GOP tried automated phone harassment

Automated campaign phone calls aren’t new. But this past election, the national Republican Party flooded residents in several dozen districts with repeated phone calls, the New York Times reported. Some residents received five calls a day, every day, for a week — all with the same automated, negative message about the Democratic candidate in that district. A few calls were made in the early morning or middle of the night, and some voters received several calls minutes apart, the Times reported. Democratic officials have protested, saying that the calls were tantamount to harassment and were aimed at discouraging people from voting.
One solution: New Hampshire has a law that prohibits automated campaign calls to people on the no-call list (though the GOP still called them but agreed to stop after being contacted by the state’s attorney general).
The GOP also employed a new automated telemarketing ploy that is akin to a push poll. The call asks a question, such as whether you believe that judges who “push homosexual marriage and create new rights like abortion and sodomy” should be controlled, the Times reported. If your answer is “yes,” the automated message then says that you shouldn’t vote for the Democratic candidate.
Posted by Phillip Brownlee

72 Comments

  1. Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:13 am | Permalink

    If we didn’t have a clear majority, we wouldn’t have a chance against these people.

  2. Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:19 am | Permalink

    WHY DOES THE EAGLE REPORT THIS BUT WAS NEARLY SILENT ON THE SIX SNOOP DOGS TO ELECT MORRISON AND THE THREE MAILINGS SENT OUT IN CERTAIN STATE REP DISTRICTS — BOTH PAID FOR BY “NON-PROFITS” WITH CONNECTIONS TO TILLER’S PROKANDO PAC?

    AT LEAST ONE STATE SENATOR IS CALLING FOR FOLKS TO DROP THEIR SUBSCRIPTIONS TO THE EAGLE OVER YOUR UNFAIR TREATMENT OF BONNIE HUY.

    ANY GOP PHONE HARRASSMENT IS SHAMEFUL, BUT EVEN MORE SHAMEFUL IS THE BIAS SHOWN BY THE EAGLE.

  3. writerdog
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:29 am | Permalink

    OK THAT IS IT! It is bad enough to belong to a political party that G.W. Bush claims to belong to! But I refuse to assistant with Tele-marketers! I do have my standards….

  4. Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:30 am | Permalink

    Hey, good point, Meadow poop!

    It’s time for me to RE-UP my subscription since they supported Raj.

  5. kelly
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 5:44 am | Permalink

    Maybe 6 years ago, Democrat Elizabeth Bishop ran against Huy, and lost by less than 200 votes. After that victory, Huy and the Republicans gerrymandered this district to make it more Republican, AND to carve out Elizabeth Bishop’s neighborhood, Huy didn’t want to run against Bishop again – this was a perfect example of the arrogance of power. So I have no sympathy for Huy. She was her own worst enemy, as she could not escape her voting record. Most important, she was soundly thrashed in a district that was overwhelmingly red. She was held accountable by hundreds of Republicans who helped make up a 700+ winning margin for Goyle, and no amount of whining about ridiculous claims of unfairness is going to vindicate Huy. Her career is over.

  6. rm6046
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 7:06 am | Permalink

    If this is true, it’s reprehensible. If it is not, it is reprehensible. Either way, this is “Kansas news” how ??

  7. JM
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 7:11 am | Permalink

    It is true about the Snoop-Dog phone calls and the brochures with false information about the medical records. (Kline only subpoenad 90 very specific records that were expunged of any privacy of patient identification.)

    I got several phone calls about 5-6.

    Don’t think I was annoyed about the number of the calls as much as I did was about the false message about the medical records.

  8. TRACY
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 7:19 am | Permalink

    rm6406.Anything to keep meadowpoop irritated.It’s all a big left wing conspiracy to push meadowpoop over the edge.

  9. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 7:38 am | Permalink

    Something smells. If the GOP was trying to get what it wanted, this was the wrong way to go about it. It doesn’t make sense. The New York Times is the source. Something smells. Where are the follow up questions? Where are the quotes from GOP officials denying/apologizing/lieing/outraged about this?

