parkay | October 09, 2007 at 04:01 PM
I think that anybody that rapes anybody is vile and perverted and evil. As far as I am concerned, their punishment should be this:
Nail their scrotum to a wood stump. set the stump on fire. Give them a dull knife. Walk away.
Does that answer your quesiton?
Actually, Kansas, as you will note from the total list linked at the article, there are private schools which also received the “Standard of Excellence”. Reason; the schools are state accredited, and participation in the assessments is a condition to such accreditation (and, yes, there is no state money involved with reference to said schools). Private = private plus parochial.
Actually, Parkay raises a good point.
What is right and what is wrong?
Who is to say that what Parkay described is wrong? If any religious beliefs are not the foundation for determining right from wrong, then how do we determine what civil laws we should have?
Maybe anything goes as long as there is consent?
And is there an age for consent? How do we determine what that age is?
Throw out all the laws!
Vaughn, as you will note the opening sentence from the article starts out like this.
“Thirty-one Wichita public schools…”
The reason for my comment on NCLB.
Yes, Kansas, it does. You were responding to a Capn America post about private schools, which prompted my response.
BTW, all that really shows (results from assessments) is that the students are getting better at taking the same. If the assessments are really valid measures of what the students are to know in these areas, fair enough; but I’ve my doubts.
“Actually, Kansas, as you will note from the total list …” ”
Posted by: Vaughn Tolle
Kansas seems to be unable to “note” facts that do not support his opinions.
“Sent to be by a cousin in Indiana. Checked Snopes – found nothing to disprove it.”
Posted by: ksgrm | October 09, 2007 at 01:44 PM
http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/canada.asp
http://message.snopes.com/showthread.php?t=17352&page=1
Posted by: cosmos | October 09, 2007 at 04:09 PM
I am not familiar with Snopes. Is it difficult to use? What I am trying to determine as best I can – if one checked Snopes, would it be likely that one would find nothing?
Cosmos,
Good one with the Snopes link. I noticed the first thing mentioned was about provinces, which is exactly what I posted.
Ksgrm, perhaps learning to use Snopes with ease would be beneficial to you. Those spam emails can kill ya…or the people you forward them on to might.
Steven, I’m not Cosmos, but I’ve discovered that it’s best to use the search option on Snopes. Scrolling through tons of options on tons of folders/headers can take up too much time.
For Ksgrm’s email, using “Canadian Health Care” would probably send you right to it. A little smarts is all you need, just like Google.
Thanks Cosmos, I am not too good with Snopes and did a very quick search because I was in a hurry. Thought it might be a little too convenient.
The links you posted did bear out what the young bus driver I talked to in Canada this summer said. He paid around 42% in taxes. Still think this is entirely to high. Especially when people like JR refuse to work for people who would furnish good insurance for him and is waiting for you and me to buy his insurance with our tax dollars.
What happened to the old work ethic of hard work to take care of you and yours?
For Ksgrm’s email, using “Canadian Health Care” would probably send you right to it. A little smarts is all you need, just like Google.
Posted by: Rox | October 09, 2007 at 05:08 PM
Fortunately for me you had enough smarts for both of us.
“What happened to the old work ethic of hard work to take care of you and yours?
Posted by: ksgrm | October 09, 2007 at 05:09 PM
I think it went out of fashion with taxpayer funded college educations. Like yours.
Employer provided health care worked for a long time. Trouble is, HMO’s and and their CEOs milk the system and raise the cost. Now the littler employers can’t afford it and forget about the individual.
A large pool of government covered folks would force competition into the system and lower prices. The HMO’s would have to improve their coverage.
I thought conservatives thought competition was good? Or is that just individuals at each other’s throats?
farmgrl, long time, no see. In the 40 years I have worked I didn’t draw one dollar in unemployment. Did you? Never sued a former employee. Did you? As for your assertion that the government paid for my education – well the true story is that it was paid out of the pool used for unemployment because at that time there was a large surplus and because Boeing paid a large sum into the fund, businesses were paying at a 1% rate. At the time there was a large Boeing and Raytheon layoff. The 18 hours I went to school didn’t touch the many years I paid into that fund. If that bothers you then I guess you will just stay bothered since you can’t wait to bring it up no matter what the topic. What a small world you must live in.
JR if you think HMO’s will give better coverage under Hillarycare you must be delusional.
Just heard a very interesting news article about how United Insurance will be administered. Personal habits will be taken into account. If you are obese, smoke, drink to excess, don’t control your cholesterol and blood pressure – you will have a high deductible no matter what your income is. This might not be a bad thing. We’ll all be skinny, non drinkers and non smokers and will live forever – or die early – your choice.
