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Open thread
- By Phillip Brownlee
- Posted Jan. 20, 2007 at 1:04 a.m.
- Filed under Open thread
- Permalink
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149 Comments
When you examine the blog thread below, “REVOTE NECESSARY ON THE ARENA,” and subtract the bloggers who are obviously on the arena dole, directly or indirectly, who are attempting to pack and spin the thread — ITS OBVIOUS THE GREAT MAJORITY OF REAL PEOPLE, UNAFFILIATED WITH THE ARENA, DON’T WANT TO PAY THE $250,000,000.37 FOR THIS WHITE ELEPHANT, ALBATROSS DOWNTOWN ICE HOCKEY ARENA.
So, lets RE-VOTE this idiocy once and for all. My unofficial poll of the people I talk to indicates to me that 90% of Sedgwick County voters now understand the arena mathematics and DON’T want it.
It appears to me only two county commissioners, Dave Unruh and Tom Winters, now stand in the way of revoting this white elephant arena that the great majority of taxpayers DON’T WANT. Unruh and Winters don’t want to swallow their pride and admit they made a gigantic mistake.
Remember the arena is basically a giant ice rink for ice hockey. It’s my understanding that ice hockey people NOW want their own smaller arena so they can make the profits for their efforts — not the county administration. This is the best of private enterprise — not leftist thinking.
The ice hockey arena arrangement is not conducive to holding conventions nor even concerts. The acoustics, staging and equipment loading in requirements are far different.
Also the arena as proposed has a single purpose, that is, supporting “Old Town.” Even business people there admit the arena will be more of a detriment than an advantage because of timing, parking, etc.
Regarding parking, I understand some private investors will “step forward,” magnamonously, to build a private parking location somewhere in the vicinity, where high parking charges can be charged to the unwashed and special arrangements can be offered to insiders.
Having been in the commercial building business in Kansas City, I know an anchor tenant is required to build a development project. Despite the best efforts of Bob Hansen, et al of the Sports Authority, no valid sizable user can be found to serve as an anchor for the arena. That alone should kill the project.
Downtown Wichita could use a new convention center along the Arkansas River thread but this option was nixed by Wichita sports interests. Remember, I was one of the first to call for a modest sports arena to be built by PRIVATE investors just east of the current Ice Sports facility and south of Lawrence Dumont Stadium.
Regarding the Wranglers, I agree they were no longer providing an exciting baseball product. Even so, I just purchased my FORTY tickets for Wrangler baseball to begin soon in about 2 1/2 months. Have any of you pro-arena people done this or are you more interested in seeing the taxpayers waste $250,000,000.22 so you can rip off a piece of the action?
On the other hand, there is some magic in the annual National Baseball Congress (NBC) world series. Thankfully, the NBC appears to be continued in Wichita thanks to its great owners, Bob and Mindy Rich.
In Wichita, where good jobs are hard to come by, I can understand why so many people have grabbed on to the ARENA gravy train. But so many important problems in Sedgwick county could be solved with a less amount of money.
SO, COUNTY COMMISSIONERS GET WITH IT — LET THE VOTERS VOTE AGAIN AND FIND OUT ONCE AND FOR ALL WHAT THE VOTERS THINK.
Some Wichita people ask, “HASN’T A LOT OF MONEY ALREADY BEEN WASTED ON THE ARENA?” The answer is, unfortunately, yes. Architects, engineers, real estate people, are frantically charging time against the arena project … knowing it is on thin ice going against the wishes of a large majority of voters.
But some of this waste could be retrieved by selling the arena footprint to WAL-MART for a “green” store that fits into that urban location. Such a store could actually serve as an anchor for a redeveloped downtown Wichita. THIS COULD BE THE START OF SOMETHING BIG IN DOWNTOWN WICHITA. There have already been some good ideas on how this could be leveraged into something good for Wichita on a 24/7 basis.
So, County Commissioners, forget your pride, do the right thing — LET THE PUBLIC VOTE AGAIN.
Deal with it JWink…………….there will be no re-vote.
Vewwwy interesting…. Libby and Fitz. have a bit of history.
The Libby InjusticeA political dispute whose “crime” was solved a long time ago.
http://www.opinionjournal.com/weekend/hottopic/?id=110009555
It makes me really wonder why JWink is really so badly against the arena.
He does nothing but flood Open Threads on this. He must be getting paid by somebody to do it.
He never answers any question and he spits out lies and unsubstantiated polls and figures.
There has to be a much deeper reason for being so rabid against the arena project other than his flat out poor excuse that it’s going to cost a billion dollars.
I think it’s his hate towards Wichita, but I don’t know what it is really, I’m just guessing. But it sure isn’t the concern about the cost. That is just a front for his morbid campaign.
As I tell people who call it a white elephant. Is the Kansas Coliseum a White Elephant? If it isn’t, then I may say to you that the Downtown Arena is replacing the Coliseum. The analogy I give is: It’s like adding a lane and repaving Central Street, then calling the entire street a White Elephant and asking for it to be dug up and wiped off the map just because the government is spending money on expanding it.
JWink! Who is paying you to flood? Park City? You should Disclose that information.
Let me be the first here to congratulate Ben on the front page article regarding the Ark River and his work supporting it.
Damn Ben, I knew I liked you, I just didnt know how much :)
Rivers need advocates if they are to be preserved, much less enhanced. The more people who use and experience kansas rivers as more than toxic dumps or an extension of city water pipes, the more people will guard and nurture these precious resources.
You go, Ben and friends. We need more folks like you who are as much into “doing” as they are “saying”. Thanks for setting a good example for the rest of the state.
And look who opposes it. The Kansas Farm Bureau. Big ag. Big irrigation. They cant have all those pesky people falling in love with rivers and getting in the way of them draining these resources.
