Remember the guys in cockroach costumes at last month’s Kansas State Fair gubernatorial debate who protested Gov. Kathleen Sebelius’ veto of an abortion clinic regulations bill? State Rep. Vaughn Flora, D-Topeka (in photo), now faces a count of misdemeanor battery in Reno County for his alleged contact with one of the “cockroaches,” aka Troy Newman of Operation Rescue; a paper clip that was holding a mask cut Newman’s scalp during the incident. If convicted, Flora could face up to a year in prison and a fine of less than $1,000. Flora’s attorney is Rep. Jim Ward, D-Wichita.
Posted by Rhonda Holman
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59 Comments
Sebelius is far-left and opposes any and all moderate views on the abortion issue! She then plays up her conservative appeaser card to stay in office.
Just like Billary.
Works, doesn’t it?
Us in the great middle don’t make as much of an issue of this as the screamers on both sides.
Will – where has she ever squashed moderate views on abortion?
Ben,If you insist on asking dishonest questions while claiming ignorance of the facts, that’s your problem, not mine.:)
No more lies!
http://www.antiabortionsigns.com/letters.html
That site is utter bs Will. Didn’t know it was a real baby? How stupid was she then?
I love how all those women who beg for abortions claim innocence of not knowing afterward. Even in 1972- it was well known. She’s lucky she’s still alive to tell her story, many women weren’t so lucky…which is why it’s so important to keep it legal.
Sounds like one of those stories the antis make up to make it sound like they’re so tortured, because had she been a real activist, she would have known the truth.
And shame on you for calling our fabulous governor a skank. What are you in fourth grade?
And oh boo-hoo, a paperclip cut the cockroach’s head. Those people need a good stomping.
politicalmomStreet Activism gets out of hand sometimes, on both sides.Those on the streets, who do occasionally bump heads, should pay the price in court when politics gets physical.Some day soon, I am sure that someone you don’t agree with will be charged with a similar crime.How fair minded are you?When the rights of one of “your own” are violated, will you take it so lightly?It is not wise to advocate violence so openly.If it is ever you who does the “stomping” your words will surely come back to bite you.Self defense is one thing, but you seem to advocate the quashing of free speech that you dont agree with.
Oh come on now Paul, I was being facetous. Everyone has the right to speak their minds free from harm, I fully believe in that.
By the way, all you anti- stem cell research people out there…have you all been vaccinated? Do you vaccinate your kids? If so, you benefit from embryonic research. I won’t tell you what vaccines have in them.
will – how does your post prove that “Sebelius is far-left and opposes any and all moderate views on the abortion issue”? My question was honest; your reply bullshit.
Ti-heartless avoids this problem by never appearing at a public venue.
Hey, Paul, how do you like Ti-heartless’s ad in which he proudly proclaims he opposed Bush on the Dubai port deal?
Who is wrong, Paul? Tihart or Bush?
Oh, wait, they’re BOTH WRONG!
Ben: I think it was in 2003 that the Guv vetoed the bill that placed limitations on partial birth abortion. That seems pretty hard line to me.
But she is really no worse than RINO Bill. As a matter of fact, there isn’t much difference between Graves and Sebelius. They even kind of look alike.
When a grown man puts on a cockroach suit in the middle of the Kansas State Fair – he should be ready to accept anything that might happen to him.
But this way, Operation Rescue gets to play the victim and rake in even more millions from the anti-abortion radicals.
These Operation Resuce people will milk that golden goose for many more years to come. Perhaps that is why they never seem to be able to reduce the actual number of abortions in this country. Or do they really want to?
politicalmomYour facts are wrong on stem cells.We currently use umbillical cord stem cells and placenta stem cells and even adult stem cells, for both research and some actual treatment.You will be very hard pressed to prove that stem cells from aborted fetuses have been put to any successful medical purpose.By the way, stem cell research with cells from aborted babies is perfectly legal, if privately funded.The drug companies have no trouble making controversial drugs, abortion drugs and the like.If aborted baby stem cells had a snowballs chance in hell of doing anything positive, Million$$$ would be flowing in that direction.
Man, who clicked the wacko button on this site? Come on folks, play nice.
I’m still waiting for the anti-abortion group to rally against these fertility clinics for disposing of their unused fertilized eggs. To me that is just as bad as aborting a baby.Isn’t all life sacred?
Really now Paul?
It’s been long known that fetal cells are used in the making of vaccines of all types- but they’ve kept it pretty quiet about that for quite a long time. If you’ve had a vaccine, you’ve likely injected aborted babies into your body. And I”m not talking stem cells in vaccines, I’m talking actual fetal cells.