FIrst this:
“In the 40 years I have worked I didn’t draw one dollar in unemployment”
then this?
“well the true story is that it was paid out of the pool used for unemployment”
WTF?
And the answer to both your questions is no. But thanks for asking.
Isnt it funny that the two posters here bragging about taking money from the public dole are… conservatives?
hehehehehhehe….
kgrm runs an escort service slash massage parlor without heath insuransce her workers wouldn’t be on the job very long.
Oh the healthcare theme is it? Gonna push your socialized medicine down America’s throat?
We will all gag, but have to wait in line for service. Interesting choice of words s-e-r-v-i-c-e. We don’t get that from the government. We get it their way or the highway. And they are none of them here to help.
I hear you all bitching about the “high cost of health care”. But your solution is to throw the baby out with the water. We are not complaining about service or quality of care. It’s that it cost to much.
Instead of treating the disease, you treat the symptoms.
And asking the government to pay those same high costs is going to be a very costly solution.
Steven Davis,
Like Rox said, using the search option at Snopes is usually best.
Also, Snopes takes time on new items. I think ksgrm’s email was released yesterday — Snopes page on it is dated today, and status is “incomplete”.
Also interesting to Google a phrase, to see how it spreads.
For example “Shirley’s cousin was diagnosed with a heart blockage” had 125 hits, and 1st hit is link to message.snopes.com .
In a few days, it’ll probably have many more hits, mostly to right-wing sites.
Wow Cos I am glad I posted that email even with the disclaimer. This is the first time I have seen you post on anything other that GW. Glad I was able to broaden your horizons.
Farmie just make up your own facts don’t worry about truths – they are just inconvenient (Al G). What about that big lawsuit you had about being fired for your sexual preference? Not true then or not true now. Boy you can sure change facts around.
Cos and Steve D I know it is something when I am wrong. Although I did say I looked in a hurry and Ilooked at the top 25 and also most recent. It wasn’t in either then. Glad this is going on. What would we have been talking about if I hadn’t posted it.
You libs sure know how to keep a conversation going. You wordsmiths you.
Thanks for the info Cosmos and Rox.
Disinformation quickly spreads on the internet.
“Please take the time to read it so you can do whatever youwish….research, verify, etc., but please read it.”
Posted by: ksgrm | October 09, 2007 at 01:44 PM
Cos as a frequent poster surely you Rox and Steven Davis know what ‘research, verify’ means. What about this faux letter scares you so much.
Gotta go. Have fun.
Germie, I think you need to get the taxpayers their money back for your fancy college education.
“Never sued a former employee. Did you?”
No. I’ve never sued a former employee.
Perhaps in YOUR college they didnt know the difference between employee and employer?
And btw, the city of wakeeney and trego county were NEVER my employers. The Trego County Economic Development Board was.
And I did not sue them.
Woof. Read much? Comprehend even less?
I was not making any accusations, grm. Sorry you want to take it that way. I have heard of Snopes, haven’t used it, and hence my interest in more informaiton. The latter is a liberal trait…. :-)
And there is a lot of disinformation on the internet right night about Canadian Health care – probably thanks to conservative reaction to Michael Moore.
Sorry for the typo. My mistake. Personal attacks are cheap and shouldn’t happen even if provoked.
Oh, and btw, the beat goes on in WaKeeney…
http://www.hdnews.net/
So WHEN will the AG’s office issue the results of their “investigation”?
And the WaKeeney taxpayers are footing the bill for the city council and chief of police legal bills?
I’m tellin’ ya, the state just needs to come in and take over the local government here. Corruption abounds.
Heheheheh. And as far as economic development boards and directors go out here…
It would be a good idea for the county commissioners and the city council to remember that if you are having the SAME problems with EVERYBODY…
…maybe the “problem” isnt EVERYBODY? Maybe it’s YOU?
We are all relieved that Steven Davis is an expert on Canadian Health Care.
I’ll sleep better at night now.
-,-
“What about this faux letter scares you so much.”
Nothing. Concerted disinformation campaigns and conservatives who desperately want to believe untruths concerns me. It should concern you more.
Steven D I do feel that national healthcare isn’t the answer. Michael Moores movie had many falsehoods in it. There were some truths and many grabbed hold of these and maligned the entire healthcare/insurance system. This election is very important. Probably the most important we will face in many years to come. I will continue to share articles but will try to do more research before posting.
