One of our bloggers wanted a thread started on the Denver high school teacher (in photo) who made comments in his social studies class critical of capitalism, the U.S. invasion of Iraq and President Bush, which a student taped (click here for link to audio). About 150 high school students walked out of class Thursday in protest of the teacher being placed on administrative leave while the school district investigates. Yes, the teacher was over the top and inappropriate at times, and should have offered and encouraged competing opinions, as the district policy states. But is this really a national news story? One teacher in one high school in one state?
Posted by Phillip Brownlee
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64 Comments
Well, yes. You see Phillip, this is not really an isolated story it is happening everywhere.
It’s OK to compare Bush to Hitler. It’s merely academic freedom, or first amendment rights. But don’t let a teacher acknowledge Christmas!
Hank
They are still doing interviews on the Natalee Holloway case and you have to ask that?
Oh wow, Nathan whines for his blog and gets it.
Sure this is a national story. It is a national story because the Right wing lie machine and media arm of the bush white house that is talk radio wants and very desperately needs it to be. It takes a little heat and attention off of the perpetual failings of George bush.
The stunt was concocted by one of these talkmasters, and played endlessly and all day to the mindless masses of that medium.
And, just as it was meant to, it got one of our less reputable posters motivated to completely go off topic in more than one thread questioning George bush and whine and whine until he got the thread we see here.
As to that teacher; comparisons of bush to Hitler are made by a significant portion of the American public. As such, it certainly is a viable, even required topic for a course in world geography today. If certain individuals are troubled by this they must at least take some comfort that their particular thoughts on the subject are more than adequately represented, even to the point of saturation, by AM radio. And there are more than a few of us that feel that particular media dominance by those who affirm their beliefs more than a little unfair.
I hope the Eagle will continue to answer calls from posters for requested threads. But I also hope that such requests be rationed in a way that does not allow any particualar poster to become a distraction from relevant debate. That is what talk radio is for.
Just another Right Wing distraction. Where’s the Beef?
Come on JR,
He’s a geography teacher! What if I was your child’s teacher and I was lecturing him on the moral bankruptcy of the democratic party in home ec?
Would you dismiss it with the same inane rationalizations?
Hank
I agree with Hank. There has been widespread commentary on the ideological depradations of college professors but precious little regarding high school inquisitioners. If they are anything like my high school teachers of 20 years ago, they need to be held up to the antiseptic light of day.
With the ability of ‘alternative’ media to go places the weak kneed hypocritical mainstream wont go, expect to see much more of these types of stories.
How many times have I seen others ask for a topic to be started?
The first time a liberal asks for a post and now it is some huge problem?
On top of that, this has nothing to do with taking away from whatever the weekly bash-Bush topic is. In another week it will be something different anyway.
This is not an isolated incident. I went to Goddard high school and had similar things happen and I have been at WSU where it has happened many times.
Unfortunately many students are too scared or intimidated to say anything to their teachers or professors.
I have engaged them in discussions many times and they usually try to quickly change the subject back to actual class related discussion when they see that they have an actual adversary willing to debate them in front of class.
This would have been front page news if the teacher had been talking about how great and wonderful Christ is and that they should be Christians.
I wonder if the ACLU would be backing his 1st amendment rights then?
I see that JR must have gone to a public school. The math teacher apparently spent a great deal of time commenting on political things since JR says a ’significant portion’ alludes to George Bush as Hitler.
Perhaps you would like to clarify for us what percentage ’significant’ equals. Be clear now, give us some empirical numbers…
When Americans criticize obvious blunders by Bush, his Zionist buddies call it ” Bush Bashing.”
Perhaps if they kept their noses out of our business and their asses out of our government things would improve.
If government (republican and democrat) would keep its nose out of our business things would defintely improve!
“You see Phillip, this is not really an isolated story it is happening everywhere.”
Hank, that’s about the first really truthful thing you’ve said. It is indeed, happening everywhere. The people are fed-up with your King and aren’t afraid to say so any more.
