U.S. students know a little bit more about history, but not much. The National Assessment of Educational Progress’ test last year on U.S. history showed no more than 8 percent increases within the three grade groups tested and drastic declines as students get older and near voting age. Some are blaming the lack of history knowledge on the No Child Left Behind Act, which focuses on reading and math. But even if history were taught to its full potential, would U.S. teens pay attention?
Posted by Andie Clum
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45 Comments
I have met a black woman in her twenties, lived here all of life and asked me who Martin Luther Kings was when I have asked her what she was going to do for the holiday.She actually did not know who he was or what he was about, go figure.
More ammo for Ron Paul, or opportunity for jingoistic Giuliani? How are we going to entangle ourselves from the abyss in the Mideast now …
NEA
Jimmy Carter
’nuff said.
Maybe we should make “My Pet Goat” required reading.
Maybe we should disband the teacher’s union.
Since we, the public, are paying their salaries – they are actually organizing AGAINST the taxpayer.
No wonder our kids are scoring lower and lower and lower. Today’s teaching motto is ‘it’s all about us.’
I’ve never read “My Pet Goat,” but at least it’s a book. Our kids need books more than Ipods, texting cellphones, and those stupid baggy pants that show their underwear.
A national dress code?
Now there’s an idea.
Here we go again, blame the teachers.
GSheridan, what law are you going to invoke to carry your insane plan: “Maybe we should disband the teacher’s union”? The NEA has 302 million members who might disagree a bit with your assertion that they “are actually organizing AGAINST the taxpayer”.
But of course, you are bush-apologist who just loves to find a bogeyman to blame for every problem in the world.
Gee, Apophis, personal attacks so early in the morning?
Grab a cup of coffee to smooth those ragged nerves and come on back with a smile. lol
Of course, the teachers will disagree with disbanding, they have a cushy ride right now.
Problem is – our kids aren’t learning. Private school kids and home schooled kids keep beating them on all fronts – even technology.
So – go ahead and sing the praises of the teachers.
But, talk about empty lyrics…..
It usually isn’t the teachers fault that kids are not learning anything. It is mostly the parents and kids fault. The teacher can teach all day but if nobody is listening to her, they are not going to learn anything. And yes, the teachers should be unionized. Parents who care will see to it that their kids learn even if they have to move them to another environment to do it. We have a mother here in Georgia that just was found not guilty Friday for enrolling her 3 kids in the wrong school district here. They was trying to put her in prison for 13 years for it.
“Private school kids and home schooled kids keep beating them on all fronts – even technology.”
Uhh . . . nope; not correct. If you read the above link, and not cherry pick, you might just learn something.
http://nces.ed.gov/nationsreportcard/pubs/studies/2006461.asp
The teaching system does need change, but not anything to do with the teachers unions. It has to do with core curriculum, and the twenty-first century.
History is very important. Just consider a greater writers words that “Those who don’t learn from history, are doomed to repeat it.”
That lesson holds true when one looks at this administrations failure to look at past conflicts, and the lessons that should have been learned from them. Obviously, they have little, if any, understanding of history.
“But even if history were taught to its full potential, would U.S. teens pay attention?”
I don’t think so Andy. And it’s not the kid’s (as a group) fault. They start as a blank slate and become what they are made. Do teacher unions bear some fault? Yup. And so do coddling parents that pay for everything the kids want and who refuse to enforce any kind of discipline.
302 million members in one union? That accounts for every man, woman and child in the United States. I had no idea we were all members of that union…even us non-teacher types.
History is awesome! I loved history in school.
I disagree that blaming it on the teacher’s union is what is wrong here though. GS doesn’t like any union that gives the workers a chance to keep themselves from getting screwed.
Not only is U.S. history important, but it would be even better if students got a thorough look at world history. A survey of the ancient world would be helpful. Kids get a glimpse of it when they read Sophocles in high school English, but we need to go deeper. The world really begins to open up when you understand that people haven’t changed one bit. The ancient Athenian leaders faced the same damned if you do and damned if you don’t situations that our leaders face. It’s too bad if kids do not graduate with at least some understanding of what happened in the Peloponnesian War. The lessons are still relevant.
