The idea of America’s richest people dodging their taxes in droves might not come as a surprise these days, but it’s still maddening. Especially when the problem is described in a Senate report as so rampant that it’s now beyond the control of law enforcement.
The report estimates the loss to honest taxpayers at about $70 billion a year. The beneficiaries are a variety of billionaires who apparently availed themselves of offshore tax havens while the rest of us were staring wearily at a Turbotax screen and wondering where we mislaid that shoebox full of receipts. Two of the billionaires, who testified yesterday before a Senate panel, are described as victims — unwittingly duped by advisers into believing that all was aboveboard. Well. There are victims, and then there are victims.
The report urges changes, of course: Going after law firms and accounting firms, banks and investment advisers. Here’s a call from the cheap seats: How about a tax code that is not written, via lobbying, by those very same interests?
Posted by Dave Knadler
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77 Comments
DaveMost of the millionaires in Congress are Democrats. The Kennedy and Kerry and Gore familes all make huge use of trust funds and perfectly legal accounting to avoid lots of taxes.The “rich” however, are paying a larger share of the total tax burden now than they ever did under Clinton.
Dave,
You are a great addition to the “junior members” of the WE editorial board!
Take care.
Paul, I don’t think it will take too much effort to discredit your statements. Will do so tomorrow, during a break. Thanks for posting nonsense. You help discredit your ideology in more ways than your small mind could ever conceive.
Good on you AGAIN Dave to come out swinging!
These folks working and EMPLOYING lawyers to protect their obscene wealth are the SAME folk who want an increase in the minimum wage tied to a repeal of the estate tax.
HONESTLY? How do so few demand so much? Is wealth and total comfort not enough? Do they have some sick need to exploit and hurt others?
I note also Steven, Pauls attempts at “moderation”. I don’t trust them. And I don’t trust him.
“One may smile and smile and be a villian”
This is a CNN link which shows that more Repubs are millionaires in the Senate than Democrats.
Pauly, will finish you off later, okay? I know you look forward to it, or you wouldn’t make it so easy.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/06/13/senators.finances/
Senate millionairesJohn Kerry, D-Massachusetts: $163,626,399Herb Kohl, D-Wisconsin: $111,015,016John Rockefeller, D -West Virginia: $81,648,018Jon Corzine, D-New Jersey: $71,035,025Dianne Feinstein, D-California: $26,377,109Peter Fitzgerald, R-Illinois: $26,132,013Frank Lautenberg, D-New Jersey $17,789,018Bill Frist, R-Tennessee: $15,108,042John Edwards, D-North Carolina: $12,844,029Edward Kennedy, D-Massachusetts: $9,905,009Jeff Bingaman, D-New Mexico: $7,981,015Bob Graham, D-Florida: $7,691,052Richard Shelby, R-Alabama: $7,085,012Gordon Smith, R-Oregon: $6,429,011Lincoln Chafee, R-Rhode Island: $6,296,010Ben Nelson, D-Nebraska: $6,267,028Lamar Alexander, R-Tennessee: $4,823,018Mike DeWine, R-Ohio: $4,308,093Mark Dayton, D-Minnesota: $3,974,037Ben Campbell, R-Colorado: $3,165,007Chuck Hagel, R-Nebraska: $2,963,013Olympia Snowe, R-Maine: $2,955,037James Talent, R-Missouri: $2,843,031Arlen Specter, R-Pennsylvania: $2,045,016Judd Gregg, R-New Hampshire: $1,916,026John McCain, R-Arizona: $1,838,010James Inhofe, R-Oklahoma: $1,570,043John Warner, R-Virginia: $1,545,039Kay Bailey Hutchison, R – Texas: $1,513,046Mitch McConnell, R-Kentucky: $1,511,017Harry Reid, D-Nevada: $1,500,040Sam Brownback, R-Kansas: $1,491,018Thomas Carper, D-Delaware: $1,482,017Ted Stevens, R-Alaska: $1,417,013Maria Cantwell, D-Washington: $1,264,999Barbara Boxer, D-California: $1,172,003Orrin Hatch, R-Utah: $1,086,023Mary Landrieu, D-Louisiana: $1,080,014Bill Nelson, D-Florida: $1,073,014Charles Grassley, R-Iowa: $1,016,024*These figures are base estimates provided by senators on their financial disclosure forms.
