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Open thread 9/13
- By Phillip Brownlee
- Posted Sept. 13, 2007 at 1:05 a.m.
- Filed under Open thread
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225 Comments
20 reasons to ban guns….. Flawed anti-gun liberal logic
1. Banning guns works, which is why New York, DC, & Chicago cops need guns.
2. Washington DC’s low murder rate of 69 per 100,000 is due to strict gun control, and Indianapolis’ high murder rate of 9 per 100,000 is due to the lack of gun control.
3. Statistics showing high murder rates justify gun control but statistics showing increasing murder rates after gun control are “just statistics.”
4. The Brady Bill and the Assault Weapons Ban, both of which went into effect in 1994 are responsible for the decrease in violent crime rates, which have been declining since 1991.
5. We must get rid of guns because a deranged lunatic may go on a shooting spree at any time and anyone who would own a gun out of fear of such a lunatic is paranoid.
6. The more helpless you are the safer you are from criminals.
7. An intruder will be incapacitated by tear gas or oven spray, but if shot with a .357 Magnum will get angry and kill you.
8. A woman raped and strangled is morally superior to a woman with a smoking gun and a dead rapist at her feet.
9. When confronted by violent criminals, you should “put up no defense – give them what they want, or run” (Handgun Control Inc. Chairman Pete Shields, Guns Don’t Die – People Do, 1981, p. 125).
10. The New England Journal of Medicine is filled with expert advice about guns; just like Guns & Ammo has some excellent treatises on heart surgery.
11. One should consult an automotive engineer for safer seatbelts, a civil engineer for a better bridge, a surgeon for internal medicine, a computer programmer for hard drive problems, and Sarah Brady for firearms expertise.
12. The 2nd Amendment, ratified in 1787, refers to the National Guard, which was created 130 years later, in 1917.
13. The National Guard, federally funded, with bases on federal land, using federally-owned weapons, vehicles, buildings and uniforms, punishing trespassers under federal law, is a “state” militia.
14. These phrases: “right of the people peaceably to assemble,” “right of the people to be secure in their homes,” “enumerations herein of certain rights shall not be construed to disparage others retained by the people,” and “The powers not delegated herein are reserved to the states respectively, and to the people” all refer to individuals, but “the right of the people to keep and bear arms” refers to the state.
15. “The Constitution is strong and will never change.” But we should ban and seize all guns thereby violating the 2nd, 4th, and 5th Amendments to that Constitution.
16. Rifles and handguns aren’t necessary to national defense! Of course, the army has hundreds of thousands of them.
17. Private citizens shouldn’t have handguns, because they aren’t “military weapons”, but private citizens shouldn’t have “assault rifles”, because they are military weapons.
18. In spite of waiting periods, background checks, fingerprinting, government forms, etc., guns today are too readily available, which is responsible for recent school shootings. In the 1940’s, 1950’s and 1960’s, anyone could buy guns at hardware stores, army surplus stores, gas stations, variety stores, Sears mail order, no waiting, no background check, no fingerprints, no government forms and there were no school shootings.
19. The NRA’s attempt to run a “don’t touch” campaign about kids handling guns is propaganda, but the anti-gun lobby’s attempt to run a “don’t touch” campaign is responsible social activity.
20. Guns are so complex that special training is necessary to use them properly, and so simple to use that they make murder easy.
Looks like 20 good reasons to me!!
But what do I know???
I am only for banning cetain kinds of weapons.. not all of them…
But, the gun nuts will spin that into something totally different than what I just said…
Looks like another Guns, etc. etc. day on the Blog!!
Have a good one y’all!!
Hello!
I am currently working on a side project in a Plant Evolution class, and I’m seeking some input from creationists (young earth and old earth) who believe that the account of Noah’s ark is literal.
I am interested in your views on what happened to plants and algae during the Great Flood. Example questions are did Noah take only one of each animal, or did he take plants, also? If he didn’t take plants, did all of the plant life die? And what did the herbivores feed on for the 40 days?
Actually, ANY thoughts you have on plant life and the flood would be welcome. I don’t give a hoot if you have scientific evidence or not, I don’t care if your answer is “God makes everything possible”, all I care about is your personal (even if its unsupported) speculation on how this might have gone down. You can write anything you’d like about the topic, no word limit or anything.
This IS NOT an evolution-creationist debate thing. If you write to me, I will send you a reply of “Thank you” and maybe a request for clarification if needed. I will not attack or disparage your beliefs in any way, shape or form. I will not demand you to cite evidence for your statements. I will not try and change your thinking. All I want is a personal interpretation, what you personally think might have happened with plant life in the context of the Great Flood account. I also welcome any questions you have about plant evolution.
Also, I WILL NOT disclosing the replies I receive from volunteers on this blog or referencing them in any way here, even if we have another heated evolution debate thread. This is purely for my own inquiring mind. If I cite your answer for some reason in a publication, it will be completely anonymous.
I sincerely thank you for your time if you are willing to participate.
Please email me at taratc@hawaii.edu with your thoughts. I know that sometimes emotions and resentment can run high on the WEBlog, but I ask you to put that aside in this instance. I value your opinions and hope that you’ll indulge me. You may choose to remain anonymous, but it will be easier for me and require less back-and-forth questioning if you use your WEBlog handle.
When you write to me, please include your beliefs on the age of the earth, your views on evolution (if any) and whether the Bible should be literally interpreted (and if so, what parts–keep this brief and focused on Genesis, if possible). THIS IS ESPECIALLY IMPORTANT IF YOU CHOOSE TO REMAIN ANONYMOUS, if you are a lurker, or if I have no way to gauge your beliefs on this subject besides your email.
Any additional thoughts on plants/algae would be welcome.
Again, your answers will remain completely confidential.
Thanks,Tara :D
I would also be willing to send a sample pack of Maui Onion Macadamia Nuts to anyone who indulges me.Just include your shipping address.
I’m not a creationist in the form that you might think. I do think God created all things in the beginning.
As far as the flood is concerned, I believe this was a local occurrence in Euphrates River Valley. the number and kind of animals was probably representative of what was in the immediate area, camels, goats, sheep, dogs, birds cats, etc.
The arc if constructed according to specification would have been rather large. 450 feet long, 75 feet wide, 45 feet long. It would have looked like rather plain riverboat in a barge like configuration.
As far as the food is concerned, it would have been local fare of grains, grasses, seeds and other plant life. Not sure about the dogs and cats, I suppose they could have eaten eggs and grain mixtures.
Most likely the boat didn’t travel very far as it was mainly a floating dock (an animal hotel.) Some say Arafat, but one of the sons was within walking distance, I don’t recall but I think it said they came “upon” Arafat. Which of course, doesn’t mean they were on it, but were in walking distance to see a view of it. Pioneers in our own country describe coming upon the Rocky Mountains. It just means they saw them from a distance, but didn’t necessarily traverse them.
That’s my interpretation of the event.
- It was local to the Euphrates..- It was a minimal number of local animals…- The ship was really a hotel that could float and not really a boat.- The food was local fare, grains and etc.
the end… :)
oops 45 feet high I believe I should have wrote.
Well, thanks, “Kansas” for your “interpretation of the event.”
We’ve all been exposed to your interpretation of events, “Kansas.” and I can’t imagine anyone who’s been convinced. Because your interpretation of events tends to be tainted by a previously-determined goal.
You, “Kansas,” are a conservative Republican, so all your responses to current events are twisted to assume the current *event* is the result of only wholesome and wonderful efforts of conservative Republicans. You come up with a solution then contrive all sorts of Rube Goldberg constructs to maybe, perhaps, possibly, make your pre-determined outcome seem maybe, perhaps, possibly…possible. And then you declare it “proof.”
The Noah story is a fable. Here’s a real shock for you, but there never was a real race between a tortoise and a hare where the turtle won; it was a fable.
A lot of the Old Testament are fables. Doesn’t make them worthless. Doesn’t mean the lessons aren’t important. Doesn’t mean those Old Testament stories aren’t “true” in some metaphysical sense. They just didn’t happen exactly precisely the way nomadic tribes ten thousand years ago told them.
Even Jesus chose to teach in parables. Does it matter, as far as the lesson is concerned, if there really was a Prodigal Son? It’s the lesson that’s important, not the specifics of the metaphor.
The Bible is a book. A good book. But it’s not the *only* book.
Your trying to rationalize details of a fable is irrelevant to the truth beneath the story.
It’s as if you purposefully have tried to miss the point.
Hey, “Kansas!” If a turtle actually plodded along and a rabbit stopped to take a nap, maybe the tortoise *could* beat the hare to the finish line. But that’s not what happened in real life, is it? It’s a fable. It’s a lesson. It’s about people learning stuff metaphorically.
I wish there were some fundamentalist Greek Mythologists with churches and Sunday schools and theologies. Their whole movement would be about coming up with a better glue than Icarus used to stick feathers to his arms so he could flap his arms and fly like a bird. Those Greek Mythology Fundamentalists would demonstrate specifically that most religions — especially fundamentalist religionists — don’t understand the lessons of their purported scriptures.
So how was it, “Kansas?” What happened to sinful fish during Noah’s flood? Is “40 days and 40 nights of rain” really enough to wipe out tadpoles and frogs? Why didn’t the tigers get hungry and eat the sheep?
You are our prophet, “Kansas.” You and you alone will explain how all those fables in the Old Testament are based on literal truth.
Start with this. How did serpents get around before “The Fall,” when they were condemned to slither around on thier bellies? Tiny little legs? And how did serpants talk? There’s no biblical record of God preventing them to talk today. Or was that one special snake? Or is it perhaps, possible, maybe a metaphorical lesson that you’ve missed along the way?
576 comments on yesterday’s open thread. Obviously there are some who need to get a life. (And a couple who need to find girlfriends).
Gun Control Cut and Paste -
If you Google part of Nathan’s rant you will see that he cut and pasted this list – but he added his own “flawed liberal” tag to it.
How phony can you get? Posting someone else’s stuff as your own, and worse, the points are pulled out of thin air, then it’s claimed they represent the views of those he disagrees with.
Intellectual dishonety X2.
The site http://www.guncite.com/ seems to have a balanced investigation of guns and society. But then it is harder reading than phony, made-up talking points…
Can those of you who post here and consider yourselves conservatives, tell me what it is about your political (or other) beliefs/behaviors that make you a conservative?
This post is made in all sincerity and will hopefully steer these 550+ post open threads toward something different than the usual topics of who’s a Christian and who is not, should the government have any say on who owns what firearm, should people get abortions or not, etc. The preceding are side issues and not what I will be looking for in response to this post.
My prediction is that many of you conservatives here could not define yourselves outside of your opposition to liberalism. There are many contradictions in conservative thought that require dealing with the cognitive dissonance created by such inconsistencies, which can prove to be difficult when said dissonance is experienced by somewhat rigid people. Actually, cognitive dissonance theory suggests that you deal with the inconsistencies quite easily, but not wisely with respect to honest introspection.
As an example, our pledge of Allegiance to the flag includes the statement of “One nation under God”, but also says “With liberty and justice for all.” Would atheists be denied these liberties and justice given their beliefs (or lack thereof)?
Liberalism has developed over centuries and Conservatism is a relatively new ideology by comparison. People who know a lot more than me have had great difficulty in defining conservatism.
My questions: 1) what is conservatism; 2) why do you think it offers more for the American people – make your case without providing us a diatribe against Liberalism; in other words, describe the _benefits_ of conservatism; and 3) what evidence can you site for your answer to number 2?
I will answer my questions to a degree. 1) I will not define conservatism except to say that in general it tends to be a philosophy that values solving problems in light of the wisdom of the past. I will not criticize it for that, because sometimes such perspectives are helpful. 2) Liberalism offers more to the American people because: a) it has the right balance of valuing individual liberties and valuing our obligations to others as fellow citizens; b) it has been more favorable to those who have less and is truly concerned with equality instead of privilege; c) I have profited more personally when such balances are in place – I think others do too and it is a win-win, non-zero sum game d) Liberalism holds people as being more important than dollars, but still maintains good stewardship of resources. There are more reasons, but the above will do for now.
Thank you for your consideration of this post.
Fellow Liberals, I would offer this same challenge to you. Define the benefits of Liberalism… etc., etc.,
How about:ALL children covered by health insurance.Those with mental health problems get the help they need.Not going to war because someone threatened daddy.Balancing the nations security with the peoples rights.Cleaning up business owned government and replacing it with one run by the people of this Nation, as it should be.
Planning this nations highway, communications and power infrastructure so as to meet the needs of the future.Expand federal involvement in renewable energy sources to the extent we make it a “Manhattan” project.Bring all our troops back from Iraq. . . NOW.
I think liberals are pro-progress, where conservatives dont’ want changes.
Hey Steven,
Good thoughtful post. Great questions! Actually I can define my beliefs without mentioning opposition to any other political beliefs.
However, I’m out of the door to Salina until Sunday night. Let’s do this next week!
Hank
PS Also to Tara, I am a strict creationist and I’ll work on something for you next week if it’s not too late.
We are peacemakers, one in the love of God.
With hearts united, we establish harmony and peace in our lives and in the world.
White-collar jobs moving abroad
A spate of new studies points to an exodus of skilled labor, from high-tech to financial services.
By Stacy A. Teicher | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor
For decades, Americans watched as manufacturing plants set up shop overseas to capitalize on cheap labor. Ross Perot immortalized the anger many workers felt, vividly terming the potential exodus of jobs to Mexico that “giant sucking sound.”
Now a growing number of US firms are sending coveted high-tech and service jobs “offshore” in a move that’s reviving a debate about the future of the American workforce.
No longer is it just Disney toys and Nike shoes made in Haiti and Indonesia. It’s software engineering, accounting, and product development being “outsourced” to India, the Philippines, Russia, and China.
The result is a growing backlash from unionists, contract workers, and erstwhile techies with time on their hands. More broadly, the trend raises a pointed question in an age of globalization: Is sending certain jobs offshore – even high-tech ones – better for the US economy, or does it just amount to more pink slips for American workers?
“Manufacturing is a small slice of the economy, and when people saw globalization creating instability there, a lot said, ‘It’s not my problem,’ ” says Josh Bivens, an economist at Washington’s Economic Policy Institute. “Now white-collar workers are feeling it.”
The number of such jobs now outsourced – from information technology (IT) to architecture – is less than half a percent of the US workforce. But it may grow fast:
• Half a million IT jobs – roughly 1 in 20 – will go abroad in the next 18 months, according to Gartner, a research firm in Stamford, Conn.
