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Open thread 7/27
- By Phillip Brownlee
- Posted July 26, 2007 at 1:04 a.m.
- Filed under Open thread
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Looks like Pres. Wacko has nothing but contempt for congress, the law, and nuclear security.India nuclear deal complies with U.S. law: Burns By Carol Giacomo, Diplomatic CorrespondentThu Jul 26, 12:57 AM ET
WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Undersecretary of State Nicholas Burns said on Wednesday that a just-completed nuclear deal with India complies with U.S. law, but some experts doubted that, and lawmakers said the agreement could face a rough road in the U.S. Congress.
ADVERTISEMENTCongressional sources and other experts told Reuters the agreement reached last week appears to go a long way toward meeting the demands of India’s nuclear establishment, giving New Delhi rights only accorded to key U.S. allies Japan and the European Union.
“The administration is going to call this a success even though from policy and legal perspectives, there are major problems,” said one congressional source, who spoke anonymously because he learned details of the deal on a confidential basis.
The pact, approved by India’s cabinet on Wednesday, would allow India access to U.S. nuclear fuel and equipment for the first time in 30 years, even though New Delhi refused to join non-proliferation pacts and tested nuclear weapons.
“We’re very satisfied because we know the agreement is well within the bounds of the Hyde Act,” Burns told reporters after testifying before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.
The Hyde Act, approved by Congress in December, created a unique exception to U.S. export law to allow nuclear cooperation with India. The just-completed agreement, called a 123 agreement after a section of the U.S. Atomic Energy Act, spells out technical details for that nuclear cooperation.
Like the Hyde Act, the 123 agreement must be approved by Congress. But that cannot happen until India agrees on a program of inspections of its nuclear facilities by the International Atomic Energy Agency and the 45-nation Nuclear Suppliers Group changes its rules.
“None of this will happen this year,” the congressional source said.
FRIDAY ANNOUNCEMENT
Specifics of the pact will not be publicly disclosed until Friday, but administration officials have telephoned some lawmakers to discuss the deal; more briefings are due Thursday.
In a letter to President George W. Bush, 22 congressmen, including some who had voted for the nuclear deal, said a 123 agreement that does not meet the Hyde Act’s minimal conditions “places congressional approval deeply into doubt.”
The conditions include no nuclear testing, permanent unconditional IAEA inspections of declared Indian nuclear materials and facilities, and an end to nuclear cooperation if the agreement is violated.
Others are a ban on transferring enrichment and reprocessing technology to India and a requirement that the Washington give prior approval on a case-by-case basis before India reprocesses U.S. origin nuclear material, the letter noted.
Said Democratic Rep. Edward Markey of Massachusetts, who organized the letter: “These conditions and restrictions are not optional nor are they advisory. They were passed by the Congress and signed by the President.”
“If the 123 agreement has been intentionally negotiated to side-step or bypass the law and the will of Congress, final approval for this deal will be jeopardized,” Markey added.
Experts and congressional sources said the United States agreed to give India advance, long-term permission to reprocess U.S. origin nuclear material once New Delhi builds a new reprocessing facility that would only use such material.
This is happening despite the fact that the Americans “do not give consent rights to reprocess except to our closest allies, Japan and Euratom,” the European Atomic Energy Community, said Sharon Squassoni, a non-proliferation expert with the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace,
She expressed concern that with such an arrangement “there will never be a way for us to prevent the transfer of (U.S.) know-how and technology to India’s weapons program,” as Washington promised in the nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty.
The 123 agreement also says Washington has the right to have India return U.S.-origin fuel and technology if New Delhi tests another nuclear device but stipulates “this will not undercut their fuel assurances,” a congressional source said.
This apparently means that while the United States might cut off nuclear cooperation in the event of an Indian nuclear test, it will seek to ensure India continues receiving fuel from other sources, he and other experts said.
In New Delhi, an Indian official close to the negotiations said a complex process of consultations would be required before a U.S. administration could penalize India by ending nuclear trade if it conducts another nuclear test.
So much for the poor oil companies and low margin on refining operations.Shell Q2 profit rises 20 pct, boosted by refining 1 hour, 26 minutes ago
LONDON (Reuters) – Royal Dutch Shell Plc (RDSa.L) posted a 20 percent rise in second quarter current cost of supply (CCS) profit to $7.556 billion on Thursday, as fat refining margins helped outweigh lower production.
ADVERTISEMENTShell said in a statement that the CCS result, which strips out changes in the value of inventories, included a non-operating gain of $660 million.
Excluding this gain, the underlying result was up 5 percent at $6.896 billion, compared to an average forecast of $6.770 billion from a Reuters poll of 10 analysts.
Meanwhile on the bin laden front, the wh says al-quida is pretty much in a safe have in Pakistan. Weren’t we told we’d attack any country that provided refuge, and no where in the world would be safe for the terrorist?If that area of Pakistan isn’t actually under musharaff’s control, we should feel free to invade at any time.WE editors pay less attention to what’s going on locally, and more on national/international issues.
In Sedgwick County, Democrats will gather for a presentation by Dr. Ed Cook, entitled “Global Climate Change.” Dr. Cook was trained by the Al Gore Climate Institute. Dr. Cook’s presentation is an updated version of Al Gore’s award-winning picture, An Inconvenient Truth. If you did not get a chance to see Al Gore’s epic documentary, this is a great time to see the presentation live. With the serious environmental problems facing our nation and the world today, it is important that we as Democrats become educated and informed on these issues.Time: Saturday, July 28 at 11:00 AMDuration: 2 hoursHost: James RyanContact Phone: 316.262.7534Location: Sedgwick County Jury Room (Wichita, KS)525 N. MainWichita, KS 67203
The House Judiciary Committee did its duty yesterday, voting to cite Harriet Miers, the former White House counsel, and Joshua Bolten, the White House chief of staff, for contempt. The Bush administration has been acting lawlessly in refusing to hand over information that Congress needs to carry out its responsibility to oversee the executive branch and investigate its actions when needed. If the White House continues its obstruction, Congress should use all of the contempt powers at its disposal.
The committee really had no choice but to hold Ms. Miers in contempt. When she was subpoenaed to testify about the administration’s possibly illegal purge of nine United States attorneys, she simply refused to show up, citing executive privilege. Invoking privilege in response to particular questions might have been warranted — the courts could have decided that later. But simply flouting a Congressional subpoena is not an option.
Mr. Bolten has refused to provide Congress with documents it requested in the attorney purge investigation, also citing privilege, and he has been equally unforthcoming about why he thinks it applies. Together, Ms. Miers’s and Mr. Bolten’s response to Congress has simply been: “Go away” — a position that finds no support in the Constitution.
If these privilege claims make it to court, it is likely that Ms. Miers and Mr. Bolten will lose. The Supreme Court has held that a president’s interest in keeping communications private must be balanced against an investigator’s need for them. In this case, the president’s privacy interest is minimal, since the White House has said he was not involved in purging the United States attorneys. Congress’s need for the information, though, is substantial. It has already turned up an array of acts by administration officials that may have been criminal.
The administration’s contemptuous attitude toward the constitutional role of Congress was on display again this week when Attorney General Alberto Gonzales testified before the Senate Judiciary Committee. He repeatedly refused to answer legitimate questions, and he contradicted himself so frequently that it is hard to believe he was even trying to tell the truth.
Congress must not capitulate in the White House’s attempt to rob it of its constitutional powers. Now that the committee has acted, the whole House must vote to hold Ms. Miers and Mr. Bolten in contempt. The administration has indicated that it is unlikely to allow the United States attorney for the District of Columbia to bring Congress’s contempt charges before a grand jury. That would be a regrettable stance. But if the administration sticks to it, Congress can and should proceed against Ms. Miers and Mr. Bolten on its own, using its inherent contempt powers.
It is not too late for President Bush to spare the country the trauma, and himself the disgrace, of this particular constitutional showdown. There is a simple way out. He should direct Ms. Miers and Mr. Bolten to provide Congress with the information to which it is entitled.
“In Sedgwick County, Democrats will gather for a presentation by Dr. Ed Cook, entitled “Global Climate Change.” Dr. Cook was trained by the Al Gore Climate Institute. Dr. Cook’s presentation is an updated version of Al Gore’s award-winning picture, An Inconvenient Truth. If you did not get a chance to see Al Gore’s epic documentary, this is a great time to see the presentation live.”
Just what this Democrat wants to spend his Saturday doing… watching a 2 hour lecture on “global warming” in the jury room of the courthouse (zzzzzzzz)- NOT! Now, I do think we should know more about this subject but the best way to present this is at a party with BBQ and beer! Since many scientist therorize that farm animals are actually responsible for global warming because they fart too much, a BBQ not only keeps things lively but actually helps cut down on global warming by eliminating a few farm animals!
I am so mad I could scream. Our do nothing Congress (all inclusive) had a chance to at least provide funding for building security/fencing for 700 miles along our border.
On the one item a majority of Americans (not to mention the 911 Commission) agree on – border security, the clowns of both parties derailed any progress.
