It’s good news that the arena sales tax is bringing in more revenue than expected, contrary to the complaints of some arena opponents. Sedgwick County now expects to collect $205.5 million during the 30-month life of the sales tax, which expires Dec. 31, rather than the $184.5 million original estimate or the $201 million revised estimate. The extra revenue, which by law can be used only on arena-related projects, will help cover the higher-than-projected construction costs and is an indication that the local economy is strong (and hasn’t suffered much under the 1-cent sales tax, as some opponents predicted).
Posted by Phillip Brownlee
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47 Comments
Praise Allah, the Koch bros. will get their tax-payer subsidized sky boxes.
How did we ever go this long without ice hockey in town?
ACCORDING TO PHIL BROWNLEE’S LOGIC, IT’S REALLY, REALLY GOOD NEWS THAT OUR THREE HOLDOVER COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, DAVID UNRUH, TIM NORTON AND TOM WINTERS IN THEIR COLLECTIVE WISDOM CHOSE TO SPEND SOME $21 MILLION DOLLARS … MORE … OF YOUR TAX MONEY FOR THE PROPOSED WHITE ELEPHANT DOWNTOWN ARENA.
And at the same time eliminate all funds for parking and operational costs etc. on the theory the City of Wichita’s taxpayers should eventually pick up these costs if they want to actually use the arena.
According to Mr. Brownlee’s logic, Boston’s “big dig” and Alaska’s $200,000,000 “bridge to nowhere,” to an island with 50 residents, would be outstanding expenditures of mostly federal taxes because they produce jobs regardless of need.
Locally, Mr. Brownlee could be expected to praise the ZEBRA MUSSEL infestation of Cheney Lake because a large amount of Wichita’s tax funds will be needed to protect Wichita’s drinking water.
Perhaps the BEACON CAFE next door to the EAGLE’S massive downtown headquarters can be converted to a ZEBRA MUSSEL DELICATESSAN TO USE THESE TERRORIST INVADERS.
ACCORDING TO STATEMENTS IN THE WICHITA EAGLE, EVERY PENNY OF INCOME FROM THE ARENA SALES TAX MUST BE SPENT ON THE ARENA. HOWEVER, SO FAR I HAVEN’T SEEN ANY COMMENT ABOUT HOW THE INTEREST COLLECTED ON THE ARENA FUNDS WILL BE USED. ACCORDING TO MY QUICK ESTIMATE, THESE UN-EARMARKED FUNDS COULD BE SOME $25,000,000 … MUCH MORE THAN A PENNY.
It appears to me a few carpet baggers from Alabama, Georgia and Florida plus the three holdover county commissioners are having great fun spending a massive amount of your tax dollars for this unneeded, unwanted downtown white elephant arena.
Its already a massive albatross around the collective necks of Sedgwick County taxpayers.
SO LETS CANCEL THIS IDIOTIC UGLY, DANGEROUS, STEEL AND GLASS BUILDING CIRCA 1960′S BEFORE ITS TOO LATE.
It’s already how much over budget, and no ground broken yet? But don’t worry, there will be plenty of parking . . . somewhere.
We have been to OKC a few times to the Ford Center. Private lots provide the lion’s share of parking and walking 10-15 blocks is not unusual.
Build a great arena, allow the management company the opportunity to fill it, and Parking will be establishe by the private sector.
I am excited that quality will NOT be sacrificed.
Let’s “git er done”. Get the thing built and start bringing in the concerts and other events.
I thought the parking issue was already settled. Our county commissioners said there was lots of parking available (no pun intended).
While it is not exactly in walking distance, it seems there is plenty of parking spots that have been made available at the former Kansas Coliseum, the Wichita Greyhound Park, and Wild West World.
Ha! And they told us people wouldn’t drive that far North to attend a concert!
“Parking” - if we should not be providing parking for the Arena then why did the proponents promise me IN WRITING that they would? If we don’t need a reserve fund then why did they promise IN WRITING that it would be provided?
What we are seeing today is NOT what the voters narrowly approved.
Let’s see . . .
Tax ends in December? What’s the betting line that the powers that be will want to extend it?
In the immortal words of Monte Python: ALBATROSS!
Tax ends in December? What’s the betting line that the powers that be will want to extend it?
In the immortal words of Monte Python: ALBATROSS!
Posted by: GMC70
one of the county commissioners is considering an extenstion to the tax.
I thought the parking issue was already settled. Our county commissioners said there was lots of parking available (no pun intended).