I suggest all of you Bush suck-ups get used to it. It’s only going to get better (or worse from your syncopant point of view).
Dear XXX,
I think that the average American voter is going to look at this story for what it really is. The more the left-wing press either ignores it or defends it the worse you leftys are going to appear.
It can only be good for us right-wing defenders of justice and the American way!
Love ya, coming to the picnic?
Hank
As a former teacher, there is absolutely no way this teacher should be disciplined, let alone fired (I’m speaking as a Republican, no less). He teaches social studies, for goodness sake. His job is to challenges students to think.
I don’t want teachers who are mindless automatons, tied to the textbook. I want teachers who can think, who express opinions, who challenge students. If this teacher refused to let students who disagreed with his POV speak their mind, or enforced his position as “answers” on a test, it might be different. But as I understand it, that’s not the case. While I disagree with him (NO american politician, of either party, deserves the broad brush of either being a “nazi” nor a “communist/Stalinist;” both are outside any part of the mainstream of American politics), the last time I checked, the 1st amendment was still good law.
Hey all, I’ve been asked upthread to provide some evidence that a significant number of Americans can see some comparisons between bush and Hitler.
So I’ll ask for a show of thought here. WHo else besides me sees some similarity between Hitler and bush?
If teachers are overwhelmingly liberal, it’s only because no qualified conservative would deign to take the low-paying job conservative legislators have made teaching.
It is stupid to compare shrub to Hitler and I find such comparisons to be offensive!
Viva La Raza Blanco!!
Left wing lunatics indoctrinating our high-school kids shouldn’t be teachers. I’ve listened to the tapes and there is nothing substantial about brainwashing kids into adopting his political ideology. How low has the Left sunk that they try to secure more young impressionable minds that can’t even read at a college level for their own political purposes. I bet that teacher chastises and humiliates any of his students that DISAGREES with his asinine political views. Thank God the Lefty sons o bitches are here to “educate” by banning freedom of expression.
Hank,”Love ya, coming to the picnic?”Hell yes! I wouldn’t miss it! Did we settle on a time and place?
Whether you agree or disagree with what this teacher did, as a parent you should have meaningful choice as to where to send your children to school. This means reducing the level of control that government has over schools, and vouchers are a good way to start.
“It can only be good for us right-wing defenders of justice and the American way!”
What a crock! Giving away liberty is NOT the American way. Starting wars with countries that didn’t attack us, torturing prisoners, and taking bribes is NOT defending justice.
Hey XXX,
Here’s my post from the other thread:
OK children,
Here’s the rules! Anybody can make their own rules, but these are the rules.
March 16th, 4pm to 7pm.
Shelter #1 East side Lake Afton.
I’ll provide hamburgers, buns and condiments.
Everyone else bring a side dish.
Let me know by Sunday night if you’re coming.
If we don’t at least have ten by Sunday night we’ll have it someplace else. I’m not renting a shelter for J.R. and me.
Hank
Let me know if you’re attending.
XXX,There is info about the get-together at the old “Why is Osama Living Large in Pakistan” thread. Hank lists the time, place, and “rules”. Maybe that info should be put on the new Open thread?
Sorry, I was too late. Hank beat me to the response. I will cut and paste the info to the new “open thread” unless that has already been done.
Thanks for the info, guys. Of course, I found it after I asked. As I said Hank, I’ll be there for sure.
So what’s the venue? Guns? Knives? Or just clubs and rocks?
Ian,I guess you know there’s a big gun show at the Coliseum this weekend.
Teachers DO NOT have the freedom of speech in a classroom. Schools are not public forums. These are PAID government employees who are there to provide instruction to teach the state guidelines of the particular subject(s).
Although he (the teacher) was taught be a leftist group to go around a legal loophole by saying a disclaimer, if he was really teaching children to be critical thinkers, then why only give one side? Why is Bush being critized on the war on Iraq, when Saddam is never critized? Give both sides, and I would have been ok with it.