The move put political pressure on Senate Democrats. They killed Sen. Lindsey Graham’s plan on a 52-44 procedural vote, but Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., immediately countered with a pared-down proposal containing only the border security funds. Then Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas, a Bush ally, killed that effort.
I sure hope all our elected officials hear from concerned Americans on this one again. It appears they have forgotten what they heard us clearly say last time. 70%+ agreed, “IT’S THE BORDER STUPID.”
“No arsenal, no weapon in the arsenals of the world, is so formidable as the will and moral courage of free men and women.”– Ronald Reagan
Forgot to add: The presidential candidates could not take the time from their busy campaign to fly back to Washington and vote on the immigration/border security measure.
In fact, our own Senator Brownback has missed 1/3 of the votes in Congress this year. Maybe congressmen should RESIGN when they decide to no longer do the job their constituents voted them to do?
I guess he is busy pressing the 1% of voter support he has to make it 2% before admitting defeat.
farm animals are actually responsible for global warming because they fart too much, a BBQ not only keeps things lively but actually helps cut down on global warming by eliminating a few farm animals!
Posted by: Kev | July 26, 2007 at 07:04 AM
For every action there is an equal and opposite re-action. Don’t you think BBQ and beer will increase the human farts contributed to the global environment? Everyone doesn’t carry around a bottle of Beano. Besides, all that does is create silent killers. The gas will still pass.
This damn Global Warming is KILLING my kids!!!
Normally by late July I have to add water because their pool is like bathtub water. This year they won’t get in it because it’s too cold. WTF Algore???
Wow. Well gollllly. You conservative fellers sure are funny, Heckler, ah tell you what!
I should go to the GW meeting wearing a Exxon Logo shirt. :D
Yes yes…
We do have a sense of humor don’t we.
Yes lets build a 700 mile long fence along our 2100 mile border. Don’t you see that this is just another “lets not and say we did” ploy by the administration. Oh and while we are at it….lets give amnesty to all the illegals that are here, make them go touch homebase and wait 6 yrs to get back in. Just another idiotic plan from your favorite cowboy!
Ummmm….global warming does not mean that everywhere on the globe will get hotter.
The average temperature of the planet will go up. This will and as evidenced by Heckler already is, affecting weather patterns. Some areas will get more rain, some will have less rain, some will get hotter, some will get colder – but, the average temperature of the planet will go up.
I really don’t care WHY it is happening. I don’t really think humans can affect it that much. But I do know, as do the vastly overwhelming majority of scientists in the world, that there is a marked shift in global cliimate/weather patterns from past trends, and the average global temperature is rising.
It is something that needs to be addressed. Not from the viewpoint of ‘we are ruining the climate, no more SUVs allowed’ but from the viewpoint of ‘how will we adapt to an ever-changing world climate that will affect food supplies, public safety and the well-being of all people?’
CF2k
Just trying to brighten everyones day a little.
“Yes lets build a 700 mile long fence along our 2100 mile border.”
That is something something the fence-loving isolationists don’t like to talk about much.
Just another idiotic plan from your favorite cowboy!
Posted by: Mike | July 26, 2007 at 08:25 AM
The 700 miles is just a start. I’d pay tomorrow to build a security zone along all 2,100 miles. But we gotta take what we got on the table now. The 700 miles was approved by congress and the president. It was just never Funded.
And I don’t agree and don’t believe too many people agreed with the amnesty plan as proposed. (Personally I don’t agree to any amnesty.
But that is how this issue got so convoluted. Let’s stick with the basic’s which the majority of Americans agreed with. Sorry if you did not. But some of us believe we need to stem the flow of illegals crossing our border.
We can debate the merits of the “cause” of that flow, and how to discourage it until the cows come home.
But the physical act of crossing our border is something we do have the resources and knowledge to control.
The number of illegals here did not stop for this debate.
And didn’t the democrats support adopting EVERY measure of the 911 Commissions’ recommendations?
Come on, this isn’t a democrat or republican issue. This is an issue for Americans. Pointing fingers at parties just muddies the water and nothing gets done.
That shows us what the real intentions are from the administration. Bait them and they will shut up. We will act like we want to fix it, this will buy us time to implement our real strategy.
I don’t know about the rest of you, but I’m looking forward to a few Palm Trees in my backyard. Bring on the global warming. Keep your black ice and snow further north.
“I’d pay tomorrow to build a security zone along all 2,100 miles”I can get the address where in the Federal Treasury to send your check if you are serious. Let me know.
You may want to consult with your kids and grandkids first though, since I doubt you will be able to pay for it in one generation at your income level, Hotdog.
You are cute Brian, but I already got a dog. ;-)
This is by no means an attack or name calling excersize. I agree you disagree with a fence.
Of the 700 miles of fence they have funded, only about 50 miles has been constructed. I agree this is an American problem. If you have read my previous posts you will find that I am for not only building the fence but putting a mine field the last 100 yards leading up to it, with armed guards waiting to pick off anyone lucky enough to make it through the minefield. So lets not muddy my statement. The right has controlled our government for the last and has done nothing but pad their pockets and run campaigns on social wedge issues. Don’t tell me to not point fingers when a little accountability is warranted.
Mike,
RE: your mine field
Like I said, this nation has the resources to control access via our border. Our military has demonstrated this along the DMZ in Korea and Vietnam. The East Germans did so quite effectively along their border with western europe. Drastic? Yes Bad comparison w/the “wall”? Yes. But we have the technology and ability to seal the border.
Very few make it across from North to South Korea (alive anyway). The Berlin Wall was effective too.
I don’t think we need these drastic measures, but we can seal our border with protective measures.
Republicans and Democrats are constantly pointing fingers at each other.
This happens in Congress and on this blog. And nothing gets done in either venue.
When the Congress no longer listens to the People, what is the solution?
Vote out all of the incumbents in 2008!
I don’t know how anyone can be proud enough to brag about being either Republican or Democrat, unless they are bought and paid for.
Vernon, That is a good idea.My voting philosophy is that if I do not have a good idea which candidate to vote for, I vote for the one that is not incumbent.
The mine field… I dunno. Death sentence is kinds harsh.
There are many many other ways to secure our borders.
Let’s start by bringing our troops back from Iraq and stationing them on the border.
If you haven’t noticed, the last 4 presidents have encouraged soft borders. OK, ready for your quiz? Which candidate is for strong borders, a strong America, and keeping America’s fingers out of other country’s affairs?
Ron Paul is the answer you are looking for Solly!
Al-Qaeda { real spelling } is pure Bush hype, nothing more.
So, be afraid America, shake in your boots while the Zionists are laughing up their sleeves.
The tribal people living next to Pakistan are being used as scapegoats. Do they like Americans…well not any less than Americans like Bush.
Sol, you might want to consider the effects of the Posse Commitatus (sp) Act in framing your proposal.
I’ve arrived at the opinion that regardless of how many fences, how many folks we post along the borders, unless and until real enforcement with, if necessary, beefed up penalties of the current laws against employment of illegal aliens is undertaken against those who will knowingly employ them, it doesn’t matter. If it becomes so expensive to do “business as usual” in this area that there ceases to be a demand to be met by a seemingly ever-increasing supply, the traffic should diminish greatly, allowing concentration of efforts to secure the borders against the drug smugglers and those who are coming to do us harm (terrorists). I’m aware this will lead, in most cases, to an increase in cost for certain goods and services, which I suggest that should be borne by us as a necessary cost of securing the borders.
I’d be a bit more sympathetic to the arguments of the Administration about the “fired” U.S. Attorneys not prosecuting more immigration cases if the cases not being prosecuted involved employers, rather than the individuals caught attempting to unlawfully enter the U.S.
VT,
I opposed a mine field and death sentence for illegals. You are supporting such?
I fully agree that the demand for cheap labor must also be addressed – but that was not what I was commenting on. It should be up to the states to regulate the illegals, not the federal gov’t.
Posse Comitatus Acthttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act
The Act was intended to prohibit Federal troops from supervising elections in former Confederate states. It generally prohibits Federal military personnel and units of the United States National Guard under Federal authority from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States, except where expressly authorized by the Constitution or Congress.
Wasn’t our military founded to protect our country? How would this differ?
That really you VT? Or have you been trolled too?
Mike,
DING-DING-DING – give that man a cigar !!!
No, Sol, I’m not for mine fields or machine guns. Sorry I didn’t make that clear earlier. I’m also not for the “fence” nor the use of troops along the border.
The use of troops along the border to enforce immigration laws (civilian law enforcement) is, IMHO, a direct violation of the Act unless Congress would directly authorize it.
Hope this clears it up, Sol.
Anyone else note that the thread heading is for tomorrow’s open thread? Have we traveled into the future?
Sol, I am for better enforcement of the immigration laws by hiring and training additional qualified agents to post on both borders with adjoining countries, North and South. I am most definitely for more vigorous enforcement of the law which prohibits employment of “illegal aliens”, so long as it is knowing; and, to help with this, making it a presumption it is “knowing” if the employer took no steps to verify the status of the applicant, including resort to the data base.
