Kansas House Majority Leader Ray Merrick, R-Stilwell, says that a bill to make English the state’s official language would send a statement about the need for all residents to be fluent in English. But immigrants already know the importance and value of learning English, and there is no threat of Spanish replacing English as the state’s dominant language. So be honest — this bill is really about making a political statement to Kansans who are upset about illegal immigration. But as House Assistant Minority Leader Jim Ward, D-Wichita, noted, “these are symbolic things that don’t address the underlying problem.” That’s why an English-only bill has never passed the Legislature, despite 10 other tries during the past 20 years — and why it’s still not needed.
Posted by Phillip Brownlee
Registered?
Commenting on WE Blog now requires you to be a Kansas.com member. Use the links above to register, if you haven't already, or to log in.Contact us
Follow us
Daily Archives
-
Recent Comments
- ANTI on Open thread 11/24
- SolDevVB on Open thread 11/24
- DavidB on Open thread 11/24
- DavidB on Open thread 11/24
- DavidB on Open thread 11/24
- Pleefer on Open thread 11/24
- BlueJay on Open thread 11/24
- DavidB on Open thread 11/24
- JimJohnson on Open thread 11/24
- Blaidd_Drwg69 on Whose ‘unchecked spending’?
170 Comments
why do you think Illegal have such an easy time of getting around now days… Nafta embraced tri-lingual products. I would really like to pick up a product off the shelves ,Not having to turn it three different directions to figure out who, what, when and where i’m suppose to use this product.TOILET PAPER …!!!!! WHY DOES IT NEED 3 langauges….well maybe just one side note in spanish.. FLUSH THE TP, DON’T PILE IT IN THE CORNER..
This bill does need to be passed . Why ( once is one) not eleven. so if someone’s mom had learned english,then they may still have a mom. 11 pills were taken instead of the one… this happened in Do Da….
Look at the Kansas turnpike , a virtual freeway to and from messico.. evidently we need the kilometer signage on the pike, also. Rather than the few lines of dibble on the toll plaza windows..Caravan after caravan of mojado’s driving 45 – 50 miles per hour ..I’m scared pass a slow moving Ford truck with a topper or a van .
“But immigrants already know the importance and value of learning English, and there is no threat of Spanish replacing English as the state’s dominant language.”
English as the officicial state language means we can stop printing everything is spanish as well as english. IF the “ILLEGAL immigrants” know the importance of learning english, then why the hell do they not learn english and what is the need for all the extra printed material???
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
“So be honest — this bill is really about making a political statement to Kansans who are upset about illegal immigration.”
SO let’s be even MORE honest, opposition to this legislation IS a for, and support OF illegal immigration. Those whom oppose the bill by the author’s (and HOuse Ass. Minority Leader) (that would be the dems) logic and line of thinking and oppose this legislation then by default support illegal immigration at the expense of Kansas and American Citizens.
Yes, by all means let’s be honest.
If we were truley serious about illegal immigration, we would run check lanes like we do for drunk drivers. IT seems constitutinal to stop all cars to search for drucks (which is good). IT seems that it would be OK as well for ICE and local LEOs to run check lanes for illegal alines and the smugglers.
That is a law I would like to see passed. A law allowing the KHP and the Sheriffs to start rolling “immigration check lanes” just like what is done for drunk drivers.
I think the populace would be happy to be stopped in that case, and you would get a helluva lot more illegals than drunks.
If this bill passes does it mean we can arrest Bush after he gives another one of his piss poor speeches?
How about making tourists speak Engish before they spend any money in this shithole state?
to quote: “That is a law I would like to see passed. A law allowing the KHP and the Sheriffs to start rolling “immigration check lanes” just like what is done for drunk drivers.
I think the populace would be happy to be stopped in that case, and you would get a helluva lot more illegals than drunks.”
THE MOST UNAMERICAN WRONG THING POSTED ON THIS BLOG EVER! EVER EVER EVER EVER!!!$@#% “excuse me sir, we need to see your papers.” that phrase sound familiar? Huh/grunt, ask anyone who used to live in Eastern Europe during the reign of the Soviet Union!
Uh, the Salina Journal recently began printing a spanish version of their newspaper. And you’re saying there is no need to establish English as the language because plenty of them already know English?
Maybe you should try treating a spanish speaker on an ambulance run when nobody speaks spanish. It’s SO much fun and safe too.
Well we are already having check lanes anyway. Why not use them to hunt illegals?
t’s really embarrassing to see a bill like this brought up.
The entire rest of the world has no problem with multi-lingualism, but so many parochial Americans insist on never being exposed to another language.
The thread was exactly right–this bill isn’t about motivating people to learn and use English. It’s about insulating English speakers so they don’t have to hear any other language.
Good grief! You people might learn something.
Pindejos . . .
No it’s about not having to cater to another language.
We are a country of a million languages, and that is fine if some choose to continue to talk in their native tongues, but not for purposes of business and other. We need to have a universally accepted language, and English should be it. We ask every person whether they speak Russian or Swahili to come here and assimilate into our country- and they shouldn’t have to learn to speak spanish too.
If you want to divide people, make language a barrier.
Several federal laws require some documents (voter registration and ballots to name two) to be availalbe in multiple languages.
This bill would not stop the Kansas Secretary of State from printing items in Spanish, Federal law will require him to do so.
Also, law enforcement often prints information on domestic violence and where to get help (for example) in spanish as well. Under this bill, that information would not be availalbe in any language but English.
This is a political bill, nothing more. Let’s forget about this strawman bill and focus on something that will really matter, like harsh fines – that are enforced – for business that knowingly hire illegals. If they are afraid to hire illegals, there won’t be jobs and hence the illegals will have to go elsewhere to find work.
During DUI checkpoints,everyone in the car is probably checked out.DUI isn’t the only thing people are going to jail for.Anyone can be arrested and detained for simply not having ID,and held until they can be identified.I believe it’s illegal to be anonymous in the USA.
BTW, Capn….I believe that it’s spelledpendejo.
This bill is just salve for all those out there who need a reason to hate someone and have their undies all in a wad because they only know backwoods English. I taught foreign languages for many years and let me tell you no one learned one in 2 or 3 years. Immigrants know the value of learning the language of the country and look for opportunities to learn it (and it takes years); that doesn’t mean they don’t enjoy using their own language when with family and friends. I’ve seen American tourists in other countries who although being able to get along in those countries’ languages still speak English when with their group. Why? One’s own language is like comfort food.
“but so many parochial Americans insist on never being exposed to another language.”Excuse me But I think you have that backwards! It is the Invaders who don’t want to be exposed to English!I happen to think Bi-lingual is great(I speak 2) and one of them should be the language of the country you live in.
We’d better ban them there damnedbilingual marriages.Not natural I tells ya.
What? Comfort food?No wonder I’m gettin so damned fat.That’s it.I’m speaking spanish from now on.
I think this bill is awesome! I am not afraid to be exposed to another language (in fact, I would love to learn multiple languages) BUT I also believe that if someone comes to this country, they should learn English. If they want to speak another language with others who speak that language, that is great, but to force all of us to learn it/print it because they don’t want to learn English is BS. When I visit another country, I don’t expect them to speak English just because that is what I speak!
I grew up on an Air Force base and in high school I had a friend who’s mother was Asian (his father, an American, was stationed overseas, met this woman, married her, brought her to America). Well, she refused to learn English. He learned to speak her language and of course my friend grew up multilingual going to school in America and speaking her language when around her. I remember one time running into him and his mother at a local Pizza Hut and he was having to do all of the speaking because of course none of the employees could communicate with her. The next day I asked him how things worked – I knew that his father had just been deployed, so I wondered how the family got along. He said that he had to take care of things that his father would usually take care of – such as talking to doctors, insurance people, anyone that spoke English. Now, we were about 15 at the time and I could tell how embarassed he was. It was hard for him to assume that role but he had no choice and that is how his life had always been because his mother refused to learn/speak English. How horrible is that? I’m sorry, but if you think that America is so great and you feel the need to live here, learn the language – even if it’s just enough to be able to shop, take care of yourself and your family, etc…
I have no problem with learning other languages, but it’d be nice to be able to choose which language I want to learn. I shouldn’t have to be forced to learn spanish simply because they demand we learn their language.
I’d learn spanish because it’s a useful and practical tool.Great on a resume’ too.
If it takes years to learn a language, let them do it in their home country first like all the rest of the law abiding legal resident status foreign nationals.
We don’t need the filth that is here.
Sears, take down your bi-lingual signage, its abhorrent.
Bleh, if you find the Sears signs offensive, don’t shop there. I believe the reason they are present is a matter of federal law; the proposed bill in the Kansas legislature won’t change a thing in this regard.
“We don’t need the filth that is here.
Sears, take down your bi-lingual signage, its abhorrent.”
I hope you were attempting to be sarcastic, otherwise, you’re just being plain rude.
And as far as those Sears signs go, that is not Federal law. There is no law stating that stores must post items in multiple languages, that is their commercial decision to hopefully improve their sales by catering to another group.
