In 2007, a time of terrorism and identity theft, no one should be able to vote without showing a photo identification card. That only makes sense, right? But some voting rights activists persuasively argue that because there are costs associated with acquiring a photo ID, such a mandate is an unconstitutional poll tax that disenfranchises voters. There is enough confusion about the issue in state courts around the country that it comes as a relief that the U.S. Supreme Court has agreed to hear a case on Indiana’s voter ID law. Given the leanings of the Roberts court, some voter ID opponents aren’t hopeful that justices will see things their way, but the court’s consideration is warranted.
Posted by Rhonda Holman
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37 Comments
I was surprised the first time I voted, no one asked me for ID.
As far as the underprivileged are concerned, I can’t think of anyone under any situation that isn’t required to have some kind of photo ID by most State laws. I can see where the infirmed or elderly who no longer drive might have issues, but I’m sure the laws could be changed to adapt for that.
In Europe it is widely accepted that everyone has a photo ID.
They could have photo ID booths at places like Walmart where you get you drivers license. Sign an affidavit or whatever the State requires to get an ID.
I don’t see a reason for not having a photo ID - especially if the price is kept low and the ID lasts for a period of years - say five or so.
Given the low voter turnout it’s not like there’s a rush of people coming out to cause problems at the voting booth. The only problem elections have had is uncounted votes by rigged machines. How about address the real issue rather than placing a poll tax on the American voter? I guess the Rethuglicans just miss the days of Jim Crow laws.
How will Democrats commit voter fraud, if picture ID is required to vote?
How will Ann Coulter commit voter fraud?
Easy,
The voting machines are not secure… Anyone with the knowledge of the machine and the time could change the outcome of any election…
Actually voter fraud is not a problem.
http://projectvote.org/fileadmin/ProjectVote/Publications/Politics_of_Voter_Fraud_Key_Findings_Final.pdf
Just another cry of “victim” by the supposed minorities. Being put down by whitey or some such nonsense.
Don’t they have to have some kind of id to get their welfare check?
Well KSCityDude! That means all the claims that Democrats had about Bush’s election was a stolen election were all false and propaganda lies? Whoa! Not a surprise!
In our society today for anyone to be critical of requiring a photo ID and proof of identity to vote, or any other activity where one is presenting themselves to be a particular person, is simply asinine. Anyone claiming otherwise has some hidden agenda they are ridiculously attempting to pull off. As small as the cost for an I.D. is the idea of calling it a “poll tax” is disingenuous and an affront to anyones intellegence.
This is solution in search of a problem.
The poll workers have all your information. You give them your name, and they check you off.
If you give someone else’s name, then you have a good chance of being caught (because they already voted) and you’ll get hauled off to jail.
Voter fraud laws are very punishing and the pay-off for one person voting twice is minimal.
Anything that makes voting harder, CONs love, because they’re not in the majority.
It’s an anti-democratic manueveur, typical of what CONs always do–suppress voters at every turn to keep their tenuous grip on the levers of power.
DING DING DING DING
Ringing the Joe Williams bell!!
Joe is confusing VOTER fraud (not a problem) with ELECTION fraud (huge problem).
Of course the Supreme Court will hear the case and of course they will rule that photo ID’s are a great idea.
These are the same people that told the voters in Florida to go to hell and shut down the recount so their guy could win.
I hit outrage fatigue about five years ago. Each outrage is followed more and more outrages.
This is the country formerly known as America . . .
Capn
Take a pill and get over yourself already.
Gore and the Florida Supreme court are the ones who tried to tell the voters of Florida to screw themselves. Get over it.
“These are the same people that told the voters in Florida to go to hell and shut down the recount so their guy could win.”
It’s spelled N A D E R
Capn
You know what the really funny part is pal? After all the newsie organizations did their own recounts and investigations it turned out that Gores best chance of winning the recount would have been to do the statewide recount according to THE LAW as it was written!!
THATS the really funny part!
The old “to expensive” is a canard the Dems have used for years. Hell, GIVE them one then. The cost to the state is minimal. You can get a NON DRIVER ID at the DL place. Even if you dont drive its a good thing to get anyway, you cant do much in the country without some type of VALID ID. And its only going to get worse. Many states are putting in their own rules due to the nasty ILLEGAL ALIEN problem. ANd its going to be worse here in Kansas due to Oklahomas new law kicking in and Tulsa alone has seen a reduction of some 25,000 illegals since its introduction. Guess where they have gone…see gangs and crime increase HERE.
