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Open thread
- By Phillip Brownlee
- Posted April 5, 2007 at 1:06 a.m.
- Filed under Open thread
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You know if it was April 1st I would think this a fools joke, so many illogical thoughts but sadly some may actually think it is a good idea!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/20070404/cm_usatoday/howcanwedeprivealqaedaofaniraqibasearmmoderatesunnis
How can we deprive al-Qaeda of an Iraqi base? Arm moderate SunnisBy Alan J. Kuperman Wed Apr 4, 10:40 AM ETNeither President Bush’s surge of troops, nor the withdrawal deadline Congress is expected to send to him after the Easter recess, has any hope of stabilizing Iraq. So it is time to contemplate a more radical option: Switch our allegiance from that country’s Shiite-controlled government to its moderate Sunni minority, on condition they help us wipe out Sunni extremists in Iraq, including al-Qaeda.?This shift would not immediately stabilize Iraq, but it offers the only near-term path to prevent al-Qaeda from establishing a haven and claiming credit for a U.S. withdrawal. In the longer term, restoring an ethno-sectarian balance of power could lay the groundwork for eventual peace.The president’s ongoing surge of roughly 30,000 combat forces cannot succeed because it provides too few troops to hold areas after we clear them of bad guys, who simply shift operations elsewhere until we move on. But a deadline for withdrawing U.S. troops, as Democrats pushed through both houses of Congress, would backfire by increasing ethnic cleansing, boosting Iranian influence and elevating al-Qaeda prestige. The third option, partition or federalism along ethno-sectarian lines, cannot satisfy Iraq’s Sunnis, who have neither large oil fields nor faith that the Shiites and Kurds would share revenue.Because no option can stabilize Iraq quickly, we should refocus on our greatest achievable objective: preventing al-Qaeda from establishing a haven. This danger arises because Iraq’s moderate Sunnis have allied with their extremist Sunni rivals. Why? They’re trying to fend off domination and ethnic cleansing by the majority Shiites, who control Iraq’s government, army and militias. Indeed, the U.S. strategy of bolstering and training Iraq’s Shiite-controlled army drives Sunni moderates into extremist hands. The only way to defeat al-Qaeda in Iraq is to switch our primary allegiance to Iraq’s moderate Sunnis.The prospect of this dramatic shift in U.S. strategy raises several questions, including most fundamentally: Can we identify the moderates? Fortunately, two ready pools are available. First are the Sunni tribes the United States has attempted to recruit with little success. Until now, our offers have been too feeble, but serious military aid could do the trick.The second source of recruits is Saddam’s secular Sunni-led party, which was antithetical to al-Qaeda. Admittedly, some former Baathists are attacking U.S. forces and coordinating with Sunni extremists because they view our presence as an obstacle to their return to power, but this could change quickly if we offered to support these former enemies.There is a danger, of course, in arming Sunni moderates because the weapons could end up in the hands of extremists. That’s why implementation would be crucial. During the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan in the 1980s, the United States outsourced the arming of mujahedin rebels to Pakistan’s intelligence agency, which favored the most extreme Sunni rebels and thereby gave rise to al-Qaeda. To avoid replicating this error, we should strive for monopoly control over weapons delivery and training of Iraq’s Sunnis, and demand cooperation from Saudi Arabia.The most delicate problem would be managing our existing alliance with Iraq’s Shiite-led government. In an ideal world, even as we armed the Sunni moderates to stamp out al-Qaeda, we could continue working with Iraq’s Shiites to marginalize their militias, enabling the quick stabilization of Iraq under a moderate inter-sectarian government. But that scenario is improbable.More likely, the moderate Sunnis would use our military aid not merely to quash al-Qaeda but to try to reverse recent ethnic cleansing. Shiite and Kurd militias would retaliate in kind. Iraq’s government, dependent on support from militia leaders, including Muqtada al-Sadr, would not dare confront them. So the United States would be compelled to reduce military assistance to the government.The good news is that al-Qaeda would be marginalized, but at least initially, Iraq’s civil war would escalate. U.S. forces, needlessly in harm’s way, would have to be withdrawn. The exception would be a limited number of special operations troops to arm, train and monitor the moderate Sunni forces, and coordinate air strikes on extremists, as they did with Afghanistan’s Northern Alliance in 2001.Peace would become possible only much later, after our aid bolstered the Sunni moderates and produced an ethno-sectarian balance of power, leading to a protracted stalemate that convinced each side victory was impossible. Americans will be dissatisfied by this strategy because it cannot stabilize Iraq quickly. But no option can accomplish that cherished objective, and at least this plan could stamp out al-Qaeda in Iraq while permitting withdrawal of most U.S. ground troops.Unfortunately, in this war, that is the closest we can come to victory.Alan J. Kuperman is assistant professor at the LBJ School of Public Affairs, University of Texas at Austin, and co-editor of Gambling on Humanitarian Intervention
Oh nooo…a church pastor was just on the morning news, upset about the vote in Mulvane to allow a local liquor store.