AFN, thanks for the correction on the signage; I was thinking of the packaging requirements under NAFTA, and managed to slip it in at an incorrect point. You are most correct about the marketing decisions of the various companies; again, for those who find such signage offensive, don’t shop at those stores, and if enough don’t so shop, the policies will be reviewed and changed.
“The entire rest of the world has no problem with multi-lingualism, but so many parochial Americans insist on never being exposed to another language.”
Not so, MOST all other countries have their language as the “official Language”.
What is the “Official Language in Mexico for instancce? Yes they do have one and it is Spanish.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Thos of you against this bill are by default FOR ILLEGAL ALIENS, and that means that you are against US and Kansas Citizens. You are also not in favor of enforcement of laws. Technically, no one can get a DL in Kansas if they cannot read and understand the highway and street signs.
To get a Kansas DL, you must be able to recognize the direction of the sign based on the SHAPE of the sign.
I lived in Yuma, Arizona about 20 years ago and the first thing I noticed were the street names were all letters or numbers. Because I grew up in the Midwest where basic street names were Elm, Maple, Main, Broadway and etc., I asked the locals why the streets did not have names and the reason was because we lived 10 miles from the Mexico border. The town was full of illegals and most of them knew their numbers and letters but could not read English.
And that was 20 years ago and Yuma had accommodated the illegals but now we are expected to put everything in Spanish for them? I just don’t feel it is necessary for the government to bend over backwards to accommodate the illegals when the illegals are not willing to bend over backwards to learn English.
A big difference some of y’all might not be seeing. When you TRAVEL to another country to visit, you should not have to learn the full language. Some key phrases would be helpful.
However if you MOVE to another country, it is your burden to learn the language.
Crap, even in France, if you are a tourist, they look down their shitty long noses at you.
F#$%* the French !!!!!
Only if they shower first.
SolDevVB:
“F#$%* the French !!!!!”
Too late- they already are.
The correct phrase might be: “Bush’em and feed ‘em fish heads!”
“To get a Kansas DL, you must be able to recognize the direction of the sign based on the SHAPE of the sign.”
BS clarkie, you must be able to understand and domprehend the “instructions of the traffic control devices”. You are talking out your arse.
“Technically, no one can get a DL in Kansas if they cannot read and understand the highway and street signs.”
My point is made…….
Why do illegals need to be taken out of the loop? Because in Oklahoma 7 illegal aliens being smuggler were killed in a crash on icy roads, and 5 were injured. ONe is in custody of ICE because of smuggling illegal aliens. Comprehending english would have let them know that the road was ICY, RIGHT!
They knew it was ICY and there are 7 people dead, beacuse we are not enforcing the immigration laws. Those people should have NEVER BEEN IN THE COUNTRY. SOme mule from Mexico just doesn’t understand I guess about icy roads, he obviously need instructions in Spanish.
THis is absurd folks It is time to take our state and our country back form illegal aliens and illegal alien syncophants and supporters.
YOU illegal alien supporters are selling your children’s future down the river.
If attracting tourists to our great state is a pillar of the overall eco-devo plan, shouldn’t the traffic control signs be the so-called “international” ones, that are understood by all? Thus, if the DL test can be read, the questions thereon relating to such signs may be answered by anyone who recognizes what the signs mean, irrespective of the native language of the examinee; however, the other questions might prove a bit more difficult.
Reading this debate from a country where English is the official language of government and commerce… and nobody STILL understands a damn word I say… puts a whole new perspective on this.Making English an “official” langauge– without offering any money to pay for more ESL classes–is just another unfunded government mandate.
“Comprehending english would have let them know that the road was ICY, RIGHT!”
Was there a highway sign in English that said the road was icy?
Ice is pretty much a universal language. English speaking American driver slide on icy roads into oncoming traffic all the time. I seriously doubt that the issue in OK was due to the fact that the driver was Spanish speaking.
It was all about a bad driver.
I wish the US would go to International Road Signs. Also, I wish that the standards for obtaining a driver’s license was similar to those in Germany. It is not easy and requires comprehensive study and formal driver’s training.
Now if we can just convince the Germans that driving at unlimited speeds is not good for their health. :)
YES, WE NEED AN OFFICAL LANGUAGE. If we don’t need this bill, why are we teaching English as a second language to children who speak Spanish???? I went to school with a great number of Mexicans and they all spoke English. They were proud to be an American and their families came here legally. They have kept their traditions, but became Americans in all other ways just like the Irish, Polish, Germans and others when coming to American. We can not afford the illegals who refuse to learn English.
SÍ, NECESITAMOS UNA LENGUA DE OFFICAL!
I thought I would put that in Jane in case Spanish readers couldn’t understand English. :)
For the “Freedom freak”
“THE MOST UNAMERICAN WRONG THING POSTED ON THIS BLOG EVER! EVER EVER EVER EVER!!!$@#% “excuse me sir, we need to see your papers.”"
Why we do the same thing to every CITIZEN motorist in check lanes for drunk drivers. Why do we only enforce rules ie drunk driving , on legal citizens. Driving a car is not a right and the MAN can ask for your DL and require validation if that DL is legal.
You freak are a total idiot.
“I went to school with a great number of Mexicans and they all spoke English.”
That is correct and the current crop of illegals have no desire to learn the language and no desire to assimmilate. THESE new ones are NOT PROUD to be American, they are Proud NOT to be American, but proud of MExican, El Salvador, Nicaragua, etc.
I spent the weekend in jail with a guy from El Salvador, Jose Luna.We got to be pretty good friends after that and I always called himJoe Moon.That’s about all I can add here.Oh, and I speak fluent redneck.
I will vote for English as the official state language. Brownlee thinks English is not threatened and that the Hispanic cultures ‘knows’ they need to learn English, is a soft hearted way of playing nice.I contend we pass the law now while it seems meaningless rather than wait until it becomes a serious issue and we get our hands tied by the Hispanic community. Is it racist to deam an official language?
Tracy,who would arrest a softy life you?
I did not learn to speak English correctly until I was nine years old.Noooo!! I am not a foreigner; I am just a mix of every other nationality of the world and was born deaf and hard of hearing.It is bad enough trying to understand my own country’s main language and now I have to start all over with trying to understand someone else’s language.Now why would I have to learn someone else’s language?Well for one reason, good communication skills is a good reason to achieving an understanding of another person and it is very important to be able to do this because someday it might mean the difference between life and death.I am for the bill, it is very important to have a foundation to build from and I am a strong believer in responsibilities and accountabilities, I will not accept excuses from our political system’s ineptness and laziness to remedy a solution.Remember these are foreigners, they have invited themselves and imposed themselves here and an accommodation is a two way road.
If you want to weigh the benefits of being bi-lingual and/or learning multiple languages, consider the following article, recently published in Reuters:
January 13, 2007
HEADLINE: “”Being bilingual can delay onset of dementia
Study: Keeping parts of brain active can stave off Alzheimer’s up to 4 years
“OTTAWA, Canada – People who are fully” bilingual and speak both languages every day for most of their lives can delay the onset of dementia by up to four years compared with those who only know one language, Canadian scientists said Friday”
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16611042/
Cool, I already speak Canadian!
The question is not whether learning multiple languages is benefitial or not, but as to whether we should be forced to learn it to communicate with those that illegally join our country.
I’m all for making English the official language as long as it’s proper English.
Then we can lock up all who think the apostrophe is the proper way to turn a noun into a plural. Let’s bring back the chain gang and sentence everyone who says something like, “then I seen the tornado dip down into the trailer park” to 20 years hard labor. If someone writes there when it should be their or they’re; 90 days in the pokey.
When politicians or sportscasters spew out a phrase such as, “this is a good thing for he and his family,” the language police will crack down and haul them off to Lansing. Misuse of its and it’s will carry the death penalty.
Can we lock up people who use the word pokey?!?!?
AFN,
We are a free nation, so no one will be forcing you to learn another language. But if you want to improve your monetary returns on your company learn other languages. Encourage your children to do the same.
Just remember: if you don’t want to get Alzheimer’s learn a new language to communicate with others humans. Besides, many wars can be prevented, when we learn to reach out to other humans.
I lived in Europe, and most Europeans know three or four languages, and aren’t as narrow minded, like middle America.
By the way, my son who is in middle school is learning Chinese. When he grows up he’ll be able to corner the market while your kids will be stuck in Kansas.
Trading with China and other cultures is the future and your children need to progress so that they can save what’s left of this great nation. Don’t get stuck in the past.
No AFN,
Unless they invoke “Hokey” and “Pokey” in the same sentence.
Platypus, if you had bothered to pull your head out of your @$$ and read my previous posts, you would know that I am very interested in learning multiple languages and I see many benefits of doing that. My point was that we shouldn’t be forced, by people illegally entering our country, to learn other languages to communicate with them. If they want to shop, learn in our schools, get a job, then they can learn english too – just as if I moved to another country, I would be expected to learn their language if I wanted to survive there. And by the way, you don’t know shit about me so don’t tell me that my kids will be stuck in KS while yours are kissing the Chinese’ asses and don’t tell me to get out of the past.