KFB and its members prefer doing their business with no spectators. Not as many questions that way. Remind you of darth cheney and company?
Shine a light on them and they scurry off like the roaches they are.
The rivers and ALL of the water in Kansas already belongs to ALL of the people, not just to big ag and a few municipalities with political ties to governor leadership.
We already own the water. Who could condem us for wanting access to it, or for wanting to preserve it?
KFB and the Kansas Water Office.
How ironic……
Thanks kfg. I’d love th see everyone get on board with this – not just Wichita but all through Kansas and beyond. We are working on the Water Office.
Joe – to the best of my knowledge JWink is not being paid by anyone. In fact, politically, one big reason it passed in the first place is there were many paid advocates who could devote a lot of time and only unpaid working people on the other side who could only devote spare time.
Ben, are you familiar with the “riverkeepers”?
I cant quote the name of the group exactly, but I know they have at least one certified “riverkeeper” in northeast kansas. She has made presentations to the Ks water board before. Dont know if she is still around.
Good luck with the Kansas Water Office. I wonder if you and Joe Harkins, who STILL calls the shots over Tracy’s head, will be the irresistable force meeting the immovable object.
Guess which one is which? heheheheh
…and have you all gotten any support from governor leadership?
Hillary is now a candidate for president 08!
And she’s gonna win- she’s got my vote.
Yes – riverkeeper groups are a part of the big picture nationally. Locally I think the closest thing is our Ark River Coalition.
http://www.arkriver.org/
Come on over …
hee hee hee hee Ben. The dogs tend to follow me on water issues. You are better off if I stay away.
Of course, it doesnt mean I cant consult behind the scenes….
Ahhh…how soon we forget Whitewater. And the mysterious boxes of evidence that disappeared for years and magically appeared in a closet?
Ahhh yes…another “ethical” politician wanting higher office..
“Iraq: Security forces kill 15 insurgents.http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/16504148.htmU.S. copter down in Iraq; 13 aboard deadAssociated Press
BAGHDAD, Iraq – A U.S. helicopter went down northeast of Baghdad, killing all 13 people aboard, the military said Saturday.=================Nice linkage Wichita Eagle; Although I’m sure the families of the helicopter crash wont’t appreciate it
Oh Raptor get over yourself, Whitewater is old news and they were exonerated.
And yeah, I’ve still got boxes here from when I moved in 7 years ago that I haven’t a clue what is in them.
Hey JM, is it now wrong for the media to report US deaths in the war?
Bill Richardson gets my vote.
Joe,
What JWink says makes more sense to me than what you say on this subject. I have finally found out what I was told before the vote wasn’t true. I don’t think I’m the only Wichitan who voted YES and would like the opportunity to rescind that vote. I do agree that it’s a done deal. There will be no revote and the arena will be built. But it isn’t right and it isn’t good for Wichita.
That’s your opinion Linda.
Although I’m not for sure if JWink lives in Wichita. Could be Park City.
It would seem the arena is not in fact a done deal. Good.
Right, Joe, just like it is your opinion that the arena is a good thing. See, we are all entitled to our own opinions. What you don’t like about the situation is that now that people are actually INFORMED about the arena, their opinions have changed and they no longer want it. And that scares you, because you know that if enough people make enough noise, it could cause a revote, which you know would not pass. Now granted, that’s very unlikely, but it is a remote possibility. Which is why you persist in shoving YOUR opinion down our throats. So we don’t agree with you. Great. Get over it and leave us alone. All your spewing of talking points isn’t going to change our minds. Let’s move on…
I worried about parking the whole time, and they said NO NO it’ll be worked out.
Ha.
I do not agree that the arena is a done deal and I am drafting my letter to the county commision to encourage a re-vote.
Why is it we always have to put up buildings on every scenic piece of ground? Even back when I was a young conservative, I was part of the save scenic McClena blvd. movement.
If we are going to clear out old construction, why not create a large park around the Century II area? There could be lagoons and fountains and art. More people will go to that than will pay 40 bucks to walk 30 blocks to see some idiot bounce a ball or smash a guitar.
I say bring it on. But remember, the re-vote must be on a Presidential general election to maximize turnout. That is November 2008. The project should go forward as plan until then, because it’s going to pass again. Did anybody read the support for the Arena on the opinion line?
I’m for a re-vote. You can even try for a third one if this fails your agenda. After the arena is built, you can even hold a vote for it to be torn down. It doesn’t matter. There isn’t enough people who are against it.
Joe?
You KNOW you are wrong.
You WANT your arena. That’s fine. But it is dishonest and unrealistic to pretend that Wichita is not damn pissed off about the dishonesty of the arena. It is not too late to at least try and reverse that.
It doesn’t even have to be a a re-vote up or down. It could just be an agreement to go back to formula and start over.
I haven’t concerned myself with specifics on the arena…..because that is not how the thing has been done. Very little in the way of public survey.
For starters? The location is all wrong.
See, I think I have already had this arguement with you Joe, so I am not going to jump into again. But I am pretty sure that the concerns that I raised regarding the arena, you had NO answers for, other than “Oh parking won’t be a worry and isn’t a valid concern” Right, but it seems to be a major concern of people in this city. As for me, if there was a revote, you could add an additional NO to the vote, because I was a Butler county resident at the time of the first vote, but I live in Sedgwick County now!!! And for the record, I have lived in and around the Wichita area for my entire life (excluding the four years I spend up at KSU) so yeah, I have a pretty invested interest in what goes on here… Especially since I don’t plan to leave in the forseeable future (of course, if a promotion opens up with the job, I am jumping on it because we peons get paid pennies but the next level up makes some good cash…)
If Parking is a big issue to you, then that’s fine.
Do what ever is in your power to convience the County to issue a non-binding re-vote on the issue. I encourage it.