Yeah, Sol, saw that, wondered if we’d traveled across the International Date Line, or if it had been moved while we slept.
Today’s Bush Family Evil Empire: Scandal Du Jour is brought to you by Blackwater Security Company.
Why pay military personnel GI wages when you can hire that same person for five times as much with our company?
Blackwater . . . we turned cost plus accounting into cost plus plus plus.
Why do we call the Bush Family an EVIL Empire? There’re the well-documented connections to Nazi financing, the shady insider trading at Harkin Energy, the Savings and Loan scandals that cost the taxpayers billions, the propping up of the Communist regime in China during the Tienanmen Uprising to protect Bush family investments there and on and on.
But would the Bush Family actually try plot to overthrow the democratically elected government of the United States and install a FASCIST DICTATORSHIP?
Uh . . . yeah . . . they would. And yeah, they did.
Read it and weep for your country:
The coup was aimed at toppling President Franklin D Roosevelt with the help of half-a-million war veterans. The plotters, who were alleged to involve some of the most famous families in America, (owners of Heinz, Birds Eye, Goodtea, Maxwell Hse & George Bush’s Grandfather, Prescott) believed that their country should adopt the policies of Hitler and Mussolini to beat the great depression.
Mike Thomson investigates why so little is known about this biggest ever peacetime threat to American democracy.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/history/document/document.shtml
Listen to the story on the BBC site.
*****
The Congressional Committee that investigated this treason, which carried the death penalty, drew this conclusion at the time:
“In the last few weeks of the committee’s official life it received evidence showing that certain persons had made an attempt to establish a fascist government in this country.No evidence was presented and this committee had none to show a connection between this effort and any fascist activity of any European country.
“There is no question that these attempts were discussed, were planned, and might have been placed in execution when and if the financial backers deemed it expedient.
*****A number of right-wing organization hated the reforms of the New Deal (social security and jobs for all–blacks, Catholics, etc.)
A number of willing idiots started fascist organizations to be the shock troops for rich industrialists–Black Shirts, Silver Shirts, Black Legion etc.
Eventually, the uber-capitalists tried to subvert Marine General Smedley Butler to bring the military into the coup.
******
Prescott Bush wanted to overthrow FDR (stop the SOCIALISM!) and align the United States with Mussolini and Hitler in World War II.
One line that stands out in the testimony–the plotters planned to spread the lie that FDR’s “health is failing.” The line? “The dumb American people will fall for it in a second.”
“Dumb American people” who will fall for right-wing lies “in a second.”
Gee, that doesn’t sound like . . . oh, I don’t know . . . TONS AND TONS OF WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION AND A MUSHROOM CLOUD OVER AN AMERICAN CITY or anything, does it?
This has been your Bush Family Evil Empire: Scandal Du Jour brought to you by Blackwater Security.
Blackwater, when it absolutely, positively has to cost the taxpayers a lot more money.
Another one …
http://www.charlotte.com/observer/story/204465.html
KANNAPOLIS –Coy Privette, a retired Baptist pastor, conservative lawmaker and outspoken advocate for Christian groups, was charged Thursday with paying a prostitute for sex acts.
The 74-year-old Cabarrus County commissioner was arrested at his home in Kannapolis early Thursday. He appeared before a Rowan County magistrate on six misdemeanor charges and was released on a promise to appear in court Aug. 22. He did not return e-mails or calls to his cell and home phones, and no one answered the door at his Kannapolis home.
Privette, a prominent Republican with a 30-year career, is one of the state’s most vocal opponents against alcohol sales and legal gambling. He also serves on the State Baptist Convention of North Carolina and as president of the Christian Action League of North Carolina.
Is anybody going to prostitutes and propositioning undercover cops for sex OTHER THAN right-wing Christian activists?
These people are to Christianity as terrorists are to Islam.
Latest overused phrase:
be afraid America, be really afraid.
It’s getting really old. Can someone update the liberal tape recording? Change the kool-aide formula. God forbid coming up with an original thought.
Ho-hum.
Be afraid. Be very afraid of the sock-puppets who post under a million nics . . .
Please email the WEBlog editors…
Capn. Check your email. You are wally right?
Capn
Folks like Blackwater could come in handy if we ever decide that Hugo Chavez needs to go visit the fishes. ;)
The Zionists want America to be afraid, so they can get away with what they’re doing. Of course they also don’t want to allow belittling of being afraid.
And , of course they demand that we “walk on eggs” when speaking about Jews, no matter what the stripe and no matter how barbaric or horrendous the act.
Sol, why not come out of the closet? You support Zionism, every disgusting part of it.
“why not come out of the closet”
That’s funny you put it like that. Anything you want to share Ed?
Ed, who exactly are these Zionists you keeping on ranting about? From what I figure you’ll see a dog pissing on a fire hydrant and shout out that he’s a Zionist before screaming at a fence post for being a Zionist.
That’s two, so far.
Hey HEY !!!!
Ed can count to two. Let’s hear it for Ed everyone!!!
Atta boy Ed, atta boy.
Ben, I’m impressed with the old goat – 74 years and seeking services from prostitutes. :D
==================
Zionists
Starts singing -
We’re marching to Zion,beautiful, beautiful Zion;we’re marching upward to Zion,the beautiful city of God.
Let those refuse to singwho never knew our God;but children of the heavenly King,but children of the heavenly Kingmay speak their joys abroad,may speak their joys abroad.
Please email the WEBlog editors…
Posted by: SolDevVB | July 26, 2007 at 11:28 AM
SolDevVB, did I do something to offend you? I didn’t use your name in my post. Did I cuss or say a fib?
It is true.
Ed — Is there a word(or words) other than “Zionists” that you might use, to explain better who these people are, and what they are connected with in political/economical world interests???
If Al Gore had been elected, how long before a fatal accident?
Hey Ed, challenge. Show where I have posted in support of Israel.
Ready?…. GO
The other night I dreamt that Bush, Cheney, Rove and others came up with a plot to steal the 2000 election using brother Jeb’s state of Florida.
They intended all along to start a war so their oil buddies and particularly Halliburton could all steal billions/trillions from the American people.
By chance (maybe?) the terrorist attack of 911 happened and the Bush boys were able to implement their plan beyond their wildest dreams.
As Rosemary said when she woke up during her dream, “My God this is really happening!”
Impeach the SOBs! This is no misdemeanor they’ve committed…it is treason.
Funny thing about dreams. They are not reality and they almost never come true.
By any name: They are the enemy.
Congratulations Republican.
You pretty much killed the blog.
Hope you’re happy with your creation.
? Sol?
Perhaps if there wouldn’t have been so much whining and those whiners just stated their opinions, their self-induced trauma would have been so, ummmm…traumatic. :)
I don’t see anything wrong with the Blog, must be a matter of perspective.
But whine on brother.
wouldn’t have..”
Well, you can skoff all you want about Zionism, but it has been a real movement in the world for many decades. Zionism is the belief that Jewish people should have their own nation, in the lands where they originally came from.
Not to go into the vast history lesson, but simply: Would Israel exist if the west didn’t think Adam was their grandpa? I think not.
If Al Gore had been elected, how long before a fatal accident?
Putin is upset about the defensive shield in the EU as he knows that he’s next in the upcoming Atomic war. It won’t stop in the Middle East, as the “crazies” won’t let it.
I smell another boycott coming on.
Zionism hides behind the Jewish People.
80% of Americans can not have their way, yet the Zionists of Israel can have their way…unbelievable.
My GOD, door king is trying to “spin” Zionism…..
yet the Zionists of Israel can have their way…unbelievable.
Posted by: Ed Friedemann | July 26, 2007 at 12:21 PM
So Ed, you’re saying that the Zionists of Israel are the equivalent of the Burger Kings of the Middle East? (have it their way)
:)
Another perfectly good Blog going down hill already…
Tsk Tsk Tsk
Hey Ed, this upcoming atomic war, when is it? I want to mark it on my calendar. Now settle down, don’t shout at my calendar calling it a Zionist, it’s just a calendar.
Must be another email campaign going on among the Lefties of the Blog.
I haven’t noticed any change. :)
The absence of alternatives clears the mind marvelously.- Henry Kissinger
Well, looky there: the Senate Judiciary Committe has issued a subpeona to Karl Rove regarding the US Attorney firing scandal.
http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/003790.php
Long statement from follows from Senator Leahey.
Good for him. It’s time Rove answered some questions.
“I really don’t care WHY it is happening. I don’t really think humans can affect it that much.”
Posted by: brian | July 26, 2007 at 08:26 AM
Humans ARE causing global warming — there are no other valid explanations. We have to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, to avoid the risk of passing the “tipping point”.
Ignoring “WHY” it is happening is like ignoring WHY water is leaking into a boat, and just “adapting”, by turning on the bilge pump. If the pump fails to control the leak…
Ruminant Livestockhttp://www.epa.gov/rlep/faq.html“Globally, ruminant livestock produce about 80 million metric tons of methane annually, accounting for about 28% of global methane emissions from human-related activities.”