And yes, embryonic stem cells have been used in other countries, the adult stem cells that you all have been talking about haven’t been doing as much.
I’m talking about the ethics of it all….if you complain about fetal stem cells in therapy for illness, isn’t it just as wrong to be using fetal cells to grow your vaccines? Apparently not.http://www.cogforlife.org/articles.htm
The catholic church says when there is no other alternative, then it’s ok. However, what EFFECTIVE alternative are there for adults with degenerative diseases? Is it only ok when we are injecting our babies with vaccines because it’ll POTENTIALLY save their own baby’s life? AND even on top of that, it’s a theoretical disease, most of them aren’t even fatal.
So we’re comparing a potential, non-life threatening illness (like measles) being ok to treat with fetal cells…. but it’s NOT ok to reverse the effects of a lifelong debilitating disease that WILL end up fatal with stem cells.
Sigh……
Been on both sides of this one. I probably rubbed elbows with Paul Rosell at the “summer of mercy”. I was “pro life” back then. I managed not to get arrested. I hear Pauls experience was somewhat different.
Look, abortion is NOT going to go away. It just isn’t. Even if it is made illegal it will STILL HAPPEN. Republicans have had control of congress for 12 years. They make no real attempt to ban abortion because they need it for a continuing political football.
So Paul was arrested during the summer of absurdity huh?
To say that they won’t ban abortion- that’s not true. They’re already doing it. In South Dakota, they’ve closed down sole abortion providers in some states. They’re already limiting abortion, putting impossible restrictions on them. Don’t tell me not to worry.
Troy Newman is a very violent person who provokes people into fights. He’s attacked me without provocation, he’s tried to start a fight with a Buddhist at an anti-war protest, he consorts with notorious terrorists. Rep. Vaughn smacked Newman on the side of the head and Newman went crying like a little baby.
This is America the land of the free and freedom of speech.
Everyone is allowed to express his or her opinions and if you don’t like them walk away.
What this legislator did was wrong. The people of his district should be outraged. Obviously he is not capable of hearing both sides of an issue. Does he also physically attack Fred Phelps? Does he attack constituents when they disagree with him? Does he have an anger problem?
I don’t necessarily like some of the theatrics some folks do for attention but they are allowed to express themselves how they see fit as long as it does not violate the freedoms of others.
Will, Paul Rosell, others…
You want to ban abortion but you do not present your statement of reality which addresses the real concerns of women, 1) their rights to control their bodies. 2) if there is a ban what plan to you have for all the babies born into bad situations.
I personally am antiabortion but I strongly feel that a woman has a right to choose.
Here is my argument for the reduction and hopeful end to abortion.
Envision starting a large company. There is only one thing absolutely necessary to start a company, expecially a large company: money, capital.
It seems to me that churches and anti-abortion organizations are gathering and trying to raise money to combat pro-choicers..and the law.
What if the anti-abortion rhetoric and energy were put towards developing alternatives to abortion, alternatives such as adoption, pre-birth counseling, birth adjustment plans.I am not the type of Christian idealized by the GOP. I have to believe there is some hidden fear or disinterest within the anti-abortion Christian world and GOP that prevents these anti-abortionists from grouping and developing alternatives rather than screaming the word of God as if anyone should believe that any mortal human has the insight to speak for God. Taunting women who are planning an abortion or have received an abortion is a horrendous practice. It says that anti-abortionists have nothing practical to offer.Believe it or not, God is not the solution to many problems, especially social issues. Trying to put the fear of God in someone is suggesting that the taunter knows more about God than the tauntee.Impossible.Rather than tying the whole argument to religion, how about arguing that there is a better alternative.Woman who wish not to give birth – still do not wish to give birth whether they are Christian or not. However, if they can be assured that they can give birth and an Overwhelingly Concerned Christian Community has an alternative then the woman may be dissuaded.But there is no option other than to preach preach preach and shame shame shame.Folks, since when does preaching and shaming get the attention of a nation in a positive way. Let’s see, preaching and shaming causes this nation to withold secular rights from homosexuals. Preaching and shaming is trying to change to abortion laws. Preaching and shaming are the alternatives that Christians use when they don’t put their money where their mouth is.
Brownback – Bush – Santorum – are not going to elevate the rhetoric.In America some of us value the freedom from religion. Just look at the middle east to see what a state is like without freedom from religion.
Ending a viable life should not be a unilateral decision.
CALLING JOE WILLIAMS!