• Nearly 5 percent of human- resources jobs have moved offshore in the past year, and by 2007 that number will climb to at least 15 percent, says Jay Whitehead, publisher of HRO Today magazine, which tracks outsourcing.
• By 2015, 3.3 million US high-tech and service-industry jobs will be overseas, according to Forrester Research in Cambridge, Mass. That’s 2 percent of the entire workforce, and $136 billion in US wages. Oracle, for instance, already has 2,000 employees in India and expects to move 2,000 software-development jobs, plus accounting, payroll, and customer-service positions.
Competition or a zero-sum game?
Granted, projecting to 2015 is risky. And even if these numbers pan out, some say there’s no reason to panic: By staying competitive, the theory goes, companies will strengthen their positions in the new global order.
“If you look at history, we create new jobs in new areas to make up for what is outsourced,” says Richard Hundley, lead author of a recent report by RAND’s National Defense Research Institute. North America will still lead the technology revolution, the report says, partly because of a willingness to engage in “creative destruction” to stay on the innovative edge.
But others – particularly those whose jobs are lost – see overseas outsourcing as a zero-sum game, with US workers sacrificed for corporate profits. “America’s leading companies are sending our best-paying jobs to cut labor costs…. I don’t buy the idea that new jobs will be created,” says Marcus Courtney, organizer of the Washington Alliance of Technical Workers (WashTech) in Seattle, an affiliate of the Communications Workers of America.
In the past six months, as his union has led protests against offshoring plans at Microsoft and elsewhere, its e-mail list has grown from 2,000 to more than 15,000. Last week, the group publicized a recording – received from an IBM employee – of IBM senior executives on a conference call in March, talking of the need to send more jobs overseas, though acknowledging that it would upset domestic workers.
India: land of spices and IT jobs
It’s unclear how much offshoring contributes to job cuts, despite anecdotes of techies who now work at Starbucks, pouring lattes with the precision of an engineer’s eye. Mr. Hundley of RAND attributes job loss to the current economic doldrums, and says it will ebb. But Gartner’s July 15 report estimates that through 2005, fewer than 4 out of 10 IT workers whose jobs go overseas will be redeployed by their own companies.
And the potential that some jobs are gone for good raises the question of how the economy can weather what seems, in turns, a boon and a blow.
Critics caution that while executives are under extreme pressure to cut costs, some of them may be too quick to outsource jobs higher up on the spectrum of creativity and skill. Companies are training developing nations’ workforces to become America’s competitors, says Basheer Janjua, CEO of Integnology Corp in Santa Clara, Calif., which offers domestic IT outsourcing.
“What’s going to be the incentive for our future generations to get a degree in electrical engineering?” he asks. “We have to ask if we’re ready to give up our pioneering position in the world.”
Even offshoring’s proponents agree that its real effects on US jobs need to be analyzed. WashTech recently persuaded two of the state’s US representatives to call for a study by the General Accounting Office.
But people shouldn’t be concerned about the best jobs leaving the country, says Mary Jo Morris, president of the Global Transformation Solutions Group at Computer Sciences Corporation (CSC), an IT outsourcing firm in Falls Church, Va. Offshoring, she says, is an irreversible trend, but “roles that create a lot of value will not go overseas, and more of those will develop as the industry matures.”
Globalization’s thorn in the side
Corey Goode, for one, has become a self-proclaimed thorn in Microsoft’s side. Since June, when he watched his $40-an-hour contracting job sail to India and learned that the jobs of permanently employed colleagues in Las Colinas, Texas, would probably do the same, he’s launched a website to protest offshoring and the use of skilled foreign labor in the US through special visas. Mr. Goode insists he’s not out to stir up xenophobia. But he wants companies to see American employees as more than numbers. “Globalization is here to stay, and we’re experiencing the growing pains,” he says.
His is just one voice in a chorus gaining strength – and numbers – as offshoring gains steam. About half a dozen states are considering laws to make sure state contract work is performed within US borders. “If you want to enjoy the benefits of an unfettered free market, you can try to cushion the downside as well,” says Mr. Bivens of the Economic Policy Institute. Goode – and plenty of others – will clamor for government to do just that.
Good Bye American Dream
http://www.alternet.org/columnists/story/31127/?page=4
===========
Myth: Deregulation promotes competition.
Fact: Deregulated competition eventually leads to monopolies.
Summary
Deregulation only promotes competition in the early stages. In the latter stages it actually eliminates competition as rivals are driven out of business. Owners feel the need to cut every corner possible — and both workers and consumers pay the price. And what is the result of all this perpetual elimination of business rivals? A monopoly, of course.
Argument
The many hymns to deregulation usually describe the success stories that occur immediately after deregulation. This is always a period of price-slashing and better service as companies compete to attract more customers. But there is always more to the story, which often takes years to play out. The latter stages of deregulation feature generally look like this:
*There is a perpetual elimination of the weakest companies, even when only strong ones are left.
*During the heated competition phase, the name of the game is not prosperity, but survival.
*Corporations become desperate to cut costs wherever possible to maximize profits.
*Consumer and worker safeguards are reduced or eliminated.
*Environmental safeguards are reduced or eliminated.
*Convenience and comfort are reduced or eliminated.
*Wages are reduced.
***Workers are laid off by the thousands.***
*Production and workloads are pushed to the limit, often at the risk of life and limb.
*Entire markets — for example, rural areas — are dropped if they are deemed low-profit.
*In the final stages, a monopoly or oligopoly emerges, after which prices are raised, services dropped, quality reduced, and corruption and abuses of power become commonplace.
Workers from failed companies continue working in their fields by either joining the few surviving giants (usually at lower wages) or working alone (always at lower wages). In other words, a monopoly or oligopoly will dominate the market, but hundreds of nickel-and-dime operations may work around the edges.
Of course, competition, corporate restructuring and eliminating inefficiency are all necessary to keep an economy healthy. A moderated meritocracy allows competition to thrive right up until the point where it becomes destructive, and then it steps in to prevent trouble. The advantage of such a system is that competition becomes sustainable. It is a supreme irony of unrestricted meritocracies that what starts out as a wide open field of competition sooner or later winds up as no competition at all.
We have already described how deregulation affected the airline industry. After a brief period in which new airlines formed to compete for customers, there was a shake-out. To cut costs, airlines began paring back their maintenance and safety crews, which outraged the flying public. Since 1978, a dozen airlines have merged or gone out of business. Some 50,000 employees lost their jobs. Now that a few majors exist, air service is being dropped to 130 smaller communities, many others are served by only one airline, and air fares are climbing faster than the planes themselves. (1)
After the trucking industry was deregulated in 1980, truckers ran their trucks without maintenance until they became road hazards. More than 100 companies have gone out of business since then, and 150,000 truckers at those companies have lost their jobs. The surviving majors hired them back, but only after cutting their wages. At least 350,000 truckers are now private owner/operators, which are not reflected in government trucking statistics; they make even less than their corporate counterparts. (2)
In 1982, Savings and Loan lobbyists bribed Congress to quietly deregulate the industry. In effect, Congress promised to cover any losses if S&Ls made bad investments with their customer’s savings, but also promised not to regulate or oversee these investments. Industry experts call this arrangement “moral hazard,” because it tempts investors to abandon their normally cautious, conservative investments and make high-risk, high-return gambles instead. Not surprisingly, fraud and abuse soon ran rampant in any institution that called itself an S&L. Investments turned sour; to cover their losses, the culprits committed even more sins. Charles Keating was caught attempting to bribe five U.S. Senators to bail him out of trouble. To date, about 650 S&Ls have gone under, and another 400 are threatening to. The final bill to the taxpayers: half a trillion dollars.
With amazing audacity, Congress then set out to deregulate the banking industry.
After the cable television industry was deregulated in 1984, prices soared, quality of programming plummeted, and cable systems began selling their channels in indivisible blocs that prevented subscribers from voting with their dollars. From 1986 to 1990, the cost of basic service rose 56 percent — twice the rate of inflation. (3) The problem? Growing monopolization, at several levels. There are now 11,000 cable systems across the nation, almost all of them exercising a local monopoly over their municipal region. They in turn are controlled by a handful of national companies. By far the most dominant is the ever-expanding TCI, which is a gatekeeper over national programming. Its owner, John Malone, owns all or part of 25 national or regional cable channels, including Turner Broadcasting. (4) Because there is little or no competition, cable programmers search for the cheapest shows to produce. Quality of programming has sunk to network TV levels. It seems that each year, Congress passes yet another cable deregulation bill. Every single one has been touted to “open competition” and “benefit the consumer.” But the concentration of power in the cable industry keeps getting worse, not better.
The deregulation of cable is only a small part of what is happening to the media in general. In 1983, Ben Bagdikian published The Media Monopoly, which warned that continuing deregulation of the media under Reagan’s FCC was allowing the media to be bought and controlled by an ever-shrinking number of corporate owners. Once called “alarmist,” the book is now considered a classic, because all its predictions have come true. By 1992, the number of corporations controlling the media had fallen from 50 to 20, and more media mergers are inevitable. ABC is controlled by Disney, NBC by General Electric, CBS by Westinghouse — and all these parent companies are renowned for their conservative political activism. Most cities have become one-newspaper towns, with giant companies like Gannett and Knight-Ridder buying every paper in sight. Once a newspaper has been taken over by one of these giants, the same things happen: to maximize profits, editors lay off journalists, reduce local stories, rely more heavily on national news wires, publish more sex and violence, and increase their advertising. The drop in quality is so great that even Gannett’s CEO admitted his papers were journalistically “embarrassing.” (5) Almost every year, Congress deregulates the media still further, even as dizzying new mergers make headlines. The 1996 Telecommunications Act became notorious for censoring sexual content on the Internet, but perhaps even more insidious was its massive deregulation of the media. By the time information has become centralized in this country, we will have finally abandoned the ideal of a free press.
Deregulation in the telephone and transportation industries have brought different results to different sectors of the nation. Companies have dropped routes and services to poor communities, or only offered them by raising prices exorbitantly. Senator Byron Dorgan (D-North Dakota) said as early as 1983: “There have been some benefits from deregulation, but they have gone largely to population centers, while the costs have gone to rural areas.” (6) Long distance telephone rates fell 38 percent in five years, but about three-fourths of the calls were routed through 18 major cities; for the rest of the nation, local service climbed 50 to 60 percent. (7)
Labor unions also suffered heavily from deregulation. In 1986, Alfred Kahn, an architect of deregulation under Carter, admitted that 3 million union members in airlines, telecommunications, trucking, bus transportation and other industries had taken a severe blow after deregulation. (8) On the other end of the spectrum, surveys in the late 80s showed that businessmen gave only qualified support for the era’s deregulation. For example, although they enjoyed the lower air fares of their business trips, they were troubled over airline delays, loss of routes, long reservation requirements and air safety reductions. (9)
To be sure, some regulation in the past has been ham-handed and ill-conceived. But this means it should be improved, not eliminated completely. A good analogy is that of a referee who makes a few bad calls in football game. The solution is to find better referees — not throw them out completely.
Well, looky there: Iraq’s hyrocarbons legislation appears to be going…up in smoke.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/13/world/middleeast/13baghdad.html?_r=3&hp=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
And, as Josh Marshall notes, looks like one of the major contributing factors to the unravelling of the deal was that Ray Hunt, of Hunt Oil Inc., a buddy of George Bush’s, made a deal with the Kurds for their oil.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/052614.php
So, let’s review: George Bush insists on keeping 160,000 troops in Iraq to let the “political surge” work, while his Texas cronies are cutting deals with the parties that prevent this very same political reconciliation.
Y’all will understand why CF2K doesn’t exactly trust President Bush to tell the truth about much of anything.
I can’t define myself as a conservative or a liberal. I guess my beliefs have aspects of both..but I believe in respect for life and individual freedoms, helping those who can’t help themselves, and allowing people the natural consequnces of their choices in order to facilitate personal growth. I believe in supporting people’s strengths and not enabling them in their weaknesses. I believe we should be an asset to our country, not a liability, and that everyone has value and worth and something positive to contribute.
Values boy completely shamed himself with his column today. In reading his hypocritical apology and defense of Larry Craig, he shows himself to be the whiney shill that he is.
So vb, why no mention of YOU ALL putting down the freakin’ pitchforks when it comes to gay folks?
And I noted the tolerance you all showed to Bill Clinton.
Hypocrisy, thy name is values boy. Trying to make your viscious religious bias appear “kinder and gentler” is an exercise in futility.
If craig were not a conservative evangelical hypocrit, I wonder how far values boy’s charity would extend.
He recommends compassion for craig, but he and his have NO compassion for the thousands of gay folks who want equal treatment and protection under the law.
Thanks for showing us your true colors son. For those who didnt see it before, the thinking amongst us should SURELY see it today.
Jesus WEPT! How many hypcritical statements can you make in one article?
God and guns last night, with thankfully very little about gays.
I think nathan must be having a crisis of faith to keep hammering that crap.
And the bedwetting conservatives are again consumed with fear that the boogy man will take their guns?
hehehehehehehehhehehehehehhheheheh!
Perhaps chas and nathan could just get a room? I think the attraction is killing them. At least give them their own thread. That way max could join them.
Big eye roll. Anyone notice the good posters, on both sides, rarely post here anymore?
1) what is conservatism; 2) why do you think it offers more for the American people – make your case without providing us a diatribe against Liberalism; in other words, describe the _benefits_ of conservatism; and 3) what evidence can you site for your answer to number 2?
——————————–
Steven,
Although “we the people” still see differences between Conservatives and Liberals it is becoming more difficult to see those among our elected representatives.
It seems our country has been taken over. Corporations own the politicians and the media. Elected officials have sold out to the highest bidder and MSM who used to attempt to keep them honest saw where the money was and jumped on the bus.
These corporations aren’t the business owners of yesteryear who felt a responsibility to the people them employ, the people who make their product reality. These are the greedy who don’t care about anything but maximum profits which won’t be shared with many. They’ll spread just enough to keep lawmakers and anyone who may get in their way out of the way and firmly on their side. And it seems to me there are only a few who have held out for the really big bucks. Most are cheap streetwalkers.
So, if I were to answer your questions about why I think being a Liberal offers more benefits for the American people I would first have to go back in history to a point I fear we will never see again.