And the coming REAL ID will have to be verified.
And the Kansas DL already is the 3rd securist in the country Im told , so its a good start and we will soon meet the REAL ID specs.
Doug (Ittner) you and Walt Chappell need to get over it. You and Walt Chappell lost. Get over it. The machines in Sedgwick County have proven accurate. You got a recount and the casino vote got a recount. The machines are fine.
Indiana isn’t Kansas “time for change” it’s sad that this fact has to be pointed out.
http://www.votetrustusa.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2584&Itemid=26
I think there is nothing wrong with requiring a photo id to vote.Whether or not there is a massive voter fraud problem is difficult to tell. I would say probably not, but it is there. WHy not remove the posssiblity as much as possible. I have to show id to write a check, and enter into other transactions, why not fo voting. The cost to those without ids is a smokescreen. GIve it to them free. THat way, there is no “poll tax”.On the other hand, I think there is plenty of election fraud going on. By everyone who thinks they can get by with it. On both sides. Let;s clean it up!
lj, you would also agree, then, that the “free id” you propose also includes a free certified copy of a birth certificate, and free assistance to those whose, e.g., social security numbers are for whatever reason among the self-admitted 10% or so erroneously contained in the SSA data base. Getting the “non-DL” ID here in Kansas does require when one applies therefor initially, among other things, a certified copy of a birth certificate, something that not everyone does have, or unfortunately has lost, and obtaining a new copy from the appropriate state authority is not currently free of expense.
With all that said, a photo ID for voting purposes might alleviate many concerns over voter fraud. Will that cure it 100%? Probably not; there are ways of obtaining fake IDs, but if the folks are impoverished, they won’t be able to afford those, either.
I’m not opposed to some form of photo ID to be shown so a person may vote. I’m just pointing out that there are additional costs other than the cost of the ID itself that are or may be incurred when application is made for the ID.
Yes, I would support free certified copies of birth certificates. I am unclear about the problem about the social security numbers/cards.
lj,
The problems with the SSA data base have been discussed over the past few months with respect to the new immigration/hiring policies implemented under an Executive Order requiring employers to respond to non-matches within a limited time after notification. I bring this up as I understand one way to show citizenship, over and above the cc of the birth certificate, is by valid SSN. Thus, if there is to be some photo id issued, and a prerequisite to voting is being a citizen, as well as a legal resident of the state, etc., where one lives,
I can imagine issues arising over issuance of photo ids if (as rightfully should be) it is required that there be some additional “official” indicia of citizenship over and above the cc of the birth certificate. Trying to untangle the mess created when a SSN is wrongly entered in the data base is time consuming. For example, a client of mine had an issue with the IRS denying a dependency exemption for a child whose SSN was correctly reported on the return, but somehow two digits thereof were transposed when the number was entered in the SSA database. It took well over six weeks to get this straightened out.
I’m sure you may well decide I’m posing a hypothetical here, but I can imagine that if the IDs are to have validity, there may be a requirement for a SSN to be valid, which would be a relatively simple requirement for the states to adopt, given the existence of the data base. Then, if there is an issue with the SSN as entered into the data base at SSA (and SSA itself has admitted at least a ten per cent error rate), there exists the strong potential for the ID to not be issued until that problem is corrected.
Anyway, there is my explanation.
We need to allow for online or mail-in voter registration with minimal identification requirements to make it easy to vote.
How else will we get the illegal immigrants and ex-cons to vote?
Oh that’s right, if Hillary has her way convicted felons WILL have the right to vote in all states. Some states already allow that!
I certainly would not be adverse to free assistance to those with ssn problems. THere are always going to be errors. The path to fix them should be easy, and at no cost.
anything that makes voting harder, CONs love, because they’re not in the majority.Posted by: CapnAmerica
What are the numbers Capn? How many Libs are there? How many Cons? I’m registered independent, but lean one way. Where does my number show up?
I thought 49/51% nationwide was not much of a majority. Albeit, I support whoever one by one vote. But I don’t see the nation leaning either way heavily.
Maybe you meant locally?
This Democrat-leaner favors requiring photo id. I verified that the drivers license people also issue ‘non-driver’ ids so there really is no reason not to.