There are other factors besides methane,’Meat is murder on the environment’http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/climate-change/mg19526134.500-meat-is-murder-on-the-environment.html
And we need to look at the big picture,
http://www.desmogblog.com/tibets-warming-provides-global-warning“It’s time people stopped taking refuge in the climate change averages and start contemplating the likely results of the increasing climate extremes. That’s NOT an extremist position; it is modestly prudent – the least we should expect of the world’s leaders.”
The Goracle’s disciple is still at it.
I hope Tom Delay doesn’t really believe he’ll go to heaven before he goes to prison.
Delay: US and Israel must enjoy second coming
Will MenakerPublished: Thursday July 26, 2007After attending the College Republican convention, Nation journalist Max Blumenthal took his camera to the Christians United for Israel’s annual Washington-Israel Summit in D.C. Founded by right-wing mega-church pastor John Hagee, the group has “added the grassroots muscle of the Christian right to the already potent Israel lobby,” “forging close ties with the Bush White House and members of Congress.”
That evangelical support for Israel is largely based on “End Times” theology is largely irrelevant to the Israeli politicians who share the goal of expanding settlements into the West Bank and a military strike on Iran, but it is anything but irrelevant to the rank-and-file members and even one former House Majority Leader.
Blumenthal opens the video by interviewing Tom Delay, who when asked how much the “Second Coming” plays into his support for Israel, says, “obviously, it’s what I live for, I hope it comes tomorrow.”
Delay closed by saying, “we have to be connected to Israel to enjoy the second coming.”
While Hagee and others have stated that “End-Times” theology or eschatology plays no role in their support for Israel, the people Blumenthal interviewed tell a different story. Former Israeli ambassador to the U.S. Dore Gold, also claims that it plays no role and is not concerned with the apocalyptic undertones of such a group, claiming only the Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad purports to want Armageddon.
Blumenthal then interviews a string of conference-goers who explain how when Jesus returns all of the Jews will be “saved” after realizing the divinity of Christ. He also speaks to several people who say they are looking forward to Armageddon, because it will bring about the “cleansing of the earth.”
He is also hounded by a pair of PR flacks who want to make sure he is not asking questions about “End Times” or conversion of Jews, which according to them are questions, “okay to ask, but just not now.”
Hagee stressed the need for a preemptive military attack on Iran to “prevent a nuclear holocaust” as he introduced Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) to thunderous applause from the crowd. Lieberman compared Hagee to Moses and pointed out a visiting Rick Santorum as a “worker for what is good in our society.”
Other conference attendees were quick to note that Muslims are satanic, and that the anti-Christ would most likely be a “man of peace.” Much like the College Republican convention, Blumenthal is eventually kicked out after confronting Hagee with a passage from his book that blames the Jews for their own persecution.”
Click on the web site and go to the bottom of the article to view video.
http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Delay_US_and_Israel_to_enjoy_0726.html
I really do not know of much information that says that humans are CAUSING global warming, most just indicates that it is happening. The causality is inferred from the increased levels of greenhouse gases.
My point on not worrying about the ‘why’ is that gets nothing accomplished. Warming is Already happening. If we humans could stop production of all greenhouse gases today, global warming would still occur. Now our efforts may affect the severity, but not the incidence.
By focusing on how to adapt, we can get beyond the arguement of who’s fault it is and DO something.
“Humans ARE causing global warming — there are no other valid explanations.”
He is exactly right. Mankind is so advanced that we now control the climate. Of course Cheney has been at the controls turning up the heat for some reason. I guess he wants to extend the summer driving season to increase profits for oil companies. Or maybe Bush really is in charge and is too stupid to know that he is turning the knob the wrong way.
At any rate we should all feel extremely smug and full of ourselves. Mother Nature is just another relic of our unenlightened and superstitious past.
It is interesting that BOTH extreme ChristISTS and extreme IslamISTS lust for a second coming – either of Christ or the mystical Imam. They are peas in a pod.
CF2K,
Perhaps M.C. Rove will appear and he can perform his act again for Leahy and Schumer. :)
Yo…
Ah, brian, trying to make a logical argument here?
I agree with you; the issue upon which to concentrate is how we, as inhabitants of this planet, will adapt to the warming clearly occurring not on the “it’s your fault” “no, it’s not” dichotomy of argument.
BTW, if warming is already happening, and the subissue is the degree, if any, of human contribution thereto, shouldn’t we, as a part of the adaptation process, do what we can to minimize any anthropogenic contribution thereto?
“Ignoring “WHY” it is happening is like ignoring WHY water is leaking into a boat, and just “adapting”, by turning on the bilge pump. If the pump fails to control the leak…”
This analogy is a flawed comparison. It presupposes that climate is like a boat: without some outside force acting on it, it will float along as it is. That is not entirely true.
World climate is very dynamic and is affected by everything on earth. How much pollution and greenhouse gas do you think volcanos spew forth, compared to that of humans? There have always been plants (flora) on the earth, most likely more than there are now. They produce quite a bit of C02 .
All of these things affect the global climate. I do not dispute that it is warming. In fact the global climate has quite a lengthy history of rising and falling. However, I do not think we can stop it. It is just how nature works.
We need to focus more on what we can do: adapt.
“shouldn’t we, as a part of the adaptation process, do what we can to minimize any anthropogenic contribution thereto?
Posted by: Vaughn Tolle | July 26, 2007 at 01:18 PM ”
Certainly. We should definitely not thumb our noses with the attitude of ‘it is going to happen anyway, so I am not going to change anything.’
On the other hand that should not be our Primary focus. We need to change what we can control.
Ya’ll see the dow today? Yikes!
How many lefties here are gleeful because “the rich” are losing money?
“How much pollution and greenhouse gas do you think volcanos spew forth, compared to that of humans?”Posted by: brian | July 26, 2007 at 01:19 PM
CO2 emissions from volcanoes are estimated to be only about 1/100th of human emissions.
‘Climate myths: Human CO2 emissions are too tiny to matter’http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/climate-change/dn11638
Before the Industrial Age, CO2 sources and sinks were balanced, and at an equilibrium.
Humans burning of fossil fuels, land use changes, etc have upset that natural equilibrium, and caused atmospheric CO2 to rise.
See graphs at link above.
Looks like the shit is going to hit the fan for bush, trying to block congress right to subpoena. It’s about time.
It is about time Congress grew some balls.
Not literally ladies, no offense
:)
And SOB is still attacking the “messengers”… because SOB can’t attack the very solid climate science.
What’s the next weather fad going to be once this bogus global warming hoax fades away? Global stay-the-sameness?
Memo to Sen. Roberts, the obstructionist republican congress act to discredit isn’t working, the majority of Americans see through it as evidenced in this article.Voters frustrated with lack of change: poll By Andy Sullivan45 minutes ago
WASHINGTON (Reuters) – U.S. voters are growing cynical about politics as the newly Democratic Congress has been unable to change Bush administration policies like the war in Iraq, according to a poll released on Thursday.
ADVERTISEMENTThe George Washington University Battleground Poll found widespread disillusionment among voters, with 71 percent of those surveyed saying their member of Congress put partisan politics ahead of voters’ actual concerns.
Lawmakers as a whole fared even worse: 93 percent of voters’ surveyed said members of Congress put partisan politics first.
“The election of 2006 was in the point of view of many Americans a failure in that it has not changed the direction of politics,” said Christopher Arterton, a university dean and political expert at George Washington.
Both political parties received negative reviews from a majority of the 1,000 likely voters surveyed, though Republicans received lower marks across the board.
A record 70 percent said the country was on the wrong track.
Analysts said this attitude would make it difficult for lawmakers seeking re-election next year.
“Cynicism may be the hot new political trend,” Republican pollster Brian Tringali said at a news conference announcing the poll results.
The bipartisan poll found that 52 percent of the 1,000 likely voters surveyed disapproved of the job Democrats were doing in Congress this year. Top criticisms included the inability of Democrats to pass meaningful legislation and change the course of the war in Iraq.
Congressional Republicans fared worse, with a 61 percent disapproval rating. The same number said they disapproved of President George W. Bush’s job performance, though 57 percent said they approved of him as a person.
“The country wants change and they’re not seeing change from either party,” Democratic pollster Celinda Lake told the news conference. “Thank God Democrats get to vote against somebody.”
Democrats also fared better in electoral matchups, with 49 percent saying they would vote for the Democratic candidate for president if the election were held today, while 38 percent said they would vote for the Republican candidate.
In congressional races, 47 percent said they would vote for the Democrat, while 40 percent said they would vote for the Republican.
But respondents preferred leading Republican candidate Rudy Giuliani over leading Democrat Hillary Clinton 49 percent to 44 percent. Clinton tied with likely Republican candidate Fred Thompson at 46 percent each.
Democrat Barack Obama fared better against Republicans, beating Giuliani 52 percent to 42 percent and beating Thompson 56 percent to 35 percent.
The survey had a margin of error of 3 percent.