Wow, you sound very angry. I see you speak crude English–I must have struck a cord, there, somewhere….goody for me!
I’ll tell you what;I won’t tell your kids, if you don’t force the illegals to talk to you. My experience has been, most illegals speak broken English and they do everthing they can to blend in so they won’t be deported.
When I travel to Latin America, most of those who work in the hotel and retailer industry speak English, and even French. I’m impressed that they know how to earn a dollar.
I can care less if my son ‘kisses’ the Chinese, as long as he makes six figures and continues to make Wall Street numero uno in the world.Meanwhile your kids will be stuck in a rural farm in Kansas, somewhere, just like that idiot –what’s his name–who killed Jodi.
I’m angry because you seem to think you know me, my family, and my level of education and surprise, surprise you don’t. And just because the employees in some hotel in Latin America speak English, doesn’t mean that the majority of the population in that country would be willing to deal with you if you don’t speak their language. I’m not even from KS, so the chances of my kids being here are slim but even if they were still here working at a McDonalds for $6/hour, I’d be happy that they weren’t snobs making 6 figures on Wall Street like your kid will apparently be.
By the way, I have never heard of any illegal forcing anyone in this country to speak Spanish to them.
AFN, can you give us an incident that you experienced when an illegal ‘forced’ you to speak spanish to him?
I’m waiting.
I never said I was forced by an illegal to speak Spanish. I said that we (as a state/nation) shouldn’t be forced to change our signs and etc just because some of them refuse to learn English.
Screw all illegals!They do not deserve anything. They are here “Illegal”. Screw them.
Platypuss,(sp.?, he he)I think it is great that immigrants use broken english to communicate with us. The problem is that once there are 151,000,000 of these immigrants…they will no longer give a shit about broken english…they will push for Spanish this/Spanish that…..Let’s cover our asses now.AFN is the man.
“By the way, I have never heard of any illegal forcing anyone in this country to speak Spanish to them.AFN, can you give us an incident that you experienced when an illegal ‘forced’ you to speak spanish to him? I’m waiting. “Posted by: Platypus | January 18, 2007 at 03:39 PM
Well, not exactly, but do you remember the Philly Cheese Steak Restaurant Owner who put up a sign that said No English, No Service or something to that effect.http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-06-09-cheesesteak-english_x.htm
It created a firestorm of outrage of those who wanted to impose their will on the restaurant owner who didn’t budge.
Even a local Politician got involved, it’s in the content of that article and its linked articles. :)
Who says one must be a snob to earn 6 figures?
I know plenty of successful people who are well mannered, well to do, and don’t express themselves crudely, even when they’re mad.
I also know many children of immigrants who would love to make 6 figures one day, and be part of generation Next, and continue to make this country a success.
And if you think McDonalds is a high aspiration for your progeny, well, then, there’s not much hope for your legacy. that’s ok. Your kids, can leave the 6 figure jobs and opportunities for the children of immigrants, who have always made this nation great.
By the way control your anger. It is very toxic to your health.
Hmmm…maybe you’re defensive and angry because you never had the opportunity to learn and master another language.
I’m fluent in two languages, and can read and translate in a speed of a blink. So, if this country ever went to bi-lingual signs, I wouldn’t be threatened by following directions in other languages.
Proven fact: If you try learning a new language, and then learn to translate into English, your brain will create more neurons speed up as you get older, in leu of becoming senile.
I’ve traveled throughout Latin America and Europe many times, and most speak English, even the poorest of Mexicans will make attempts to speak it to me. There’s no harm in knowing more than one language. Do not be afraid of learning new things. It might save you from getting dementia.
Take runway 1-4-0
Que?
Take runway 1-4-0
Que?
Oh my ….explosions heard, carnage ensues.
English is the official language of Air Traffic Control worldwide as well.
Yep asbestos, I knew, but couldn’t resist the joke concept of politically correct assertions. :)
Platypus is a jacka$$ and pulls your chain there AFN.
AFN all VERY GOOD POINTS and you whipped Platypus in the intellict dept. and in reasoned agrgument.
Commendationa all around for you AFN.
A Raspberry for paltypus.
This country is so frigging goofy about immigration that if we wait another decade to ‘discuss’ a national language…the politicians will puss out and this nation will get stuck into the 3rd world toilet which is what all our friendly immigrants from Mexico are causing us
JM,
I did get it, but some do not know THIS actually happened in Sout America. The pilots were speaking only spanish and so was the tower, problem is in air traffic control, there are some American English words that simply do not exist in the “third world volcabulary” of some of these countries.
That is an additional problem with these illegal yahoos, they usually do not know one whit about what them are doing.
I surely would not buy a new house, the contractors hire these third worlders to build our western houses. That is why they fall apart and mold and leak water. CHEAP UNEDUCATED ILLEGAL ALIEN LABOR.
BUY KANSAS first, and EMPLOY KANSANS, then ONLY THEN HIRE AMERICANS! BOYCOTT ILLEGAL ALIEN EMPLOYERS!!!
I think this bill is a good thing. My arguement to all of you that American’s are close minded for not wanting to learn another language is this:
This is an English speaking country, and has been from it’s inception (yeah, they stole it from the Native Americans and if you really want to get nitty-gritty, we should all speak Native American languages relative to our geographical location, but for the sake of arguement, let’s leave that for another time). If I WANT to learn another language for my own personal purposes, then by all means that should not be a problem. But I shouldn’t HAVE to learn another language. (and BTW platypus, I work in a service industry and I have had MANY instances where a customer has become angry and/or offended because I do not speak Spanish and cannot assist them) Next point of arguement – everyone who says America is behind the times because we are not a bi-lingual country like most other countries… Okay, I get your point. Here’s mine. English is the language of business. These other countries learn their nations primary language AND ENGLISH in an attempt to allow them to easily communicate with ANY OTHER COUNTRY becuase, AGAIN, ENGLISH is the language of business. In a nation whose primary language is ENGLISH, and which is comprised of mostly Immigrants from hundreds of other nations who speak hundreds of other languages, who gets to decide what the second language this country learns is? If we mandate Spanish, how fair is that to those who speak French, or Irish, or German, or for that matter, Swahili? Why doesn’t their language get to be our secondary language?
I took french in high school and college. i do not consider myself bilingual, but I have made an effort to learn another language. It wasn’t Spanish, because Spanish did not interest me as French did. I shouldn’t now have to learn Spanish to communicate with people who have come to this country to LIVE when this is an English speaking country. Now, my son will learn Spanish, because it is part of his heritage and he has many extended family members whose primary language is Spanish. But he doesn’t have to, because all of these family members speak very clear english, and made a concerted effort to learn English when they immigrated here (legally I might add) But i am encouraging him to learn Spanish because it is part of his heritage and I think that is important.
VERY good Wendy! I remember in the late 70’s and early 80’s that we were all to learn Japanese because ot the juggernaut growth on economy in Japan.
I think the same thing is happening with the illegals, as they are overrunning our country and state’s.
And Platypus is an unsophisticated straight line liberal left winger that hates America. THe illegals are also for the most part unsophisticated. Last week there was the LaRaza Head honcho bitching that the American culture was “degrading” and “corrupting” the latinos that are coming here illegally!! THE HYPOCRACY. If you illegal alien supporters cannot see what is going on you are blind, clueless and stupid.
Wake up, you are trashing this country … and your Children’s future.
“Who says one must be a snob to earn 6 figures?”
I never said that one must be a snob to make 6 figures, but you yourself said, “I can care less if my son ‘kisses’ the Chinese, as long as he makes six figures and continues to make Wall Street numero uno in the world.” If making money is all you care about, you’re a snob. I know it’s hard to recognize when you look in the mirror, but trust me, it’s there:)
“Proven fact: If you try learning a new language, and then learn to translate into English, your brain will create more neurons speed up as you get older, in leu of becoming senile.”
Once again, you are arguing mute points. I am not threatened by learning multiple languages and I myself would like and plan on learning many languages. There are many benefits to becoming bilingual.
“And if you think McDonalds is a high aspiration for your progeny, well, then, there’s not much hope for your legacy.”
Once again, I don’t care how much money my kids make, as long as they are happy. And by the way, to go back to the you don’t know anything about me point, I don’t even have kids and I don’t know if I ever will. You are assuming you know me by the things that I write.
“AFN is the man.”
Thank you and although it really doesn’t matter, just a point of FYI, I’m a woman…
“Platypus is a jacka$$ and pulls your chain there AFN.
AFN all VERY GOOD POINTS and you whipped Platypus in the intellict dept. and in reasoned agrgument.
Commendationa all around for you AFN.
A Raspberry for paltypus.”
I agree that he’s a jackass, but I’m actually starting to feel very sorry for him right… And as for the whipping, thank you for saying so:)
I have to admit that I didn’t know that thing about the air traffic control, that is very interesting…
Some of you folks just need to get over yourselves. No one is forcing you to speak Spanish. No one is making you read the label that is written in Spanish AND English. No one is forcing you to converse in Spanish. No one is making you do anything except maybe “push one for English.”