  10. Posted November 9, 2006 at 8:17 am | Permalink

    Coming over to our side are ya Writer?

    The mailings are smaall biscuits compared to mass telephone calls. How many people even really read those?

    Hotlick, the NYT is not the only source talking about these…I’ve seen it on multiple news networks too.

  11. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 8:33 am | Permalink

    I have read the article and this is incredibly stupid. So stupid in fact that there has to be another explaination. Calling the same number over and over? All you will get from that is irritation and a lost voter.I want more info. What does Ken Mehlman have to say about this?

  12. raptor
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 8:34 am | Permalink

    Hotlick..

    Surely you know better than to ask for proof or evidence among this group? Anything that attacks, belittles, or accuses Republicans is absolute fact. Taken at face value…an indictment is the same as conviction..at least whenever anyone associated with the Republican party is mentioned. If anyone, anywhere ever says something negative about any Democrat, the personal attacks start and don’t quit.

    Not whining..just making observations.

  13. ken
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 8:54 am | Permalink

    I am not renewing my subscription to the Beagle (dog of a paper that it is) because after recognizing Tiahrts ties to DeLay and Abramhoff they still endorsed him. They never pushed / asked for a debate between the 2 candidates. They never investigated or asked him about his alliance with Delay. Also, because they will not put coverage of the war on the front page, opting for hiding it in the middle of section A. Thier Business Section sucks, as does the Wichitalk and Wichits Go on Friday. They opt for pap on the front page like decorative dentures and free publicity for the Rolling Stones concert. While I’m at it — the Food Section / editor, when they provide a recipe or restaurant review they should also add the calorie / carb data associated with the reviews. Oh, but that would upset the advertisers and god knows they don’t want to annoy them or the business interests of Wichita.

  14. Bias
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 8:57 am | Permalink

    I truly don’t understand the name calling and mean-spiritedness The Wichita Eagle allows on this blog. It says volumns about its leadership and condemnation towards those who might view issues differently than its editors.

  15. WSClark
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:01 am | Permalink

    That was a good one, Eagle Hater. Did you stay up all night working on that one?

    Perhaps you might just try NOT READING the paper.

    Maybe you can stay up all night tonight working on that one.

  16. Dan H.
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:01 am | Permalink

    “Surely you know better than to ask for proof or evidence among this group? Anything that attacks, belittles, or accuses Republicans is absolute fact. Taken at face value…an indictment is the same as conviction..at least whenever anyone associated with the Republican party is mentioned. If anyone, anywhere ever says something negative about any Democrat, the personal attacks start and don’t quit.”

    So, Kline bringing up the 15 year old DROPPED charges against Morrison was wrong? Republicans have been doing what you say is whining for years. They are the masters.

  17. CF
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:04 am | Permalink

    Boy, now that all the returns are in, I gather this is the long-awaited GOP meltdown?

    Let me pull up a chair so’s I can watch.

  18. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:06 am | Permalink

    The Eagle does suck. The editorial board is left wing, but the EagleHater sucks much worse.Go away.

  19. ksfarmgrrl
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:24 am | Permalink

    I’m popping the organic corn from my garden CF. Care to join me?

    heheheheh

  20. ksfarmgrrl
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:26 am | Permalink

    Oh, and what a big surprise. The whiney wingers are… wait for it…

    BLAMING THE MEDIA!!!!!!

    hehehehehehehehehehhehehehehheheheheh

    Culture of personal responsibility, eh? Like the one exhibiited by bias boy this morning? The religious right shares NO BLAME for the thumpin’?

    Of course not…….

  21. Bias
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:31 am | Permalink

    No meltdown here – simply an observation of the eagle’s love affair with leftest/socialistic theories. Please please don’t tell me (regardless of political flavor or gender persuation) this isn’t obvious. It’s the talk of many a coffee shop in town.