Hey, how about that stock market this week, it’s going crazy!
opps dow jones industrial average off 430 points mr.bush that could have been my social security dude
Yeah, good day to buy!
How many of you are sitting at your computer desk with a plastic bottle of water?
Bottled Water: A Global Environmental ProblemSource:OneWorld.net, February 5, 2006Title: “Bottled Water: Nectar of the Frauds?”Author: Abid Aslam
Faculty Evaluator: Liz CloseStudent Researchers: Heidi Miller and Sean Hurley
Consumers spend a collective $100 billion every year on bottled water in the belief—often mistaken—that it is better for us than what flows from our taps. Worldwide, bottled water consumption surged to 41 billion gallons in 2004, up 57 percent since 1999.
“Even in areas where tap water is safe to drink, demand for bottled water is increasing—producing unnecessary garbage and consuming vast quantities of energy,” reports Earth Policy Institute researcher Emily Arnold. Although in much of the world, including Europe and the U.S., more regulations govern the quality of tap water than bottled water, bottled water can cost up to 10,000 times more. At up to $10 per gallon, bottled water costs more than gasoline in the United States.“There is no question that clean, affordable drinking water is essential to the health of our global community,” Arnold asserts, “But bottled water is not the answer in the developed world, nor does it solve problems for the 1.1 billion people who lack a secure water supply. Improving and expanding existing water treatment and sanitation systems is more likely to provide safe and sustainable sources of water over the long term.” Members of the United Nations have agreed to halve the proportion of people who lack reliable and lasting access to safe drinking water by the year 2015. To meet this goal, they would have to double the $15 billion spent every year on water supply and sanitation. While this amount may seem large, it pales in comparison to the estimated $100 billion spent each year on bottled water.
Tap water comes to us through an energy-efficient infrastructure whereas bottled water is transported long distances—often across national borders—by boat, train, airplane, and truck. This involves burning massive quantities of fossil fuels.
For example, in 2004 alone a Helsinki company shipped 1.4 million bottles of Finnish tap water 2,700 miles to Saudi Arabia. And although 94 percent of the bottled water sold in the U.S. is produced domestically, many Americans import water shipped some 9,000 kilometers from Fiji and other faraway places to satisfy demand for what Arnold terms “chic and exotic bottled water.”
More fossil fuels are used in packaging the water. Most water bottles are made with polyethylene terephthalate, a plastic derived from crude oil. “Making bottles to meet Americans’ demand alone requires more than 1.5 million barrels of oil annually, enough to fuel some 100,000 U.S. cars for a year,” Arnold notes.
Once it has been emptied, the bottle must be dumped. According to the Container Recycling Institute, 86 percent of plastic water bottles used in the United States become garbage or litter. Incinerating used bottles produces toxic byproducts such as chlorine gas and ash containing heavy metals tied to a host of human and animal health problems. Buried water bottles can take up to 1,000 years to biodegrade.
Worldwide, some 2.7 million tons of plastic are used to bottle water each year. Of the bottles deposited for recycling in 2004, the U.S. exported roughly 40 percent to destinations as far away as China, requiring yet more fossil fuel.Meanwhile, communities where the water originates risk their sources running dry. More than fifty Indian villages have complained of water shortages after bottlers began extracting water for sale under the Coca-Cola Corporation’s Dasani label. Similar problems have been reported in Texas and in the Great Lakes region of North America, where farmers, fishers, and others who depend on water for their livelihoods are suffering from concentrated water extraction as water tables drop quickly.
While Americans consume the most bottled water per capita, some of the fastest collective growth in consumption is in the giant populations of Mexico, India, and China. As a whole, India’s consumption of bottled water increased threefold from 1999 to 2004, while China’s more than doubled.
While private companies’ profits rise from selling bottled water of questionable quality at more than $100 billion per year—more efficiently regulated, waste-free municipal systems could be implemented for distribution of safe drinking water for all the peoples of the world—at a small fraction of the price.
I don’t drink bottled water, it’s a waste of money.
For the most part, tap water in the U.S. is safe to drink and is monitored closely by the various Water Departments.
I thought it strange the first time I went to Europe, asked for water and got a bottle instead of a glass full of water and ice.
By the way, the bottled water brand “Evian” spelled backwards is “Naive.”
Appropriate I think. :)
Well I am guilty as charged. However, once in awhile I do refill a used bottle (not to save bottles, but cost). But other people seem to be frowning at me as if I’m doing something socially unacceptable, as I’m filling the bottle at the scuttlebutt.
Yeah, but that tap water in London is foul! No wonder they serve bottled water.
SOB asks how many liberals are happy that rich people are losing money in the latest stock market melt-down.
Answer:
1. Rich people aren’t losing money. They invest in stuff that doesn’t (often) lose money. How many rich people were destroyed by Enron’s collapse?
Hell, even Ken Lay had 8 million dollars in equities and a couple of expensive houses left after all the law suits etc. he went through.
It was pensioners and average Enron employees who were wiped out, of course . . .
2. Liberals don’t enjoy the suffering of others. That’s why they championed civil rights, gay rights, social security, national health care, 40 work week, labor unions, assistance to needy children etc.
Conservatives apparently don’t mind the suffering of others, which is why they opposed all of the above.
3. A lot of liberals are invested in the same equities that CONs are. There’s nothing wrong with owning shares in businesses that are good corporate citizens. A lot of people are in mutual fund portfolios that are constantly buying and selling dozens and even hundreds of companies.
It’s hard to know what one owns at any given time . . .
opps dow jones industrial average off 430 points mr.bush that could have been my social security dude
Posted by: rdw | July 26, 2007 at 01:55 PM
You might want to go check your SS “statement”. It clearly defines that the numbers are only estimated benefits. You have no right to any money and that laws can be changed to shaft you at any time.
“….There’s nothing wrong with owning shares in businesses that are good corporate citizens…”
Yeah, buy stock only in companies we personally feeeeeel goooood about. Oi. Good strategy there!
BTW, the Dow average under GW has to been one of the historical WORST.
It took FIVE YEARS just to get back to what it was in February 2001 when Bush took office. The NASDAQ is barely HALF of its historic high.
If you had invested 100,000 in a Dow Jones Index fund in Feb. of 2001 and checked it again in Feb. of last year, it would have been worth exactly 100,000 of Net Asset Value (there might have been some dividend income) for a percent return of exactly ZERO.
http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/quickchart/quickchart.asp?symb=djia&sid=1643&o_symb=djia&freq=2&time=13
Meanwhile, during that time, Social security didn’t miss a single paycheck.
Tell me again about how the stock market is a great alternative to social security?
Ummm….say Capn, miss the other day when the down hit 14k? …and all the other record closing lately? Yeah, worst ever, riiiiiiight.
SOB–
Guess you haven’t heard about the “social responsible” funds.
They generally do quite well, often better than the dirty co.s you love so much.
Reason #6 [of 12]: What you get will depend on whether you retire when the market is up or down.http://www.socsec.org/publications.asp?pubid=503#6
Has the new democratic congress passed a bill to buy off the subprime loans yet? This hurts poor people and minorities so I think liberals really should push this.
Now that the stock market is reflecting some apprehension about this, I have started to “care”. My REIT’s are off a little. It also would not be good to have mortgage lenders loosing money.
Afterall, the poor people ffected with ARMS cannot be expected to have read the documents they signed. They are victims here, not responsible parties.
Let’s get that bailout started as soon as possible.
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) — The already poor performance of many mortgage loans will worsen substantially through the rest of the year, according to an analysis released Thursday by Moody’s Economy.com.The company predicts that 2.5 million first mortgages will default this year, with little chance for improvement soon – Economy.com expects delinquencies to peak in the summer of 2008 at 3.6 percent of all outstanding mortgage debt, up from 2.9 percent during the first three months of 2007.The worst-hit loan category will be subprime adjustable-rate mortgages (ARMs). Economy.com expects foreclosures for those loans to hit 10 percent of that group by mid-2008. The foreclosure rate for that group is currently 4 percent and was as low as 2.5 percent in 2005.”The economic fallout from the devolving mortgage market will be substantial, but conditions would be even worse if not for a continued generally sturdy job market,” said Mark Zandi, chief economist of Moody’s Economy.com.
“social responsible” funds. Oh brother.
You better go dig up a chart showing how those perform better than the evil “un-social responsible” funds.
Okay, fair enough, SOB, let’s look at that.
In 6/07 the Dow hit 14,000. Of course TODAY it’s only at 13,600 or so, but ignoring that, let’s subtract where it was in 01/01.
14,000-11,000 = 3,000
3,000 / 11,000 = 27 percent return
27 / 6.5 years = 4.2 percent per annum
4.2 percent for SIX AND A HALF YEARS
That totally SUCKS. I’ve got a seven month CD I’m getting 7 percent on, and that has zero risk.
But you’re right, Bush has been really bad for the stock market. We won’t always have a f***ing idiot running the country, so the market should someday move up.
Very informative, re flooding and climate change.
