If I were a betting man, I’d have wagered that a gambling bill wouldn’t pass this year. Yet, against long odds and after more than a decade of trying, the House and Senate have now approved casino gaming in Kansas. Gov. Kathleen Sebelius plans to sign it.
The measure still requires voter approval in the host counties. But given that Sumner County has already approved it and will get a casino if Sedgwick County voters don’t approve it, Sedgwick County voters have almost no choice but to approve it — a casino is going to be built, so it ought to be here, where we can share the revenue and get the jobs. The real battle will be whether the new casino will be located in Wichita, Park City or elsewhere within the county.
There will also be lawsuits to try to block the bill; opponents argue that the state constitution requires the state to actually operate the casino, and not to contract that out to private companies. But that seems unlikely to succeed.
So, ready or not and like it or not, casino gaming is coming.
Posted by Phillip Brownlee
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39 Comments
I posted this earlier, but it is every bit as relevent here. After reading all the arguments, I haven’t changed my mind. A few changes, but essentially the same:______________________
The arguments have been made; I’ll not rehash them. Suffice it to say that when the Indian casinos went in, the effected counties were quickly scouring KU law school for prosecutors, as their petty theft, DUI, and domestic violence cases exploded. The same will happen again.
It appears that the ‘No’ folks win logically, but logic rarely prevails, especially here (if logic prevailed, no one would gamble – it’s a rigged game, after all). Gambling promises fast easy cash, both to governments and to gamblers. The lure of fast, easy cash is tempting, but as is generally the case, the promise is a bait and switch. The only fast and easy cash is to the developers. As PT Barnum put it, there’s a sucker born every minute – and two to take his money.
So (if permitted) I’ll be voting no. If a majority of Kansans, however, want to partipate in a voluntary tax on the stupid, I guess that’s their right. Just don’t expect me to welcome casino gambling, with all its costs, with open arms.
Harrah’s and/or Bally’s (or other developers) will bankroll the vote, and the money will talk. Why do you think they would do that? That fact says it all – wanna know who benefits? follow the money (and BTW – those profit dollars will go out of state).
So “destination” gambling (whatever that means) will probably come. Just let’s not pretend that there is not a heavy price to be paid.
Perhaps we should pass on the additional social costs to Harrah’s too?
_____________________
Put me down as still a “no.”
BTW – why are only the voters in certain counties apparantly going to be permitted to vote? (I’ll answer my own question: so that the vote is pre-ordained to pass. Another way the vote is rigged, along with the developer’s dollars pushing passage). Don’t all Kansans have an interest in this issue? The “benefits” may accrue to the counties which have the casinos (actually, the benefits go almost solely to the rich developers); the costs will spread state wide.
The only argument I’ve heard that makes any sense is that Kansans are going out of state to gamble anyway; however, this argument, stripped to its fundamentals, amounts to “We have to fleece our own citizens, because our neighboring states will fleece them if we don’t.”
Makes ya proud, don’t it?
GM I couldn’t agree with you more. The money will only line the pockets of the casino owners. For a community to proper or benefit, more new dollars have to come into a community than go out in the form of casino profits. This has been shown to not be the case.
GMC, your points presented above are valid. I’ll abide by the majority, but will do so in full realization that the elections, as are the games, are in favor of the “house”.
Ten years ago, I’d likely have voted “yes”, as at that point, there seemed to be some economic viability to the thought of a destination casino, even with the additional societal costs. That horse has left the barn, however.
I agree with GMC’s thought that the only argument that makes any sense is the one about Kansans leaving the state to gamble anyway. While I might dissent a bit from his “stripped down” version, the fact remains that the only economically viable reason to support the casinos at this point is to generate at least some revenue with which to address the societal costs already, I believe, being experienced by Kansas resulting from those either leaving the state to gamble or who, while technically still within the borders of the state, are “leaving the state” to gamble at the casinos on reservations.
Here’s an argument. Who gets to decide how I spend my money? The government? some moral crusader? I believe the best person to decide how I spend my money is me.
Well it’s about time!. Piles of money have gone to Missouri and Oklahoma, helping those owners of those casinos AND does it not help funding for Oklahoma schools? While casinos(another one has gone into business west of Bartlesville,OK are doing just fine down there, the Kansas Legislature continued to drag its feet,letting money flow out of the state. If a person wants to go a casinos or whatever, that is none our businees. Gaming, in all its forms will bring money and tourists to our states. I don’t care who runs them be it the state or Native American tribe or a private business this will help our economy and a good thing all around.