Am I smelling a foul odor? Wonder what that could be?
DNFTT
Farmgrl I apologize for bringing this up. It had no place on this thread. The very thing I accused you of. Civilized discussions shouldn’t get personal.
Grm,
We all make mistakes when information fits our biases. My biggest one, not all that long ago, was believing that abortions had gone up under GW Bush. The irony of it was too beautiful. Only problem that assertion was not true and based on a faulty sttudy/interpretation and poor sampling technique – abortions continue to trend down during Bush’s time in office.
Kum bah yah…
“What about this faux letter scares you so much.”
Scared? Who says I’m scared? Erroneous and incomplete information is harmful. And just who does that benefit?
If I post something that’s incorrect, I’ll admit it. Glad to see you can do the same, Ksgrm.
BTW, I believed the tale about Bush’s upside-down book, like thousands of others did and some still do. I was told to check Snopes, did and found the answer to how it was done. I took a real close look at the photo of him with the book, and realized it HAD been PhotoShopped.
In the past, I’ve been thoroughly embarrassed after forwarding emails, until I discovered I could check them out. I often will email the person who sent one and (politely & kindly) point them in the right direction.
It does pay to check, and your believability level will be much better. :)
“What about this faux letter scares you so much.”
I’m not scared about it… just annoyed, and tired of the misinformation tactics.
And I agree with Steven’s posts at 6:23 and 6:24 PM, and Rox’s 6:53 post re “scared”.
Don’t go cancelling your health insurance policies any time soon. It ain’t over until it over.
Seems that 47 million people without insurance were asked why. 70% said it was because of the high cost. In other words, they would rather spend their money on something else. Given that half of them making under 60K, that something else is food and basics. But the other half, it’s a choice between too much house, an SUV, or a nice boat. That said, we have maybe, maybe 25 million who truly are uninsured and need help. Well you don’t go changing the entire system for 25 million of 300 million Americans.
The problem is not quality. We do not need government interference bringing the quality of care down either. We need to provide support for those who’s employer does not provide coverage, or does provide, but the family income is at the poverty level. Those we help.
It’s like a boat at sea with three hundred passengers. Twenty-five fall overboard. So you sink the entire ship to save them.
I read this, “For every complex problem there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong.”
H Mencken
Hotdog,
If the problem is not quality, why is U.S. health care rated lower so many other countries that DO have a national health care system?
Sorry…
Should be “rated lower THAN so many…”
Onscreen revising is a no-no.
Quality is not the reason given by the politicians is it.Hillary is pushing the “availability” and “access” to healthcare.
Quality is only job one for private industry. It is not a hallmark of government programs. It will not be the expectation. Availability will be. And restrictions. Possibilities being discussed are YDI Care. That is, if you smoke, you deserve not to get by-pass surgery. Fat, eat at MickeyD’s? High Cholesterol? Drink too much? Or used to drink too much? I could go on. But the quality of care will be based upon some merit system. That will lower quality for all.
No one makes those judgements on my care today. I have great doctors, great care, and an expensive, but quality insurance program through my work. Expensive, but my family is worth it.
Don’t take that away in your zeal to safe the world for 25 million of us.
“We need to provide support for those who’s employer does not provide coverage, or does provide, but the family income is at the poverty level. Those we help.”
Okay, let’s go with this, Hotdog. What are your ideas on this? How will this be accomplished? Emergency room treatment is obviously not working. You are already paying for both the rest of the insured and the uninsured through your premiums. What other options are there for helping those WHOSE employers don’t offer insurance at a cost low enough for some to afford? Or for those who don’t have the income to pay the ungodly price of being insured OR to have anything close to adequate or even the most basic health care?
Anyone want to have some fun?
Just for shitsandgiggles, if nuthin else.
We all attack each other from time to time, most of us actually must enjoy some of that conflict, and we don’t hate each other (Really I don’t think we do, and there are some very intelligent and informative posters here!) though we often, I mean almost always disagree. That tension is why we are here after all or we would simply go to another website where everyone shares the exact same opinion.
I have a proposal. A modest proposal, and here’s what I propose:
1. I propose that all Americans have a set of Common Beliefs or Common Goals if you will, things we can all actually agree on, believe it or not. While there are many goals we do not share, there is a Core Set of Common Beliefs or Common Goals we do share. And those Common Goals are some of the most important goals each of us has in our own lives.