‘Flash floods – a sign of what’s in store?’http://blogs.nature.com/climatefeedback/2007/07/flash_floods_a_sign_of_whats_i.html
The last time the stock market went down and stayed down like that was four years under CARTER.
if your local paper prints the Bizarro comic strip, please check it out. Does this not depict our favorite troll, and perhaps his own version of hell????
Hotdog1, as long as we’re discussing “responsible parties”, I think there was irresponsibility by the subprime lenders as well. Bluntly, there was a reason these folks couldn’t get the loan from a traditional lender, and in most cases, it was the lack of ability to repay. To me, at least, it is unacceptable for there to be a subprime lender to then “swoop in” and take advantage of the situation.
Hotdog–
Why do you CONs always think that tens of thousands or even millions of people can be bankrupted (for whatever reason) and it WON’T affect you or the country at all?
Their success is tied to your success.
You CONs didn’t have any trouble bailing out Neil Bush’s S & L.
From my understanding, several people have come forward that used to work for sub-prime ‘predatory’ lenders.
Their first day on the job, they watched ‘Boiler Room’ to give them a perspective on how they were to perform. The companies went as far as to tell the ’sellers’ to lie – do anything you can to get the borrow to closing.
VT you are certainly on track with that thought. These subprime lenders should go under for bad lending practices. The problem is that there will be many investors that lose money here just as many lost money on the over inflated tech stocks in the fall of 2000.
It always amazes me Cap that when I point to the DOW as an indicator of the good economy you scream that ‘regular’ people aren’t invested in the market but when it falls you are leading the attack of how it is bringing the economy down. WHich is it? Can’t have it both ways. There are always wrinkles – always have been, always will be. By the way I am ready to move some CDs and was wondering where you got that rate. I just might move mine to that institution.
Well Capn, If you’re happy with 7% then have at it.
That’s pretty crappy really and there’s plenty of good funds doing way better. And yes, the higher market averages factors in with that.
Don’t get supercilious with me, SOB.
I’m invested in all kinds of things.
The CD was just some spare cash I had lying around.
You can maintain the fiction that CONs are doing a lot better financially than I and my lib friends.
F*** that. I doubt very much that it’s true.
And it’s not how I measure success anyway, and if you value a man by how much money he has, then we have no common ground for continued discussion.
You might want to go check your SS “statement”. It clearly defines that the numbers are only estimated benefits. You have no right to any money and that laws can be changed to shaft you at any time.
Posted by: ProudMan | July 26, 2007 at 02:30 PM
Proudman you are exactly right. Just like babyboomers and their children got the shaft when congress raised the SS retirment age to 67+. No matter how you cut it financially, that is a loss of benefits. And why was that? How could that happen to the stellar example of socialism at it’s best?
At any time, congress giveth, and they can take it away. Wait until “means testing” starts!
Of course, if my money had been invested in the market I’d have more control over it – and congress could not spend every penny of it each year.
Ksgrm–
It was The Citzen’s State Bank (not to be confused with the Citizen’s Bank).
They had a 7-7-7 for awhile. 7,000 for 7 months at 7 percent per annum.
Don’t know if it’s still on or not right now.
Mine’s about ready to come due.
“…..The CD was just some spare cash I had lying around….”
Everyone else as impressed as I am?
I’m saying everyone can do good when the stock market goes up.
…even libs that hate the evil empire of corporations and their evil scheme to make a profit.
Hotdog1, as long as we’re discussing “responsible parties”, Posted by: Vaughn Tolle | July 26, 2007 at 02:48 PM
I agree with you! We need to keep promoting the Americans who signed up for those loans as people to pity. They are, after all, the poor victims of the big corporations who took advantage of them.
I like that! That means a bailout is coming.
To your point, no one twisted the signers arms on the ARMS. But I’ll grant the lenders the same greedy part that we give to credit card companies who charge people double digit interest rates in a single digit era. Or Banks/CU’s providing LT 1% on savings/checking, but loaning it out at 8-12%.
In all these cases, the people doing the lending are making huge returns. But they are also the one’s taking the risk.
It gets ugly when capitalism collides with socialism.
Looks like this lie is going to lead to reprimands. Wonder if bush as cic didn’t know about it early on.General faces demotion in Tillman case By LOLITA C. BALDOR, Associated Press Writer58 minutes ago
WASHINGTON – Army Secretary Peter Geren is expected to recommend that a retired three-star general be demoted for his role in providing misleading information about the death of Army Ranger Pat Tillman, military officials say, in what would be a stinging and rare rebuke.
ADVERTISEMENTLt. Gen. Philip Kensinger, who headed Army special operations, is one of seven high-ranking Army officers expected to get official reprimands for making critical errors in reporting the circumstances of Tillman’s friendly-fire shooting in Afghanistan in April 2004.
The officials requested anonymity because the punishments under consideration by Geren have not been made public. The Army said that no final decisions have been made, and that once they are and the Tillman family and Congress have been notified, there will be an announcement sometime next week.
Geren also is considering issuing a letter of censure to Kensinger, who is receiving the harshest punishment of those involved in what has become a three-year controversy that triggered more than half a dozen investigations. Five other officers, including three generals, are expected to be issued less severe letters criticizing their actions.
Army officials opted not to impose harsher punishments, which could have included additional demotions, dishonorable discharges or even jail time. One senior officer, Lt. Gen. Stanley McChrystal, commander of the Joint Special Operations Command, escaped punishment.
Tillman’s death received worldwide attention because he had walked away from a huge contract with the National Football League’s Arizona Cardinals to enlist in the Army after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.
Tillman’s mother, Mary, said the impending punishments were inadequate.
“I’m not satisfied with any of it,” she said in a telephone interview with The Associated Press.
She rejected the Pentagon’s characterization of the officers’ offenses as “errors” in reporting Tillman’s death, when several officers have said they had made conscious decisions not to tell Tillman’s family that friendly fire was suspected.
Geren’s pending decisions come four months after two investigative reports found that Army officers provided misleading and inaccurate information about Tillman’s death. A central issue in the case has been why the Army waited about five weeks after it suspected the former NFL star’s death was caused by friendly fire before telling his family.
The probes found that nine officers — including four generals — were at fault in providing the bad information and should be held accountable. But the reports determined that there was no criminal wrongdoing in the actual shooting, and that there was no deliberate cover-up.
Geren then tapped Gen. William Wallace to review the probes and recommend disciplinary actions. Wallace disagreed with initial findings against McChrystal, according to the military officials.
But Wallace also surprised Army officials by singling out a 10th officer for rebuke — one who had not been blamed in the earlier reports.
Brig. Gen. Gina Farrisee, who is director of military personnel management at the Pentagon, is expected to receive a letter of punishment for her involvement in the oversight of the awarding of Tillman’s Silver Star.
Two others who were blamed in earlier reports are also expected to receive letters of admonishment: Brig. Gen. Gary Jones, who led one of the early Army investigations into the matter, and now-Brig. Gen. James C. Nixon, who was Tillman’s regimental commander.
Jones, now retired from the Army, was faulted for failing to address several issues in his probe, leading to speculation that Army officials were concealing information about Tillman’s death.
Nixon was criticized for failing to ensure that Tillman’s family was told.
The names of the three lower level officers expected to be punished have not been released by the military, but they are likely among the five who were blamed — but also not named — in the earlier investigations.
According to an AP analysis of the reports and other documents, those five officers include then-Capt. Richard Scott, who conducted the first investigation into the shooting; then-Lt. Col. Ralph Kauzlarich, who conducted the second; and then-Lt. Col. Jeff Bailey, the battalion commander who oversaw Tillman’s platoon and played a role in the recommendation for his Silver Star. Officials would not say if any of those three were among the ones recommended for rebuke.
It is no surprise that Kensinger, 60, is targeted for the most severe punishment. An investigation by the Defense Department’s inspector general found “compelling evidence that Kensinger learned of suspected fratricide well before the memorial service and provided misleading testimony” on that issue. That misrepresentation, the report said, could constitute a “false official statement,” a violation of the Military Code of Justice.
Farrisee’s rebuke is tied to the Army recommendations that Tillman receive the Silver Star. The investigations found that Army officials were aware that Tillman was likely killed by friendly fire even as they were moving ahead with the medal that was awarded for heroism in the face of the enemy.
If Geren does recommend to Defense Secretary Robert Gates that Kensinger lose a star and be demoted to major general, that would trigger a decrease in his retirement pension and benefits.
The letters of rebuke for the others could also be crippling blows. They can include letters of concern, reprimand or censure, with escalating degrees of gravity.
“For officers generally, a reprimand is a devastating career injury,” said Eugene Fidell, a lawyer who specializes in military cases and teaches at American University’s Washington College of Law. “It can trigger an effort to throw the person out of the military, it can trigger a reduction in pay grade when the time comes to retire, it can prevent a future promotion, and it can gum up a promotion that has already been decided.”
For a one-star general, Fidell said, it could mean they are likely to never get a second star. And, he said, a lower level officer, such as a captain, “would have to dig out of a deep hole to continue his or her career. Letters of reprimand are truly bad news.”