While it is not exactly in walking distance, it seems there is plenty of parking spots that have been made available at the former Kansas Coliseum, the Wichita Greyhound Park, and Wild West World.
Ha! And they told us people wouldn’t drive that far North to attend a concert!
Posted by: RustyFord
the eagle ran a story where there is barely enough parking when CII has a moderate event and about 500 spaces short when CII has a major event. The arena is going to improve this how? Most Wichis complain about the short walk at the Coliseum and they wont complain about a 5+ block walk to the arena? Local govies expert showed the arena needed to be 20000+ seats to draw the big names and if so big, the big names would still avoid podunk Wichi. This was in the report before the arena vote.
When the arena is built tear down CII since it will be redundant.
The arena took 6 (?) votes to get approved. It should take as many votes to get approved again. Local govies friends make a killing and we get the shaft again.
Gotta be a better way to spend all this wonderful revenue collected off the people’s back than on a play toy venue that caters only to “vips”.
“When the arena is built tear down CII since it will be redundant.”
Problem is, the Arena is designed in such a way that it cannot serve as a convention center nor as a venue for the events that take place at CII. It will be the home of the Wichita Aeros sem-pro minor league basketball team … I guess.
They can use some or sll of the 290 million they were going to renovate CII to expand the arena.
If the arena is only going to cost a pittance in comparison for building, it makes no sense to spend so much on renovating CII. For a fraction of the renovation cost, they could expand the arena to fit the needs CII fills and use the CII space for more parking.
casino - you make a good point. It’s too bad our ‘leaders’ failed to take an integrated approach to such facilities. And in that regard I would include te missed opportunity to include WSU in the picture. That was recommended many years ago BEFORE the renovatio on campus but was ignored.
I honestly can’t believe the amount of negative public opinion in this town concerning progress, and related development, that makes this a better, more attractive place to live.
I’ve spent significant amounts of time in Tulsa, Omaha, and Des Moines and can honestly say that the retard, white-trash mentality is about the only thing that Wichita can claim higher ground on. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING, else comparatively is second rate.
God, I can’t wait to get out of here. Wichita, and it’s production worker mentality can stick it where the sun doesn’t shine.
Wichita, and it’s production worker mentality….
Uh, what do you have against production worker? Is it that they can’t afford seats or parking at the arena?
Suck it yourself! It is your arrogant attitude that helps feed the divisions in our community. It is also one of the main reasons the casio failed.
I have no problem with progress when it is progress. I have a problem with stupid decisions that are not progress and the arena is one of those decisions. The local govies needed to have a definitive plan on the arena before the vote, not develop one after the vote. What it looked like, where it was going to be, lock in as many preconstruction costs as possible, listen to their expert who pointed out it needed to be 20000 seats and even then it would not work. Their own expert for petes sake. If he said it was not viable, why should they go ahead and do it?
Parking is a huge issue and we need the parking garage. As I mentioned, there is barely enough parking downtown for a moderate CII event, much less a major CII event. Throw in a Hyatt or other downtown event and the amount of parking is woefully inadequate. Add a moderate arena event and it will get worse. If you have a major CII event and a major arena event, you will be parking 30 plus blocks away if you are lucky.
Downtown needs more hotel rooms in the core area, more eating establishments from McDs to fancy restaurants, more parking, and other amenities that need to be in place first. CII has lost numerous events over the years because these things were not in place.
Almost 500 million (CII renovation and arena tax collections) would allow for a much nicer arena that might (and I use the word might) draw in bigger crowds and make the arena a profitable venue.
I agree with most of the assessments. There will most likely be an extension of the “arena tax.”
If this would have been ran properly, popcorn vendors should have been moving in by now and the parking issue settled.
I wonder if the County has ever heard of project software? Apparently not…
My above comments do not include things like naming rights. The local govies pointed to other regional arena projects but ignored how important naming rights and corporate sponsorship were to getting those venues going.
“Uh, what do you have against production worker? Is it that they can’t afford seats or parking at the arena?”
LOL!
The production workers in this town make plenty of money, more than their real market value is in fact. If any of those spoiled brats moved to a different city that wasn’t production-based they’d be making $10 at best, and living in a single wide instead of their super-deluxe double wide.
The reason most of them are still broke, in spite of being more than well-paid, is that they’re all too busy racking up debt at Rent-A-Center and accumulating negative net savings to notice.
The reason most of them are still broke, in spite of being more than well-paid, is that they’re all too busy racking up debt at Rent-A-Center and accumulating negative net savings to notice.
