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Open thread 10/06
- By Phillip Brownlee
- Posted Oct. 6, 2007 at 1:05 a.m.
- Filed under Open thread
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127 Comments
SOB,
Thank you for the Steve Huntley link on Fridays ‘open’ thread, that helps prove our media is dysfunctional.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/huntley/589551,CST-EDT-HUNT05.article
Huntley admits that he is a “layman” who does not understand climate science.
Huntley writes about Avery’s “Every 1,500 Years” — but Huntley does not understand that Dansgaard-Oeschger events were NOT global warming… and do NOT refute recent human-caused global warming.
‘Unstoppable Hot Air’http://tamino.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/unstoppable-hot-air/
‘Avery and Singer: Unstoppable hot air’http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/11/avery-and-singer-unstoppable-hot-air
Huntley also repeats the completely false claim that Gore said sea levels would rise 20 feet by 2099. Gore only said “if”, with no time given (also page 190 of his book).
And Gore’s claims were accurate.
‘Myths and falsehoods about global warming’http://mediamatters.org/items/200703230007
‘Broad Irony’http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2007/03/broad-irony/
Bottom line: the Heartland Institute, a libertarian think tank, is spending $1.2 million to spread falsehoods about Gore’s claims. And Steve Huntley helped them.
Don’t forget Woofstock today!
I’ll be there with Samson the wonder dog. Come over and say hi.
It’s for a good cause!
Hank
Hope you don’t have a “ruff” time there Hank!
Hey Max,Here’s a bone for ya. Let’s see some spittle.
The controversy about Blackwater USA’s role in a September 16 shooting, and broader questions about the role and oversight of private security firms operating in Iraq, are becoming fodder for political attacks among 2008 presidential candidates.
Former Sen. John Edwards jumped first at the connection — loose though it may be — between the Blackwater firm and a top adviser to Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton.http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2007/10/05/blackwater_ties_fodder_for_pol.html?hpid=sec-politics
Iraq’s armed groups form alliance
By Ahmed Janabi
Analysts say that unified armed groups could have the resources to attempt to gain control
of towns and villages [AP]
Several nationalist and Islamist armed groups have formed alliances in Iraq in what they say is a move to thwart a power struggle should the US military withdraw and the Iraqi government collapse.
In July, groups including the The Islamic Army, The Army of Mujahidin, The Supporters of Sunni, and the Salafist group for Missionary Action and Fighting, got together to form the Reform and Jihad movement.
This was followed in September by the Change and Reform Front, comprised of eight groups, including The 1920 Revolution Brigades and the Mohammed al-Fatih Brigades. The latter groups include senior members of the former Iraqi Army and Saddam Hussein’s elite Republican Guards.
Fadil al-Rubaie, a member of the National Alliance, an Iraqi opposition movement in exile, believes that the unification of Iraq’s “resistance groups” indicates a turning point after previous refusals by the Islamist groups to merge with nationalists.
“Resistance groups are gearing up to meet that stage, where leading parties will be needed to lead and to prevent a potential militia war among many small groups,” he said.
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/4565633F-9691-44A8-B14E-F3D1F97C6414.htm—–
The controversy over what Rush Limbaugh meant when he uttered the phrase “phony soldiers” last week isn’t just another broadcast sideshow. As the political power of conservatism declines, the symbolic authority of figures such as Limbaugh is likewise shrinking. That is why he backs away from his own words, rips them from context by selectively editing his program’s transcript, and insists he didn’t demean soldiers and veterans who dissent from the Bush White House war policy — as he and his fellow partisans have done so many times before.http://news.yahoo.com/s/uc/20071004/cm_uc_crjcox/op_454003
Why do Rush and his followers hate our troops?
Richard Roberts is accused of illegal involvement in a local political campaign and lavish spending at donors’ expense, including numerous home remodeling projects, use of the university jet for his daughter’s senior trip to the Bahamas, and a red Mercedes convertible and a Lexus SUV for his wife, Lindsay.http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/O/ORAL_ROBERTS_SCANDAL?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2007-10-05-14-30-33
Roberts has been taking lessons from republicans in Congress.
No, I think the Republicans in congress learned from his father….Richard is only carrying on a long family tradition.
I have read it more then once and it is sound advise for the most part. “ It is not important what we are saying as much as it is important what they are saying”. It also has to do with the question “Why should we care what the world thinks of us?”.Here are quotes from the blog on Al Jazeera English. So far there seem a majority from India and Great Britain and those are far more damming then the ones from the Middle Eastern countries.
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/E9A36960-AB5A-43E7-A637-4628328249EB.htm?choice=3&dgDiscID=187&dgPoolID=c56b0707-9774-4524-86fb-55e9d30fa60b
‘The broad mass of the nation will more easily fall victim to a big lie than to a small one’ Adolph Hitler Mein Kampf 1925.
We live in the a scared world where the world leaders are afraid to speak the truth. Have we all forgotten that the Americans have more than 20,ooo nuclear bombs and that the US was the first country to use it on innocent civilians? Have you forgotten that Americans use biological weapons on civilians? If any country has the right to go to war because of nuclear facilities, then the whole world should go to war with the Americans or ask them what are they using the nuclear bombs for. And I bet you all, there will be peace. culture, Telford, United Kingdom
Mr Ahmadinejad’s speech was robust, honest, and precise. Over all, the speech was eloquent. For the first time, an Islamic leader had the courage to tell the truth about Zionists and Zionism in Palestine. It is true that Pogrom or Holocaust has nothing to do with Arabs. Strangely enough, when Zionists in Europe said we were going home, no one asked the question Is Europe not your home for the last 1800 years? When they ethnically cleansed Palestine, normal Jews did not say: How dare you, we were victims of ethnic cleansing. Despite the Zionists massive propaganda, the West is beginning to see the truth about Zionism. It is a movement fouler than all the past isms of Europe put together. If not contained, it will make nations fight. It is already happening and is on the rise. Zionists are powerful. They will try every trick under the sun including a small nuclear detonation in America to force the USA to attack Iran. Iran and other countries including Russia and China must join hands to prevent WW3. Syed, Worcester, United Kingdom
The world must prepare for war against the US and Israel. The US is the mother of all terror, and Iran should pull out of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. The creation of Israel in Palestine is illegal and not based on the will of the Palestinians. Israel is a terrorist state supported by the Zionist-controlled US with arms and money. They are responsible for the Palestinian holocaust. During World War II, over 50 million people were killed, including around 25 million Russians. But Zionists indoctrinate people with the disputed figure of 6 million European Jews. Propagandists argue that millions of European Jews were taken to concentration camps to be gassed. But the German army was a killing machine and they shot on sight. Why did they have to go through the expense of building gas chambers and sending millions to camps to be gassed instead of manufacturing weapons? Just to give the propagandists something to build their propaganda on? How did they kill the other 45 million? Shilpa Brother, Bombay, India
Open Mind, please understand there is no hate spewed against America here. What you must understand is that we are objecting to the actions that America is undertaking in the Middle East. It is not as your media portrays it. People are just objecting to your administration finally coming out and blatantly treating it as their personal fiefdom. Would you not object if the roles were reversed? rainmaker, , India
Surfdog1958USA, yes you are misreading me. Not everything they say about the shah’s era is entirely true. I was an active student at the time. I don’t seem to have lost an arm or even a finger nail. But, the point is that you like your government seem to be disregarding the sanctity of the sovereignty of a nation. Your government is drumming on about the war while the US people seem to have made their business to criticise everything Iranian on earth. Surely, it must be every nation’s prerogative to choose their own laws and live by it without interference from another nation. Open Mind Brooklyn asks: will we live under Sharia law. Well we do and until it is law we have to obey it. As you would do. It is up to the people of Iran to seek a change. Tizab, Tehran, Iran
The real concern is the fact that GW and BUSHCO willfully and knowingly lied about Iraq so how is it that Hillary has the hard facts that did not exist with Iraq about Iran. The worldwide community is no more ready to support invading Iran than Iraq. According to radio and European intelligence news Iran is not and cannot development nuclear weapons for the technology is far more complex than we know. What is it about american presidents that make them feel attacking other nations proves them to be presidential? makes them tough?