I would imagine some of these churches would love to be able to arrest anyone who doesn’t attend church. Then, of course, the issue becomes, WHICH church. *sigh*. It is really a shame that the separation of church and state doesn’t go BOTH ways..so that churches could not meddle in governmental affairs like government is prohibited from legislating churches…
Never thought I’d see the day when ‘confessions’ under torture could be used to prosecute someone. Bush has taken us to hell in a hand basket.
MIAMI (Reuters) – Evidence from alleged al Qaeda operative Jose Padilla can be used against him at trial despite defense claims the American’s arrest was based on information obtained through torture, a U.S. judge ruled on Wednesday.
ADVERTISEMENTU.S. District Judge Marcia Cooke refused to reconsider a magistrate’s ruling in September to admit Padilla’s statements to the FBI as evidence in his trial starting on April 16 on charges of conspiring to aid Islamist extremists overseas.
Cooke said the defense failed to raise any new arguments.
The warrant the FBI used to arrest Padilla at Chicago’s O’Hare airport in May 2002 was based in part on information provided by two prisoners held at the U.S. military jail at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba, Abu Zubaydah and Binyam Muhammad, prosecutors acknowledged in November.
The information was the basis for the government’s initial accusation that Padilla planned a “dirty bomb” attack on the United States — an allegation that was quietly dropped when he was finally brought into the normal U.S. court system after 3-1/2 years in a military brig.
Padilla, who has not been charged in connection with any bomb plot, faces life in prison if convicted of helping terrorist groups.
Muhammad is an Ethiopian electrical engineer accused by the United States of receiving explosives training from al Qaeda, which he denies.
Zubaydah is an alleged al Qaeda lieutenant whom the United States describes as Osama bin Laden’s liaison with numerous terrorist cells.
They were captured separately in Pakistan in 2002.
Documents filed with the U.S. war crimes tribunals at Guantanamo said Muhammad and Padilla viewed bomb-making instructions on a computer in Pakistan and met there with Zubaydah to discuss the feasibility of carrying out dirty bomb attacks in the United States.
Zubaydah told interrogators that Muhammad and Padilla were plotting a bomb attack and identified Padilla from a copy of his passport photo, according to court documents in the Padilla case.
Padilla’s lawyers said both men’s statements were obtained through torture and “are equally worthless.” Therefore, they argued, Padilla’s statements to the FBI were the fruit of torture and cannot be used as evidence in court.
Muhammad has claimed in court documents that he gave false confessions implicating Padilla while held in a Moroccan prison, where he was beaten and slashed on the chest and penis with scalpels before being sent to Guantanamo.
Zubaydah was transferred to Guantanamo in September, along with 13 other “high-value” captives who had been held in secret CIA prisons. The New York Times has said his interrogators stripped him naked, held him in an ice-cold room and subjected him to deafeningly loud music.
President George W. Bush has denied Zubaydah and the other prisoners were tortured in CIA custody but said in a September 6 speech that interrogators used “an alternative set of procedures” to get information from them that thwarted attacks against the United States.
Bush initially ordered Padilla, 36, transferred to a military brig and held without charges as an “enemy combatant.”
While a challenge to that order was pending in the Supreme Court last year, Padilla was transferred to civilian custody and charged with providing money and recruits to terrorist organizations that conspired to kidnap, maim and murder people in Afghanistan, Chechnya, Bosnia and elsewhere.