But it was clearly leftist propaganda. This is very common is unionized monopolisitic government schools. It’s basically child abuse.
Let’s just say I hate to get close enough for knives! Careful XXX, you’ll scare the bedwetters!
So far, its me and you.
Hank
This is just more crap from the right. There is also a teacher in NJ who had a mock trial of dubya that the right is blowing all out of proportion. When it is their man being ‘tried’ or critized they throw a hissy fit. But when the NJ teacher had a mock trial of Clinton where was the outrage? Where were the complaints that teachers were pushing their political idea? Hypocrites.
Joe, I think you answered your own question. If he was trying to teach them critical thinking providing one side and having them provide the other is the best way (imo). The problem is getting students to pipe up. I was a teaching assistant in grad school and it isn’t easy to get students to talk. Highly controversial topics like this are the easiest way (again imo) to break the ice and get students to start talking. And once you get them talking the problem becomes getting them to shut up (LOL).
I’ll go a step further. bush is worse than Hitler. bush is here and now and in charge of us. Hitler is history we should learn from.
Oh by the way? “Indoctrination” does work both ways. It just isn’t reported.
My son of 11 years was recruited into the JROTC. This was done with no contact to me his father. A provision of funding in the “no child left behind” act allows for this. Though I have no doubt that some find this program valuable, I resented that my son was recruited without my consent. The dif here? The teacher in question was outed and may be punished or fired. the recruitment of my son into a program I did not approve of was a matter of federal mandate.
Personally, I don’t like this guy’s teaching style.
It’s supposed to be a learning experience, not listen to how clever the teacher is.
This guy is preaching, not teaching.
But what Hankathan have trouble distinguishing is that what liberals SAY is in no way comparable to what conservatives DO.
Liberals say some over-the-top things sometimes that are unjustifiable. Bush is not Hitler. Al Franken has gone on record many times saying that he repudiates and despises people making that kind of comparison.
But SAYING is not the same as DOING. Right now, only conservatives (and a particularly VIRULENT ilk of conservative) are in positions of power in this country.
They are the ones who gave Paris Hilton a tax break and let soldiers die without body armor. They are the ones that ran the country into historic high debt while giving oil companies 36 billion dollars of publically owned oil “royalty free” and then gave them a tax break on top of that.
BushCo are the ones who’ve sent 2,300 service people to their deaths in Iraq, and the situation is getting worse not better.
There’s no comparing what the neo-cons DO with what the liberals SAY.
JR–
Excellent point. The military has full access to every students’ information attending public school.
There’s an “opt out” clause, but it takes time and most people don’t know about it.
Which is why I have been putting up posters around town asking Bush supporters to volunteer their children to fight in Iraq.
“2300 Service people have been killed in Iraq. Isn’t it time YOUR CHILD was one of them?”
I then go on to point out that Bush supporters are the party of “personal responsibility” and since the recruiting numbers are dropping like Bush’s approval ratings, it’s time to step up and sacrifice for service.
I then include information to the local recruiter.
Just trying to do my bit to help Bush supporters be a little less hypocritical . . .
PL,
I like what you are doing regarding the bush supporters. you should also go to the synagogues and try and convince the jews to enlist. Afterall, this war is being fought, mainly, for israel and the zionists and jews are the most under-represented racial group in our military!
V.L.R.B!!
“Meet up” posts have also been included here.
Personally, I do not care to take part in any “meet up” that is organized by “Hank”
JR,
Yikes, what did Hank do to get under your skin?
V.L.R.B!!
Hank,”So far, its me and you.”
Surely you and I aren’t the only bloggers with guts enough to meet face to face.
“Careful XXX, you’ll scare the bedwetters!”
I’m a scary guy.
Not a thing Ian……other than remembering his posts.
Hey triple X,
My boy is coming, but he’s a Marine and bullet proof; too young to be scared.
As far as JR goes, we’ll miss him!
Hank
Bush 2 vs. Hitler? At least one of them had fought combat for his country and severely wounded in action.