The above from CNN. The largest number of millionaires in the Senate are of the Republican party. We can argue over-all weatlth, if you would like, but I doubt if you are smart enough to do that.
Notice Mr. Brownback in the pack. Interesting, no?
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0630-05.htm
Income and wealth are too entirely different things Steve. Perhaps I should be more careful on statements that are hard to prove, but the point of conservatives on tax rate cuts has always been: The Rich Dont Have to Earn Income, therefore, we have to cut tax rates to encourage them to earn! (And therefore raise MORE revenue from them)I still say most of the WEALTH of the Senate is heald by Dems.And of course, I said Congress so I still might be right, since you focused on the Senate alone.I bet you were even surprised by your post, with who was on top.Thanks for the research, andCongratulations for comming up with lots of Republican names.However, do you realize that money held in an irrevocable trust does NOT belong in the estate but can still be drawn upon for “health, education, welfare,” etc?Also, section 529 money, or College Savings Plans, have become the biggest tax dodge out there. Trust me on that one, these things are better than any lawyer written trust, and the “penalty” is less for using it for whatever you want (other than educaction) than what you would pay in taxes anyway. Again, this number is not in the estate and I doubt anyone reports it.My point for the “trust fund democrats” is that we will NEVER know how much wealth is actually controlled by the Kerry, Gore, Kennedy and Rockefeller families.They are OLD MONEY. They don’t really need income, they can live on muni bonds and trust fund money and charitable gift annuity money and any number of tax dodges that they ALL voted for. Some of these legal tax dodges will protect their Estates as well.It is the Entreprenuers family, or the farmer or the small business people that get hit with high estate taxes.The Kennedys would sue any attorney that cost them an Estate tax.Tax rate cuts help the non rich become rich.Tax rate cuts encourage those who dont have to be productive at all to be productive.Again Steve, since everyone in here shoots down the research of conservatives, I prefer to have you post your stuff and then work off of it.Not long ago, the raw number of millionaires was higher for dems than republicans in the Senate.I am still betting that the raw number figures are higher for Dems in the entire Congress.Have at it slugger.Prove me wrong!—–
Thank goodness Tiahrt recently voted to give tax cheats a tax cut and lowered the minimum wage for those making poverty level wages. If there’s one thing Republicans know how to do is to reward criminals.
and by the way, I counted 22 Republicans on your list and 18 dems.What is the “party of the working man” doing with 18 millionaires in the Senate?The Republican Party would LOVE it if everyone was rich, only the Democrats depend on the “poverty vote”I can’t wait for your House figures.And, by the way, if the Dems do take over either house, it will be because they have some millionaires running for office as well.
DougHow many pardons did Clinton hand out in his last week in office? Some of those were to political buddies who were also tax cheats.Quick Steve, look that one up for us will you?
SteveBy the way, with the Republican majority, is it not also true that a higher percentage of Senate Democrats are millionaires as compared to Senate Republicans?
Let’s see, the government can’t or won’t control the problem of tax evasion by the wealthy. I am willing to bet that shrub offers the crooks an “amnesty” whereby they pay a fraction of the taxes that they evaded! If amnesty is good for raping, drug dealing, disease ridden wetbacks then it is good for millionaires and billionaires too, right? Our government is a sick joke!
v.L.R.B!!
And isn’t it also true Paul that you sold out your union, failed in your career as a jprnalist, and became a trader…..or was that traitor?
Who are you working for Paul?
Gettin extra for shilling late are ya Paul?
YOU know. Planting your seeds when no one is here to question?
Aww but I am here.What is your agenda Paul and is it your agenda? Or…..are you paid to trouble us?