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Average (8 votes)» Recommended StoriesFull Coverage: Guantanamo DetaineesOff the WiresParents of ‘American Taliban’ plead for release after Hicks deal AFP, Wed Apr 4, 4:32 PM ET Hicks may be able to speak to media AP, Wed Apr 4, 1:31 AM ET Feature ArticlesThe Hicks effect at The Economist, Mar 30 New Justice System Is a Work in Progress at The New York Times (reg. req’d), Mar 29 News StoriesLittle redress in US courts for detainees The Christian Science Monitor via Yahoo! News, Apr 03 Justices Won’t Hear Detainee Rights Cases — for Now at The Washington Post (reg. req’d), Apr 03 Opinion & EditorialsOrwell at Guantanamo at The Washington Post (reg. req’d), Apr 03 Rights for Gitmo detainees at The Los Angeles Times (reg. req’d), Apr 02Top StoriesBritish navy crew leaves Iran for London AP Friendly fire may have killed 2 in Iraq AP Bush: Iraq withdrawal would spawn danger AP Bush bypasses Senate to name ambassador AP American Taliban seeks reduced sentence AP Most Viewed: Top StoriesBritons leave for London, ending Iran standoff Reuters Bush acknowledges Americans weary of Iraq war Reuters First joint inter-Korean school set to open in Pyongyang AFP Gates sees Iraq “ethnic cleansing” if U.S. pulls out Reuters Southern Thai mosque bombed, 14 wounded ReutersTop Stories VideoKeys to a Long and Healthy Life ABC News – 2 hours, 55 minutes ago Crash Test: headrests unsafe in many cars AP – 1 hour, 50 minutes ago Students attempt to ‘arrest’ Karl Rove AP – Wed Apr 4, 11:15 PM ET Billionaire magnate Wang dies CNN – Wed Apr 4, 10:08 PM ETReuters Photo: A sketch of Jose Padilla (C) appearing at a courthouse in Miami, January 6, 2006….Slideshow: Terror Suspect Jose PadillaAdd headlines to your personalized My Yahoo! page(About My Yahoo! and RSS)Al-Qaida & Osama bin Laden» More News FeedsNEWS ALERTSGet an alert when there are new stories about:
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Kevin Sites in the Hot ZoneReaching outAn Afghan child bride gets help from Hot Zone readers.
steve,
Freedom’s on the march, don’t you know. If someone has to give coerced testimony now and then, hey, you know, at least people who are innocent won’t have anything to worry about.
writerdog,
Huh. The writer of that link, even if he IS a professor at UT, sounds like somebody who’s really good at playing “Risk” and has decided to take it to the next level.
The idea that we can just ’shift’ our allegiance from an elected government to a minority is laughable. I mean, just laughable. Al Sistani runs the country, and this guy thinks the Shia are going to roll over while we arm and enfranchise the Sunni minority who are currently the leading edge of violent insurgency?
Of course, such a line of “thinking” does conveniently fall into line with the new “Great Game” being staged by Bush and Cheney to divide the Islamic world along Sunni/Shia lines. But it is just as fantastical as the Bush/Cheney vision, and also is likely to come to nothing.
Enough. Any academic who proposes something so incredibly dumb in a non peer-reviewed forum ought to be made to answer for it in his or her tenure process.
“Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi was seen roaming the streets of Damascus flaunting a Hijab. The Hijab worn by women across the Muslim world has come to symbolize either one of three things: 1) a symbol that men control women by forcing piety, or 2) a return to religiosity because of oppressive rulers, or 3) a fashion statement. If you ask any expert on the Middle East, you would get any one of three answers. The ones who usually claim it is a fashion statement are the political rulers who usually oppress people in general. A Hijab is NOT a confirmation of the rights of women in the Middle East but rather a symbol of their suppression.