Meanwhile we the people are still arguing about who is better or worse and ignoring the takeover. Maybe it’s too late. Maybe the takeover is complete. I know there isn’t any hope until we the people see who the real enemy is and join forces.
thought this was cool
http://www.keepingapace.com/blogarchives/sports/baseballs_greatest_play.php
ps who decides who the good posters are. I find everybodies opinions interesting
Seconding KFG’s post:
“But let’s show some compassion when people like us fail.” Final words from Castillo. My question would be who are these “people like us” that he refers to? Evangelical Christian like him? Rabidly heterosexual like him? Or, does it encompass more?
By Bill O’Reilly
E-MAIL STORY PRINTER FRIENDLY VERSION
A few weeks ago, I spent some time with a senior citizen whose two sons were killed on 9/11/2001. He called the young men his best friends.
Every day, this fine man and tens of thousands of other Americans wake up and confront the pain of irrational loss. It never goes away.
That is where we began our discussion of 9/11 and the war on terror this evening. Liberal newspapers today are full of editorials that say the Bush administration is violating everybody’s rights and fighting the war.
However, our research shows that only one, one case of a rights violation has been adjudicated in a U.S. court in the past six years. And we’ll tell you about that later.
But come on. Whose rights have really been violated? The answer’s obvious, those who were murdered six years ago and their families. The government under Presidents Clinton and Bush knew the danger Al Qaeda posed, but didn’t take action until after the 9/11 attack.
Our intelligence agencies were caught by surprise. And the shameful immigration mess allowed the killers to live among us.
Those are massive violations of the rights of Americans. But even worse, even worse are those citizens right now who continue to put us all in danger by misusing their freedom.
Spotlight one, Hollywood Director Brian DePalma. His film “Redacted” shows American soldiers raping an Iraqi woman and killing innocent civilians. DePalma admits he made the film to hurt the effort in Iraq.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRIAN DE PALMA, “REDACTED” DIRECTOR: The move is an attempt to bring the reality of what’s happening in Iraq to the American people. The pictures are what will stop the war. And if we can get these pictures in front of a mass audience, and get these stories in front of a mass audience, maybe we’ll have some effect.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
Now that the vile man and his vile film will have an effect all right. Imagine young Muslim men, already steeped in hatred, sitting there watching a Muslim woman raped in living color. If even one of those men enters the fight and kills an American, it is on Brian DePalma.
And during World War II, President Roosevelt, the liberal icon, would have put DePalma in prison. Mr. Roosevelt well understood the danger U.S. forces faced in battled, the same exact danger they are confronting right now.
A loyal citizen doesn’t make that danger worse, ladies and gentlemen. If you want to protest the Iraq War or the war on terror, fine. But don’t put our troops in danger by doing so. There is no justification for that.
And then we have the deniers, the loons who spit in the face of the 9/11 victims by saying America attacked itself on 9/11. I mean, how low is this?
It’s true these people are usually mentally unbalanced, but some of them do have influence, especially on uneducated young people.
Listen to this rap by Jadakiss and Mos Def.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JADAKISS: Bin Laden didn’t blow up the projects. It was you, (BLEEP). Tell the truth, (BLEEP).
MOS DEF: Bush knocked down the towers.
JADAKISS: Tell the truth, (BLEEP).
MOS DEF: Bush knocked down the towers.
JADAKISS: Tell the truth, (BLEEP).
Bin Laden didn’t blow up the projects. It was you, (BLEEP). Tell the truth, (BLEEP).
MOS DEF: Bush knocked down the towers.
JADAKISS: Tell the truth, (BLEEP).
MOS DEF: Bush knocked down the towers.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
Again, there is no — there is, I should say, freedom of expression in America, but there’s also right and wrong.
It’s the duty of all clear thinking Americans to defend their country against the deceivers, call them out. Don’t buy their stuff.
Finally, it’s truly sad the country is so divided on the sixth anniversary of 9/11. Many are simply blind to the danger. Some simply despise their own country. All in all, it is tragic. And that’s “The Memo.”
Sorry, but I couldnt resist. The pictures here remind me of last night’s open thread.
Enjoy.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389×1796755
Fallon Derided Petraeus, Opposed the SurgeBy Gareth PorterInter Press Service
Wednesday 12 September 2007
Washington – In sharp contrast to the lionisation of Gen. David Petraeus by members of the U.S. Congress during his testimony this week, Petraeus’s superior, Admiral William Fallon, chief of the Central Command (CENTCOM), derided Petraeus as a sycophant during their first meeting in Baghdad last March, according to Pentagon sources familiar with reports of the meeting.
Fallon told Petraeus that he considered him to be “an ass-kissing little chickenshit” and added, “I hate people like that”, the sources say. That remark reportedly came after Petraeus began the meeting by making remarks that Fallon interpreted as trying to ingratiate himself with a superior.
That extraordinarily contentious start of Fallon’s mission to Baghdad led to more meetings marked by acute tension between the two commanders. Fallon went on develop his own alternative to Petraeus’s recommendation for continued high levels of U.S. troops in Iraq during the summer.
The enmity between the two commanders became public knowledge when the Washington Post reported Sep. 9 on intense conflict within the administration over Iraq. The story quoted a senior official as saying that referring to “bad relations” between them is “the understatement of the century”.
Fallon’s derision toward Petraeus reflected both the CENTCOM commander’s personal distaste for Petraeus’s style of operating and their fundamental policy differences over Iraq, according to the sources.
The policy context of Fallon’s extraordinarily abrasive treatment of his subordinate was Petraeus’s agreement in February to serve as front man for the George W. Bush administration’s effort to sell its policy of increasing U.S. troop strength in Iraq to Congress.
In a highly unusual political role for an officer who had not yet taken command of a war, Petraeus was installed in the office of Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, a Republican from Kentucky, in early February just before the Senate debated Bush’s troop increase. According to a report in The Washington Post Feb. 7, senators were then approached on the floor and invited to go McConnell’s office to hear Petraeus make the case for the surge policy.
Fallon was strongly opposed to Petraeus’s role as pitch man for the surge policy in Iraq adopted by Bush in December as putting his own interests ahead of a sound military posture in the Middle East and Southwest Asia – the area for which Fallon’s CENTCOM is responsible.
The CENTCOM commander believed the United States should be withdrawing troops from Iraq urgently, largely because he saw greater dangers elsewhere in the region. “He is very focused on Pakistan,” said a source familiar with Fallon’s thinking, “and trying to maintain a difficult status quo with Iran.”
By the time Fallon took command of CENTCOM in March, Pakistan had become the main safe haven for Osama bin Laden’s al Qaeda to plan and carry out its worldwide operations, as well as being an extremely unstable state with both nuclear weapons and the world’s largest population of Islamic extremists.
Plans for continued high troop levels in Iraq would leave no troops available for other contingencies in the region.
Fallon was reported by the New York Times to have been determined to achieve results “as soon as possible”. The notion of a long war, in contrast, seemed to connote an extended conflict in which Iraq was but a chapter.
Fallon also expressed great scepticism about the basic assumption underlying the surge strategy, which was that it could pave the way for political reconciliation in Iraq. In the lead story Sep. 9, The Washington Post quoted a “senior administration official” as saying that Fallon had been “saying from Day One, ‘This isn’t working.’ ”
One of Fallon’s first moves upon taking command of CENTCOM was to order his subordinates to avoid the term “long war” – a phrase Bush and Secretary of Defence Robert M. Gates had used to describe the fight against terrorism.
Fallon was signaling his unhappiness with the policy of U.S. occupation of Iraq for an indeterminate period. Military sources explained that Fallon was concerned that the concept of a long war would alienate Middle East publics by suggesting that U.S. troops would remain in the region indefinitely.
During the summer, according to the Post Sep. 9 report, Fallon began to develop his own plans for redefine the U.S. mission in Iraq, including a plan for withdrawal of three-quarters of the U.S. troop strength by the end of 2009.
The conflict between Fallon and Petraeus over Iraq came to a head in early September. According to the Post story, Fallon expressed views on Iraq that were sharply at odds with those of Petraeus in a three-way conversation with Bush on Iraq the previous weekend. Petraeus argued for keeping as many troops in Iraq for as long as possible to cement any security progress, but Fallon argued that a strategic withdrawal from Iraq was necessary to have sufficient forces to deal with other potential threats in the region.
Fallon’s presentation to Bush of the case against Petraeus’s recommendation for keeping troop levels in Iraq at the highest possible level just before Petraeus was to go public with his recommendations was another sign that Petraeus’s role as chief spokesperson for the surge policy has created a deep rift between him and the nation’s highest military leaders. Bush presumably would not have chosen to invite an opponent of the surge policy to make such a presentation without lobbying by the top brass.
Fallon had a “visceral distaste” for what he regarded as Petraeus’s sycophantic behaviour in general, which had deeper institutional roots, according to a military source familiar with his thinking.
Fallon is a veteran of 35 years in the Navy, operating in an institutional culture in which an officer is expected to make enemies in the process of advancement. “If you are Navy captain and don’t have two or three enemies, you’re not doing your job,” says the source.
Fallon acquired a reputation for a willingness to stand up to powerful figures during his tenure as commander in chief of the Pacific Command from February 2005 to March 2007. He pushed hard for a conciliatory line toward and China, which put him in conflict with senior military and civilian officials with a vested interest in pointing to China as a future rival and threat.
He demonstrated his independence from the White House when he refused in February to go along with a proposal to send a third naval carrier task force to the Persian Gulf, as reported by IPS in May. Fallon questioned the military necessity for the move, which would have signaled to Iran a readiness to go to war. Fallon also privately vowed that there would be no war against Iran on his watch, implying that he would quit rather than accept such a policy.
A crucial element of Petraeus’s path of advancement in the Army, on the other hand, was through serving as an aide to senior generals. He was assistant executive officer to the Army Chief of Staff, Gen. Carl Vuono, and later executive assistant to the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Gen. Henry Shelton. His experience taught him that cultivating senior officers is the key to success.
The contrasting styles of the two men converged with their conflict over Iraq to produce one of the most intense clashes between U.S. military leaders in recent history.
———
hawk, if you found last night’s open thread interesting, you are a sad little man and need to get out of the house more.
Interesting? Like a russian documentary. Boring, humorless, and just plain sad.
Nevermind. You may now resume your god, guns and gays rants. Version number: 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
And you wonder why I say the world would be better off without religion?
Norman Hsu Booked, Hillary Rodham Clinton Hints Donors May Give Again
Clinton Campaign Contributions A GROWING Problem!
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296625,00.html
IF Hsu survives, he may tell some interesting tales as part of a plea bargain. (He likely will have the same fate as Vince Foster)
I wonder what Hsu expected in return when he gave $850,000 to Hillary Clinton?
Oh, yeah, the number is now $850,000 for donations to Hillary.
$850,000!!!!!!!!!!!
I wonder how much higher that number will be tomorrow?
“IF Hsu survives, he may tell some interesting tales as part of a plea bargain. (He likely will have the same fate as Vince Foster)”
“paranoia runs deep”
Max, the shark is calling again….
The fear is on your side farmgrl – the Left is very afraid.
Steven interesting way to start a good discussion. In a post yesterday I opined that liberals and conservatives are more alike than they are different – it’s just that we are both more vocal on the things we hold dear.
I am a conservative because I don’t think government should be the enabler for people who have no ambition and know that if they stand around long enough with their hand out someone will put something in it. No one has to tell me that some people can’t help themselves (save those posts). I realize this. There will always be those who need our help. Many social institutions (church and other faith based) already do a great deal to help with this.
I think that governments role in business is to make an atmosphere that will encourage businesses to expand (equitable tax system, etc…). It is not the role of the government to create jobs and with the right incentives this role will be filled by businesses the way it should be in a capitalistic society.
I am a conservative because I don’t think it is the role of government to use social engineering in our school systems to promote their view of how society should be. I think that we should be teaching our children the basics. Reading, math, writing sentences that make sense, the ability to leave the public school system with the skills needed to support themselves and a family if that is what they chose to do.
I am a conservative in my thinking about universal health care. In MOHO this would really be stepping into the mess of nanny care. Many people go to work everyday because they need to support themselves and family, this involves working for benefits such as healthcare. If they could get a guarantee of this care without working how many would continue to go to work daily?
The health care system needs some tuneups. The HIPAA law was supposed to correct the problem of taking insurance from job to job for those who lost coverage when they lost their job. The P stands for portability and not privacy as many think. This was a case of government gone wild. So much was added about privacy that the original intent was lost.
A short list but a start.Unfortunately I could go on longer but have to leave for a while.
ctually LTP, I’m a Moderate with both conservative and liberal views.
I believe that abortion is the law of the land, but also believe using abortion as a form of birth control is unwise, unhealthy and undesirable.
I believe that all men are created equal, including gays who seek equal rights. Just don’t do any lip-locking in front of me in a very public place, I find it a bit past my tolerance stage.
I believe if you have belief in this country, its Constitution and laws, then you should follow them and uphold them responsibly.
I grew up in a very stable family environment and this probably helps me to maintain my views of the world and how to interpret them.
Those who mock me and my faith, do not understand either, but are simply playing the game of “oneupmanship” in order to score some invisible points that helps neither their cause or their internal psyche.
I can be very aggressive or I can be an observationist like a Shepard watching over his herd. That is, tending to the matters at hand, not letting my attention stray on trivial matters and keeping my priorities in line with my belief system.
I probably have a bit of a superiority syndrome as I am large in stature and was inclined to lift weights and run when I was younger, giving me better than average endurance and strength. My sisters constantly reminded me of this as they kicked me in the ankles when I would say something stupid. :)
I’ve most likely seen more of the world than most blogging here. I’ve seen war and peace in different countries. I’ve been stabbed, shot at, have had shards of metal rip apart my body and left wondering at times if I would ever live past 50 years of age.
Having seen and lived in other countries has aided me in my view of life. I understand that all of the countries I visited have a value of family, their children and certain ethical rules of conduct.
I’ve also witnessed countries where people were oppressed from expressing their opinion, held captive in a socialistic upbringing and denied even the basic freedoms we take for granted.
I don’t keep a gun in the house, but if I did wouldn’t hesitate to use it if invaded or threatened.
I believe free speech has no bounds, but the responsibility of decorum and good taste is essential if a society expects to survive. (blogs are excepted because it is basically anonymous ranting.) :)
There can be nothing farther from the truth than the denial of facts. Painting a fence still doesn’t change it’s constituent elements, it can be eyewash or enhancement.
Those who stand for freedom and go to defend it are the heroes in my life. There can be no higher calling. Those who mock those who fight for freedom are those who don’t deserve liberty or justice. “Mock” I said, which is different from protest.