Your kids will not HAVE to learn Spanish. The USA is not turning into Mexico North. No one is going to take your dollars out of your wallet and force you to pay for goods and services with pesos.
When you walk up tomorrow or next moth or next year or in 2050, the USA will still be a primarily English speaking country. No one will have died from Spanish exposure. No one will be hospitalized for bilingualitis. No one will have been institutionalized for a hispanic generated stroke.
For God’s sake, just press one and get over yourself. It’s just a few words in a foreign language.
The world is not coming to an end.
Many years ago my wife related to me about a recent Japanese immigrant she had met on the bush in LA. He worked up the courage to ask her if he could practice English with her on the daily commute. He was learning the language and wanted to do it right. So, every day on the way to work, they worked on his pronunciation. She told me his English was already good but he still wasn’t satisfied with himself.
I am certain that he is now a fine citizen and contributor to our country. Yes, English matters.
Asbestos,
Thank you for agreeing with me, but I have to take offense to some of your statements. I don’t consider myself left, I do consider myself middle of the road. I think turning this into a political party line debate is wrong. I know many hardcore Democrats who believe just as stringently that illegal immigration is wrong and that illegal immigrants SHOULD NOT be granted all of these rights that are being proposed. They also don’t hate america, but in fact, love america. So much so that they are willing to stand up for it’s best interests (or at least what they perceive as it’s best interests) in debates such as these. You know, I think if we were to leave party lines out of all these debates, we might actually find ourselves agreeing with people we would otherwise automatically discount because of their political affiliation. You shouldn’t assume someones party based on what they say unless they flat come out and say that they consider themselves Democrat or Republican or Libertarian or Independent or what have you…
But Clark you’re wrong. There are many jobs out there insisting on bilingual.
Foreign language requirements for school, when the only one offered in school is spanish?
And yes, I’ve also had clients angry when we don’t understand their language.
I’m all for making English the official language as long as it’s proper English.
Then we can lock up all who think the apostrophe is the proper way to turn a noun into a plural. Let’s bring back the chain gang and sentence everyone who says something like, “then I seen the tornado dip down into the trailer park” to 20 years hard labor. If someone writes there when it should be their or they’re; 90 days in the pokey.
When politicians or sportscasters spew out a phrase such as, “this is a good thing for he and his family,” the language police will crack down and haul them off to Lansing. Misuse of its and it’s will carry the death penalty.
(Wendy, you’re Death Row material.)
Not to be hypercritical, P Mom, but there are many jobs that require specialized skills. For some jobs, it may be a CPA or an engineering degree or a language skill. It’s just part of the job market.
Personally, I am still learning, at age 54, to speak English. Having grown up in Detroit, however, I can speak a little French, since Detroit was originally a French settlement. I can even pronounce “Gratiot” with out a smile. (The word is the name of a major north-south hiway in SE Michigan.)
The bid to make English the official, and thereby only, language of the USA may fall victim to the Law of Unintended Consequences.
English only may futher isolate Hispanic immigrants, legal or otherwise, leading a greater series of problems for society as a whole.
Seriously, we all need to step back and take a deep breath, in English OR Spanish and let cooler heads prevail.
There is room on the planet for people that speak many different languages.
Until Kansas had passed the conceal/carry law, I had no idea that almost all of the states already had it. I was in the dark.
Does anyone know how many states have passed an English Only law?
WSC – if “yo’uns’ grew up in Michigan you do NOT speak English!
You’re right, Ben, I speak Detroit, eh!
wendy-You consider yourself “middle of the road”.Please tell us if there is anything on the Republican side that you agree with.Gun Control, abortion, the war, welfare, death penalty, anything.
Fleetwood,
check this link out, shows a map and the various states English or English Plus laws:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English-only_movement
Thank you, JM. Looks like over half the country.Does this make the eagle, again, and the rest of the Libs, again, out of the main stream?
“English only may futher isolate Hispanic immigrants, legal or otherwise, leading a greater series of problems for society as a whole.”
The hispanics are isolating themselves BY RACE, by supporting illegal activity namely illegal entry and employment and tacet support of identity theft.
Hispanic Americans that support the rights of America as a country have nothing to fear from tightening down illegal immigration or the requirements of language. They are after all citizens. The problem is the illegals, not the hispanic citizens.
Hispanic citizens must stand up for America FIRST, BEFORE RACE, and BEFORE ALLIGENCE TO COUNTRY OF ORIGIN. This is the same problem/arugument with muslims, as they need to denounce and fight the radical illegal factions of their own group, and show alligence to their country that gives them the religious freedom, and not allegiance first to the Koran. (Fundamentalist Christians need to learn that too as in the ID/CREO proponents.)
“There is room on the planet for people that speak many different languages.”
Clarkie, THAT is not the question or topic of the thread. DUH! THe world already speaks many languages, however the topic and the legislation is KANSAS you dip!
TRY, just TRY to stay on topic once.
Did you miss your medicine again, Asbestos?
Try to think through this, Ass.
Not all individuals in the United States that speak Spanish as a first language are ILLEGAL aliens.
Think that one through for a minute.
Okay…..
There are American citizens that only speak English as a second language.
It is not for you to judge as to why or how they only speak English as a second language.
So, why is it so damned offensive that various public signage or documents or label on soup cans are in a language other than English?
To refresh your memory – the thread was about language, not about illegal aliens.
So Asbestos, try to stay on topic for once.
A couple of years ago, I was at the annual skool meeting/open house that should have taken an hour. It took two hours. That’s what happens when the speech by the principal takes an hour (in English), but is translated into Spanish after every paragraph. My time was being wasted and I didn’t care for it.The next year, I vowed to myself that I would walk out if it happened again, but, instead, the meeting was split into two groups (English and Spanish speakers) and the meeting took one hour.I call that enabling the Spanish speakers to avoid having to learn the language and I’m not a big fan of it.”The melting pot has stopped melting”.
“but, instead, the meeting was split into two groups (English and Spanish speakers) and the meeting took one hour.”
That is called “dividing our country”.
Those yahoos need to learn english.
And CLarkie, you are just a pure idiot.
“To refresh your memory – the thread was about language, not about illegal aliens.”
Unh, YEAH, but that is the reason why so many require spanish. They come here igonring our laws, and then ignore our culture, and then ignore language.
These are the weak of Mexico and the other places. They should have stayed in their own country and made it better, rather than coming to America by their own invitation illegally, and then expect us to conform to their shortcomings of humanity and culture and “cultural maturity”.
And we are supposed to bend over backwards for them and accomidate all their little infirmaties AFTER they invite themselves in and demand us to give them money aid and rights.
That is wearing a little thin and wearing out American Hospitality.
Look at the WIKI map that someone posted here, it is the wave of the future. IF the Feds aren’t going to do what is necessary, then the states can and WILL.
And again Clarkie old boy you are an idiot.
Get over yourself, Ass. When you are in the check out line at Wal Mart, and those Hispanic looking people behind you in line are talking amongst themselves, think about it….
They ain’t talking about you, Asbestos!
They could care less about you! Don’t be so freakin’ paranoid!
Jeez!
The thread is about language, not illegal aliens. As I said, NOT ALL people that speak English only as a second language are illegal aliens.
Is that REAL hard to understand?
Let’s try again and I will shout for your benefit.
PEOPLE PREFER TO SPEAK IN THEIR PRIMARY LANGUAGE. MANY LEGAL (YES, LEGAL) IMMIGRANTS ONLY SPEAK ENGLISH AS A SECOND LANGUAGE. IT DOES NOT HURT YOU TO HEAR FOREIGN LANGUAGES! THE SIGNS WON’T HURT YOU! THE LABELS WON’T HURT YOU!
THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT ILLEGAL ALIENS!
IT IS NOT EVEN ABOUT HISPANIC/SPANISH SPEAKING PEOPLE!
Get over yourself, Asbestos. Believe it or not, you are just not that important.
You are now a raving lunatic there clarkie. Your chain has been pulled! LOL!
How does payback feel?
They can go ahead and speak swahili for all I care behind me in line- as long as when they get up to the checkout- they can speak english to the lady trying to help them rather than expect her to figure it out through interpretive dance.
Asbestos, you are a loser of major proportions.
You went on and on and on about illegal aliens, even though the thread is about English as a first language, not about illegal aliens.
Undoubtedly, Asbestos, you are the Bob Dornan of the English First movement.
I had an Aunt that was born in America, lived in America for decades, all of her life, but spoke German as her first language.
The English First folks would have (had) her deported, even though she was an American through and through.
Give it up, Asbestos.
Not everyone that speaks a language other than English as their primary language is an illegal immigrant.
Stay on point, Asbestos, it won’t hurt you.
I remember that night when my then girlfriend and I walked in her apartment and found three Hispanics burglarizing her.We try to communicate but one of them got real angry pull out a knife and stabbed me in the stomach when he ran out.I did not know what he was saying because he was speaking Spanish and I do not know if he could understand me since I only speak English.This is one of the reasons as why I have said in my previous post that it is very important to have a foundation of what language.Another poster asked, “Are we being force to learn another language?”The Answer is YES – WE ARE!