As a Muslim, I fully understand respect of our religion by visiting US officials and I applaud that respect. Had Speaker Pelosi worn the Hijab inside a Mosque, this would have indicated respect but for Pelosi to wear it on the streets of Damascus all the while she is sitting with the self-imposed Baschar al-Assad who has come to symbolize oppression and one of the reasons why women are forced to wear the Hijab as they turn to religion to express their freedom is a statement of submittal not only to oppression but also to lack of women’s rights in the Middle East. Pelosi just reversed the work of the Syrian civil society and those who aspire for women’s freedom in the Muslim countries many years back with her visual statement. Her lack of experience of the Middle East is showing.
Assad could not have been happier because Syrian women, seeing a US official confirming what their husbands, the Imams in the Mosques tell them, and the society at large imposes on them through peer pressure will see in her wearing a Hijab as a confirmation of the societal pressures they are constantly under. No one will ever know how many women took the Hijab on after seeing Pelosi wearing it. The damage Speaker Pelosi is causing with her visit to Syria will be felt for many years to come.”
http://www.reformsyria.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=282&Itemid=66
Heckler,
Right on cue with the downloaded spin from LGF. Ever write your own stuff, Heckler?
Just one problem: in the pictures of Pelosi touring the market, the Haijab isn’t on her head. It’s around her neck.
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.saukvalley.com/content/articles/2007/04/04/news/national/312560369952072.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.saukvalley.com/articles/2007/04/04/news/national/312560369952072.txt&h=343&w=450&sz=44&hl=en&start=14&um=1&tbnid=wbMCxHGtA8qwAM:&tbnh=97&tbnw=127&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dpelosi%2Bdamascus%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN
Or this one?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/04/world/middleeast/04pelosi.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
Now, if we go to a shot of Pelosi IN THE MOSQUE, the Hijab is on her head:
http://africa.reuters.com/world/news/usnL04321424.html
But that’s appropriate. As Condi will tell you (scroll down)
http://mahablog.com/
LGF’ers realized that wearing a Haijab in a mosque wasn’t going to work as an attack strategy. So, presto! Pelosi wore one in a market, and ‘reform Syria’ cooks up phony outrage.
Except one thing: it’s a lie. The pictures show it wasn’t on her head. And he’s clearly wearing a different outfit for the market visit than for the mosque visit.
So, Heckler, unless you want me to say that you post lies and are a liar by extension, you may want to reply.
Since it appears to be cut and paste day, I’ll contribute this. The title? How Global Warming Became a Left Wing Plot. I’m sure you will recognize the usual characters here.
Jon Carroll
One of the stranger things to happen in recent political discourse — and this is a crowded field — is the morphing of global warming into a left-wing plot, a conspiracy by godless scientists to … well, it’s not clear what benefit the scientists get from spreading lies about global warming. Maybe they just want research money to study this nonexistent warming thing.
I have a pretty good idea where that meme started. If you believe that global warming is man-made, then you believe that greenhouse gases are a bad thing.
If you believe they’re a bad thing, you believe they should be reduced. And reducing greenhouse gases would mean using less petroleum, in all its myriad forms.
And since the current administration is dedicated to the protection of petroleum companies, it is only natural that it would try to convince its base that somehow global warming is being promoted by the same people who approve of gay marriage, abortion and secular schools.
The idea that global warming is a liberal plot is a lunatic notion, but it’s surprising how closely it maps with public opinion. It’s an extremely successful con job, and it’s bought the oil companies at least a decade of profits and indolence.
It’s not clear why evangelical Christians — or that portion of them that are die-hard supporters of George Bush — should be so interested in the financial well-being of oil companies. It’s not as if they’re getting anything out of it.
So the president, who is nothing if not consistent, is trying to stick it to environmentalists again. Last year, he nominated three people for top-level jobs at posts that affect the environment. All three nominations were blocked, and thank you, Barbara Boxer.
But now the president is thinking of making recess appointments of the same three people. He thinks it’s a game of chicken. He thinks he has to win.
Is politics the art of compromise? Not anymore. Politics is the art of slandering your enemies and rewarding your campaign contributors.
more:
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/04/04...
Crowson, you NAILED it again with your cartoon here!!! Great job. But it could have used one little addition. It isnt just air pollution kansas will get. We will get a more dramatic and rapid draining of Kansas water.
But maybe you have a special cartoon in the making for that point? That other state get the electricity AND the use of our water. I tell ya, that Colorado is pretty clever about using Kansas water.