Life is a gamble. The question is, who do you want setting the odds? Which is to say, setting the odds to favor themselves, against the little people?
Never seen so many people so eager to throw their money away.
I suspect the Indian tribes are all pissed off. I wonder if they will try to stall the state from issuing casino licences in court.
And! Somebody needs to make a note, for all those legislators who voted against it, how many of them received contributions from Indian tribes that operate casinos.
But that being said. I don’t mind any casinos. I’ll never go to them, but I don’t care if people spend their money at one.
DingusAs I have said before, I am conflicted by this issue.I think I am mature enough and have the self control to avoid the pitfalls of gambleing while still being able to enjoy it, occassionally.I am a huge hypocrite on this one, since, at the same time, I worry about those who do blow their kids lunch money at the slots.Your question has merit: “Why cant you decide how to spend YOUR money?”Well now, if it is Payday Loans, Title Loans, Investments, Insurance Products, or credit card offers, the goverment agencies dont think you are smart enough to handle the above services without the governments help.None of the above services are anywhere near as unfair to their customers as a casino!In fact, a casino will create the need for more loan sharks.Insurance agents and Stock Brokers will continue to pay judgements for bad advice that didnt work out, while a casino can take every dime of a senile widows money and that woman will have no recourse.I am a hypocrite on this one, but an honest hypocrite.
Kind of makes you wonder about all these Cash/Loan places popping up around Wichita.
I’m no big gambler but I’ve been to a couple of casinos and I had a lot of fun. The last time I went was when I took my 86 year old aunt to gamble in Shreveport. I had a ball watching her plug nickels into the slots. I won enough to pay for a nice dinner and our hotel rooms. Auntie took home $240 in winnings. All in all, a pleasant weekend.IMHO, the majority of Kansans want gambling. While I won’t spend much time in a casino, I don’t think having another entertainment choice is a bad thing for Wichita. Yes, there’s a social cost, but lots of things have a social cost. If that’s what we’re REALLY concerned about, why don’t we discuss outlawing booze?
When the lottery was initially discussed, naysayeers said if the lottery is allowed, casinos wouldn’t be far behind. The response was “We’re not talking about casinos, just the lottery. And we need more money for schools. This way, we won’t have to raise taxes.” Those darn naysayers…what do they know anyway.
Infernal, Dingus;
While I do think there’s a moral dimension here (gov’t should not be in the business of fleecing its own citizens), I don’t think that’s really relevent here. The fact of the matter is, I think casino gambling is simply a bad investment. The social costs far outweigh any (doubtful) benefits. Casinos are sold as job creators, but some basic economics will tell you that on balance that is not true; the dollars pumped into gambling don’t just materialize out of thin air, they come from somewhere, and every dollar spend in a casino chasing the illusory dream of easy money is a dollar not spent on other (and I’d argue more productive) goods and services. And where do those dollars go? To casino developers – out of state.
The fact of the matter is, however, that gov’ts have been chasing that money for years. Don’t hold your breath waiting for gaming revenues to lower your taxes, however. Remember how the lottery was sold – to pay for education? How’d that work out?
Gaming may well be with us, true enough. But I don’t think that’s a good thing. It is your right to throw away your dollars if you like, however. If we’re gonna have a vote, though, I’d rather see it an honest vote, state wide, rather than rigging the vote by pouring developer money into bribing those counties who hope to reap the immediate direct benefits while the enormous costs are diffused throughout the state.
And Dave, please don’t delude yourself that casinos will bring tourists to Kansas. Tourists may indeed come to Kansas, but very few will come to Kansas to gamble; if they are traveling for gambling, they will go to the usual gambling destinations, i.e Las Vegas, etc. No, the best we can hope for is to keep Kansans from leaving to gamble. As noted above, what this is really about is fleecing our own citizens before our neighboring states do.
Yeah Dan I am still waiting for lower taxes, more money for schools and here Oklahoma is saying the lottery isn’t living up to expectations.
When will we ever learn?
“(gov’t should not be in the business of fleecing its own citizens),…”
Come April 15th, we’ll be fleeced again. Everytime we go to the gas pump or the grocery store or pay the phone bill the fleecing continues. At least when I walk into a casino, I know I’ll be fleeced by choice.
fleet!!
True enough. But as much as I bitch about taxes (don’t we all!), taxes are what we pay for a civilized society.
I just wish we didn’t pour so much of that money down the bureaucracy rathole.