    Sports reporting is about the only “neutrality” represented in the paper.

  22. Bias
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:33 am | Permalink

    farmgrrl – you just can’t make your claims without being nasty, can you??

  23. ksagnostic
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:33 am | Permalink

    “I have read the article and this is incredibly stupid. So stupid in fact that there has to be another explaination. Calling the same number over and over? All you will get from that is irritation and a lost voter.”

    You don’t seem to understand, hotlick. Irritation and lost voters are the point. The automated phone calls first identified the candidate they were attacking by name and then went into a negative attack. They didn’t identify the source of the call until the end of the automated phone call.

    Anticipated response: The voter who was targeted would hang up before hearing the rest of the message past the candidate’s name. By making the call over and over, the voter would associate the call with the candidate’s name, and blame the candidate.

    These tricks have been happening not only with regards to democrats, but moderate and even conservative republicans when they oppose republicans of a certain ideological bent or within the Bush circle. Not surprisingly, they are consistent with any campaign Karl Rove has been involved in. Ask John McCain.

  24. ksfarmgrrl
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:36 am | Permalink

    Dear Bias,

    Think of my posts as a reflection. A reflection back to you of what has been given to me.

    Do unto others, ya know?

    I can only assume you wanted me to do to you what has been directed at me.

    I can also assume you all on the right can dish it out but you cant take it?

    Expect more of it. I’m just getting warmed up.

    BWHAHAHAHAHAHA

  25. ken
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:41 am | Permalink

    I think when it comes to politics the Eagle is neither Republican (conservative) or Democrat (liberal) inclined. They are incompetent at both ends of that spectrum. They do not serve the community very well without any real investigative reporting (ok with the exception of the food and fashion sections) — they pander to the business and advertiser interests, they hide war coverage in the middle of the paper.

    Generally a very inadequate paper, too bad they are the only game in town.

  26. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:45 am | Permalink

    ksag-If this is true, then the perps should burn. If it’s not true, then nothing will happen. No correction, no apologies.Where’s Ken Mehlman, the GOP election guy, on this?Something just doesn’t seem right here.

  27. Bias
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:46 am | Permalink

    How sad… I’ve searched you posts over the months and they’re all basically the same… sarcastic, (in greek means – “to shred/cut)hateful, name-calling, etc.

    I’m fine with the reflections/debate (its the American way – in some countries you would be in jail or even killed because of your comments), but I just don’t understand why the name calling??

  28. Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:47 am | Permalink

    “Generally a very inadequate paper, too bad they are the only game in town.”

    For now.

  29. Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:47 am | Permalink

    Goodness, some conservatives are certainly throwing some temper tantrums today.

    Sorry Meadowjerk, your uninteresting stories just aren’t worth covering. They amount to people legally donating to campaigns and legally mailing out flyers. How is that a story?

  30. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:49 am | Permalink

    ken-You ignorant slut. It’s comments like that the paper points to and says “we must be doing something right, we are accused of being too conservative and too liberal”. Look at the editorial board. From top to bottom, not a conservative in the bunch. Not one. For a time I thought that Brownlee was a “sort of”. I was wrong.

  31. raptor
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:49 am | Permalink

    Is it too soon to try the well used tactic of screaming voter fraud, STEALING elections and hijacking voter terminals???

    Had any of the votes gone differently, I am sure we would be hearing those charges…so, might as well start them up.

    THE ELECTION WAS STOLEN…WHINE, WHINE, WHINE…

  32. TRACY
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:51 am | Permalink

    We like name calling.If you don’t, then don’t participate.

    Let me know if you need help with some new and improved names, KFG.

  33. ken
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:51 am | Permalink

    OK — I’m confused, no surprise there. Do the editors contribute to the blogs? If so, who is who? Is Rhonda Meadowlark? etc …..

  34. ken
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:53 am | Permalink

    Bias

    Is there another paper coming? If so what is it? Are they hiring? I’ll work for any paper that does real investigative reporting and does not reflect any liberal or conservative bias. I work for integrity and ethics very cheaply.