Looks like there was a dust up with the Kansas Water folks at their latest meeting. Damn good thing the Salina Journal reports on water issues. Because you know you would NEVER read this in the Hays Daily or even the WE.
Aquifer talk floods water officials
Surface water was expected to be focus of Water Authority meeting
HUTCHINSON — Decades of dithering over the unrelenting overuse of western Kansas’ groundwater reminded Fred Cholick of a truck hurtling toward a brick wall. “We are arguing about how fast we are going,” said Cholick, dean of the College of Agriculture at Kansas State University and an ex-officio member of the Kansas Water Authority. “Why not stop the truck?”
Heheheh. Indeed. Why not?
Darn it, I was waiting for that post about Pelosi in a hijab just for the photo of Condi in one too. You beat me to it!
But I disagree with you on the assessment of coercing testimony…it has been proven time and again that people will confess to whatever when coersion and torture are used.
And I have to wonder if that is the case in that one guy who just confessed to everything under the sun. You know the one this past month, I swear he would have said he was BTK too.
Of course, I find it completely ironic that Kansas is pissing away the last of it’s clean water…
…. all the while legal citizens are fleeing the big cities and moving to more rural areas. Not rural like WaKeeney, but rural like Wichita, in their minds anyway.
The winners in this emmigration from the cities? The more rural areas that are prepared. And the reason they are leaving the cities? Mostly quality of life and housing issues. And clean water and water based recreation are among the amenities these new refugees from the big cities want.
So? Give all the water to Steve Miller, give all the electricity to Colorado and other states, and leave the pollution and lack of water in Kansas.
Yep. That sure is the way to prepare to draw and receive new residents. hehehehehheheehhe
Who the hell is in CHARGE of this state?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17954186/
Who the hell is in CHARGE of this state?
Posted by: ksfarmgrrl | April 05, 2007 at 09:30 AM
Do I see a run for Governor in Farmgrrl’s future? Open seat in 2010…
Ok, the last of the cut and paste. I dont have very strong feelings about your arena controversy. I see it as a local issue for you all to decide.
But I did note with interest this article about how the public does and does not benefit from stadiums.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389×546292
Oh hell no Tom :) You see how I am attacked here. Imagine if I actually ran for office…
No. I am way better as the Secretary of Snark, but I miss the true champ of snark, Mr. Tracy :)
LOL @ “Secretary of Snark”
Hee hee hee Tom. If I WERE appointed to any water office?
I’d be dead by midnight, and probably not from drowning.
As flike said, I’m sure there is a nose bandage in my future.
Where are the pit bull lovers? Why aren’t they in an outrage against proposed Wichita regulations?
The usual, it isn’t the dog, it is the way they are trained BS seems to be missing.
This isn’t a cheap plug–I’m just too damn lazy to write it again :)http://www.kctu.com/weblog/blogs/index.php/news/2007/04/05/people_get_fired_for_telling_the_truthInteresting remarks by Michael Brown at KU last night.
Mr C? I cant seem to get into your blog over there. Is it operator error? Have I been preemptively banned before posting? :)
Link to article linked in kfg’s post, for those who don’t want to go to the du website.
http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D8O60R0O0.htm
awwwwwww Vaughn :( yer spoiling my fun :(
I LOVE to hear ‘em whine about going to DU….
:)
Wow Mr. C!!!! You all should read that link.
Sounds like brownie got religion just a litte too late. But it sure is refreshing for someone to talk about the culture of the lie. And the bigger the lie, the easier it is to sell.
Hell, you see it right here every day. Deny ’till you die. Wash, rinse, repeat!
kfg, try this link to MrC’s blog; I think it works!
http://www.kctu.com/weblog/blogs/index.php/news/20...
“If at first you don’t succeed, …”
I think this one does it, kfg.
http://www.kctu.com/weblog/blogs/index.php/news/2007/04/05/people_get_fired_for_telling_the_truth
It was a mistake to put FEMA under Homeland Security imo.
The problem with the Katrina incident is that mistakes were made at all levels from low to high. The national news just amplified those mistakes and the top government echelons are always easy targets to blame for mistakes. That’s life…
Thanks Vaughn.