T H E W E A L T H P R I M A R Y
Millionaires in the House* / Assets in MillionsAmory Houghton (R-NY)$420.0Michael Huffington (R-Calif)$75.0Norm Sisisky (D-Va)$30.0Herbert Klein (D-NJ)$20.0Jane Harman (D-Calif)$15.0Nancy Peloisi. (D-Calif)$8.5Terry Everett (R-Ala)$8.0Porter Goss (R-Fla)$8.0Sid Yates (D-111)$7.0Jimmy Quillen (R-Tenn)$6.5John Mica (D-Fla)$5.6Charles Taylor (R-NC)$5.5Jim Sensenbrenner (R-Wis)$5.2Pete Stark (D-Calif)$5.2John Spratt (D-SC)$5.1Jim Leach (R-lowa)$5.0Owen Pickett (D-Va)$4.5Pete Geren (D-Texas)$4.0J.J. Pickle (D-Texas)$3.6Jack Brooks (D-Texas)$3.5Lynn Schenk (D-Calif)$3.4Ralph Hall (D-Texas)$3.2Joe Kennedy (D-Mass)$3.0Jay Kim (R-Calif)$3.0Carloyn Maloney (D-NY)$3.0Harry Johnston (D-Fla)$2.9Nita Lowey (D-NY)$2.9E. Clay Shaw (R-Fla)$2.9Cliff Steams (R-Fla)$2.7Martin Hoke (A-Ohio)$2.6Tom Lewis (R-Fla)$2.6Roscoe Bartlett (R-Md)$2.5Tom Petri (R-Wis)$2.2Bill Archer (A-Texas)$2.0John Linder (R-Ga)$2.0Arthur Ravenel (R-SC)$1.8Dan Miller (R-Fla)$1.8Scotty Beasler (D-Ky)$1.7Jim Cooper (D-Tenn)$1.7Ben Cardin (D-Md)$1.6Don Edwards (D-Calif)$1.6John Boehner (A-Ohio)$1.5Marylin Lloyd (D-Tenn)$1.5Lewis Payne (D-Va)$1.5James Bilbray (D-Nev)$1.4Nick Joe Rahall (D-WVa)$1.4Bud Schuster (R-Pa)$1.4Fred Upton (R-Mich)$1.4Dave Hobson (A-Ohio)$1.3Neal Smith (D-lowa)$1.3Karen Shepherd (D-Utah)$1.3Cal Dooley (D-Calif)$1.2Rob Portman (A-Ohio)$1.2Tillie Fowler (R-Fla)$1.2Bill Clinger (R-Pa)$1.1Thomas Ewing (R-111)$1.1Jack Fields (A-Texas)$1.1Mel Hancock (R-Mo)$1.1Wally Herger(R-Calif)$1.1Bill Baker (R-Caiif)$1.0Cass Ba!lenger (R-NC)$1.0Sonny Calahan (R-Ala)$1.0David Drier (R-Calif)$1.0Paul Gillmor (A-Ohio)$1.0William Hughes (D-NJ)$1.0James Inhofe (R-Okla)$1.0Mike Parker (D-Miss)$1.0Bob Smith (R-Ore)$1.0Nick Smith (R-Mich)$1.CFioyd Spence (R-SC)$10Dick Zimmer (R-NJ)$1.0
—–
This is an old list, from this link, which I dont agree with by the way:http://www.opensecrets.org/pubs/law_wp/wealth06.htm
this study was done a few years ago, cant find one on the current congress. I think the A’s on the list just posted refer to folks that are no longer in Congress, did a fast check and that is all I could figure out.Anyway, I get 32 D’s and 28 R’s in the remaining millionaire list in the house.So, in total, it is probably close to a draw huh?And, most of the wealth held by Congressmen and women is held by Democrats.So Steve, What did you come up with?
SteveIt is STILL true that a higher percentage of Congressional Democrats are millionaires than Congressional Republicans.
JRI never failed as a journalist, that is spelled j o u r n a l i s t.I have been paid by a few publications but not recently.Yes, I like to write, in spite of my faults, such as spelling (a fault which I share with you.) The degree you keep refering to was out of the journalism school, but was not a reporting degree, it was, as I told you, in Advertising, PR and Marketing.Why must you make things so personal?My agenda, really, has always been to challenge the insular journalists and other liberals to question some of their articles of faith.I enjoy it.Sorry if you don’t.Get over it.You act like a Tom Cat marking its territory.Guess what? This place doesn’t “belong” to either one of us and we need to leave the personal junk out of here.I am not going to bore the other bloggers with personal stuff anymore.Not in answer to you anyway.Get someone else to ask and I will consider an answer.And don’t forget, I made my union very successful and was rewarded with a vandalised vehicle when I cautioned against a strike. The company was Safeway. The Union drove them out of town, just like you and your buddies will do to the aircraft industry if you keep putting nails on the street and paint thinner on cars. Whoops, sorry, I just accused you of something with no proof, I will leave that to you in the future, my apologies.