Those who live their life on platitude or bumper sticker slogans, harpooned by poll results are not looking forward. They are merely a leaf floating down a stream with no purpose.
But hey, I am one person with opinion and my view of myself is different from others.
However, I am the most qualified person in the world to know myself. :)
Chas. has exceeded the maximum capacity for posting “good night” on this blog.
Did anyone count the number of times Chas said good night last night?
Chas obviously has many problems, which spill out onto this blog. Over 500 posts last night on Open Thread, and 250+ must be from Chas.
Have you noticed that Chas posts one sentence posts every minute, followed by another post?
And Chas does say goodnite alot.
Things that make you go hmmm…..
From Rush.Hsu’s $40 million came from Rosenman, organizer of Woodstock.
$1 million dollar earmark in spending bill for Woodstock museum requested by Schumer/Clinton.
hmmmmmmm
And if Chas isn’t talking about God, then he’s talking about his religious beliefs being none of anybody’s business.
Also, Chas talks about getting rid of guns, gay rights, gay marriage over and over, like he’s preaching to us or something.
And let’s not forget how Chas is for abortion, so add that to the list of 5 topics he keeps harping on, makinig moral judgements on all of us.
Heckler I want to know where the investigation into this is? Are we still going after the late AG. Maybe they could pencil this one in. It could be a trifecta, Trie, Chung and Hsu.
Some of our liberal friends on this blog have expressed concern about the amount of our debt is due to China, we might have found a common tie here.
And now Chas says he’s Libertarian, but he’s against
GunsRight to Lifers
and he’s for
More social programs like National healthcare
ksgrm said, “Steven interesting way to start a good discussion. In a post yesterday I opined that liberals and conservatives are more alike than they are different – it’s just that we are both more vocal on the things we hold dear.”——————
When I read your posts I can only hope there are truly a LOT more differences than similarities. I really don’t want to even imagine I am more like you than different.
ksgrm
Apperently Rosenman claims Hsu scammed it in some kind of business dealing the 2 had, and is trying to get it back.
Still makes ya go hmmmmmm…
And Chas is a Marxist now, admitedly.
KSgrm, you can bet that if Rudy Giuliani had been ensarled in an $850,000 (and growing!) scandal, we would hear about this NON-STOP from the mass media.
And Congressional hearings would already be underway.
Hillary is a standing US Senator afterall, and having to return $850,000 in contributions from a FUGITIVE is not as important as stomping your foot and waving your hand in a men’s restroom!?!
Although I am not a conservative, Steven Davis, I will chime in if I may with a few comments on your answers.
You answer about liberalism valuing obligations to our fellow citizens: I don’t believe we have such obligations. We may help others if we want, but for the government to impose such a duty on us is, to me, abominable. Why? Because the only way government can impose these duties is through coercion.
I do not agree with your remarks about equality.
I do not agree that liberalism holds people more important than dollars and maintains good stewardship of resources.
(I have not given reasons or evidence for these last two beliefs, but neither did you. You stated them as though they were the uncronverted truth.)
Linda I can only say that you and I must be the right and left wing radicals. I still feel that we are more alike that different. We just have different paths to take to reach the same destinations.
We want the best for our country or at least I do. I want to see every child succeed. I want to see every person prosper. I want to see healthcare for all. I want to see respect for life, from our youngest to oldest. I want to see a strong business environment to encourage growth.
Do you disagree with any of those objectives?
Kans,My dear old daddy used to say that if you stick your ass in the air, somebody’s bound to come along and kick it. Let’s face it; those towers were America’s ass, it’s hubris, sticking up in the air over NYC. They were the symbol of our culture proclaiming our perceived right to go to other countries and sell their kids porn, Paris Hilton, soap operas, Big Macs, “I’m with stupid” T-shirts and rap videos. That doesn’t excuse what Bin Laden did, but it doesn’t excuse us either.
Max sometimes it is hard to get your mind around these things. I am as disappointed with the repubs and I am with the dems on this one. They came out as a group against Craig and here we have a setting senator accepting money from a felon. Not just a few dollars either.
Look at how zealously the dems went after Delay. Ran him right out of office. Had their operative in Texas bring some sham charge against him (many of which have already been dismissed). Doesn’t matter they filed them and the damage was done. I am no Delay fan but this was wrong and not going after Hillary on this is wrong.
Believe when I am called to donate to the RNC they have heard this and more from me.
Jed
And just what the hell is wrong with Big Macs????
I prefer a double quarter pounder with cheese myself, but still….
The picture accompanying your story on the Hispanic march was perfect. It showed the lack of respect these people have for this country, it’s people, it’s history and it’s flag. You don’t drape a child with the flag, it’s not a blanket or a left over piece of cloth.
It means something. It represents the thousands upon thousands of men and women who have given of their lives so that we can remain free. It represents those who serve on foreign lands to counter the evil threat of dictators and megalomaniacs. It represents those who obey the laws of the land in which they live.
I don’t know or care how they treat the flags of the countries from where they came. I care if they are here illegally and showing disrespect for our country, people and flag.
Jed,
I never thought of architecture as an open invitation to knock something down just because you don’t like it.
The reason for skyscrapers is that it’s logical and utilizes minimal ground space. Skyscrapers can also house many types of facilities, it is an efficient space in a crowded area.
Anthropomorphizing the WTC buildings as an “ass” and one of hubris rather than efficient design says a lot about your way of thinking Jed.
Sorry Jed, but you just failed, appropriate behavior, basic logic and common sense 101 with your remark.
Jed while I agree with the fact that we shouldn’t be selling others these things your analogy of Bin Laden’s right to knock down the towers was warped.
That also gave them the right to attack our government buildings, etc..?
We don’t as a nation send these things to other countries. We are capitalists and as such are allowed to make those decisions indepently of the government. Should we all wear sack cloth and ashes and live in caves and not our houses (wouldn’t want to appear to be prosperous), do away with all technology that moved us into the 20th century?
Why is a man who lives in a cave right and we as a nation are wrong?
(CNN) — Iran wants “peace and friendship for all,” the country’s president said Wednesday while again denying Western assertions his nation is pursuing nuclear weapons and trying to destabilize Iraq.
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad speaks at the Natanz nuclear facility in April.
But Mahmoud Ahmadinejad took a hard line against Israel, calling it “an invader” and saying it “cannot continue its life.”
Does anyone but me see some conflict in this statement? Which part of ‘all’ doesn’t include Israel?
Metaphors…
obviously you guys don’t get it…
Jed’s point was more to the “We went around shoving these things down peoples throats in the name of “progress” and “democracy” and nobody bothered to ask if they wanted them. So we are culpable in 9/11. What happened was tragic. The zealous religious beliefs of a few do not give them the rights to kill many. HOWEVER – let’s stay on the real topic here, right? Go after the man who did it, quit wasting our time and our troops lives in Iraq, a quagmire of a mess that NEVER should have been made in the first place – and go after the people who did this. And by the way, in the process, let’s try NOT to force our way of life on them – simply hold them responsible for their own actions. If they ask us for help to establish a democracy or any number of other things, great, give it to them. If they don’t ask for it, DON’T MAKE THEM TAKE IT… after all, isn’t that Bin Laden’s bigggest issue with us anyways? That we force our beliefs on other people? (Granted he does the same, and not to say anything about the pot or the kettle, but lets focus on the real problems here) What if *GASP* he’s right? Who made us GOD and gave us the right to say the way WE live is the RIGHT way, and you have to live like us now, not how you want to live? Because that is what we are doing… and in the process creating more and more enemies for ourselves… Here’s an idea – instead of forcing people to take our help – how about we wait for them to ask us for it and THEN give it to them?????????
Anon, What is your take on Ahmadinejad’s threat to Israel? Do you think they deserve to be ‘rubbed off the face of the earth’?
Sounds like Hsu was wrapped up in some serious chicanery.
snipHowever, the story still has some deep mysteries. One of the reasons Rosenman trusted Hsu was the 40% profits he and others received from investments in Hsu’s companies in 2000-2004. With these companies exposed as fronts, the question remains how Hsu made those profits, which sucked in Rosenman and others. Did some other deep-pocketed entity front the money for Hsu in order to thoroughly launder the cash? It seems like the perfect long con — show some flash up front and steal big in the end, but it still requires someone to supply the up-front money.
And if that was the point, why would Hsu bring all of this attention to himself by engaging in high-profile political fundraising? If theft was the point, it makes no sense. If influence and money-laundering was the point, who intended to benefit from it? Rosenman has his own connections to the Clintons and others. Who fronted Hsu?
Hsu’s still an enigma. Now, however, we have literally hundreds of potential co-conspirators who will vie for the opportunity to mitigate their legal exposure and testify to Hsu’s machinations. The FBI will not act gently, either, and neither will the IRS, which will undoubtedly recheck the returns of all involved in an effort to track the money themselves.
http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/012915.php
So. GOP House Minority Leader John Boehner said on CNN yesterday that 3,771 dead and 25,000 injured Americans would be a “small price” to pay for defeating Al Qaeda and achieving stability in the Middle East.
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/horsesmouth/2007/09/gop_leader_boeh.php
Represenative Boehner is the House GOP Leader. For him to characterize the ultimate sacrifices made by American service personnel and their families as a “small price” says everything we need to know about the GOP’s contempt for the ‘little people’ who fight and die to implement its schemes.
Rep. Boehner needs to apologize to the families of American service personnel killed in the war he supports. But he won’t. IOKIYAR, you know.
This conversation was recorded when the Clinton’s thought the microphone was off.
Hillary: Bill, what am I gonna do about all this Hsu money?
Bill: Keep it.
Hillary: But he’s a fugitive and now everybody knows about it.
Bill: So?
Hillary: Now Bill, you know I need to spin this somehow.
Bill: Ok, so give it back. How much is it?
Hillary: Over $3 million, but they only know about $850,000 of it.
Bill: Keep it.
Hillary: Maybe I keep all except for the $850,000.
Bill: Ok, give it back and then ask for it again. That way you aren’t really giving it back.
Hillary: What? How do I just ask for it?
Bill: You know, you say something like “Those individual contributers are not to blame for Hsu’s mistakes. Though I will be giving back $850,000, if you really meant to donate your own money to me, then you can give it back to me!”
Hillary: So, it’s just like taking it out of my right pocket and putting it into my left pocket?
Bill: Exactly, and you clean the money in the process.
Hillary: Bill, you are so brilliant! You might just get a special present from me tonight!
Bill: Oh God no! I don’t need that! You know dear, I’m too old for that now. Besides, I’ll be out of town tonight.
Hillary: Aw Bill, don’t worry, you didn’t think I was serious, did you?
Max is as funny as he is clever.
Heckler, what concerns me is that the facts, as presented, do not make sense.
According to the Washington Post, Jack Cassidy reportedly notified the Clinton campaign that something about Hsu smelled funny. His warnings resulted in the Clinton campaign running a second criminal check on Hsu, which again found nothing.
But Cassidy also notified the FBI, and others; the FBI sent agents to talk to Cassidy.
So tell me who knew what when? Did the FBI do a Criminal Check and find nothing?
Something is not making sense.
“You stated them as though they were the uncronverted truth.”
To clarify, I don’t see my opinions as uncroverted truths. Upon further reflection the best evidence one could provide on these issues would be anecdotal, and not proof in any convincing way.
I, as a consumer, I have competing interests. I want the best deal that I can get and I think that other rational actors will pursue the same goal. I don’t want to support a company, however, that abuses foreign workers so that I can have a good deal. Robert Reich was on NPR the other day and mentioned this dilemma and he called it our consumer vs. citizen conflict.
I believe liberalism provides what I consider the proper balance by giving more weight to the citizen concerns through governmental regulation. (That would be an anecdotal bit of support for the position). Actions that many libertarians and conservatives hate.
It is interesting, I think, that traditional conservatives (Goldwater – according to the John Dean book I’m reading which spurred my original question) were suspicious of human nature and saw it as something to keep in check via values legislation – banning porn as an example.
I am concerned that today, it seems to me any way, that the only morality is the morality dictated by markets. If people will buy it, it is good, if they won’t it is bad.
I think I see the government always imposing its will on people. To think it won’t and shouldn’t is pretty unrealistic if you ask me. Supposedly our government is able to govern given our consent for them to do the same. While I would rather the cop in Eastborough not give me a ticket for exceeding what I think is an unjust law of 20 MPH speed limits in a residential area, I will pay it if I get caught. I don’t like it, but I consent to the advantages and personal disadvanges of being subject to governmental regulation.
I don’t know if you are libertarian, but I think both conservatives and liberals would disagree with this group, due to their overly optimistic view of human nature. I think the traditional conservatives have been replaced by market driven libertarian blend with the older ideas. No proof, just my sense.
This post is getting to long, but I think the fact that we have had usually strong presidential powers going back to at least Johnson (and you could even go back to Roosevelt) have made the problems we’re considering here worse. But that will be for another post.
Thanks for taking the time to respond to my earlier post.
hud
Its going to get very interesting by the time its over.
Steven Davis,
I offer the following opinion piece on the attempt to enhance executive power by the current administration (I started to say the accretion of executive power, but that would not be correct, given the thesis of the blogger) for your consideration, given your thoughts in the penultimate paragraph of your 12:51 PM post, supra.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jay-rosen/the-master-narrative-that_b_64213.html
Passed by the United States Congress,“An act to establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization” (March 26, 1790).
TEXT SOURCE: 1 Stat. 103-104. edited version: De Pauw, Linda Grant, et al., eds. Documentary History of the First Federal Congress of the United States of America, March 4, 1789 – March 3, 1791. 14 vols. to date. Baltimore: Johns Hopkins University Press, 1972-1995. 6:1516-1522.
Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America, in Congress assembled, That any Alien being a free WHITE person, who shall have resided within the limits and under the jurisdiction of the United States for the term of two years, may be admitted to become a citizen thereof on application to any common law Court of record in any one of the States wherein he shall have resided for the term of one year at least, and making proof to the satisfaction of such Court that he is a person of good character, and taking the oath or affirmation prescribed by law to support the Constitution of the United States, which Oath or Affirmation such Court shall administer, and the Clerk of such Court shall record such Application, and the proceedings thereon; and thereupon such person shall be considered as a Citizen of the United States. And the children of such person so naturalized, dwelling within the United States, being under the age of twenty one years at the time of such naturalization, shall also be considered as citizens of the United States. And the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond Sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born Citizens: Provided, that the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States: Provided also, that no person heretofore proscribed by any States, shall be admitted a citizen as aforesaid, except by an Act of the Legislature of the State in which such person was proscribed.