  35. hmmm ...
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:53 am | Permalink

    Bias – are you referring to;

    “The Eagle sucks!

    The Eagle is run by a bunch of losers! One sided liberal pukers. Their rag is nothing short of the National Enquirer.”

  36. ken
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:56 am | Permalink

    Hotlick

    Who let you out of your cage – who is supposed to be watching you so you don’t slip on your spittle? Just look at who the Eagle endorsed in the election – many more Republican conservatives than Democrats — ahhh I forgot you can’t and don’t count —

  37. ksfarmgrrl
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 9:59 am | Permalink

    Thanks Tracy, I do need a little help. I think I’m losing my razor edge with all the warm and fuzzy wins this week. heheheheh

    My friends used to say they were surprised I didnt cut the inside of my mouth with that sharp tounge.

    Badum dum. Rim shot.

    Gosh, a little sore and touchy on the right today?

    They seem a little humor impaired when it is at THEIR expense.

    Off to yahoo in search of that hunk o’ man meat.

    Although, you know I’d only marry you for the benefits. Like health insurance, pension, survivorship, etc.

    hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee

  38. Rosemarie
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:00 am | Permalink

    I received numerous pre-election-day automated phone calls from the anti-Kline crowd. The caller never identified herself or the organization she represented. IMHO that is cowardly and perhaps illegal, considering that other groups were required to identify themselves or face fines. I find it EXTREMELY hypocritical of the Eagle to criticize the GOP then look the other way when people they support right here at home do worse. I think the Eagle’s credibility is at an all time low.

  39. Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:00 am | Permalink

    If the Eagle staff endorsed anyone other than republicons, they will get called liberal. It’s funny that anytime someone is MORE left of the ultra-rabid right are called liberals.

    Most in the middle will see that this newspaper is biased in some ways, but not too bad. They supported Tiahrt, and I can’t see why anyone would do that unless they had very conservative leanings.

  40. Bias
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:00 am | Permalink

    Tracy – not my style to stoop to name calling, but thanks anyway.

  41. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:03 am | Permalink

    We have gone over the endorsement process already. Call it the paper’s self-preservation mode. That has nothing to do with the editorials written, the cartoons from Crowson. Just look at the topics on today’s list. It is so obvious, trying to make it otherwise is silly. Embrace it. They are your people, not mine.

  42. hmmm ...
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:03 am | Permalink

    I got robocalls from both sides on my answering machine. Didn’t seem to be much of a pattern

  43. hmmm ...
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:04 am | Permalink

    Is Castillo a “One sided liberal puker”?

  44. ken
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:06 am | Permalink

    Sorry — I have no people, other than inteligent, independent moderates, who according to you’re calculations are not supported by the EAgle either ………..

  45. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:06 am | Permalink

    Castillo is not on the board and he is very new to the page. I suspect he was allowed to write to deflect some critisism.

  46. Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:07 am | Permalink

    Rosemary, did you ever think it was probably the Kline group pulling this too?

    Perhaps you all can’t read or understand, that the GOP was calling INTENTIONALLY to annoy swing voters to vote against dems…representing themselves as democrats calling over and over again.

    The script I got from the Kansas Democratic Party was very clear…It showed very clearly that you were to say “I’m so and so, and I’m calling on behalf of the KDP”…and it was very polite, you had a box to check off if you called them, no answer, answering machine, asked them if they had time to answer a few questions whether they supported Sebelius or Morrison, then thanked them for their time.

    So I KNOW for sure that those calls were not coming from the Kansas Democratic Party. And the people on my list were all registered democrats too.

  47. Steven Davis
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:25 am | Permalink

    The only robo-call I got was from the Libertarian Party and they weren’t advocating any particular candidate. Seemed pretty unoffensive to me.