Here’s the bet we made exactly one year ago today:
Joe W.–You’re on. Oct 15, 2006. If people can drive from the airport to downtown Baghdad without an armed escort, if the country has a stable elected gov’t, if the US has pulled more than half of its 140,000 troops out, and we’re not losing 1-2 soldiers a day, then I will be happy to pay you 50 US dollars.
If however, any of the above is not true, you owe me.
*****
Joe—You can send your check to
Horace SantryPEACE AND SOCIAL JUSTICE CENTER of South Central Kansas1407 N. TopekaWichita, KS 67214-1107
I’ll be checking with Horace to see when he gets your check. The sooner you send it in, the sooner I’ll quit hounding you about it.
Thank you.
If Troy Newman is so concerned about violence in politics, why did he hire a convicted terrorist to serve as the spokesperson for Operation Rescue?
Cheryl Sullenger spent time in federal prison for her role in an attempted bombing of an abortion clinic in California. She bought ingredients to make the bomb and disguises to help her and her fellow bombers escape.
If Newman is concerned about stopping violence, he needs to look at his own group first.
Capn… keep us apprised of his payment…
Also, as Operation Rescue points out above, OR is a terrorist group and as far as im concerned, dressing up like cockroaches and disrupting an event like that is unacceptable. There is a time and a place for protesting and making your point.
Antics like this turns people off rather than convincing them to move to their side… I hope the judge gives him a $5 fine and tells Troy to go to hell…
Operation Rescue believes abortion is murder and they act like it. Nothing wrong with that.
hotlick
Yea, there is something wrong with that when they step on MY constitutional rights.
Troy Newman, in his book, “Their Blood Cries Out” (don’t worry, if you want a copy they have plenty left), advocates the murder of abortion providers as well as any women who get an abortion. If Troy had his way there would be bloody carnage on a massive scale.
In addition to advocating murder he has terrorists on the payroll. There’s the convicted clinic bomber Cheryl Sullenger, there’s Keith Mason (who dressed up in a cockroach costume with Newman) who runs around with Army of God members and sues people for a living, Danny Ware who was busted for plotting a terrorist attack during a pro-choice rally, and Randy Richardson, a pedophile.
He’ll tell you that he’s pro-life, whatever that means.
Your right to have an abortion?
hotlick
Yes, if i choose to…
I’ll go ahead and justify it while im here cause i know ur going to ask…
It is my right to be free from Religion.
Anti-abortion sentiment MOSTLY comes from within religious bounds.
Therefor, I should be free from some nut job like Troy from telling me what i can and cant do.
The same thing applies for pornography, euthanasia, gay marriage, and other religiousally charged issues…
And God spake unto Troy Newman and Keth Mason saying ” Adorn thyselves as insects and accost the multitudes in the market place. Be of loud and annoying voice. Stick thou thy noses also into the bedchambers of those thou dost determine unclean.”
Tony-I’m with you, partly. It was the religious people who led the fight against slavery, so I don’t quite get that part of your argument. As the good conservative that I am, I just the goverment to leave me alone. But, I am a 3 month pro-choicer. I know some would say that is not consistant, but I don’t care.Just because something is led by religious folks, doesn’t necessarily make it bad.When I was in 3rd grade, the teacher started each day with a prayer and a reading from the New Testiment. It didn’t hurt me, but I’m not for that in the goverment schools. It’s not their job. If you want that, go to a private skool.
JR; I am intrigued that you were a pro-life demonstrator during the summer of mercy. What changed? I think Al Gore was once pro-life too, but of course, he is a politician and his convictions are for sale.
But you have no reason to sell yours. And to go from strongly pro-life to pro-choice is a big step. You have to go from believing that a child in the womb is a human life and deserving of protection, to thinking that a mother’s right to choose to kill her unborn child is more important.
Care to expound on that?
wow hotlick,
and all this time i figured u to be a avid pro-lifer…
about slavery though, u are right there, sorta, but i would probably say it was as much a regional and informed mentality rather than truly religious.
but, in today’s society we are so polarized by the abortion (and other hot button issue) that it will be detrimental to future society.
Like i mentioned in another post, one of the major reasons that younger people do not involve themselves in politics is because of the attacks from the pro-lifers…
The verbal and sometimes physical beatings politicians get from the pro-lifers and pro-choicers make politics undesirable… I would want to put up with it or put my family though it…
Tony-I guess you figured wrong. As far as the young people you speak of, I say too bad. That is one lousy excuse. What? It’s too hard? People are too mean? I say game up.