By the way, I think there is really nothing wrong with millionaires in Congress. I agree with Medved.Again, only trying to pop some liberal bubbles in here.http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/printer-friendly.asp?ARTICLE_ID=30231
Way to move on without name calling there Paul.Another member of the ‘do as I say, not as I do’ club.The only bubble needing popped around here is your huge ego.
Defending the indefensable again.
Paul,If your job is to pop Liberal bubbles in here, you are failing miserably. I expect your job is a shill for the Republican national. Tell us about MUR 4518 and Randy Rathbun.
The problem with offshore accounts and tax evasion covers both parties. It is funny, though, the Republican led house inserted the tax break for the upper crust into the wage increase bill. Kinda deflates your bubble, doesn’t it?
It would be interesting to see a list of those taking advantage of all the tax havens. I would bet we would be seeing a broad spectrum of political bases involved. But the majority would probably include recognizable names from all walks of life. You in there Paul?
You made YOUR union very successful? Or did you work FOR a union? Shop Steward? You can prove it was a union member who vandalized your car? Under union orders? Were the union demands so outragious as to drive a company out of town? Or were the demands done to give the workers a decent living? Was Safeway bought out by another company around that time? Just asking.
OMG too funny! And the funniest part is that he doesnt even know how funny he is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Paul, sweetie, cant you do your own research? Cant you research before you make stupid and FALSE statements? heheh
Even when proven WRONG, he wont admit it, he just keeps working that shovel.
Son, a little piece of advise here, Molly Ivins says the first rule of holes is to stop digging. When you are shown to be the vapid blogfart you are, it isnt smart to change the subject, be WRONG again, and then tout how wrong you are?
Where did that degree come from again? heheheheh A cereal box?
DD proved you wrong, your own pitiful attemp at research proved you wrong, you ARE wrong on the millionaires issue, and WTF? it MATTERS how many millionaires are in each party?
hehehehehehehehehe
We are TOTALLY amused and urge you to try again Paul!!!!
And which party’s millionaires always votes to protect their self interest when it comes to taxation, Paul?
Instead of Protect, I should have said increase, their wealth, at the expense of everyone else.
I seriously doubt Paul is a Proll, who in their right minds would pay for such ieffectual representation? He is more like Colmes, of hannity and colmes, just put in there to make his purported side look dumb!
heee heee heeee
Ya steve, I think if someone has been paying Paul to be a republican shill, they oughta ask for their money back!!!
Heheh. Or maybe the DEMOCRATS should pay him since he makes them look like a REASONABLE alternative!
hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee hee
Come on Paul, truth in advertising time.
Are you really on JOHN KERRY’s payroll?
Hey republicans, why no representation on the connie morris thread?
Come over there paul and work on your “republican shill” routine.
I think it needs a little polishing right now, no?
heheheheheheh
Paul you are using limbaugh logic. Who cares what the breakdown is in congress. I don’t have the exact figures but estimated 200 people in the USA control 86% of it’s total wealth and asserts. We fight over the 14% that’s left over.
Your party carries the water for these people. Job well done.
BTW how do know what the Kennedy’s think or do? Do you have a direct line to the CLENIS which tells you all things that are Democratic.
The Fair Tax will end it all.
There would be no reason for the wealthy and the uber rich to shelther their money.
http://www.fairtax.org/
.morg, good post.To the point.No name calling.No spin.Made your point.AND moved on.
Take a lesson Paul.
Joe I like the fair tax or straight tax or whatever they call it now. Pay the same amount per earnings no matter what you earn.Fair.
ksfrmgirl, I consider myself somewhat of a snarky smart-ass myself, but it is a real pleasure to read and blog with ya’, as I can’t even take the bronze in competition with you.You are the queen of snarky, and I submit myself as one of your lowly subjects.(long deep bow)Long live Queen Snarky!
