What a terrible tragedy in West Virginia. Not only did 12 of 13 workers trapped in a coal mine die, but their families were incorrectly told by a mine official that the miners had been found alive (which was reported in Wednesday’s Eagle). The official then learned about 30 minutes later that the miners were dead, but waited three hours to tell the families — who were celebrating outside a local church (see photo). The families were so furious when they learned the truth that the church pastor said he was thankful that the police were there to protect the mine official.
Posted by Phillip Brownlee
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38 Comments
Workers Comp laws will probably shield the mining company from wrongful death just as they did here with DeBruce grain elevators.
And well they should. Workers Compensation law was created as a social solution by state legislatures. It is a trade-off.
Workers used to have to prove their employers negligent through the adversarial court system in order to recover anything. Workers Comp removes that requirement. Workers or their survivors can recover medical, disability, and death benefits for on the job injuries regardless of who was at fault.
In return, employers are shielded from negligence suits. In most states, however there is an exception if it can be shown that there was gross and wanton negligence on the part of the employer. And of course, if there was another party at fault, that person or entity can be sued.
As I understand it, this situation could have been avoided by someone checking the facts before reporting to the families and the media. It is a terrible tragedy no matter how you look at it, but one that could have been so much less gut-wrenching, had someone checked the facts before spouting off! It is truly a sad lesson learned.
Outlander–
So you’re saying that when gov’t protects big capitalists by absorbing their liabilities, that kind of socialism is okay.
Just clarifying what you’re saying.
Carry on.
PL: Your ignorance of the subject is apparent. Please tell me how the government absorbs the liabilities of employers? The employers are responsible for the work comp payments to workers. Most insure that exposure.As explained above, both the worker and the employer gain but also give up some rights. Who the law favors the most, I will leave for others to judge.
“In return, employers are shielded from negligence suits.” Taxpayers pick up costs that might otherwise be passed on to the company.
That’s a kind of socialism, correct?
Uh, no that’s not right PL. Plus your comment makes no sense. Ya want to take another shot at it?
Well, you can deny it all you want to, but everytime I talk about gov’t helping people, you right-wingers accuse me of “class warfare” and “socialism.”
I just wanted you to clarify how this is NOT socialism.
Looks like your not able to . . .
Outlander, PL is a TL (typical liberal). Makes a claim based on emotion/feelings and not facts, figures or perspective. Same MO time after time. Always big gad corporations are evil.
ID, you ignorant slut.
What I’m pointing out is that when someone says gov’t should help homeless victims of Hurricane Katrina, the right-wingers call it “socialism.”
But when the gov’t protects businesses by paying off victims of those businesses, that’s not socialism . . . oh my, no, that’s just good sensible gov’t.
Hypocrites.
And rather than admit that tax dollars to protect business liability is “welfare for corporations,” you simply use nothing but ad homenim, the conservative stand-by when all else fails.
Sad, but then how else could you continue to support President Cuckoo-Bananas . . .
Sigh. . .Ben, tell Outlander about the Debruce explosion, if you would. I’m up wayyy too late already. . . .thanks!
Those miners were down so deep and in such peril because we don’t want to spoil the environment and strip mine for coal. The mountains look pretty and 11 miners are dead. Nice.
The amount of compensation for the maimed and the dead is pitifully small and falls far short of actually making a person (or survivors) whole. Therefore many medical bills and survivor support fall upon taxpayers.
If I kill someone through my negligence I should be held responsible. As we saw with DeBruce we don’t believe in that axiom when it comes to the rich and powerful.
The Golden Rule: “He who has the gold makes the rules”
Am I not making myself clear? Work comp is a trade off. Yes, in certain situation, it would be advantageous for workers to be under the regular court system. For instance the DeBruce elevator explosion, where the company was at fault. But what if one of the employees had done something stupid to cause his own death or injury. Under our regular court system, they would have been SOL.
In the vast majority of of cases, injuries are not the employer’s fault. Yet employees are still able to have ALL their medical bills paid, are provided wage loss benefits while disabled, collect permanent disabilty payments etc.. Again, IT IS A TRADE OFF!
Yes, it is a trade off; but not an even one. ALL medical and rehabilitation bills are NOT paid. Wages are only replaced at pennies on the dollar. And in death survivor benefits are meager.
In far too many cases extreme negligence is allowed to continue because of this system. See, for example:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/workplace/mcwane/
Thanks for the link Ben. As I said upthread, I will leave it to others to judge who benefits the most.
BTW, in Kansas all medical bills and rehab costs are paid, or at least are required to be paid under statute.
“Trade off” or not, it’s still “taxpayer dollars benefitting corporations” sometimes huge, multi-billion dollar corporations.