What a slam on Adolf. For all the vile things he done, he was at least a leader.
Hank, I look forward to meeting a brother Marine. As we know well, anybody who can survive the Corps has something going for them.
Too bad about JR. I’d offer to protect him, but it sounds like he’s made up his mind.
I wonder what happened to CF?
I assume CF will come, if he’s been reading lately. I’ll count him toward the total just in case he’s out of town.
I think you would like Nathan. He’s a very good Marine! Takes it seriously!
Hank
JR, I agree that the bushies and the reich have a great deal in common. A scary amount in common, and what is even more scary, the bush supporters remind me of the sheeple who followed hitler.
And Ian, I agree, it is almost an insult to hitler to compare him to bush. I am no fan of hitler, but at least he was honest about who he was and what he wanted. bush scares me because he is a nuanced hater, just slicker with the code words. A subtle hater is harder to fight, especially when they sound so good and hide behind jesus.
Give me a straight up hater anyday. I can see them coming and deal accordingly.
If one wishes to be accurate then you should compare shrub to Judas or King Ahasuerus.
V.L.R.B!!
Regarding “meeting up…”
I, personally, prefer to stay anonymous. I think we are free to share our thoughts and feelings in a safe environment. I’m not sure that I want to bring a covered dish and eat a meal with any of you. It would be too awkward.I’ll pass…
Dear Gertie,
It might be a little awkward at first..
I understand, I’ll put you on the ‘gracefully declined’ list.
Hank
Hey Hank, how come when we post under screen names, you rag on us constantly, but Gertie, in her desire to be anonymous and post under a screen name, gets a break?
Where is the outrage about us not willing to say things face to face? Could Gertie be the alter ego of another poster? JR is a coward but Gertie just gracefully declines? She can ask for a safe environment but the rest of us cant?
I call double standard. But it’s ok. The Flying Spagetti Monster and I still love ya! :)
Dear ksfarmgrrl,
Most of the time I bitch about anonymous posters, its a general statement and that covers Gertie. J R is an admitted coward, he has posted in the past that he wouldn’t eat lunch with me and my boy because he was afraid.
Besides, Gertie sounds like she might be my aunt or somebody precious.
Believe it or not, I’ve never realy been outraged by anything written to me or about me, just some things amuse me less than others.
I’m glad you’re going to try and make it to the bash!
Hank
I listened to the tape. It sounds like the teacher was doing exactly what he is supposed to do: challenge the students to think for themselves. And he told them that they didn’t have to agree with him. I heard students expressing their own views.
I suspect the reason that some people are upset with the teacher is the fact that sometimes the truth hurts. As Americans, we need to take a good honest look at ourselves and our actions on the world stage. We have not always been the good guys.
So would it be better if he taught the students to always blindly accept what ever our president was saying? And if he did, would he then be required to toss in a little Bush bashing just to be balanced and fair to the other side?
The 150 students who walked out in protest of the teacher’s suspension apparently like him and did not feel like they were being bullied by him.
Dixi Chicks where are ya, we need ya.
The Dixi Chicks are in obcurity where they belong.
Anyone who compares President Bush to Hitler needs to be bitch slapped into next week. Let’s see, President Bush started and unpopular war, Hitler and the Germans murdered 6 Million Jews and others, the liberal agenda has murdered several million babies.
Hmmm, maybe the liberals need to look into the mirror to find the worst offenders. In advance of what you liberal a-holes have to say – Fuck YOU!
NoJo,Bush was the one who said family was everything, and whose granddad, for whom he was named, bankrolled the 3rd Reich. Give him time!
Just spent an hour adressing the “coward” issue on open thread.
Thanks your defense Farmgirl. If I can, I will see you at the meet up
HmmmmmBush and Hitler…..
Well NoJo is usaully irrational. That last post was, to use a right wing term, unhinged. Lately I have demonsrated that I am no coward. I invite NoJoCo to “bitch slap me into next week”
On comparisons of bush to Hitler:
Hitler exloited irrational fear of the jews.