I would suggest getting with Karl Peterjohn, he has a lot of clout and knowns the government system to get your voices heard.
If you think it’s determental, then do what you can to stop it.
Personally I’m not convienced at all to scrap it, but I’m only the 10%. If you really believe it’s better to scrap the downtown arena for any reason, then do what it takes to stop it or at least correct it.
I’m not asking people to shut-up or quit. It’s fine by me. It’s our democratic process. Although I would encourage to have the non-binding re-vote in November of 2008. Just to make it as fair for turnout purposes, just as the Yea vote was in 2004.
I’m against the arena for it’s location and the parking issue.
Karl Peterjohn, the Kansas Taxpayer Network dude?
That guy is fruiter than a loon.
I’m waiting for my email from floggytesticles. We’re supposed to be meeting within the hour.
“If Parking is a big issue to you, then that’s fine.”
Joe, what good is an arena is no one can go? Should everyone that wants to attend an event just walk? You can’t take a bus, they don’t run after 6:00 PM or on Sunday.
How many people would shop at Wal Mart in there was no parking lot?
Would there be anyone at the Mall if they had to walk?
We were promised the complete package for our “yes” vote. Now there is only a partial package.
We bought the car but it didn’t have a transmission.
Now we want our money back.
I disagree with Peterjohn on just about everything. Except the arena.
Wait until 08 Joe?
What you mean is wait til it’s TOO late. Even as slow as Wichita is, construction will be under way by then.
See? This is exactly the sort of “negotiation” you yea people have engaged in.
You get it exactly backwards.
You should have first asked what the arena should be, sought out a concensus, and THEN said “should we build this thing?”
I vote for Edwards, he’s prettier than Hillary.
Joe – the big problem I have with you is that you falsele claim than anyone who disagrees with you hates Wichita. When has JWink ever said he hated Wichita? When has anyone else ever said they hate Wichita? What evidence do you have that he is paid to oppose the Arena?
Those specious arguements weaken your case – at least to me. Rather than actually discussing the issue you shout “Wichita-hater”
I agree with Apothis – it is probably a done deal. And I hope it works out. But I don’t think it will.
By the way, if I hated Wichita I would be all FOR the arena. Figure that one out Joe.
One hour, still waiting of gooftesticles.
Gee Mom, you dont think he’ll stand you up, do ya?
Maybe mrs. nutz has him on a short leash?
He is still licking his wounds after yesterday?
He will always be like Wilson on Home Improvement? We will never see his face?
The possibilities are endless…
shrillary for pres GREAT
If elected not only will she be the first women president,BUT THE UGLIEST…
See woman, you could have come to meet me, and we could have had a grand ole time just imagining what he is like.
Wilson..that’s too damn funny.
He’s afraid of me hehe.
I didn’t vote for that stupid arena. We don’t need it. I want my money back.
I’m in a blizzard out here today!!
A great time to be re-reading the seed cats and laying out this year’s garden. I cant seem to find room for all 500 varieties of tomatoes I want. hee hee And I only have 150 tomato cages, so I see some restraint will be needed here.
And that doesnt even count all the hot peppers I have made a check mark beside.
Farmers. The eternal optiminsts. Planning a garden in a January blizzard.
EAT YOUR HEART OUT! WE’RE GETTING THE TAX MONEY AND YOU CAN’T STOP US!
HAHAHAHAHA!
AND IF YOU DON’T LIKE IT, MOVE SOMEPLACE ELSE!
And while the snow flies, here’s one for Denny.
“California dreamin’ on such a winter’s day”
“And that doesnt even count all the hot peppers I have made a check mark beside.”
I expect an e-mail when the peppers are ripe, Farm Grrl!
And I will light one for Denny also.
I received my copy of Time in the mail today. Thank’s mail lady.
Cover story: The Brain – A User’s Guide.
I am going to send my copy to George W Bush.
Not to worry Clark. I usually travel with bushels of peppers in the summer. I could be persuaded to bring the overflow to a summer meetup.
I’m tellin’ ya, two years ago, I was paying people to TAKE the damn peppers.
heheheheh. Made me really popular at the farmer’s market. I gave away peppers for bags people brought me.
Recycled the bags and saved the peppers from the compost pile.
Ok goofy testicles has had two hours now to send me an email saying he’s ready.
I think that is ample time to determine he is totally full of it.
So any of you who were planning to meet him at the Scotch and Sirloin- I seriously doubt it.
Now, I have to go take my son to where we were to meet, since I promised it to him this morning.
Sorry your son is disappointed, but I think the two of you will have a much better time alone :)
Wonder if nutz will reappear under a different nic?
Hey kfg?
I have a really good book on using old tires as water conserving planters for tomatoes.
Sounds good JR. I need to warm my soil as much as possible. The last freeze date on my farm is Memorial Weekend.
But I’m a tomato and pepper warrior and I put a few out after the 15th of May, and the rest the first of June.
I’m putting out a huge melon patch this year, along with pumpkins and squash. And a big crop of potatoes and onions.
Come on Spring!!!!!!!!
WOW JM is loose! Anybody got a butterfly net?
Hey kfg it probably is stuff you already know. It is from a book called “Tirecrafting”
Lots of stuff in there I didn’t know about raising “super productive tomato plants”.
Actually, the JM posts are now starting to look like Fleetwood trolls.
Hmmmmm…………..
Yeah, I don’t think that’s JM.
He’s obtuse and maddening when he refuses to answer questions, but this seems to be someone intent on making JM look like a bigger idiot than he really is.
Go away, troll shizen . . .
Let the record show–I stuck up for JM when he was getting trolled.
He doesn’t deserve it and he wouldn’t do it for me or any other liberal, but we still defend his right not be trolled.