Between Blackwater Inc. and our troops there are approximately 260,000 military types on the taxpayer payroll bestowing destruction in the mideast. The USA military advised against going into Iraq in the first place for all of the reasons making headlines. ( http://antiwar.com/ a mainstream media source)
===============“The Terror Dream: Fear and Fantasy in Post-9/11 America”http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/04/1355237
==============Seymour Hersh: White House Intensifying Plans to Attack Iranhttp://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/02/1438251
Why Vote Kucinich Is a Smart Vote:
Progressives Should Vote Kucinich
Dennis Kucinich is the one candidate for President whose vision, eloquence and commitments on the issues can lead us to rise to and surmount the worldwide …
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20040301/dugger – 33k – Cached – Similar pages
Vote Kucinich! Vote Kucinich!
http://www.dennis4president.com/go/issues/
http://www.vote-usa.org/Intro.aspx?Id=OHKucinichDennisJ
Draft Kucinich
http://www.draftkucinich2008.com/
Yes! Vote Kucinich.
I just got through watching C-Span and they had the author Bjorn Lomborg. He was considered one of the 100 most influential people by Time Magazine.
He did an excellent presentation on how to go about dealing with the world’s problems and of Global Warming. I know he is hated by the Gorites, but Lomborg was dead on right about what needs to be in the discussion about Climate Change.
I would suggest to Cosmos and other Gorites to watch or read his work.
I’ve asked before and I’ll ask again.
If Kucinich is elected President,(hold on have to get myself in check, I can never seem to type and think that without being overcome by the giggles)
Will I have to pay for my own prayer rug or will the Guvment. How about the burkahs for my wife and mother?
Will Hillary start her own line of burkahs? Maybe open up a chain of stores. I can picture it now, she’ll have “Tehran Twofer Tuesdays” buy one burkah get the other FREE.
What a beautiful world it will be. I wonder if it will be ESPN who carries the beheadings or if that will fall into the news categories and CNN will pick them up. Won’t it be great to see Jane Fonda dancing around and laughing and giggleing again as christians and homosexuals are beheaded each day. I wonder who’ll take care of Rosie O’Donnels animals once shes beheaded.
Yep, should just be a truly fantastic peaceful world. So all the Jews will be gone, thats good right?
So the nuclear fallout in the Middle East might take a few years to decipate, thats good right?
Last update – 15:59 05/10/2007
Ahmadinejad calls Israel ‘insult to human dignity’ on Al-Quds Day
By The Associated Press
Millions of Iranians attended nationwide rallies Friday in support of the Palestinians, while the country’s hard-line President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said Israel’s continued existence was an insult to human dignity.
“The creation, continued existence and unlimited (Western) support for this regime is an insult to human dignity,” Ahmadinejad said. “The occupation of Palestine is not limited to one land. The Zionist issue is now a global issue.”
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/909877.html
So the nuclear fallout in the Middle East might take a few years to decipate, thats good right?
Uh Gene? The only entity in the mideast with nukes is Israel.
Oh and if you are implying that a Kucinich administration would get us beyond making foreign policy with religious nonsense as a foundation? All the more reason I support him. If the Jews are God’s chosen people, let God take care of them.
Published on Friday, October 5, 2007 by the Seattle Post-IntelligencerThe Democrats Who Enable Bushby Helen ThomasPresident Bush has no better friends than the spineless Democratic congressional leadership and the party’s leading presidential candidates when it comes to his failing Iraq policy.
Those Democrats seem to have forgotten that the American people want U.S. troops out of Iraq, especially since Bush still cannot give a credible reason for attacking Iraq after nearly five years of war.
Last week at a debate in Hanover, N.H., the leading Democratic presidential candidates sang from the same songbook: Sens. Hillary Clinton of New York, and Barack Obama of Illinois and former North Carolina Sen. John Edwards refused to promise to withdraw U.S. troops from Iraq by 2013, at the end of the first term of their hypothetical presidencies. Can you believe it?
When the question was put to Clinton, she reverted to her usual cautious equivocation, saying: “It is very difficult to know what we’re going to be inheriting.”
Obama dodged, too: “I think it would be irresponsible” to say what he would do as president.
Edwards, on whom hopes were riding to show some independence, replied to the question: “I cannot make that commitment.”
They have left the voters little choice with those answers.
Some supporters were outraged at the obfuscation by the Democratic front-runners.
On the other hand, New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, and Sen. Joe Biden, D-Del., are more definitive in their calls for quick troop withdrawals.
But Biden wants to break up Iraq into three provinces along religious and ethnic lines. In other words, Balkanize Iraq.
To have major Democratic backing to stay the course in Iraq added up to good news for Bush.
Now comes a surprising Clinton fan.
President Bush told Bill Sammon — Washington Examiner correspondent and author of a new book titled “The Evangelical President” — that Clinton will beat Obama for the Democratic presidential nomination because she is a “formidable candidate” and better known.
Sammon says Bush revealed that he has been sending messages to Clinton to urge her to “maintain some political wiggle room in your campaign rhetoric about Iraq.”
The author said Bush contends that whoever inherits the White House will be faced with a potential vacuum in Iraq and “will begin to understand the need to continue to support the young democracy.”
Bush ought to know about campaign rhetoric. Remember how he ridiculed “nation building” in the 2000 presidential campaign? Now he claims he is trying to spread democracy throughout the Middle East.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is another Democratic leader who has empowered Bush’s war.
Pelosi removed a provision from the most recent war-funding bill that would have required Bush to seek the permission of Congress before launching any attack on Iran. Her spokesman gave the lame excuse that she didn’t like the wording of the provision. More likely, she bowed to political pressure.
Is it any wonder the Democrats are faring lower than the president in a Washington Post ABC approval poll? Bush came in at 33 percent and Congress at 29 percent.
Members of Congress seem to have forgotten their constitutional prerogative to declare war; World War II was the last time Congress formally declared war.
Presidents have found other ways to make end runs around the law, mainly by obtaining congressional authorization “to do whatever is necessary” in a crisis involving use of the military. That’s the way we got into the Vietnam and Iraq wars.
So what are the leading Democratic White House hopefuls offering? It seems nothing but more war. So where do the voters go who are sick of the Iraqi debacle?
Helen Thomas is a columnist for Hearst Newspapers. E-mail: helent@hearstdc.com.
Copyright 2007 Hearst Newspapers
So the nuclear fallout in the Middle East might take a few years to decipate, thats good right?
Posted by: Gene Raston | October 06, 2007 at 10:01 AM
Gene,I think I read someplace that the newer tactical nukes only take 3-4 months for the radioactivity to dissipate.
If there’s a nuclear exchange in the Mideast, I hope our troops aren’t caught in the middle of it. I’m a little surprised that we haven’t seen a nuke, dirty bomb or a chemical or biological weapon hasn’t been used yet (discounting all the depleted uranium of course).
Today is German-American Day. It’s also Get Organized Week, Eat Country Ham Month, Car Care Month and Dental Hygiene Month.
http://atlanticreview.org/archives/865-Celebrating-German-American-Day.html
Today is ALSO, as Hank pointed out, Woofstock day.
It’s at Sedgwick county park. A benefit for the Kansas Humane society. They want to build a sheltler big enough that no adoptable animal ever need be put to sleep. It’s only $3 I’m headed out that way myself in a bit.
What? No comments about this?
PARK CITY, Kansas, Oct. 5, 2007 – A potential buyer has backed out of buying Wild West World Amusement Park. Now, the most likely scenario is for everything in the park to be liquidated.
Just about anyone could see that one coming Rox. A fun parked themed on Hee Haw and hosting the high priest of hate never had a chance.
Today is also the day that KU is going to kick some Wildcat butt.
Mey Max,
Some more of the bone XXX offered:
“Clinton was assailed by Democratic rival John Edwards, who charged that her campaign strategist Mark Penn’s public relations firm, Burson-Marsteller, represented Blackwater USA, the security firm accused of killing Iraqi civilians.
“In Iowa, Edwards likened Penn to President George W. Bush’s former political adviser, Karl Rove, and suggested a Clinton presidency would not bring the sort of change needed in Washington.”
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071006/pl_nm/usa_politics_dc_3;_ylt=AqyUWB0TFRpW0NO7NyD3h9dlM3wV
Who needs SCHIPS? Just spend your money on video games.