Who cares about stuffs that is so beyond last week. Today’s teenagers probably care more about what is “now” than some boring old craps that won’t matter much, right?
On the other hand, if History Channel is free, maybe more people will realize that history is “cool”. Just knowing what have shaped today’s society: industrial revolution, age of exploration, eras of colonisation; they’re good to give a sense of identity. At the least, trivias can be great conversation pieces to use when cruising the singles bars. :)
We should not expect any meaningful change from the gentle ‘reform” measures that school boards and governments agree to implement. The consitituancy of the public schools — which is not the welfare of the students — will not allow it.
They can’t read.
They can’t write.
They can’t spell.,
They can’t do math.
They couldn’t tell you who is in the current Administration let alone who any of our prominent historical figures are…
However, they can do these things wonderfully:
Our children can put a condom on properly.
They are taught how to have safe sex.
They are taught about Evolution.
They are shown Al Gores propaghanda film: An inconvienent truth in every class.
They learn about equal opportunity, racism, sexism, bigotry, and sexual orientation discrimination.
No worries here.
What an interesting thread today. After 27 years in the military I plan to retire this year and am considering becoming a teacher. After reading the above threads I have a few questions for the group; What are you as a parent or student looking for in a teacher? What would it take to draw the students interest in the subject? I love history and remember an 8th grade teacher who used to dress up in costume and try to bring the subject to life, what an impact he had on me. I really am interested in the feed back and I would imagine so would any other educators out there as well.
Again, GS, has shouted out a GOP talking point. Shut down the NEA but yet these same Republicans have no trouble supporting the doctors’ union – AMA or the lawyers’ union – ABA (as long as they are Republican lawyers).
The NEA is nothing but a teachers union. If you don’t like one union, you don’t like any of them. Simple enough even for a GOP talking head to comprehend, if she puts her mind to it.
I have had 3 three children in the public schools system. I have 3 granddchildren inthe public schools system. I have one child that is a teacher, and another in an ancilliary role at a public university. I have friends, neighbors, and relatives that are teachers, my wife works at the local school. I have no problem with the public schools and do not push for homeschooling (works, bu way too much work to do correctly) or private schools. Fine if somebody wants, but I don’t push for them. However, I think the school system is rapidly becoming broken. I see it coming from three places1) people who want the shool to be the end all for everything (breakfasts, social education and experimentation,,ect. it is hard for me to define this morning, but I see it2) Parents who want their children to be babysat, who want free daycare, even when the kid is sick. Parents who don;t want to let the school fail Johnny or Jane, because even though they suck at school, it might hurt their little pscyhes, (sp sucks this am too), parents who believe little johnny and little jane do no wrong so how dare you you give them detention, and parents who put absolutely no value on an education3) Teachers and teachers unionswho by their very nature are about protecting teachers, who are their clients, and not the students. Teacher tenure is probably the biggest culprit. If a teacher is bad, fire their butt, just like in the real world. There are plenty of good people who are teachers, that love their students, and want them to learn and prepare for life. There are also plenty of teachers that are just puttng in their time, who care about little except their pay and benefits, or wating for retirement. they are boring, and do not do their job.Yet they are protected by the union and other teachers, even though in the teachers lounge theyrail against them. Usually the admin will do nothing, because the want to be seen as supporting their teachers (not all bad), and do not want the hassle of trying to replace them.
Without a change in all three, the school system is doomed
GS whining about personal attacks? Say it isnt so…
And she hates unions? Pmom called it. Social Dominance Orientation.
Cant have those “underlings” organize, now can we?
History was my favorite subject while going to school. I was always partial to US History myself, but reading and understanding ancient civilizations helps to broaden kids horizons.
“Cant have those “underlings” organize, now can we?”————
Perfect example of why our children are scoring lower and lower; half-brain’s spewing PC talking-points without any rhyme or reason.
And the drum beats on…..
Nathan says, “They can’t spell.,” and then goes on to talk about “Al Gores propaghanda” [sic] film and proves exactly what he’s talking about.