  48. Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:30 am | Permalink

    hmmm,

    “I got robocalls from both sides on my answering machine. Didn’t seem to be much of a pattern”

    The problem is multiple annoying robocalls that seem to come from a Dem, but are actually from the GOP.

    It’s ‘dirty tricks’. Make the Dem voters angry — so they wont vote Dem, or switch, and vote Repub.

    http://www.boston.com/news/local/connecticut/articles/2006/11/01/how_do_you_like_those_nasty_telephone_calls_from_the_campaigns/?page=full

    http://blogs.chron.com/kuffsworld/2006/11/attack_of_the_republican_roboc.html

    ‘Demand Coverage of GOP ‘Robocall’ Deception’http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2991

  49. Dave
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:30 am | Permalink

    >>>Castillo is not on the board<<<

    Wrong. Castillo is on the board.

  50. Bias
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:33 am | Permalink

    Of course, we all know repubs. are the only party that does such things. Just hoping everyone is clear on that.

    Wow – glad we got that under control.

  51. TRACY
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:47 am | Permalink

    By-assed, Okay!!Hey just kidden’.Ya’ ought to know that the regulars here have been calling each other names since day one.With most uf us it seems to be a game, others, not so much.In any case, we all come back for our fair share of abuse.Don’t take it too serious and have fun.

  52. SolDevVB
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:53 am | Permalink

    If y’all think the elections were dirty in KS, you should have seen the gov’s race in Michigan.

  53. Posted November 9, 2006 at 11:03 am | Permalink

    Bias,

    “Of course, we all know repubs. are the only party that does such things.”

    Can you find any examples of Dems doing it? Any complaints filed to the FCC re calls made by the Dems?

    The “bias” is that media falsely reports that both parties do the misleading and/or illegal robocalls,http://mediamatters.org/items/200611070013

    … or media mostly ignores it,http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Republican_national_robocalling_scam_on_eve_1106.html

  54. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 11:59 am | Permalink

    dave-I see by looking in the paper that he is on the board along with McCormick. Don’t they deserve a pretty picture on this site?I will revise my statement:From top to bottom there is one conservative. Just one.

  55. hmmm ...
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 12:36 pm | Permalink

    hotlick – “From top to bottom there is one conservative. Just one”

    In your opinion, yes. However, I do not see Brownlee as liberal; if anything he leans manistream conservative. Of course, if your definition of liberal is anyone to the left of Atilla the Hun …

  56. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 12:51 pm | Permalink

    hmmm-Hog wash. Maybe you haven’t read what he has written.I’ve said it before. There is something in the air in the editorial boardroom. I half expect Castillo to go down next.

  57. hmmm ...
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 1:00 pm | Permalink

    HogWash – yes, I have read his writings. My statement stands.

  58. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 1:03 pm | Permalink

    hmmm-”The biggest local race this election, both in money spent and political party attention, was for Kansas House District 87. I’m glad that Democrat Raj Goyle prevailed against incumbent Republican Bonnie Huy, who ran a hard-fought campaign. Goyle is just the type of smart, young professional we need more of in Topeka.”Posted by Phillip Brownlee

    I win.

  59. ksfarmgrrl
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 1:05 pm | Permalink

    “I half expect Castillo to go down next.”

    We can only HOPE biasboy goes down.

  60. ksfarmgrrl
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 1:06 pm | Permalink

    even castillo couldnt save bonbon from being gonegone.

  61. hmmm ...
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 1:12 pm | Permalink

    No, hotlick. Bonnie is way over on the right – with Atilla. So, his pleasure at her loss does not make him a liberal.

    I think he was one of those backing “scared-to-debate” Tiahrt. Dies that make Todd a “liberal”?

  62. Jed
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:06 pm | Permalink

    The only campaign call I got was from the Bon Bon camp. I think I melted down their switchboard. Needless to say, they didn’t call again.The other calls I got were from people wanting me to volunteer to help save the state from the uncompassionate conservatives, and I did what I could for them.