And everyone can enjoy the market “discipline” of seeing a big index like the Dow PLUNGE from a high of around 11,000 (01/01) to 8,000 (01/03) over TWO YEARS later.
Gee, if someone had sunk a nice pile of money into DOW index funds when Bush took office and then died two years later (under the piratized Soc. security plan, say), they would have left their widows or heirs about 30 percent LESS than if they had just plunked it under the mattress . . .
Hotdog1, the subprime lenders involved likely have little to no risk from their actions. I believe that they, like traditional lenders, packaged the ARMs and sold the same on the secondary market, happily pocketing the cash, leaving all the risk to fall upon the investors who fund the secondary market for mortgages. No, the investors are not without fault here either, as there should have been careful examination of the packages in which they were investing. However, given the beginning of the fallout over this as referenced by Sol upthread, there may well have been fraud involved. The injured parties, however, will likely be eating their investments in whole or in part, as the subprime lenders involved will likely be out of business, judgment proof, or go into Bankruptcy (as has Conseco, Chapter 11, about four years ago long before the current issues surrounding subprime lenders were known).
Well Capn, you better play it safe and take all your spare cash and burry it in the backyard then.
Your extreme hatred for the President and trying to twist good things into bad and then blaming that on him is just…well…laughable.
Take a deep breath dude.
Also, SOB, you haven’t explained why if seven percent return is so crappy for a rock solid investment, why is the DOW so great when it posted less than 5 percent return per year for the LAST FIVE YEARS, including the inherent risk of owning stocking.
Usually, higher risk means higher returns–NOT IF YOU OWN THE DOW UNDER BUSH.
I bought some stocks today, hope it wasn’t too early.With inflation the average investor has not done well during the bush admin., factor in their increase in the national debt., and they are net losers. Factor in the cost to be paid for the iraq fiasco, and they’ve done extremely poorly over his reign.
The repubs. anticipated this when they changed the bankruptcy laws to favor the lenders rather than teh debtors.
7% is fine for a no-risk investment. If you’re happy with 7% return then that’s fine. I am not. Stocks and funds are returning higher for me and have for years. The past couple of years have been the best so far for me. UNDER BUSH. ….not that he had anything to do with it.
The DOWs an average indicator you know….just one of the indicators in the market. Nobody would be happy with 5% with a long term investment.
Life Decisions International has released a new boycott list of corporations that donate to Planned Parenthood, America’s busiest abortionist. Companies added to the list for the first time include Allstate insurance company, CCA Global (the parent of Carpet One and other flooring stores), Chevron, Texaco, Comcast, DuPont, eBay and PayPal, the Four Seasons Hotels, GlaxoSmithKline, Marriott, OSI Restaurants (which includes Outback Steakhouse), Sears and Kmart, Sonic, and Wawa convenience stores. Companies that remain on the boycott list include Abode software, Wachovia, Nike, Time Warner, Bank of America, CIGNA, Walt Disney, Johnson & Johnson, Wells Fargo, Whole Foods, and Nationwide insurance. Charitable organizations associated with Planed Parenthood include the Audubon Society, Alzheimer’s Association, AARP, American Diabetes Association, Juvenile Diabetes Foundation, MDA, NEA, MS Society, and the Sierra Club.Boycott ‘em.[Unfortunately, we cannot boycott Congress for giving our tax money to Planned Parenthood, but merely can have our complaints ignored by Democrats and RINOs until Election Day.]
In Texas, the Prolife Waco organization is calling for an explanation of a huge discrepancy between statistics regarding statutory rape cases Planned Parenthood says it has reported, and the number of those cases documented by law enforcement or other authorities. Planned Parenthood abortion mills are notorious for instructing statutory rape victims to lie about a predator’s age or other circumstances, in order to avoid guilt for failure to report such crimes to criminal authorities, which might interfere with abortion profits.
Someone mentioned returns up thread and looking for a place to park some CD’s. May I suggest the following funds:
Twelve Month:C Fund 20.63S Fund 19.47I Fund 27.18L 2010 Fund 12.15L2020 Fund 15.90L2030 Fund 17.60
http://www.tsp.gov/rates/returns-5years.html
BTW, these are the same funds proposed for the privatized accounts under Social Security.
Not too bad heh? Same funds congress sticks their government checks in!
The subprime mess is founded on greed and duplicity, the same as the S&L crisis, the dot.com melt-down, etc., etc. EVerybody saw a chance to make a quick buck and stick the suckers with the tab.
Parkay, did it occur to you that not every victim of statutory rape goes running to the nearest Planned Parenthood clinic? Of course there would be a discrepancy. They don’t all end up with an STD or pregnant, thank goodness. Some go to family doctors, some go straight to the authorities.
PP is not “notorious” for anything. YOU and your Operation Refuse buddies are notorious for _saying_ they are.
Go spread your rhetoric somewhere else.
A new poll conducted by the New York Times and CBS News finds that 56% of Americans want abortions to be illegal or under more strict limitations. The survey found 22% of Americans say abortions should not be permitted and another 34% want abortions to be much more restricted than they are currently.
And since all of those people polled are medical authorities, they’re really qualified to comment, right?
Public polls don’t control the law, legislators do. We live in a democratic republic, laws aren’t codified by a show of hands.
Thanks for providing me with a list of places I SHOULD shop Parkay. I appreciate that.
Actually, CapnAmerica, that 4.2% rate is really a 3.7% rate compounded annually over 6.5 years; compounded being how these things are usually calculated and reported.
While stock returns have been bad recently, over the last 100 or so years, the return on equities has been about 10%, and on bonds, about 6%, and on case, which is what your CD is, about 3%.
I’m not REAL sure, but seems the last I heard, statutory rape doesnt involve any NEED to visit an abortion clinic, since no SEX happened… I could be wrong…
“I’m not REAL sure, but seems the last I heard, statutory rape doesnt involve any NEED to visit an abortion clinic, since no SEX happened… I could be wrong…”
Posted by: Chas. | July 26, 2007 at 04:18 PM
You may have to explain that further Chas, I don’t get it.
A Memphis TV station aired the story of lesbian high school gangs raping and sodomizing normal female schoolgirls, as also reported by Bill O’Reilly, although the news has been spiked by other news outlets across the nation. GLAAD is threatening to sue the TV station for making lesbians look bad.At least 10 Memphis high schools have reported this growing problem to the Shelby County Sheriff’s gang unit.There is some suggestion that these gangs were inspired to commit gang rapes by the vulgar lesbian play “Vagina Monologues”, which promotes the seduction of underage girls by adult lesbians.See news pagehttp://www.cwfa.org/articles/13499/CFI/education/index.htmand TV cliphttp://blip.tv/file/165392/and flashback Philadelphia lesbian gang news of 2004 pagehttp://www.nbc10.com/news/2857417/detail.html- – -
Thanks, anonymous. Actually, I did know that about the historical returns from the stock market.
Which is why I’m aggressively investing in stock funds like a lot of people are.
But my point is simply what is written on every prospectus you get in the mail: “past performance is no indication of future earnings.”
The people invested in Enron thought they had their retirements taken care of too . . .
Parkay–
What exactly is your obsessive hang-up with sex? A kind of puritannical pruience so typical of you right-wingers.
What ever it is, I wish you’d take it somewhere else . . .
With ss money pumped into the market, you would have rampant price escalation. The market manipulators would in the end wind up with the $, and the poor worker would get screwed.
“As for IVF, I am not opposed as long as all the human eggs fertilized are implanted with the opportunity for live birth. Freezing and thawing will kill some fertilized embryos. I would prefer that nearly all orphans were adopted before promoting IVF instead of adoption.- – -Posted by: parkay | July 25, 2007 at 09:41 PM ”
Hypocrite Parkay is thy name!
You are not opposed to IVF as long as all fertilized embryos are implated? That would be like saying you are not opposed to abortion as long as no fetus are killed.
ANY time IVF is done, dozens of eggs are fertilized, many are implanted with the express knowledge that they will not successfully implant and will ‘die’ and the rest are frozen or destroyed. This always happens, exactly like every time there is an abortion, a fetus dies.
If you truely believe a fertilized egg is a living being there is no way you could EVER support IVF, regardless if all the orphans are adopted or not!
Posted by: brian | July 26, 2007 at 12:58 AM
Kansas
“So Ed, you’re saying that the Zionists of Israel are the equivalent of the Burger Kings of the Middle East? (have it their way)”
No, Kansas, but they are the Gestapo and their way isn’t pretty. The Labor Party in Israel wants peace, but the [Zionist] Likuds and Katiana [sp] Parties keep everybody in hot water.
Kansas — I dont think statutory rape is “actual sex rape” at least not in all circumstances… If that is the case, why would it be reported to or from Planned Parenthood, as was implied upthread??
“A new poll conducted by the New York Times and CBS News finds that 56% of Americans want abortions to be illegal or under more strict limitations. The survey found 22% of Americans say abortions should not be permitted and another 34% want abortions to be much more restricted than they are currently.