I’m just asking if the right-wing can support welfare for the rich, why can’t they support welfare for the poor in some cases?
How much did they pay to rehab the corpses after the DeBruce explosion? And there was no one allowed to judge the fairness.
By the way (for PL); when the system is working correctly it is self-supporting as a sort of insurance program. Thus it would not be corporate welfare. And outlander is correct in part about the benefits of a no-fault system. My problem with it is that it has been used too much as a shield when we should unleash a good plaintiffs’ lawyer on them.
It IS a trade-off; however in my experience it has been too much on the side of the employer in too many cases.
Heh, you’re thinking too much, Ben.
The fact is that it is a gov’t mandated system that redistributes wealth. To the right-wing nuts, that’s socialism.
That’s not my definition of socialism, but it’s theirs.
So by their own definition, what benefits the corporations is socialism–i.e., welfare for corporations.
It’s pretty sad to see something like this politicized, just as Katrina was.
No surprise which side is doing the sniping.
Oh, boo hoo, Todd. You dropped bombs on people. Get over it.
Or . . . no, I mean you parachute in and then shoot people, same difference.
Anyway, here’s what I’m talking about, whine boys: “Capitalism privatizes profits, socializes costs”
“The practice of using the public’s money and resources to subsidize private enterprise continues to this day. It is variously estimated that every year, the federal government doles out hundreds of billions of dollars in corporate welfare, in the form of tax exclusions, reduced tax assessments, generous depreciation write-offs and tax credits, price supports, loan guarantees, payments in kind, research and development grants, subsidized insurance rates, marketing services, export subsidies, irrigation and reclamation programs, and research and development grants.”
The article cites interstate highway construction that immensely benefits trucking and automotive companies, the park service that facilitates logging, USAID that spent a billion dollars last year to help American corporations move overseas.
“Under corporate capitalism the ordinary citizen pays twice for most things: first, as a taxpayer who provides the subsidies and supports, then as a consumer who buys the high priced commodities and services. Overall, federal spending represents an enormous upward redistribution of income.”
http://www.zmag.org/sustainers/content/2005-12/31parenti.cfm
One place the resposibility for this disaster lies is with employers who regard the safety of workers secondary to profits.Another is with Congress, who cut the funds for Bureau of Mines inspecors, and mandated such small fines for safety violations that it’s more profitable to pay the fines than fix the problems.Another is with the voters who elected officials they knew were in bed with corporate interests, in exchange for pork-barrel projects.There’s plenty of blame to go around!
“Oh, boo hoo, Todd. You dropped bombs on people. Get over it”
I have no earthly idea what this is supposed to mean.
PL, Would he still shoot the cowards after they’ve dropped their weapons? When he jumps does he use a parachute or a full-skirt?
Oh, ha ha. I get it. I served my country, so I’m a murderer.
Todd: I hope that’s not what they meant. I would like to think better of the bloggers here. If they did mean it, that is reprehensible. I will have lost all regard and respect for those who would sink so low.
Todd – I don’t know the context of the ‘bomb’ comments so I will not add anything to them. As for my comments it isn’t really partisan but more reflects past professional involvement in workplace safety matters.
We were told he was 8 months in Iraq with the “mighty US Airborne.”
And Arab fighters were all cowards that threw-down their weapons rather than fight.
Yup. Ignore the post and go right to a wrong-headed reading of the side comment.
Note to self: remember the KISS principle . . .
Todd, you claim to be “hurt” by the politicization of a mining disaster (those damn liberals!).
But you fought in a war zone.
You can take war but you can’t take arguing politics?
Maybe you should go through basic training for blogging so you aren’t so . . . uhm . . . sensitive.
I guess the rest of my post was just way over your heads.
PL: It was a stupid thing to say. We all do it. It just makes it worse when you try to gloss over it.
Boy is my face red!
Now respond to the post . . . if you can . . .
Something I heard on the news last night. The Sago mine is non-union. The mine was originally union, but went bankrupt and re-opened as a non-union mine. Sago’s safety record is pathetic compared to union mines.
PL: Your post that isn’t even on topic. It is quoted drivel attacking capitalism. How in the world do you expect me to respond? I could ask you if you are a communist. Otherwise, what point are you trying to make?
XXX,Do you know the figures? What was the safety record of the Sago mine while it was union, compared to now? Seems a useful fact to have on tap.
Okay, you can’t refute it or even respond to it, Outlander, I understand. It’s beyond your ken and abilities which is why you retreat to the “conventional wisdom” of Rush and Michael Savage.
But, ya know, it just makes it worse when you try to gloss over it . . .