So old Blood and Guts Golf Nut wouldn’t even show up to meet a lady?
Figures.
He’ll finally post in a couple of hours about how he was golfing with Jimmy Buffet and Tom Delay in Key West this weekend . . . so he couldn’t make it.
JWink,
Chill. Please. Good day to do it.
Who cares about what some “ice hockey” people want, if they could build their own arena, it would have happened.
You bought Wranglers tickets, does that fix the stadium? That’s the problem with L-D. Until its chair back seats for all, locker rooms and dugouts fixed, better field turf and a fresh identity as Wichita’s ball field that will be leased and never owned by someone else, its not fixed. LD is a reflection of Wichita. Not attending events is a reflection of Wichitans.
Never mention Wal-Mart as doing anything to benefit what you desire. That’s insane. I’ve never seen a Wal-Mart as a cultural location to celebrate. Its a warehouse with stuff to sell.
One guy here has mentioned enough area for semi’s to load off gear and park downtown..excuse me, but HOK is a highly credible company and has built arena’s nationwide to know how they should function for events.
He also said a comment about “paid parking” vultures waiting. The city has to give those businesses the licenses and its not likely.
Public parking is key to have with all of our event places. Every where we’ve ever been has had public parking and thats not going to change.
Downtown has metered parking in some areas during the day, it doesn’t affect night time events and weekends.
Discussing parking issues is not going to stop construction of the arena.
Nothing is going to stop construction of the arena except weather and underground utility concerns. Red tape too the way politicans do it.
I question your continued ranting its not productive. Leading others to believe some re-vote is possible. It’s not. Contractually, its impossible.
My advice, stop leading on “every Sedgwick County person” you talk with. Of course, they hate it, is natural response when people don’t know what’s going on.
They hate the inaction, waiting to see it being built. Understanding the parking issues more clearly.
People who loved the Coliseum location has to accept change or choose never to be downtown.
I too will stand to defend JM and the possibility that his nic is being hijacked.
And it DOES look alot like BDP fleeties work…..
BUT JM did this before. He stomped off vowing never to return. This was followed by a new nic poster who showed up and made a lot of “noise”.
In any case, I ask the editors to remove the mess.
JM is usually calm, even whe he is seriously ticked off – this is a troll.
Jeez, does anyone know where Fleet and Nutz are?
J R and a Capn went a huntin uh huh uh huh
J R and a Capn went a Huntin uh huh uh huh
they fond some fondlin bunniesand they made themlife long hunnies
J R and a Capn went a Huntin uh huh uh huh
Ms. farmgrill went a courtin uh huhMs. farmgrill went a courtin uh huh uh huh
she found mate of proper stickinask her if she culd do some lickin
ms. farmgrill went a courtin uh huh uh huh
Well I’m back. Got about out of town and decided when I watched a big SUV driving sideways down the street that it probably wasn’t a good idea to try to go.
From the Arena Proposal Sept 1 2004
Arena cost $141,517,000 15,000 seats
Parking garage cost $19,400,000 for 3200 spaces.
Reserve fund: $23,611,000
Total Project Cost $184,528,000
Today: No parking garage, reserve fund less than $4,000,000; total project cost over $200,000,000
Projected opening date Fall 2008. Now I think they are talking spring 2009.
Other facilities:
Alltell – 18,000 seats $80,000,000 total budget
Ford Center – 20,000 seats, $90,000,000 total budget
All items taken from Arena literature received from Sedgwick County 1.5 years ago.
Gee, testicles was gone all day and it was quiet, now look at what is happening with the trolls.
Just came in from outside. Amazing how bright and how quiet it is in the snow. Beautiful winter wonderland.
So should I cry or rejoice that I was stood up?
Well, P Mom, we were all worried about your meet up, so we are happy that you are safe and sound at home.
I was going to take my husband with me. You didn’t think I would go meet him alone did you?
JM<—–trolling himself: )
JM<——trolling J R : (
JM<——drunk
Actually that’s true Popup
And the only people that could know this are the people who are at the Wichita Eagle.
This was a test case to prove that Liberals cannot stand to be treated the way they treat anyone on the right.
And finally it proves that the Wichita Eagle is a Liberally biased newspaper because no one else could have know it was mean without having access to the computer that has the IP addresses.
So, sayanara. When the Eagle knows full well that the majority of the bloggers that troll are from the liberal side (I have proven six of them without a doubt.) and does nothing about it…
The show their true bias and it’s time for me to abandon this leftist blog.
How did it feel to be treated with total disrespect Libbies?
You didn’t like it did you?
See ya chumps.
Oh and I report by astroturfing that the Wichita Eagle is a Leftist blog and will warn others to stay away from it.
Are you going away, JM?
See ya!
It was nice knowing you, but I still don’t believe that it was same clean and sober JM.
Maybe is was the not so clean and sober JM.
I really hope that Sam Brownback doesn’t get elected into office. I do not want to live under the thumb of another Christian Taliban mullah.
Hello Ben –I am sending to you a donation for the ARC.You guys are doing a great thing.
That really was you JM? Ok, well, I’ve lost ANY amount of respect I MIGHT have had for you.
Yup, you’re dead to me. To get this bent out of shape is ridiculous.
ws-For accusing me of being the troller, you can now say “I’m sorry, sweet Fleettwood”.
What is astroturfing?
And thenks wiseman. Come on out sometime. All are welcome regardless of politics.
PMom — You know I’ve never believed a word he has ever said. Too much bragging, too many different versions of his work and his families business, etc. I’m positive he will have some wonderful-sounding excuse and go right on chasing you around the board bringing up things that have nothing to do with anything. I think if he is ignored he might go away, or I can always hope anyway. Maybe that MySpace profile posted yesterday really IS him (in another one of his seems-to-be several on-line personalities).
what myspace profile????