JOIN THE GNOSTIC LIBERATION FRONT TODAY!!!
gnosticliberationfront.com
My two inspirations for the earlier post was listening to Robert Reich on NPR 09-11, and John Dean’s book _Conservatives without Conscience_.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=14321590
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatives_without_Conscience
Lindainks:”It seems our country has been taken over. Corporations own the politicians and the media.”
Reich was stating the above, too. He favored getting all corporate money out of elections and ending all benefits to corporations which made them like individuals. One of these things he favored ending was all taxes on corporations – he contends that we individuals pay for these any way and ending this taxation was a way to benefit individuals.
Reich had a lot of good things to say. In my google search of him, I discovered he is running for governor of Massachusetts – I hope he wins.
“My dear old daddy used to say that if you stick your ass in the air, somebody’s bound to come along and kick it. Let’s face it; those towers were America’s ass, it’s hubris, sticking up in the air over NYC.”
“So we are culpable in 9/11.”
You know, I’ve never referred to or criticized what some call the “blame America first crowd;” after all, criticism of our gov’t is as American as one can be, and it is important to be self-critical.
But with these two quotes, these two members of this “crowd,” if it is that, have exposed their true colors. You’re saying America DESERVED to be hit because developers had the audacity to build those two towers? THAT is shameful.
Jed. anon, you should be ashamed. However, this is America, where people are entitled to say stupid things.
Steven Davis
Our entire tax code is a tool for social and political manipulation. It should all be scrapped. With it would go much opportunity in for influencing elections.
“Reich was stating the above, too. He favored getting all corporate money out of elections and ending all benefits to corporations which made them like individuals. One of these things he favored ending was all taxes on corporations – he contends that we individuals pay for these any way and ending this taxation was a way to benefit individuals.”
I’d want to see the details but, in principle, I agree.
Steven If you didn’t read the blog post from Huffington that VT posted a link to above, you should! Then go read the comments to the blog statement. Here’s one that spoke loudly to me:——-Corporatocracy is the Master Narrative
The overarching Master Narrative is the ascendancy of the Corporatocracy. Consolidating power in the executive is a component of the actual Master Narrative.
America is no longer a democracy. Power does not reside in the people or their representatives. Power resides in the Corporatocracy that now operates America for its own benefit, not for the benefit of citizens. The Corporatocracy comprises Big Oil, Big Energy, Big Finance, Big Media, Big Ag, Big Pharm, Big Military, and Big Politics (meaning the two political parties). These entities care only about their own survival. Citizens are mere consuming units.————————–
I have been strongly against impeachment because of the obvious outcome and don’t advocate acts of futility, but now I’m wondering if it might be the only avenue to at minimum geting on the record with all the abuses.
Unless Cheney is impeached frist, we could be going from bad to worse… And I am not sure there is time to finish the impeachment job, given the relative short time frame to accomplish the task…
Okay two things:
First, ksgrm – No, I don’t think it is right for ANYONE to be wiped off the face of the earth… However, i also don’t think jumping the gun on Iran like with Iraq is the correct answer either.
GMC – first of all, who appointed you God to tell me whether or not I should be ashamed? Secondly, you took my statement entirely out of context, and i am sure you know it. Thanks for twisting my statement, which, in case you DIDN’T get it, was – WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR OUR OWN ACTIONS. however badly they were interpreted or felt by Bin Laden aside – WE CERTAINLY CONTRIBUTED TO HIS FEELINGS OF HATRED BY OUR FORCING OUR BELIEFS UPON OTHER COUNTRIES WHO DIDN”T ASK FOR IT – and Bin Laden has said as much in his many statements. What happened was wrong. No excuses. Those thousands of innocent people did not deserve to die that way. That said, the US cannot realistically expect that acting like we are the be all and end all, the only right way to live, etc, and go forcing that down other people’s throats and NOT expect them to get upset or try to retaliate… which is what, in recent years, we have done. Although Bin Laden’s hatred of the US is illogical at best, it had to arise from something and he has clearly stated what that something is? And what do we do in response, rather than try to capture him and deal with him? Rush in to Iraq and try to impose a democracy… in the process collapsing an entire nation, and creating EVEN MORE enemies for ourselves because NOW they believe Bin Laden, because hey, didn’t what he just said would happen do so? THAT WAS MY POINT. And if you can’t get that, well then, I can’t help you. But CERTAINLY I am not ashamed at all, because for one, I have the right to my own personal beliefs whether you agree with them or not, and for another, I am willing to admit to the faults of this nation, and say maybe we need to take a look at fixing things here at home before we go out trying to “fix” any other countries… maybe then not everyone will hate us the way they do now… idealistic? Perhaps – but the reality is that we are screwed the way things are now…
PS, GMC – my statements Had absolutely NOTHING to do with the **** ARCHITECTURE!!!! Neither did Jed’s if you have any reading comprehension. As I said in my original post – METAPHOR!!!! I LOVE how if you don’t agree with something you want to play semantics and WILLFULLY ignore the point of a post…
I agree Chas. I’m still not in favor of the impeachment process which is, of course, doomed to go nowhere in the Senate just as the process against Clinton was doomed. But somehow, someway, we need someone who is a true patriot and won’t use these powers grabbed by this administration. They are far beyond what our Constitution sets out and allows. And we the people need to be aware and warned. I already think these powers are in the hands of someone who is potentially dangerous to our country. But if not this one, there will be one in the future. Will we survive? Not in any way we recognize.
Vaughn,
Thanks for the link. It was very interesting and I recommend it highly.
I think our bipolar partisanship that has been facilitated by democratic and republican presidencies which have consistently added to the power of the executive branch.
Johnson certainly added to the power of the presidency as evidenced by his fighting of an unpopular war. Nixon got in trouble ultimately for his expansion of presidential powers. Ford and Carter were time-out administrations for the adding of presidential powers – which was resumed by Regan/Bush. Clinton used these expanded powers to adopt more regulations to look out for citizens – which helped him attract the undying ire from conservatives. Bush II has added greatly to presidential powers and if Hillary Clinton becomes president, I can’t help but think she will use these powers in a manner similar to her husband, which will foster in an era that will be deja’ vu all over again.
We need to have presidential candidates tell us how they will share power with other governing bodies and we need to figure out how to hold them accountable when they fail to do that. No more signing statements which say the president can ignore any legislation he/she chooses.
Some people can’t accept the fact the Al Queda has the full blame for 9/11.
AQI (Al Queda in Iraq)just blew up another Sheik who was attempting to establish an Iraqi government.Al Queda has chosen Iraq to bomb any force that seeks to set up an Al Queda free government.
Why change the battlefield to Afganistan from Iraq? We’ll still be fighting Al Queda.
For those of you who support the effort to make Al Queda responsible for 9/11 but are in favor of an immediate withdrawl from Iraq….
Will you support a war against Al Queda located in Afganistan instead of Iraq?
WE CERTAINLY CONTRIBUTED TO HIS FEELINGS OF HATRED BY OUR FORCING OUR BELIEFS UPON OTHER COUNTRIES WHO DIDN”T ASK FOR IT Posted by: anon | September 13, 2007 at 01:52 PM
When did we force our beliefs on other countries? Was that when we forced the Arab countries to take our Money in exchange for their Oil? (Now at $80/barrel)
Anon, very hateful, angry, anti-American attitude you have on your shoulder there. Are you an American or are you in the MidEast?
That was weak anon, really weak.
There was no justification in any thought process for his comparing the WTC to an “ass” and it should be kicked.
Yes, we all know what metaphors are but this is simply transference or assignment of ideology to a symbol.
It’s one thing to throw a dart at at photographs of someone you don’t like, it’s quite another and despicable thing to destroy human life just because you want act out your aggressions on the symbols.
Symbols taken in a literary sense are fine, but using them as a destructive means to satisfy an ideology is not fine, it is barbaric and inhumanly cruel.
It would be like me saying that all women are just breeding and incubation chambers and they deserve only enough attention to bear offspring, then disposed.
I don’t think I would last very long on this planet with that kind of attitude.
You are just wrong anon/Jed and no one with a mature mind would suggest that the destruction of symbols of a country are targets to advance an ideology.
That is the mind of a madman.
The Blame America Crowd is here today.
Are they truly Americans?
Challenge to Scientific Consensus on Global Warming: Analysis Finds Hundreds of Scientists Have Published Evidence Countering Man-Made Global Warming Fears
Posted : Wed, 12 Sep 2007 14:58:42 GMT
Author : Hudson Institute
Category : PressRelease
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WASHINGTON, Sept. 12 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ — A new analysis of peer-reviewed literature reveals that more than 500 scientists have published evidence refuting at least one element of current man-made global warming scares. More than 300 of the scientists found evidence that 1) a natural moderate 1,500-year climate cycle has produced more than a dozen global warmings similar to ours since the last Ice Age and/or that 2) our Modern Warming is linked strongly to variations in the sun’s irradiance. “This data and the list of scientists make a mockery of recent claims that a scientific consensus blames humans as the primary cause of global temperature increases since 1850,” said Hudson Institute Senior Fellow Dennis Avery.Other researchers found evidence that 3) sea levels are failing to rise importantly; 4) that our storms and droughts are becoming fewer and milder with this warming as they did during previous global warmings; 5) that human deaths will be reduced with warming because cold kills twice as many people as heat; and 6) that corals, trees, birds, mammals, and butterflies are adapting well to the routine reality of changing climate.Despite being published in such journals such as Science, Nature and Geophysical Review Letters, these scientists have gotten little media attention. “Not all of these researchers would describe themselves as global warming skeptics,” said Avery, “but the evidence in their studies is there for all to see.”The names were compiled by Avery and climate physicist S. Fred Singer, the co-authors of the new book Unstoppable Global Warming: Every 1,500 Years, mainly from the peer-reviewed studies cited in their book. The researchers’ specialties include tree rings, sea levels, stalagmites, lichens, pollen, plankton, insects, public health, Chinese history and astrophysics.”We have had a Greenhouse Theory with no evidence to support it-except a moderate warming turned into a scare by computer models whose results have never been verified with real-world events,” said co-author Singer. “On the other hand, we have compelling evidence of a real-world climate cycle averaging 1470 years (plus or minus 500) running through the last million years of history. The climate cycle has above all been moderate, and the trees, bears, birds, and humans have quietly adapted.”"Two thousand years of published human histories say that the warm periods were good for people,” says Avery. “It was the harsh, unstable Dark Ages and Little Ice Age that brought bigger storms, untimely frost, widespread famine and plagues of disease.” “There may have been a consensus of guesses among climate model-builders,” says Singer. “However, the models only reflect the warming, not its cause.” He noted that about 70 percent of the earth’s post-1850 warming came before 1940, and thus was probably not caused by human-emitted greenhouse gases. The net post-1940 warming totals only a tiny 0.2 degrees C.The historic evidence of the natural cycle includes the 5000-year record of Nile floods, 1st-century Roman wine production in Britain, and thousands of museum paintings that portrayed sunnier skies during the Medieval Warming and more cloudiness during the Little Ice Age. The physical evidence comes from oxygen isotopes, beryllium ions, tiny sea and pollen fossils, and ancient tree rings. The evidence recovered from ice cores, sea and lake sediments, cave stalagmites and glaciers has been analyzed by electron microscopes, satellites, and computers. Temperatures during the Medieval Warming Period on California’s Whitewing Mountain must have been 3.2 degrees warmer than today, says Constance Millar of the U.S. Forest Service, based on her study of seven species of relict trees that grew above today’s tree line.Singer emphasized, “Humans have known since the invention of the telescope that the earth’s climate variations were linked to the sunspot cycle, but we had not understood how. Recent experiments have demonstrated that more or fewer cosmic rays hitting the earth create more or fewer of the low, cooling clouds that deflect solar heat back into space-amplifying small variations in the intensity of the sun.Avery and Singer noted that there are hundreds of additional peer-reviewed studies that have found cycle evidence, and that they will publish additional researchers’ names and studies. They also noted that their book was funded by Wallace O. Sellers, a Hudson board member, without any corporate contributions.http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/news_press_release,176495.shtml
gnosticliberationfront.com—–
Interesting Questions Steven.
“1) what is conservatism;”
Conservatism is the belief in personal responsibility, a government which is fiscally responsible, a government which only provides for people those things which are critical and can’t be provided by individuals or organizations, and a government which respects individuals personal freedoms. Conservatism also believes in equality. (In a nutshell)
“2) why do you think it offers more for the American people – make your case without providing us a diatribe against Liberalism; in other words, describe the _benefits_ of conservatism;”
To me this is not a bribe. This is what I see as one of the biggest problems with the government and polititians. Everything is about what they can do for you. Which polititician will promise you more and get more government money for you. That is one of the main reasons the government has become as bloated and corrupt as it has. We keep relying on the government for more and more and at the same time we then expect our government to do more and more for us and then we ask questions about what can our government do for us or which political philospy will offer more?
So does conservatism offer more to the American people? I think conservatism offers a government which our founding fathers originally envisioned or at the very least one closer to it. A government which enables people to do for themselves, not a government which provides for them.
To me Conservatism is about providing an atmosphere in which people are able to provide for themselves and are free to pursue those things which enable them to do so.
“3) what evidence can you site for your answer to number 2?”
Traditionally under conservatism the capitalist system thrives. You will see business grow, people doing more for themselves and being successful at it.
It is all nice and dandy to talk about conservatism and liberalism in the most general sense, but anymore, the difference between the two can be better seen in about 20 issues and you can see where liberalism and conservatism are at different ends of the spectrum. Everything from gun control, taxes, immigration, the military, and a whole litany of government programs, abortion, crime, religion, etc…
***Conservatism is the belief in personal responsibility
Notably absent in the Bush Administration. They’re not responsible for _anything_.
***a government which is fiscally responsible
We now have the largest deficits and national debt in our history. The Iraq war has left the Federal budget in tatters, and has largely been paid for with “off-budget” expenditures, just so the President can have his talking points.
*** a government which only provides for people those things which are critical and can’t be provided by individuals or organizations,
Organizations the government supports, you mean, such as the so-called ‘faith based’ initiatives. Organizations the Administration doesn’t like get targeted by domestic surveillance operations, such as the Society of Friends and other peaceful, peace-oriented groups.
***and a government which respects individuals personal freedoms.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA::choke::HAHAHAHAHAHAHAGood one.