Outlander,
I’ve told the story of my personal change in thinking as to abortion before. Long story short, it was having my own kids that changed my views. I realized that it was wrong to think of a child as a punishment or a consequence for some “wrong” action. Parenting is an awesome responsibility not a penance. Also after witnessing pregnancy up close, I realized that it is not something that a woman should be forced to endure against her will.There was also the fact that I had a friend in an abusive relationship (her fault yes to a degree) She got pregnant by her abuser and litterally begged me to help her pay for an abortion. That happened while I was still straddling the fence. A baby would have got this guys hooks into my friend for the next 18 years. Neither the mother and especially not the father were what I would consider fit parents. So I paid for a procedure I had only a year earlier picketed against.
Little refresher here. I call some folks “pro life” and others pro life.
I found also and still do that most “pro life” folks lose all interest in the ….gonna use a “bad” word here….welfare of the child the very instant that the child emerges from the womb.I’m not much on embracing hypocrisy and as long as every child is not truly wanted by society as a whole “pro life” folks are fighting on the wrong battlefield.
hotlick
why should i get attacked left and right and be called all sorts of names because i believe the way i do…
I’m not going to let my kids hear or go through that… most people my age wont deal with it because of the attacks…
politics used to be civil… you talked about policies and public life, not attacking their families or their personal beliefs or attacked personally for their personal beliefs…
when my dad ran for state house, he and my family were called every name in the book by the wackos… Hell, my dad was even declared gay…
Those type of actions rnt civil and that’s why good people wont run.
JR
Great post… “I found also and still do that most “pro life” folks lose all interest in the ….gonna use a “bad” word here….welfare of the child the very instant that the child emerges from the womb.”
I say that i would be happy if the “pro lifers” would pony up the money and resources to take care of all of these unwanted kids till they become adults, i believe the current numbers are $330k per kid. that doesn’t include health care or collage.
Tony-Again, I’m with you. Name calling etc. is not necessary. If you want to run for office, you had better have led the life of a monk or something. If I ran, it would take two terms just to empty all the skeletons out of my closet.Nobody needs that
hell, it would take 5 min for everyone to come out of the closet and smear me with dumb things i did when i was in highschool and drunk…
Hot,” It was the religious people who led the fight against slavery, so I don’t quite get that part of your argument.”It was you religious conservatives that were quoting bible verses agaist civil rights back in the ’60’s, claiming that god had ordained segregation and white supremacy.
JR and Tony: In my view your arguments; ie cost, inconvenience etc.. are somewhat logical arguments on the surface. But I don’t see how they ever rise to the point of trumping a human being’s right to life.
I suppose that illustrates the nut of a debate that will be unresolved as long as there are abortions.—–
From what I’ve seen of Troy Newman, whatever you do, don’t buy a used car from that guy. He probably scratched himself and hollered assault!
Outlander, I was also staunchly anti-choice, when I was brainwashed by religion. It took me really living life to see that life isn’t always Rosy, God aint gonna rescue you, and that everyone has the right to believe for themselves what is right for them and their lives.
Jed–For one, they are not my religious conservatives. For two, inexplicably, the Bible does not condemn slavery. Even Jesus does not. Don’t put me in that catagory. They were wrong.
God DID oradian segregation and that has not changed. Rather it was the Mormons and cowards like Bob Jones who changed to keep their tax exempt status.
V.L.R.B!!
hotlick – it was also ‘religious’ people in the South who used the Bible to justify slavery. Just like we have a guy here who says “God DID oradian segregation and that has not changed.”
Ben-I am afraid that you are right. Like I said, the Bible was used at that time to justify slavery. And, pitifuly, they weren’t wrong, Biblicly speaking. Make no mistake, slavery was constitutional. Sometime that is what happens when you compromise like they did when the constitution was ratified. I don’t know about the bible ratifying segragation, but it wouldn’t suprise me.
proble is hotlick – depending how you read it and edit the parts you use you can get all sorts of things from the various books by various authors that make up the Bible. In fact, different versions of Christianity accept different selections of books.
Add to that the problems with translation …
That last part is part of why a Muslim must study the Quran in Arabic. But, at least they will lat me (an infidel) read an English translation.
Ben-Different versions of Christianity do use different books of the Bible, but this has very little to do with our discussion, and the “translation” problem is too weak. It is a diversion. True, the translation problem is important for the subleties, but not for what we are talking about. Slavery was not condemned in the Bible. It was something to be avoided it you could help it. I don’t see any other way it could be interpreted. Again, Jesus did not condemn it. If anybody has any scripture to cite saying otherwise, I would love to see it.I do not have a dog on this fight.
Christianity would have had an almost impossible time becoming established had the subject of slavery been taken on at that time in history. And this is consistent, as Christians are instructed (in Romans 13:1)to obey the authorities. Jesus Himself made it clear that His kingdom was not of this world.