Posted by: Suck it! |
Very true. If they paid off stuff or only purchased with cash what they need instead of using credit for what they want, they would be much better off. Buying a bigger house when you can only afford a smaller house or buying a bigger vehicle on credit is stupid. I could live very well on what they make and have a nice car and home.
Suck it seems suspiciously like Joe Williams…
No! It’s not me JR.
I am a blue collar worker and I worked in production for many years at Cessna and all of my friends are production lower middle class people. I’m lower middle class and come from that background.
So I don’t have anything negative to say about production workers. Unions I do disagree with as an entity, because they are exploitive and do nothing for the average worker anymore, but not workers themselves. They don’t deserve criticism.
Expanding parking has been done for CII at the city parking lot north of the Broadview Hotel.
The Waterwalk has added two parking garages. They are redoing the artery streets that connect Century II/WaterWalk to the Arena site, including wide sidewalks and and parking along the street. They are also going to expand the diangle parking along Douglass.
The negative comments coming from people here, like JWINK are people who aren’t from Wichita. JWINK is a Karl Rove/Phil Kline Republican from White Flight Johnson County, who has repeated his antics over and over and his disrespectful remarks about Wichita. He’s just a bad guy.
The arena is going to be ok. It’s not going to be a white elephant. It’s going to be bought and paid for without borrowing, like with bonds, and it will renovate and update many of the streets around downtown Wichita, including Washington Street.
We could have probably got a more bang for your buck if this was done years ago, but we are certainly getting a more bang for your buck then it would have been if the Kansas Coliseum was closed down for 2 years on borrowed money.
It’s a done deal.
Century II is a whole different matter. I believe everybody was sticker shocked to see the $290 million face lift job. That’s unbelievable.
A few comments: I work in arenas, stadiums, convention centers, and theaters all over the country. I’m one of the people who’s involved in making your night out special.
The 2 major concerns I have about THIS arena are parking and functionality. Parking is a dead, done deal. Look for various factions of the Steven familiy to open pay lots. Neither the city nor county will interfere with this franchise. I have no problem with them or any private entity providing parking, but it needs to be coordinated, and that won’t happen without local government actions.
Functionality… those of you who’d followed my posts about *how* an arena is used and is worked already know what I think. For you new folks: not one person at the county level (other than current Coliseum employees) actually knows what goes on with the building itself when it comes to staging a concert, sporting event, or rodeo. There are critical stuctural issues that need answers before I can say the new building will be better, worse, or no different than the Colisuem. My guess is that it will be no better in some respects (loading dock space) and potentially worse in others (access to, and height above the arena floor of the roof beams for rigging sound, lights, video, etc), dead case storage, space for catering to prepare & serve meals for touring and local concert crews, parking for performer, crew, and team motor coaches, and “shore power” for those motor coaches while the drivers are at a hotel, sleeping before the night’s drive.
For those are saying “build it and get the events going” I can only say this: the events that promoters bring to Wichita is based on market size. Yep, plain old demographics determine who plays here and who doesn’t. Nothing about the venue comes into play unless the physical size is wrong. Even the performances of Cirq de Soliel’s “Delireum” worked in spite of the previously mentioned roof beams being too low (an engineer signed off on cutting holes through the Britt Brown Arena roof beams). If there’s a market for the show, someone will present it… but having a shiny new building doesn’t mean a damn thing to a promoter or performer. It’s all about putting warm, paying bodies in seats. In Wichita, that means having low ticket prices, convenient and preferably free parking, and a performer who’s been played to death on Clear Channel’s stations, publicized on Clear Channel’s billboards, and the concert promoted by Clear Channel’s “Live Nation” division. All the money goes to San Antonio except for the rent on the buiding, the wages paid to the local crews (show and facility), and the artist’s fee.
I don’t want to step into the “SuckIt” and “Casino..Ripoff” people’s comments about “production worker mentality” except to say the concept of living beyond one’s means is certainly not limited to any socio-economic class. Instead I think it shows the power of advertising and marketing, and the inducement to a ‘consumerist’ lifestyle. Madison Avenue makes people feel inferior if they don’t drive a bigger auto than their neighbor; wear a particular brand or style of clothing; eat particular brands of foods; or own a bigger TV than anyone on their block. Sure, individuals still have free will, but the highly (and falsly) lauded “free market” mentality is dependent on most purchasers buying things they don’t *really* need, usually on credit. The banks and financial institutions didn’t want to be left behind, so they offered credit in excess amounts, and to people who hadn’t the ability to service their debts. Oh, and then congress changes the bankruptcy laws so creditors can continue collection attempts, reducing the lender’s risk for extending credit to folks who shouldn’t have gotten it in the first place.