Why thank you Tracy. I consider that a high compliment coming from the master.
hehehehe
Joe, when you say fair tax do you mean a flat income tax or a national sales tax?
I dont like the flat income tax, still too many shyster lawyers and CPA’s to help the rich escape paying via deductions and credits.
I like the national sales tax, otherwise known as the consumption tax. But I only like it if food and medicine are exempted.
Advantages? No filing, collections on the spot, no weasling out of taxes for the rich, and the poor can control their tax bill by curbing spending.
Like they have anything to spend on stuff besides food and medicine and rent….
It’s a national sales tax. With a prebate to those on or below the poverty line, so they don’t have to pay for it.
There would have to be a very strict restriction on the food and drug part. It can be easily abused and you would get lobbyist trying to “exempt” their products all the time.
If you said, tax exempt for freash produce, juice, and milk. That might work. Drugs would be ok. But if we go to far on exemptions, we will soon go back to income and FICA taxes again.
In any case, this blatant abuse by the GOP is outrageous.
Take from the poor and give to the rich is the absolute bottom line.
Your welcome farmgirl, and thanks back at ya’
Beware the so called “fair tax”! Without going deeply into it, just watch who supports it.
My main bitch with the fair tax is mobility of capital.Say you make your money here,pay little for infastructure,get free military proctection for the transportation of your chinese manufactured goods.
But make all your purchases overseas.
I know JR, I have to take a shower everytime I think about it, but damn, it couldnt be any more UNFAIR than the current system.
And you know big money aint ever gonna go for fair….
“And which party’s millionaires always votes to protect their self interest when it comes to taxation, Paul?”
Getting back late to this discussion, but the above is clearly the relevant question, rather than who has more millionaires in office. It looks as though they are all pretty rich, if you ask me.
Yeah Paul, if there are so many rich democrats, and you hate democrats….
….why do you hate rich people Paul?
Paul,I would recommend reseraching before making assertions. This has the practical advantage of avoiding taking up bandwidth with redefining your statements later.
hee hee hee
That was my best imitation of republican logic.
Hey KFG! Off Topic! About your Restaurant in Collyer, Kansas. You were saying your website was down. What hours and days are you open?
Well, their is a difference between wealthy and greedy.
The guy running against Lieberman…..name escapes me at the moment. HE is wealthy. He is also a self made man and life long Democrat. He is ALSO going to beat Lieberman!
I saw the guy on Colbert’s show. Real foward and direct!
KFG,I would say it was a good imitation. And I would add if he hates rich people, why does he love the terrorists?
OFF TOPIC: I saw the “V for Vendetta” dvd last night. If you want to see a scathing critique of the Bush adminstration (set in the near future England) this is the movie to see.
JMOk, you are not RJ, so I will answer.The Retail Clerks Union paid me to try to organize Dillons into the Union, since Safeway made a deal with the Union that Safeway would be more willing to grant raises if Dillons was also unionized.We came very close to getting the Clerks at Dillons unionized. Then Dillons granted an accross the board raise.Safeway didnt think that was good enough so the Safeway raise was smaller than expected.We went on strike.It lasted a long time.I helped get several other cities involved, like KC, Omaha, etc.The Unions there respected the peaceful picket lines and spreading the strike helped end the strike.Then, 3 years later, I realized that Safeway was in a BAD competitive situation and asked my fellow union members not to strike.I had borrowed my brothers truck that night.It was parked in the Machinists lot for the meeting.I argued with a number of people in the parking lot that night, close to the truck.That night, the windows were shot out of the truck and a brick with a nasty note was in the front seat.I guess the tooth fairy did it.
Hey folks,Are you not missing a HUGE point? Can’t you honestly admit that there are more Democrat millionaires than you realized in Congress?Can’t you admit that the wealtiest members of Congress are Democrats and not Republicans?Can’t you realize that the people reading these posts, who are not posting themselves, are learning a lot of things they didn’t know before, and that knowledge transfer is enhanced by your angry retorts, which make this more interesting and memorable?You are doing what I want.What do I care if you like me or not?