You know, I worked for a great guy at AT&T who said “all evil begins with a lie”.
One person’s lie is another person’s mistake. And before you get out the hatchet and the hair to split, all lies are mistakes, but not all mistakes are lies.
So? You still want to say katrina was just another in a long line of mistakes by this administration?
Or do you just want to admit that their lack of preparation for and their horrific response to katrina was both a lie and a mistake?
Bravo for brownie for being willing to admit he lied. And to exposing the culture of lies.
That was NO mistake!
Mr. Brown alluded to repeating talking points from the Administration. Any one who has worked in the government knows that talking points is a guide not a finalized speech delivery method.
For instance, if I was to give a talk about President Bush arriving here in Wichita, I would get a talking points memo from the Secret Service which would provide some guidance such as:
Do Don’tThe President President Bush
In other words, the correct way to refer to the President.
or more specifically concerning Katrina:
We have ( ) the needs in New Orleans
DoPeople on the ground evaluating
Don’tevaluated
Using the don’t part of the talking points shows that everything is settled when it is actually not.
A person in the Director position such as Michael Brown should have known that certain phrases actually have literal meaning and should not be said. He could have adapted his speech in a way that he saw fit to show the truthfulness of what was occurring.
The fact that he did not communicate accuracy, shows his failure to communicate effectively, which is after all, was a part of his job as Director.
Nice spin republican but I think you could have used a few more words to say:
It’s brownie’s fault for not knowing the bush talking points were lies. He should have know not to say what they told him to say.
Uh, I think that is what brownie NOW says. He should have known better.
WTF? Republican, yer slippin’ today….
heheheheh. Sorry, still laughing about that one.
Indeed, it is the Director’s job to know when the preznit is lying and when he is not. It isnt the bush administration’s fault that brownie believed their lies. Wow.
But I gotta say republican, that is the most artful defense of lying I have ever read!
ksfarmgrrl,
It is why they call them Director and not sock puppets. They have the ability to do things within their purview such as giving accurate speeches.
I think it is great that Mrs. Pelosi visited Syria. According to the Constitution, Congress has the most power of the three federal branches. It’s listed in Article I of the Constitution. This is the longest of the three Articles. Congress writes our laws. The President can veto laws, but Congress can override with a 2/3 majority. International treaties require Senate approval. Congress can impeach and remove from office members of the two other branches. The President can only remove Executive Branch political appointees. The courts cannot remove anyone from any branch of government.
It is important for Congress to communicate with other nations’ leaders, and send a message, “We in Congress have the power to make deals with you.”
If Dick Cheney and Karl Rove hadn’t been so fixated on restoring the powers of the “Imperial Presidency” that Nixon lost, had they respected the fact that *most* American voters picked *the other guy* in 2000, which should have suggested, to wise people, that bipartisan collaboration was in order, then our nation would have become much better off than it is now.
Republican, man, I am even feeling sorry for you here.
You STILL just said, in effect, that the bush talking points were lies.
That brownie should have known better than to say what the bush administration TOLD him to say.
And hey, it isnt a problem if the bush marching orders were “inaccurate” heheheh. (Is that yet another name for lies?)
It is just a problem that brownie didnt KNOW they were uh, “inaccurate”.
heheheheheehe
No ksfarmgrrl I never implied the talking points were lies.
Another example:
Pentagon passes on information that tanks will be used in a deployment exercise. The Public Relations Officer finds out that the tanks aren’t really tanks but tracked vehicles like the M113 Armored Personnel Carrier.
He/She makes the changes to the PR statement and gives the PR statement with more accuracy than the original talking points.
As I said, Talking Points are guides not a bible of knowledge. Any good leader knows and realizes this. I let you figure out your own conclusion on Mr. Brown and his leadership abilities concerning the Katrina affairs.
It’s snowing. Dang, sure could use a dose of global warming about now.
Yeah, I want Cosmos to collect some of that Global Warming snow in his CO2 collection devices. :D
Well well well. A very interesting development regarding the Holcomb power plant. Maybe that is where little miss hissy fit is today?
http://online.hdnews.net/content/news/coalplants040507.shtml
Thank God for coal.