So we need to require that all buglars speak English? Huh?
Sorry, but if they are breaking and entering your home (or your girlfriends home) they probably will not be infuenced by an English only law.
Buglars rarely pay any attention to language laws. They really don’t pay any attention to any law.
wiseman-Too bad you didn’t have a gun to protect yourself.
“Undoubtedly, Asbestos, you are the Bob Dornan of the English First movement.”
Clarkie, what a NICE thing to say. Thank You.
“I remember that night when my then girlfriend and I walked in her apartment and found three Hispanics burglarizing her.We try to communicate but one of them got real angry pull out a knife and stabbed me in the stomach when he ran out.”
They already commuicated with you, and that was “we do not respect or acknowledge your rights of possession or of privacy”. You should have shot him where he stood. The criminal was obviously threatening you with potentially deadly force.
So Clarkie, what do you think the odds of that criminal was hispanic citizen or an illegal alien> My bet would be illegal alien and it is the problem we will have more and more ir the economy slides and jobs dry up.
Wiseman – LE always recommends that you promptly leave if you suspect that an intruder is in your home. You are lucky that you were just stabbed. They could have killed your girlfriend and raped you. Consider yourself lucky.
Asbestos – Comparing anyone to Bob Dornan is not a compliment. After Dornan lost his House seat, he had to be told to leave the Capitol building by Republican (former) collegues because he apparently did not REALIZE that he no longer held office.
Let’s see, Asbestos. Twelve million illegal aliens – three hundred American citizens – half of the illegal aliens are working (male works, wife stays home taking care of jr.) – that would be two percent.
Or 2%.
Or not a whole freakin’ lot.
Remember, your hero George W Bush said that the illegals are taking the jobs Americans WON’T do.
So which jobs are drying up?
And how is the economy sliding?
Your George Boy said that the economy is doing great, better than it has been since Reagan.
So, what is the issue?
Did you see the inflation report today? Bush is doing something right.
If Bush was playing shortstop and batting ninth for the Nationals, he still would suck.
He still can’t field a routine grounder and is batting about 0.010.
“half of the illegal aliens are working (male works, wife stays home taking care of jr.) – that would be two percent.”
YOU are out of touch. If you knew any illegals you know that BOTH work and work possibly 2 jobs each minimum at the paltry wages they get (barter for). The kids usually are not even watched or are watched by a grandmother or other extended family. THAT is the demographic.
ANd 2% taking services and usually are the poorest that we end up paying disproportianately for because they are in poverty and are literally stealing from our American Citizens.
ALL the while we have to have all the calling cards of entitlements in spanish because this group of refuse invited themselves into our country. ANd we have to have school districts spend additional dollars to teach their kids in spanish in our public schools (again with the low wages and cash these yahoos are paid they do not pay any taxes in comparision to the aid they receive).
This takes money away from American Citizen Children in school being robbed becasue of illegalactivities and it results in duplicate classes being MANDATED to be taught in English and spanish.
YOu are the clueless one there Clarkie yahoo!
“If Bush was playing shortstop and batting ninth for the Nationals, he still would suck.
He still can’t field a routine grounder and is batting about 0.010.”
ws-I suspect that you thought that was quite clever when you hit “send”.
So, since we have switched topic to illegal aliens rather than the English language, as was the original topic of the thread, why does your George Boy want to extend amnesty to illegal aliens?
But the thread was about language – so why are you deviating from topic, Asbestos?
Bush is an idiot when it comes to the illegal issue.
Learn to live with illegals, they pay taxes and never seek refunds. The Gooberment will never get rid of them. Free money for the Gooberment.
Illegals do pay sales tax. Other taxes, not so much.
This is not about language, it is about racism. I don’t see anyone clamoring to build a wall to keep out Canadians. This is interesting since several of the 9/11 terrorists came here through Canada. The illegal immigrants are not taking American jobs, corrupt and greedy corporations are exporting the good jobs. I don’t see much outrage here for that. The real issue is that brown people are coming here and some white people want to use this as a way to scare and whip up emotions.
Of course, brenda. How many millions of illegal Canadians are in this country?
Fleetwood, I do have guns but it was at a time when a citizen is not legal to carry.WSClark, things are not that easy, the moment you open your door then you are face to face to the intruders, sometimes you are not given that opportunity to suspect anything, you would be very surprise how fast things can happen and a language barrier does not help any situation.
I am not in favor of anything that gives comfort to these invaders. And that is what they are. Job stealing invaders.
I’ll tell you why they need to learn the language AND why they need to go home.
The other night I saw a car stuck in the ice/slush. As always, I went to help.
I was sorta sorry I did. It turned out to be an older hispanic woman and a young kid. Maybe her grandson. Had I known they were illegals I would have not helped them. Clearly, they are not up to dealing with our weather.
Anywho, I was committed so I tried to help. Well it is difficult to give instruction to a person who speaks NO English and a kid who can only loosely translate. What is the Mex word for “rock it!”? She wasn’t good with hand signals either.
Well eventually, a couple of African Americans stopped and helped and we got the illegals on their way. Without me and the other help? Those two would likely have been there a very long time.
SO clearly these folks are not adapted to our weather or our language. They need to go home and fix their own country.
JR,How do you know they were illegal?Did you just assume that they were? I knew a nurse who is as American as I am. She speaks perfect English and is very uppercrust. Yet she was stopped by a policeman who kept insisting on seeing her green card. She was outraged and insulted and there is nothing other than the color of her skin that would have led the policeman to believe she was illegal.I’m tired of hearing about all the jobs that illegals take from us. I have yet to have a glut of white people clamoring to be hired for the jobs in my facility in housekeeping, laundry, and dietary. It is almost completely minorities that apply. To be honest Hispanics are the best workers and do the best job. So maybe people hire Hispanics because they do the best job. There are more white people on welfare than minorities so you guys are blowing smoke up my butt!!
Hire illegals do ya Brenda?
IF and I say if you do you should be severly disciplined.
My story? I say it is good odds that a 50ish woman who speaks no English other than “help” and “thank you” is illegal.
And you insult Americans. Americans are perfectly willing to work when they are paid and treated fairly.
YES Brenda DO TELL where is it that you work? SOunds like a hospital or an assisted living center.
HEY ICE, CHECK OUT THE HOSPITAL AND ASSISTED LIVING LAUNDRY AND ENVIRONMENTAL SERVICES FOR HIRING OF ILLEGALS!!!
Thank you for the tip there Brenda, we will be reporting that to ICE through the Miniuteman network that we have.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
“Americans are perfectly willing to work when they are paid and treated fairly.
ABSOLUTELY JR, good comeback.
Sorry, J R, not every immigrant is applying for citizenship. Some are on temp visas, etc. Just because someone does not speak English does not mean that they are an illegal immigrant from Mexico.
I have been to Chinese restuarants when the hostess could barely understand a word I said. Was she an illegal alien? I doubt it.
We need to get past assuming that any Spanish speaking person is an illegal alien.
Life is too short to allow this trend to continue.
Jeez, J R, is this really the company you want to keep? Asbestos?
I’m so SICK of the majority of linguistic illiterates saying that English should be the only national language in US!! One of the posters asks why he should have to find where it’s written in English. I would say that if he can’t tell which language is English,then he’s obviously retarded; this may sound offensive, but think about it; With Spanish,French,and German, for example, they have accent marks, umlauts, etc., whereas English does not. Therefore, the poster, or any individual who can’t immediately see this should question why they’re bothering to complain, when they can’t even recognize their own language!!!!Secondly, in Europe, it’s common to be mutli lingual, and granted this isn’t Europe,the United States has been and is still known to be a land of immigrants.How easy is it for the average American to learn a second language? I can say with absolute certainty, that most Americans are linguistically illiterate. I say this because anytime someone is speaking Spanish, many people automatically assume that they’re Mexican, which would be likened to saying that all english speakers are British, or Australian,which is clearly not the case.America is a good country, with opprotunities, but it’s no wonder we’re considered “ugly americans” with our ethnocentric attitudes, lack of decorum, and unwillingness to be a multilingual country.I myself,have studied six languages, currently speak three, and will soon be able to speak six, if not eight in the next two years.In summary, could it not be, that those who are so against multi lingualism, feel this way, not because of the principal of being mono lingual, but because they truly are too anasephalic to learn any more than the abhorrent form of english that they currently speak???
Brenda, at the nursing home I worked at, not a one was a minority. And they paid better than the average nursing home too.
So it’s not that there are people who won’t do the job. That’s no excuse.
Keeping company with ASBESTOS? On this issue? Yes. WS? A nation that is outsourcing jobs at all skill levels and IMPORTING low/no skill laborers in the millions is a nation that cannot survive as a democracy. It will degenerate first to a feudal and then in violence to a socialist state.