“SAN FRANCISCO — Microsoft Corp. (MSFT) said on Thursday that its “Halo 3″ video game racked up worldwide sales of $300 million in its first week, making it one of the year’s best sellers and helping to more than double sales of its Xbox 360 console.
The news builds on Microsoft’s previous announcement that the final chapter in its series of alien-battling shooting games did $170 million in sales in the first 24 hours after its September 25 debut.”
Say XXX you against Hillary now too!?! Say XXX, you got nothin!
Interesting that Edwards is questioning this Blackwater/Hillary connection.
Maybe that’s to detract from Edwards New Orleans foreclosure connections.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118728685546999884.html
Edwards, Foreclosure Critic, Has Investing Tie to Subprime Lenders
By Christopher Cooper
As a presidential candidate, Democrat John Edwards has regularly attacked subprime lenders, particularly those that have filed foreclosure suits against victims of Hurricane Katrina. But as an investor, Mr. Edwards has ties to lenders foreclosing on Katrina victims.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=12881916
Edwards’ Ties to Mortgage Company Scrutinizedby Peter Overby
All Things Considered, August 17, 2007 · Democratic presidential candidate John Edwards has a big stake in a company that has been foreclosing on mortgages in New Orleans, not far from where he announced his candidacy as a champion of the poor against corporate greed.
Whatever happened to those socially responsible mutual fund packages? Maybe the better question is, did they ever exist? The one I have some money in will buy into Tobacco companies if they think need to. That does not sound real socially reponsible to me.
Hillary Clinton: Still socialist after all these yearsBy Deroy MurdockSaturday, October 6, 2007
NEW YORK — With her intimidating lead in the polls, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton’s presidential juggernaut looks increasingly unstoppable. This may have emboldened the New York Democrat to stop masquerading as a moderate and instead flaunt her full-throated, left-wing radicalism.
“I like the idea of giving every baby born in America a $5,000 account that will grow over time, so that when that young person turns 18, if they (sic) have finished high school, they will be able to access it to go to college or maybe they will be able to make that down payment on their first home.”
Given roughly 4 million annual births, Clinton’s proposal would cost taxpayers some $20 billion each year.
Clinton’s SCHIP reform also would air-raid cash on Americans as if from B-52s. While senators extended the State Children’s Health Insurance Program to families of four earning thrice the poverty line ($61,950), she advocated a scandalous $82,600.
It now transpires that an SCHIP concept was among Clinton’s fallbacks if “HillaryCare” crashed, which it stunningly did. Tuesday’s Politico.com revealed a 1993 memo in which White House staffers outlined “Kids First.”
“This proposal phases in universal coverage,” the draft states. “Under this approach, health-care reform is phased in by population, beginning with children.”
Clinton’s spend-o-rama accelerated with her latest government-medicine scheme unveiled Sept. 17. This mandate-rich program would cost taxpayers $110 billion annually.
Indeed, the National Taxpayers Union reports that during the 109th Congress, Clinton proposed $170.8 billion in net expenditure hikes. She is the Senate’s seventh-biggest spender, far behind outlay champ Ted Kennedy, D-Mass., at $813.7 billion, but comfortably ahead of gravy boats like Barbara Boxer, D-Calif., at $152.6 billion, and Democratic leader Harry Reid, of Nevada, at $119.2 billion.
http://www.venturacountystar.com/news/2007/oct/06/hillary-clinton-still-socialist-after-all-these/
What prompted the above question, was Max’s story on Edwards. Could Edwards put his money anywhere today that would be above suspicion?
Clinton Iranian Ties?
http://www.atlanticfreepress.com/content/view/2552/81/
T-bills.
Clinton is all talk on finance reform
By DICK POLMAN
First published: Friday, October 5, 2007
Hillary Rodham Clinton is trying to sell herself as a reformer, a new broom that will sweep away the traditional Washington chicanery. Yet her response to a fundraising scandal in her own shop is classic old-school politics, and her determination to run a fully privatized presidential race is the antithesis of reform.Consider the case of Norman Hsu, the onetime fugitive and confessed crook who raised $850,000 for Clinton’s campaign, and who now stands freshly accused of mail fraud, wire fraud and violation of campaign finance laws. He was a “bundler,” one of the freelance players who tap people for donations, then bundle them for delivery to a money-hungry presidential candidate. He was an unusually notorious bundler, but, in the end, he was merely a symptom of a money race that has spun out of control.
When Clinton was asked about Hsu recently, she said this: “Well, I’m very much in favor of public financing, which is the only way to really change a lot of the problems that we have in our campaign finance system. … The real answer here is public financing, and I’m going to work very hard in my time in the Senate and then in the White House to try to get to a public financing system … because that is the answer to all of these issues that have arisen.”
In other words, Clinton insists she is “very much in favor” of providing taxpayer money to the presidential candidates — to thwart the influence of private money, and foil the aspirations of the bundlers — and that she will “work very hard in my time in the Senate” to effectuate that kind of reform.
To which I say, “What a crock.”
During her six-year Senate career, Clinton has never once championed campaign finance reform. Barack Obama has been touting a public financing bill designed to wean candidates away from the chase for private money; the bill was introduced in the Senate earlier this year, yet Clinton won’t endorse it.
http://www.timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=627548&category=OPINION&newsdate=10/5/2007
Halftime. KU KS tied 14-14.
The KU fans are not in full force in the stands. Unfortunately, a liberal meeting of Young Democrats for Peace, precluded a large turnout of fans.
Got their priorities screwed up.
SLIPPERY SLOPE:
Report: Scientists Create New Life Form in Lab
Saturday, October 06, 2007
A scientist who built a synthetic chromosome from laboratory chemicals is expected to announce the creation of a new species, the first new artificial life form on Earth, British newspaper The Guardian reported Sunday.
The new species is a form of bacteria, and the announcement, which could come as early as Monday, is expected to provoke a substantial ethical debate about the manufacturing of life forms in a test tube, as well the dangers posed by introducing a new species, The Guardian reported.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,299857,00.html
“A fun parked themed on Hee Haw and hosting the high priest of hate”
Hahahahahahaha! Good one JR!
Seems the repukes just dont get that if you scream “socialist” at every turn in every situation about every democrat, eventually what folks hear is “the sky is falling” and think “chicken little”?
Max,I think that article is a bit sensastionalist.Nobody “created new life” in the lab. What they did is take a chromosome from a bacteria, strip it down to remove everything that is not “necessary for life” and created a minimal genome. This genome they can insert into similar bacteria, effectively overriding its DNA. They did not create a chromosome (which is a lot of complex protein interaction) but more likely a loop of DNA.
Which is pretty damn cool. Even though any similar work to eukaryotic organisms is years and years away, it would be interesting to see what a minimal genome looks like, and perhaps what happens when you strip away all the so-called “junk DNA” in a genome.
Last year I heard a lecture from Craig Venter, it was really interesting. But how I wish it was another scientist that pioneered this…
Also, what are you so scared of Max? It’s good to try and understand life.
KU 21 KS 17
KS capitalizing on KU mistakes.Much as Hillary on Bush.
New Dr Pepper Commercial:
“We want it all,We want it all,We want it now.”
Advertisers capitalize on Hillary’s free healthcare, free money for babies message.
Libs hands stretched forth begging with nothing, but a mouth full of gimmee.
More from KS to follow.
“… but Lomborg was dead on right about what needs to be in the discussion about Climate Change.
I would suggest to Cosmos and other Gorites to watch or read his work.”
Posted by: Joe Williams | October 06, 2007 at 09:55 AM
I would suggest to Joe Williams that he read ABOUT Lomborg’s work(sic).
‘The Skeptical Environmentalist’http://www.ucsusa.org/ssi/resources/the-skeptical-environmentalist.html
“These separately written expert reviews unequivocally demonstrate that on closer inspection, Lomborg’s book is seriously flawed and fails to meet basic standards of credible scientific analysis. The authors find that:
* Dr. Lomborg consistently misuses, misrepresents or misinterprets data to greatly underestimate rates of species extinction, ignore evidence that billions of people lack access to clean water and sanitation, and minimize the extent and impacts of global warming due to the burning of fossil fuels and other human-caused emissions of heat-trapping gases.