2. Most of our disagreements in America are not about WHAT our Common Goals are, but on HOW we achieve those goals.
So first things first. One step at a time. Can we, do you think it might be possible, for us to agree on a common set of goals? IF we can do that, then maybe we could tackle the next step, which is HOW to achieve those goals.
Why do I care, and why do I think anyone on this blog might care? Because I think we are all united in a common cause of caring about the future of this country, about the future of ourselves, and about the future of our kids or there would be no point in posting all this stuff that we post everyday. I think most of the conflict we have dividing America is not so much on the End goal, as in the How to achieve the End goal.
So to start, I’ll modestly (yeah right Max is modest, oh and humble too) propose a set of Common Goals. Some may propose other goals or propose changes to my initial list, and that’s what I would expect. So here goes, 12 Common Goals to start with:
1. Freedom, we all agree that people should be free. There are no excessive laws and controls on our lives, for every law passed restricts our freedom to some extent.
2. We agree that the rule of Law founded in the Constitution of the US is the foundation for all other laws and controls over our lives.
3. A certain amount of Government is necessary to provide order in our society, to maintain the rule of Law, and to perform a basic role in ensuring the rights of people are protected.
4. We all believe that we should pay our own way in life, that no one should pay for us, that we need to pay our fair share to survive on this planet Earth. There are a few who will require support from others to survive and no one wishes anyone to starve to death, go homeless, due to certain incapacities someone may have.
5. We all desire to own our own homes, land, food, clothing, and other property necessary for life.
6. We all desire to have a good job paying a wage commensurate with our effort and value added and job security. We believe we have a marketable skill to provide value to society.
7. We desire a good education for our children.
8. We desire affordable and available healthcare.
9. We want a clean environment as pollution free as possible.
10. We recognize that our economy requires energy and that we must in the long-term, find an economical, environmentally-friendly, and affordable supply of energy.
11. We recognize there is a finite supply of resources, Earth resources, Human resources, Economic resources, and that we must necessarily make choices and balance our resources in order to meet our needs. And not all of our wants will be satisfied. (Wants and Needs being clearly distinguished). A difficult task then is in allocating scarce resources.
12. The US is a world power with certain responsibility to as JFK said, be a beacon of freedom for the rest of the world. While we cannot be the policemen of the world, we can and should help other nations whenever we can.
IF we can agree on 12 Common Goals, maybe that’s a starting point for those who want to have a constructive discussion. OR, we can all just post our 2 bits, going back and forth, attacking each other personally, having some fun with that and etc….
The problem with your 12 common goals Max, is that you and your kind only want the “free market economy” to control the process.
It is proven that this will not work.
Ok Blaidd Drwg, I stated our disagrements would be on the How, not the What.
Can you or can you not agree to the What – the 12 points?
Man, I was looking for a starting point of common ground an you leap ahead already!
Good list.I think “Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs” sums it up pretty simply. If everyone in every nation had those needs fulfilled, then people could probably exist side by side in peace.
Mybe that is because the right cannot be trusted.
Look at the mess your people have made since January 2001
Max, I’ll play. For a few minutes, at least, until later.
A few questions to to clarify your starting point on the following:
#1 — Define “freedom”. Are you basing this on the freedoms mentioned in the Constitution, or do you have others in mind? And can we accept that the term “men” in that Constitution also means women? :)
Also, you mention that laws take away freedoms, when in fact, some laws grant freedom. But that does go back to the Constitution…
#5 — Does everyone strive to own what you listed?
#11 — Reminds me of my kids when they always said, “It’s not fair!”
#12 — “Help” would be good, as long as it doesn’t involve attacking and invading. I don’t consider that help. IOW, help in the form of educating, for instance.
Next?
Mary, I think you’re right. Having needs meant would help a heck of a lot. It’s more “wants” than “needs” throughout the world that have caused the problems and led to wars. Greed.
(Off to watch an hour of TV…so later!)
How will this be accomplished?
OK, I never said I had the answers. :-) But my opinion on private versus socialist healthcare is as valid as anyone’s. I didn’t see anyone debating the merits of individual pieces of the Hillary Plan.
First off, I would change the Form W2 to include a character for Employee Provided Healthcare.Like they do already for pension plans, 401K, and others. I would record the standard company employee portion of cost.
This lets the government know three things:
1. Does this American have the opportunity to sign up for a family healthcare insurance at work?
2. Based upon the income, can this employee reasonably afford to pay for the basic family coverage?
3. I would then provide all Americans a tax break for healthcare payments. Similiar to home mortgage payments.
At this point, the citizen applies for assistance, like they do foodstamps, free cheese (WIC), or housing assistance. You check the total household income – regardless if married (stop the co-habitating loophole somehow) or civil union. Basically by this, we determine the need.