OMG show me?
I’m going to have to search to find what thread it was on. Anyone else remember?
Buh bye, JM.
You’ll be missed.
Fleet, NOW you suddenly show up?
Hmmmmmmmmm…… seems a little suspicious…..
ksgolfnut myspace profile
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=97888204Posted by: the shadow | January 19, 2007 at 02:30 PMAnd to be fair, a few posts down:That’s neat shadow…however, I:Am not divorcedDon’t smokeAm 6′2Am not NECKCAR fanDo have more than a HS educationDon’t make 30k-45k/yearPosted by: KSGolfnut | January 19, 2007 at 02:38 PM
popup!<—–NOT with Eagle
WEblog<—–NOT run out of Eagle
popup!<—–observant{oo}
JM<—–NOT very clever % (
JM<—-s-h-o-r-t-f-u-s-e————–sssssss KABOOM!
Read carefully and note that KSGolfnut does not deny it’s his profile. He’s a careful writer, so I think it’s likely that the shadow busted our resident cement pond owner/wannebe, faux millionaire stalker troll, aka KSGolfnut.
Oh yeah, that’s his web page all right. ;)
And if that’s the case: why oh why KFGolfnut would you post on — wait for it — Myspace (have you no self-esteem at all?…LOL) that you’re divorced and all in pieces over it YET claim here that you’re all dolled up wife-wise?
What a frickin weasel.
The same troll who put up that fraud myspace porfile of me did the same to the Golfnut. The clown used to post here under the nic of “k”, as in morty the.
This popup dude is really wigging me out, but I think i know his true identity.
Viva La Raza Blanco!!
Go ahead, ws, “I’m sorry sweet, fleettwood” for the false accusation.
Hey, Fleet, PROVE that you are not the troll!
That should be easy for a smart guy like you, right?
And don’t use a lame comeback like “prove that it was me.”
Lame comebacks are not allowed.
We are using Rush Limbaugh/Right Wing Rules today.
Prove that the troll was NOT you, Fleet.
If that’s true, then I owe KSGolfnut a mega apology.
If it’s true, though, then there ain’t no doubt there’s at least one big-ass weasel around these parts.
Either KSGolfnut or his troll is despicable.
The troll in question, Pendant, was trolling JM, not Nutz.
The best reason to cancel the downtown arena is so that politicians and government bureaucrats won’t be in charge of our entertainment.
The editors can prove it wasn’t me.
Anyone can use an IP hiding website if they want to spend a dollar a month.
Hell, even you could do that Fleet.
Limbaugh Rules – PROVE that you were not the troll, Fleet.
Ask yourself.
Why popup! doesn’t bring up anything on the leftist trolls.
We all know now since I proved it that CapnAmerica is “TheFinger.”
We all know now since I proved it that hmmm is “Ben Huie.” since I proved it.
Not one peep out of popup! on these trolls.
Not one.
And popup!
I’m more clever than you think.
Welcome to my linux spyderweb.
So, now the “REAL” JM appears, just as the challenge has been thrown down to Fleet to PROVE that he is not the JM TROLL buddy?
This is getting very, very suspicious now……
Are Fleet and JM one and the same?
Is Fleet trolling JM even though JM and Fleet are the same blogger?
Where is KSGolfnut and what has Fleet done with him?
Is “StillJM” different than the regular JM and, if not, why is there a need to differentiate between the two?
And more importantly, who the “F#@$” cares?
what the heck?
uhhh, super troll has trolled me.
WS,
your answer is NO ONE CARES!
im sick and tired of these idiots who are so right or so left than invent new personalities to than support their own claims…
Cool Ian,
That means all those Global Warming Blogsites will be going down because they will have to register under their true names.
Same goes for all those Veteran Websites against the War. People will find out who they really are. Made up veterans, backed by Kerryites and such Corporations such as Heinz (Kerry-Heinz)
Poor government babys, they dont like it that people are able to express their first amendment rights.
Yeah, Tony
you mean first amendment lies.
StillJM
http://www.realclimate.org/ does not “criticise Congress and organise grassroot causes”.
They’ve had 2,343,026 vistors since Dec 10, 2004, and an award in 2005 from the ‘Scientific American’.
Also, jailing scientists from NASA, NOAA, etc would get a huge amount of negative PR, and “backfire” against your anti-GW fantasies.
cosmass keep believing that this a pure org
urban legends has a larger following than that and it is all false
your point is negated as usual
Look out everybody!! More of StillJM’s “first amendment lies” are going to be released on Feb 7.
‘Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change’http://www.ipcc.ch/
About that arena you keep talking about: I don’t live in Sedgwick Co so the tax, expense, conflab really don’t effect me personally. But! Parking IS an issue with me. I do know Wichita, lived there many yrs ago. Getting to Century II for us is a nuisance, and parking ain’t that great. The colosium (sp ?) is much handier. Not that fancy, but handy for out-of-towners. Unless it is something really, really “must see” I can’t see driving to Wichita for another downtown fiascono matter how fancy the facility. “Us” small-towners prefer simplicity. And we do know to beware of crazy Wichita drivers.
JM?
Are we going to have to install a revolving DOOR for you?
You’re in you’re out. Gone and back again.
I even stood up for you when I thought you MIGHT be being trolled. So did others.And it was just you playing games?I think you lost just about all your credibility here today. And if you don’t like this blog or feel that blogs in general are a bad thing as you seem to suggest above? Why not go and STAY gone?
Personally? I think you are a seriously disturbed person. Seek help?
Oh and if there IS legislation to restrict bloggers? It will NEVER stand. The internet is outta the bottle and it aint never going back.
Whatever JR.
Now you believe it’s a troll and now you don’t believe it is a troll.
Either way you feel the necessity of calling me a disturbed person.