* His assertions and analyses are marred by flawed logic, inappropriate use of statistics, and hidden value judgments.
* Dr. Lomborg uncritically and selectively cites literature — often not peer-reviewed — that supports his assertions, while ignoring or misinterpreting scientific evidence that does not. His consistently flawed use of scientific data is, in Peter Gleick’s words “unexpected and disturbing in a statistician.” ”
Scientific American’Misleading Math about the EarthScience defends itself against The Skeptical Environmentalist’http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=000F3D47-C6D2-1CEB-93F6809EC5880000
Bush has been acting-out his Jim Jones religious beliefs and is oblivious to every other reasoning.
That makes him extremely dangerous and has created the vulnerability which the Jews have manipulated and now flaunt.
Joe Lieberman is in “high cotton” as he “helps” Israel in almost every Bill.
But on the bright side; had it not been for Bush, the Israelis would have not shown us their ass.
Give it up Cosmos, Bush is here and he is taking care of our environment. He would have taken up the cause long ago, but for the interruption with 911 and the war.
His methods will protect American Industry, utilize American natural resources, and end the call for returning to caves.
Despite the Geico Commercial with cavemen, we are not returning any time soon.
We will have Palm Trees in Kansas. But they will be environmentally friendly, with low cholesterol nuts.
Palm trees,
Bush is a joke, and irrelevant on the climate change issue.
So 47 million don’t have healthcare (including illegals)and a poll conducted by the Kaiser Family Foundation reveals that 70% said the reason they don’t have insurance is because of the “high cost”.
They have the opportunity to pay for insurance like the rest of us (the vast majority of Americans), but choose not to.
How does that become MY responsibility?
Rock Chalk Jayhawks!!!!!
Very funny.
Runaround Hsu
http://youtube.com/watch?v=m24dABZjBnY
I thought Rep. Jack Murtha said the Marines were killing innocent men and civlians in cold blood?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=hMedVWUsSFU
cosmos the communistic ideologically based environmental terrorist calls anyone that isn’t of his ideology or thinking a liar or a fraud.
When this hooh hah of his Global Climate Scaring blows up in his face, he’s going to slink back to his Theodore Kazinski hole and send out more letter bombs.
ROCK CHALK JAYHALK!!!
err..
(I’m so happy, I typoed)
ROCK CHALK JAYHAWK!!!
I just got through watching “An Unreasonable Man”, a two hour documentary on Ralph Nader.
It’s excellent! A must see for everybody that in involved in politics, no matter your political ideology.
I know Democrats hate the man! It will show you the real side of the Democrat Party, especially during the 2000 and 2004 Presidential Election.
“Democrats are the meaning bunch of motherf–kers!”
“The Democratic Party wants their voters to shut-up, shut off their brain and vote Democrat.”
And I especially love how the Democrats blamed Nader for loosing in 2000. And how they threw pies at his face afterwards.
But Democrats don’t know is that Nader has accomplished more and has driven in legislation more than any Democrat Politician can even dream to do.
Nader was clearly much better than Gore and Kerry, yet to the Democratic Party, it isn’t about Candidates, it’s about Power and with that Power access to the Corporations and Money.
You Democrats are blind and bought and paid for by Corporations.
Oh I forgot! The quotes I posted in quotations is from the documentary from journalist and other advocates who were interviewed for the documentary. Those aren’t my own!
Just wanted to point that out.
Joe Williams,
You might want to compare Lomberg’s CV to Dr. Jerry Mahlman’s.http://www.isse.ucar.edu/mahlman/vitae.pdf
Actually Cosmos, Lomborg takes all of his statistics from the UN Panel on Global Warming. So by challenging his statistics, you are saying the UN has it all wrong.
For instance, a Gorite challenged him about the depletion of fossil fuels, in particular oil. The person that challenged him was citing a source that was not peer reviewed!
So I’m sorry Cosmos! But he is right in his argument about addressing Global Warming. He is not denying nor is he saying to ignore it. He is saying that we have a better chance to solve Global Warming if he think about what to do logically to the investment we will spend on tackling this problem.
Again Cosmos! Where is he wrong? Just because he doesn’t think the Kyoto Protocols will make any difference, he was right about that. Because the counties that did sign the treaty and promised to reduce CO2 output hasn’t even done it at all, they have in fact increased it. Meaning that it isn’t doing anything.
He is saying that what we spend on tackling CO2 output is better spent on RD&D in technology for the future to reduce it and for alternative energy.
His criticism on the Goreites is that they are telling everybody we must do and spend whatever it takes to reduce CO2 and we need to set goals, such as reduce greenhouse gas emissions by 60% by 2050.
Lomborg said, well that’s fine and dandy, but that would mean that we should be reducing CO2 emissions by 3% a year to reach that goal. How come it hasn’t happen.
The Goreites will say, it will happen in the future. We might not be able to reduce it now or in the near future, but we will get that 60% in the far future and meet that goal. Lomborg said, well after we are already long and dead, right?
The Goreites hate him because Lomborg’s remarks that Al Gore and others who want to make these bold statements and goal achievements that are so far out in the future, long after their dead, because to Al Gore, it’s more about building a legacy that he was the one that started the movement, when it fact he isn’t doing really anything about it. He wants to take credit for what future generations will have to deal with and solve. Meaning that Al Gore is an egotistical politician and nothing more.
Cosmos, I’m sure you care about the environment and want to make changes for the better by bringing awareness to the subject. And that’s cool, but it does a great disservice to your cause if you align yourself as a Goreite and think that Al Gore has the answers. Al Gore’s way of dealing with Global Warming is the wrong way, and many of the consensus scientist are realizing that.
Stick to the issues and open dialog about how we can deal with it now and in the future, but looking at cost base analysis on what we can do to maximize and provide results.
Um Wildcats. Ah Jayhawks.
Who cares.
And what is this nonsense of “living in caves.”?
No what we are going to be doing is moving past dinosaur based dinosaur technology and into a cleaner and more efficient future. Sorry stastists. You lose.
We are going from reading our genetic code to the ability to write it,” Venter told The Guardian. “That gives us the hypothetical ability to do things never contemplated before,” he said.
For example, the bacteria could be capable of absorbing carbon monoxide, a possible solution to global warming, Venter said.
According to The Guardian, a team of 20 elite scientists assembled by Venter at his institute has already constructed a synthetic chromosome from lab chemicals—also a landmark acheivement. The man-made chromosome will be transplanted into an existing bacterial cell and is expected to take control of the cell. When the synthetic DNA takes over, the cell will be a new species
That’s from Max’s link. I call it wonderful news.
“Actually Cosmos, Lomborg takes all of his statistics from the UN Panel on Global Warming. So by challenging his statistics, you are saying the UN has it all wrong.”
Posted by: Joe Williams
Did Lomborg say that?
What Lomborg actually does is cherry pick the IPCC’s stats. For example he includes the IPCC’s 4.7 degree F warming stat, but omits their 10.5 deg F (more than double) one.
It’s not the “Goreites” versus Lomborg as you claim.
Science is about the SCIENCE, not the people doing it.
It’s the huge body of climate science, done by highly qualified scientists such as Dr. Jerry Mahlman, versus the non-scientific claims made by Lomborg.
And we need to start making CO2 reductions now, not some time in the distant future.
* Delaying forces the future cuts to be more drastic.
* We do not know how much warming the natural positive feedbacks will cause.
* Rapid melting of Arctic sea ice (a positive feedback) is happening much sooner than scientists projected.
* Kyoto was only a first step, and it did help reduce emissions more than “business as usual”. The next step is improve on Kyoto, and fix its mistakes.
* The billions of $’s to build new coal-fired plants (with a lifetime of 50+ years) should instead fund higher end-use energy efficiency, and renewables.
Although the possiblity is many many many years away, I wonder what WOULD happen if we created life in the laboratory?
Would it mean that god is dead? I don’t think so, but I suspect some people do and that is where the “OMG SLIPPERY SLOPE STOP TEH SCIENTISTS” comes into play.