Now eligibility. At some point, the government is forced to decide for us, as a nanny would, how much of expendable income is needed for healthcare. This is cruicial and painful at the same time. Because it would apply to ALL Americans. Paying any amount over the standard percentage is tax deductible. It would really be critical for senior citizens on fixed income, no employer, and with heavy healthcare needs. This would be similiar to buying a home, what percent of income can you devote to buy a home?
For our purposes, let’s use the 7% of total income vice AGI. Too many tax rules make AGI unfair for comparison/even playing field.
Once any American has receipts/evidence of having already paid the 7% – they are then eligible for consideration.
Now, you have to look at income levels. 7% of a 10,000 income is not the same as a 100,000 income. The former has no more to spend. The later can spend more.
So the last test is a means test which excludes anyone who has a household income/ability to pay at or near the poverty level. This is a very detailed review of the lifestyle of the applicant. What are your assets (hidden or otherwise)? Too big a house? Too much debt? Too many toys or cars?This is the ultimate in big brother and nanny care. But it will happen one way or another with socialized medicine anyway.For retirees – this includes all their investments, trusts for children, and transaction analysis over preceding five years (they do that today for nursing care).
You only qualify if you are in need. You are only in need if you are wisely spending your money.
This is a handout program afterall. Beggars should not be deciding what questions they will ask. They want the free care, they will provide the info..
Establish a mandatory COPAY. This discourages unnecessary trips. Emergency room COPAY is much higher. All kids coverage ends at 18. K12 only.
Child birth. For each additional child a woman in poverty births, I would reduce all welfare benefits to include pregnancy and delivery costs. The costs for having children are paid as a loan from the government. Mother has to pay it back.
Constitutional Time: Get it going in the states. Babies of illegals are illegal.
This is just an off-the-cuff attempt. No research or time allowed to investigate and come up with the best plan.
I don’t mind paying taxes to help the truly needy for healthcare. Just don’t spoil it for the 92% who do have coverage available.
“Child birth. For each additional child a woman in poverty births, I would reduce all welfare benefits to include pregnancy and delivery costs. The costs for having children are paid as a loan from the government. Mother has to pay it back.”Posted by: Hotdog1
I can go along with most of this. I think some of it is already being done but I will have to do a little research.
However, Child Birth threw me for a loop. It takes two to tango and you have suggested penalizing the mother only.
However, Child Birth threw me for a loop. It takes two to tango and you have suggested penalizing the mother only.
Posted by: hud
We have not been very successful at “penalizing” the males. However, women have become VERY successful of taking them to court and courts are very supportive. Easier for mother to be detective than the taxpayer.
(plus it was a quicky writing.)
Thanks Rox, I’ll try to answer:
#1 — Define “freedom”. Are you basing this on the freedoms mentioned in the Constitution, or do you have others in mind? And can we accept that the term “men” in that Constitution also means women? :)
**Yes Freedom as defined by the Constitution.
Also, you mention that laws take away freedoms, when in fact, some laws grant freedom. But that does go back to the Constitution…
**In General terms, any law necessarily restricts some behavior, and thus some element of freedom.
#5 — Does everyone strive to own what you listed?
**Own? I’m not hoping anyone signs a contract! I’m hoping to define some Common Ground to use as a base for moving forward! Or we can just attack each other constantly and there is some fun to that, though we don’t really accomplish any learning from throwing stones back and forth.
#11 — Reminds me of my kids when they always said, “It’s not fair!”
**Yup. You can’t always have what you want, but you get what you need!
#12 — “Help” would be good, as long as it doesn’t involve attacking and invading. I don’t consider that help. IOW, help in the form of educating, for instance.
**Help yes needs to be defined. Though to some great extent, much American blood has defined this. WWII for example.
Next?
**Your call!
Max,
Not a bad plan. I think I can go along with 11 of your points – and that says a lot for a libertarian leaning conservative.
But your last on helping the world, I disagree with. It tends to get us into trouble and certainly affects our pocket book in the form of billions of dollars in military and other aide.
But, I can reserve my position on that one and agree in order to promote “your constructive discussion”.
Mybe that is because the right cannot be trusted.
Look at the mess your people have made since January 2001
Posted by: Blaidd_Drwg | October 09, 2007 at 09:00 PM
Ya know Blaidd Drwg, I think of us as all being Americans, with similar Common Goals. That’s why I posted that long dang post, to try to confirm this.