Posted by: parkay | July 26, 2007 at 03:42 PM ”
Link please.
OK I found my answer>>>
“In accordance with the FBI definition, statutory rape is characterized as non-forcible sexual intercourse with a person who is younger than the statutory age of consent. The actual ages for these laws vary greatly from state-to-state, as do the punishments for offenders. Many states do not use the actual term “statutory rape,” simply calling it rape or unlawful sexual penetration among a variety of other titles.
These laws rarely apply only to intercourse, but rather to any type of sexual contact.”
I was getting my previous idea from the last sentence of the definition…
Ah okay Ed. I know about the secular Jews.
We have secular folks in the U.S. that cause trouble as well.
I’m unsure though other than what you pointed out how to separate the two other than by political association in a Democratic Society like Israel.
Labeling Peace Activists and War Mongers in any society is liable to draw more attention from those being oppressed.
Lot of the so-called oppressed in Palestine has been cause directly by the attacks of the radical Islamic militants. There are more Palestinians that would like to peacefully co-exist with Israel than the one’s that never want to give the Israeli’s peace.
It takes two sides to make a peace. Unless you’re Switzerland and declare neutrality. Even the Swiss have a defensive military though.
Statutory rape and other KS sex laws:http://www.kslegislature.org/legsrv-statutes/
Section 21-3501 to 21-3525
Well Chas, as you may well know pre-seminal fluid may carry viable sperm in which a female perhaps get pregnant even if there was no ejaculation by the male.
Penetration during the act of sex with a penis occupies a high risk situation (physically, legally and morally) and has been deemed illegal by all States.
Your previous Non Sequitur statement was not in line with the risk assessment involving statutory rape and linking a visit to an abortion clinic.
Penetration always has a certain risk and therefore as a consequence a trip to the abortion clinic may be considered as an option to terminate the illegal act.
should read penetration with an underage female…
Ice Cube Cold
How Stuff Works WebsiteAre ice blocks better than air conditioning?
http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/ice-block-ac.htm
“A novel method of air conditioning is taking root among some of the world’s most powerful corporations, and it uses the simple power of ice. Morgan Stanley and Credit Suisse now use massive ice blocks instead of traditional air-conditioning systems in some of their offices. Credit Suisse is considering expanding the system beyond its 1.9-million-square-foot Manhattan office to its other locations around the world, but they won’t be alone. An estimated 3,000 facilities around the world use ice-based cooling systems [Source: Discovery].”
“The system works by making ice at night, when lower power usage means energy is cheaper and lower temperatures mean less power is required to freeze water. The larger the difference between nighttime and daytime temperatures is, the greater the energy savings. In Credit Suisse’s system, the ice forms overnight, and as it melts during the day, fans blow cold air into the cooling system and throughout the building. At the end of the day, the 51,200 gallons of water — spread across three rooms in 64 tanks — is ready to be frozen again. The ice-block system can also be combined with traditional air conditioning, which is the case in Credit Suisse’s New York office.”
brian,The poll showing a majority in favor of abolition or more restriction of abortion was distributed on 07/26 as a news item fromnews pagehttp://lifenews.com/
Republican
“Lot of the so-called oppressed in Palestine has been cause directly by the attacks of the radical Islamic militants. There are more Palestinians that would like to peacefully co-exist with Israel than the one’s that never want to give the Israeli’s peace.
It takes two sides to make a peace.”
You are glossing over the problem.
The Israelis murder and brutalize the Palestinians every day, morning, noon and night, so your comparaison isn’t real.
The Israelis are the problem, and just as brutal as were the Gestapo, with no chance for anything “peaceful” to happen.The Gestapo, did not want peace, any more than the Israelis want peace to stop their aggression.
That is the real problem.
The two sides are not close to being equal, with the US giving Israel everything and the Palestinians nothing.
The two sides are not close to being equal, with the US giving Israel everything and the Palestinians nothing.
Posted by: Ed Friedemann | July 26, 2007 at 07:38 PM
Oh, I wouldn’t categorize something as nothing Ed. Read the following link.
http://usinfo.state.gov/xarchives/display.html?p=texttrans-english&y=2007&m=June&x=20070621155920eaifas0.8757593
I feel a little responsibility for Open Thread, because WE responded to my suggestion to go from once-a-week to daily.
I have just felt really sad to see the thread degenerate into dysfunctional bickering, with zero substantive input.
Today’s thread indicates we can move beyond that.
I think posting links is good. More food for thought is beneficial.
The numbers that count suggest that the Dems will win in 2008. The numbers I mean are campaign donations–the Dems are ahead of the Repubs by $100 M, according to the Wall Street Journal. The securities industry is favoring Dems in financing by 69% to 31%.
Bill Richardson’s campaign created the first humorous self-deprecating ad, where he presented himself as a job applicant. Other Dems have jumped on board. The Repubs haven’t done this. Americans like humor.
Kansas
What you’ve posted misrepresents, as for openers: ” U.S. announces “intent” to contribute an additional $40 million” when in fact the US does not support any workable solution to jump-start an economy which will sustain those Palestinians in between Israeli military “operations.”
Ever try to eat an “Intent Sandwich” in a hail of artillery shells?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/27/world/middleeast/27saudi.html?_r=2&hp=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print&oref=slogin
“Now, Bush administration officials are voicing increasing anger at what they say has been Saudi Arabia’s counterproductive role in the Iraq war. They say that beyond regarding Mr. Maliki as an Iranian agent, the Saudis have offered financial support to Sunni groups in Iraq. Of an estimated 60 to 80 foreign fighters who enter Iraq each month, American military and intelligence officials say that nearly half are coming from Saudi Arabia and that the Saudis have not done enough to stem the flow.”
“Officials in Washington have long resisted blaming Saudi Arabia for the chaos and sectarian strife in Iraq, choosing instead to pin blame on Iran and Syria. Even now, military officials rarely talk publicly about the role of Saudi fighters among the insurgents in Iraq.”
A much more comprehensive look at the numbers.
pollingreport.com/abortion.htm
The sauds have always tried to export their radicals and pay them off, rather than deal with them at home. Guess they’d rather have their radical militants “blowing themselves up over there, rather than over here”.
Did you all read about the proposed 750 mil. in aid to the tribal areas of pakistan, and the lifting of any export duties from the area in an effort to improve conditions there? Wonder what the money they make will be used for, funding their Afghanistan taliban fighters, or Al-Quida? Bush and his pentagon are gol dern jeniuses!
Ever try to eat an “Intent Sandwich” in a hail of artillery shells?
Posted by: Ed Friedemann | July 26, 2007 at 08:43 PM
No, but I have eaten sandwiches in a tent. :)
Thanks for your more than ample notes on my question earlier Kanss… And yet another area for your vast wealth of expertise… I posted earlier that i FOUND my answer… almost as fast as I asked the question… I was thinking of a different statute… But, nice try anyway!!
And, oh, yea, I know how pre-seminal fluid works… I have two kids and 5 grand kids… And I also know it is extremely rare that pre-seminal fluid causes a pregnancy… nice try!!
Jews have been despised for thousands of years, yet now that Bush has turned them loose, those reasons are rising to the surface like “floatees.”
More and more Israeli soldiers are refusing to “work” in the “territories” and their masters are not punishing them as long as they stay “quiet” about the reasons.
The most powerful man in the world is acting like a child with a loaded gun.
And the “reasoning” of that child is why we are are where we are.
Never has America made such a horrible mistake.
And congress is following suit.
America is being depised as much as the Israelis; they’ve taken us down that far.
brain,You would be correct in saying that I am opposed to IVF the way it is being practiced today.
Parkay,Have you protested, or would you support protesting outside IVF clinics? For every woman that has IVF, dozens of fertile eggs are ‘killed’.
Stopping 1 in vitro rather than 1 abortion would be more efficient in terms of saving babies.Funny, I did not see anything about this on the CWFA website.
“A new poll conducted by the New York Times and CBS News finds that 56% of Americans want abortions to be illegal or under more strict limitations. The survey found 22% of Americans say abortions should not be permitted and another 34% want abortions to be much more restricted than they are currently.
Posted by: parkay | July 26, 2007 at 03:42 PM ”
Quote from CBS story on this same survey:”(CBS) On the 30th anniversary of the Supreme Court’s Roe v. Wade decision, a CBS News/New York Times poll finds the vast majority of Americans continues to believe that abortion should remain available in at least some cases.
Seventy-seven percent of respondents said abortion should either be generally available, or available but with stricter limits than now. Just 22 percent said abortion should not be permitted.”
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/01/22/opinion/polls/main537570.shtml
Funny how statistics and survey results can be twisted.
Depends on how far you want to spin the chicken’ neck, brian LOL
No mater how you spin that CBS poll report, there are still just 22% of the American People who want to END ABORTION totally!!
I just wonder why the right wingers havent taken notice that the only ones they are preachin to is the Choir…
The last I checked, it takes a lot more than 22% in favor of anything, to make it happen in a democracy…. Why does the 22% keep acting like they speak for ALL the people???
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