***Conservatism also believes in equality.
Which is why todays SO-CALLED “conservatives” do everything they can to keep certain parts of society as unequal as they can get away with.
The modern Republican Party, ruled by Bush and his gang, has betrayed almost every single principle of traditional conservatism.
Experts: Climate Change Puts Sea at Risk
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j6Yg-hZ55TkIyVhoOySNyJC0X6iA
“ROME (AP) — Climate change is affecting Europe faster than the rest of the world and rising temperatures could transform the Mediterranean into a salty and stagnant sea, Italian experts said Wednesday.
Warmer waters and increased salinity could doom many of the sea’s plant and animal species and ravage the fishing industry, warned participants at a two-day climate change conference that brought together some 2,000 scientists and officials in Rome.”
More at link.
Tom,
The Republican party doesn’t equal conservatism.
President Bush is not a convservative.
Those of us who are have been upset with him for some time now.
Cosmos,
It would be great if you would ONLY post peer reviewed material and stop with the articles and links to biased websites…
“The modern Republican Party, ruled by Bush and his gang, has betrayed almost every single principle of traditional conservatism.”
This essentially would be the thesis of the John W. Dean book, _Conservatives Without Conscience_, but he also points out that these changes started before Bush.
Democratic Fundraiser Norman Hsu Mailed Suicide Note Last Week, Source Says
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296708,00.html
Clinton’s are NOT going to allow Hsu to testify.
Was the note in Bill or Hillary’s hand writing?
TIMES GIVES LEFTIES A HEFTY DISCOUNT FOR ‘BETRAY US’ AD
http://www.nypost.com/seven/09132007/news/nationalnews/times_gives_lefties_a_hefty_di.htm
Huh? Is the main stream press on the side of Democrats!?!
Say it isn’t so!
“***Conservatism also believes in equality.”
According to Dean, again, this was not held in high value by traditional conservatives. He makes the point that the Liberalism’s high value on equality is one of the important distinguishing features between the two ideologies.
“Warmer waters and increased salinity…”
If the ice caps are melting, doesn’t that dump more FRESH water into the oceans? I thought that was another driving factor, the seas being desalinated and increasing the cycle.
Sol, looks like the quote made reference to the Mediterranean only, not “the sea” in general.
Steven,
I would have to read his arguments and just what exactly he is qualifying as a conservative.
SolDevVB,
At the link: ” “The Mediterranean is becoming warmer and saltier” due to increased evaporation,…”
Oh boy, look out now… Definition city coming right up!!
“I would have to read his arguments and just what exactly he is qualifying as a conservative.”
I think it would be fair to say that he had a very difficult time defining what a conservative is and he points out the shortcomings of others in this endeavor.
cosmos only posts op ed pieces because he really doesn’t understand the science behind it.
If he actually read the science, he would realize that the “predictions” of these scientists all have a very large “IF” in front of them.
cosmos makes everything as an established fact and doesn’t even attempt to read about the science.
A foghorn that’s all toot and mostly gas.
Foghorns are supposed to be mostly all Toot… and the gas that it takes to run the foghorn as well… Foghorns are Warning Devices, after all…
A foghorn has no brain. It takes someone with a disciplined brain to know when to toot it.
To constantly toot a foghorn when there is no danger equates the “crying wolf” story.
Thing is, progressives and conservatives are the same thing- utopians. They just disagree on whether paradise is around the next bend or the last!
polar bears and foghorns and tooting oh my!
It is no wonder that he dems don’t want stringent voter id requirements.
Voter fraud case takes a new twist
Web Posted: 09/12/2007 10:28 PM CDT
Guillermo X. GarciaExpress-News
Officials involved in a joint federal-state probe say that some of the dozens of people under investigation in a months-long Bexar County voter fraud case may be charged with both state and federal crimes.
Federal investigators are to meet this week with local prosecutors to coordinate the cases being developed and determine who’ll face state felony charges for voting illegally and who will be deported for violating federal immigration law.
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No arrests have yet been made.
Authorities said they are anticipating charging some of the undocumented people alleged to have voted in Bexar County with felony violation of state law before they are turned over to immigration agents and likely deported.
As the federal portion of the investigation begun in late May winds down, Bexar County District Attorney Susan Reed will determine how she’ll proceed in the case of the 41 people who allegedly voted, some repeatedly, despite being non-citizens.
Reed’s office will determine who will be charged with felony offenses after a meeting between Homeland Security Department investigators from Immigration and Customs Enforcement and Adriana Biggs, Reed’s white-collar crime division chief.
“The joint federal-state strategy will likely be that (Bexar County) pursues felony voter fraud charges, while the parallel federal investigation will focus on violations related to identity theft, re-entry after deportation and other violations of (federal) immigration law,” ICE spokeswoman Nina Pruneda said Tuesday.
She said it appears likely that some of the investigation’s targets will be prosecuted in state court on voter fraud charges before facing an immigration law judge in deportation proceedings.
“They have not shown me what the results of their investigation reveals,” Biggs said, referring to ICE’s ongoing probe. “Once we have determined who is a citizen and who is not, then we’ll proceed with looking at filing state charges.”
The investigation was launched after Bexar County Elections Administrator Jacque Callanen apparently discovered that undocumented immigrants had voted, some several times, in more than a dozen local, state and federal elections between 2001 and early 2007.
She said it didn’t appear the illegal voting influenced an election’s outcome.
Callanen earlier this year was updating the county’s list of eligible voters when she discovered some 330 people who should not have been on the rolls because they weren’t citizens.http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA091307.03B.Voter_Fraud.2f71d87.html
JOIN THE GNOSTIC LIBERATION FRONT TODAY!!!!—–
Steven Davis
I don’t know about “traditional conservatives”, I would suggest that todays Conservatives believe in equal oportunity, but oppose government taking action to hold one group back or push another group forward, emphasis on GROUP.
For instance- I have no opposition to govt. assistance to help folks pay for college. It should however be based on financial need as opposed to GROUP identification such as race or gender.
Heh, I love how when there is a lull in posting, the sock puppets enter stage right.
Max writes–
IF Hsu survives, he may tell some interesting tales as part of a plea bargain. (He likely will have the same fate as Vince Foster).
*****
I am no friend of Hitlery (or Bill, the best REPUBLICAN president we ever had for that matter).
But implying that Vince Foster was MURDERED by the Clintons’ puts you in with the wacked-out right-wingers.
You just blew whatever credibility you had . . .
Bexar County. $HIT !!! That is my home town !!!
See, I never should have left ;->
ROFL!!!!
CapnAmerica,
Are YOU??? actually questioning someone elses credibility because of some conspiracy theory?
That’s it folks. Im outa here. I have to go prepare for the end of the world.
That Rapture must be getting ready to happen now!
yep, whatever gnostic, it sure does say a lot about the dems being the voter fraud people in your posted article. How far did ya have to search for that piece of tripe. Maybe you need your reading glasses renewed.
“Conservatism is the belief in… a government which respects individuals personal freedoms. Conservatism also believes in equality.” (2:30 p.m.)=================
Unless a certain kind of couple wants to get married, or a woman wants freedom of her reproductive rights…
Right on cue, sock puppets!
Chas, I’m glad you walked on by the first time. Keep up the good work this time. I think the childish calling out for you will soon get bored.
I know we are.
Solly, ever eat a Rosario’s? Kacees (sp) oyster bar? I worked there for a year and LOVED the food.
He led them straight to his den, and they never saw the king to tell him that the sky is falling.
Posted by: Palm Trees For Sale | September 13, 2007 at 03:19 PM
================================
We already had that post a few days ago… But I dont think that was the same poster… Hmmmm
I used to eat at Mario’s in San Antonio, it was an upscale Mexican food restaurant.
Even the tamales served out of the trunks of the cars they would sneak on base were good. :D
Go figure Chas. Maybe all the sock puppets lurk here with the regulars?
hehehehhehehehehehe….
Oh for some San Antone carne guisada on those thick, fluffy tortillas….
” He led them straight to his den, and they never saw the king to tell him that the sky is falling.”
. . . meanwhile, whatever and all his trolls followed agustus stupidus to the local cliff and they all fell 600′ to the bottom and were then eaten and digested by wolves. Their leavings still pollute the area. A super-fund cleanup has been mentioned, but who cares.
end of story.
Posted by: Kansas Gnostic | September 13, 2007 at 03:13 PM
=================
Ummmm I dont see the words Democratic, or Republican in whatever that was you posted, Gnostic… So, your point is??
Frmgrrl. Heard of em. Never made it there.
Mi Tiera? (sp?)Rudy’s BBQ?
Ashamed–
Bill O’Reilly is totally losing it.
What you posted shows his unhinged lunacy in supporting Worst. President. Ever.
There is no comparison between protecting our country from facsist armies bent on world domination and the ABILITY TO CARRY IT OUT in WWII and the war for oil in Iraq.
Jihadi terrorists are security threats — they are not military super-powers that can ever overthrow the free world like the Axis powers could have done.
Remind me again–why did Bill “Loofah” O’Reilly have to settle with his female co-worker?
What was it? Oh, yes, now I remember–unwanted phone sex with Mr. O’Reilly masturbating to orgasm.
Those conservative family values . . .
Cloudy, I think your post needs some kind of a link if you are going to make such an accusation…
“thick, fluffy tortillas….”
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl | September 13, 2007 at 03:26 PM
Can not BELIEVE you said that. I have been bitching to no end about the paper thin tortillas up here. Every self respecting Tex-Mex place down there made their own. I miss good Tex Mex like you wouldn’t believe!!!
Cloudy–
This registered democrat is saying it: “Hillary, step down and stop running for president!”
Damn, it’s not doing any good . . .
“If they could get a guarantee of this care without working how many would continue to go to work daily?”
How many who don’t have a guarantee of insurance or even have insurance continue to go to work daily?
Are you saying that having insurance is the only reason some people work?
And the sock puppets ballet is now on the stage… I never did like Ballet much, except for Swan Lake, and the March of the Toy Soldiers
Bill Miller’s Barbecue in San Antonio and fresh pecan pie!
Yummy!
I had a strange thought… Somebody had to “front” all that money to Hsu… Maybe it was a wealthy Republican, who wanted to pull a fast one, in order to make Sen. Clinton look bad….
I mean, it could happen….
THAT is a blatantly FAKE post!!!
THAT will be turned in for complaint… immediately…
Bill Millers. Damn. forgot about that one.
Bongo Joe.
The river walk
NIOSA
The Rodeo.
Damn, too much to list…
OMG, the rhaspa wars….
Nathan says that “under conservatives, capitalism thrives.”
Uh, sure, Nathan. I guess that explains the Great Depression that occurred under Hoover.
Actually, national debt goes down and the stock market climbs higher during Democratic presidencies.
Here is a test along the dimensions of Freedom-Order-Equality that some writers felt related to conservatism and liberalism. There is a tutorial with it also:
http://idealog.org/
Here is a libertarian test:
http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html
Chas,
Wetbacks and other, mainly minority criminals only ever vote for lib-dems, it’s a fact.
JOIN THE GNOSTIC LIBERATION FRONT TODAY!!!
Be a Green IconSubmit to win $20,000 for your favorite non-profit»Vote or Enter NowMake a DifferenceJoin the solution. Reduce your carbon emissions.» Count Me InFeatured BlogEcoGeek – The latest in green technology.»See What’s New Big climate change did not kill NeanderthalsWed, 12 Sep 2007 18:20:49 GMT
Email this Page IM this Story Bookmark this Story Add to your Del.icio.us account Digg this Story
LONDON (Reuters) – Neanderthals probably fell victim to taller and superior Cro-Magnons rather than catastrophic climate change, researchers said on Wednesday.
Using a new method to calibrate carbon-14 dating, the international team found the last Neanderthals died at least 3,000 years before a major change in temperatures occurred.
This suggests either modern humans or a combination of humans and less severe climate change caused the species’ demise some 30,000 years ago, said Chronis Tzedakis, a paleoecologist at the University of Leeds, who led the study published in the journal Nature.
“What clearly emerges from our study is we can eliminate abrupt, catastrophic climate change,” he said in a telephone interview.
“It does point toward humans being involved as a factor.”
Neanderthals were a dead-end offshoot of the human line who inhabited Europe and parts of west and central Asia.
Despite their image as club-carrying hairy brutes, research suggests they were expert tool-makers, used animal skins to keep warm and cared for each other.
Most researchers believe Neanderthals survived in Europe until the arrival of fully modern humans about 30,000 years ago but controversial findings last year indicated they might have survived to as recently as 24,000 years ago.
Some have used the more recent date to link the disappearance of the Neanderthals with drastic climate changes during the destruction of ice shelves that allowed modern humans to thrive, the researchers wrote.
But using radiocarbon dating on sediment samples collected from deep beneath the sea off Venezuela, the team painted a climate picture during the time of the last Neanderthals and found they died out long before such severe climate events.
The team found that even though temperatures were fluctuating 30,000 years ago, the swings were not severe and similar to climate changes Neanderthals previously withstood.
Additionally, none of the dates ranging from 24,000 to 32,000 years ago that the researchers tested corresponded with any big climate changes.
This makes it likely that a combination of climate change and the impact of humans was responsible for the disappearance of Neanderthals, Tzedakis said.
One theory is that colder weather in northern regions spurred a migration of Neanderthals and modern-day humans to southern Europe where the last known Neanderthals lived.
“They went through these climate events before and bounced back,” Tzedakis said. “Climate on its own may not be the most parsimonious explanation.”http://green.yahoo.com/index.php?q=node/1586
Ruth’s Chris
Papadeaux’s
The best damn thing in MI is freakin Olive Garden or Ruby Tuesday’s. They don’t care about flavor or taste up here. Just portion size.
When asked how a new restaurant was, a michigander will reply by making a circle with his hands approximating the portion of food. Gotta love yankees… NOT !!!
Chas, all that money is tied to the Chinese.
It’s Bill and Hillary’s old friends from China give them a wink, nod and a nudge.
To Chinese bribery is a way of life, nothing unusual for them to do this.
http://money.cnn.com/2004/01/21/markets/election_demsvreps/
Surprise: Dems are better for rallies
Despite ‘market friendly’ Republican policies, stocks rise more and volatility dips under Democrats.
January 22, 2004: 2:11 PM EST
By Alexandra Twin, CNN/Money Staff WriterNEW YORK (CNN/Money) – Plenty of Wall Streeters are Republicans. The party’s policies are seen as better for big business and therefore better for the stock market.