But the principles of the New Testament are those of brotherhood and equality in God’s sight.The fact that anti-slavery attitudes naturally evolved in the Christian community as they followed these principles speaks of the effectiveness of God’s plan. Note also that the original anti-slavery leaders in the U.S. were members of Christian sects.
Those using the Bible to justify slavery were clearly in error.
Abortion is not a constitutional right. Neither is marriage considered a right, it’s not even mentioned in the Bill of Rights for Pete’s sake! That’s why the Supreme Court won’t even touch the gay marriage issue. You guys need to go out and get a copy of the Constitution with the Articles of Confederation if you libs want me to take you seriously. :)
A cursory browse on US Supreme Court:1967: U.S. Supreme Court in Loving v. Virginia overturns all state bans on interracial marriage, declaring the “freedom to marry” belongs to all citizens.1978: U.S. Supreme Court in Zablocki v. Redhail declares that marriage is “of fundamental importance to all individuals,” “one of the ‘basic civil rights of man’”, and “the most important relation in life”. It declares “the right to marry is part of the fundamental ‘right to privacy’” in the U.S. Constitution.1987: U.S. Supreme Court in Turner v. Safley articulates four attributes of marriage: 1. expression of emotional support and public commitment; 2. spiritual significance, and for some the exercise of a religious faith; 3. the expectation that for most, the marriage will be consummated; and 4. the receipt of tangible benefits, including government benefits and property rights. Because incarcerated prisoners can enter into a marriage with these four characteristics, the Court declares that they deserve the freedom to marry and invalidates Missouri’s ban on marriages between prison inmates.
http://www.uulmca.org/documents/History_Mariage_Equality.doc
So, the Supreme Court is simply unwilling to take the issue on same-sex marriage … yet.
“Note also that the original anti-slavery leaders in the U.S. were members of Christian sects.
Those using the Bible to justify slavery were clearly in error”
No disagreement here at all outlander. Many of the original civil rights leaders were also Christian; meanwhile segregationists found ways to justify their policies through Scripture. My point above was that there are far too many who will find a way to twist scripture in whatever way they want.
will – the Constitution DOES have mention of “equal protection under the law.” Marriage is a legal entity. That is how we get to the arguements about “gay marriage” – to allow for equal legal treatment. Abortion, as I understand it, comes in via “right to privacy” which I think comes from an interpretation of “being secure in persons and property.”
“Ti-heartless avoids this problem by never appearing at a public venue.”
Why, sure he does, Capn. He rides in parades while his literature is distributed. Not that he says much to anyone. He’s too busy getting to the next parade to actually speak with his consituents. Yet they continue to vote for him, accepting his untruths as truths and ignoring the fact that he does nothing for his state.
Trinity isn’t mentioned in the Bible but it doesn’t prevent Christians from finding material in the Bible to support the trinity. The same goes with the right to privacy and other rights not spelled out in the Bible. The authors of the Constitution could have written a lengthy Bill of Rights but they never assumed people would be so willfully ignorant about the issue.
“there’s Keith Mason (who dressed up in a cockroach costume with Newman) who runs around with Army of God members and sues people for a living”
Geez, isnt that a PHELPS family value?
Isnt that want phredd and his family do? Provoke people, then sue them and live on the proceeds?
hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee
Tell me again why you righties whip up such outrage everytime you are compared to the PHELPS family?
Seems like you all, especially newman and paulie the shillie, have copied their tactics so well…
… you would be FLATTERED by the comparison.
After all, isnt immitation the sincerest form of flattery?
Just for the record, I know Vaughn and his mother. In fact, she eats my fried chicken every Sunday, and I am proud to have her, and her entire family as my customers.
Go JIM!! Dont let these phelps wanna be’s smear a very good man.
Vaughn also has a great track record on water issues.
heheheh.
And you cockroaches? Your track record would be…what?
Leaving “tracks” for others to clean up?
heheheheheheheh
Oh yeah, Keith is a hoot. He violently attacks old men and is surprisingly quiet and well hidden when around people who can stand up to him. Despite not being employed he owns a $100,000 house which he hasn’t paid his taxes on.
A real model citizen.
“Despite not being employed he owns a $100,000 house which he hasn’t paid his taxes on.
A real model citizen.”
sounds like he went to the terry fox school of leadership….
Has the little ayatollah paid his property taxes yet?
Why is tax evasion a conservative family value?
Something they share with snipes out in “hollyweird”.
Who knew the cons and the stars had so much in common.
Why do they hate paying their taxes? Why to they love terrorists?
Why do they hate america?
heheheheheheheh