Nothing worse than being a professional bum eh J R? Have to cash in your 401K so you can continue blogging?
Now that’s sad.
kook JM?
Is THAT your BEST shot?
Try harder. Why you must have all SORTS of invective real or imaginary you can hurl at me from your fevered brain!
sure thing webtv boy, the lowest rung on Internet ladder. Only the computer illiterate and those on social security or feeding off their 401k use webtv.
Anybody know a good place to sled?
Me and my son tried tried at one of the overpasses along Mt. Vernon this afternoon. But the run there is not very long. I have heard that SG park is a good place but have not been there. Anybody got any ideas.
Not you JM I want places in THIS world!
That is seriously lame, JM or StillJM or WannabeJM or CouldbeJM or JMJM or……
Really WSClark?
The same person that calls people expletives and raves around like a lunatic?
You have zero room to talk. The champion foulmouth name-calling low life of the blog.
Want me to give you a nick name like you do Fleetwood?
You think that’s funny? Let’s try it.
How about WussyCluck?
The liberal values boy, everyone vote on it now.
We’ll call you Wuss for short.
I’m going to go away now JM. I really do not enjoy trading shots with a feeb. It feels sorta like teasing a caged animal. Makes me feel sorta mean. Perhaps someone else will happen along to toy with you.
This isn’t JM that is posting, unless he went off his meds and needs a medical intervention.
I still think Fleetwood is trolling JM…..
J R, I watched kids coming down a good sized hill on the north side of Kellogg just to the east of Ridge Road a couple nights ago. Just east of the Palace Movie theatre on the northeast corner of Kellogg and Ridge. They looked like they were having a ball! It was fun to watch (from the heated car. lol).
They were there again today. Parents parked in Carlos O’kelly’s parking lot and the kids having a great time. You might try the dam at Lake Afton, but my neighbor got stuck coming home and had to put on chains to get out.
The beardies here at home are having a great time! House is a mess. We’ve had the family room dog door open all day and they are soaked.
This is Boomer’s first real snow storm and at barely a year old he’s having a blast! Lilly hasn’t seen this much snow either, she’s only about 16 months old.
It was a little tough getting to the horses and goats today to feed, I’ll probably not try and get the truck up to the stables tomorrow. When I fed tonight I noticed that evidently someone went off the road up there. By all of the tracks they had a good time getting out.
Everyone stay safe and enjoy the snow!
Hank
Well, what could be better — a snow white evening, no wind, Lawrence Welk program on Channel 8, a little time to e-mail friends.
Wait a minute — I’m writing a note to Lawrence Welk about his especially good show this evening with guest, Pat Boone and the Lennon Sisters. Perhaps they could perform at the Kansas Coliseum later this spring!
Now, lets see what the good bloggers have said today about RE-VOTING the white elephant downtown arena.
Uh Oh, there’s those two remaining pesky downtown arena cheerleaders, Joe Williams and MRage. I believe they are the only unaffiliated people left in Wichita who want the downtown arena. Boys, I wish you would join the 180,000 Sedgwick County voters/taxpayers who DON’T WANT the downtown arena — better ideas are being suggested for the proposed arena footprint.
Joe, I remember when we met at a previous WE Blogger meetup. As I recall, you were close to completing WSU, you didn’t have a job, and you were considering doing the patriotic thing by joining the military. By the way are you working anywhere?
MRage, I did receive an e-mail from you about your unusual name, as I recall, the only one like it in Wichita. I still don’t understand your position in the scheme of things. I presume you are a WSU/Shocker student with big ideas.
Boys don’t take the “leftist” pathway. That is don’t espouse leftist slogans, that is, “take from the many (all the people), to give to the few (the insiders).” Or as the old Lenin/Trotskyites said, “From those according to their ability, to those according to their need.”
Or the opposite of Robin Hood, “Take from the poor, give to the rich!”
Boys, boys don’t ruin your lives by espousing these “leftist” positions. Only when the private enterprise system works with government will great improvements be made.
Now, I’ve got to type some long overdue e-mails — and finish listening to Lawrence Welk and the Lennon sisters.
Hank,What kind of dogs do you have? And you have horses? I’m jealous! Even though I’m an old lady I still haven’t gotten past that part of me that always wanted a horse! I have 3 dogs and a cat. I’d probably have more but then my husband would divorce me. All except one of my dogs were someone else’s castoffs. My husband thinks I need to apply for my kennel license sometimes as I have taken in other strays but have found homes for them.
I’m sorry JWink! But you must the shortest memory or just nonexistence.
We’ve had this posting conservation before and AGAIN, you are thinking of the wrong guy. But let me remind you! I’ve been graduated from College years ago and I’ve been gainfully employed since the day after my 16th birthday and I’m over 30 years old now. I haven’t been unemployeed for a single day since I was legally able to work.
And AGAIN! At the WE Blogger meet-up, we never spoke a word to each other. Other than friendly handshakes that went around. I never spoke to you, said anything to you, mentioned anything to you and a matter of fact was on the other side of the room in the back, when you were up front.
So you got me mixed up with the wrong guy. It’s like your unsubstaniated and blantently false statisitic that you only rattle off of your forgetful brain.
But it probably isn’t any use! You’ll still mistake me for somebody else AGAIN! One eye and ear and out the other.
Ok I am back from my trek in the snow.
Whew it is getting bad out there. I did not even want to get my little truck out.
I WISH we could have went sledding on that ice stuff we had last week! That would have been fun but it was too damn cold.
I’m thinking sledding will have to wait till Monday. Let everybody else smooth out the runs.
Dogs? I have a little Shih Tzu that has always lived in the house. One time show dog. “Hot house” plant if you will He takes one look at the snow and gives me a look that says “OK this is when you pick me up and carry me out to the bare grass under the boat!” The other little foundling Lhasa?Shih Tzu? mix? He LOVES the stuff. Bounds around in it in insane glee.