  63. ddub
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:36 pm | Permalink

    Wait, wait, wait…Republicans using dirty, possibly illegal tricks in their desperate (and failed) attempt to cling to power?

    NAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, COULDN’T BE

  64. ksagnostic
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:43 pm | Permalink

    “hmmm-Hog wash. Maybe you haven’t read what he has written.”

    What, that he’s anti-Kline? That doesn’t make someone a liberal, or even not a conservative, except relative to one who is to the right of the editorial writer. It is a common error among social right wing conservatives that “not us” = “the other”. Hotlick, you continue to demonstrate that you really don’t understand “moderate”, and that your view of conservatisim is myopic and narrow. Brownlee on issues (if you DO pay attention to what he writes, tends to run conservative-he is particularly financially conservative). However, he is moderate in temperment like A LOT OF REPUBLICAN voters in this state are. Politicians with immoderate temperments, like Kline, tend to annoy even conservatives with moderate temperments. I would pay serious attention to the exit poll data if I were you. It was in fact an angry moderate tidal wave that swept the Republicans out of office. Extremists who define anyone who is not an extremist of their stripe as “other” (in the case of conservatives, as therefore liberal or at least “not conservative”) have not learned the lesson of this election, and will probably be doomed to repeat their mistake in subsequent elections.

    “I’ve said it before. There is something in the air in the editorial boardroom. I half expect Castillo to go down next.”

    Uh huh. Because you know how much those liberals love to conspire to shut off conservative voices in the newspapers.

  65. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 2:53 pm | Permalink

    Number one, I am not a social conservative.Number two, if Brownlee is such a financial conservative, why would he like Raj?Number three, there is a stunning lack of conservative voices on the Eagle editorial board.Number four, you throw around “extreme” and “moderate” like they mean something.

  66. ksagnostic
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 4:28 pm | Permalink

    “Number one, I am not a social conservative.”

    Walks, talks like a duck, etc.

    “Number two, if Brownlee is such a financial conservative, why would he like Raj?”

    Gee, I don’t know, maybe for the same reason I like Pat Roberts, even though I oppose most of his stands? See above about moderate temperment verses someone like Goyle’s opponent who was…not.

    “Number three, there is a stunning lack of conservative voices on the Eagle editorial board.”

    See above my comments about narrow definitions of conservative.

    “Number four, you throw around ‘extreme’ and ‘moderate’ like they mean something.”

    Yes, I recall your juvenile dismissal of the definition of of “moderate” as “lame” (without supporting reasoning, by the way). The fact that the terms don’t mean anything to you counts for nothing other than they don’t mean anything to you. Stating that “moderate” and “extreme” don’t mean anything is not any sort of rebuttal.

  67. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 4:45 pm | Permalink

    #1) I’m a 3 month pro-choicer, I’m for decriminalization of some drugs. No ducks here.#2) If Brownlee is such a fiscal conservative, why would he support a taxer (Raj).You like Roberts, but oppose most of his stands? That doesn’t even make sense.#3)I will stand by my statement regarding the editorial board. No refutation necessary.#4) Your stand on principle doesn’t make you extreme as would mine. I think the real definition of a moderate is someone who agrees with me. An extremist is the opposite.Is someone who support partial birth abortion an extremist?Is someone who supports lower taxes for everybody an extremist?It depends on where you stand.

  68. ksagnostic
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 5:10 pm | Permalink

    “#1) I’m a 3 month pro-choicer, I’m for decriminalization of some drugs. No ducks here.”

    OK, fair enough (I also went back over some of your old posts which support your varied stands on some social issues) so I will consider the duck dead. That is, I concede that point. That being said, I stand by my general point about the “my side” verses “everyone else”.”#2) If Brownlee is such a fiscal conservative, why would he support a taxer (Raj).You like Roberts, but oppose most of his stands? That doesn’t even make sense.”

    The “taxer” is a perjorative label, pre-emptively dismissive. I doubt Brownlee DOES like some of Goyle’s stands.