Pictures of the outrageous public nudity and displays of various perversions and defamations of Christianity, in full view of children, are being made available to assist the boycott of Miller Brewing Co. for sponsoring this year’s Folsom Street Fair (a homosexual S&M leather celebration) in San Francisco.See GRAPHIC news pagehttp://www.catholic.org/adv/catholicleague/folsom1.php
Hooray! More good news!
http://www.zap2it.com/movies/news/zap-comedycentralmencialilbushrenewal,0,6949800.story?track=rss
This is one HEElarious show.
Big deal parkay. At lease they are all adults. Unlike the alter boys.
I recently spent some time with a stem-cell scientist I know well and he gave me what he called “the black box” explanation. I wish I could have his words as they were so eloquent. You’ll have to settle for what I remember (NOT nearly as good!).
Remember when the plane landed in the corn field and they went out to gather as many pieces as possible, took them to some warehouse to put them together looking for possible causes of the crash? Well, there were some parts that showed wear and tear and it couldn’t be determined if those were partly responsible or not.
So, along came THE BLACK BOX which recorded how each system in the plane was performing, what was happening when, a detailed recorded history. So now when they went out to the corn field they still looked for as many pieces as possible and they still put them together in some warehouse. But they had THE BLACK BOX. Many failures were identified and prevented! Aviation became so much safer.
Now if we can take a stem cell and give it a disease and watch it develop, it’s like a recorded history of how we got to failure.
Much better chances of prevention than what we get to determine from autopsy.
“Pictures of the outrageous public nudity and displays of various perversions and defamations of Christianity,IN FULL VIEW OF CHILDREN”-
Another difference between margarine and butter. Butter can’t read.
I agree, boycott Miller.
Hey Tara! What about artificial life?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2007/oct/06/genetics.climatechange
Cosmos! Lomborg argument is that we have much more pressing problems than global warming and focusing on these more pressing problems will lead to combating global warming.
AIDS/HIV infections, hunger and poverty in the 3rd world, education, advancement of free markets around the world, stability and sustainability of agricultural production, raising the standard of living and etc. These all lead to great strides in pollution control and clean up of the environment.
If you focus on global warming alone and ignore the rest of the pressing problems in the world, any efforts towards combating global warming will not do any good.
He sites Japan in the 60’s and 70’s, during their industrial revolution when environmentalist at that time was spelling doom of Japan in environmental disaster. They wanted the US to end the industrial revolution of Japan for environmental purposes because Japan was polluting the hell of out of their country.
But with that industrial revolution came wealth and education which in turn increase the standard of living of Japan into a 1st world nation and they had the resources and wherewithal to combat and correct their environmental pollution problem.
I didn’t see one single child in any of those photos. Are you sure this happened in front of kids?
By the way, I saw some of that bondage stuff on TV not too long ago. ON a regular channel too.
Golf, try typing with two hands :p.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Utilities/printer_preview.asp?idArticle=3000&R=785F27881Behind all this is a fact: the incredible military superiority of the United States vis-à-vis the nations of the rest of the world, in any imaginable combination. This superiority was planned by no one, and even today there are many Americans who are in denial. To a large extent, it all happened as a result of our bad luck. During the 50 years after World War II, while Europe was at peace and the Soviet Union largely relied on surrogates to do its fighting, the United States was involved in a whole series of wars: the Korean War, the Vietnam War, the Gulf War, the Kosovo conflict, the Afghan War, and the Iraq War. The result was that our military spending expanded more or less in line with our economic growth, while Europe’s democracies cut back their military spending in favor of social welfare programs. The Soviet Union spent profusely but wastefully, so that its military collapsed along with its economy.
Suddenly, after two decades during which “imperial decline” and “imperial overstretch” were the academic and journalistic watchwords, the United States emerged as uniquely powerful. The “magic” of compound interest over half a century had its effect on our military budget, as did the cumulative scientific and technological research of our armed forces. With power come responsibilities, whether sought or not, whether welcome or not. And it is a fact that if you have the kind of power we now have, either you will find opportunities to use it, or the world will discover them for you.
The older, traditional elements in the Republican party have difficulty coming to terms with this new reality in foreign affairs, just as they cannot reconcile economic conservatism with social and cultural conservatism. But by one of those accidents historians ponder, our current president and his administration turn out to be quite at home in this new political environment, although it is clear they did not anticipate this role any more than their party as a whole did. As a result, neoconservatism began enjoying a second life, at a time when its obituaries were still being published.
Irving Kristol is author of “Neoconservatism: The Autobiography of an Idea.”
© Copyright 2007, News Corporation, Weekly Standard, All Rights Reserved.
I don’t understand people who think their bodies are “dirty.” It’s a body; a physical object, like a board or a rock.
dog,
I heard a speaker, a retired Lt. Colonel speak on CSPAN. He was chair or something of other for Votes for Vets.
He was a very good speaker and squished every one of the propaganda talking points that the Libs say about Iraq.
Ladies and gentleman and children of all religions…
We shall now be entertained by the incoherent if slightly amusing textual spewage of his irellevancy “kansas”!
JR, just walk on by the troll!
“Pictures of the outrageous public nudity and displays of various perversions and defamations of Christianity,IN FULL VIEW OF CHILDREN”-
“Another difference between margarine and butter. Butter can’t read.
“I agree, boycott Miller.”
Outlander,Maybe you can help me here. Why would the Catholic Church go to the trouble of printing these pictures? I fail to see what is accoplished by that. My Catholic spouse can’t help me with this question, maybe you can.
Kansas and Parkay.
Man, aren’t you glad you aren’t in their head?
Whew!
Joe Williams,
Lomborg argues that we have more “pressing problems than global warming”, by falsely minimizing the problems, and threats of global warming.
That’s why he only quotes IPCC’s 4.7 deg F stat, NOT the 10.5 deg F one.
Global warming will lower the standard of living. Even a small sea level rise will negatively impact many people. Future water supplies are threatened, farm production may drop, ocean marine life will drop, etc.
And Joe, the Industrial Revolution is being replaced by Natural Capitalism. http://www.natcap.org
Cosmos,
Thanks for the link. Interesting stuff.
My son is interested in engineering subjects, is better at math/algebra/calculus, etc. than I ever was. I am wondering if there will be Green alternatives for him to look at when he goes to college (in about 3 yrs from now).
One article to consider, if you are interested in the SLIPPERY SLOPE.
Venter’s man-made bacteria will be designed for good intentions, supposedly. But what if, by accident or intentionally, some very harmful bacteria are created?
Y’all worry about Polar Bears dying due to global warming, yet you do not understand the implications of introducing man-made life forms to this planet, and are not concered about potential harmful, even deadly effects?
http://www.primitivism.com/genetic-engineering.htm
SOME SPECIFIC DIFFICULTIES WITH GENETIC ENGINEERING
Here are a few examples of current efforts in genetic engineering that may cause us to think twice about its rosy benefits.
The Potential of Genetic Engineering for Disrupting the Natural Ecosystems of the Biosphere
At a time when an estimated 50,000 species are already expected to become extinct every year, any further interference with the natural balance of ecosystems could cause havoc. Genetically engineered organisms, with their completely new and unnatural combinations of genes, have a unique power to disrupt our environment. Since they are living, they are capable of reproducing, mutating and moving within the environment. As these new life forms move into existing habitats they could destroy nature as we know it, causing long term and irreversible changes to our natural world.20
Slippery Slope ObjectionsIf we cannot draw a sharp line which demarcates the acceptable from the unacceptable there is a popular line of argument to the effect that we should not be in the business at all. This is the so-called “slippery slope” objection. Slippery slope arguments come in two flavours, which Bernard Williams (1985) has called the “horrible result” argument and the “arbitrary result” argument. The horrible result version objects to a particular practice because of where it is likely to eventually lead. The arbitrary result version objects that there are likely to be inconsistent applications of a principle.
http://www.uq.edu.au/~pdwgrey/pubs/geneth.html
June 2002 | 75 » Cover story » Biotechnology: our slippery slope? Buy Issue
Should we be afraid of tampering with human nature?
Francis FukuyamaGregory Stock
Francis Fukuyama is a professor of international political economy at John Hopkins University. He is the author of Our Posthuman Future (Profile). Gregory Stock is director of the Medecine, Technology and Society programme at UCLA. He is the author of Redesigning Humans 18th March 2002
http://www.prospect-magazine.co.uk/article_details.php?id=5281
All of which can be summed up by:
Max: “Max no like teknolgee. siance bad scary!