Hey watch out for your neighbors if they are elderly. Clean off a car or shovel their porch. Lotsa people DIE shovelling snow.
JWink,
Your no Wal-mart site decider.
Your ideas including Wal-mart in any way are nonsense.
Wichita voted for the arena downtown, accept that in your own mad way, no going back from progress.
I want to change WSU for the long term benefit in this community from outside the college. I haven’t been a student there since the 80’s.
Arena’s and stadiums have similar goals. Wichita needs a new stadium for WSU football to return. A stadium that is engineered to do a variety of events, year round.
I won’t be asking you specifically to help.
My projects are private enterprise working with the local governments. My stadium idea has a “tenant” in mind. It has events clarified, due to configuration possiblities.
The biggest risk is on investors in my planning.
I’m willing to risk as a citizen in this community, the belief our downtown arena will do well enough. I like the location downtown. Near the bus depot is the proper place.
Much better than the tired Coliseum. Parking just as available and free.
Your ranting about a re-vote has to stop. Your wasting time and air with all those Sedgwick County people you claim to know.
People can be “worried” about parking or access to and from downtown, but the project isn’t going to stop.
FYI, it’s a beautiful night here in Salina America
Hey Brenda,
We have two registered Bearded Collies, a rescue Beardie, a rescued mutt and a miniture schnauzer. Most of the regulars here know about them.
We had to get a state rescue license, one of my neighbors turned me in for having too many dogs once. (I did have 13 from a puppy mill in Missouri once). I can now keep up to 25 legally!
No need to be jealous, you can come out and feed the horses a few weeks till you get it out of your system!
http://www.beardie.net/bcca/
Hank
Hey how do you get your cox.net email to follow you to Salina?
Political Mom,
Tell me you’re not that computer illiterate, please.
Ever hear of Web Login?
MRage: I am confused about your claims. What do you do? Do you work professionally in the activities you have mentioned on this blog such as building arenas and/or stadiums? What’s this about changing the name of colleges and universities? Regarding getting football at WSU, that will never happen unless you step up with the millions of dollars necessary to pick up the tab. That option went out the window years ago. I’m sure the students don’t want to pay for it nor our state legislators.
So, please clarify your participation and track record in these activities.
No, JM I haven’t.
I guess I’m just a puter dummy.
MRage: You are correct, I don’t work for Wal-Mart’s real estate department. However, I do have a friend who works in W-M’s exective offices in Bentonville so I can get a message to Wal-Mart’s top people in about 15 minutes if its important enough.
I also hope to visit Bentonville and Springdale, Arkansas sometime this spring/summer to see where the Wranglers are going to play next year.
Pee,
I can access it via the web using Outlook, but only to read mail. I can’t send. I have to use webmail.central.cox.net to send anything. It’s a pain in the ass.
I’m assuming that you didn’t get my mail about the mall…and my cell?
I got your email, but I didn’t see the point in calling.
It’s not like I could have driven to Salina in all the snow that fell between the time I was SUPPOSED to meet you and when you finally contacted me.
okie dokie. I told you it had to be flexible. And you told me it had to be in the evening.
No, we had agreed that I was going to stay awake after work and meet you for LUNCH instead.
Because you were going to be with the other parents for dinner…
remember?
the snow put the kabash on all that. we ordered pizza in the hotel.
it’s no biggie. we’ll do it another time. I’m sorry if you made special plans to meet irresistable lil ol’ me. =)
No, dear we won’t do it another time, I don’t go out of my way like that to get stood up for someone who thinks I should sit around waiting for him to email in his own sweet time.
Oh well…ok then. I seriously doubt you were doing much on such a crappy day.
JWink,
When the Wranglers leave I say good riddance. Tied to the Royals, terrible team. I think Wichitans were afraid call ups would go to Kansas City and be involved losing 100 game seasons.
We still need to fix L-D as a community facility. The City shouldn’t be quick to lease it out until its fixed.
About WSU name improvement, we’ll see. From Wichita State to Wichita Shockers University, because its the right thing to do.
A “mistake” was made from past history. Wu-Shock the mascot was created and took over defining the people called wheatshockers.
Wu-Shock began to represent Shockers and never made sense.
What are Shockers? That is continually asked.
The answer is; Shockers are people. Wu-Shock is only a mascot.
I don’t have Millions, have to raise it. I’m working on building a new stadium for high school sports, downtown.
Eventually, hope to earn enough, find partners and build a new stadium for WSU to play football in. Partners to create a fund so WSU can afford the football program and create Title IX sports for girls, like a swim team, soccer and field hockey.
Anyone can give to WSU at any time.
I want to earn at least $75 Million or at least own property and holdings worth that much. I’m trying a variety of ways to do that, all legally.
What state legislators want this community to do is use Star Bonds properly. Star Bonds to clear land for the stadium, County will own. Tax on the facility alone.
Topeka would like Sedgwick County to own destination facilites.
Stadium and Casino! County and city govs using tax money in a stadium they partner own is proper.
Combine what Cessna stadium does in seating and grass field, with the “dirt” floor abilities of the Coliseum. A place to see Monster Trucks, Rodeos, motocross. WSU football will play on a grass field.
Smaller than Chiefs stadium in seating but larger than the Sprint Center. The ability to bring events to Kansas that pass this state.
Boise Idaho, where Boise St. is has a blue turf field. 20 degree weather but has a Bowl game as an event. Miami beat Nevada, 21 to 20.
Wichita could have a “Bowl” game too. Get the Big 12 Championship football game that travels around.
Colorado State in a Bowl playing in Wichita or any other Big 12 team. WSU football earning a Bowl game anywhere eventually!