I really don’t see the relevance of the number of millionaires in Congress?
Can you enlighten me to the grand purpose there Paul?
The liberal myth is that the Republican Party is the “party of the rich”Actually, the Republican Party would love it if everyone were rich.High tax rates dont hurt the rich, high tax rates keep the poor and middle class from becommming rich.High tax rates don’t hurt the wealthy trust fund democrats, they have hidden their wealth from the tax man through legal means.You are arguing details that dont matter.Historically speaking, the percentage of millionaires in the Dem Party has been higher than it has been for the Republicans, as far as Congress is concerned.That is still the truth today.My hyperbole did not earn me an “A” but I didnt flunk either.Besides, this isnt about me is it?Come on, someone in here claim that they knew these figures before reading these posts from Steve and myself.Lots of you learned some uncomfortable information.I win!
What you are doing paid poster Paul is shilling and lying.
It has become virtually impossible for any but the wealthy to run for office. Now I’d like if that were different. But for now it is the reality we live with.
So some Democrats are wealthy? Your point?
It is the REPUBLICAN party that just the other day tacked an increase in the minimum wage onto a repeal of the ESTATE TAX. This is a tax that affects only a few thousand of the most obscenely wealthy…..the very sort of folks this thread is about. So it should be remembered that the GOP is the party of a slightly larger crumb for those who have nothing and an all you can eat buffet for the super wealthy!
I dont HATE Democrats.The late Jan Kennedy was one of my best friends, and you Democrats treated her like dirt. I stood up for her more than any Democrat ever did.
Paul,You win the prize for making the most useless statements so far: A ball cap, size 2.
There is NO relevence to your supposition. Remember: it was the Republicans who pretty much sunk the minimum wage increase with their add-on tax break for the filty rich, or, as you seem to think, themselves.
So, paul, you lose in the long run, along with the lower class minimum wage earners in this country. With that in mind, it would probably be a good idea if you stayed completly away from any union organizers.
Well looky upthread folks!
Paul sold out his union because SOMEONE vandalized his truck.
People have DIED for their unions. Poor poor Paul and his mussed up truck.
You didn’t finish the story Paul.
You know, the part where you prove it was angry union members you were selling out that damaged your truck? They were caught right?
Or maybe it was the company that trashed your truck Paul.
People don’t lose their “souls” Paul. They sell them.
How much did yours go for?
JR:
Question: You’ve stated several times, as I peruse your favorite current target, that you believe Paul to be a “paid poster” – your direct quote.
Any evidence for such an accusation?
Just wonderin’
JRAre you willing to state, in here, that you know of NO union vandalism or violence against those who disagree with you?Your threat seems to back me up, huh?I have several Union members as clients and customers. Most think that organized labor is a necessary evil.The rank and file usually realize that the union bosses lead them astray at times.That happens to be my position as well.I did’t “sell out” — I realized that class envy politics was self destructive.You hate your employer JR. Do you “sell out” every time you cash your check?Again, the minumum wage hurts the poor.The minimum wage forces those who are worth less than that arbitrary figure to be fired.The minimum wage causes higher unemployment.Economics folks.
Paul, you made the statements about rich Democrats in Congress, but you offer no proof. Then you followed up with a blizzard of bullshit.
You talk a lot, but you’re not very good at supporting what you say. Since everybody agrees you’re “truth challenged, you need to start backing up your BS.
Paul?
“Your threat seems to back me up”
Nice try. The casual reader might glide right over that line and assume I had threatened you. An attempt by you to discredit me.
Where did I threaten you Paul? Isn’t that just another of your lies?
Yeah X
See how he slid that little line in there about me “threatening” him?
That is an outright lie.
So, paul, you lose in the long run, along with the lower class minimum wage earners in this country. With that in mind, it would probably be a good idea if you stayed completly away from any union organizers.
Posted by: J M Walker | August 03, 2006 at 11:40 AM
JM said itmy apologiesI have trouble keeping all of you “brave” people with your fake names straight.But this one was my fault and I beg your forgiveness.
No dice Paul.
J M didn’t threaten you either.
Go ahead, spin some more Paul.
Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive!
OMG, I am rolling now!!!