OMG this freeway sign is TOO funny.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389×584208
Republican,
“The Europeans… actually produced several hundred million more tons of CO2 than they did last year.”
“several hundred million”? The rise was actually around 30 million tons, about 1 to 1.5%.
And emissions will drop in the future, when the “cap” trade system is adjusted, new technology is installed, etc.
But heh, what can you expect from Republican, who believes DIFFERENT regions should have the SAME climate.
And ignores his own ‘copy/paste’, which said “drastic retreats in Larsen-A began to be observed” TWO DECADES before the 1995 storm.
Republican is an excellent example of an incompetent AGW denier.
Rut roh, looks like germie may get to have her republicans police their own again. hehehehh
Yet another emerging scandal from bushco.
Federal investigation targets Doan.
“The Office of Special Counsel confirmed to ABC News it has launched an investigation into General Services Administration chief Lurita Doan, probing concerns she may have violated a ban against conducting partisan political activity at government expense by participating in a meeting featuring a presentation by a White House political aide on GOP election strategy.”
http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2007/04/probe_targe...
Reporting on Thursday @ 4 PM: The Wranglers baseball staff still say at this point they plan to open their baseball season at 6 PM this evening at Lawrence-Dumont … against Corpus Christie I think.
Reminds me of a Wranglers double header in April, two or three years ago, when it was snowing so hard at the end of the first game, the players actually refused to try to play the second game … couldn’t see the ball.
So, we will see what happens this evening!
I think I bought too many carbon credits….and now it’s snowing! Damnit! Goracle! I want my money back!
gee that is so funny and original EVERY time I hear….”it’s cold today, what about that global warming?”
On this date in history, in 1862, Gen. McClellan begins the seige of Yorktown, VA, during the Peninsular campaign. It was all a huge failure. The war wasn’t going like anybody hoped.Sound familiar? Then, like now, Democrats called for a “peace” with the South. “Let them be their own country”, said the Dems. “Let’s pull out”, said the Dems.
wow that is so profound! let me try… on this date in 1756 Marie Antoinette said “let them eat cake” and the republicans all applauded.
“the republicans all applauded.”
Silly rabbit, republicans weren’t invented yet. Try again.I do notice that my point stands. Another plaque for me?
“Marie Antoinette never said “Let them eat cake.” We have that on the authority of biographer Lady Antonia Fraser, who spoke on the subject at the 2002 Edinburgh Book Fair.”
The answer is YES. Another plaque for me!
ok, you win!!!later
Well, that wasn’t very fun!
I knew that bait would get Cosmos out researching in hyperlink mode.
(sneaky grin)
“Republican is an excellent example of an incompetent AGW denier.”
Global Warming, The New Facist.fap fap fapLet’s all pray to the Goretholic Church.
fleettwood, Republican,on the global warming topic do we want to start from an “in our life-time” place or an “in the grand scheme of things” place? I think in the grand scheme we all don’t make a loud fart in the universe.
That’s true kg, probably not even a polite burp. Even compared to our sun, the earth is very tiny.
funny bleeding-heart liberal thing, though… I do worry some about if we could have some small success or effect in making the “in our life-time” quality of our (and our children’s) lives.. I’d feel really bad that we didn’t try to do something. I remember there were nay-sayers when they talked about trying to fix acid rain. Also chloro-floro-boro carbons…I think that ozone hole is shrinking.
I don’t know about you all, but I’ve been duped by the weatherman.
Told trace to 3 inches, and I’ve got like 6 flipping inches of snow out there when I woke up.
Not that much here Political Mom. Perhaps you are more in the Snowbelt than Wichita. :)
kg,
“on the global warming topic do we want to start from an “in our life-time” place or an “in the grand scheme of things” place?”
Whose “life-time”?
A 70 year-old, whose life WILL be impacted if Earth’s climate goes past the “tipping point” soon, say in a decade?
A baby born today, whose life will very certainly be different, because human-added GHG’s warmed Earth?
Or the 5th, 10th, 20th, etc, generation of a baby born today?
Any inhabitable planets nearby? And a way to transport Earth’s population there?