    My comments about Roberts don’t make sense to you because you don’t understand them. It’s like this, Roberts is reasonable, and also articulates WHY he stands where he does and demonstrates an understanding of why people who disagree with them stand where they do. Being reasonable means that he can be worked with. Bob Dole was very much the same way when he was a Senator. It is, in fact, crucial in my view to be senatorial. I have seen people in office who self label themselves as conservative (and less often, this is Kansas after all) liberal who will still talk to people about an issue, and who show an inclination to be educated about issues. That, more than ideology, defines a good Senator. Roberts has that quality, Brownback does not. Both, however, are quite conservative.

    “#3)I will stand by my statement regarding the editorial board. No refutation necessary.”

    You hint that there is “something in the air” at the editorial boardroom at the Eagle that akes you half suspect that Castillo will go down next. I think the “something” is in your own mind, because you don’t get the concept of moderation even in conservatives and liberals. Castillo I am certain is at odds with the rest of the Eagle editorial board over Kline, but like I said that hardly makes Castillo the only conservative on the editorial board, and even then, I think Castillo demonstrates a moderate temperment even in his strong social and Christian conservatism. Tell you what, you know who else I think has that sort of temperment: Pat Buchanan. He is a red meat conservative but he can talk to and about liberals without demonizing them. Unlike, for example, Ann Coulter. Rejection of ideologically polluted performance of job duties, which Kline did, does not necessarily mean disagreement with conservatism.

    “#4) Your stand on principle doesn’t make you extreme as would mine. I think the real definition of a moderate is someone who agrees with me. An extremist is the opposite.”

    Uh huh.”Is someone who support partial birth abortion an extremist?”

    Why do they support it? I don’t know anyone who supports “partial birth abortion” because they think it’s great or cool. There are medical reasons why that method is used.

    “Is someone who supports lower taxes for everybody an extremist?”

    Yes, IF they support lower taxes for anyone regardless of any evidence that lowering taxes across the board would be a bad idea, and if they support candidates who are so obsessed on the tax issue that they don’t show any interest in other issues, or no openness to listen to people who disagree with them.

    “It depends on where you stand.”

    That’s your problem, you think moderation is about stands. It’s about how people arrive at them. For example, some of the most extreme people I have ever met are self described libertarians, even though they are often seen as a mix of social liberalism and extreme fiscal conservatism.

  69. hotlick
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 5:32 pm | Permalink

    ksagnostic-Thanks for the conversation. It’s been interesting. BTW, I am also an agnostic.I must go now to teach the joys of a killer 1-2-1-1 full court press to my team.

  70. grayfox67212
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 10:18 pm | Permalink

    The trouble is, the Wichita Eagle doesn’t get it! This election was about protecting the American people from both the far right and left. As stated before, the Eagle endorsed Tiahrt solely because of his committee positions not on his position on major issues. He tried and was successful in distancing himself from President Bush and the Iraq war. He never once (as far as I know) mentioned that he supported the war or backed the President 99.9% of the time. The media never once called for a debate between Tiahrt and his opponent (whoever he was). Because Tiahrt’s opponent did not have very much money and the Eagle didn’t print his position on major issues, we do not know if he would have been a better representative. This only proves two things: money talks and good politicians are lost; and as my mother always said’ “we have the best politicians that money can buy”.

  71. political_mom
    Posted November 9, 2006 at 11:19 pm | Permalink

    I agree that newspapers need to be more open with allowing different points of view especially during election times. They need to present all the information. I had a friend who ran on the reform party, and he said he couldn’t get any papers to print his stuff. That’s just wrong. We are entitled to the information regardless of power or money.It is curious to me as to why the Eagle wouldn’t bring up Tiahrt…especially when they endorsed him.

  72. Jed
    Posted November 10, 2006 at 8:43 pm | Permalink

    I’d much rather elect a “tax and spend liberal” over a borrow and blow “conservative!”