See my advise above dude about the first rule of holes.
HEHEHEHE
DD and HIS OWN RESEARCH show more millionaires in CONGRESS that are republican, and he does some kind of victory dance because there are ANY democrat rich guys in congress?
Woo hoo, and he thinks he enlightened the unwashed masses to something? heheheheheheh What? That his own stuff proves him wrong? hee hee hee hee hee hee hee
It is hard work being a shill these days. I guess you have to snatch some fragment of imagined victory when you can.
Especially when every piece of research posted on this thread proves his original premise wrong.
Yeah Paul. We all learned something today. heee hee hee hee You are a super egotist, I mean optimist and can see a little hope in the most embarassing defeats.
heheheheheheheh
We are so amused once again. Please play soon!
I have to go for awhile. Somebody babysit Paul.Make sure he doesn’t slip anymore lies or false assertions into his posts.
I’ll cut you a break here Paul because you are new. “Threats” have happened on this forum. We take the matter VERY seriously. We even had a death threat from a poster who in so doing completely and forever destroyed his credibility here. Out of kindness, I’ll not name him.
Even ACCUSING somone of making physical threats here is a very serious charge. Do not make it unless you have substantial evidence.
Paul.No, I never threatened you, nor would I. If I am a threat to you, it is only because I show how vacuous your arguments are.As in: “The minimum wage causes higher unemployment.Economics folks.”
Uhhh, no it doesn’t Paul. Republicans have stated that nonsense since the first minimum wage increase passed and was signed. The truth is, that has never happened. There has never been a firing assault on employees because of the wage being increased. Again, you lose.
So Paul, since I witnessed a bunch of cops beat a veteran in a wheelchair I should hate ALL cops?
Paul,
“Can’t you realize that the people reading these posts, who are not posting themselves, are learning a lot of things they didn’t know before,…?”
If they’ve read your posts elsewhere, they already know you’ve got no credibility. Ken Lay – Lincoln bedroom, and so on…
btw: Most people realize that the parties consists of citizens, not just elected politicians.
They know about the bill with the minimum wage increase being tied to repeal of the estate tax. They KNOW which party favors the rich.
Paul comes up with good examples of why wingnut talking heads seldom debate anybody who disagrees with them.
BTW great blog and comments, really enjoy everyones thoughts.
Why thank you .morg.
I don’t think we ever properly welcomed you to the forum. I do so now.
Hey where did Paul go?
Let’s see……
He tried to slide in a lie….yes …..and then he got called on it…..ummmm…ok then he tried to spin the lie…got it….and that didn’t work EITHER….and then,……and then…….he disappeared.
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-goldberg3aug03,0,5959522.column?coll=la-opinion-center
Thanks JR, this is kinda on thread
If I were king, this is how taxes would work:
0-25k – 0 taxes25-50k – 20%50-100k – 25%100-250k – 30%250-500k – 35%500k-over – 40%
It is well known that when poor people have more money, they are going to spend it. With the infusion of cash from their tax exempt status, there would be the need for more mid-level management jobs and the like, who in turn produce more cash, and the money keeps growing up the ladder, sort of a trickle up economics. Regardless, couldn’t be any worse than what we have now.
ddub, when wealthy people have more money, what do they do with it, do you suppose?
SBA, they hide it offshore so they don’t have to pay taxes on it. Or they donate it to the political party that allows them to steal more.
So if the rich are not paying their fair share of taxes anyway – then WHY does George W. and his cronies make sure that the rich get even more tax breaks?
It’s called supply side economics CR.
The money is all on their side and they want it kept there.
The RINO’s don’t want raises in minimum wage, because then they wouldn’t be able to look down on their unfortunate brethern, and think, “I’m a lot better off that him”. The real Republicans don’t want an increase, because they have never cared about anybody but themselves.I have nothing but respect for the Warren Buffets and other rich democrats that care about the less fortunate. Like the group Gates was in that tried to prevent tax cut plans for the wealthy.
Besides, being poor is clearly god’s punishment for not being republican enough.
GIRL, it’s not a sin to be poor,…..it’s just damned inconvenient!
Well I guess, I know what a liberal blogs is now. Nothing but a bunch of crap!