Many of us disagree as to How to achieve the Common Goals. We all have different starting points in life, some better, some worse.
Growing up in a family of six, the only time I thought we might be poor and living in a small house was when someone was in the 1 bathroom we had, and I had to go!
I had a roof, food, and clothes. That’s all I was told to expect.
Nowadays, people expect or even demand, much more.
Kids moving out at age 18 going to college or not, expect to continue the same standard of living their parents worked 40 or 50 years to achieve, without working for it.
I didn’t have that expectation and I tried to drill that expectation of hard work to ahieve your goals, into my kids as well.
If you want to label me as some evil conservative BD, go ahead.
Thanks Hotdog, not a busy night tonight or not much interest in the topic.
Maybe I’ll try again some other time.
Common Ground, I truly think there is some. Maybe someone else can find it.
Max, I would love to weigh in… your 12 points are worthy of discussion… But, I have had it up to my eyeballs with paper work today, and need to take a breather… So —
Good night; Good luck; and God Bless; whatever you conceive God to be!!
Blessings all!!
12 points of agreement offered from the ivory tower of the haves?
Thanks. No. I’ve learned not to trust you people.
“You People”. I wouldn’t expect you to trust the people of America JR.
No problem. Just keep blowing smoke.
Hotdog,
I need to go and read more closely what you answered, and I will later.
If we went to a flat tax or a fair tax, how would the IRS suggestion you made work?
And I have to agree with hud. Putting all the blame for childbirth on all women is wrong. While it’s true that some abuse the system we now have, the changes made during Clinton’s terms have gone a long way to help stop those abusers. Not that we don’t have a way to go yet.
You got yours Max. And you don’t give a damn about anything but that.
Your call for truce is only out of fear of people who know that you and only you is what you care about.
JR,
Let’s give Max a break. I don’t sense any smoke blowing. If there is, I’ll be the first to cry foul. Right after you, of course. :)
Is there any reason why we can’t reasonably discuss what Max has outlined? Isn’t finding one small spot where we can all agree a first step in working things out? Common ground? Maybe I live in a fantasy world, but I believe if we could ALL use the power of discourse, not insulting, & compromise we might get somewhere and solve something. Anything.
Isn’t that what we’d like to see happen in Iraq? Lay down the arms and start talking? If we can’t do that here, how can we ever expect those in power to ever do it?
A journey of a thousand miles…
I admire your spirit Rox.
And I do respect your opinion.
You must not have read many of Max’s posts though.
I am well familiar with his concept of “common ground”. I’ve spent my whole life fighting folks like him. He doesn’t have anything to share with me that I want any part of.
If we went to a flat tax or a fair tax, how would the IRS suggestion you made work?Posted by: Rox
I’m pleasantly taken aback by your question. I’ll vote for any candidate tomorrow who can make a flat tax, consumption tax, or anything that puts the IRS and it’s literal mountain of code books out of work.
Again, this wasn’t a work of art. There is still a need for a very small percentage of Americans. If we paid a flat tax, without benefit of any deductions, the new and wonderful 1040 would look like this for ALL Americans:
Total Income: XFlat Tax percentage: Y
Total Tax (income x times flat tax):
It appears there is no line for any deductions of any sort. (There is also no line for the UNearned Income Tax deduction.)
So it appears to me there is no medical costs deduction. Or any other for that matter.
Therefore, you question or qualifying question is not relevant to the discussion.. It will never happen in America.
Oh I have wet dreams that it would, but it won’t. Liberals would loose a large bulk of their baseline support. The appeal to the poor and anyone who feels “victimized” by the system would no longer have an advocate.
So you will have to cross that bridge with socialize medicine and the flat tax – along with all other entitlement programs, when America gets there.
And we will get there. Just wait until 77 million Americans retire and DEMAND the benefits.
When one fourth of America is enjoying retirement, that is to emphasize 1 in every 4 is a retired babyboomer – all equations will change.
The majority will be smart, understand finances, have investments in the stock market (mutual funds via 401x plans), you will see a whole new world driven by their needs.
G’night.
Is there any reason why we can’t reasonably discuss what Max has outlined? Rox
Well yes, there is Rox. If you agree to attempt to find compromise, or common ground, then you take away J R’s entire reason for posting on this blog.
He thirsts to bad-mouth, disagree, and cause hate.
If you try to find common ground, he has no reason for being. He is no longer of interest to you.
The only thing he will reach out for is a weapon to attack.