In fact, I’d like them to be able to read the information on my drivers license and get my correct ballot at any voting station in the County. That way I could vote near work instead of home.
However, as Tony noted, it is the MACHINES that are the problem. That is why Joe!’s Republics like them so much.
Democratic Voter Fraud, Intimidation Confirmed
Several readers wrote to point out this study of the 2004 election by the American Center for Voting Rights. We reported extensively on efforts by the Democrats to intimidate Republican voters in the months leading up to the election, and to commit fraud on election day. Those anectotal reports are confirmed by the Center’s report. I’m still working my way through the full text, but here are excerpts from the executive summary:
[A] careful review of the facts shows that in 2004, paid Democrat operatives were far more involved in voter intimidation and suppression efforts than their Republican counterparts. Examples include:
* Paid Democrat operatives charged with slashing tires of 25 Republican get-out-the-vote vans in Milwaukee on the morning of Election Day.
* Misleading telephone calls made by Democrat operatives targeting Republican voters in Ohio with the wrong date for the election and faulty polling place information.
* Intimidating and deceiving mailings and telephone calls paid for by the DNC threatening Republican volunteers in Florida with legal action.
* Union-coordinated intimidation and violence campaign targeting Republican campaign offices and volunteers resulting in a broken arm for a GOP volunteer in Florida.
Vote fraud and voter registration fraud were significant problems in at least a dozen states around the county. Vote fraud is a reality in America that occurred not only in large battleground states like Wisconsin but in places like Alabama and Kentucky. The record indicates that in 2004, voter registration fraud was mainly the work of so-called “nonpartisan” groups such as Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN) and NAACP National Voter Fund. Examples include:
* Joint task force in Wisconsin found “clear evidence of fraud in the Nov. 2 election in Milwaukee,” including more than 200 felon voters, more than 100 double voters and thousands more ballots cast than voters recorded as having voted in the city.
* NAACP National Voter Fund worker in Ohio paid crack cocaine in exchange for a large number of fraudulent voter registration cards in names of Dick Tracy, Mary Poppins and other fictional characters.
* Former ACORN worker said there was “a lot of fraud committed” by group in Florida, as ACORN workers submitted thousands of fraudulent registrations in a dozen states across the country, resulting in a statewide investigation of the group in Florida and multiple indictments and convictions of ACORN/Project Vote workers for voter registration fraud in several states.
The Democrats have organized massive efforts to subvert the democratic process over the last several election cycles. Voter fraud is still the great unacknowledged issue of our democracy. Ominously, violence has more recently supplemented fraud in the Democrats’ arsenal of dirty tricks. We are a long way from solving these problems, but shining the light of publicity on them is a first step.
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/011255.php
“Anything that makes voting harder, CONs love, because they’re not in the majority.”
There is evidence from just about every state in the union:
Operating in at least 38 states (as well as Canada and Mexico), Acorn pushes a highly partisan agenda, and its organizers are best understood as shock troops for the AFL-CIO and even the Democratic Party.
Associated Press ^ | Jul 26, 2007 | Associated Press
SEATTLE (AP) - King County prosecutors filed felony charges Thursday against seven people in what a top official described as the worst case of voter-registration fraud in state history, while the organization they worked for agreed to keep a better eye on its employees and pay $25,000 to defray costs of the investigation. The seven submitted about 1,800 registration cards last fall on behalf of the liberal Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, or ACORN, which had hired them at $8 an hour to sign people up to vote, according to charging documents filed in Superior Court. Secretary of…
Seattle Times ^ | 1/27/5 | David Postman
TUKWILA — The state Republican Party said in court papers filed yesterday that it has found 300 illegal votes and more than 400 that can’t be verified in the governor’s election. With Christine Gregoire winning the governor’s race by 129 votes, Republican Party Chairman Chris Vance says he now has found far more than enough evidence to persuade a judge to nullify the election and call for a rematch between Gregoire and Republican Dino Rossi. Lawyers and Republican staffers are continuing to look county by county for votes cast by felons, in the name of dead people or by people…