I have never knowingly hired an illegal. But I completely disagree that there are “many” Americans that what to work for what I can afford to pay them. I have been hiring for years and I have discovered that a lot of Americans are in love with the concept of work but not the actual thing. Today was a perfect example. We had a young white woman who did not show up for her shift. She had given her 2 week notice but obviously her word means nothing because she chose to not fulfill the notice. This same woman was in my office for weeks begging me to give her a job and told me how bad she wanted to work for our facility. She didn’t even make it a month. And this kind of thing happens all the time. However, I’ve found that the Hispanics that have worked for me over the years rarely do these kind of things. They are much more grateful for their job and perform much better. Why are you assuming because they are Hispanic that they are illegal? I am sick of the many white people in this country that think they are too good to do hard work. I grew up doing anything I could to earn money and when I got tired of menial labor jobs that didn’t pay enough I got off my butt and went to college. Now I earn a very good living. I was just as disavantaged as anyone could be so I have no time for lazy white people. On any given day if you are white you have an advantage over any minority. I still believe this is really about race.
What “abhorrent form of english” do we currently speak?
There is nothing wrong with us who wish to make a universal language in America. I’m not against multi-culturalism, as long as all of the cultures asimilate into our culture as well.
But you bring up a good point Brianna, which type of Spanish would be the kind we should all learn? Peruvian? Brazillian? Spanish? Guatamalan?
Sorry J R. On this point you are wrong. You assumed that the person in question was an illegal alien. You did not consider that she was very distressed, you did not consider that she was far more comfortable with her primary language.
I helped a man and his daughter when they were stuck on the ice the other day. The man, the driver, could not seem to understand that mashing the gas pedal did not help the situation. If fact, he did not seem to understand much of anything. Finally, with additional help, we got him moving despite his lack of linguistic skills.
Was he an illegal alien?
Probably not, he was a white man.
Brenda you cannot tell me you don’t have good American aides working for you that don’t work their asses off every single day.
And if you don’t, then you’re certainly not hiring the right people.
And we had such a nice beginning Brenda….
I THINK you just called me a bigot.
Far from it. I’m an American. I concern myself with the improvement of MY country.
It is the duty of Mexicans to concern themselves with making THEIR country better.
SINCE you called me a bigot. Well I gotta fire back.
You Brenda are an exploiter. You concern yourself with employing the people that will make you the most money.
“I have never knowingly hired illegals”
Well that’s pretty vague. How hard to you look into backgrounds?
An American woman begged you for a job for SIX WEEKS?
Are you just indecisive or do you take some perverse pleasure in being begged for employment?
And I AM sorry, but after that last I have to wonder just what sort of employer you are.
Like you friend Mary, it seems you have developed a pretty high hill to sit on.
Brianna,
Europe is unique in that the countries that speak foreign languages could fit inside the boundaries of one our larger states.
We only have two border countries, Canada and Mexico.
The French speaking Canadians know English as well as French.
The Hispanic Mexicans that come here illegally are a problem. Those Mexicans who come on work visas, I have no problem with.
I lived in Europe for 8 years. The Germans would simply not tolerate millions of illegal immigrants coming across their border. They would be rounded up and ejected very quickly.
Of course, no one has brought up all the various Native American languages we have. Ranging from Alaska/Hawaii to the Texas border. They always get excluded from the debate. :)
By the way, Hawaiian, I believe is part of the dual language base authorized by the state Hawaii.
We also have Amish communites where dialects of German are spoken. There a few different German dialects in Kansas as well.
Louisiana has a high tolerance and legal acceptance for the French Acadian dialect spoken there as Cajun.
Then there is the infamous Tex-Mex, spoken in Texas which is part Spanish, part Native American and part English. Some call it Spanglish.
There also several Portuguese communties in the US. They call them Luso-Americans.
Ever been to Chicago? There are massive numbers of Polish speakers in Chicago.
How about New York City? There are huge numbers of Italian spekaing peoples all along the eastern seaboard.
How about Russian? There are Russian Communities in California and other places.
Then there are the far east dialects, I can’t even begin to count.
And what makes us tick as a country is a common language, English.
It makes us be able to communicate in our transportation, industry, commerce, banking, medical, scientific and other things.
Also, there are no universal translators out there that I know. This isn’t Star Trek. So, we do the best we can by adhering to a common language English.
Multicultural US? You bet! We got more languages here than you can shake a stick at. :)
“…for what I can afford to pay them.”
Now that is the honest answer there Brenda. You won’t pay a wage that an American will do, but you pay sub American wages and expect the same level of work? What a boss and “biness” whiz you are. Look Brenda dear, exploiting a desperate human being for slave wages is NOT a sound business plan nor is it moral high ground. You should be ashamed of what you do.
No wonder you are pro illegal alien, you need them to pay slave wages, or your “biness” will fail.
Yeah, I do get you know, you are not in it for the Illegal alien, you are there to exploit to fill your pockets at the illegal alien’s expense and the American Citizen’s expense.
Quite the community and business leader we have in you Brenda dear!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
“I have never knowingly hired an illegal.”
Well you dip, that is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to “find out”. You can do so by visiting the Social Security Website and you can check your people for legality. That is the good thing about American Citizens, they can prove it, without you having to go to Social Security to check and all the time and expense in doing that.
You dear lady afe full of it! I wouldn’t work for an ass like you either!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Clarkie idiot says:
“Sorry J R. On this point you are wrong. You assumed that the person in question was an illegal alien.”
ANd you asshole assume that they aren’t, and YOU are probably statistically WRONG there clarkie!
Pmom,I didn’t say that I don’t have any. But I will tell you that I have a growing number of minorities, Hispanic, African, and Middle Eastern that are more dependable and consistent. They are often also in college so this will not be their way of life. I have tried many times to help my American staff improve their lot in life through education but they give up much more often than those that many of you want to throw out of the country. Maybe they come with more baggage and many of them have made poor choices which has kept them from reaching their potential. But it is hard for me to feel sorry because I know you can change your life if you want to bad enough because I did. I have a responsibility to have good caretakers for my residents so I keep the people who do the best job. I don’t care what color they are if they do a good job. But I am cynical when it comes to this topic because I meet more white people who don’t want to work than anyone else. And whether you believe it or not, I fight hard to get better pay for all the people that work for me but I have no tolerance for laziness and poor performance.
Brenda you need to look in the mirror, I do not think you will like the reflection. What you have posted here is in direct conflict with your previous posts.
I note that Brenda also asked the “how do you know” question.
That would SEEM to add to the perception that she MAY be rather neglectful in exploring the legal status of who she hires.
Jeez, Ass, where do you get your statistics from?
And who taught you English?
And who taught you to type?
That is an interesting assumption – if they have difficulty communicating, they must be an illegal alien.
By that definition, George W Bush is an illegal alien.
Ah, shit, let me try to find another example.
Bush is obviously an alien.
This is a blog clarkie boy, spelling and the typing is not the issue, the Thought is what counts, but you are here expecting a book report, Silly you!
Good catch JR, I got the “how do you know” as well. ANd there was that chorus of “The employers need to pay and be in jail”. Well, Brenda the criminal exploiter and employer of illegal aliens.
Good Comment – JM
JR,As far as exploitation, I pay what is the norm for my industry. Actually our pay is better that most. I used to think that more money would get you better staff but that is not necessarily true. It is really about whether a person has a work ethic and many in this country do not. I have pushed my company to provide higher wages, instituted a wage scale that considers experience, insurance benefits that are affordable, low cost meals, daycare benefits because I believe that all work is honourable and those who do it well deserve good things. But I have seen a lot of poor performance and it is not just the unlicensed staff that behave badly. I see the same behavior from LPN’s and RN’s. We have a general attitude in this country that we deserve things just because we breath air. If you want good things you have to earn it.
Remember, you’re talking to someone who spent two years in college only to have it taken away from me the day of graduation based on a lie.
And I’m really sick of the politics. I expect nurses to be good people, and I’m finding more and more who just aren’t.
As I noted before, we are on a first name basis – you can call me William, I will call you Ass.
Well, Ass, why are you so afraid of Spanish speaking people? Do you “pucker up” when hispanic men walk by you? Do Latino women make you nervous?
Do you believe all those myths about Mexican guys carrying switchblades. Are you worrying about your hubcaps? Do you have nightmares (or other dreams) about Salma Hayek?
Grow up, Ass. The world is not coming to a end.
And work on the stats, Ass, you are not doing real well with the reality based community.
ASBESTOS
I am not comfortable with you in some other areas.
Here you are entirely correct.
Sheesh Brenda it is no wonder you and Mary are pals. You sound just like her. Same high horse rhetoric. IF you and she come from humble beginnings you have clearly forgotten them.
Clark, it’s not about race! It’s about illegal immigration. I love people of all races, I worked with some awesome guys who were here in college. They were here temporary but legally. I had no problem with them- I even hung out with them after work and had a grand ole time, even learned a little bit of their languages. But you know what, they all spoke English too.
From Brenda:
“But I have seen a lot of poor performance and it is not just the unlicensed staff that behave badly. I see the same behavior from LPN’s and RN’s. We have a general attitude in this country that we deserve things just because we breath air.”