Max, in his way, tossed out a method of bringing Americans together. This runs counter to the two-party adversary system our leaders thrive on.
You are either a Chiefs Fan or a Bronco fan – and it is critically important the two don’t realize any common ground which runs counter to the goals of either.
Think for yourself. Not J R …
well, assy, farty, pissy, crapy.
JR, I’ve read all of Max’s posts. Okay, truthfully, I’ve scrolled by a few lengthy copy & pastes. :grin:
Yes, I’m hopeless. Always willing to give someone another chance. When will I learn, huh?
I don’t blame you if you don’t want to participate. That is, of course, your choice. But can I? Can others? Real participation, not throwing rocks at each other.
Hey, it might be nice for a change. :)
Pardon me “hotdog”?
Just where did I tell Rox how to think?
I told her that I meaning ME in the FIRST PERSON do not trust such as Max.
I went through what Max laid out. It’s like I said.
His position is “I’ve got mine. How can I placate you into having less than me?”
Sorry, Hotdog, I tend to be a “what if” person sometimes.
So, as a self-employed taxpayer, I can’t deduct my business expenses? Damn, I AM poor.
Have at it Rox. DO mind when he attacks me. Just as you should pay attention when I go after him.
You cannot trust these folks Rox. That is my take.
Hotdog,
I’m a Cowboys fan. ;) Saw the Chiefs play the Broncos a couple of times though. (Yes, live and in person, back when Montana was QB.) Chiefs won. :grin:
I agree that the two-party system is the way they want it. I believe it was originally conceived to be that way by our Founding Fathers. Unfortunately, that’s the nature of the human beast. I don’t think the FF thought it would be a detriment. Or maybe they did. I don’t read dead minds, nor do I channel dead people. :)
You wanna play really fair with politics? Set up the government to have a split & equal congress. Instead of a President and VP, have 2 presidents, one of each party. Either nothing would ever get done, or they would learn to compromise.
Maybe I’ve been a parent of too many…
JR,
Nobody said you and he or the libs and cons need to love each other. But if we all continue to be enemies, we stalemate. No one wins. We all lose.
Perhaps Max is trying to set us up so he can shoot us all down. If that’s so, then he’s setting himself up, too.
I’d like to set aside my biases (yes, I have plenty!) and see what happens. If you don’t want to play, that’s okay. If I’m the only one who does, well, it’s gonna get REAL boring and definitely won’t last.
Rox
You know me as passionate, relentless, and fair.
I think.
I’m gonna be the first to lay into the buffet of crap he laid out.Let’s see if he can defend it. Most likely I’ll find what he’s REALLY after.
Oh and wanting an end to the hate? I want it too. I reach out to those folks whenever I can.I’ve just been burned to many times to trust them.
JR,
I understand burned.
I’d like you back in my email Rox. Steven has it. I’ve got a new one and I don’t share it here anymore.
Email away, JR, if you still have mine. Just don’t use it to feed the trolls. LOL
Or I can check with Steven, if I can dig up his.
Rox,
Please read what Washington had to say about the two party system. It is still relevant today. It was so near and dear to him, that he made mention of it in his farewell address, despite knowing his disagreeing view with Jefferson:
“I have already intimated to you the danger of parties in the state, with particular reference to the founding of them on geographical discriminations. Let me now take a more comprehensive view, and warn you in the most solemn manner against the baneful effects of the spirit of party generally.
This spirit, unfortunately, is inseparable from our nature, having its root in the strongest passions of the human mind. It exists under different shapes in all governments, more or less stifled, controlled, or repressed; but in those of the popular form it is seen in its greatest rankness and is truly their worst enemy.”
There is more in his farewell address available anywhere on line. There are those who favor party over neighbor even today. There is no limit to what they will do to keep the people apart and obedient to one of the two. Not to be overly dramatic, but there are even those on this blog pressuring you to toe the line.
I’m gonna be the first to lay into the buffet of crap he laid out.Posted by: J R |
In other words: No regulars should post until after J R does.
Have at it Rox. DO mind when he attacks me.
Posted by: J R
J R gives permission for one of his underlings to post. But provides specific instructions on what to post and how to conduct themselves.
I’d like you back in my email Rox.Posted by: J R
Here we have J R solidifying his control over anyone who dares to post on the WEBLOG. At the very least, it demonstrates the liberals control over the internet. One they dream about over the radio waves.
No one dare speak without the BLOG CONTROL authorities approval.
Go J R.
Ya know what I do “hotdog”
I say what I mean.