Also, usually one doesn’t put a comma immediately following a period: “spell.,” and the possessive of Al Gore would be of course “Al Gore’s” with an apostrophe “s.”
The thing I don’t like about how history is taught is the emphasis on dates and places rather than context. Those things are easier to ‘test’ then thinking is.
For example, the who and connections of the assassin who killed the ArchDuke Ferdinand is more important than the date. Interesting to note that, in effect, World War One was sparked by Serbia. Most people think Germany started it. (Of course, the Triple Alliance and Triple Entente were just waiting for a spark)
GSheridan writes that “our children are scoring lower and lower . . . ”
Actually, you must not have been paying attention during the last SOTU when Bush crowed about the scores going UP.
Also, SAT scores are up from 20 years ago as well.
Interestingly, when scores went down from the 60’s to the 80’s, all the reich-wingers blamed “socialized schools,” but strangely when the scores went UP from the mid-eighties to today, they didn’t CREDIT the improved schools.
Those that do not remember history are doomed to repeat it. So, if the young are not taught history, well…….
“Also, SAT scores are up from 20 years ago as well.”————–
You wouldn’t be talking about the NEW SAT’s that dropped the analogy section, and combined other parts, would you?
I suppose if you take reasoning out – public school kids may score higher.
lol
RE: Teaching HISTORY
The biggest problem we have in the public regarding history is how to make US history seem a glorious and inevitable march of progress when actually it IS a death match of ideology.
History is the story of competing world views and power struggles.
Because of people like G Sheridan who don’t want our kids to know that Helen Keller was a flaming SOCIALIST, because of people like outlander who don’t want kids exposed to The Salem Witch Trials and impassioned defenders of SLAVERY perpetrated by the most devout CHRISTIANS (so-called) at the time, because of people like Nathan who can’t conceive of any occasion when the US military would be involved in overseas imperialism like The Philippines or Cuba (”Remember the Maine”) or simple facism like Kent State, we get this stupidly mind-numbing version of American exceptionalism.
The history taught in most public schools is so patently bogus and mythologized that even the kids don’t buy it . . .
“”Cant have those “underlings” organize, now can we?”————
Perfect example of why our children are scoring lower and lower; half-brain’s spewing PC talking-points without any rhyme or reason.”
Got any proof of that? “why our children are scoring lower and lower”?
The NEA has 302 million members who might disagree a bit with your assertion that they “are actually organizing AGAINST the taxpayer”.Posted by: Apophis | May 21, 2007 at 05:17 AM
Holy Frijoles Apophis! 302 million members in the NEA? Wouldn’t that be like almost everyone in the United States? :D
History has always been one of my favorite subjects. If you have excellent history teachers, which I had, you can’t wait to attend their class.
In all fairness though, the children of today have access to the Internet, History and Discovery Channel, PBS and other sources of history. They might be getting more history knowledge than we think.
About the SAT scores going up…Didn’t they “adjust” them?
I know they adjusted the ACT test several times. My ACT scores went up and down twice during those changes.
Ben,
I agree completely.
The best history class I ever took was my US History Colonialization to 1865 class at WSU with Dr Born.
About 2/3 of the test was multiple choice/ true false and 1/3 essay. Of course it was a 100 level course though.
Dr Born taught the class from a context perspective instead of a date/time one. We had to read the book and get the dates on our own for the test.
I learned more in that class than I ever did in High School.
Anyhow, I agree. Context is so much better than simply saying that on X day X happened.
Really, Republican?
What were your ACT scores?
29 overall I think Capn, been awhile since I’ve seen them though. Don’t recall what the individual assessments were. My first test was a 30, then it got upgraded, then down graded. I have no clue why.
Not that it makes a difference now.
I never took the ACT but know that one of the reasons that SAT scores fell from the 60s to 80s is that so many more people took them.
And to rub salt in an already-open wound, public schools actually lie and CHEAT to keep from being accountable.
For shame.
http://www.reason.com/news/show/36161.html
All I have to say about teachers unions, is that all they should be able effect or to comment on is the work conditions of the Teachers (their members).
We elect people that choose what is taught and what is expect of our teachers and students to accomplish..