You are a piece of work. Professional Health care providers, RN’s and LPN’s, and they do not measure up to a manager of the laundry and environmental services department?? And you base this on what? Do you follow that LPN or RN around all day? Nursing is a helluva lot more difficult than what you put here missy! It is clear YOU do not know one iota of how to judge competency or rewarding good work ethic, hell I do not even think you know what good work ethic is, based on your posts.
Clarkie asshole I am a lot more reality based than you are, and that is obvious to anyone who can read. But for some strange reason when I come on here you give me a rash of shit regardless of what I am posting and you go off into those psycho-babble diatribes like above.
You are the one with a problem theer clarkie.
“Well, Ass, why are you so afraid of Spanish speaking people? Do you “pucker up” when hispanic men walk by you? Do Latino women make you nervous?
Do you believe all those myths about Mexican guys carrying switchblades.”
So clarkie a question for you. DO you hate white people? DO they make you nervous? IF you are white are you filled with self hate? OR if you are a minority do you have an inferiority complex? Or are you merely racist against whites?
DO you hate America so much, that you would champion for illegal aliens from another country?
That is what it is all about?
“Clark, it’s not about race”
Sorry, P Mom, I didn’t say it was about race. I said that people should not assume that that folks that speak Spanish as a first language are illegal aliens.
I also said that there were much more important issue than “press one for English” and “boil for uno minutes.”
I never said that illegal immigration was acceptable, but I would rather that language not be the primary issue.
I also said that an “English Only” law may have unintended consequences by futher isolating legal immigrants.
But other than that, it’s all good.
Well, Ass, please note…..
For one, as most everyone here knows, I pass for white but I am multi-cultural. I am part native, black, jewish, norweigian, irish, german and english.
Secondly…..
“DO you hate America so much, that you would champion for illegal aliens from another country?”
I am not championing illegal aliens – I just find it stupid that people like you get all bent out of shape about people speaking Spanish.
Your leaps of logic are quite amazing. Undoubtedly, you are the Evel Knevel of Blog Logic.
And you just crashed into the Ceasar’ Palace fountain.
JR,I haven’t forgotten being poor and hungry and wearing my cousin’s hand-me-down’s that were to big for me but there was no money to buy anything else. I haven’t forgotten being made fun of in school. My mom didn’t think education was important so she didn’t care if I stayed in school. I haven’t forgotten all the abuse. I do try to help people who want help and give to many charities that give people a leg up. But I get tired of people who believe they are somehow entitled and yes, Mary and I do have those feelings in common. I think it is pretty disingenuious of people to make me a bad guy or say I am bad because I say what I have encountered. But I can’t help people who don’t help themselves. I try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt but I will not put up with poor performance. I expect people to do their job to the best of their ability. If they don’t want to do that then go somewhere else. I will not allow the elders to be victimized because someone does not want to do the work.
I find that refreshing in an administrator, really. I wish more wouldn’t hide their eyes from the neglect that goes on in the facilities just trying to keep a warm body employed.
Assbestos,I am a nurse and have been working in LTC for many years. I have been in administration for a number of years and now work at the regional level. So you don’t know what you are talking about. I have hired all kinds of staff and have served as the interim adminstrator, director of nursing, and have had to run dietary, housekeeping, laundry, you name it until staff was hired. Actually I am quite accomplished at what I do. I just don’t live in an ivory tower as some of the rest of you must. Sorry.
so all the nurses suck but you? That is the point of your posts? Everyone sucks that are American and White looking for a job, but illegal aliens are just fine, qualified and fit the bill.
That is what you are saying for your third rate existence? I hope never to end up in a LTC that you have an hand in or are employed by.
You are scarey! IF you would employ illegal aliens, you would rip off your charges, because there is no moral difference there.
Ass, you are one funny boy! Are you doing some sort of Redneck Colbert Report?
The freakin’ thread was about the English language, not illegal aliens. No one here is arguing FOR illegal aliens. No one here is suggesting amnesty FOR illegal aliens. No one here suggesting HIRING illegal aliens.
Unfortunately, Ass, you are just pulling stinky, gooey chunks out of your rear end.
Get a grip, Ass, no one is out to get you. No one cares. No one wants your job. No one is going to pull a switchblade on you when you go home.
Actually, no one gives a good god damn about you, Ass. Get over yourself. No one really cares if you live or die.
When you are gone, no one will miss you.
In English or Spanish.
Ivory tower?
Well Brenda that seems to me just exactly where you live.
Bottom line is you are a paper pusher who is real judgemental of the actual “hands on ” folk.
Ya know? I met just such your sort when my Dad was dying. He had Kreutzefeld Jakob disease. The paper pusher at the hospital could not wait to get him out of the hospital. The paper pushers like you at the nursing homes were uninformed and stupid as to his condition and did not want to have him as a patient.
The nurses and nurses aids? NONE of them Hispanic were wonderful. The dietary person was not. The administrators were not.
Oh you talk a good fight Brenda. But the right IS right about one thing. There ARE limosuine liberals.
JR I don’t think that’s quite fair now. There is no doubt that some people work harder than others. I just don’t think hispanics work better than whites in general…it all depends on the person.
I’ve heard Brenda talk about workers in the past, and I’ve agreed with her on almost every point.
And she didn’t say she thinks she hires illegals.
Asbestos,Why do you assume that because I hire minorities that they are illegal? I think you are a bigot! I guess I will have to repeat what WS said, being brown does not mean you are illegal. Not speaking English doesn’t make you illegal. I can’t believe you are trashing me because I don’t feel sorry for white people, the most privileged class in this country, especially if you are male! I keep people who want to do a good job. I don’t care who you are if you perform poorly then you will not have a job from me. This English only crap is completely about race. The other issue is that we are so arrogant in this country that we assume that brown people don’t have enough money to come to the US on vacation so there is no need to accomidate for the language difference. In Europe most everywhere you go you will find English signs posted. My son’s wife’s relatives come from Mexico 2-3 times a year and they have plenty of money to spend. I guess you assume that all Hispanics are poor. Sorry, you are wrong.
Many of these wetbacks don’t even speak Spanish, they speak obscure cental american indian dialects. Anyway, the langauge issue is just an attempt to put a band-aid on a cancer patient, deport em all and no more nonsense!
Viva la Raza Blanco!!
“My son’s wife’s relatives come from Mexico 2-3 times a year and they have plenty of money to spend.”
There we go, your bias. Thank you. There is usually a poersonal and emotional component in supporting illegal aliens such as personal acquaintences. However the law is the law and is independent of race. If one of my personal attachments breaks a law they have to go face the music. The illegals just sa “no abla” in court and the cost skyrockets.
Because they cannot “abla” we then have to incarcerate them until the “abla” the charges to deport them. IF they refuse to “abla” or “comprehende” we are stuck with them and them have to release them.
That one event cast a 6 year old girl her life, as she was raped beaten and killed by an illegal alien that was incustody, but we had to let him go because of his spanish impearment.
Illegal Alein criminal are usually arrested 6-7 times before incarceration, because they disappear after arraingment.
Illegal Alien drivers whom are not legally licensed kill an average of 13 americans a day, and 12 Americans a day are murdered by illegal alien criminals.
THat is a BIG clog in our courts and a big cost to taxpayers.
You Brenda are the problem, and are very far from the solutions.
You garner the “C” name in my mind.
Asbestos,
Pull your head out. As Clark has pointed out numerous times, this thread is about LANGUAGE, not IMMIGRATION.
Monkeyhawk,
So terribly sorry that I didn’t properly check all my spelling before posting. Although, I must add that I probably use more correct english than 75% of the people who post on here. Why aren’t you jumping on anyone else’s back?
Fleetwood,
Just because I don’t agree with all of YOUR views on things doesn’t mean I am not middle of the road. Let’s try this one on for size – I believe that abortion is a single persons decision and it is not my job or my right to tell them yes or no. They will face judgement in their own time from the one who is allowed to judge and I am not it. Personally, for me it would never be an option. But that doesn’t give me the right to tell someone else what they can or cannot do. Amnesty for illegals? Against it. I don’t begrudge people looking for a better way of life. I just feel that they need to follow all the same rules as all the OTHER people who immigrate to this country. Capital Punishment? For it. The punishment should fit the crime. We have enough technology in this day and age to be certain we are prosecuting the right person. Gun Control – I think it is necessary. There are too many people out there who just flat don’t know what the hell they are doing, but they think carrying a gun is “cool” and then someone winds up dead. This is a rather personal one for me. In college, my sorry excuse for an ex-boyfriend got drunk off his ass and leveled a loaded 12 gauge at me “as a joke” – yeah well I didn’t find it funny, and I think we need more regulation on that. The war? Another touchy subject for me. I absolutely 100% stand behind our troops. They are doing the job they have been sent to do and they are doing it to the best of their ability and they need and deserve our support in this time. That said, I think we are fighting the WRONG war. This Iraq war is not what we were told it was about. We have been lied to from day one. We should have been spending all this time tracking down Bin Laden instead of running after Saddam. Yes, Saddam needed to be handled, but he was not an immediate threat and Bin Laden was and still is. Let’s get our priorities straight, and Bush definitely does not have them straight. Welfare? The concept of welfare is not bad – helping people who have hit a rough time get back on their feet. We could all use help at some point or another. The reality of welfare is horrible. Another debate I am not going to start here.