Kansas City Star (Missouri) ^ | Tue, Nov. 21, 2006 | staffA federal judge has dismissed charges against a Kansas City woman for alleged voter registration fraud, court records show. Senior U.S. District Judge Howard Sachs on Monday dismissed a two-count federal indictment against Stephanie L. Davis at the request of the office of U.S. Attorney Bradley Schlozman. In the request, the office said Davis claimed she “was not the person who did the acts charged” but that her “identity was used without her permission.” The office said the claims were true.Davis was one of four people indicted by a federal grand jury for allegedly submitting false voter registrations while working… (They arrested the WRONG ACORN worker)
Belleville News-Democrat, IL ^ | 10.25.2006 | AP
CLAYTON, Mo. - St. Louis County Election officials claim hundreds of fraudulent voter address changes have been turned in by ACORN, a group that’s been criticized for its voter sign-up work in Missouri. St. Louis County’s Republican elections director Joseph Goeke said if a county voter does not get a polling-place notification card in the mail right before the election, the address could have been changed behind their back. Election Board employees estimate hundreds of fraudulent address changes were submitted. The address changes included forged signatures and are among questionable or fraudulent voter registration cards submitted to the county within…
STLtoday.com ^ | 10/25/2006 | Jo Mannies
Hundreds of bogus address changes have surfaced at the St. Louis County Election Board, which is warning voters to make sure they get a polling-place notification card in the mail next week. If the card doesn’t show up, a voter’s address may have been fraudulently changed without their knowledge, said Joseph Goeke, the county’s Republican elections director. Voters who don’t get a card can call the election board or bring valid identification and proof of residence to the polls on Nov. 7, Goeke said. “If you’re at the correct polling place for your (correct) address, then you can vote,” Goeke…
RedState.com ^ | October 5, 2006 | RedState.com
RedState.com has a video on their website where unpaid, ACORN workers let the cat out of the bag that they were sent out to go to 148,000 doors soliciting votes for an increase in the Minimum Wage but, they were also instructed to push McCaskill for the U.S. Senate. This is a violation of campaign law. ACORN is not supposed to endorse any candidate. See the video here: http://www.redstate.com
HUMAN EVENTS ^ | Apr 04, 2006 | Terrence Scanlon
How does a dog vote? It’s a question to ponder. Dogs do end up on voter lists from time to time — one was registered in St. Louis in 2000 — and I worry that today’s polling places are not dog-friendly. Can a dog operate a touch screen election machine? Are owners permitted into the voting booth to help their pets? Seriously. Nowadays dogs, the deceased, convicted felons, illegal immigrants and imaginary people are registered to vote. This shouldn’t be. But to hear some liberal groups, any rules and restrictions on the franchise are intolerable. One liberal group seems to…
Madison.com ^ | February 9, 2006 | Pat Schneider
(Residents urged to join group…) ACORN, a national community organizing group, is struggling to attract members in the Allied Drive area, but is winning support from two key neighborhood groups. Members from the Allied-Dunn’s Marsh Neighborhood Association and the Dunn’s Marsh-Allied Drive Landlords Association urged neighborhood residents to join ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, at an organizing meeting Wednesday. “We need to get these lazy people out of their houses to come out and see what we’re talking about,” Greg Wright, a member of the Allied-Dunn’s Marsh Neighborhood Association, told the group of about 35 gathered
9NEWS.COM ^ | 10/5/2005 8:35 PM MDT | Marc Sternfield
DENVER - One of several defendants profiled in an I-Team investigation into widespread voter registration fraud has avoided jail time. A Denver District Court judge on Wednesday sentenced Monique Mora, 20, to six months probation and 100 hours of community service.
Posted by mn-bush-manOn News/Activism 12/07/2004 8:02:07 AM PST • 36 replies • 1,341+ views
wcco.com ^ | Dec 7, 2004 | AP
Man Pleads Guilty To Voter Registration Scam Dec 7, 2004 6:38 am US/Central Minneapolis (AP)A 19-year-old St. Louis Park man arrested this fall with hundreds of filled-out voter registration cards in his car told authorities that he forged some signatures to make extra money. Joshua Reed pleaded guilty Monday in Hennepin County District Court to two felonies. He will be sentenced next month. As part of the plea deal, prosecutors said they would recommend 60 days in the county workhouse, plus 15 days of community service. County Attorney Amy Klobuchar said Reed admitted he failed to promptly turn over the…
Man Pleads Guilty To Voter Registration Scam
Dec 7, 2004 6:38 am US/CentralMinneapolis (AP)
A 19-year-old St. Louis Park man arrested this fall with hundreds of filled-out voter registration cards in his car told authorities that he forged some signatures to make extra money.
