You always hate to see the little guy get beat down. So I suppose some sympathy is in order for General Motors when it complains that it’s lost its lobbying advantage to Japanese automakers like Toyota.
“They outspend us,” GM vice chairman Robert Lutz groused Tuesday at a Detroit auto show. “One of the sad things is, Toyota is so profitable and has plants in so many states that, frankly, they’ve got more congressmen and senators than General Motors does.”
Whether that’s true or not is debatable. GM spent about $7.8 million on lobbying in 2005, compared with $5.7 million by Toyota. But the truly worrisome thing is how blithely a U.S. executive speaks of owning congressmen and senators.
Posted by Dave Knadler
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42 Comments
Does anyone understand the leap of logic by Knadler? This should be a front page story. Can you imagine the frenzy of news coverage about all the “owned” congressmen? I would like to see the list.
WAH! WAH! WAH!
Poor little GM. They have been shutting down plants while other automakers have been expanding. The reason? Their product is limited pretty much to trucks. They have not been active in coming up with cars that people buy; so as many consumers switch back from trucks to cars they go elsewhere. Meanwhile, Toyota has entered the truch market and is successfully competing with GM in that area.
No sympathy from me.
I agree with Fleettwood. Knadler, you make yourself seem foolish with your conclusion. Lutz is saying that senators and congressmen will naturally support industry and employment in the states they represent; therefore Toyota, with plants in more states than GM, can expect support from senators and congressman from more states. There’s no implication of “owning congressmen and senators.”
““They outspend us,” he told reporters at the Detroit auto show today” … but … “GM spent about $7.8 million on lobbying in 2005, compared with $5.7 million by Toyota.”
Maybe that is part of GM’s problem. They think 5.7 is greater than 7.8.
American auto makers have burnt their own ass.Ignored all the trends and continued down the wrong path.Now it’s time for them to sit on the blister for a while.
Wait, wait, wait – big business controls our government?
NO WAY!
WAY!
Stock cars and bicycle jerseys have the symbols of the companies sponsoring them. Why can’t we just have our Congressmen be adorned with the corporate logos who own them? Transparency in government.
The U.S. automakers spent the better part of a century controlling American’s taste in cars. You bought what they offered or you didn’t drive. With the influx of competitive cars from abroad, our big three simply didn’t get the message. They’ve trailed the pack in producing what the consumers want because they still think the consumers should want what they produce. In the meantime, the imports are producing technologically superior cars for less than the bloated giants. It’s all the fault of those pesky consumers!
Doug,I like your idea! Anytime a congressman accepts a favor from a corporate interest, he has to add their logo to a sash he then has to wear whenever he appears in public. Some of those sashes are going to get awfully heavy!
What is really killing the car companies are the Unions and their pensions and their healthcare.
That’s right, blame the unions. Forget the fact that GM and Ford haven’t produced a car worth owning in decades, cars that fall apart, warranties that suck. I drive a Hyundai after years of writing checks to repair shops for fixes on my Fords and Olds and other ‘mercan cars. I’ll buy an Amercian car when American car companies build something I can trust.Every executive I know (fleetwood I suspect, GolfNut, I know) whines about having to pay a living wage and health care, but they all have fat salaries and healthcare. Quit blaming the unions for trying to get close to what you mealy- mouthed already have.
Stop bashing the union if it were’nt for the union what kind of health care and wages would exist out there. How much does Toyota or Honda pay there employees same as the big three with all there benefits? As far as quality the big 3 produce great products, its the North Americains perception that is wrong. GM is producing better quality vehicles than the imports. What the big problem here is the NAFTA agreement which allows these ASIAN companies to import as much as they want but we cant export the same quantity.
Pat – “imports”? My car was made in OHIO. That just happens to be in the United States.
That,s great that your car is built in OHIO but how much of your vehicle is built with North Americain parts. Parts made in the USA. You would be surprised to find out that its less than 40% as with the big 3 its well over 85%. So who is the better when it comes to creating jobs, good paying jobs.
It has a higher domestic fraction than a Ford Escort or Focus would have had. They are mostly inported.
If the Big Three want to truly compete with Japanese, Korean and European manufacturers, they had better start making some decent automobiles. I have always purchased an American auto or truck. Now, it is hard to find anything that an American maker produces that isn’t over priced and under valued.
Excluding the F-150, all Ford has is the Mustang, and that is all about Sixties nostalgia styling.
Excluding PU’s, GM only has Cadillac and the Corvette.