Great history teachers are adept at bringing the past back to life, of helping the student imagine his way into the period in question. You have to nail down the details, but it’s also good to show how the described event mirrors today’s world. Enthusiasm helps and anecdote can be wonderful. Points have already been made about the importance of remembering this stuff. It’s essential that people know the stories. I believe it was Faulkner (or was it Twain?) who had a quote about the past, something along the lines that it is not even past. The Athenians from antiquity, for instance, are only superficially separated from us, even with all of our technological advances. They are us and we are them, if only we can see it. In all of the ways that matter, we are every bit as brilliant or every bit as blind as they were, depending on how you look at it. Consider the famous choral ode of “Antigone,” for example (Knox translation), that says of humanity in general: “Equipped with the ingenuity of its techniques, a thing subtle beyond expectation, it makes its way sometimes to bad, and sometimes to good.” In essence, our cell phones and text messaging arguably serve a purpose, but do they also serve to distract our students from the relevant subjects? We make our way sometimes to bad, and sometimes to good, just as people have always done.
Part of the problem with history is that it ties in so much with politics.
And politics in this country has become the concern of the elite, BY DESIGN.
Consider if you will the new immigration law. If the American people could vote on whether they want some 12 million illegal aliens to become citizens, we would vote overwhelmingly AGAINST it.
But thanks to our political system which insulates top officials from the will of the majority so effectively (by a variety of means, including the electoral college), we’re going to have this rammed down our throats, just like we had the Iraq War rammed down our throats, and tax cuts for the rich rammed down our throats.
Why should kids care about history when history is telling them, “you can’t do anything . . . just buy more crap and watch basketball”?
Why should kids care about history when history is telling them, “you can’t do anything . . . just buy more crap and watch basketball”?
Posted by: CapnAmerica | May 21, 2007 at 12:01 PM
No, that’s their parents
So Republican got a score higher than 97 percent of all ACT takers . . .
Why does this not surprise me?
Anyway, it shows how good the public schools are, right, Republican?
BTW, the analogy section was done away with because it was crap.
Consider this:
Mole is to chocolate as frijoles are to
A. arroz.B. burritos.C. salsa.D. fiber.
You’d have to know about Mexican cooking to answer that question, right? So it’s very culturally bias in favor of Hispanics.
Now consider this:
A tee is to a golfball as a danforth is to a
A. dingy.B. anchor.C. a galleon.D. a lighthouse.
This analogy is culturally biased to the wealthy who know more about golf and sailing.
The analogy section mainly tested from what class one comes from.
That’s a sticki wicket ya got there m’boy!
It shows how good the Public Schools used to be Capn.
I remember talking to a High School Algebra teacher. I mentioned, “yeah we had to factor out each and every step of our problems or we wouldn’t get credit.”
The teacher said, “Oh! We don’t do that anymore, there are new methods.”
I would say that the “new” methods are not working.
I helped my niece with her College Chemistry and she did not know how to use the Factor/Label method!!!
1. A Communist is to a Socialist as a Vampire is to a:
A. LeechB. LawyerC. Pay Day Loan ManagerD. Tax and Spend Democrat
Answer: All of the above, they are all blood-suckers.
Oh, I am SO sorry that I mis-typed a “0″ instead of a “.” at 5:17 this morning. Did that put you into a lather raptorand repug? It matters not if it is only 3.2 million members, you’ll never disband the NEA. It seems the entire right wing of this blog comes comepletely unglued when educstion is mentioned. Look at the total meltdown Nathan had this morning:
They can’t read.
They can’t write.
They can’t spell.,
They can’t do math.
They couldn’t tell you who is in the current Administration let alone who any of our prominent historical figures are…
However, they can do these things wonderfully:
Our children can put a condom on properly.
They are taught how to have safe sex.
They are taught about Evolution.
They are shown Al Gores propaghanda film: An inconvienent truth in every class.
They learn about equal opportunity, racism, sexism, bigotry, and sexual orientation discrimination.
No worries here.
Posted by: Nathan | May 21, 2007 at 09:08 AM
You rightwingnuts need to get a life.