If you want to implicate me then have the balls to do so. Otherwise keep your insinuations to yourself.
Rox, I lost all my contacts.I’ll get my email to you though.
Ok THAT’s telling.
Anyone want to know what I don’t do?
I don’t wear multiple nics.
And I sure as hell do not tell anyone how to think.
Ya know what I do “hotdog”Rox, I lost all my contacts.I’ll get my email to you though.
Posted by: J R
And here we have the dastardly J R threaten another poster who DARES to disagree with his control and party line. Ewwwwwwwww. Scarey. He is saving the world. Somehow, without typo’s tonight.
Someone gave their fearless leader a spell checker. Must have kept him busy for HOURS!! ;-)
PH is always watching you. And you KNOW what I do too.
Oh this could be interesting.
Whoever you are you do not know who you are fooling with.
I’ll be pleased to make a fool fo you for as long as you like.
I’ve done it before.
JR,
I just sent an email to Steven to get yours.
He’ll get it to you Rox.
Thanks for trusting me amidst the noise.
Geez do ya think they missed me?
Sorry, troll, but I can think for myself. If you need me to think for YOU, I can pencil you in.
Hotdog,
Gee, me and George Washington. Who da thunk it?
Nobody makes me toe the line, darlin’. Been there, done that, blew it all to hell and back.
Whoever you are you do not know who you are fooling with.
J R, the 1967 spelling bee champ, makes another nasty remark to another poster. One who dares to disagree with his authority. (Really serious this time)
Without a day time job, and with all his ego tied up on the WEBLOG, these are fightin words to the HS dropout J R..
A real challenge to his one upmanship abilities. So he tells the poster how tough he is.
Has his liberal crew shaking in their feet and bowing down to his every demand.
But has me laughing my asssss off.
For the second post in a row, Junior Barns (aka J R) has posted without a spelling error.
And he will soon blink his eyes and transition to another time via the space warp, and the next Monday night episode of Hero’s.
Because he is mine.
Sorry, troll, but I can think for myself. If you need me to think for YOU, I can pencil you in.
Posted by: Rox | October 09, 2007 at 11:53 PM
And Rox demonstrates J R’s control over her posts. She immediately tows the line and shows the utmost respect for her senior. Her individualism is already gone.
Hi “Pat Herron”
I truly hope I am not the cause of your presence here.
JR, how could they not? LOL
If you are still there Rox, I am real sorry about all this.
Hotdog,
Gee, me and George Washington. Who da thunk it?
Nobody makes me toe the line, darlin’. Been there, done that, blew it all to hell and back.
Posted by: Rox
And now the circle is completed. J R speaks, the secondary poster Rox reacts to not just me but to any poster contrary to J R’s views. Already fogged from the truth and ability to use free will and post friendly to other posters.
Pat Herron Strikes again (sorry Max, Hotdog, and Kansas).
Another controlled blog revealed.
MY individualism is gone?
……………………
Just how many individuals are living inside your brain?
Troll, you brought my name into the conversation.
Those who feel the need to belittle others are really the little ones.
No one posts second to me.
Hell I’ve been gone 7 months. It’s only because a friend wanted me here that I am here.
I guess I mind controlled the left huh Pat?
Why don’t you just tell me what you want? Maybe I can help.
And now, J R has ended all discussions on this thread. No one left but his minions. No one with an opposing view or venturing forward with fresh ideas.
Time to call it a wrap. Allow grace period for final briefing by J R to it’s crew. A little brown nosing each way up the chain.
No one else left to speak. No alternative views. It’s what it wants. (sigh)
On to other blogs. Unemployed come in next shift. Will they last until 1000 tomorrow?
Jealous, troll?
Ended discussion?
Pat I’m your only topic.
What would you like to talk about?
PH is always watching you. And you KNOW what I do too.
Posted by: Blue Blog Control | October 09, 2007 at 11:43 PM
Obsess much Pat?
I shudder to think what PH does.
Don’t get any on ya, Pat. ;)
I was wondering on that too Rox.
I DON’t know what she does.
Except follow me about.
The guy in me wonders about her “YOU ARE MINE!” bit.
I was thinking she’d go all territorial.
Sorry laughing here….
It’s good to end the day with a laugh. I’m off to catch some sleep. I’ll catch you in email, maybe tomorrow.
Hey you punk white trash people !!! I’m illegal and am staying right here as I am America. if you don’t like it go to hell crackers
Hey Carlos,You’re welcome here. After all, we need somebody to clean toilets.