Chrysler has the Jeep line up and trucks, and freshing styling, butlacks quality.
Honda, Toyota, Kia, Hyundai and the Europeans beat the Big Three in terms of price, quality and value hands down.
The American makers have to step up or they will end up begin bought out by the Japanese.
The American makers could us a lesson in management by looking at Harley-Davidson. In 1980, Harley was going down hard, in the throes of bankruptcy.
And now Harley is one of the strongest and most profitable American companies, number one in the sale of heavy-weight motorcycles and number two overall.
Are you comparing apples to apple WSClark. There’s all kinds of really nice vehicles the Big 3 produce.
Pat – name them. And do it comparing apples to apples – I am looking for a car (hypothetical).
Last time I bought a car Ford had one that made my long list but not my short list after I drove it. GM didn’t even have that.
Sorry, Pat, for every good Big Three product you can name, I can name a better foreign product.
Sorry, but ‘dems the facts.
Specifications for my search 5 years ago:
Good accellerationGas mileage 30+ minimum4/5 passengerGood handlingLow maintainenceGood resale value (over 50% after 5 years)Starts in all weather
Pat?
“He went on, “One of the sad things is, Toyota is so profitable and has plants in so many states that, frankly, they’ve got more congressmen and senators than General Motors does.””
This means that Toyota is doing more to help local economies than GM is. And, according to the figures given, GM still spends more lobbying. Their problem is that as they become less important economically they will naturally lose clout.
Chevy Impala beat the Toyota Camry in initial quality according to J.D. Power & Associates and Consumer reports for 2005 model. Also Ford fusion and Mercury Milan scored higher than the Camry and Honda accord last year 2006.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration announced that Toyota recalled more vehicles than it had sold in the USA last year. Toyota made an elaborate apology for their “series of worrisome recalls”. TOTAL Toyota Vehicles Recalled: 1,828,659..
Best Initial Quality – J D Power
Best SubcompactKia RioSuzuki AerioScion xA
Best CompactToyota CorollaHyundai ElantraHonda Civic
Best Compact SportMazda MX-5Hyundai TiburonScion tC
Best Luxury Compact Sport Porsche Cayman SHonda S2000Porsche Boxster
Best Luxury SportLexus SC 430Porsche 911Chevrolet CorvetteMercedes-Benz SL-Class
Best Entry LuxuryLexus IS 250/IS 350Lincoln ZephyrAcura TL
Best Luxury MidsizeLexus ES 330Infiniti M35/M45Jaguar S-Type
Best Full-Size LuxuryLexus LS 430Audi A8BMW 750/760
Best Midsize SportToyota Camry SolaraFord MustangChevrolet Monte Carlo
Best MidsizeToyota CamryHonda AccordHyundai Sonata
Best Full-SizePontiac Grand PrixHyundai AzeraNissan Maxima
Not real good news for the American Car makers.
Pat – next time I am in the market I will consider them. However, when I last bought a new car there were no good GM or Ford options. My 5+ year old Honda still has over 50% value. What would the Ford Escort be worth?
Pat – I hope they have something for me next time I’m looking. Too bad they scrapped the EV-1.
It looks to me that America wants to see the Big 3 fail and that is sad because if the big 3 ever shutdown then the 7 supplier jobs lost for every UAW job lost would be disasterous to the American economy. But you can take solice in knowing all your hard earned money is safe over in an Asian bank.
Nonsense, Pat. As a former Detroiter, nothing would sadden me more than to see the Big Three fall, but they can’t blame the foreign car makers for their woes.
They have had 35 years to get their act together and they have completely failed in that regard.
If they want to be a player, they need to do more than buy a few bucks worth of bling and a new suit.
Thanks for the opportunity and I sure hope you take the time to look at the Big Three when shopping for a new vehicle. If people change their perception of the Big Three, I think they will be surprised and glad they did.
I’ve been a proud and happy Toyota and/or Honda (including now an Acura) owner since 1985.
The first Toyota I bought was a 1974 Corolla station wagon with 175,000 miles on the odometer. I bought it in 1985 and sold it to buy a brand new Toyota PU in 1988. In 1997 I bought a new Toyota Camry, and in 2000 I bought a new Acura. I sold the Toyota PU, with 185K miles on the odometer, to my father in 2004 for about 25% of its original (nominal) showroom price. A long time “big” 3 loyalist, he’d had his eye on the little Toyota for years and was delighted to buy it and at that price.
The chances are extremely slim that I would ever buy any car or truck made by the “big” 3. More than 2 decades of satisfaction is not something one turns one’s back on lightly.