So actually, that fits the arena, too. We needed our old arena fixed up to accomodate citizens with physical mobility issues, and we needed to pump a lot of money into downtown to help keep the redevelopment bandwagon rolling. That’s a good thing, but a single-purpose facilty (a place of assembly for 15,000 pax) is probably the least effective way to do it. Instead we get the wrong arena, in the wrong place, and spending $200+million on it is the wrong way to anchor downtown redevelopment. We were sold a consumerist bill of goods, as my grandmother might have said… The only saving grace is we’re paying cash for our albatross.
And to those who say the sales tax will be extended… It will take a vote of the state legislature to extend the tax. The county’s authority to collect it EXPIRES by STATUTE, on Dec 31 2007. What happens remains to be seen…
LTB (Lions, Tigers, & Bears)
I hope they don’t contract the people from OKC for parking vendors. Those have to be the rudest people on the planet - very unprofessional.
They’re parking vendors, not doctors — they know 2-3 things max about their job —- how to give you a ticket, how to take you’re ticket, scan it and give you the change it says…. they have absolutely no reason to be nice to you ….. it’s a what 7.00 an hour job, being nice to customers starts some where in the 9-10 $ p/hr range ….. you hope you get your car back without any scratches ….
……….. Ferris Buehler
CUBS magic number is 3, any combination of Chicago wins (3 games left) or Milwaukee losses adding to 3 and the CUBS are in the playoffs — many think, more hope they make it to the World Series — all they need is 11 wins during the playoffs —-
GO CUBS …………….
ken, the Cubs’ magic number is 2!!
GO CUBS…..
(Now returning to my more “normal” self)
LTB makes what is to me the critical point about the albino pachyderm, or any other venue. How many butts can be put into the seats for each event scheduled to be held there. Period. Thus, if there aren’t enough paying customers for events at the arena, it will fail; if there are, it will succeed. It seems just that simple.
And, one more time: GO CUBS!
Hey Herbert -
That should be “TO” with one “O” not “TOO”.You’re a journalist Huh?
LBT -
I like your Post, it sounds like the truth in what you are speaking, not just self-gratifying hype.I am not against progress if it is done with an “Honest” approach, but Ben is right about the promises in writing made.The broken promises goes beyond government services and its intended pact of trust in representing the whole of people.That in itself could be a violation of Constitutional laws.
Ken, VT … CUBBIES!!!!!
My dream has been a Cubs-Red Sox series. Dave at Players has promised me he won’t have my son and I arrested until the games are over. (My son - Cubs fan; me - Red Sox)
And to those who say the sales tax will be extended… It will take a vote of the state legislature to extend the tax. The county’s authority to collect it EXPIRES by STATUTE, on Dec 31 2007. What happens remains to be seen… Posted by: LTB
Any sales tax will be a NEW sales tax. It will not be an “extension” of the old. It will take a vote of the state and locally to say yes to this new tax.
Remember, this is my money you are talking all rosey about.
You have to ask me for it.
“people who aren’t from Wichita”
There you go again Joe! Why do you hate the idea of people actually CHOOSING to live in Wichita?
By the way; I think I have been in Wichita as an adult as long as you have. I just didn’t spend my childhood here.
A little reminiscing about the Cubs ere returning to the daily ennui;
As a boy, living “out in the country”, one of my great delights was listening to the radio broadcasts of the Cubs (on WGN, 720) when they were playing “on the Coast” as the saying was in those days. Fairness dictates that I also disclose listening to the Cardinals (who were broadcast in Wichita) as well under those circumstances.
There was always something a bit magical about the Cubs; a history of futility after a grand history in their earlier years; how would they lose this game; etc., etc. The players, Ernie (”Let’s Play Two”) Banks; in a later time, Billy Williams. Knowing that the last time the Cubs were in a World Series my dad was still in high school, so on and so on. The 1969 run, so rudely stopped by the “Miracle Mets” (OK, so I was in college then, but still managed to hear the Cubs games “from the Coast” in my room at school). Coming to Indiana for my active duty, and discovering that the local cable carried WGN, so I could (on the weekends) see the Cubs’ games; the local cable also carried the Chicago station that, in those days, broadcast the White Sox games, with Harry Caray as the announcer; best of both worlds.
Ben, one of my dreams has always been a Cubs-Red Sox World Series. The enthusiasm has been damped a bit by the Red Sox recently being in the series, but hope springs eternal.