Cosmos! Sea level is expected to rise 1 foot by 2100. Sea level also rose 1 foot since 1900. Huge devastation I know!
Gore’s 20 to 30 feet rise in Sea Level is wrong and has been largely discredited by the consensus of Scientist.
Lomborg made a remark that draconian environmentalist spend whatever it takes to save the Polar Bears. By spending hundreds of billions of dollars every year on CO2 reduction, we can save one polar bear a year from environmental destruction caused by Global Warming. Then Lomborg continues that it’s fine to save the polar bears, but by spending billions of dollars to save one polar bear, then over 1,000 of them are shot and killed by sport hunters every year, basically doing nothing to save the polar bears, when you can just ban the hunting of polar bears at basically no cost at all.
His argument is that we should spend the money on RD&D for technology to reduce CO2 and pollution and not spend the money on corporate welfare, punishing corporations by carbon tax credits, carbon trading or pollution control protocols or treaties.
He said you can force companies to spend billions reducing CO2 now or you can spend money on RD&D on technology that it compels every company to adopt carbon reduction because it’s cheap and feasible through technology.
By trying to have companies and people change through the force of a gun and using panic created illogical decisions and wildly destructive mistakes.
Even your precious Kyoto Protocol is a perfect example. It was suppose to be the darling of capping emissions. It didn’t do squat for those countries who adopted it. They increased their emissions. So ok! You say “fix” Kyoto by having a Kyoto Protocol 2, because the 1st one is broken. Well Cosmos, you can keep going and have a Kyoto 2, 3, 4, and on and on. It’s not going to do anything because it’s the wrong solution.
They why I believe that Bush is a better environmentalist than Gore. Because he’s putting money into R&D for alternative energies and alternative fuels. There has been more development and adoption of alternative energies, fuels, carbon reduction technology and so on during the Bush Administration that the entire Clinton Administration and Gore’s self indulgence campaign. Bush has also put more ocean water and parks under sanctuary and protection than Clinton or Gore would have ever done.
In Wichita, this could be a real fuel saver I’ve practiced it for years.
you’re going to be idling for more than 10 seconds, you can get 30 more miles per tank, according to the Canadian Office of Energy Efficiency and the Celias blog.
Idling uses up a lot of gas. You’ll save money, and the environment. The Swiss like this method and it’s the law in several of their cities to turn off your car at stoplights.
But what about the gas used to start a car? All cars use fuel injection, so starting a warm engine is negligible. And the cost of that or the wear on your starter is far outweighed by the fuel savings
Missed a line.
I’ve shut off my engine at railroad crossings for years. Oh and drive throughs? Go inside if there is a line of more than 3 cars. You’ll get served faster.
Max! You wanna know about something scary about genetic engineered species and their evasive destruction of ecological systems, then check this out!
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/algae/
I haven’t heard any Goreite say anything about this yet.
The “creation of artificial life” through genetic engineering by Dr. Venter sounds more like the premise of a science fiction thriller.
By striving to create life, I worry that we are reaching beyond that which is wise or intended. Science, unrestrained, is to be feared. Creation of life is the purview of God. This comes very close.
“Science investigates religion interprets. Science gives man knowledge which is power, religion gives man wisdom which is control.”-Martin Luther King
Joe Williams,
Again… cherry picked, or false #’s
IPCC’s upper range for sea level rise is closer to 2 feet. That’d be a major problem for many cities, like Bangladesh.
And that’s NOT the whole sea level picture,IPCC: “Model-based range excluding future rapid dynamical changes in ice flow….Models used to date do not include uncertainties in climate-carbon cycle feedback nor do they include the full effects of changes in ice sheet flow, because a basis in published literature is lacking.”
Gore’s 2o foot rise was only “if” Greenland melted, no time-frame was given. Watch his DVD, or read page 190 of book. 7 meters = almost 23 feet.
IPCC: “If a negative surface mass balance were sustained for millennia, that would lead to virtually complete elimination of the Greenland Ice Sheet and a resulting contribution to sea level rise of about 7 m.
The corresponding future temperatures in Greenland are comparable to those inferred for the last interglacial period 125,000 years ago, when palaeoclimatic information suggests reductions of polar land ice extent and 4 to 6 m of sea level rise.”
Saving polar bears is a side issue. Less Arctic sea ice means more solar energy absorbed = more warming. It’s a positive feedback.
Increasing energy efficiency to reduce electricity demand costs less than building new coal plants.
Kyoto was never meant to be a long-term solution — that’s why it expires in 2012. And it did help reduce CO2.
Bush should have pushed for higher energy efficiency. Instead Cheney had secret meetings in 2001, and made plans that benefited coal and oil.
“I haven’t heard any Goreite say anything about this yet.”
Posted by: Joe Williams
Gore shows algae blooms on page 170, 171 of his AIT book.
Also,Experts: Climate Change Puts Sea at Risk
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j6Yg-hZ55TkIyVhoOySNyJC0X6iA
“ROME (AP) — Climate change is affecting Europe faster than the rest of the world and rising temperatures could transform the Mediterranean into a salty and stagnant sea, Italian experts said Wednesday.
Warmer waters and increased salinity could doom many of the sea’s plant and animal species and ravage the fishing industry, warned participants at a two-day climate change conference that brought together some 2,000 scientists and officials in Rome.”
More at link.
I watched him to Kansas, yes he spoke well and I admit his version of Iraq is lacking in the media, of course there are many good things happening and directly due to our militaries efforts. The American soldiers have long been one of this country’s greatest ambassadors, from the classic use of the chocolate bar to reach out to building schools and helping orphanages.
The Problem I had with Lt.Col Steve Russell was he painted a very rosy picture of what has been a bloody affair. Now compared to the battle of Gettysburg where 51, 000 soldiers died in three days. Our loses could have been far worse and thanks to the advancements of battlefield treatment. The number of causalities would be far worse, though the numbers have been balanced out by the increase of those that have been perpetually disabled and survived.
Also, if you wish for rather simple answers he had them, he did not actually dismissed the points of the right and wrong, the realities on the ground and the long lasting effects of our invasion of Iraq.
One of the most obvious questions was, “if the vast majority of the Iraqis are for a free, Democratic, united Iraq. And the numbers break down to over seven hundred thousand Iraqis verses only about twenty some thousand. Why do they need our help and why are we still there? Its not a shortage of weapons since at this point, each household is allowed one Ak47 for home defense. The only way such a small number could actually survive and continue to stand against us or even the Iraqis Government would be for others within the “Majority” to at the very least passively support them! So why are they still able to be such a disruptive force? That is part of why I am such a strong supporter of second amendment right in this country. If the waste hits the fan and the government is either not able to or not willing to defend and aid. Our armed citizenry is a strong last defense against it.
No I am sorry but he did not dispel any of real talking points about Iraq, let say the Neocons were not stopped and indeed continued to use our military might to force their version of the “Perpetual Revolution” upon the world. Of course there would be individual acts that would be welcome by those being forced to accept the impose ideology. Our soldiers are not the bad guys in this! But still the very principal of such an action would be unacceptable as well as Un-American.
Step back and take off your American hat and put an Iraqis hat on, a foreign country that speaks a language you do not understand has invaded your country. Is telling you that ever thing you think is wrong and you will have to accept their version of right and wrong. You are seeing your fellow countrymen killed and some maybe your family or friends. All you know is that before these foreigners forced themselves into your country is that your neighborhood was quite peaceful and your friends and family as long as they followed the simple rule were safe. How would you be feeling about those foreigners?
Lt.Col. Russell’s argument that it is nonsense the statement “I support the soldier but not their mission”. And their mission IS the soldier you can not separate the two, was that not the same mistake in thinking that occurred with Vietnam? And we as Americans should forever bow our heads in shame because we did not separate them! Remember the terms, “baby killers, fascists” the spitting on troops returning from Vietnam?