Like WS said, those bozos had multiple chances and blew every one of them. It’s far less risky buying a new Japanese car than it is buying any new “big” 3 car. Far less.
I’ve budgeted to buy a Lexus later this year (but we shall see, I’m still very happy with the Acura).
It’s sad that so many Americans have been brain washed by the media. The media has been on GM for years, since the 70’s actually. Nothing gets passed the front page of any news paper if it is bad news for GM. If there is bad news about Toyota it will be found on page 6 of section c. Good news about GM has all the talking heads chuckling and stating how it won’t last. It is scary how the citizens of the United States are so willing to give it all away. Until the government gets this straightened out as far as export/inport taxes go I do my best to buy american. Do americans understand how these other countries treat their people? Do they care? I feel that GM’s trucks and cars are just as good if not better then the competition it’s just the spin the media supplies that these people buying foreign vehicles are thumbing their noses at American companies. I know your arguement about GM having foreign factories, outsourcing etc… BUT when you purchase a foreign vehicle the vast amount of the profit for that purchase is going back to the home country of that company.
Yeah I’m brainwashed, but it ain’t by the MSM. If anything, I’ve been “brainwashed” by Toyota and Honda Motor Companies.
The first car I owned was an ancient, black 1953 Plymouth 4-dr, 3-spd on the column, velvet interior, built like a tank. Bought it from my uncle; great car. Next was a 1967 Mercoury Cougar, which couldn’t stay out of the shop. Next, a Chevrolet van, also couldn’t stay out of the shop. I bought a 1974 Toyota station wagon to replace the van, and the price I paid for the Toyota was less than the total repair costs of the Mercury and the Chevy together. And you know what? That Toyota had 175K miles on the odometer and it never went in the shop one time in the three years I owned it. Not one time.
That seemed somehow significant to me. I decided to pay attention.
Yeah that’s me, brainwashed.
When it comes to a purchase incurring depreciation rates as high as 15% FOR NOTHING MORE THAN TAKING OWNERSHIP, when it comes to such an investment, what’s wrong with thinking about me before I give a fig about where the profit goes?
Again, it’s not the MSM that’s at fault. Consumer’s Union doesn’t accept advertising, they rely solely on subscriptions (and other sales, but not of ad space) for their revenue. Go to consumerreports.org and check out the vehicle ratings. (Ratings are those submitted by Consumers Union members, btw.) Black dots trail almost every “big” 3 offering, red dots trail those of the Japanese. The math ain’t hard, especially when what I read parallels what I’ve experienced for more than 2 decades now.
Did I mention that I lived in Asia for a year and a half?
Ever see a Japanese couple shop for cars in Tokyo? Name an essential tool for a young Japanese couple shopping for a new car.
??
ANS: a ruler, to measure the consistency of the gap between the door and the car body. If the car is a Ford, the gap is likely 3mm at the top of the post and something like +-60% at the bottom of the post. From that those crazy Japanese feel free to deduce that Ford doesn’t care about quality, that Ford’s promise of quality is an empty one, nothing more than puffery.
I agree.
Why is Mr Lutz (GM vice chairman) complaining about Toyota making inroads in America? GM, through its wholly owned subsidiary, GM Japan (which markets GM products in Japan) is affiliated with Susuki, Fujisawa, Kawaski, Tochigo Engines, Tomakomai engines, Yamato (truck cabs) and Isuzu. Several of those names are familiar to Americans as Toyota. Mr Lutz’s complaint is deceptive, like Walmart’s complaint a few years ago in Britain about the power of a British supermarket chain.
flike,Ohmigosh; a conspiracy of superior quality! Damn, now that’s really inscrutable!
Although the Japanese (Toyota) automaker often proclaims that it wants to build where it sells, nearly half of the 2.5 million vehicles Toyota sold in the U.S. last year were imported from overseas factories.
Pat – the last time I looked at cars I DID look at the Big 3 (US). Only Ford had a car that made my list to look at further. However it did not make the short list of 4 – Honda, Mazda, Nissan, Toyota all did. You never did answer my questions above: in the 2002 model year (my last new-car purchase) what were my options? My Honda is still over 50% value. What would an escort be?
It is NOT my job to by a car from the Big 3. It is THEIR job to sell me one. They failed in doing their job.
When will the Big 3 have a hybrid car? Why did GM scrap the promising EV-1? Answer those questions; then you might be able to answer this one: What do the Big 3 executives offer me?
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