Parties interested in building casino
Expect no shortage of suitors to line up for a chance to build a destination resort casino in Sedgwick County.
If local voters approve an expanded gaming referendum, former Wichita Mayor Bob Knight’s group and a Canadian group headed by Brian Hamm are ready to build — Knight in Park City, Hamm downtown through a Century II retrofit.
Wichita Greyhound Park owner Phil Ruffin — precluded by the bill from developing a casino — said he’ll add slot machines to the dog track, along with a Gilley’s-style entertainment club.
Also, expect competition from Sumner County if Sedgwick County voters turn down the referendum, or if the Sedgwick County Commission refuses to take the referendum to the voters.
—-
What’s the difference between liquor stores, pawn shops, pay day loans.
Places where money is spent, lives can be ruined.
Casino is an attraction, city property can be sold downtown is where I see the benefit.
City shouldn’t own The Hyatt. I don’t know about a casino in the Century II building.
Money from selling those buildings and the Library, will give the city funds to build a new library, and larger convention center.
Hyatt or Broadview Hotels could be affected.
Bob Knight has a problem on the federal level getting out of state Indians involved.
If the vote happens for a Sedgwick County arena, likely place is downtown.
What other counties do for a Casino, I don’t know.
Ruffin doesn’t want any part of a “state” owned casino.
When that’s changed in Topeka, for private ownership, he’ll think about owning one here some day.
Not today.
Slots at Greyhound Park won’t entice me to go out there.
To Mr. James Watt aka GMC for someone who puts him self on a pedestal lecturing others on such topics as not insulting others Nics, civility and so you sure are being a pompous asshole. Im supposed to take Moral lessons from a sleazy government Lawyer? I might as well take sex ed lessons from a pimp. The other day you were crying about how it was a first amendment violation for their to be limits on campaign contributions now your crying about gambling interest being able to buy an election. Hows your boycott against businesses that don’t allow guns going, not far considering you work a place that doesn’t allow gun either. I also don’t think its the best use of taxpayer money for you to be blogging on their dime. So as far I am considered you can take your hypocritial pompous and screw yourself.
There’s a real problem when a state government makes gambling a crime in your own home, then wants to open state controlled gambling casinos. But hypocritical political decisions are a thing, unfortunately, too often made. Talk about the all too true maxim of it being about the all-mighty buck.
Dingus,
It’s a Blog, people put their opinions on here.
You however have taken it to a whole new level by putting someone’s name on here.
Personally, I hope GMC tears you a new asshole legally.
He probably won’t because he’s a mature fellow.
Do we have issues, Dingus?
Is that the best you can do? A personal attack (and a pretty lame one)? You’ve made not a single coherent response to a substantive point; and at no point did I get personal. Where do you get off doing so? Personal issues are just that: personal issues. That’s not the subject here. And you even got the name wrong.
You want to meet me personally, that’s fine. I’d ask we do so in a public place; I don’t know that I can trust you in a private one. And now that you – sorta – got my name, do you have the guts to e-mail me yours? I won’t even ask you to put it out publicly, nor will I reveal same (though I will reveal whether you did so or not). I, you see, have the class you lack.
I’m guessing the answer is no.
So you’ll hide behind “Dingus.” How appropriate a nic that is, it turns out.
Dingus,If someone wants to out themselves, that’s their business. Your throwing names out there could get people in trouble. If GMC’s posts bother you so much, I suggest you find another blog. Any credability you had, which wasn’t much anyway,at this blog just got flushed down the toilet. See ya, moron.
By the way: What’s your real name. Tit for tat, bozo.
JMW – interesting point. A friendly wager with a buddy on a B-ball game or friendly Friday night poker game is illegal. CRAZY!
GMC, Republican, JM – DITTO TO ALL THREE OF YA’LL!
There must be some measurements of success when it comes to casinos; after all, it is spreading like wild fire from state to state, county to county and it has been doing so for well over a century.High crime, destruction of family values?There is more then one cause to it all.
Personally I could give a shit what people think about me. and what does infernal mean? Its not like you haven’t made fun of my nic before. which is odd considering you want to be some sort of blog monitor now. If you don’t want everyone to know who you are then don’t tell everyone your a Lawyer for the county and use your work email to blog with. And you want to meet in public? to do what have coffee, dinner, kick my ass?
Did some idiot just post something?
Wise;
I don’t lay all the blame of society’s ills on casinos, of course. There’s far more complex factors than that at play (THERE’S a blog thread for ya!).
But is it ‘A’ factor? Sure.