It’s a few years down the road while Wichita continues to grow but I think its a necessary facility to have in this community.
Football teams and fans coming to Wichita will affect the airport with more business.
Parking, access to and from my stadiums are important. Free too!
Chiefs charge for parking and they use tax money is wrong.
Business partnerships with both County and City govs with my stadium ideas. But bulk of the costs are investors, not the taxpayers.
Locations are a secret for now, but it will be a different process with land and property owners, than how the County is doing it.
Things get weirder and weirder. Popup! implies involvement in both website administration AND meetups; Ian Santiago SEEMS to have some inside knowledge.
Intriguing, but I’ll pass.****************************Sigh. . .JM discovered that nonprofit organization registerd realclimate.org, and the person who registered it is involved with other (unrelated) environmental activist sites. Thus, to his twisted mind, everything on the site is run by this organization, even though the content is created by well-regarded, experienced climate scientists.
I had researched the domain registries JM mentioned earlier (toward the end of the “ice shelf” thread), but decided against mentioning it–I wanted to let the thread die. Figures JM would insist on beating a dead horse.
Give it up, JM. It’s embarrassing to watch.
Keep in mind huge sports arenas sit idle most of the time and offer expensive concessions. A new arena may work in Kansas City because KC metro is home to MORE than 1,000,000 (one million) people. These projects rarely pay for themselves. Wichita could better spend this money buliding a state of the art Vocational-Technical campus thus providing good jobs and bringing in constant revenue to the city from students across the state. Rental units could benefit greatly.
That’s why Wichita will get a multi- event facility. The goal stay busy with “dirt” events. Grass field or whatever flooring, basketball court, year round.
I marvel at some colleges having 100,000 people in seats for football games and have no ideals this regional area will ever have that many people going to a singular event constantly. We have the river festival, the only time that’s possible today.
I’m a consumer first on ticket prices and concessions. This market can cost less than KC event concessions and seating prices.
I’m hoping WSU expands from 14,000 to 18,000 students in future years with a wider variety of scholarship opportunities.
Rental units have to be created for increased WSU students. Apartments, not dorms.
This area has growth potential and we need a stadium, plus arena for events, places to entertain the community.
JWink – I am one of those who has mixed feelings about WalMart. I’d like to discuss some things that they need to deal with – particularly landscaping and traffic – when locating adjacent to residential as on Kellogg/Oliver. I tend to oppose what I have seen but at the same time could support it with changes.
BEN HUIE: On the water thread quite a ways down now, I acknowledged your work on the Arkansas River as mentioned in the Sunday EAGLE yesterday.
Also on that water thread I asked VAUGHN TOLLE a question about the result of the lawsuits that Kansas has brought against Colorado. Are we in reality selling our water to Colorado?
MRAGE: I get it now — you are talking about outdoor “stadiums” rather than “arenas” that we have been largely talking about. I suspect if USD 259 or Wichita State needs another stadium, they would build it on some existing school property. I doubt if either would lease a stadium facility on a game by game basis. And what about practice facilities?
JWink – I don’t think we are selling water to Colorado. The problem there has been CO taking the water out of the river before it flows into Kansas. Riparian law is quite complex – it was Bob Stephan who went after that.
JWink,
No county or city league high school, nor WSU football will be charged to play in my stadiums.
With the schools its a different process than they are used to and needs some figuring out. But playoff games for high schools could be played downtown in the future.
WSU should have TV contracts and road games to make money. Recent D1 colleges in the game are making profit playing on the road.
Conferences have wins to make against other D1 teams and by not playing D2 schools that weaken their schedule. TV to show those games.
Have you noticed, no matter property the school board might have or WSU, neither is building a stadium because they can’t afford to.
High Schools county wide have issues with fields and their campus stadiums or tracks. Will help those efforts.
There is need for what I’m trying to accomplish, not my whims, because its very expensive. Costs for the rest of my life to work out.
Practice fields and facilities for WSU football will be constructed as well.
Ben and Jwink, it could be seen that we are selling our water back to Colorado, one step removed.
They release water, we pump it for the coal fired plant in Holcomb, and then we sell the electricity back to them. Same deal with ethanol and wind.
Well, hehehe, the “we” doing the selling are utilities, not the people of kansas. The PEOPLE own the water, but someone else is making money by using it to generate electricity for Colorado.
Bonus for them. They get the power they need to expand and grow (and use MORE water) but they comply with the law and let the water run so the environmental consequenses are paid by Kansas.
Nice work if you can get it.
As long as Kansans continue to insist on an extraction and resource mining economy, that is how it is gonna go. The “tragedy of the commons” when a few get the money and the rest of us pay the piper. Keep it up, and eventually, we’ll just be a dry toxic waste dump out here.
Wont you all in the east LOVE what that does to your water? Your gonna have more love when the bill when the bill for THAT folly comes due?
It would at least be good policy to require wind generators to put money in escrow or trust to “decommision” the turbines eventually. Because, eventually, they will need to be decommissioned, and who wants to bet the people that reaped the profits along the way will want to pay that bill when it comes due?
Better to make them pay now, let the money draw interest, and it will be available when it is needed.
Same with ethanol and coal fired plants. Maybe a “severance” tax on those who mine water for profit? Including the irrigators?
Why do a few irrigators get to reap the benefits of destroying the water supply for ALL of us? Better to carrot and stick them. A little tax, a little incentive, they could see the light.
But right now, there is such a rush to love ethanol and wind, that NO ONE is really paying attention to ALL of the local costs involved.
I wholeheartedly agree we need alternative energy sources. But let’s not rush blindly and jump from the frying pan into the fire.
Of course, all that would require some forsight and vision from governor leadership and the legislature.
heheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheeh
I suspect the devil will ice skate on Cedar Bluff before that happens….
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