Finally, the younger, being a dyed-in-the-wool Yankees fan, and going to college in Red Sox country, has managed to survive by admission that she is also a Cubs fan; the pity engendered by the admission overcomes the outright hostility connected with her AL rooting affiliation.
LTB - thanks for your comments. While I really don’t understand many of the detailes of what you say I respect a professional opinion of the situation.
VT - don’t forget Harry Carey …
“ah 1, ah 2, ah 3 … Take me out to the ball game … “
Lions, Tigers and Bears (LTB): Agree with Ben that your comments are certainly well informed … probably “expert” testimony.
I recall say three?? years ago when a young femaie pop singer was scheduled to appear in the evening at the Kansas Coliseum. Was it Hillary Duff, a young lady with a following among Wichita teenagers?
In any case, I happened to visit the Kansas Coliseum early that Saturday morning.
Of course Miss Duff wasn’t there … she wasn’t scheduled to arrive until just before the show and leave the Coliseum for California before the show was over. Tightly scheduled.
Outside the south entrance of the Kansas Coliseum was probably some 200 young people waiting to help unload the trucks and probably 30 technicians and perhaps four 18-wheelers and several airconditioned passenger buses for the traveling staff. Breakfast was being served to start the day.
The 18-wheelers backed into those massive south side entrance doors for unloading.
THE POINT IS A CONCERT IS A MAJOR OPERATION … NOT JUST A SMALL AFFAIR THROWN TOGETHER OUT IN A PARKING LOT.
Also I was told a large number of people are given free passes to moniter the show for problems … people including security, medical, fire, management, friends of the performers, bus drivers, etc., etc.
As Lions, Tigers and Bears (LTB) said, no holes should be drilled in the overhead structural beams holding up the roof … NO WAY.
Unfortunately, a lot problems exist with the design of the arena including appearance and structural safety. In Wichita, a city loaded with structural engineers why is this function being left up to three holdover county commissioners, Tom Winters, Tim Norton and Dave Unruh, amateurs at best.
I grew up on the NW side of Chicago and high school was 2 miles from the ivy —- summers almost weekly seats in the bleachers — best times were when my god father took — he knew everybody…… meet Ernie Banks, Billy Williams —– when Veeck (as in wreck) took over the sox and installed the first exploding scoreboard, I converted to a Sox fan, 05 was a very special year —- was a scary el and subway ride to the south side and usually went to only day games
Sox are stinking up the league this year battling KC for last place — with any luck the Bears will turn it around with a new QB —- so for now — it’s the Cubbies
Magic Number is 1
ken - I’m afraid they are backing in … and won’t get past the first round.
Did they ever exorcise that guy who tipped the ball?
I grew up on the NW side of Chicago and high school was 2 miles from the ivy —- summers almost weekly seats in the bleachers — best times were when my god father took -”"”"
Would that be Senn or Sullivan High? I lived for 13 years in Evanston.
Never cared for the Cubs much. Most of the time I lived in Chicago, they were a daytime only team and since I actually was expected to show up at work everyday to get paid, I did not have the option of going to a ball game in the middle of the day. I did attend a few of the night games there after Mayor Sawyer finally got them lights but even then they were limited to only 16 night games a year. It was always easier to see the Sox in Comiskey Park.
Parking is not an issue. People will find somewhere to park or walk or ride a bus if there is an event they wish to attend. Neither Phillips Arena or the Georgia Dome here have lots of parking and people still find a way to get there.
The extra revenue, which by law can be used only on arena-related projects, will help cover the higher-than-projected construction costs and is an indication that the local economy is strong
(and hasn’t suffered much under the 1-cent sales tax, as some opponents predicted).Posted by Phillip Brownlee
i liked the part where only one company bid on the contract.
it’s kinda like iraq.
spin reality and win.
Kev - ever spend any time at Northwestern? Old stomping grounds for me - alond with IIT donw south.
Ben - Kev
Lane Tech (right next to Riverview) class of 65 —- lived in Logan Square until 67 and then to the AF — moved back in 96 eventually settling in the South Loop could see Sox park from my living room,
Hard to really say about the Cubs, several pundits say they are sneaky — pitching is strong and offense is improving — if Soraino can stay hot — it may happen ———typical Chicagoan always optimisitic, hell I still think the Bears might make the playoffs ……….
See Woody Austin is doing himself and Derby proud in the President’s cup …
Last I heard he moved to Florida, and they cut and smashed the ball cooked it and served it with some spaghette at Harry Carey’s …