It made me wonder just what part of the country is he living? I see it every day, the thank you for your service, the hand shakes, our guard here have been deployed three times and each time there is a welcome back thrown for them! He asked where the support for the troops was in America? I will have to tell him in answer, “Look out your front window!”.I lived in his home state for over a year, I have not been back to Oklahoma now for over two years. I got to know those people there, it is overwhelmingly Democrat there in fact the year that Dole ran for President My wife and I was the only two registers Republicans in our county! They had to send for the ballots from the next larger city so we could vote!yet I will wager and have your money in my pocket. Right now, in Grady county Ok. EVERY TIME there is a returning soldier, every Sunday in every church there is a pray for our soldiers. You walk up to anyone, man, woman, child and say that they are wishing for our defeat in Iraq. You better have brought a lunch because its going to be a long fight!
The Lt. Col’s argument sounded more the pabulum you hear on Fox News, not defending the cause but simply blaming those that see the error in it. Such dialog is better fitting for an argument between two twelve years olds and not a real thoughtful position.
I applaud his service and rejoiced when Saddam was captured, it was meant to be one step closer to us being able to rectify the global mistake this country made by invading.
It really is a noble calling to aid those oppressed and come to the side of those fighting for their own freedom from an oppressive Dictator. But two important points he did not address:one: The Iraqis were not fighting for their freedom, they were not even asking for our help to fight for it. Freedom can not be imposed on those not desiring it in their heart and soul. To do so as we see in Iraq, to them it is meaningless to them as of as much value as the rich kid puts on the fast sports car daddy hands the keys to.
Two: By doing so, by their not asking for our help, by invading a country that had not attack us first and NO ONE was saying would be or could be a direct threat to this country in the immediate future. Thus justifying such an action to our own moral core and that of the world. Why should not the title of the “aggressor” in this battle be justified?
But he was a good speaker….
Wrong algae Cosmos! Gore has nothing about genetic engineered aquarium plants.
You are referencing extremely high ends worse case scenario or false #’s.
But it’s ok! What are you doing about it? How big is your SUV?
I read your link Joe. Nova. Impressive.
Why are you lying? The plants in the story are not genetically engineered. They are artificially selected. Big difference.
Sorry cosmos,I think we have to consider Joe Williams for the Eric Cartman Poster award – at least he has the necessary number of exclaimation points.
“Screw you, hippie!!!”, etc.
Well Steven. You get the G.W. Bush Poster award. Because you have nothing constructive to say. You resort to using people of disabilities as pawns for your attack postings.
The lowest of low! But I don’t expect any more than that from you.
Ya got caught in a mistake Joe. Admit it and move on.
Joe,
Give those exclaimation points a rest, would ya, please. Eric Cartman is an obnoxious fictional character – not a real person with disabilities. I am not surprised that I have to point out this subtle distinction to you, however. Go do some deep breathing, it will, no doubt, help you…
You know what I’m talking about Steven. And I’m not talking about Eric Cartman.
*Shakes head*
Don’t worry! I know, and so do others. Nice try in denying and dodging your despicable tactics.
Plese to show Steven’s “despicable tactics”
Oh and you might want to clarify your lie Joe.
Joe,What in the hell are you talking about? Enquiring minds would like to know…
My “despicable tactics” – I did not know that I had them, please, kind sir, enlighten me, so that I can do better and be a “liberal” like you. :-D
Steven?
Joe is seriously confused. Remember the Eagle meet up back in January? You were there. I was there. Joe was there. On another thread, Joe is referring to me as “he/she/it”.
I wonder about his eyes or his memory.
I met Joe and I am sure he is okay. He and me might disagree, but we needn’t go to fighting again (Sorry that was from Pete Seeger). He does want to demonize me every once in a while – I frankly don’t care.
Joe is a good man, he is a father to young children, he works hard, I am sure. I have no argument with him. He has one with me, that frankly, I don’t understand. I don’t think I will get the answer on that from him.
But, thanks for asking J R.
No answer from Joe. No surprise there. See ya later Joseph. Take care.
J R and Steven Davis are game players.
They could care less if they make a meaningful post on the Blog or not.
They think the Blog is here for their personal pleasure not getting anything worthwhile out of life, they come here to exorcise their personal demons.
They are with some others, true Blogladytes.
Yup. Back to walk on by.
Bye.
Hey . . . Kansas’s post was another perfect example of a post
Without Any Content, Kooky, Exercrable, Demeaning
In other words, WACKED.
It’s an open thread and you just made two posts that were without any content.
Steven, you won’t get a straight answer from Joe. That leftist Liberal thing…did you ever see such a panty-wetter? I think he must have gotten chased home from school by Leftist Liberals.
Joe! Get ready! The Leftist Liberals will be running this country pretty soon.
I’d move to Mexico if I were you. You’ll fit right in.
And you might want to get that mental thing checked out.
WriterD–
That long excerpt from one of the founders of neo-CONism had to be the most ridiculous example “fair is foul and foul is fair” I’ve ever seen.
Totally without evidence or even fact.
It’s faith-based reasoning.
Long day tomorrow!!
Good Night; Good Luck; and God bless; whatever yo9u conceive God to be!!
Blessings all!!
I don’t want to repeat it Steven. Because it doesn’t need to be brought up out of context. It’s ok. My grudge will dissipate. I’m sure you didn’t really mean to use it as a rock to throw at somebody, but sometimes the way you respond to post I can’t be too sure.
We are experiencing a huge political ideological split in our nation and that is causing us to be unreasonable and spew out personal attacks because it’s easy to do so. I admit that I’m outspoken and very critical of leftist ideology and religion and sometimes that translate badly, but I try to catch myself from going too personal.
Two: By doing so, by their not asking for our help, by invading a country that had not attack us first and NO ONE was saying would be or could be a direct threat to this country in the immediate future. Thus justifying such an action to our own moral core and that of the world. Why should not the title of the “aggressor” in this battle be justified?
But he was a good speaker….
Posted by: writerdog | October 06, 2007 at 10:21 PM
I know several fighter pilots that were shot at by Saddam’s missiles after the First Gulf War.
Perspective is everything, especially when you are sitting in a cockpit and see a blip on your radar coming at you at mach 2.5.
But hey Dog, they are just pilots right? They don’t really count.
Steven Davis,
That Nat Cap book is very interesting… bought a copy when it was printed.
An update to chapter 2 is at http://www.hypercar.com/ which has a link to Fiberforge. They’re trying to lower the costs of making composites (and hiring ME’s and EE’s)
Re engineering college, your son might want to think about what career(s) he would like to work in (like in composites, above) — and then research possible future jobs.And then get a degree that matches. People are usually more successful doing something that they have a passion for.
Hi Joe,The “I am creating artificial life” declaration from Venter is exactly why I said I wish it could have been another scientist who pioneered this. He’s a bit of an egomaniac and more focused on the profit potential of science rather than researching for the sake of gaining knowledge and understanding. And that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
I’m glad you brought up alien invasive seaweed, outlander. It’s something I’m very familiar with, working in a phycology lab for two years. Hawaii has several species that are classified as alien invasive and some of them were deliberately introduced for commercial use and broke free. Another kind was inadvertently brought to Oahu by a scientist. Another kind is thought to have been brought over from Guam on a boat.
Outside of Hawaii, Caulerpa taxifolia is a horrible problem and has spread from the Mediterraean to California and Florida, because it looks pretty in fishtanks. But that sucker can reproduce like crazy. Joe! That is the green alga pictured in the NOVA site you linked. It’s NOT genetically engineered, its a naturally occuring strain. It was just introduced in the wrong place, an ecosystem that it could easily dominate. We have the same species here but its not problematic. It’s actually quite cute, I have some sitting in my fishtank right now :)
My point is, yes, introducing alien organisms has potentially HORRIBLE effects on the ecosystem. But in Hawaii, these introductions were avoidable with a little more care–more research, better disposal, just all around less stupidity.
If research in Venter’s line progresses, we would need stringent procedures to ensure that modified organisms don’t escape into the environment with research into its potential effects. Considering that invasive species can cause a lot of financial ruin, and considering the general bottom-line view of Venter, I find it difficult to believe that he would let something escape that could overtake the native ecosystem. People would have him hanged!
tl;dr version: Introducing things into a new environment without careful research is a BAD idea and should be prevented, and it doesn’t matter if the alien is naturally occurring or genetically engineered–the impacts of both can be devastating. This is not a reason to shut down research, just to be attentive.
Joe is referring to me as “he/she/it”.
I wonder about his eyes or his memory.
Posted by: J R | October 06, 2007 at 11:14 PM
Probably hard to tell.