“Democrats are seen as being pro-regulatory, and more willing to enact laws against Wall Street and laws against CEOs,” said Don Luskin, chief investment officer at Trend Macrolytics.
But here’s Wall Street’s strange little irony — studies show the stock market performs better and tends to be less volatile when Democrats are in power.
This discrepancy was explored recently in a study by two finance professors at the University of California at Los Angeles, Pedro Santa-Clara and Rossen Valkanov.
According to their paper, entitled, “The Presidential Puzzle: Political Cycles and the Stock Market” and published in the October issue of the Journal of Finance, stock market returns are on average about 5 percent higher when the White House is run by a Democrat than during Republican rule.
Looking at the 72-year period between 1927 and 1999, the study shows that a broad stock index, similar to the S&P 500, returned approximately 11 percent more a year on average under a Democratic president versus safer, three-month Treasurys. By comparison, the index only returned 2 percent more a year versus the T-bills when Republicans were in office.
The study also looked at how the index responded under both Democrats and Republicans, using two portfolios tracked by the Center for Research in Security Prices, a research outfit affiliated with the University of Chicago’s business school.
The “value-weighted portfolio” ranks all the stocks in the index according to their total market value, whereas in the “equal-weighted portfolio” the stocks are all ranked the same.
On average, value-weighted portfolios returned 9 percent more under Democrats than Republicans during the 72 year period, while equal-weighted portfolios returned 16 percent more under Democrats.
“I think plenty on Wall Street would be pretty shocked to hear that,” said Barry Ritholtz, a market analyst at Maxim Group.
The study examined a variety of reasons that might have caused this discrepancy. One particularly interesting finding was that markets seemed to show more surprise in reaction to economic or stock-related decisions made by Democratic administrations.
“It thus seems that the difference in realized returns can be attributed to the market being systematically positively surprised by Democratic policies,” the professors wrote.
According to their study, the difference in stock returns becomes gradually obvious through the course of a presidency, rather than in the period immediately surrounding an election.
Volatility down under Dems, too
Critics say that if the Democrats should win the presidential election in November, the almost year-old stock rally could be in trouble, largely because many of the Democratic candidates have vowed to scale back some or all of the $1.3 trillion in tax cuts that President Bush enacted in 2003.
In addition, critics fear that a Democratic administration would make markets more volatile. This is because of extensive research showing that gross domestic product growth is slower during Republican presidential mandates and that higher interest rates are more common during Democratic mandates.
However, volatility is actually lower during Democratic presidencies, according to both the UCLA study and another recent study by two political science professors — David Leblang of the University of Colorado and Bumba Mukherjee of Florida State University.
The study — which tracks stock market returns since the first day the Dow Jones industrial average was calculated in 1896 through the fall of 2001 — shows that market volatility decreases during Democratic administrations.
The paper argues that the expectation that inflation rates will rise under left-wing presidential administrations does indeed have an impact on trading, as older studies have suggested, but in a different way than those studies proposed.
“Our model predicts that rational expectations for higher interest rates under left-wing administrations decreases demand for stocks among traders,” the professors write. “This decrease in demand leads to a decline in stock price volatility not only during the incumbency of left-wing governments, but also when traders expect the left-wing party to win elections.”
Alternately, the statistics also show that expectations of lower inflation under right wing administrations make the market more volatile. This is because traders increase their inflow of capital and investment into the stock market when they believe the interest-rate environment is more friendly for stocks. More money at work translates into more volatility in the markets.
The study showed this trend was consistent regardless of whether a right wing administration was in office or whether traders merely expected the Republican party to win the presidential election.—–
“Are you saying that having insurance is the only reason some people work?”
Thank you Rox, that was going to be my question, but I forgot about it when I moved on to something else. I think I mention upthread that conservatives tend to suspicious of human nature, which may be what drives views like this.
I think most all rational actors will try to get the best deal they can. But, that does not mean that there are a multitude waiting to rip me off to achieve this same best deal. I hope that distinction makes sense.
Tony Rodham, Hog Futures Hillary’s brother, quietly settled the lawsuit out of court for selling White House pardons for William the Slick. Another brother, Hugh Rodham, merely returned the money (or pretended to, some say) that he got for selling pardons, when he also got caught.Meanwhile, Hillary’s filthy luchre slinger Hsu is locked up again, not that the leftist media has much of anything to say about that, either.
“JOIN THE GNOSTIC LIBERATION FRONT TODAY!!!!”
Just to make it clear, I have absolutely nothing to do with this apparently racist flake.
ksAgnostic
Thats good… BIG difference between agnostic, and Gnostic
What is carne guisada?
http://idealog.org/
Here is a libertarian test:
http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html
Posted by: Steven Davis | September 13, 2007 at 03:36 PM
Those were cool tests SD. Thanx so much. My step son just turned 18. He smiled from ear to ear when his voter registration card showed up.
I asked if he was going to vote in the next election. He said, “If you tell me who to vote for.”
I told him I absolutely would NOT, but I would try to get him up to speed on who the candidates were and what the issues were.
Now I have another tool to help him decide for himself.
Thanx again SD.
Meat and something, Wichi
What is carne guisada?
Posted by: WichiWomn | September 13, 2007 at 03:55 PM
It is THE most wonderful beef dish. Served in a tangy spicy brown – sauce – for lack of a better term. Slop some on a nice fat flower tortilla and chow down. Grrl, you still around? You are better with words than I.
Hmmmm gotta try that one Sol!!
Best with rice & beans too…
Y’all ever heard of Taco Cabana or Cha Cho’s?
“Fast Food” tex mex, but served on stoneware. Awesome and fast.
Try the strawberry margaritas too…
This sounds REAL good>>>
CARNE GUISADABoil potatoes. Cut steak in bite-size strips and season generously with the following seasonings: cumin – comino, garlic powder, salt and pepper. …
I’ll settle for a regular Margarita myself… :-)
It sounds a lot like carne asada
The sauce is the marinade. I buy meat at the local hispanic markets and grill it up with onions, peppers, tomatoes and jalepenos. Add some avocado slices and yum! I’m leaving, ya’ll are makin’ me hungry!
Geez,
apparently since i hold the opinion that our actions in the past (and present) contributed to Bin Laden’s hatred of us, culminating in the 9/11 attacks, suddenly I am un-American.
Glad to know that…
Although, i have to tell you my brother in law the soldier and exfiancee still in the cavalry, who BOTH served in Iraq, would probably disagree with you there. I wholeheartedly support our troops. What I don’t support is the administration who placed them in harms way by starting a war we had no business starting..
And FYI, rfl, YES i would support the war if it were in Afghanistan, you know, where Bin Laden is… and Al Queda had no known presence in Iraq prior to the beginning of Operation Iraqi Freedom, so your arguements about current day Al Queda activities have no bearing on the excuse that they are the reason we are there, because they are not and in fact, they were never the reason for us going there – which is why I STILL can’t figure out how people relate Iraq to 9/11, except in relation to the time-frames…
OMG, you all are making me laugh my ASS off with this food discussion.
Wichi, Carne Guisada is much like Carne asada, except asada is usually grilled steak, as you mention, while GUISADA is usually cut up chuck roast or such smothered in this spicy brown gravey, rich and velvety because the peppers and onions have cooked down into the sauce.
Then when you gently fold it (not slop it!) into a thick flour tortilla that is fluffy on the inside and slightly browned and crispy on the outside…
Oh hell, now I’m hungry too. It’s better than sex, that’s all I gots to say!
Blanket equality exists nowhere in nature so the fact that libs believe in it is telling. Subscribing to nonsensical notions of “equality” is akin to wishing and hoping for a visit from the tooth fairy. Libs are insane.
JOIN THE GNOSTIC LIBERATION FRONT TODAY!!!
Damn KFG now I gotta go to the store even Better than sex, eh?? Hmmmm has to be good eatin!!!
And I’m HOWLING about your restaurant recollection. Rudy’s RULES!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bill Millers is good and I like their sweet tea. Taco Cabana is great for breakfast tacos and such and I like their pico de gallo and grilled chicken too.
And what can I say about dirty rice, Oysters Papadeux and Redfish Ponchatrain? Not to mention the Bananas Foster. All I can say is AAYEEEEEE!!!!!!
Ever been to Dirty Dicks? heheheheh!
Oh yeah, and the frozen marguritas and jazz outside on the riverwalk at the Hyatt.
Sigh. I miss Texas…
The best carne guisada was at this place on McCulluh (Sp) but damned if I can remember the name. I had a consulting job at San Antonio College and we ate those damn tacos everyday for breakfast.
loser of the draw had to make the run…
Yep Chas, better than sex!
Cheaper too most of the time, and tortillas never want to know if you really, REALLY love them….
kfg, there was a place called Bwana Dicks in San Antonio. Is that Dirty Dicks now?
Anyway, it was a gay bar and restaurant. I got trapped into going there by some friends and didn’t realize it until the female (a dude) was dancing in front of me. He had a 5-oclock shadow, so I was a bit repulsed. But that’s my personal taste in sexual choice.
My friends got a good laugh at my expense. Oh by the way, my friends as I had suspicioned were gay and very nice fellows. I kept their little secret and they became career officers.
There were so many restaurants in San Antonio and most of them were excellent. Some hole in the walls, I don’t even remember the names, but had outstanding food.
Little Red Barn was infamous for their steaks. It sat right underneath an Interstate underpass. Was a huge place, great steaks, ice tea and pie. Really good Texas eats there!
No Kansas, I dont know the place you speak of, but then, I’ve never been to a gay bar in San Antonio. I was too busy working!
Dirty Dicks is on or near the riverwalk, a beer and burger joint where they cut off your tie if you wear one. I might have the name wrong. I was only there once, and my recollection of the place is, um, fuzzy, heheh, at best.
But I do remember the col’ beer as they say in Texas, and huge burgers and a pile of onion rings.
But that’s the last I rememer….
Oh yeah Solly, and Ruth Chris’ in Austin too. Back when I was rich. Hehehe. Now, I just grill my own homegrown steak with yukon golds from the garden.
kfg, I was first introduced to Texas talk when I went to San Antonio. It took awhile for my ears to get adjusted to what they were saying.
The guy in a restaurant seated at the table next to me was ordering while we waiting for our food. You’ll probably appreciate the talk as your a native.
“I’ll hav one of them sumbeeches rat there and gimme two scoops and saddle it up wit some chocolate syrp.”
Like they say in Texas, it’s a whole different country. :)
I’m not a native Kansas. I was born here. But as they say in Texas…
“Ah waznt burn here, but ah got hair az quick az ah cud.”
Farmgal,But will you respect those tortillas in the morning?
LOL Jed!!!
they should start a food thread in here.
it’s way more interesting than who is a real christian, or a real american.
and, the best may be tex-mex or whatever you want to call it.
that’s real not fake americanized food, as in driving around harlingin with a native who says… you may of noticed there are no taco bells around here.
breakfast tacos… yummmmy
or is that… Harlingen
Love mexican food, but I will often take the Americanized version. Bad me. I like cheese, and I hate havaneros!
Out of here. So do not think I am not answering. Well, I guess I am, but not intentionally. I will be away from my computer until late. See ya’all.
“Like they say in Texas, it’s a whole different country. :)”
I believe the correct wording of that is, ‘Texas, it’s like a whole other country.’
And all y’all are givin me a major case of heartburn.
Oops, that’s right Rox.
Don’t leave yet, we haven’t talked about chorizo and eggs for breakfast, menudo for lunch and the infamous jabnernos and jalepenos gobbling contest yet!
::reaching for the Prilosec::
But y’all enjoy!
chorizo and eggs for breakfastyesyesyesthat’s some good shi… ahh, food.just don’t read the list of ingredients.
OK…1. name your favorite mexican restaurant can
2. favorite not a mexican restaurant
surfing the texas site i came across the Trans-TexasCorridor super highway that starts in mexico and ends up in canada.
http://ttc.keeptexasmoving.org/
i was wondering if the state of kansas has started to make information public about the super highway through our state.
Why do you think they want to build the casino south of Derby? One of the proposed corridors for the super highway.
Elevated Rodent Envy?
New Jersey Supreme Court to Decide If Town Can Display Super-Sized Inflatable Rat
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296738,00.html
TRENTON, N.J. — The state Supreme Court has dealt with such weighty issues as gay marriage, education funding and abortion rights. Now, the high court will turn its attention to whether a 20-foot inflatable rat can be kept out of a New Jersey town.
A three-judge appeals panel ruled Thursday that Lawrence Township could ban the big black rat. But the litigants can appeal automatically to the state Supreme Court because of one judge’s partial dissent.
“We’re disappointed, but the dissent gives us an automatic appeal to the Supreme Court of New Jersey. That’s the silver lining,” said Andrew Watson, a lawyer arguing for the right of a union local to display the rat during a job site protest.
The super-sized rat — on its hind legs and bearing fangs — had been blown up and situated at a 2005 labor event until police ticketed the senior union official onsite for violating a local sign law.
cont’d at URL above
The Blog is beginning to feel a lot like the movie “GROUNDHOG DAY”
Any way on to more serious stuff — I think some of you gun enthusiasts would love the movie “Shoot Em Up” now in theaters….. lots of shooting scenes with what appear to be some pretty exotic / hi tech weapons. In a small way it advocates for pro-life (while about 200 bad guys are shot). It even has some political twists that I think were written by the NRA. For the CC crowd there are a couple of scenes that would be instructive:
1. How to shoot 30 bad guys with Uzi’s and other automatic weapons.in an abandoned warehouse, killing em all — while holding a 3 day old baby.
2. Or for extra level of security for yuor house — how you can cover every room in the house with automatic weapons with duct tape and broom handles and rope — controlling them all from you safe room.
3. And the one I think you’d find most invaluable. In the event you forget (god forbid) to pack your heater — how to disable an armed man holding a big gun at your head — with a carrot –
A must see —- and a trip to the veggie stand ………….
Ken,
All the reviews that I have read said it was promoting an anti-gun undertone.
At least the ones I read on Rotten Tomatoes…
nathan………….do the world a favor and look into the barrel while you are cleaning a loaded firearm
Another thing about us Dems. We are non-violent and logical. Not governed by uncontrolled stupidity or wishing harm to any living thing.
Well, except for Apophis.
I had a strange thought… Somebody had to “front” all that money to Hsu… Maybe it was a wealthy Republican, who wanted to pull a fast one, in order to make Sen. Clinton look bad….
I mean, it could happen….
Sorry dummocrat………..I am really non-violent……………nathan brings out the WORST in me……..