Bush exploits irrational fear of “terror”
Hitler launched a war of aggression to secure Lebensraum (room to live)
Bush launched a war of agression to secure “vital resources”
Hitler acccumulated power to one executive…..himself
bush accumulates power to one executive……..himself
Hitler demanded all Germans swear a loyalty oath to him and the state.
bush demanded the Patriot Act and said “if you are not with us , you are against us.
Hitler instituted the “Hitler youth” organized to steer kids to national military service
bush stealthily inserted provisions in the “no child left behind” educational act to allow access to kids by the military……without parental notification…..let alone approval.
I could go on. But I need to do another post on how bush is DIFFERENT from Hitler.
Of Course, bush is different from Hitler …..
Hitler was from a poor dysfuntional family.bush is from a rich family with a 50 year history in power
Hitler was a soldier in dangerous duty in World War I
bush used his wealth and status to avoid active duty service in Viet nam
Hitler spent his post war youth trying to market himself as an artist.
bush spent his post war youth drinking, doing cocaine and spending his daddy’s money.
Hitler was mentally and phsically disabled by mustard gas exposure during his timein World War I. ( excuse?)
bush did not actively serve and is by all accouts in perfect physical health
hitler started with a party of 12 people, and through his rhetoric, oratory, and personal appeal, rose to lead an almost unanimously unified nation
bush was fronted by a political party for the sake of name recognition, elected illegitimately by legal fiat.
Hitler unified Germany wronglybush is the most divisive person in American history rightly
JR said:
Hitler exloited irrational fear of the jews.
Bush exploits irrational fear of “terror”
JR, dont forget that bushies exploit irrational fear of gay people too. A good way to get his base to the polls.
NoJoCo, now what would jesus say about language like that?
If you wanna bitch slap me, come to the gathering. I dont run very fast on two artificial knees. You can probably catch me…but be careful what you ask for.
I have a sign on my wall that says “age and treachery will overcome youth and vigor any day”.
WHERE IS MOTHER!!!!!!!
NoJo–
I agree that the Hitler-Bush analogy is taking things way too far, as previously posted.
However the “liberal agenda” that killed millions of children, I have to quibble with–no pro-lifers have yet responded to the well-known contention that millions of babies were being aborted BEFORE it became legal.
Re-criminalizing abortion won’t stop abortion. It will just make it illegal.
Respond?
I think the Hitler bush comparison is relevant, or at least worthy of study. But I already posted as to that.
I notice NO Jo has not returned. No Jo does that. Pops in….pops OFF and disappears.
Ok farmgirrl tell me about Mother. I remember the name a little bit. Thing is I was away for awhile (mid November to early Jan.) to attend my dad. When I got back I first encountered you. But who is this “Mother”?
I dont know who she is JR, but she posts really funny stuff and sounds like a tough chic. I would love to meet her in person. We only hear from her once in a while. But when she posts, it is always good.
If you are affended by the F bomb, then I appologize. I don’t have problems with words outside of cursing using God’s name in vain.
I’m kind of like Harrison Ford’s character in “Witness” when he busts the guy in the mouth for harassing the Amish people.
I do find it hard to believe that someone would compare Bush to Hitler – the murderer of millions of Jews and others (including some Protestant and Catholic priests who went against Hitler from the start.
BTW, I don’t come on here as often as some of you. When I do, I generally read more than I post. I am trying to learn about politics, etc. I am also a people-watcher. This is another form of it.
NoJoCo…dont forget the gay people exterminated by hitler.
Scapegoating of gays…yet another trait shared by bush and the reich.
Ksfarmgrill and the rest of you liberal sapsuckers: Behold your idiocy. Hitler was very different from Bush. He was intelligent. He believed in improving mankind. He had vision. He made some serious mistakes along the way. Bush is a lackluster, bootlicking traitor to what America was founded on. He is turning us over to his cronies the Arabs. Soon you will wish we had Hitler instead.
Truth,You’re just a Kampf-idolating shrub-loving neo-con.