Introducing things into a new environment without careful research is a BAD idea and should be prevented, and it doesn’t matter if the alien is naturally occurring or genetically engineered–the impacts of both can be devastating. This is not a reason to shut down research, just to be attentive.
Posted by: Tara | October 07, 2007 at 12:37 AM
Slippery slopes do need to be monitored, for sure. Some would like to proceed full-speed ahead, even with good intentions.
Drastic action, when you are trying to change the environment, should not be taken without researching, testing, and proving the action will cause benefit, and not harm.
Well, we are in agreement there, Warhawk.
I think the fundamental difference is that I believe that knowinge everything we can about a cell’s machinery and understanding how life works is beneficial. Yes, even if it includes synthesizing reproducing life forms in the lab (a long ways away).
Those who fear science think that the danger’s of “playing God” (whatever that is) outweighs the good of increasing our knowledge.
Do we want the United States to be the forerunner in genetic research or do we want Europe or Japan to have that honor?
Joe Williams,
I did not say that it was the same (not) “genetic engineered aquarium” algae.
My point (note link, ‘Experts: Climate Change Puts Sea at Risk’) was that human-caused global warming IS causing problems in Earth’s oceans.
Also research coral reefs, and phytoplankton.
Joe Williams: “You are referencing extremely high ends worse case scenario or false #’s.”
No, I pointed out that your (Lomborg’s) “rise 1 foot by 2100″ was not what IPCC said.
And more importantly, the IPCC said that they are unable to accurately predict future sea level rises.
Your stupid reponse was, “How big is your SUV?”.
But the argument stems from how should we go about promoting scientific discovery and innovation. Should it be done by governments or business or a combination of both.
Is regulating science a bad thing? What are the potential abuses and destructive aspects of certain scientific discoveries and what uses shall they serve and whom do they benefit?
If we heavily regulated or banned products of scientific discovery, does this create barriers to research that can create good out of something that has great potential to that outcome. How does political motivation play a factor into this?
Should corporations have the right to patent created intelligent life forms and processes, such as they did with the Gnome map?
No it wasn’t Cosmos! It was a question worth asking. How big is your SUV?
Meaning that you lecture people about man-made global warming and advocating draconian measures, which is what Lomborg’s and the increasing numbers of people in the scientific and political realm is saying that we need a logical look at the problem and a systemic approach to the pressing problems of the world including Global Warming, not Al Gore’s draconian approach, which has been statistically proven to not be effective or achieve results.
As an advocate of draconian measures, I have asked you numerous times if you personally have done anything to achieve carbon neutrality for your own self. Since you never answer that question, I have to guess that you are doing nothing.
Meaning that you probably have an SUV.
Myself, an advocate of pollution reduction and alternative energy, have made personal choices of my own lifestyle and household to reduce energy consumption and CO2 emissions.
You criticize Lomborg, because you question his statistics that he uses for global warming forecast. But his argument isn’t about that we shouldn’t do anything. It is that we should take a logical approach to our limited resources and especially access to money to achieve results.
Al Gore is a very wealthy man from inherited wealth who somehow feels that he is exempt from making the changes and choices that he advocates everybody else must follow. He feels that his message alone is worth the pollution. Well! No man is worth it, no matter the messenger.
I think it will best suit your cause Cosmos that you disregard Al Gore’s approach to the problem and come join the consensus of scientist and policy makers who are dealing with this problem for real.
You have to remember that Al Gore is a politician 1st and environmentalist 2nd if not way down the list of his priorities. This is not the 1st nor will it be the last cause that Al Gore will try to egotistically involve himself in. I mean! Benefit concerts help to tackle Global Warming? It brings awareness? Yeah right!
You are just following the wrong man Cosmos!
“This is not the 1st nor will it be the last cause that Al Gore will try to egotistically involve himself in.”
Why is that every position of mainstream climate science community (IPCC) is somehow attributed to Al Gore?
You think he invented the Internet, too, Joe?
It isn’t the IPCC Rage. It’s Al Gore’s solutions that are wrong. The IPCC does not endorse Al Gore and even question his approach.
Al Gore is not the spokes person for the IPCC. Gore is a spokes person for Gore only.
It is that the radical environmentalist believe Al Gore and his message than the IPCC report and other climate scientist who are experts in their field. Al Gore is no scientist. He has handlers that do everything for him, including preparing his speeches. Al Gore doesn’t do anything on his own. He’s a preacher not a scientist and what he preaches is not accurate or right thing to do.
But if you think Al Gore is above every scientist and the IPCC go right ahead and believe that. I don’t care.
“Al Gore doesn’t do anything on his own.”
Now come on Joe. He was instrumental in making the internet accessible to the public. And the mission he is on is his own endeavour. YOU just hate him because you know he beat bush.
I wonder why it is that so many of Joe Williams posts take on the same concerns and use many of the same words and writing style of Kansas?? Hmmm???? Not to mention Wahawk
“You criticize Lomborg, because you question his statistics that he uses for global warming forecast.”
Posted by Joe Williams.
EXPERTS in the fields that Lomborg wrote about criticized his claims, and science(sic).
Dr. Peter Gleick, Dr. Jerry Mahlman, Dr.’s Edward O. Wilson, Thomas Lovejoy, Norman Myers, Jeffrey Harvey and Stuart Pimm. And others.
http://blogs.kansas.com/weblog/2007/10/open-thread-1-5.html#comment-85413970
http://www.isse.ucar.edu/mahlman/vitae.pdf
And anyone who compares Lomborg to the work reported by IPCC, and elsewhere.
Joe Williams: “The IPCC does not endorse Al Gore and even question his approach.”
Really? Gore’s 20 feet sea level rise again? I pointed out upthread that IPCC says about 7 meters, or approx 23 feet.
Any other examples?
Joe Williams: “He’s a preacher not a scientist and what he preaches is not accurate or right thing to do.”
Examples? Joe Williams seems to believe that because of the non-scientific, non-peer reviewed work done by Lomborg, and similar skeptics.
Joe, please try to rationally debate the peer-reviewed climate science, instead of making ad hominems on Gore, and me.
I rarely drive, and it’s a small Honda, 35 mpg city, 40 hiway.
wonder why it is that so many of Joe Williams posts take on the same concerns and use many of the same words and writing style of Kansas?? Hmmm???? Not to mention Wahawk
Posted by: Chas. | October 07, 2007 at 10:07 AM
It’s amazing that some libs, especially Chas, cannot comprehend the fact that there are many like-minded conservatives in America and on this blog.
How many? The next election will gauge how many Americans want Socialism and Government control over their lives Or not.
Next, Chas will call out the “troll alert” or “sock puppet alert”. Pure dimwit.
Cons could just as easily call out “lib alert” with equally ineffective results.
I got it Max.
Chas? You’ve met me. You can trust me.
Joe Williams is for real. He has been posting here since the very beginning. I do not suspect him of trolling or switching nics. I’ve met him face to face. Now I know some of his posts might lead you to think Joe is a cartoon character. I know they do me and pretty mcuh everyone else. BUt rest assured Joe is the real if strange deal.
There ya go Max. I policed one of mine and stood up for one of yours.
Your turn.
blogs.kansas.com/weblog/2006/08/is_our_presiden.html
That’s a link to a thread from more than a year ago Chas. Joe is for real.
There ya go Max and the rest of the right. I corrected one of my own and stood up for one of yours AND backed it up.
I can understand Chas’s confusion though. Why don’t you Max, or any of you on the right take kansas picanic to task? Where are any of you on the fact that Econ 101 Paul Rosell posted an outright lie about me last night?
I’ve done my part today for blog accountability. You’re welcome.
Thanks JR!! I appreciate it!!
Hi Chas I was just leaving.
No problem at all. Glad to help. Hope the right saw that.
Hey guys.
Im new to the forum :D
Hope to meet alot of cool people here . lol holllarrr
PS.
Xbox 360 or ps3 ???
Hey guys,
So im not sure if this is legit or not, but i found this site offering
Xbox 360 elite + Halo 3 + xbox live for 12 months free?
Have any of you ever tried out these offers and actually recieved your ‘ gift ‘ ?
Ive been reading around and it seems like people are actually getting them.
Any input is great!
Thanks