De-fund the War… Support our Troops… Bring them home starting NOW!!
Bush says the people in Anbar are happy that they arent afraid of getting beheaded for talking to US or Iraqi troops…
Perhaps not…
NOW they are afraid of getting blown up by a Bomb stepping out of their houses…
Wow, gnostics, agnostics, are there no Cathars kicking around the place?
I must say, Gnostic did run roughshod over the ridiculous diversity and global warming mongers, good show!
Chas,
Please keep the conspiracy nonsense to a minimum, thanks.
Apophis,
You are a rude little twerp! Nathan is a vet, show him a modicum of respect.
180*
why should I show any nazi any repect dukat?
People get respect when it’s earned. Nathan has not earned my respect! In fact, he colors my view of military and I have to fight the impressions he leaves to KNOW most are not him.
Apophis, looks like you never got that rectocrainal inversion. About time!
Lindainks55, looks like you are in bed with Apophis. That is really gross! Both of you are unamerican! You should leave he country!
And the sock puppet ballet continues… and so it goes…
That was a rousing speech by Senator Jack Reed tonight! He should be the one running for President.
It’s about time Americans get the heck out of Iraq, and a rapid redeployment is what we really need to bring our troops home!
I’m sick of Iraq already! Let’s get out of there.
Only Jack Reed gives us hope.
If Iraq blows up after we are gone, who cares? It’s not our problem!
After that speech from Reed, I’m convinced the Democrats have the best plan to keep America safe!
Good Night; Good Luck; and God Bless, whatever you conceive God to be!
Nite all!!
Chas is saying good night again!
Let’s keep count!
Hsu Had Ties To Former Clinton Scandal Figure Bernie Schwartz of Loral?
This link will not shock Clinton-era Scandalologists… Hillary’s team sure did a dramatic about-face on Hsu, going from defending him to turning over his donations within a few hours. Maybe her people became aware of this connection to a scandal of the past…
Before his forced resignation last week, Norman Yuan Yuen Hsu sat on the board of trustees of the liberal New School university in New York with former Loral Corp. head Bernard L. Schwartz, who was allowed to transfer restricted satellite and missile technology to a People’s Liberation Army front after contributing a record amount of cash to President Clinton’s 1996 campaign…
Schwartz, vice chairman of the New School board, was among officials who introduced Hsu to the school’s administration, WND has learned.
Last November, Schwartz and Hsu chaired a New School banquet at the Mandarin Oriental in New York which featured Sen. Clinton as keynote speaker. Clinton steered a $1 million federal grant to the college.
http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/post/?q=OGYyZDE0YTlkZmVlYmRhYmU0YmZkMGIwOGRhOTYwYTM=
Did you ever notice that Chas doesn’t really go away when he says goodnight?
Looks like a lot of palms are being greased “Breaking News.”
And Chas is a Christian Minister who is for abortion, and for Karl Marx, and he behaves so badly, especially late at night.
Oh please come back Chas! I miss your 250 posts every 2 minutes on this blog!
Did you know Chas supports gay rights and gay marriages too, rather odd for a Christian Minister.
Church of Sodom?
Well good night everyone. I wanted to start early tonight.
I didn’t think it was a message movie — if anything I think it would give more credence to CC laws …
…. but my review was not intended to start another GC debate, lots of action for a noble cause saving a baby’s life in the midst of about 10000 bullets whizzing by — humorous in that really goes out on a limb for that “… willful suspension of disbelief …” ———
Chas, you are back!
I sure miss you! It’s been almost a week since you moved away from home. You can come home anytime you know son.
Linda
You’re right, take some solace in that he is a part timer —- but also know that he is trained to be single minded of purpose —- we want him on that wall for that reason ….
Democrats take the low road in raising money, surpised?
“Money is the original sin of politics,” Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) said in a Web forum yesterday. “When you’re running for President you’re going to do some sinning when it comes to raising money, because otherwise you can’t compete.”
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wn_report/2007/09/13/2007-09-13_hillary_returns_dirty_cash_says_donors_c-2.html
fake chas,
Please don’t impersonate the real Chas or he might pop a blood vessel in his melon and that wouldn’t be good.
Thanks,
The Management
180*
NYT Admits Hsu Fund-Raising Scandal Not Being Covered by MSM
(Great photo on this link with Hillary and Hsu)
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/warner-todd-huston/2007/09/11/times-admits-hsu-fund-raising-scandal-not-being-covered-msm
Gen. David Petraeus is an honorable and dedicated professional. Apparently the democrats plan to continue degrading remarks about the General via MOVEON.org to hide their resentment.
They should be ashamed. I’m sorry it didn’t work out for the surrendercrats, but sometimes we just have to have some good news.
I’m sorry you have to twist that news by bringing disgraceful remarks toward our military men who are just doing their jobs.
I’m sorry you can’t use it for political advantage as a positive report.
I’m really not surprised.
First you voted for the war,then you claim it’s Bush’s.
Then you campaign to not fund the war, and then you fund it.
Then you provide 100% endorsement of Gen. David Petraeus’ appointment, and then you say he is a disgrace.
I’m afraid what is most important to democrats is that the USA loose the war in Iraq. Nothing else seems to matter.
Stealing Names is a serious offense on most blogs. It would seem that posters here just do what ever they want. This Blog is in bad need of a Monitor System. I must be sure to advise our Office of that need.
Max, are you brain dead too??? How many times do I have to post on here… I AM NOT A DEMOCRAT… I AM A LIBERTARIAN, WITH LEFTIST LEANINGS… stop calling me a freaking Democrat!!!
Posted by: Chas. | September 12, 2007 at 11:10 PM
I’m not sure Chas truly knows who or WHAT he is. Sometimes he is an ordained Christian minister (reverend?), but then he says God is whatever you want him to be and does not profess to follow Christ.
I’m afraid he is whatever he pretends to be at the moment when it is convenient.
Unfortunately, I cannot abide by his representation of Christianity. TO each his own, until one begs to be called an expert in the field. Then his posts on his religion become, well fair game.
Say Gunny, you see the circus act Congress conducted in questioning or rather interrogating Gen. Petraeus?
Question, then comment, then wild accusation, followed by no time for the General to answer.
It wasn’t a hearing! They hardly let the General speak!
It was a sick and disgusting show, put on by Congressional Democrats. From watching them, it’s hard to believe they are adults, much less elected Congressmen.
Yes, I’m ready to go to work when called by the Eagle.
I will decide who and what get’s posted here.
I will make sure this blog is decent and politically correct.
And then this will be a heavenly blog!
It would seem that posters here just do what ever they want. This Blog is in bad need of a Monitor System. I must be sure to advise our Office of that need.
Earlier on this thread, Mr. Herron, you made a post favoring Democrats. Now you make a disparaging post against Democrats.
Do you steal other names as well?
Chas isn’t converting too many Christian followers on this blog.
I thought that was a big role for Christians, but apparently not for Chas and his God and his Bible.
I will make sure this blog is decent and politically correct.
And then this will be a heavenly blog!
Posted by: Censor
Equal access is within the liberal platform. Which means to censure and cut off any opposing views.
Anyone who sees questionable posts on this Blog, please send a copy of the post, to the FBI office nearest you: http://www.fbi.gov
Say Fred, don’t you know sarcasm when you see it?
Did you SEE Senator Reed’s speech?
God man, he’s an idiot with no speaking ability whatsoever! Is this guy the best the Democrats have to rebut the President?
Thank you for your time and attention. Have a nice evening.
Anyone who sees questionable posts on this Blog, please send a copy of the post, to the FBI office nearest you: http://www.fbi.gov
Posted by: Fed One | September 13, 2007 at 10:30 PM
And the censoring by government begins. Sad day in the USA.
It was a sick and disgusting show, put on by Congressional Democrats. From watching them, it’s hard to believe they are adults, much less elected Congressmen. Posted by: Pat Herron
The liberals in Congress, as well as the candidates were publicly ridiculing the General’s report – before he even reported it.
It’s like Congress decided the General was WRONG before they even HEARD him speak.
Very sad state of affairs. Worse, the koolaide crowd is not even seeing these facts. They do NOT question their leadership.
Not one negative post about MOVEON.org’s Gen. David Petraeus comments? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?
That was a rousing speech by Senator Jack Reed tonight! He should be the one running for President.
It’s about time Americans get the heck out of Iraq, and a rapid redeployment is what we really need to bring our troops home!
I’m sick of Iraq already! Let’s get out of there.
Only Jack Reed gives us hope.
If Iraq blows up after we are gone, who cares? It’s not our problem!
After that speech from Reed, I’m convinced the Democrats have the best plan to keep America safe!
Posted by: Pat Herron | September 13, 2007 at 09:45 PM
You will not coerce me into any kind of childish name-calling.
Chas.
YOU BIGOTED LIAR!!! What kind of nuts you got Golf nut??? Golf Balls???Posted by: Chas. | August 25, 2007 at 10:37 PM
YOU ARE A SHAMELESS BIGOT!! AND YOU ARE A BLATANT LIAR, YOU ARE BOTH GOOD CANDIDATES FOR THE HITLER GOON SQUAD!!! THATS ALL YOU ARE GOOD FOR!! Posted by: Chas. | August 25, 2007 at 10:48 PM
Now the idiotPosted by: Chas. | August 25, 2007 at 11:09 PM
Be gone, Devils!!!Posted by: Chas. | August 25, 2007 at 11:42 PM
Holy One, Let my prayers rise before you as incense… And may the Demons of the WE Blog be cast down to the bottom of the Pit!!Posted by: Chas. | August 26, 2007 at 12:19 AM
BTW Kansas… Ahole… IPosted by: Chas. | August 26, 2007 at 12:22 AM
What a bunch of Cripps and losersPosted by: Chas. | August 26, 2007 at 12:30 AM
***The above posts were brought to you by the Christian minister Chas***
Gunny, there was one post above with the link below. Moveon.org received a $75,000 price break for their inflamatory full-page ad in the NY Times.
Attack the General Ad sale, normally $185,000, on sale today for $110,000.
The press attacks the President and hides Hillary Clinton’s Campaign Scandal.
TIMES GIVES LEFTIES A HEFTY DISCOUNT FOR ‘BETRAY US’ AD
http://www.nypost.com/seven/09132007/news/nationalnews/times_gives_lefties_a_hefty_di.htm
I normally enjoy time spent on a Blog. But much of what I see here is fake posting, and name stealing, and personal attacks, and very little, if any, actual discussion, or debate. I thought this City was truly different. But after my brief stay here, I am not sure anymore.
People here seem to make fun of religion in nearly every form. And the name calling, and the personal attacks are beyond absurd.
Much of the attacking on this Blog is in the textbook category of bullying. It is a wonder that anybody bothers to attempt posting anything decent, or serious.
It is a sad day, if this is any thing typical of what your country has now become. And yet, you want the world to think of you as a great Nation on the world stage.
I must now re-think much of what I have told numerous audiences in the past weeks that I have been here.
I suppose I should thank you for showing me what this once great land has evolved to be.
Praise God.
Please vote and support the pullout of american forces from all arabic countries. God willing we will be successful together.
Please vote and support candidate who will stop the American Israeli war against Palestinian people. God willing we will be successful together.
Please vote and support leaders who will remove american forces from bases in arab countries. God willing we will be successful together.
Praise God.
Hey all you sick twisted freaks! I am a 445 pound Biker. I have a beard that is runnin ZZ TOP a race for length. I ride a big ol’ Indian Motorcycle that I rebuilt from some parts I bought off some dumb farmer in North Dakota, that didnt know what he had.
I go all over the country preachin the Love of Jesus to anybody who wants to know what the real Jesus was all about. The Jesus that opposed the straight laced religious leaders of his time. The Jesus that distanced himself from the government big shots of his time. The Jesus that had the balls to reach out and touch a poor sufferin leper in need of love. The Jesus that befriended a poor hooker woman, and made her his own. The Jesus that hung out with stinkin fishermen.
You know, the Jesus of the Good Book! The Book I carry in my black leather back pack, with a big ol’ gold cross on the back of it.
I wear a black leather vest, with black leather pants, and a big pair of black leather butt kickin boots.
I preach in any church that will dare to invite me in.
I found my Jesus at a biker rally in California, when some really cute lookin chick got up on a big ol’ Harley, and started singin Amazing Grace one hot summer sunday morning. Since then, its been me and Jesus all the way!
And I want you to know, my Jesus loves everybody. He looks beyond all our faults, and sees straight thru to all our needs. He takes us where we are, and makes us better. And he doesnt care what we look like, or what we wear, or what kind of ride we pimp!
So, go find my Jesus! And see what he can do for you!
My hair is still the same. My beard hasnt changed. I still love a cold beer on a hot day! And Jesus still loves me just the way I am! Because I havent tried to whitewash what I was, and blame it on somebody or something else.
Find me some time. Just look for a big ol’ fat biker, with a long beard, preachin from a big black Bible, with a whole bunch of ordinary lookin people gathered round the old Indian bike!
Lord bless ya now!
Way to Go Thompson!
Daily Presidential Tracking PollThursday, September 13, 2007
The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Thursday brings good news for Fred Thompson and John McCain in the race for the Republican Presidential Nomination.
For the third straight day, Thompson is the top choice for 28% of Likely Republican Primary Voters. For the first time all year, Rudy Giuliani has fallen below the 20% level of support and is now the favorite for just 19%. Arizona Senator John McCain moves up to 13% and now has a three-point advantage over former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney at 10%. Former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee remains atop the second tier at 5% (see recent daily numbers).
Thompson now leads Giuliani by 14 percentage points among political conservatives. It will be interesting to see how long the Thompson bounce can be sustained and if it translates into success in key states.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/daily_presidential_tracking_poll__1
Wow,
I guess Linda and Apophis want me to kill myself?
I may have a different opinion and I may voice it loudly…
But saying I should look down the barrel of a loaded gun?
Well you see Nathan, Libs can suggest violent death and say they were making metaphor or some other silly thing.
If a right winger does something like a punch in the nose suggestion, then it suddenly becomes a capital offense.
Hypocrisy at its finest brought to you by the Liberal Cheese Eating Orangutans.
Mr. Nathan, from my observations, it would appear that you LOVE your guns very much. Perhaps if you were not so exuberant over your degree of fire power, people would not feel so uncomfortable.
Just an observation, from one who comes from a land where guns are mainly forbidden.
Due to an early morning committment I am away to my sleeping quarters for the night.
Thank you.
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