Why is it spreading? Follow the money.Who benefits? Developers.Who usually has state and local gov’ts in their pockets? Developers (see arena here in Wichita).Add in the “fun” factor for some, though it’s not my cup of tea (I got plenty of other vices), toss in the appearance of economic growth, at least in the short term, throw the gov’t some crumbs in the form of revenue that taxpayers don’t complain about (a “voluntary tax on the stupid,” after all), and any wonder it’s so hard to say no?
Ben,Not crazy, but typical politics in the state where suicide is redundant, and politics (and politicians) as usual and paid for.
Dingus:
You are upset because I used the term “infernal” and you apparantly thought I was using the term as an adjective referng to you? Is that it?
“Infernal B” was another poster!!!! Just a few posts up from the one you’re apparantly upset about. Notice the comma???
Who I am is hardly a big secret, nor do I work very hard to try to keep it same. This is not the first time I’ve been “outed.” I’m a big boy, I can take it, and I don’t think I’ve said anything (well, maybe, not TOO much) that I’ll have to disown later.
But we all use our nics here, for various reasons, our chosen on-line personnas. We’re entitled to that. And yes, I made fun of your name. Want that tiny apology? OK. Seems to me to be small potatoes compared to the pile you dumped – mostly, as JM notes, on yourself.
So – Is that what this is about? If so, I’ll be expecting that public apology directly.
Sorry Dingus, there really is an “Infernal B”. What does it mean? It’s a riddle no one’s solved yet.GMC 70 is a reasonable and thoughtful poster. You shouldn’t have tried to out him. That’s taking this blog way too personal.
It is time for Wichita to cash in! I don’t think Wichita should build “a” casino but they should build a dozen or more casinos and hotels- perhaps a kind of “Las Vegas Blvd” down south Broadway from Kellogg to 31st street south. Think BIG! Huge hotels, huge gambling halls and great big tacky looking signs up and down Broadway!
They will have to either expand or build a new airport for all the millions of tourist that will be flying in to gamble and enjoy Wichita!
The only fun I ever had in a casino was drinking cheap drinks and watching other fools lose their money! Oh, and watching the foxy waitresses and cigarette ladies that work the floor!
I got this in my email directly from the governors office -
For immediate release Nicole Corcoran , Press Secretary
March 29, 2007Sebelius praises responsible expansion of gaming
Governor says she intends to sign bill passed by Legislature early this morning
A bill allowing a responsible expansion of gaming will keep dollars in the state, attract out-of-state visitors and provide revenue for critical state projects, Governor Kathleen Sebelius said today.
Early this morning the Legislature passed a bill allowing for up to four destination casinos, as well as slot machines at the three existing race tracks in the state. Sebelius said she intends to sign the bill when it reaches her desk.
“The people of Kansas will finally have a chance to decide for themselves whether to allow expanded gaming,” Sebelius said, referring to the requirement that local voters approve an expansion of gaming in their communities.
“Kansans long ago expressed their support for gaming, first in a 1986 statewide constitutional amendment, then through local votes for expanded gaming and through patronage of out-of-state and tribal casinos. This is a continuation of that process and will give local residents the final say,” she continued.
It’s estimated the state will receive roughly $200 million a year in revenue from gaming once all of the destination resorts are constructed.
“This new revenue will allow the state to meet key needs, such as deferred maintenance at Kansas universities and local property tax relief, while avoiding a tax increase,” Sebelius said. The bill also requires $17 million to be spent on programs to help problem gamblers, a significant increase over current levels.
The destination casinos will attract visitors to the state – much like casinos just over the Missouri and Oklahoma borders have attracted Kansans. The authorization of slot machines at Kansas race tracks will also provide a boost to the state’s ailing horse and greyhound racing industry.
“This is an opportunity for our state to generate out-of state dollars from visitors, to reinvigorate Kansas agribusinesses raising horses and greyhounds , and to maximize state revenue while maintaining strict regulatory oversight,” said Sebelius.
I don’t need to write an entire story to lay it out.
I drive to Oklahoma to spend my money and take a chance on winning every few months and I will be voting yes so the drive is shorter and it benefits my are instead of theirs.
If we vote against it, I’ll still go to Oklahoma.
If you want to throw good money away why don’t you throw it toward something worth while. Putting it into the hands of Organized Crime does much less good than giving it to a homeless shelter or some other charity.
After all once it’s gone, it’s gone. I can guarantee you will never make back what you spent, but some good will come out of it, instead of funding crime. It’s just a thought.
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