“Because we don’t think about future generations, they will NEVER forget us.” Henrik Tikkanen.
Republican,
“I knew that bait would get Cosmos out researching in hyperlink mode.”
Thank you for proving that you have zero credibility, and that you post BS.
Republican seems to believe that our only Earth’s climate is just a blog game.
fleettwood,
Keep on faping… it’s probably the only productive thing you do.
For the record, the hardest working man in adult rock and roll is Van Morrison.
Check out his song “The Beauty of Days Gone By” on his “Down the Road” Album.
It makes one’s heart leap up, like Wordsworth’s rainbow . . .
Hey Cosmos, why are you lying to the people. I said tons and you mentioned metric tonnes. Don’t you know there is a difference? :)
Republican is the past master of the meaningless quibble.
Wow, the man KNOWS THE METRIC SYSTEM!
We’re all so impressed.
Now go back to your Playstation and quit bothering the adults . . .
Republican,
Please explain to everyone who will read this thread, how your “several hundred million more tons” was more accurate than my “AROUND 30 million tons”.
And then, please offer your scientific theory on WHY the Larsen-A ice shelf began “drastic retreats” in 1975.
Was the ice PRESCIENT? Did the ice “know” that a storm would hit TWO DECADES later, so it decided to “retreat” instead?
Heh… write a scientific(sic) paper about it.
Nice try Cosmos.
Go back to your “melting water theory directly caused by Global Warming as the sole source cause for the Larson B break up.” You know, the one the GORACLE wrote in his book.
Ruh-roh.
Looks like the Republicans are losing their battles to keep the 2004 ballots in Ohio under wraps. Considering how hard they’ve been working to stop any inspection or recount, this can’t be good news for them.
Check it out:
Judge Brunner has requested the resignations of the entire scandal-plagued Cuyahoga County Board of Elections, which Bennett has chaired. Two Democratic members and one Republican have complied with her request. The BOE’s executive director, Michael Vu, previously resigned amidst a cloud of scandal resulting from a mishandled primary election and more than $12 million in budgetary overruns. Two BOE workers have been given 18-month prison sentences for felony convictions stemming from what a government prosecutor called the “rigging” of an officially mandated recount for the 2004 presidential election.
Bennett has issued a legal challenge against his removal. But on Wednesday, April 4, Franklin County Common Pleas Judge John Connor ruled Bennett has to comply with Brunner’s call for a public hearing on the matter. The hearing is scheduled for Monday, April 9.
A long-time GOP power broker, Bennett is a close personal confidante of White House advisor Karl Rove. He has been Rove’s point man in Ohio’s most populous county, which includes the Democratic voter rich city of Cleveland. A wide array of irregularities there were pivotal in giving Bush his narrow margin of official victory in 2004.
Bennett asked the court to rule that the Ohio statute seeking his removal was unconstitutionally vague. But Judge Connor ruled that the law was “clear and unequivocal.”
http://www.freepress.org/departments/display/19/2007/2525
“Two election workers in jail for rigging elections” . . . hmmmm, good thing there’s no conspiracy or anything like that going on. We might have to question the partisan ideologues controlling the election counts otherwise.
Oh crap, more evidence that the Rethuglicans hate the democratic process. Thankfully the RHINO governor of Florida is making amends to the 2000 theft. He is bringing back paper ballots, he is restoring voting rights to felons, just so the Bush regime can’t steal another election.
If Gore was elected then no 9/11, no illegal war in Iraq, no 3100 dead American soldiers, no dead 650,000 Iraqis, no trillion dollars wasted. Also, Gore would do something about climate change so Alaska doesn’t sink into the melting permafrost.
C-SPAN showed a Senate committee hearing with Al Gore testifying. Oklahoma senator Jim Inhofe tried to use a cheap-lawyer trick of insisting that Gore answer only “yes” or “no” to his questions, but committee chair Barbara Boxer overruled the oilpatch mouthpiece, and let Gore give explanatory responses. The other Republican members were respectful of a former member of their body, and a former vice-president. They gave Gore his due, and he gave them their due. Inhofe basically embarrassed Oklahoma.
Inhofe embarasses anyone with an IQ over 5.
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