Joshua Reed pleaded guilty Monday in Hennepin County District Court to two felonies. He will be sentenced next month. As part of the plea deal, prosecutors said they would recommend 60 days in the county workhouse, plus 15 days of community service.
County Attorney Amy Klobuchar said Reed admitted he failed to promptly turn over the voter registration cards to the Secretary of State or a county auditor, and he admitted he forged signatures on 18 voter registration cards.
Klobuchar said Reed never intended to use the forgeries to allow anyone to vote twice. Instead, he wanted to increase his earnings — he told authorities that ACORN paid him $1.50 for each new voter he registered, she said.
“He was trying to get some extra cash for registering voters,” Klobuchar said. ACORN, known as Associated Community Organizations for Reform Now, was one of several groups that hired canvassers to register new voters this year.
An ACORN official previously said Reed was paid $1 per registered voter.
Posted by Tumbleweed_ConnectionOn News/Activism 10/31/2004 2:08:24 PM PST • 6 replies • 1,303+ views
NRO ^ | October 31, 2004 | Meghan Clyne OhioReports of voter-registration fraud are tiresomely commonplace. From the 6,000 ineligible felons listed on Colorado’s voter rolls, to the cocaine offered in exchange for registrations from Mary Poppins and Dick Tracy in Ohio, this year’s swing states have already seen unprecedentedly corrupt get-out-the-vote efforts. This is especially true in Florida, where the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN) is the subject of a state investigation for potentially criminal voter-registration activity. THE MONEY TREE Although ACORN’s projects run a wide gamut, the group claims as its purpose helping low- and middle-income Americans — through initiatives ranging from improving urban…
Miami Herald ^ | Oct. 30, 2004 | Natalie P McNeal
Several South Florida residents are suing a nonprofit agency, saying the group conducted a voter registration drive, paid workers for each application and purposely withheld applications until after the registration deadline. The lawsuit against the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now says the nonprofit group asked several South Florida residents to register to vote during a summer petition to get a minimum-wage amendment on the ballot. The lawsuit, which has 11 plaintiffs, was filed Friday against ACORN in Broward County Circuit Court. ACORN is the nation’s largest community organization of low- and moderate-income families. Solicitors were paid $2 per…
I think it’s a small price to pay — for those that have limited income and don’t drive should be able to go to some federal / state / city / county office and get a free ID — but they need to have some proof they live at the address they say, bill etc ….. the post office, or the dov places —– to minimize the expense only do it on specific days and times, or even travel a team to the malls / major grocery stores, at riverfest etc … on weekends — get qualified volunteers or pay them what election works are paid …
…. but we should be just as concerned about the programs that are running our computer voting machines — i don’t think all the rumors / allegations have been ironed out.
D P — think Cliff Notes next time
Won vice one.
Enter Republican in every spot he says Democrat —– and it’s a draw —- read similar articles last year focused on republicans — so then your point is ?
D P — think Cliff Notes next time
Posted by: ken
Sorry. Didn’t know how to show the difference cases/locations/events in short time span.
I’ll make room in my casket for that next time.
How will Democrats commit voter fraud, if picture ID is required to vote?
Posted by: Joe Williams | September 27, 2007 at 07:12 AM
Reading the above thread, it appears you are right. Democrats are afraid of photo id’s.
Listen to the CONs, “They’ve got THOUSANDS of phony registrations.”
Dipsh*ts, if the registration is phony, then the photo ID doesn’t make a dime’s bit of difference.
If I register to vote but I’m not eligible to vote because I GIVE A FAKE ADDRESS LIKE ANN COULTER, then a photo ID makes absolutely no difference.
Also, say you wanted to throw an election. Which is easier? Getting tens of thousands of people to vote twice, which will involve driving from one polling place to another and serious jail time for no immediate or obvious gain . . .
OR
screwing with the machines so they count the votes the way you want them to?
Look at Ohio in 2004. A court ordered the voting records to be preserved so they could be inspected and verified, and the Republican political machine just went right ahead and shredded them.
Heckler–
You know what the really funny part is pal?
Your party’s Supreme Court telling Americans to take their right to vote and shove up their ass.
Laugh at that.
Just hilarious, isn’t it.
‘It’s not the people who vote that count; it’s the people who count the votes’
The Republicans have learned this lesson all too well . . .