I see nothing wrong with declaring English our primary language. We are, after all, an English speaking country. As another poster so correctly pointed out, with all the immigrants from all the different nations with all the different languages we have here, english is our uniter. As I asked earlier – if we want this to be a bilingual country, who gets to decide what that second language is, and how fair is that to anyone whose primary language is NOT that second language? I have no problem with people speaking whatever language they want among their family and friends. But when it comes down to it, if you need assistance or are approaching a stranger for help, you need to be able to communicate with them on some level. If you do not make the effort, then there is a problem. We are not doing the children of these people any favors either by teaching them in Spanish language classes. If their parents can’t speak English, where else are they going to learn it? My grandmother used to run the religious education at a local church, which has seen more and more hispanic members in the last two years. When a new, hispanic family joined the church, they came in with a “friend” to act as an interpreter since she spoke no English, to sign their children up for RE classes. The church offered RE classes in Spanish up to the 3rd grade. After that, the children were mainstreamed in to English speaking classes, because there were no instructors available who could speak Spanish. When the new mother insisted her 5th grader be put in a Spanish speaking class, my grandmother explained this to her interpreter. When the woman persisted to argue, my grandmother told her that her child would have to be in the English speaking class because it was the only one available and because the child would have to learn English in order to attend school there anyways as none of the instructors spoke Spanish, and the church leader spoke only English as well. They would not be able to form a Spanish speaking class for this woman’s child, her child would have to learn English. The interpretor’s response? “Don’t be so sure about that. We will have this church speak only Spanish within 5 years”
Wendy, I think I love you:) Just kidding of course, but I agree with you on 95% of those issues and I would just like to say one more thing – preach it sister! Sorry, I’m a bit goofy this morning…
Well, thank you for the support! I know I can be a little opinionated at times, but hey, that’s the beauty of this country, right? We are all allowed our own opinion. I won’t try to change your mind, I’ll just give you my opinion and the reasons for it…
And Yes, I am middle of the road, fleet. Thanks so much for playing…
Yeah, right, wendy. “I am for the troops, but I despise what they are doing”How many times did you vote for Clinton? Bush II?
Wendy~”Personally, for me it would never be an option. But that doesn’t give me the right to tell someone else what they can or cannot do.”
As a civilized society, it is our obligation to tell someone what they can and cannot do. As a free society we should minimize those ‘rules’.
Did you drive 80 mph going to work today? Did you refuse to pay sales tax at the check-out line? Did you not file with the IRS? Did you stop at the red light?
Thousands of times a day, we are told what to do.
sanford-wendy is deluded. Middle of the road? She’s for gun control, though almost every state has conceal/carry, she’s for abortion, but we know what abortion does. Sounds like something other than middle of the road, but it makes her feel good about herself. That’s something, I guess.
Well, at least she’s got that goin’ for her.
Actually, Fleet, I didn’t vote for either… And I notice how you only jump on my opinions that differ from yours – see, if you look at what I posted, you will notice that it is pretty much split down the line where my opinions lie. And sanford, having been in a position where most people would consider abortion (like i said, not something I would consider) I would venture a guess that I am more informed on that matter than you. and, sanford, NO it is not MY job to tell people what to do. Just like it isn’t your job to tell me what to do. our right to freedom, remember? If other people want to try to do that, it’s fine, that doesn’t mean taht it’s right, and doesn’t mean that it’s my place to do it, so i won’t. And that’s my view on that. And, Fleet, I didn’t say I despise what they do, I said they were doing their jobs and deserved our support. I said I think we were lied to about this war and that we are there for false reasons when we should have been pursuing someone else. Where does that ever say that I despise what they do? I like how you want to put words in my mouth. As for being seriously deluded, I think the only deluded person in the room is you, fleet… And yeah, I am happy with who I am, who are you to begrudge me that?
By the way Sanford, I notice that the other examples you give of “rules” are in regards to EXISTING LAWS. And the EXISTING LAW says Abortion is legal. That is the rule that the government has given us. So really, your arguement holds no water with me.
Asbestos,If the “C” word is what I think you mean then You have a real problem. Again it is all about the personal attacks when you don’t have an intelligent comment. Do you think illegal aliens are the only people who murder children and somehow get away with it? That sounds like a personal connection. Yes, I have a personal connection but my opinion was the same before my son married Leigh. She is a wonderful, legal citizen and will be an asset to this country. I believe OJ got away with murder, Robert Black got away with murder, William Kennedy Smith got away with rape, and the list goes on. Throwing that case out is a red herring and has nothing to do with whether English should be the “primary” language of the US. All the crap you spread does not alter the fact that you are really a bigot and a racist. And by the way I think you qualify for the “D” word.
Right on, Brenda!The rest of you have no freakin’ idea what you’re talking about. Spend time in Brenda’s shoes and you’d see the reality of her job.I see it all the time, also. Many American’s are spoiled and have a firmly established sense of entitlement. Those who come from countries where there are few opportunities often appreciate what the USA has to offer. If you don’t think that’s true, then go live in a poor county for awhile and try to get ahead there. Most Americans take everything we have here for granted, and it often shows in their work ethic.Brenda doesn’t hire illegals, she runs a tight operation and expects her employees to do their best, there’s not a thing wrong with that, it’s called being a good manager.Asbestos…go f**k yourself.
Asbestos is not right about much. But he was right about this.
Mary? Seems to me you don’t think folks suffer….ENOUGH.
That’s a pretty pathetic perspective for a nurse.
You have absoluetely no connection to real life anymore. I’ll tell you the truth. I really think your best interests are served in becoming a Republican. You are already most of the way there.—–
When did I say people don’t suffer enough? If that were true, then why am I out in the world everyday trying to make things better for those who are suffering? Why do you make such accusations? I bet I live in the real world a hell of a lot more than you do, seems like you’re the one out of touch with reality.I guess expecting people to take responsibility for their lives is just not the way many of your generation thinks. If you make poor choices, don’t want to work hard, or take much responsibility, then everyone else should pick up your slack and try to do everything for you? Is that how the real world works, JR? Funny, because I had to do it all for myself, as did most of the successful people I know.You can lead a horse to water….and throwing money at problems doesn’t work well either if people aren’t motivated.Be glad you live in this country, because if you’d been to some of the places I’ve been, you’d be illiterate, living under a bridge and begging for food. You should kiss the ground everyday that your son will have the opportuntiy to get an education and make something of his life because of where he was born. Quit whining and be thankful, you don’t have it so bad.
Thank you Rush!
Why does it make you a Republican because you expect people to be responsible for themselves? My oldest son did a 6 month Army tour in Honduras. He came back from that with a much greater appreciation of how lucky he was to live in this country and thankful for what he had. He saw what true poverty looks like. Poor people in this country at less have some resources. In those countries there is no “safety” net. He told me he was amazed at what people would do for money. I have always believed that we need to invest money in programs that help people help themselves. No matter what you say I still live with the reality of dealing with irresponsible people. If you want to better yourself in this country you can. I want to make sure that those programs are always there. I have no problems with those people who come to this country wanting a better life. I’m much more frightened of those of you who try to scare everyone with the “bogeyman” who is coming over the border. It is a lie!
Thanks to you too george!
Ian,I went to your link and I read it all. Can you find a link that is unbiased that says those kind of things? Maybe I could give it some credibility then. Yours is all racist garbage!
I stayed on Roatan for awhile off the coast of Honduras, there wasn’t even a high school until a few years ago when a generous, obviously very wealthy person from another country built one for the kids there, the average Honduran has only a fifth grade education. There is no social system, the poverty there is something the average American can’t even comprehend.My son spent a year in India, Pakistan, and China. Once he watched the Chinese police shoot a local man in the head for stealing a camera. The poverty, abuse, and oppression he saw broke his heart.I feel very blessed to live in this country….and I’m sorry more Americans don’t appreciate what we have here.
HOw about some truth Brenda?
http://www.wehategringos.com
See the ilk you are supporting on video.
Yeah, Asbuttos, your link seems real unbiased to me!
I’m curious.
Just how low would the American standard of living have to fall before we stopped letting in everybody? Is there an expectation on the minds of you open borders people that if 23 Mexicans can live in a 2 room house why then Americans can darn well do the same?
If Carlita and Gomez will work 90 hours a week for 4 bucks an hour do you expect John and Jane American do that too?
Myself I’ve never encountered an employer who would not lower the floor of wages and treatment as low as they could get away with. And illegal aliens are like gasoline on a fire to such folk.
No. No signs in Spanish. And any employer caught with illegals working for them should have their buisiness siezed and liquidated. That is what SHOULD happen. But it won’t. And come a few years down the line? Well the snooty folk will have an even larger group of people to accuse of being at fault for their own poverty.